For years it was only within the sphere of conspiracy theory and contrarian news. But a downgrade of US debt is becoming more likely as budgetary and monetary problems come to a head.
The debt ceiling debate in Congress is really nothing more than a distraction. The government will not shut down simply because just about everyone knows Congress will eventually raise the ceiling to absorb even more debt. A week or two delay is no big deal. Very few of our elected officials are prepared to take the necessary steps and the subsequent immediate pain that would follow an outright refusal to increase our debt borrowing capabilities.
But what the current budget and spending debate highlights is something worse than just the possibility of a temporary government shutdown. Tim Geithner’s letter to Congress regarding the debt ceiling in January of 2011 made it clear that We’re Literally On the Brink of Catastrophic Collapse. While a temporary government shutdown may delay some services and entitlement payments, paychecks for soldiers and processing of IRS taxes, it is nothing compared to what would happen if the US government were to lose its AAA bond status.
RT and economist Max Fraad Wolff explain:
It would create global shock waves, in part because most models and understandings of the global investing landscape, including the bond landscape, take as their central anchor the US 10 year Treasury bond as a risk-free asset.
Hat tip Daily Bail
Some argue that because the United States has the privilege of printing the US dollar, no such downgrade will ever take place. We are, after all, the reserve currency of the world, and a downgrade is simply not a possibility, according to the experts.
Within the context of this argument it is important to remember that the ratings agencies responsible for giving US bonds a AAA credit rating are the very same agencies that rated mortgage backed securities, which just so happened to be loaded with toxic paper, the same risk-free status. Nonetheless, those so-called investments were nothing more than another Wall Street Ponzi scheme designed to plunder large financial institutions and individual investors alike.
Thus, a AAA bond rating doesn’t really mean what it used.
Even while those mortgaged backed securities and other alphabet investment vehicles held triple A ratings, the entire financial system was imploding around them when investors realized that they didn’t actually hold risk-free assets, but rather, worthless paper. It didn’t take a ratings agency’s downgrade to send global markets into a free-fall.
The US dollar may very well be worth about as much as those risk-free assets of 2007. What will it matter if purportedly “independent” ratings agencies like Moody’s never downgrade US debt from AAA status if large investors like China, Russia, Japan pull the plug? Embellished or outright fraudulent ratings will only work until they don’t. The collapse of 2008 should have made that clear.
Whether US Treasury bonds are downgraded officially, or through back channels when our creditors decide to stop buying any new debt, makes absolutely no difference. The end result will be the same.
While economist Max Fraad Wolff provides us with a general overview of how world markets will react, describing the subsequent effects as a “shock wave”, understanding what that shock wave could entail may be critical to financial well being, but more importantly, your physical survival.
There are several fictional portrayals available for your review that may, in part, explain what such an event might look like. In summary, it would be the end of the world as we have come to know it, and the government shutdown in terms of essential services and entitlement payments would be permanent, not temporary.
Here is what the first 12 hours of such a collapse in US Debt purchasing might look like:
While we could debate the time line and speed of such a crisis, the overall effects on the economy and social order are, in our view, fairly accurate.
For inquiring minds, we also recommend the following resources:
The Day the Dollar Died (by John Galt) [FREE]
Indivisible (by Troy Grice) [FREE online, or available as an e-book or paperback]
Patriots (by James Rawles) [Paperback]
No Way of Avoiding Financial Armageddon (by Mac Slavo) [Article]
I’ll buy your bonds if you buy ours. The three piece quartet has been downgraded to a one man band playing the blues. He’s leaning sideways, his ankles are wet and the crew is shooting destress flares up in the air. Inflatable straight jackets anyone. I’ll bet tiny tim owns gold & a house overseas. He’ll probably file his taxes via mail.
This is silly, the Fed is already having to buy 70% of the last treasury issuance, this change in ratings will change nothing.
My favorite part of the day the dollar died vid is the Batman/Superman crossover movie billboard!
@Dave
maybenothing will happen, but i think it might force the fed to increase interest rates to attract more buyers and keep the asians from dumping what they have. And if the fed boosts interest rates, then the price goes up for everything, more people are booted from their houses, no one can BUY a house, yadda yadda yadda, cats and dogs sleeping together… mass hysteria!
