Loan Debt Trap Swallowing Up Consumers Making Bad Decisions: “Shame On Me. But Damn, Shame On Them”

by | Jun 6, 2016 | Conspiracy Fact and Theory, Headline News | 99 comments

Do you LOVE America?



    This article was written by Tyler Durden and originally published at Zero Hedge.

    Editor’s Comment: Say what you will. The character in this story admitted his foolish mistakes. But there is a predatory system in place, and its operation goes to the very top. Stupid people and bad consumers are absolutely getting eaten alive, and a pound of flesh is once again demanded from all the rest.

    As SHTF has noted many times before, the debt crisis is going to absolutely map the landscape. Impossible fines and fees, and terms that the illiterate and inexperienced average Americans are being signed onto amount to a modern day siege of slavery.

    • U.S. Marshals Collect Unpaid Student Loan Debt At Gunpoint: “Isn’t The First And Won’t Be The Last”
    Specter of Debtors’ Prisons Looms Over Americans Who Just Can’t Pay: “You Can’t Squeeze Blood From a Turnip”
    Short on Cash, “Poor Americans Ending Up in Modern-Day Debtors’ Prison” Over Traffic Fines
    Injustice System: Texas Jail Sued for Locking Up The Poor: “They Can’t Afford Bail or Trial”

    Through financial enslavement, individuals – regardless of background – are being held back. They are stunted, and deprived of the opportunity to ever be truly free and working towards their own ends. Many are once again being literally jailed in modern debtor’s prisons.  Though escape may be theoretically possible, many people are falling into a trap from which there is seemingly no escape. It is indeed a vicious cycle.  Welcome to the age of neofeudalism.



    “I’m Considering Filing Bankruptcy” – St. Louis Proves A Harbinger Of Things To Come For Subprime Auto Lending

    by Tyler Durden

    “Subprime lending is a calculated risk – we know that some of the customers won’t pay, we just don’t know which at the time the loan is made. With higher default rates come higher expenses, and higher interest rates are necessitated to remain solvent. That’s a quote made in a statement by Midwest Acceptance corporation, who specializes in high interest car loans for subprime borrowers in the St. Louis area.

    Stories like the one involving William Lesinski are becoming all too common in the St. Louis region. Lesinski’s story begins with taking out a ridiculously high interest rate loan for a car to be given as a graduation present for his son, and ends with his wages being garnished – beyond the amount of the court judgement.

    Wanting to buy his son a car as a high school graduation gift, Lesinski put $1,750 down and drove off the lot in a 2003 Ford Mustang. The loan for the car was $11,367, and it carried 29 percent annual interest over nearly four years. His son would make the payments, but the loan was in Lesinski’s name.

    After paying the balance down to a little more than $10,000, his son, who had stopped making insurance payments, wrecked the car, Lesinski said. In 2011, after more than $4,000 in interest had accrued, Car Credit City’s in-house finance arm, General Credit Acceptance, sued Lesinski. Factoring in attorney fees, the court judgment came to more than $15,000.

    After Lesinski fell behind on a payment plan later that year, General Credit Acceptance began garnishing a portion of his check from a Fenton painting company. It hasn’t stopped since.

    As of Friday, the company has taken $22,600 of Lesinski’s wages. Because Missouri court judgments can carry the interest from the initial contract, little of that money has gone toward principal. Lesinski assumed the balance was near zero. In fact, he still owes almost $13,000.

    In order to get a better understanding of the subprime auto lending activity in the region, the St. Louis Post-Dispatch analyzed court data from suits involving three area auto finance companies. Since 2010, those firms alone have filed more than 15,300 lawsuits against borrowers in local courts, and the vast majority of cases resulted in a judgement against the defendant, after which the lender often sought to garnish wages from the borrower.

    The Post-Dispatch found that contracts involved in the suits typically have an interest rate between 24% and 29.75% over terms ranging from three to five years. The Post-Dispatch followed up with interviews of borrowers, many of whom had rates of nearly 30%. Some said they knew the interest was high, but signed papers because they couldn’t get to work without a car. Others said they didn’t understand the terms until they fell behind.

    I wasn’t very good on paperwork” said Lesinski – that’s an understatement.

    Although Lesinski isn’t alone in claiming ignorance…

    My clients aren’t sophisticated enough to know that they should negotiate the price or interest rate. They just think this is the interest rate they deserve. They think they deserve a 30 percent interest on a car loan.” said Rob Swearingen, an attorney who represents borrowers being sued by subprime lenders. “This is the way people get poor or stay poor in this country. This is the biggest purchase most low-income consumers will ever make. They don’t buy houses. They buy cars. And if they get ripped off at a young age, you get a judgement against you, and you start off behind the eight ball immediately.” Swearingen added.

