Will the Military Court Martial of Lt. Col. Lakin Finally Put an End to the Birther Debate?

by | Apr 14, 2010 | Headline News | 43 comments

Do you LOVE America?


    An MSNBC report suggests that the ‘birther’ debate may finally be coming to a head, as the Army will pursue a court martial of an officer who has refused to take orders from the Commander In Chief:

    U.S. military officials tell NBC News that the U.S. Army will court martial a lieutenant colonel who refuses to deploy to Afghanistan because he considers orders from President Obama to be “illegal.”

    Army doctor Lt. Col. Terry Lakin believes Obama does not meet the constitutional requirements to be president and commander-in-chief, because he believes (incorrectly) that Obama wasn’t born in the United States.

    *Note: It is clear that MSNBC’s reporters are not objective in this regard, as they have already judged Lt. Col. Lakin to be guilty because he “incorrectly” believes that President Obama was not born in the USA. No evidence has been submitted at this point that proves, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that the President was not born in Kenya.

    Lt. Col. Terry Lakin gives us his reasoning in a video posted below:

    Past challenges to President Obama’s natural born citizenship have failed to yield any results other than to be thrown out of federal courts around the country.

    But this time is a little different, as the previous cases were brought on by citizens who, according to some courts, did not have authority under the Constitution to challenge the President’s legal standing under Article 2, Clause 5.

    In Lt. Col. Lakin’s case, it is he who is being challenged by a military court for committing a crime, and thus the tables may have turned. The case cannot simply be dismissed as frivolous or without merit, as happened to Maj. Stefan Cook, who took legal action in civilian court. This time, the government will have to see the case to completion, which means that Lt. Col. Lakin should be allowed full discovery in this case. Though we are not completely clear on military law in this regard, it would stand to reason that if Lt. Col. Lakin is in the wrong, it can only be proven via a certified birth certificate (see below).

    We suggest to our readers that there are some inconsistencies regarding President Obama’s eligibility, and the only way to silence critics and unbelievers is to prove that he is legally serving as President of the United States.

    Some key points which we have found to be curious regarding this issue:


    A recently available video from August 2008 shows First Lady Michelle Obama at the LGBT Delegate Luncheon, suggesting that Kenya is Barrack Obama’s “home country.”

    View full speech here…


    Sarah Hussein Obama, grandmother of President Obama, is quoted as saying, “Yes, I was present when Obama was born,” specifically to referring to being born in Kenya (Watch the video below at approx. 4:40).


    Though a Certification of Live Birth has been made available to the public by numerous sources including this link at the LA Times, there is a dispute as to whether or not this document proves that the President was born in the USA. The question regarding the document is not in its legitimacy, it is in the fact that in 1961, anyone, regardless of where they were born, could obtain such a certificate in Hawaii if they were a resident and requested a certification from the Hawaii Medical Examiner’s office. The document does not necessarily prove his birth in Hawaii, because it does not include a hospital or the name of the doctor who delivered him, which from our understanding, is a requirement on Birth Certificate, as opposed to a Certification of Live Birth.


    The obvious question is: If President Obama has nothing to hide, then why not show the America public his actual Birth CERTIFICATE, as opposed to a certification? Instead, the President has reportedly spent millions of dollars in legal fees keeping any court challenges from forcing him to publish this evidence. There have been no less than 20 court challenges to date.

    Of course, Mr. Obama may simply be sick and tired of the challenges and may be acting out of personal principles and not actually hiding something.

    There are, of course, numerous other inconsistencies and hard facts here, as there are with any conspiracy fact or conspiracy theory, and they can be viewed in more detail at the Safeguard Our Constitution web site.

    We believe that Lt. Col. Lakin has a legitimate case, as the President has not yet proven his eligibility to serve as President of the United States and Commander-in-Chief of our armed forces. Senator McCain had to prove eligibility and Senate Resolution 511 (April 2008) cleared him for the go ahead. But why was no resolution required for Mr. Obama, even in the face of serious dispute by many citizens of the United States?

    This is a constitutional requirement and it is alarming that all challenges under Article 2 have been dismissed and/or thrown out of court as frivolous. However, it is clear thus far, the President Obama, though a constitution professor, does not necessarily believe in the document he has sworn to uphold.

