There Will Be No Law Enforcement if the SHTF

by | Oct 14, 2010 | Emergency Preparedness | 46 comments

Do you LOVE America?


    If you’re wondering what security measures will exist if the SHTF, Survival Blog provides an answer: none, unless you actively create them yourself.

    Recently a writer was predicting the way the police will respond and in this area I would like to add what I know and what I predict. A retired trooper friend and I have polled both active officers at the state, city and parish (county) level. I have worked with Houston PD, Texas DPS, Baton Rouge PD and New Orleans PD. The results of the questions all reveal the same thing. Very, very few active officers even think about TEOTWAWKI [The End of the World as We Know It]. Not only is it not on their radar there are no contingency plans should it become a problem. On the retired side preparedness or awareness is at best 50/50. I think that many Americans will be surprised with the answer many serving officers gave when asked what they will do if TEOTWAWKI ever occurs: Almost to a person they respond they will go home and protect their families or G.O.O.D. [Get Out Of Dodge] As far as protecting anyone else? Forget it. There are no contingencies to bring families in to the department or is there room.

    I was able to prevent looting on my dead end street during Hurricane Rita solely because I had a rifle and was preparing to employ it when the looters made haste. I stood on my corner for an hour and a half before a deputy came along (no phones-cell or land line). He instructed me to shoot the next looters I saw.

    source: No Law Enforcement in TEOTWAWKI by Ron M.
    [Emphasis added]

    Hurricane Katrina - Sign For LootersHurricane Katrina – Warning to Looters

    We’ve discussed this before, and it’s worth covering again.

    In a real SHTF scenario, be it man-made or natural, when grocery store shelves are empty, riots break out, and hoodlums start wandering suburban neighborhoods looking for victims, the response time from 911 will be measured not in minutes, but hours or days – if at all.

    If you are prepared to handle a food crisis, currency crisis or a down-grid scenario, then one of your primary preparedness tools will be self defense weaponary.

    Bottom line: If you can’t protect it, you don’t own it.

    Several readers responded to the Survival Blog article, all were in agreement:

    Most of the friends I’ve talked with told me with no uncertainty that in the event of such a large-scale TEOTWAWKI event they would immediately see to the safety and protection of their families first. Urban / Suburban officers have informed me that to stick around might be suicide, and most would bug out as soon as possible. -Matthew L.

    In response to Ron’s article, I have been a cop for 30+ years now. I started in a rural Sheriffs Office, got bored and after a year went on to become a big city cop (BCC). After I retired I swore another oath as a Deputy Sheriff in larger more rural county. I believe Ron is correct in his synopsis , there will not be much LE if there is a TEOTWAWKI situation via a NBC attack, meteor strike, volcano et cetera.

    Over the years I too have inquired my brother/sister leo’s mindset on this topic. Amongst the BCC the largest percentage will go and take care/be with their families in their time of need. A few, mostly the young ones with no families yet said they would stay on as long as they felt they could make a difference. The senior cops know the futility of the law enforcement situation with the Golden Horde and would bug out/in with their families, BTW these are the ones that are most prepared and think like us. – Law Dawg

    For those who haven’t yet obtained a firearm(s), we recommend reading Rick Blaine’s primer: An Introduction to SHTF Home Defense, Guns, and Safety.

    It’s up to you whether or not you want to put up a sign if the SHTF. Depending on the scenario, you may want to keep your defense capabilities and the fact that you are home a secret. But, a sign like the following will certainly be more effective than a Brink’s home alarm sign:

    Warning to Looters: You Loot, We Shoot

    Related: Government Moves Toward Martial Law: Officers Being Disarmed Nationwide


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      1. Comments…..Hey guys, don’t forget night vision.
        Without it your guns are only good for daytime.
        I’m set with a night vision monocular, that converts into a rifle scope with a laser sight.  I havent figured out how I’m gonna sight it in yet. Can’t exactly shoot at night,,, yet.

        Someone trying to loot you might have night vision, and the only defense is to also have it. I only paid $400 for mine, and its decent.