    Acording to the National Alliance of Buy Here Pay Here Dealers, those that focused on buyers with poor credit histories had a default rate of 31% in 2014. But even in that niche, loans carrying a 29% interest rate are too high said Ken Shilson, who heads the group. “When you load that kind of interest on a car they can’t afford anyway, it’s destined to fail. If you set someone up to fail, they’re going to fail on their own. They don’t need any extra help.” Shilson said.

    According to research firm Experian Automotive, the average subprime borrower received interest rates ranging from 15.3% to 18.5%.

    Because many people sued over debts don’t show up in court, debt collection dockets are often a parade of default judgements against borrowers. For those that do go to court, many were put on payment plans through consent judgements, but when they fall behind, the contract interest and the original unpaid balance applied, and lenders frequently resort to garnishing wages at that point.

    Christopher McGraugh, now a family court judge has presided over countless debt collection suits and says that “In many of these instances, you can never get out from underneath these judgements because the interest rates are so high.”

    Cerissa Robinson said she is considering filing for bankrupcy in order to get out from underneath a mountain of debt. Robinson took out a 26.75% interest loan, and yet another to cover the down payment, which had an interest rate of 62%. Cerissa lost a job and had to take one at lower pay – “I’m considering filing bankruptcy

    David Chapnick, president of Modern Finance said that he makes extensive efforts to contact borrowers before resorting to lawsuits: “I don’t want to sue anybody, but I’ve got to pay postage. I’m paying rent. I’ve got to run a business here.”

    At the end of the day, Lesinski says “Maybe I wasn’t very smart. Shame on me. But damn, shame on them.”

    * * *

    As we have pointed out numerous times, student loans and auto loans are the next two credit bubbles waiting to erupt and cause chaos in the markets, and St. Louis is a harbinger of what is to come.

    While we don’t condone taking advantage of anyone’s situation, we are stunned to see these decisions be downplayed by individuals as just chalking it up to “I wasn’t very good at paperwork” and lawyers telling everyone that clients aren’t “sophisticated enough”.

    Then again, the fact that Bernie Sanders receives a large portion of his campaign funds from the government, we shouldn’t be surprised at all.

    This article was written by Tyler Durden and originally published at Zero Hedge.


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      1. What happened to usury laws? Do we still have them?

        • The laws vary from state to state. For example, I believe the limit on credit cards in NC is 18%. That’s why none of the credit cards are issued from NC banks. Most I’ve seen were issued from Delaware. Cards from Delaware could have as much as 25% or more in interest. Someone showed me a statement from one card based in South Dakota that listed the interest rate as 25.49%.

          There are other limits, usually higher, on finance companies.

          It used to be that you could get 4% in savings and pay 10% or 12% on a loan. Now you get .25% in savings and pay 15, 20, or 25% on loans.

          It doesn’t matter to the bankers that greed is a sin.

          • The Central Bankers do the same thing on a Global scale. They print money out of thin air, then loan way more money to a Country, than they can pay back. The Hook is now set… When they begin to default like Greece did, the Bankers swoop in and take hard assets from the country in the form of Real Estate and Mineral Resource Asset control.. Thus the populations within the country suffer at the expense of Bad Government Management. How is it that a small Island like Puerto Rico can have $6 Billion in debt? And default? Who’s fault is that?


            • Puerto Rico’s debt is closer to $73 billion, not 6. 6 would be a breeze.
              Blame local politicians mostly. Every governor for the past 50+ years has pillaged the money.
              It’s stunning how widespread the corruption is. It is very difficult to get a permit for a small business or a large one.
              One big company here that sells commercial roof steel had to wait 6 YEARS to get a permit to open another office across the island.
              The mechanics are simple. The rulers in PR look like Spanish or even Caucasian aristocrats, similar to what you see in Cuba (very few, if any, Afro-Cubans in government there).
              Education sucks, they do not teach English and the point is to keep the population dumbed down and voting for one of two corrupt band of thieves (parties) that do nothing for the economy.
              I could go on but you all know the drill..

              • You are correct Katch-Up on your shirt. It was that higher amount. It is actually $73 BILLION in debt. I was thinking of some other statistic. And I have said that other amount on here before. So thanks for pointing that out. Glad to see eyes open here in search of the facts. I have no problem if someone corrects me here with facts, and provides a link. See below.


                Sunday June 5th – In many ways, Sunday’s Democratic party primary in Puerto Rico perfectly encapsulates the $73bn debt crisis that is seeping into every corner of this poverty-stricken Caribbean island.

                ht tps://

          • When I travel for business I note the advertised credit interest rates and the bank savings rates. It is just wild what is going on right now. In Europe, I saw credit cards advertised with an interest rate up to 55%. And bank accounts that charged people to make a deposit. So, if you want credit, you pay up to 55%; but if you try to save money, you have to pay the bank to keep it, so it gets eaten up.