    The evidence suggests that President Obama may have been born in Kenya and that he may be hiding something, and there are millions of Americans that dispute his eligibility. The so-called “birther” movement, although marginalized by the media, is not some fringe group of right wing extremists. The inelgibility sentiment is shared across the entire country by millions of Americans who have essentially kept silent.

    Why not clear this up beyond a shadow of a doubt?


    It Took 22 Years to Get to This Point

    Gold has been the right asset with which to save your funds in this millennium that began 23 years ago.

    Free Exclusive Report
    The inevitable Breakout – The two w’s

      Related Articles


      Join the conversation!

      It’s 100% free and your personal information will never be sold or shared online.


      1. This Court Martial has an easy solution as has been suggested. Either produce the original birth certificate (not some cheap imitation) and this officer is guilty. Don’t produce it (for whatver reason – it does not matter) and he is innocent. Having been an officer for many years and having survived a trumped up charge against me as well, I can tell you this officer has every chance of being vindicated.

      2. Why to go Mac, don’t be afraid to talk about this.

        While I believe  he was probably born here (although certainly possible he wasn’t), there is definitely something he is hiding somewhere in his records, something he desperately does not want revealed.   They let the argument rage about the BC to divert attention from the real issues of his past.

        Lets hope they don’t just produce a real or fake certified BC and call it good, lets see ALL your records you are hiding, YOU ARE OUR GOSHDAMNED EMPLOYEE YOU SOB, COMPLY!!!!

      3. Oops, should have been “Way to go Mac” …. sorry for the fat fingering.

      4. Has anyone found a website where one can show their support for this courageous PATRIOT?  It won’t take many more like him to stop the fasciobamunist train wreck running rip-shod over this country, we need to back everyone brave enough to honor the oath they have taken.

      5. Willie, you can support Lt. Col. Lakin at the Safe Guard Our Constitution web site:


        • American Patriot Foundations’ defense fund will pay for a lawyer and for Terry’s legal defense.  We must raise $50,000 in the next ten days in order to assemble a top-flight legal defense team for LTC Lakin.
      6. Interesting read: a leter from Lt. Col. Lakin to POTUS:


        The funniest thing about it is this:

        • I recently received deployment orders for a second deployment to Afghanistan. My orders included a requirement to bring copies of my birth certificate.

        That is fantastic! His orders for deployment require his birth certificate! Go figure…..

      7. Obama was not born in the United States, that is why he will never produce a birth certificate document.   He was directed to be a candidate for president, and is the product of a mass media campaign owned by the elitists whose eventual goal is to steal the all of the asset values of the American middle and upper classes, render our Constitutional rights void, and subjugate the entire American population to a world governing body.  Obama is a sociopathetic puppet doing the bidding of his elitist masters.    His allegiance is to himself and to his handlers.  The citizens be damned.

      8. This Officer is not guilty if the POTUS produces a birth certificate.  If the President does not, this man is a true hero.

      9. Sharp Tool, I think you meant to say this officer is not guilty if the POTUS does NOT produce a legal birth certificate, and guilty if he does. But we got it anyway.
        Paul Revere, you have the background to the story synopsized well here. This guy is not the POTUS and he is a puppet of the Bankster elitists who got him elected and control his every move. The banksters want to suck every dime from all of us by various nefarious mechanisms including this health care reform and all its costs and taxes, Cap and Trade, and on and on. We the People must fight back and make damn sure that the Constitution is obeyed. Cheers, X.

      10. A legal birth certificate has been repeatedly produced.  It has been shown on TV and in courtrooms.  So many copies of it (verifications) have been produced by the state of Hawaii, that they are no longer sending them out.  Tens of thousands of copies.  He’s legal, get over it.

        One of the very first things that happens to a candidate upon filing for election is the public disclosure commission and federal election commission paperwork.  These two behemoth federal beaurocracies are (in reality) thousands of worker bees with nothing better to do than analyze stacks of paperwork on every candidate for every office.  ANY OMISSION, no matter how slight, results in immediate disqualification from election.  All matters are covered; a persons financial affairs, legal affairs, birth status, marital status, and so forth.  A colonoscopy would be less invasive.

        Just because you don’t like him, doesn’t make him an invalid candidate.  The right wing wackos had eight years of bush and his sub 100 IQ.  The left hated every minute.  The left wing wackos have a legitimate right to make the right wing wackos hate every minute of obamas presidency.

      11. Don’t believe me?  There’s an election coming up and filing time is right now.  Go file for yourself and see what shit-storm befalls you.