Triple A rating doesn’t mean jack. The govt can and will change the rules of the game anytime it suits them, and whatever piece of paper you are holding with whatever is printed on it doesn’t mean anything.
Find yourself a “silver certificate” dollar bill….there are still some out there….still “legal tender”. It says “Payable to the bearer ON DEMAND one dollar in silver at the US Treasury”. Not anymore. Rule change, mid game, screw you and your paper promise. Not convenient for us to honor that anymore.
Heck, as about ANY Native American….they’ll tell you. White men REALLY DO speak with forked tongue.
Sketch:Â The FED can keep interest rates where ever they want by simply buying the OTHER 30% not being sold to fools now.
The REAL problem comes when other countries refuse to take our paper for real goods, like oil, materials, electronics, and so on, and start demanding some REAL in exchange.
This collapse should already have happened. What do you guys think is preventing from everything falling apart now? What are some of your timelines.
When Israel takes a hit, when Germany says that’s enough bailing a leaky boat, when welfare or s.s. doesn’t get deposited, when a U.S. navy ship turns into a submarine that can’t surface, when a nuke goes off (dirty or not), when bank holidays do the wave, when the DOW falls to 6K again, when the USDX goes below 74, when a golden bb hits the Saudi refinery, when Moon Beam says they are busted and gets hair plugs, when they serve square fish at the pre unscheduled state of the union dinner party, when the dog driving the car on that commercial catches the cat, when your tv/radio says “this is not a test”.
Congrats to Jimmy Carter, it is confirmed that you are no longer our worst president. Now that’s funny!
Bernake proping up the markets with his funny money, if the press breaks, he’s done and so are we for a long time, better buy more rice and beans.
Tony:  timelines are guesses. Isn’t it enough to know for sure something is going to happen even if you can’t pick the day on the calendar? Could be five years from now, could be tomorrow–the only sure thing is that it’ll happen in your lifetime. Get ready and warn family.
@TnAndy-
If the Fed buys 100% of the debt just to keep the rates low, that would only work internally in the US and only for a short SHORT while. The $ would plummet on the world market sending the US into hyperinflation literally overnight. Oil would be over $1000 in a day. The Wiemar republic and Zimbabwe would have had it easy compared to the mess that would cause here.
You seem to forget that this country doesn’t make anything anymore – do you think we can start making electrical transformers and computers all by ourselves overnight?? in a month? okay, in a year? you’re looking at 5-10 years at LEAST… and thats AFTER the rioting and die off has happened… thats AFTER 100% of this country starts farming their own front yards, learns how to make shoes again….
I understand what you are saying but we make weapons/ammo, a military to use them, airplanes and food. That is power, so far, and gold/silver/oil is priced worldwide in $’s. When that changes, look out or when Bo Bo falls down the steps of AF1.
It seems like we will not have peace. Lately one big riot after another around the globe one nation at a time.  After a revolution is under control, [… a new system having Unions in charge like Egypt’s new democratic system … ], another revolution starts in another country.  And back in the USA, we do have protestors and are now leading by Unions. Do you guys know what Union stands for?
Â
UÂ = unemployment
NÂ =Â No good
I =Â Inflation
O =Â Oil
N = Â NWOÂ Â (according to alex jones)
__________________________
I am so tired of seeing violence and protesting day after day, it’s just wearing me out and makes everyone very worried. Â
Every thing changes dramatically from hour to hour, and is full of propaganda and lies.Â
The Mainstream media doesn’t give the full story, they only give you just enough for you to be on their side. Â
Â
God Bless AmericaÂ
Â
Bonds are toast. Our economy will be flatter than a pancake. Society is headed for a humpty dumpty fall like a scrambled egg on the sidewalk. Stock up on beans cause you won’t be able to bring home the bacon anymore. This is making me hungry……please pass the salt.
Some days I just cant take it anymore. I’m gonna watch the 72 hour Gilligans Island marathon then meditate in front of my lava lamp…If I’m not back in 3 days would somebody call the paramedics? Thanks
That is a scarry thought. Sooner are later we have to carry our own weight.Â
FIGHT THE CAUSE – NOT THE SYMPTOM
OsiXs (Revolution 2.0)
Say hi to Ginger…. I seen Mary Ann the other night in Winfield, KS.