      2. Excellent advice, and something I should have mentioned!

        (Stock up on batteries, or get a solar recharged while you’re at it).

      3. Criminal activity will be widespread in this SHTF scenario. And many will be armed. Don’t overlook the use of sand bags to create a fortified area in or around the part of your home that you sleep in. Drive-by shootings could cause considerable damage, and if you or a loved one are injured, a trip to the hospital may become impossible. Add a trauma kit to your first aid preps, and hope you don’t have to use it. Gear up folks. And Good Luck To All

      4. strongly consider a  night-vision crossbow.

      5. There isn’t any law enforcement now where I live. Sure we have a sheriff’s department, but all they do is interstate stops so they can seize the drug money for themselves. That and eventually show up and fill out a crime report when you get burglarized.  I’m used to being on my own.

      6. That last sign “You Loot We Shoot” is a bit of a conundrum. On the one hand, I would think it advantageous to keep the fact that y0u’re home and your capabilities a secret. On the other hand, the sign might be the best way to go. All depends on what person/persons you come across. Obviously, if the lone inexperienced burglar comes along the sign may be enough to scare him off. But if a possie of 6 armed men with night vision and machine guns comes along I don’t think they’d blink at such a sign. Quite a conundrum indeed.

        Personally, I think stealth is your best bet, assuming you use it to your advantage. Keep your talents/capabilities hidden, and only reveal when absolutely necessary. For this reason I like crossbows/bows and arrows better than rifles, but it’s good to have heavy weaponry when the SHTF inside of your house, if you know what I mean.

      7. Chris C…
        Bows, etc are good for hunting to keep stealthy, but they are going to be virtually worthless  in a firefight with a human. 

        Have as many as you can of all kinds of weapons, this way you can account for malfunctions, use for parts, use for trade, or starting your own army….

      8. Right on Apache

        Unless you have access to a suppressor for your gun get a crossbow. Or for those of you who are a little older and have back troubles, a compound bow because the drawing process on crossbows requires you to stoop over and ‘lift’ the string at an odd angle. Stealth will be necessary some times, especially if your dealing with members of the local gang. You want to avoid vendettas at all costs.

      9. The old saying  “an armed society is a polite society”  may very well go along way here in America.   Looters and burglars will seek the easiest targets….places they know or assume are not armed.

        So, what I am saying is that maybe you are better off, letting everyone  know , that  “law enforcement” means,  you and family are fully armed, capable, and willing,  to defend properties and life.

      10. All I can say is if you live in a city it will be hell on earth. If there is no law enforcement then America when the shtf the republic will dissolve into chaos. These isn’t enough manpower to implement martial law when it all fall apart. That means states will break away and cities will be warzones and we will revert into a warlord state. The one thing that is not addressed is our nuclear weapons. Will other nations stand by if we dissolve? Who knows but I hope none of this happens but the way things are going we end in a fragmented warlord state.

      11. This sounds like a planned event. If anyone out there has more specific information, please comment. Our lives and well being are on the line here.  Shortwave freqs etc…

      12. Considering “an armed society is a polite society” and taking it a step further, an armed society may turn out to be a more safe society than is generally expected in these forums.
        I do not consider it at all unlikely the looters and gangs will find themselves outnumbered and lose any battle they mount. Especially gangs, they have a bad habit of projecting their identity into situations and are generally not shy about proudly wearing their badge of gangship, which will be to their detriment in what I suspect will be a short-lived war. Maybe.

      13. SHTF is not a planned event. It is the chaos that erupts from an event, either man made, or an act of God of such magnitude, as to interrupt life as we know it; or to threaten our very existence. SHTF can include, war, weather, earthquakes, tsunami’s, cme’s, emp’s, or any other phenomena that renders civilization as we know it, void.

      14. When not if the SHTF you want to have at least a plan A & B. I have many more depending on how and what caused the SHTF. LE and Military can only control small areas of America, the rest will be wild. I for one will be the law for my family and friends and that’s all you can bank on, your self.