            People are being fleeced alive by the financial system. It can be for one reason only: to create impoverished slaves who will do any work just to get food.

          • Interest only matters if you carry a balance.

          • D-E-B-T is the most destructive word in the English vocabulary. I have a credit card, I rarely use it and when I do I pay the total when I get the bill. Only a fool would carry a credit card balance. Another one is payday loans; IDIOTS!!! My wife drives a 21 yr old car, looks good and runs good; paid cash for it when it was five years old. My old Ford truck is 18 yrs old; not only does it run great it has the advantage of never having to be washed. Try living within your means, you’ll love it.

        • NOT LEGAL IN US.
          (BUT THEY STILL TRY……)

          • Good Morning Peeps. I have said over and over again on here to NEVER Do ANY BANKING ON YOUR CELL PHONE, SHUT OFF THE WiFi and GPS Features as well. Also Don’t open suspicious emails or links within emails as they will direct you to Key Logger Spyware and banking hacks.

            Here is the latest Threat.

            A Private Industry Notification (PIN) concerning Android Malware actively customer credentials has been posted to the XXXX (Redacted)system.

            The XXXXX (redacted Government Agency) has identified two Android malware families, SlemBunk and
            Marcher, actively phishing for specified US financial institutions�
            customer credentials. The malware monitors the infected phone for the
            launch of a targeted mobile banking application to inject a phishing
            overlay over the legitimate application�s user interface. The malware
            then displays an indistinguishable fake login interface to steal the
            victim�s banking credentials. According to cyber threat industry
            reports, both malware families have targeted foreign financial
            institutions since 2014, gradually broadening the list to include
            Western banks, and offered the malware for lease or purchase,
            respectively, in underground forums. At least as of December 2015, the
            malware expanded its configuration to include the Android package
            names of US financial institutions.

            I could give you the rest of the full document, but then I would have to kill you. You must have a security clearance to access this.

            ~WWTI… Stay Safe, and Get ALL your Money out of all Banks ASAP. Once they hack into a bank, it free for the pickings. One Company had $750K disappear out of their Bank Acct overnight. Try to get that back.

            A Dollar collapse may come in the form of a Black Swan Cyber attack that brings the banks down, so basically they can hide their fraud and bankruptcy and you lose your money as well. Only leave as much money in the banks to cover you monthly check writing expenses, Get the rest out ASAP.

        • Caveat Emptor- Buyer Beware. Ahhh just go down to the corner and get a Loan from lefty the Loan Shark.

          Another Huge scam is “Payday Advance” High interest Rate and Fees scam. Quit spending money you don’t have. Its a Rat Race to the bottom. Also “Buy Here Pay here Auto Dealers”.. Sucker born every minute – PT Barnum

          Its pretty nice being debt free. I own every day for myself.


        • Why don’t all these dumb fools who signed contracts that they no longer can afford just use the Hillary Defense. It sure seems to work for her, may even get her into the Whitehouse.

          How totally lame. You want to purchase something you cannot afford, have terrible credit, what exactly do you think is going to happen. Do you really believe any loan company out there is going to just hand you an interest friendly loan, of course not.

          It is not the loan company’s fault that you are too lazy, or too ignorant, to read what you are signing Before you put your signature making it a legally binding contract.

          The same goes for all the bloody fools who went out buying homes without having sufficient income, or credit to do so. If you Sign a Contract, it is a Contract. No one Forced you to sign, take the money, and purchase something you had no right buying in the first place.

          And Now, we are taking it up the proverbial ass bailing all of your sorry asses out.

          • Yep the sorry state of the economy is the fault of people that took out loans from predators. GET A CLUE GO AFTER THE PROBLEM CREATORS INSTEAD OF THE LOW HANGING FRUIT.

          • The Hillary Defense –
            Collection agency: “Sir you defaulted on your Loan.”

            Debtor’s Reply: “Hey What difference at this point does it make?”


      2. When you purchase on credit until you make the very last payment you are nothing more than a glorified renter. save your money and pay cash. I know it can be done because we paid cash for everything we own even our home.

        • It’s all about financial discipline and proper money management. We pay cash for everything as well, except our house and cars. Our youngest son sits down with me a couple times a month and learns about bill paying. He sees firsthand how to manage money correctly. I love going to buy a new tv or computer and whip out cash most people charge stuff like that to credit cards, so this turns into a teaching moment because when we get home, well calculate what credit actually costs. Turns out, you could end up buying 3 tv’s. I like my son to see this because this is the seed planted in his mind to get him to understand how to handle money. Strict discipline is so valuable. We used credit cards carefully and methodically to get our credit scores above 800. There are so many predator lenders out there especially credit cards that focus and feed off people’s lack of discipline. I say use it to your advantage. Make it work for you. Stay quiet Be smart.