Comments…..interest rate on a simple basic savings account is 0.15000%Â i have earned a total of .26 (cents) so far this year on a 733.00 deposit….i would love for the banks to start paying me higher interest rates for the use of my money that they loan to other people and charge others for. feeling like the “forgotten man”. fixing to take it all outta the bank while i can, and burying it in the backyard.
Comments…..I agree that, as the reserve currency of the world, the U.S. dollar is under no immediate threat of losing its AAA rating. But, if the QE and unfettered printing of the dollar continues, the dollar will continue to lose value. Frankly, I am amazed at how it has held its value considering the amount of dollars currently in circulation.
Great post!
caryn, Burying your money in the back yard will only make it worthless. Hyperinflation will eat away what that money can buy on a daily basis. You would need to buy silver or gold bullion with the money you remove from the bank, THEN bury it in the back yard where it will retain it’s value.
A pre 1964 Washington Quarter (90% Silver) will buy you two gallons of gas today vs $8 in Federal Reserve Notes you pay now because the silver and copper in the coin is worth about eight bucks at todays prices. See how your fake money is devalued?
Look on ebay if you don’t believe me.
A $5 gold eagle (same size as a dime)Â will buy you a grocery cart full of food.
Start saving your nickles. That is the only coin in the realm right now where the metal is worth more then the face value of the coin.
http://www.coinflation.com Check it out and learn.
Don’t tell me you can’t afford gold. I buy it in as little as 1gram bars or $5 gold eagles (1/10 ozt) every paycheck.
Silver is by far the better buy. I’ve been collecting gold and silver since Obama was elected because his books, his mentors, his education, his speaches all indicated his intention to destroy the american economy.Â
There is no surprise here. I’ve well over doubled my money and I’m still buying because I know I will over double my money again because there is nothing any political party can do to avoid a default anymore.
We long past that rubicon with the first stimulus.
Economic crash and food shortages are inevitable and there is nothing in heaven or earth will stop that now.
Beans, Bandaids, Bullets and Bullion. (Beans includes water)
In that order.
Good luck.
Comments…..Caryn
your’e better off buying T paper and bullets than burying it
besides your’e not going take it with you.
When I seen the Proffesor at the dock the other day, he said to
prep like I was stranded on that dam island.
so I’m taking his advice!!!
are you ????
  Spot on about savings in a bank. Due to inflation that is a losing proposition.Â
  I think I will go into business as a financial advisor. I will advise all clients to put their money into canned food and guns.
Mac,
A great piece on what’s happening in Washington.
Jane,You usually have insightful things to say(which I may or may not agree with,but worth the read).But your UNION letters definition smack of a certain closed mindedness that is lacking in historical perspective.Unions were never the central problem,only a response by working people to inhumane working conditions foisted on them by “Leaders of Capitalism”.These men(as they do today)have far more than they need,and yet express furious outrage at the suggestion that their workers(or any workers for that matter) should get a living wage.Unions have not been perfect(no one is,including me),but suggesting they are central to the muddle we’re in is lacking substance.Now,if we suggest that the feckless and fatuous REPOCRATS,The FED,as well as the “Goldie-Sakies” investment Bankers and Massive Corporations principally are at fault,then your definitely onto something.The 600# gorilla in the room is:”hows it all going to end?” No matter who’s at fault,saving ourselves and our families from the wreckage is of paramount importance.
Best to All
GFG
What happens when QE2 ends… ?
NWO U.N. blue NAFTA DHS – COP KILLER
Bye Bye American Pie…
I shot and killed a NWO U.N. blue NAFTA DHS Cop with my .45 semi-auto black Glock today… a Disabled, Homeless, Cold and Hungry Veteran… I live by the river beneath a bridge… I deserve better than this… tsk, tsk, tsk…
I had done my time… stood my watch upon the wall; a Guardian of Liberty… and after a fall… now a Stone Cold Cop Killer?  Running from the Amerikan Fascist Traitorous Law… why? why? why?