        Funny things happen when societies break down. In many countries the LE and Military become waring warlords. I don’t think America will be much different. 

        Best advice, have your tribe ready. 6 to 12 men, plus women and children. Have at least 2 medical professionals, MD, DDS, NP, RN or PA and get away from heavely populated areas.

        I’ve noticed doctors are a lot more receptive when you talk to them now. I think they get it. It sure helps with the type of medical supplies needed.

        The only way to survive this is to have law and order and in most cases that will be you.

      15. CLEM,

        It’s definitely a PLANNED EVENT which was ORCHESTRATED TO CAUSE CHAOS !!!! 

        Anybody who cannot see it must be an IDIOT or BLIND.  The  Elites know that chaos is going to happen when  there are:

        Food shortages
        High unemployment rates
        “Foreclosure Gate”
        printing trillions of worthless $$$$$
        Bailing out doomed corporations 

        They know this, because they’re gonna MAKE SURE IT HAPPENS.

        Do you think they care for you??   Ehhh  

      16. Comments…..DurangoKidd, you have it right…shtf can happen at any time, any where.

        Either you are ready or you are in trouble.  If you know you need to pick up certain items, do it NOW!
        If you’re unsure about what to do, you need to get the information ASAP!
        Something bad is coming our way.  I wish you all the best.

      17. If law enforcement is no more, that makes citizens the law. America has always based it’s laws on the bible. The day and age we live in now there are to many people that try to stay as far away from the bible as they can. That could be a problem. We all need to think clearly in a TEOTWAWKI scenario. We want our families protected so we are willing to defend them. We must always remember the elderly and children neighbors that may not be able to defend themselves do not deserve to be raped or killed because we didn’t step in. Biblical teaching can help all of us if TSHTF and it can also help us from turning into what we would be fighting off. We all read on hear about the crooked gubment and some of the police that are out there God forbid we turn into them instead of working together to over come and conquer the task at hand. Survival and protection. How you protect depends on your training and skills. If you have guns go to the range and shoot them. Learn to brake them down clean and reassemble. Shoot at different distances and shrink your target smaller and smaller. Learn hand to hand combat. But most importantly get right with GOD.

      18. Three guns:

        12 gauge shotgun.
        9mm handgun.
        22 rifle.

        Takes care of 90% of all security needs and will do pretty good for the last 10%. Add to that a 44mag handgun, a high rate of fire rifle, and a good, big caliber magnum bolt gun and now your at 99.9%.

        But, just having the shotgun will get you to 75%. If you want the most bang for your buck (pun intended) and you have no interest or desire to own or shoot a gun, please, if nothing else, go buy yourself a break action 12 gauge for $150 and 100 rounds of #4 shot. Then, take it to someone’s place who knows how to shoot, let them show you how to blast milk jugs or coke cartons at 50 and 100ft. Then, take the gun, clean it and oil it up good, put it in a case and store it and the ammo away. Someday soon, you be glad you did.

      19. @mona

        For that information I don’t have, can I go to the DHS preparedness site and get that info? I’m sure they have all the pertinent information on how to prep and be prepared right? Will they tell me what kind of firearms I need to protect myself?

        Ouch! I think I just bruised my cheek!


      20. Hey Net Ranger: I think you have it covered if that 22 is a .223 assault rifle. SHTF America has a similar recommendation and an interesting rationale behind its selection of weapons including bows and tactical gear. Just saying.

        SHTF Weapons recommends the new Tricon M6, and Rugers SR 556 assault rifles. Really nice weapons.

        One old shotgun and 100 rounds is not nearly enough for a SHTF scenario, but its better than nothing. Weapons training and knowledge for non vets is part of the preps for any non vets and families. Those of you without it should get it. 1000 rounds is more like it. Once a shtf scenario starts, there will not be any ammo available.

        I agree with the SHTF America philosphy that the entire family should be trained in a .223 AR.  The black rifle is the standard and perfect for the entire family.