          • and be content, which is great gain.

            we don’t need every new thing that comes along.

            it’s all made so you have to buy more to update it and make it work… or buy a new something to keep up with the tech.

            there’s a name for that, but I think of it at the moment.

            contentment is great gain

            • Grandee
              You nailed it on the head. I have a big list of things for my homestead and can’t buy it all. I spent much of every day working the free to me stuff already here… and go to bed content at night. Every now and again I add to my preps, but the best prep is contentment. Having slaved for those at the top… I saw no contentment just misery.

        • Yup, I’m 38 and I’ve never bought new or had a car payment in my life 🙂

          • This is where BH1776 chimes in with his usual, I never got a credit card in my like. Never bought a new car and pay cash for everything, Never owed a house, cause I gots No Credits. Not sure why but I am not worthy.


            • Wwti
              Why do you care so much unless Braveheart is insulting you? He is not insulting most of the time. Look inside.

              • When you have no life, you make one out of other peoples.

              • Rebecca the wanna-be hall monitor. Can I pass to the bathroom, or shall I just pee on your pant leg?


            • WWTI, it’s OK, I know you’re just kidding. Even you admit that it’s best to be debt-free.

              • hey dubyuh, I never got a credit card in my life. Never bought a new car, and pay cash for everything, Never owned a house, cause I got No Credit. Not sure why but I am not worthy. but i wouldn’t change a DAMN THING! i can (and DID) buy anything i need, and i pay CASH for it. when i buy a new recliner today, i aint buying 2 for someone else because i bought it on credit….cash is KING….always has been, always will be.

                • Yep BH1776, I was just pointing out the repetitive parrot talk, I see on here. Truly to live debt free is the best. I have made mistakes in the past back when in my younger years with credit, and it took years for me to straiten it out. However I knew the only way I could buy a house is having great credit, and with house equity, I could profit even greater. I prefer to buy my cars and trucks New with Credit, then quickly pay them off, and drive them for hundreds of thousands of miles for another 8 to 12 years. Done that several times over with no regrets. I buy a cars New and I stay on top of all maintenance. I needed dependability in a car for work, not wasting time fixing shit over and over year after year with someone else’s used hand me downs. That’s me. Never be afraid to invest in quality. Unless you like wasting days tinkering with low tier BS? Not my thing.


          • Me too, but I’m only 37 for a few more days.

        • If a man makes enough surplus income to set aside 20k per year – I don’t know any – how many years would it take to make a purchase on a $150k house/property (which isn’t much these days) and will still likely require repairs?

          It’s not 7.5 years.

          Should you put your hard earned savings in the bank remember that the constantly devaluing dollar thanks to the federal reserve must be taken into account. A conservative number is on average 3% per year. So how may years must you save and have your money stolen while you pay rent for housing in the meantime?

          • the house you buy today, will LIKELY be worth about HALF in the next year or two….interest rates go UP, house prices go DOWN…..math is LAW, you know….just like gravity. how is it that our houses are priced about DOUBLE what they were in year 2000….yet we make WAY less money, thanks to inflation?

            • I was speaking mainly in regard to saving money, a sizeable portion, saving large quantities of cash for long periods is futile. Most folks (myself included) haven’t gotten a raise in over a decade.

        • Notice in the Graph Above: The Highest Default Rates are in the Unsecured Debt Sectors. And the Biggest Default Rate is in the Student Loan Scam sector. Did you get schooled? Bwhahahahahaaa..

          When I went to a State University 35 yrs ago the semester tuition was only about $1300 for a full boat of classes. When the Government Guaranteed The Colleges and Banks Scam Loans, that is the downfall. Let the Banks absorb their own loses, and not the Tax payers. I would fine every Bank a Trillion Dollars combined to cover their bad Student Loans over decades. Banks will give anybody loan if the Government Guarantees it. Like why are TAX PAYERS on the Hook for the Fascism between banks and the Government? That is called Wealth Transfer. The Banksters are all parked on their Bigass Yachts laughing drinking martini’s and playing with hookers at US Tax payers expense. Yachts can sink just as good as any other boat, just punch a few holes in the hull with a few Armor piercing rounds.. Weeeeee……….


        • Exactly! The best thing anyone can do is learn about money, learn to pay your bills off on time, learn to invest wisely, and learn to say no to bad deals. It took me years to catch on, but I’m almost out of the trap, and if a construction guy like me can do it, then most others can too.

          Avoid big banks, use credit unions ONLY
          Keep month or two emergency in the CU
          All other cash/PM reserve kept in safe at home
          No more in credit cards than you can pay off in two months or less
          Use your matching funds from employer to the max, but no more than that
          Educate your kids

      3. Two Words


        Great job parents burdening an impressional 18 year old with almost an almost $12,000 car loan. What that kid is learning from you two is what not to do.