The false NWO IMF homo druggy prostitute barry soetoro- a.k.a illegal president barack obama and AIPAC israeli jew controlled U.S. congress… stopped “Canceled ALL†and my social security check the other day… on APRIL 8th, 2011… they Stole all the Social Security Funds, Food Stamps and Medicare too… intentionally Broke america’s piggy bank… gave away the pennies to the Banks and told me “Sorry” none for You! You are Many! We are Few… MORE FOR US! None for You!
I am a Disabled Veteran… I once Served My Country with Honor and Pride.
I Murdered Killed a NWO U.N. blue NAFTA DHS Cop Today… why? why? why?
 I had robbed the local Korean corner store… while the radio on the shelf played “Bye Bye American Pie”… I’d only pocketed a milk, hot pocket and a pie… ran by the Screaming Korean Clerk for the open sky… hopped on my ex Asshole Psycho Neighbors kid pink huffy bike… peddling in a crazed manic flight… hauling fast down the lane… making my one handed get away… thinking “bye bye american pie”… smiling in mirth… while with my other hand grabbing from my shirt, a half frozen Hot Pocket… then a crushed Moon Pie… shovin’ an munchin both in a hunger frenzy… my adrenaline and sugar high now kicking me into Over-Drive… I had gotten away … then I swore… “SHIT!”… it all dribbling down my beard… I thought to myself; I shoulda done like Ben Bernanke… acted like a greedy shifty Banker whore and taken more, more, more… for you see – IT’s ALL ABOUT ME! When I’m HUNGRY!
Then down the way… my calves screaming in pain… I slowed down… a mistake… an A.P.B. an All Points Bulletin – had gone out – “All Patrols Be On The Look Out for a Crazed Long Haired Bearded Hippy Hobo Bum, Riding a Stolen Hot Pink Huffy Bike Down Main Street!â€; I’m screwed now… a NWO U.N. Blue NAFTA DHS Cop car pulled up behind, tires screeching… siren blaring , lights a twirling, screaming over the horn “PULL THE FUCK OVER!”
At that time… I snapped grinned an said to myself “Screw It!” an thought “I’m homeless cold and hungry”… “This Asshole Cop isn’t gonna do me like “Rodney King”!  “The NWO U.N. IMF Greedy Banker Fuckers did this to me!”… “It is either Him or Me!†I skidded to a stop “swiiishhhh!”… planted my worn out combat boots upon the cool concrete of the street… reached into my sweat soiled pants waist… an pulled my cold heavy .45 Glock like slow dead weight… fingers numb… pointed and leveled it at the windshield of the NWO U.N. NAFTA blue Patrol Car… looking the Cop dead in the eye… I recognized him, he use to be nice to me, always smiling when we met on the street… Officer Friendly, now wearing NWO camo green Combat Gear, with U.N. sky blue Patches… once our neighborhood hero… here to “Protect and Serve”… now no more… now he is a DHS Federalized Thug… a NWO U.N. NAFTA blue Storm Trooper Whore… ordered by our illegal alien false president obama to “Punish and Enslave!”
And while the innocent curious child side of me… kept asking… “why, why, why ?”… the newly found grown up tired Stone Cold Cop Killer in me… didn’t bat an eye… I aimed an pulled the trigger BLAM BLAM BLAM 1,2,3… It was HIM or ME you MUST see… I emptied the entire clip right through the windshield… into the NWO U.N. blue NAFTA DHS Whore’s red screaming face!!!
Empty inside… now that I had unleashed all my NWO New World Order – Bilderberg Debt Slave Hate!
I simply stood astride my stolen pink huffy steed… staring dead pan at the car’s brown vinyl covered rear seat, red blood, white bone chips and grey pink brain matter splattered over it. Staring through the shattered windshield and GAPING cavernous blood red hole that had been, Officer Friendly’s Red Raging New World Order U.N. blue NAFTA DHS Cop Face.
Humming to myself “BYE BYE AMERICAN PIE”… thinking “I’m still Hungry!â€
Â
author after note:
-Property of TekRoanin – final draft – a living work in progress – share with all pls – I encourage all Veterans to use this story poem as a template and tell us their own story – write their own and post on the web so they may be heard – dtp.