      21. I do have things to protect.  But most of all I have people to protect, my wife and daughter, even the eight cats,  the little beasties good for vermin too.  A good dog is the best burglar alarm.  My wife owns and shoots a P1oo .357 mag, six inch barrel, I shoot a P97DC .45 semi-auto.  We also have a spare .45.    Two twelve gauge pump shotguns, my love the Mossie 500.  Rifles?  Well, a bolt action. 22, a lever action 44mag and a Mosin 7.62 by 54.  Low, medium and high power.  My problem is bodies to use said weapons if necessary, I do have food for them.  But most of all, I feel staying off the radar is the best way, night vision to scope things out if necessary, perhaps a quiet generator for power, not lights but other necessities.  I live in a small town, one would never know of my preparations with a simple glance, by design.  Enough to stay at home for six months and not leave, ever.  Or longer.  All the chow, meds, water and such at hand.  It has taken years, and about ten grand, but I feel worth it.  My good city friends know of my place and would try to get here.  They can all shoot.  If my place was assaulted and I had the manpower to use the firepower, a band of looters would get a most unpleasant reception.  Not looking for trouble, would try hard to avoid it.   But if push comes to shove, my family, friends and like-minded countrymen are to be helped. I took an oath once, some forty years ago…and oaths are forever………

      22. I have been an LEO for 15 years now, and this is a hot topic with a few of us. The rest, well, the rest think we are nuts.
        I work for a large Sheriff department with several departments in the county that have 70-300 officers at them. But, I do not live in the county I work for, and neither do my fellow prepping officers. We live rurally, anywhere from 35-90 minutes away, and we see the writing on the wall.
        My wife works radio at my department, and I have told her that if and when things go south, she will not be driving into the heart of the storm where radio operations are. She will be home, surrounded by ‘like thinking’ neighbors I can rely on.
        Will I be going to work ? That is something I will have to guage, day by day.
        I’ll be there, loaded for bear, and at that point, I don’t think we’ll be responding to “loud music” calls.
        I’ll do my job, but I am gonna use my head. And when it is time to not report, I have a lot of sick time and vacation hours stored. (but that won’t matter a hill of beans at that point)

      23. 11 bravo: Just one American here who appreciates the job you guys do for all of US.  Pass it on to your fellow officers. Obedience is better than sacrifice, gratitude is better than praise. Thanks abunch!

      24. Pity those living in Cali.  So few legal citizens are armed with all the ultra liberal laws the looters will have a field day.

      25. Guns aren’t just for TSHTF, they are needed now as well.
        Every night, I have my Benelli 12 ga.(w/3″ mag,000 buck) standing next to the bed, it is way more effective than a handgun, especially if the intruder has a handgun as well.
        The biggest drawback of that weapon is that if I use it while indoors, I will be temporarily deafened by the blast to the point of having difficulty understanding the 911 operator when I call them to remove the carcass from my home.

      26. Thanks 11B for what you do.  Hope there will be many more preppers like yourself.  I know…..

      27. Guns
        Night vision
        Pack of hungry wolves

      28. Comments….. 11Bravo, I hope you are a member of the Oath Keepers.  I would not expect you to be at work fighting with a bunch of thugs.  People will have to defend themselves, your job is to defend your family first.  I wouldn’t expect you to come here to defend me, we can take care of ourselves.

        to: Mike L
        October 15th, 2010 at 5:05 am
        Pity those living in Cali.  So few legal citizens are armed with all the ultra liberal laws the looters will have a field day.
        I live in California and you know not what you are talking about.  How do you know that few legal citizens are armed?  Not everyone here is a liberal and many who are liberals are armed because they see what’s coming down as well.  You would be surprised to learn how many people are prepared as well.

      29. reading all of this brings me to think of one thing i havent seen mentioned..

        I have guns, ammo..and very good ability at hitting my target 40+ years of practice..sure makes perfect.
        and am versed in the use of many types of artillery..

        fair warning devices are key to being , and having the upper hand.