      4. That last delinquency chart says it all. The deterrent of losing the roof over your head first… then, the repo man making a surprise visit for the pickup truck. Not so much worried about credit cards or school loans because the consequences don’t seem as tangible, until nobody will float your busted butt any credit at all anymore.

        Rumor has it that a single older woman just bought the 4 bedroom home across the road from us for 400K. Not saying that she can’t afford it, but can’t help but wonder why she is buying such a large house. People follow their wanna have impulses and end up in trouble.

        • Maybe she has 200 cats !

      5. Young people today are brought up in a world of immediate gratification. They are not taught personal financial responsibility at home nor at school. The “keeping up with the Jones” mentality and the ignorance of our populous has led to way to many bad loans and many people wasting their income on things they don’t need with money they don’t have. To top it off the tee are way too many companies willing to knowingly take advantage of them. All the while our government stands by and allows it to happen. When you consider this plus the economy crippling entitlement system, it’s no wonder our country is in grave financial trouble.

        • Here Here

      6. The failure of these borrowers is intentional. These companies count on defaults, with some buy here pay here cars seeing 20 repossessions from the same dealer. Because the borrower now has ruined credit and still needs to get to work, they end up at the same exact sort of place and rinse and repeat.

        Part of the problem is the type of vehicles these poor slobs choose to buy. If you have low income, the last thing you need is a vehicle with high running costs, yet that is exactly what many of them choose to buy. They will pay too much for a well-used full size SUV or pickup truck with very high mileage or a 10 year old luxury car. They tend to be too brand and image conscious and do not know how to live within their means. Sorry, but if you have very limited income, you need to choose a vehicle based upon reliability, fuel consumption, maintenance and repair costs and insurance costs and not try to be what you are not. I always advise people in this sort of situation that they need to buy a used Toyota and that the used Toyota they buy should be either a Yaris, a Corolla or a Prius. They have no “street cred”, but all of the above offer low cost motoring and will easily last hundreds of thousands of miles with attention to basic maintenance (with the Prius models requiring battery fan cleaning every 20-30k as their only quirk). They have been made in the millions, so parts are extremely cheap and they have timing chain engines so as not to need expensive timing belt services that poor people often can’t afford. Also, most of them are now fairly cheap as used car prices have collapsed for non truck and luxury models. Then again, poor people are usually poor because they continually make poor decisions and so it is damn hard to get them to follow my advice.

        • Prius is overpriced. It would take about 10 yrs of fuel savings (assuming no extra cost of ownership) to break even with many of the econoboxes out there.

          • I don’t consider a $5,000-$10,000 used car to be overpriced. The low fuel prices have crashed the used car prices of these things (especially the Prius C subcompact), which is why I suggested them.

            • Prius is a POS. All the hybrid cars are.

              • That’s why they regularly go 500,000 miles on their original drivetrain and battery when properly maintained and used as taxi cabs. Several have already crossed the million mile mark too. They require less maintenance than an ordinary car and can even go 200,000 city miles on a single set of brake pads, and oil changes are every 10,000 miles. Newer ones don’t even use drive belts, so there is no need to change them either. They have a reputation for never going wrong until they get old or have several hundred thousand miles on them.

                The only quirks to maintenance are cleaning the battery fan, changing the hybrid system coolant pump when changing the coolant and changing the transmission fluid every 30k or 60k miles in heavy use (depending on who you ask). None of these items are in the owner’s manual, but they are the known items that those in the ownership community recommend to get the best results.

        • Most Loans on every level are packaged up and resold many times over, Mortgages to car loans. So there is incentive to give out bad loans and sell off the problems to someone else. Until institutions stop buying loan paper this trend will continue.

          Our Government has taken on all the Risk from bad shoddy bank loans. That is not what Capitalism is about. That is outright Theft from the American people. And the Thieves need to be Hanged.

          Who says politics and political contributions don’t pay.

          ~WWTI…. We as Tax Payers, need to start placing liens on the Government’s assets for recovery to make us Whole Again.

      7. I agree with you Winston. But I wonder what would happen in a generation if our society was forced to suffer for their bad decisions and had to pay the stupid tax. That is to say if they had to pay the consequences of bad decisions,laziness and weakness then surely the country would be stronger as a result.

        • They do pay the “stupid tax” and suffer the consequences. The problem is that they do not realize it and continue in the same pattern of behavior. It’s one of those things that I am fond of saying: Most people do not reason, they emote. Thus their decisions are usually not based upon reason.

          I work in the restaurant industry in a fairly low level position. I see how other people think and I try to help those who will ask me to make better decisions in my areas of expertise, namely cars. It is truly shocking what some dealers try to sell you for too much money and even worse, what some people end up buying. I can usually find someone a very serviceable vehicle for around $1,000-$1500 and save them from the payment trap. It may require some minor work (which I sometimes help them with) but it is a vehicle that can be owned free and clear. I also try to teach people ways to live beneath their means by examining the details of their spending habits and learning to spend less and save more. The few who have listened to me (and not just called me an asshole) have generally wound up doing a bit better than those who don’t.