      12. LtCol Larkin is going to prison.  He has no right whatsoever to refuse those orders, and he knows it.  He is, in fact, property of the United States.  The real question is why he’s doing this.  Is he so far to the right that he just can’t accept a democrat president?  Does he want to get on fox news with the idiot hannity that bad?

        He’s going to lose all of his rank, his retirement, and all benefits for what, a political stunt?  What a dumbass.

      13. The more I read, the dumber this gets.  Obviously an army “officer”.  Probably fat too.  Any Marine private could beat the shit out of him.

      14. Don’t go away mad Jonny, just go away.  How about a ticket to Cuba one way?  You won’t be missed.

      15. Readers of this site know I am not a fan of OBAMA. I am not a lawyer either, but I am pretty sure that it doesn’t make any difference where he was born, because he was born to a natural citizen of the US who may  or may not have given birth outside of the US; and not a naturalized citizen, who gave birth outside of the US. If you are born of a natural citizen of the US you are also a natural citizen.

        As opposed to the 30 million illegals invading MY country!

      16. Colonel_X,

        What you thought I meant is not what I said.  What is Lt. Col. guilty off?  Lt. Col. Lakin has integrity & true character.


      17. Zuk, I have always understood a natural born Citizen to be an individual born on US Soil.

        John McCain, whose natural born citizenship status seems to have been challenged was approved by Senate resolution not because his parents were both US citizens, but because he was considered to have been born on “US Soil” because he was born at a US naval base in the panama canal zone. His parents’ citizenship had no bearing on his eligibility.

        If, for example, an illegal Mexican immigrant was to enter the United States and have a child on US soil, in a US hospital, that child would be considered a natural born citizen (unless they have changed this law since, but this was the case from what I remember back in the 1980’s)

        A child born on soil other than the United States, for example, if two US citizen parents were on vacation in Europe and had a child in Paris, that child would not be a natural born citizen, though they would easily acquire US citizenship. This was the case with Lowell P. Weicker, who withdrew a presidential run in 1980 because of this exact scenario.

        There seems to be a clearly defined difference between a “natural” born citizen and a “naturalized” citizen.

        If it turns out that Barrack Obama was not born in the State of Hawaii or another US state, or at anytime in his life he was a citizen of another country (i.e. Indonesia or Britain) then, per the constitution, he should be deemed ineligible to hold the office of President.

        What a clusterf*ck that would be!

        Would that then mean that all laws passed under his presidency are null and void?

        I can only imagine the riots/violence that would erupt if he was removed from office…. perhaps this is part of the grand conspiracy? haha.

      18. Johnny, if the President can produce a birth certificate, as opposed to a Certification of live birth, then the chance of Lt. Col. Lakin may go to prison. I see the point Sharp Tool has made, and that may also be a winnable argument because up until this point, according to Lakin, no evidence has been produced that requires him to follow the orders of the commander-in-chief if he is ineligible to serve in this capacity. Once that evidence is produced, per Lt. Col. Lakin’ own letter to President Obama, he will immediately follow any orders he is given. Thus, I am not sure if he has technically broken the law, though I am sure we will find out soon enough if the court martial proceeds as NBC claims.

        If you have a link to any of the copies of the birth certificate that have been circulated, please post it here. Up to this point, I have not been able to find any such document on the web. Please note that I am aware of the certification of live birth, available for viewing here, but this is where the argument begins, as I pointed out in the article above.

        In any case, this whole thing is a mess and the country would have been better off if the President would simply allow the State of Hawaii to release he actual birth certificate, which should include the name of the hospital and attending physician at his birth.

      19. Mac, What I tried to point out is that any individual running for office must pass inspection from the Federal Election Commission, and the Public Disclosure Commission.  There is no chance whatsoever that anyone, regardless of how well connected, could get through and get their name on the ballot without being qualified to hold that office, (constitutionally).  I’ve been through a less rigorous form of the same thing, and there is no fucking way that a non-American born citizen would get on there.

      20. If this court martial does happen it will likely be little more than a 3 ring circus dog and pony show. Does anyone here really think that someone with the power and resources this communitarian prick now has can’t whip up a document that will be heralded by all as the absolute certified “real thing”?

        Certainly they could just find a Dr. who worked at a Hawaiian hospital who’s now dead and use him as the attending physician. Add in the intelligencia machine to scrub this Dr.’s past and any trace of anyone still living who knew him and, voila, instant legitimacy! As for the hospital…we’ve already heard the easy out about how records were missing/lost, haven’t we? As if they even need to go this far.