        Dogs..they are very owner protective, territory, and have some primal intincts some of us humans have layed to waste..

        yes they require food and water..and those become tight resources in a SHTF senario…but they are worth involving in your prepping..stoer dry food for them in closed containers, they can drink water we cant..
        and most are very loyal, something we cant say about some people you think you can trust.

        My dogs are family members..and they will not be left behind..or not defended and by my side in my time of need

      30. I live in the Central Valley in California, and all my guns mentioned here are legally owned.    Unfortunately there are some limitations, especially regarding concealed carry.  I have no problems here.   If TSHTF these laws will go out the window.
        Most of my neighbors are armed as well, shotguns being a favorite, especially due to the waterfowl in these parts.   Gun hating city liberals will be in for a world of hurt……….many easy prey for looters and such.  In truth not my problem.   I did note with great delight the consternation many such types displayed after 9/11 when they were told a ten day wait was in order…laws they at one time favored.  I just smiled and bought more ammo…….you cannot have too much.

      31. GoldenFoxx: I hope those demonstrations get here soon. The PTB are not going to listen to the people until there is blood on the streets: theirs.

      32. That would be good Mac. After the Retards sweep in Nov we are going to have to get in their face BIG time, to halt the rush to Global Fascism.

      33. Net Ranger, your 3 guns won’t save your ass against the gang of 20 or more armed looters. You are living in a dream world. The game will be over in a few minutes. This won’t be Nam or the Gulf, this will be 20 Brothers with AK 47s against little ole you and your 3 guns.
        VRF, same goes for you and your 40yrs of shooting practice along with your dogs will not be worth a crap after the gang of 20 with their AK 47s approach.
        And to the rest of you pussies here with your wolves, night vision glasses, and your shot guns, you are all done for  after the Boys from the Hood  find you, your gold, your food,and your ammo.
        So keep on posting your BS cause when the SHTF  your so called defense preparations won’t be worth a crap against the Brothers and the Boys from the Hood.

      34. I TELL YOU WHAT EARL. PEOPLE SHOOTING AK 47 S  FIRE WILDLYand miss a lot. i have my shotguns loaded with buck shot. 5 shells per gun. if you are in the area of where i shoot you are gonna get hit. the clack of a shotgun scares anyone so the attackers will be terrified. just because a gang of 20 is attacking you does not mean they will win. and then there is JESUS CHRIST. ONLY HE CAN DETERMINE WHEN I DIE. IT MAY BE AS IN THE BIBLE WHERE JESUS SENT 2 MEN AGAINST A LARGE ARMY AND THE ARMY RAN SCREAMING RUN THERE IS TWO OF THEM. GOD DECIDES WHO WINS THE BATTLE. GOOD LUCK.

      35. I had to chuckle reading of the statements that prepping is futile and useless.   Perhpas feeble attempts by the fear mongers whose ideas of prepping is to simply kill and take.
        Such a scenario could happen…once, perhaps even twice in a given area.   But laws going out the window leaves the gun as the ultimate arbiter…
        The Hoods would be burned to the ground, with no water or firefighters it would be easy, the perps hunted down and slaughtered by the general populace, a populace far out numbering and out gunning them.
        It’s simply a matter of time…and time is on the preppers side.
        and to those brothas and hoods dropped, I saw only one thing…
        Thanks for the AK’s……

      36. @ Earl

        I don’t know NetRanger personally, but from reading his comments for some time now I would have to say he is willing to take people in and help them in a SHTF scenario. His army of believers is way more powerful than 20 brothers from the hood. Plus history has shown us you can’t shoot a gun while carrying stolen shoes and TV’s.