{ There are over 600,000 unemployed war trained experienced Homeless poor starving Veterans just like our “hero†above walking thru your yards and living in the woods, abandoned homes or storm drains of your neighborhoods!} Just think about that for a moment America… there are more Veterans joining our ranks every day from the Illegal NWO Global Domination Wars and Economic Debt Slave War here in America. JUST PAUSE THINK ABOUT THAT FOR A MINUTE! Scary???? Maybe a little. The Veterans Administration employee’s are FAILING to help Veterans in need! Living Fat like a greedy Hog on the pain and suffering of Veterans! V.A. = Eugenic’s!
Wake up America, there are 1 million – 1,000,000 foreign troops and american traitor troops under the United Nations blue Flag, NAFTA blue and IMF Bank Control right now; at this very moment here on American, Canadian and Mexican soil. Just waiting for our Illegal President Obama to call MARTIAL LAW! Upon which time they will crash the dollar, invade america and place you all; america under their U.N. NWO IMF military control. It’s either YOU or THEM!!!
U.N. AGENDA 21 is here!!!
NOW is the time to… Talk to family and friends…
AMERICA IS A LIE owned controled by the family Rothschilds – The Bank Of England!
YOU ARE NOT FREE! You are DEBT SLAVES!
ARM UP STOCK UP PREPARE… PREDITOR OR PREY THE CHOICE IS YOURS!
And remember all US POLICE and SHERIFF DEPARTMENTS , NATIONAL GUARD TROOPS ARE NOW FEDERALIZED UNDER FEMA, DHS, NAFTA -UNITED NATIONS blue CONTROL!
They are not here to protect you! They are here to DisArm you – “Punish and Enslave!”
To Force you all under their one world NWO CFR Tri-Lateral IMF WORLD BANK government!
U.N. AGENDA 21 is here!
If the color of your skin is any color of Brown – and you value your life – Beware the Shots – All Shots! Israeli Jews, America, WHO, U.N., NATO is NOT your friend… RUN! They mean to kill you – All!
… spread the word.
Â
What about the hash browns, link sausage & small portion of grits? I never did get to see the last episode of Gilligan’s Island.
If anyone else had a debt to income ratio like the U.S. Government they would not have a bond rating period. If it was any of us we wouldn’t be able to run a .25 cent tab at a neighborhood lemonaid stand.
The financial systems are in a self preservation mode to keep the lie going.
@Anonymous “I understand what you are saying but we make weapons/ammo, a military to use them, airplanes and food. ”
Â
All of these things are based solely on ONE item – oil. 70% of which is IMPORTED. paid for by the USD. once that becomes worthless, what happens to the price of oil? what happens to “cheap” gas? “cheap” fertilizer? “cheap” ammo? its ALL based on oil, which is in turn priced in dollars.
Yes, I agree. We have plenty of oil Sketch, easier to buy others first with fiat and then directly control the price of our oil later.
The whole thing is F**king joke ! The whole system is arigged and they know it .It use to be easy, jsut put your money in a 401k plan and after 35 years, you can retire .Its the same thing but now you retire with about 180,000 dolalrs which wont last you very long . Everything is geard to take your money in fees, market based profits, Taxes, and Fraud. you people trusting your money in these forns are due for a royal ass plowing .gold and silver is takeing off while your palsy interest isint doing jack S**T ! Better get off the pot and flush that bad boy down the drain before you stat wearing it on your face ! Â
Harry says it is coming soon!!
Â
http://finance.yahoo.com/blogs/daily-ticker/harry-dent-major-crash-coming-stocks-commodities-already-20110331-080715-415.html
ARGentina ‘defaulted’ c1899, 2001,
see lists of other nations that
defaulted, or changed currency
You know what..our monetary system can not sustain the physical needs of our country without having to borrow …means we are not working anymore. The USA will have to go through some serious re adjusting and that could mean serious sacrifice. OUr government is reaping what it has sowed. If you build society on a false and borrowed money..it will always end up being worth zero in the end. I think we are nearing the end of a broken system.Â
I truly feel sad..
Washington knows that the game is UP….. and are playing this government shutdown so that the politicians can cover their ass.the politicians are playing it as it is the other parties fault……,they are fighting over peanuts…(pennies on the Dollar) what bullsh@t !!!!!.