      8. Some simple financial training should be part of every person’s education. Unfortunately most schools don’t give kids even an hour of economic reality training. Some private schools however do teach the kids. My father was a great teacher and an excellent example. So also my mother. When I was about ten years old my mother was paying bills. She told me that if you have only a little money and lots of bills, just pay a little bit but do it consistently every month. My father taught us how compound interest adds up with the old question: Would you rather have ten thousand dollars? Or, would you rather have a penny that doubles every day for thirty days?

        • My daughter did a sixth grade “life” project where buying a car outright was not an option.

      9. Good advice Winston. Lot of young people buy shit because it’s pretty. I’ve owned one new vehicle in my life. My wife got it as a RN grad gift to herself with some help from me. There is nothing you can do faster to lose money than buy a new vehicle. Loses money right off the bat. But she got a Subaru which will run forever. This is another reason we need better education. Schools are turning out morons but they can tho a footbawl. Kids need a life class shop class, sewing home ec etc. buy a sensible jap car and chances are it will make it through the payment book. But these slime ball sleazy fucking car salesman are just pimples on humanity that need busted. You think they tell a 20 year old girl no don’t buy this mustang buy this Honda Accord I hate these buy here pay here shop and rob places. Interest rates this high are no excuse. Where are our leaders? They legislate where you can take a shit but not this? Back to what I been saying. Bring our God dam jobs back from Mexico and China and put this country back to work! Trump 2016. And you lazy little shits living in your parents basement playing video games and jerking off to porn you are part of the problem too

        • You drive a new car off the lot and park a used one in your driveway.

        • TM, spot on. My cars from private owners ONLY. NEVER from a dealer.

          • I’ve done very well buying rental cars, near new and well maintained

            • Paranoid. Let me tell you Rental Cars are one of the worst Investments. I worked for one of the biggest Rental car agencies out there. The Maintenance records are horrible. Cars that go out on long rental may have 12,000 miles between Oil Changes. I am not kidding you and all the abuse to the car while out of rental. The interiors are beat to shit and knobs broken off. You are buying a Rat Trap. I guess if that is you thing, you better, buy the car really really cheap. So when they go to sell these cars, they shine them up and do oil changes, and you think ahhh the oil looks great. Yeah but the slime crust within the engine is a mess.

              ~WWTI… Get a car fax and see who really owned the car? Ever see what renters of cars do to cars while on Vacation? And they are on the road with 98% occupancy getting abused daily. I have seen first hand the damage renters do, as I managed an Airport rental car agency office for several years, with $5 Million worth of cars in the fleet. Especially American Made cars are shit-boxes.

      10. Git a student loan I am paying for. The principal is doable. The interest is killing me. Just remember:any part of loan forgiveness is counted as taxable income

      11. The car dealerships in my area are absolutely overflowing with vehicles.

      12. Well, the rain from Tropical Storm Colin has just about reached my area in eastern NC, according to the radar. Hopefully the wind will stay out to sea when it passes us Tuesday afternoon.

        • The rain has just started here from Colin.

          • Tropical storms are nothing more than a big thunderstorm. They only cause damage if they are moving VERY slowly. Like 2 to 5 miles an hour.

            They usually move at 25 to 30 miles an hour so the rain they do drop moves past quickly.

            To be fooled by “TV Events” that blow disasters WAY out of proportion.

      13. I saw some big banks like Wells Fargo and Chase are offering to pay depsitors in new savings account for 18 months a gift of $250, depending on the amount.

        With banks losing their assets from defaults, this is a big red flag. When they go under, they take your savings money because no way can FDIC pay for their losses.

        • Sure the FDIC can, just turn on the printing press.

      14. How about saving $1000 for a car instead of financing one? Only pay cash.

      15. Well a 13 year old Mustang is just crap anyway. Should have looked up Consumer Reports reliability data beforehand, besides he grossly overpaid for a car that is low rated all the way around, even later year models. The ads I see for used cars are overpriced, it is epidemic in a scrounge economy. My 25 year old Toyota Tercel, the first year with the new design and logo design drives great at 166 grand miles, new priced when I bought it at 7,500 total. The price for an equivalent is closer to 20 grand now. I feel sorry for the younger people today who can’t get a break or a decent affordable car without being gouged to the moon.

        • Putting an 18 year old behind the wheel of a sports car is asking for trouble. A decade old Lincoln Mercury with 80,000 miles previously owned by some depression baby who recently departed and sold by the kids for $3000 is what the kid should have.

          • That was a great present. A totally unmanageable mountain of debt in the form of a car he was likely to get killed in. Kind of like the 20 year olds buying 1000CC bikes. They’re afraid of it at first, then quickly get brave and stupid.