        Anything that even gets close to the truth will likely be hidden in the name of “national security.” What if the rumor is true that Barry was recruited as a CIA asset while at Occidental? If that did happen to be true you might as well try to get the truth out a ghost (but it certainly would explain some obvious and glowing holes in his resume and all the worldly travels back then with no source of income, would it not?).

        As I see it the man is a veritable puppet of the Zionist elite (as was Bush and every other President since Nixon, if not before, IMHO) and the hour has passed to do anything meaningful about it.

        Participate in trying to change the situation while that’s still an option and prepare for the all too obvious which lies ahead…where each of us will have to decide where our true allegiance lies and what we’re willing to sacrifice to remain free.

      21. Here’s a website that clarifies a great deal of confusion people have over the differences between the following definitions of citizenship:
        Natural Born Citizen
        Native Born Citizen
        Citizen by Statute and/or Naturalized Citizen


        Many of the comments above are confusing a natural born citizen with a native born citizen.

        The “legal” definition in place, at the time Obama was born, for a natural born citizen is someone who is born in the US, to parents who are both US citizens.

        Obama’s father was NOT an US citizen, therefore, even if he was born in Hawaii, which has yet to be verified, the fact that he was not born to parents who were BOTH citizens of the US, brings his natural born status into question, as well as bringing up legal questions pertaining to possible dual citizenship due to his father not being a US citizen.

        In addition to this matter, following are just a couple of the numerous other concerns regarding Obama’s background that brings his natural born status into question: 

        He has not produced a copy of his passport, therefore, how was he able to travel to Pakistan in the 80’s when Pakistan was on the No Fly List for Americans traveling with an American passport. 

        He has not produced his school records which would also list his “cistizen status” and would enable us to see if he received financial aid as Barry Soetero, possibly as a “foreign student”.

        The concerns regarding Obama’s eligibility to be POTUS are legitimate and not just based on whether or not he was born in the US.  This issue has been ignored or marginalized by the media, but is a MUCH larger and legitimate concern than most people realize.

      22. If you folks believe for one second that any federal or military judge will demand the real birth certificate which would guarantee to set off thousands of cities to burn in protests and riots,then I have a bridge to sell you.
        Absolutely nobody has the balls to open that can of worms.
        The NSA,CIA,FBI and all police know in advance what would take place shortly afterwards.
        This officer will be quietly allowed to retire before it comes to that time.

      23. “They are being guided by their ethnic consideration and objectives. They are living in the past. If America was living in a situation where they feared
        ethnicity and did not see itself as a multiparty state or nation, how could a young man born here in Kenya, who is not even a native American, become the President of America? It is because they did away with exclusion.” *
        (From the Kenya Nat’l Assembly Thursday March 25, 2010)

      24. Thanks Mac.
        I for one know that the “Doc” was required to submit his birth certificate before joining the military and becoming an Officer which includes a background security clearance.  We need more people like the Doc.  This man has true character.

      25. Sharp, You and I are essentially saying the same thing. No birth certificate no Court Martial conviction. If the government shows up with a valid birth certificate, the officer is guilty as charged. I was an officer and know the UCMJ and the manual for Courts Martial. He will have not followed a valid order if they can produce evidence O’Bama is a natural born U.S. citizen.
        Sorry, Jonny V, you sir are totally out to lunch!!!