If you think that America is going to collapse over woman’s rights/health-care…cancer screening, this is only a smoke screen..!! . The politicians know that the money spigot as dried up….USA is broke,Dollar is falling,and just weeks if not days away from going into total financial nuclear meltdown….. . Once SILVER reaches $44-7 Dollar an ounce….(just days away), the dollar will start falling off a cliff and the road to TRUE hyperinflation will begin….
ANYONE who has ever played Monoploy should be able to correctly interpret what’s happening; tha player’s ARE ALL BROKE, so the ‘bank’ just keeps giving them loans to pay off loans to pay off loans to pay off loans to pay off loans to pay off loans (repeat 78,987 times more, at least).
In other words: GAME OVER. Â
Yes, just looking at today’s silver – pushing $41/0z – and dollar – collapsing thru 75Â – curves, looks like System Collapse may come sooner than I thought (July/August 2012). But I’m fairly well-prepared already – weapons, ammo, water, canned food stockpiled – and can’t wait to rock and roll. All sorts of outstanding problems will be resolved after a year or two or ten of Civil War II: total reset of the political system and economy, plus population bomb defused. I really feel for all the urban,high-rise apartment dwelling cosmic liberals over at Kunstler’s Clusterfuck Nation: their former group-entitlement allies are going to be coming up the stairs, and the down elevators won’t be working.
America is too broke and broken to have a triple “A” rating. Wake up people. You have a choice.
“THE REVOLUTION HAS STARTED”
Read “Common Sense 3.1†at ( http://www.revoluÂtion2.osixÂs.org )
“Spread the News”
I believe Jesus walked on water, but I have yet to see honesty coming from DC. Now THAT would be a miracle! All the commenters are right that say this whole thing is a scam run by the weasels in power who want to stay in power and will do ANYTHING toward that end. All the crap about a government shutdown is just a diversion. Just like everything else we hear from the jerkoffs in DC. I don’t know what the real motivation is (other than power) or who the real puppetmasters are, but it doesn’t matter. Don’t believe any of them. Bonds, and all gov debt will, at some point, become worthless. Just like our currency will be. Debating the particulars is best left to Mac, the contributing authors and the commenters here who have a better grasp of the subject than I do. What I do know is this: Fast crash/slow crash - either way you lose the buying power of your money. Whether that happens in a few days or takes a few yrs to play out, we’re still screwed. The survivors are gonna be the ones who have stocked up to get through the early hard parts and then have the ability to feed, house and protect themselves for the long run. Maybe that means growing food, making stuff, whatever. We are going to have to be able to provide for all our needs without relying on paper money or a functioning economy as we have known it. In the meantime, keep stocking up, keep your useful skills sharp and get additional ones. And if nothing catastrophic happens in our lifetime- we’re still better off because we’re less dependant on the “system.”….
…I will now climb off the soapbox and return to the mind numbing bliss of the Gilligans Island marathon. Yeah Mary Ann!! Go Ginger! Attaboy little buddy…
Anonymous- what was Mary Ann doing in Kansas? Isn’t that Dorothy’s turf?
Al Falfa,loved the “Monopoly” comparison!!!SmokinOkie,gotta agree with your ideas about what’s needed to “get by”.Dear “tekroanin”,your rant about”I shot and killed a NWO U.N. blue NAFTA DHS Cop with my .45 semi-auto black Glock”….Did you forget to take your meds again?If what you claim about yourself is “real”,Dude,Mickey D is hiring.Ain’t much to be sure.But it might give some cash flow to step up and out of that pretend “scenario” your in.Otherwise it’s sounds like what some geeky dork dreamed up while playing his PC gun game.So far you placed your self-serving “item” in every blog here without regard to relevance.Even if true,what ELSE you got???To Everyone else,Mother Jones mag. has a terrific front page article on the “Vampire Economy”(ultra rich feeding off the rest of us)Might be worth the read.Gotta say in leaving,,I HOPE Washington gets their act somewhat together.But I don’t plan on them even slightly trying to do so.Why should they?They got THEIRS and so why SHOULD they give a damn about the rest of America?The Washington Farce reminds me far too much of the Marx Brothers movie:”Night at the Opera”.Except they(Marx Brothers) were far funnier with better comic timing.