      37. I noticed more than one glaring omission in Earls diatribe, aside from abysmal  ignorance.    For in reading, I automatically sized up a potential foe.  Any ex-military would.  You have essentially, with few exceptions, untrained recruits packing AK’s and an attitude.  The thought of them going up against a squad or two of Marines bringing a smile to my face.   Who says people will wait for these losers to attack?  And in a TSHTF scenario there will be troops around.     Most of them far too busy dealing with troublemakers to concern themselves with the law-abiding.   What the boys in the hood may encounter, for the first and last time in their lives, is a form of street justice bereft of defense attorneys, sympathetic judges or juries, their bodies left to rot in the street, or hung from lamp posts like coyotes on a fence, for people will not be harboring a receptive frame of mind towards this behavior. 
        I know I won’t……..

      38. Insanity will reign in the inner cities of major metro areas and this violence will spread to the suburbs. The mentality and psychology of the population in the major metro areas is very different than that of smallville.  – SHTF America, Weapons Page

        There will be troops around, but only in the major cities, along both coasts and in the capitals of every state. Not enough LEO’s to go around, so if you live in a small town, you probably won’t see any troops, or looters.

        I live in Smallville.

      39. As do I, Durango Kidd……I wouldn’t have it any other way.  Some punks would no doubt try to start something, but I doubt it would last long.  Not in this town of five thousand……..

      40. Earl..good luck boy..

        Im a county boy..and a 30-06 with 180 grain bullet will find someone with an AK-47 before he even knows where he is..way before he even makes it to my “Hood”
        Go back and look at my age, than think of where i could have been in those years..not all of them were spent sitting in a big city getting fat and lazy., and some of them were spent being trained and side by side with the best and im still alive to talk about it.
         I have also taken down big game at well over 400 yards with one poke..a human..with that mantality will be like shooting fish in a barrel over 300 yards they drive or walk they will be wondering why their back up is falling to the way side one at a time..
        im not talking about a 20′ fire wont get with in 200 yards..

        and I have the element of dont know where i am..but i will be able to see you a mile away..just waiting for the right time to diminish your numbers..

        better come with more than 20..hell bring em all..between me and just my family no one that is an outsider will stand a chance of even getting near my farm.,especialy your mind set type.
        I have tracked people(humans) while deer hunting..and even in a complete Ghillie suit..i grabbed one guys leg in full on daylight, the piss ran down his leg i scared the shit right out of him
        tree stands on the ridges are over 100′ up..i can probably see you sitting on your front porch eating chicken right now.

        If you havent lived in the have no idea of what your up against..yes the city is rough..but us country boys got a few things up on ya..we’ll just have to wait and see wont we?

        my house is protected by the good Lord and a might meet them both if you show up here not welcome son

      41. Also Earl
        The point that you think you will make it out of the city with your life or all your 20 men and enough ammo to come at me and mine shows you know very little.
        80 miles out of the city is a long way to come unprepped.
        you’ll be tired, hungry and your numbers will be diminished.
        and sitting ducks, your entire demeaner will change from “Gimme what you got” please dont shoot me i need food and water.
        an AK47 will come as nothing but a problem for will be viewed as an agressive tool..and so will you.

        probably best, you try to care for your loved ones, than to try and be a thug..because that mind set will certainly bring you as one of the first downed, for thinking anyone owes you anything when TSHTF

      42. Comments…..People are not thinking of possibilities.
        Unless some type of emp happened there will be vehicles and people to take them from.
        Walking hoards? I doubt.
        They will come out of the city’s en mass and spread across the country side doing the rape/rob/steal and many will be begging until  you tell them to go away- enemy made.

        Granted any with visible weapons are automatically an enemy, one or several can’t hold out indefinitely.
        I realized long ago this house I live in is nothing to a rifle bullet, totally indefeasible.
        How many people are deluded enough to think they will be safe when “inside” a building ?

      43. If this is what you wish, you shall obtain. Those of us who band together for security and such shall evict those with selfish desires and become a new entity as and among ourselves. Beware small thinking else smite the ground.

      44. Hey, no knocking the AK47.  I own two and both are shooting more accurately at 300 yards then my friend’s AR15 and I’m using iron sights vs his scope.  Its operator more then weapon people.

        People, leave poor delusional Earl alone.  He does not know what he speaks of.  In this case, his ignorance is our bliss.

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