      26. Thanks Colonel.  You still are.  I have 29 so far.

      27. Spreading this would be a good thing..,
        Feeling a little down? All dressed up and nowhere to go?
        Try this on for size..,
        Come on down to Madisonville, TN on the 20th where we can show support for another Oath Keeper (in the trueset sense of the words) Lt. Cmdr. Walter Fitzpatrick III (Ret) who was, on the 1st of April arrested while performing a legal citizens arrest. Seems the local police and Sheriffs don’t really know that much about their own TN Constitution or the U.S. one either and we must be there to show them what it all means. Fitzpatrick has put his life, honor and fortune on the line for every one of you and now it’s time to honor that sacrifice by being there to show support as he has his day in court. I will be there just as I was when he was arrested. I will finish the job he started by affecting (again) the citizens arrest of these out of control politicians. The call went out then and only two (2) OathKeepers showed up. Is this the kind of showing you guys, ahem, I’m also a member, are accustomed to?
        Let there be no doubt, they know we’re coming and only by having a large number of Patriots show up can we begin to affect the kind of meaningful change this country wants and needs. No less than the repatriation of America with its God given rights as expressed in the Constitution. That very document we all took an oath to uphold and defend.
        For those of you who are not Oath Keepers I suggest you take that oath and then join us at ground zero in this action to restore our Republic one county at a time. Come one, come all to the new Lexington/Concord.
        Be a leader, don’t follow the crowd, follow your heart and mind. This is a noble cause for a noble Patriot who refused to back down when he initially filed criminal charges of Treason against Barry Soetoro. Those charges still stand and I have many other Patriots who are former military that have stepped forward and delivered their own Treason charges.
        I have no idea what to expect in terms of who will show but I will never let this Patriot down and both hope and pray that the leadership of the Oath Keepers and other organizations will see the need for you to grow a pair and show up (Not meant for the two of you who did). This is no drill or exercise, it is an educational tool for you to use in the ongoing quest to educate law enforcement in Monroe County, TN and then, the rest of the country.
        the 20th of April at 0900 in front of the Monroe County Court house.
        “They are being guided by their ethnic consideration and objectives. They are living in the past. If America was living in a situation where they feared
        ethnicity and did not see itself as a multiparty state or nation, how could a young man born here in Kenya, who is not even a native American, become the President of America? It is because they did away with exclusion.” *
        (From the Kenya Nat’l Assembly Thursday March 25, 2010)
        How much are you willing take sitting down?

      28. little johnny v is a half wit troll, stop feeding his nonsense, he tries to rile everyone on every article, ignore and he will eventually get hungry and have to go up upstairs for one of is mommies nutter-butter sandwiches.  Go play over at the Huffington post, its always recess time there.

      29. Jonny V- I have ran for federal office before and I was never required to prove my citizenship.  You are full of beans.

        The fact that they have to resort to name-calling (calling truth seekers “birthers”) instead of simply producing legit proof is all the evidence you need that they are covering this up.  They use the same tactic for EVERYTHING they cover up.

      30. Leo Donofrio has coined the phrase
        NBC Gate
        Couldn’t agree more.
        For those who would defend Soetoro’s coverup I have nothing but pitty. How easily you’ve been duped and how ready you are to accept the bondage promissed. History will forget you but not the men and women who now stand up for truth, justice and the American way.

      31. Disinter.  I went back and looked at my C1 and F1 forms, and dammit, you’re right.  None of my personal birth info on there.  I still don’t believe that someone not qualified could get through however.  At least I didn’t go the childish route like half-wit above.

      32. Bill O is reporting this story right now.  Bill doesn’t quite understand.

      33. As I have said before Obama is a total fraud and ineligible to be president of the United States.   He is a articulate self serving sociopath chosen by global elitists to continue the subjugation of the United States and it’s citizens to global governance.     Bush Jr. was also under the control of these same elitists.   If you recall Daddy Bush always frequently mentioned “new world order” in his speeches.  These conspirators think the American people are dumb and will never figure it out.   But through the internet their evil designs are being openly discussed in forums like this.  Let your family, friends, and neighbors know that Obama is selling our country out to the elitists.  He is a traitor of the highest order.  

      34. Hey Mac, thanks for that clarification. The Lowell Weicker example is cool. Thanks too to Diane.

        I would think that everything would have to be null and void. The real problem is that by the time the courts decide, this guy will be out of office anyway.

        And good riddence to bad rubbish!

      35. From my humble research, the whole “birther” and counter arguments are just another red herring by the powers-that-be. It is a well documented fact that Barry Soetoro, aka, Barack Obama was emigrated by his step-father to Indonesia. His citizenship, was required by Indonesian law to attend school. He took trip to Pakistan when he was in college (if he was in college – there is no documentation of that either), and conjectured that carried an Indonesian passport. It is a fact that he is an illegal alien who has overstayed his visit. It can even be found on Google, tho I prefer to use AltaVista.
        Less that three years to go until the nightmare ends and rebuilding can begin.