Best to all(that includes you too,tekroanin)
All the best
GFG
Yes, but she was born there Okie. Where was Ginger born, test question. I wait for your every blog to make my day……. You picked up this place. Do they serve grits your way? When do the lightning bugs come out?
QEIII JT. What did you expect?
Grayfoxgreen, Thank you for your nice comment about my insightfulness.
1. The letters about “Union†are political satire which Dems and comedians have been using for decades; rules should be consistent and apply to all, not just for liberal or special interest groups only, that’s for closed minded people, so lighten up dude!!
2. You said that I said “Union is a central problem?†Don’t put your words in my mouth. You need to ask those owners and shareholders who took their companies overseas or those companies who went bankrupt, so by now have you figured this out yet?
a)Â Â Â Â Â You better ask China or India, perhaps they will tell you better sob stories than I can.
b)Â Â Â Â Â Or ask big foreign companies who open business in the states where Unions are limited to bargain or must meet certain guidelines.
________________
Â
Corporations cannot meet production with long strikes during collective bargaining while companies must meet production deadlines. Otherwise they loose customers, contracts or pay heavy fines for not meeting contracted schedules and cannot pay its bills.
3. You said the “leaders of capitalism†caused “inhuman conditionsâ€. Which U.S. laws did we pass which allow inhuman conditions? What about labor laws and the millions of others which are already on the books. Do you really believe:
a)Â Â Â Â Â taking companies overseas will solve this problem?
b)     you blame capitalism for this problem? It seems like you want the U.S. to become a Socialist country Or have your leaders (not my leaders) unofficially already done that?
Â
Come Sept thru Nov. money isn’t going to matter much anyway….we got a major storm coming. And things until then weather and environmental wise are going to increasingly get worse…but Sept thru Nov is going to be bad bad bad like not seen since Noah and his sailing days
 Well, RATS! I am one bummed out okie today. The gov didn’t shut down so now I’m stuck with all these picket signs and 400 of my closest friends and nowhere to go. Does anybody still do the old “flash mob” thing? Quick! Send directions for the best place to hold a flash protest. And hurry, our potato salad is gonna spoil…
Hey, Anonymous- thanks for the comments. I didn’t know that about Mary Ann. Ginger, I believe, was born on a greyhound bus somewhere between Toledo and Cleveland. I read that on the net so it must be true. 🙂
I don’t make statements based on my opinion. What I say is based on facts and point out discrepancy – Check it out.Â
I often use direct quotes from Liberals who post propaganda or from my opposition.
Â
You can see Liberal comedians flood the airways with jokes 24/7 against Conservatives and no one ever complains. But if Conservatives do the same thing, liberals have a fit.Â
Liberal comedians try too hard to be funny, when they are not while attempting to trash their
opponents/Conservatives.Â
________________________
When you try too hard, you risk becoming a joke yourself J.
Again the major issue isn’t union/non-union labor. Its the insanely high corporate tax we have in the country. When they can pay less in another country the company (if it is beneficial of course) will pack up its toys and move.
Â
Unions came around when there were no labor laws, people could be forced to work 18 hours in a coal mine deep underground without proper ventilation etc. Now-a-days, with all the laws passed its really a mute point and they could really go the way of the dinosaurs.
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I believe its US Steel that is a union shop and is producing good quality steel for less then Chinese mills can. But this is one example and I doubt I can find many more easily. I know Boeing workers in Washington state are scared to death of the non-union workers Boeing is going to use in North Carolina (I believe that is where the new plant is, it’s East coast anyways), Boeing is expecting them to turn out 1.2 planes in the time it takes WA plant to pump out 1.