          • a land yacht. 🙂

          • You just listed what I drive

      16. On the west coast of central Florida a mile from the Gulf we got a bit over 5 inches of rain so far, gusty winds today under 40 mph, power out for half an hour. Yawn.

        • For the most part, Colin has been a non event. Some rain, an occasional strong breeze, but nothing Florida hasn’t seen with a typical summer thunderstorm. My only prep was doing some soldering on one of my USB power banks and buying some milk and cookies to have while watching the rain. Yawn indeed.

      17. Do the people know that no banks make loans for anything? When a citizen goes to the bank they are not given lawful money. Lawful money is gold or silver or currency backed by gold or silver. The banks do not deal in lawful money. There is no lawful money in circulation. The banks just take your signature on a promissory note and they deposit it with the Federal Reserve as an asset. The Federal Reserve issues a check in the amount of the so called loan. The banks then take that check and charge you the consumer the principal plus interest for something they never provided in the first place. The banks commit fraud against the consumer every day. The same goes for mortgages, credit cards, and other so called loans

      18. Many have been questioning “why isn’t someone taking steps against all the things that are being thrown at us, seemingly faster and faster.” (Not a quote, just the basis of the inquiries):

        Try this link, and as I’ve said prior to this post, you can see (beyond my OWN words), that there are those “doing something” …and apparently The Feds are more than nervous about it.

        This is my final post and I bid you all farewell and Godspeed, especially to the ones who befriended me in their own ways (it is appreciated and will never be forgotten).
        NOW is an excellent time to “fall of the radar” if you’ve a lick of good sense in the matter, but of course feel totally free to do it your way, be it right or wrong). Do enjoy the link, and it starts with a small ‘movie’ of sorts…

        ht tp://


        God Bless You and Yours

        WWTI – Of course, you need not review any of the above. We all know that you are the “ultimate master” of everything” with all of the answers to everything, and singlehandedly will pull the entire world together with mere words, stunning all who hear into submission and fearfulness of your almighty and unprecedented intelligence …even if you can’t spell or express yourself ‘worth a shit’. You are A Legend In Your Own Mind …and that alone will be your undoing, possibly before the end of this year. (You can’t as much as write in cursive? lol… I would not have told nor have admitted to that one). Idiot.

        • Amen Bud.
          Be well sir.
          Been a pleasure to read your posts…

          • Funny, just bought a jp grnd chrke 02, 150k miles, grandma owned for 2k for my girls. Tight as hell, full records. 6 cylider, tow pak, never wrecked, grandma had dementia.
            Or did I just blow my opsec again?
            Why would anyone really freaking care?
            If one listens to some posters, well what can expect???

            • We had been looking for a few months.
              Lucked up on this one.
              Networking made this happen.
              Mother in law made this happen, it was her neighbor.
              New tires too. Got some torque.
              Lone wolves miss out on many opportunites…

              • Talking to yourself again dopey. Mumbling stutter…

                You don’t know shit about Lone Wolves. We network on a “need to” basis. How’s your herpies case going Cable Guy? Is your wife pissed?


                • As usual our resident athiest is spreading lies again.
                  Your eyes must be brown, since you are full of shit.
                  No one here is your ‘peeps’, Bud figured you out in 30 days.
                  You tell your boyfriend you got AIDS yet???

              • Eppe, back in March I bought a 2000 Honda Odyssey minvan from the original owner in my neighborhood for only $1800 cash. Only 124k on it and everything still works, even had cold A/C. Drove it on the last trip to the BOL and had no problems at all. Paint faded and a little rough but that doesn’t faze me at all. What’s under the hood is what really counts. Still has a good strong 3.5L engine in it. I refuse to pay an outrageous amount of money for any vehicle. Get something from a private owner, pay cash, and you don’t have a stinkin’ car note to worry about. Only insurance you need is liability.

        • Take care and God bless

          • One last post; as you may well find this of value to yourselves shortly:

            George Mason, one of the foremost framers of the Constitution and the Bill of Rights, made the statement, “The militia shall consist of the whole body of people, minus public officials.”
            This expressed intent to leave the power over government in the hands of the people, as the unorganized militia, is reinforced by many statements from the Founding Fathers. Further, the authority, duty, and obligation of the citizen militia is clearly
            expressed in our Declaration of Independence and the Constitution for The United States of America. One such provision from the Declaration of Independence clearly provides: “when any Form of Government becomes destructive to these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it [and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles, and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness]” …, further,
            “it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, …”.
            This is for We The People, and the above is our clear, legal rights and responsibilities thereof. Never allow a soul to lead you in a different path, as it will carry you into a sea of damnations and slavery. These matters, such as the above, have been subdued, deleted and oppressed by our national medias and government (as a whole, working in collusion), as they are socialist or whatever (I do not remotely attempt to discern “who is what”, but only that they are not “constitutional” and thus totally ‘out of step’ with our loves and beliefs and Law of The Land).
            Our Founding Father’s empowered us with everything we need to ‘stymie’ The Government, from the bottom up and the top down in one, felled swoop. Short and sweet, THIS is what everyone who is not “American-minded” would love to dispel from your mind (and why “none of the above” is allowed to be taught to We The People of The United States, one REPUBLIC Under God: (NOT a Democracy).