      36. It’s very strange to think that the last three terms of the US presidency have had questions of authenticity but quickly hushed. Bush stole two terms with questionable polling machines and Obama’s eligibility is in the dark. This last guy even got a Nobel Peace Prize but a bit cloudy for what. All this must be directed from the same oligarchial political machine of profound power, money and connections throughout the world.
        This group must be laughing their heads off at how easy it is to blatantly dupe the populace. Even my spell check doesn’t recognize Obama. It wants to insert Osama instead. I get a real kick from that. You’d think Microsoft Word would have changed it by now. The joke is a big one.

      37. Terry Lakin will find out that beliefs and facts are two very different things and in the end his courts-martial will be his own public humiliation for believing something he can not prove. I would love to be there during the military trial and find out what facts he has, internet gossip? Let’s face it no one will take the Birthers seriously until they win a case, but until then, they will continue to appear dumb, crazy or racist, or maybe all three. The old GOP Confederacy, that is what these liars want, good luck with that.

      38. Montana, thanks for your comment.

        In my view, what makes this case different from past birther cases, is that in essence, it is now the government that would be bringing charges against Lakin, as opposed to Lakin filing a lawsuit. Thus, the burden of proof should not be with Lakin, but with the military to prove that the President is authorized, by the constitution, to be the commander in chief.

        In regards to internet rumors – which rumors are you referring to? Most of this has been extensively documented, and the videos that are posted above are just a fraction of the documented evidence that suggests President Obama was either born outside of the USA, or at some time held the citizenship of another country, both of which would make him ineligible for the highest office.

        As an example, how can Mr. Obama’s trip to Pakistan in the early 1980’s be explained? How was he able to enter this country with a US passport? Mr. Obama himself, in his book, claimed he had visited Pakistan at a time when US passport holders would not be allowed into the country. And this is just one of many unexplained instances.

        Again, there is a very simple solution here, and that is to produce his Hawaiian birth certificate. Once that is done, the case is closed.

      39. “If the government shows up with a valid birth certificate, the officer is guilty as charged. I was an officer and know the UCMJ and the manual for Courts Martial. He will have not followed a valid order if they can produce evidence O’Bama is a natural born U.S. citizen.”

        I do not think a guilty verdict would be fair even if the government produces a valid birth certificate so long as he follows orders after being shown the proof he is asking for.

        He would have followed the orders if he believed the paperwork was in order.

        On the other hand, a brutal and evil empire is likely to fry him up as an example to anyone who demands the truth before acting.

      40. Can someone please explain why you can’t see the forest for the trees?
        Article II Section I Clause V answers all questions about eligibility. For God’s sake read it and understand that his father was a British subject and NEVER a U.S. citizen. That alone makes him ineligible. Period!
        Or is reading and understanding this law just too much of a bother.
        Read it, understand it and let’s remove him ASAP before he completely destroys what’s left of our country.

      41. Frankly speaking, I do not care what Lakin, you or others like you believe and cannot prove in a court of the United States (civilian/ military). That is your entire problem, your side has not won a case, and the apparent documents that were presented were laughed at. Honestly what facts are you basing your arguments on, not internet fabrications (or wishful thing). Until real facts are presented reality dictates all of you will be continue to be disregarded. Deal with that honey.

      42. No doubt Obama is a fraud being financed by the Saudis. He has paid members of congress to go along with this ploy and has also threatened them within an inch of their life to keep their moths shut.  I suggest that all of the troops in the U.S. Military do the same as Terry Larkin “refuse to go to Afghanistan and Iraq” that should bring about a real showdown.

      43. This stinks.The judge did not let him show any evidents or speak.Or the witness’s speak.. This is what had been all along.No Judge would look at anything they will say denied. and the last one said it would be embarrament to Onbama. Now it’s only cost 12 -13- dollars for a long form birth certificate. No the fraud pays attorneys over a million dollars to keep his Birth Certifiace and documents sealed and hidden.. You know that guy who was goibng to be a wittness of Obama’s ss Number ? Well dayd before he was due to court he was killed.What about the one  who got into a wall street wealthy people  secert meeting Obama  was there he said  WEST VA  gling to thier guns and reglion.. well that guy was  shot while he was parked by a church.

      Commenting Policy:

      Some comments on this web site are automatically moderated through our Spam protection systems. Please be patient if your comment isn’t immediately available. We’re not trying to censor you, the system just wants to make sure you’re not a robot posting random spam.

      This website thrives because of its community. While we support lively debates and understand that people get excited, frustrated or angry at times, we ask that the conversation remain civil. Racism, to include any religious affiliation, will not be tolerated on this site, including the disparagement of people in the comments section.