Jane,when your being humorous do give us some hint as to the change of tone in your writing.And JANE,do think about what Mike L has to say about unions.Your complaints about:”You can see Liberal comedians flood the airways with jokes 24/7 against Conservatives” fails the accuracy test when we talk about “The Foxy News Network”.THEY always(24/7) complain about “liberal media biases”while lauding “Conservative views”(what ever that means besides no taxes for the Very RICH)as being “mainstream”(NOT!).So what does that make them?Paradigms of unbiased news reporting we can trust?I think not.Lest you think I’m only spouting my own uninformed opinion about them,read on JANE.They(FOXY NEWS NETWORK decided to do a “edited” version of a recent Republican rally where Ron Paul was the featured speaker.The applause was deafening!However,They(FOXY NEWS)decided because they felt it didn’t reflect how they(Foxy News) felt about Mr.Paul,They REMOVED the ACTUAL sound track of cheering that came with the tape and put one for last year from a different setting(less cheering and more BOOING) to “show” how little support he had with the people in the party.With such “false flag” disinformation who needs a “liberal” media?As for your comment:”a) taking companies overseas will solve this problem?
b) you blame capitalism for this problem? It seems like you want the U.S. to become a Socialist country Or have your leaders (not my leaders) unofficially already done that?
I never implied wanting America to become a Socialist country(do show me your definition and I’ll show you mine,might be interesting;-)).Yet ALL the “Socialist” countries far outrank AMERICA in health-care and education to name just two.Another thing,JANE.Try to read up on the turn of the century “Robber Barons” and how they treated their workers and their use of children in their Sweatshops (look that term up at Wikipedia) factories.I’m still not saying that UNIONS are a panacea for our current problems.BUT think about this for a moment,when Corporate heads like Mr.Blankenship,CEO of Massy Coal, flagrantly,criminally and PROUDLY refused(and still DOES) to obey the safety laws enacted for coal miners,bad things occurred.NOW so far 29,(TWENTY_NINE,YES That’s RIGHT TWENTY NINE)miners were killed,all due his(Blankenship’s) PERSONALLY directing Forcefully his mine bosses to flaunt and DISREGARD these same laws,that’s WHY those men with families died.ALL he decided that needed saying was:That’s(the deaths of the miners)the COST of doing business”.Do YOU agree with that FACTUAL statement?How very,VERY droll,of him!This is the “so VERY Christian” attitude that most leaders of Big business carry with them in everything.To their credit,I DO know of a few businessmen who deserve credit for their humane treatment of their employees,but they remain in the minority of their kind.If that were not true we wouldn’t need so many laws to protect the consumer and worker in the first place.Thanks to the like of Blankenship and HIS Ilk we still do.These same business men went China and parts unknown so they could continue their wicked and SINFUL ways of conducting business without repercussions.That’s WHY they spent so much money to get NAFTA and “free trade”(a oxymoron) enacted by the REPOCRATS.Have a nice and educational day of reading,JANE.For everyone here(JANE included)you might read the latest copy of Mother Jones mag..The cover article looks like a good read.
Best to ALL,and to ALL a Goodnight!!!!
GFG
JT asked on April 8th, 2011 at 12:05 am, “What happens when QE2 ends… ?”
U.S. Dollar Crisis Looms, Spike in Interest Rates Following End of QE2
“Chris Martenson writes: As a major currency crisis looms in the west, there are some things that we should all expect. Lifestyle changes that we don’t have to imagine, but ones we can see happening right in front of us today. Now the catalyst for the beginning of a major currency crisis could be several things. To note just a few, QE2 ending would cause a spike in interest rates, banking crisis, and inevitably a debt crisis that would lead to a dollar crisis.
… a QE3 will only delay the inevitable and actually make things much worse in the end…”
http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article27430.html
clark,enjoyed the article you suggested.Has anyone else read the Blacklisted article on Iceland’s voters rejecting the “repayment” plan that their political hacks tried to foist on them to cover the massive losses by some PRIVATE bankers there.Seems that it would amount to a scale of 700 billion for the small population.These bankers were never covered by government until they collapsed.Then at Britain’s and the Netherlands “suggestion”,did the government decide to offer to “repay” this private loss by the bankers.I.E. pass it onto the public.In Iceland,however,the bankers ran into a informed public who voted HELL NO(over 60% said so)!Read the rest to see how the international bankers are threatening to take Iceland to a international court to “force” the debt to be be repaid by the public.This even though the Iceland government NEVER promised the bankers guarantees in the first place.
GFG
Comments…..I have a web site where I give investment advise on penny stocks and stocks under five dollars. I can not believe that the credit rating of united states is still AAA + this is absurd the best thing could happen to the united states would be a downgrade in its credit rating from say AAA+ to A – this would make the congress finally get serious about cutting the budget. and raising taxes if necessary.