            If you want democracy you damn well know where our borders are …use them.

            Thank YOU, my friends (salute) for all you have taught, as nobody “knows it all” – and I am no exception. I stress that you increase OPSEC to the max, each and every one of you. (seriously)
            LCDR Bud out.
            /////////////////END OF TRANSMISSION/////////////////////

            • Peace and Long live the Republic ! Bud

            • Peace and Long live the Republic ! Bud

            • Bud, I hope you’ll still come back on occasion. Enjoy your posts.

            • It is time, it is definitely obvious that the government does not operate for the benefit of the people. Until they do again i will not cooperate in any way shape or form with it, dont care what kinda bullshit any of the trolls will say,,,

      19. “his son, who had stopped making insurance payments, wrecked the car,”

        Is not the lender notified if insurance is dropped on a financed car? Methinks the whole story is not told. Also, to get ass raped at 29%, you are not credit worthy and are factually bankrupt, no doubt. He bought a car for a man child who will never be anything but a drain, unless something drastic happens to turn his life around.

        • I have a friend who rolled her husband’s financed car and he had stopped paying for insurance. don’t know how long he let her drive without it, but obviously long enough to end up making payments on a car in the junkyard. Hell, some of you may have parts of it from the U Pull N Pay.

        • Typically when someone stops buying Insurance on a Vehicle, which has a lien, the previous Insurance Co reports that default to the State, which then the State DMV reports that to the Lien Holder on the vehicle, and that Lien Holder buys and Issues Car Insurance for you (Usually at massive Inflated cost) weather you like it or not,…and then adds that Insurance bill on top of your Auto loan as more debt. So… You will pay either way.


      20. Bud.

        There are those who wait a lifetime for the chance to lead men into battle and never receive it, while others have it thrust upon them. Lead, follow or get out of the way, I say.

        Take care.

      21. You won’t win the Joo games in a country that is owned by them. Don’t use their money and let them die one by one.

      22. I think the auto loan bubble will bust next. Aside from houses the next most expensive is cars. Very few folks have the coin to pay full price for a new vehicle without getting a loan. People buy shit they can’t afford all the time. I’ve seen people trade perfectly good vehicles in just because they wanted a new vehicle. Your wants will screw you every time. A lot of fools out there.

        • friend that sells cars , (& leases them) says that the new lease programs are like “lease crack”

          way too many people taking the bait .. and soon the crash and car lease and loan bubble will come back to hit hard ..

          all these “busy” car manufacturers are going to get a slow down of epic proportions , and soon

          My Office is right next door to a auto repo buiz .. its already been picking up

      23. Keep buying the Buckwheat Barry GM JUNK and spending thousands in repairs that you as a taxpayer have already paid for!!!

      24. Dahboo7 is reporting EBT \ SNAP system is down in 17 states. Bpearthwatch has a great vid of cascade rising. Watch out tomorrow everyone

        • Watch out fer them crunchberries!

        • Capt Crunch: Thought he changed to Dahboo777. That 17 state EBT down, was a few years ago.. Is this a New glitch? Look at the date on his video. Provide a link to the vid. Thx

          Either way, it is a False Flag Beta Testing to install forced rioting, all to roll out Martial Law.


        • last I saw that happened in 2013.. is Douscheboo7 recycling old news and making it seem new again ?

      25. If you play the game by their rules, you are sure to come out on the short end.

      26. Congress and Obama should be in prison for National debt.

      27. EBT/SNAP failure

        Down Detector on the web does mention it. Nothing on main news.

      28. Aside from co-signing on the loan for his son’s car, the biggest mistake this guy made was not taking the keys when his son stopped paying the insurance premium. I would have told this kid, “well….until you get insurance and payments caught up, this is my car now.” And if the kid couldn’t get a job, I’d buy him a cheap lawn mower, a hand edger and a gas can and tell him to start walking the neighborhood and find lawns to mow.

        This guy’s biggest problem is a lack of parenting skills. Way too many parents bail their kids out and pay their bills. The kids learn nothing….except a sense of entitlement.

        If the kid is over 18 and still not working, then I’d be booting him out of the house as well.

        I speak from experience on this. I’m not just talking…I’ve walked the talk.

        Tough love works.

      29. This must be one of those SLOOOOOw days.

      30. I would love to know the average IQ of those in the “debt trap”. I suspect that it runs on the low side.

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