The Ground Zero mosque debate has been heating up not only across the country but across the world. People in Europe, Asia, and (of course) Middle Eastern Countries all seem to have an opinion on whether a mosque should be built 2 blocks away from the site where the World Trade Center once stood.
Those who oppose this project say that it represents an incredible amount of disrespect to the families who lost loved ones on 9/11 and those who are for it (Muslims and non-Muslims) say that allowing it to be built shows that America is tolerant of all religions, is accepting of all people, and believes that there is strength in diversity. After all, that is what America is all about. Isn’t it?
A few interesting things to point out about this 13 story mosque/cultural center in particular:
- No one can find out where the money is coming from to build it.
- It has been said that they plan to open it on 9/11/2011, the 10 year anniversary of when terrorists representing their religion murdered 3000 of our citizens.
- Of all the available buildings in Manhattan they are not only choosing one that is 2 blocks away, but the one building available that has a significant piece of the history of September 11, 2001 attached to it, in that a part of one of the planes that struck the towers actually fell through its rooftop.
My questions are:
Why can’t we get an answer on whether this mosque is being funded by terrorist countries?
Why open it on that day?
Why build it that close to Ground Zero?
And lastly, why that building?
If I could get legitimate answers to those 4 questions maybe I’d feel a whole lot better about this, but I don’t think I will because the real answers are most likely not very legitimate. Perhaps these are just inconvenient coindences that are causing this mosque to be “accidentally controverisal” or perhaps this is this adding up to be the most arrogant, aggressive and audacious provocation that the Religion of Peace has ever perpetrated upon this country (aside from the 9/11 attack itself).
Let’s grant them the benefit of the doubt for now, however, and say that they originally meant no offense at all when the plans were drafted to build this place. When they found out how pissed the families were about this, why then didn’t the Religion of Peace back off and scrap the project so as not to offend anyone? Why are they persisting and, in fact, demanding that the families of the victims and the rest of us who were either directly or indirectly affected by 9/11 tolerate THEM?
So, where does tolerance end? Where do you draw the line? When do you stop sticking up for Islam and start getting offended? If you are not offended at this proposed mosque/cultural center, then please respond to this article and tell me at what point you would get offended. Would the mosque have to be built on the Ground Zero site itself in order for you to be offended? Would there have to be 19 statues of the victorious highjackers erected in lower Manhattan in order for you to be offended? Please tell me at what point your acceptance and understanding would turn into rage.
Every night on the news we listen to “intellectuals” come on and scream about the hatred and islamophobia of those opposing the mosque (the most vocal of that group being the family members of those who were killed almost 9 years ago). “How far away from Ground Zero does the mosque have to be built in order for you to not get offended?” they ask. My question is this: COULD THEY HAVE CHOSEN A CLOSER SPOT TO BUILD IT? I don’t think they could have. Lord knows they looked for one. But what strikes me as a bit inconsistent about these “intellectuals” is that in order to show how sensitive and tolerant they are to The Nation of Islam they have to show the utmost insensitivity to and intolerance for the families of the victims of 9/11 who are expressing their outrage. In doing this the hypocrisy of these “intellectuals” speaks much louder than their empty dogma of “religious tolerance” does. They are not true Americans, and they are not intellectuals. They are brainwashed Marxists – every last one of them.
Where does tolerance end for Islam? You would think that those who are demanding tolerance of us would practice what they preach, right? So how do they tolerate the rest of the world’s cultures and religions? They have already shown us. They showed us when they put a school teacher in jail because she let her students name a teddy bear ‘Muhammed’. They showed us when they screamed “Allah Akbar!” (which means our God is greater than your God) as they decapitated civilians in front of a video camera. They showed us when they protested in the streets over a Danish cartoonist who drew a picture of their beloved Muhammed (incidentally, they also burnt his house down). Oh yeah, I almost forgot, they also showed us when they crashed 2 planes into the World Trade Center, one into the Pentagon and one in a field in Pennsylvania all because we are a nation of “infidels”.
And yes, I am using “they” in the sense of “all Muslims”, not just the so-called terrorists. The book of Islam, the Koran, calls for Jihad (the holy war) against the infidels. If you are a true Muslim then you’re a terrorist because Jihad is what Islam demands. If you don’t believe in Jihad then you’re not a true Muslim, and so you’re just like one of those “hypocritical Christians” who goes to church only on Christmas and Easter, and you shouldn’t give a shit about where your place of worship is being built because you hardly ever go there anyway.
But wait a minute. There’s something very important that I left out here. We are Americans. Is it not in our culture to rise up and be the “bigger person” in all of this? Is it not in our culture to tolerate when others don’t, to forgive when others won’t, and to harbor those in need of a safe haven? Well, it used to be. The truth is that today in America we aren’t allowed to have a “culture” anymore. Those who attempt to rewrite history tell us that we are supposed to be the great “melting pot of all cultures” that wasn’t founded on any religious principles at all, and of course this serves as the premise to accepting all religions in the world as being equally harmless. We now are told that “old cultures” (cultures which integrate a specific religion of choice) are bad because they “cling to guns and their bibles” and this promotes a certain closed-mindedness and intolerance of different ideas that challenge our way of thinking.
What better way, then, can we show to the whole world how tolerant we are than to allow the most intolerant group of people on the planet to build a testament to their victory over us, the infidels, to the dismay of all of those who continue to suffer over the loss of their loved ones? What better way can we promote freedom of religion than to allow those who want to destroy all other religions to open their Victory Mosque on the 10th anniversary of the worst tragedy on American soil WHICH WAS CAUSED BY THEM NO LESS?
Where does tolerance end? This country had a culture once, but its descent into the abyss of political correctness and blind acceptance of all other cultures and religions (especially the ones that hate everything America stands for) in the name of “tolerance”, “acceptance” and “strength in diversity” is causing this nation to become a cultural vaccuum that no longer allows anything to be held sacred, not even the very foundation that made this country so great to begin with.
That’s my 2 cents.
-Schaef
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they should put a Wal*Mart there. Everyone loves Wal*Mart. This is sooo a non-issue, and about as relevant to whats going on in our country as all the Lindsey Lohan coverage.
When are they going to build a few at Martha’s Vineyard? Camp David’s not good enough? Where is our flag when the President speaks? What is with the gold curtains?  Where is the American flag in front of our schools? Come back from eating ice cream and lead this country. Turn the teleprompter off and look into the camera. I want to hear you say “God bless this country”.
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I’ve seen the debate on this heating up it’s all over the place, you want to know what I honestly think this whole Mosque debacle is? Nothing more then the PTB trying to stir the pot and piss people off…There’s not even really any proof who exactly was behind the 09/11 attacks many people think it could have been our own government attacking us, they’re now throwing in this mosque because they know that it will split people up and they’ll fight over it. The ones who really believe the muslims were behind the 09/11 attacks are obviously going to oppose it, and you know that there’s going to be others on the opposite side of the coin defending it to show that ‘we’re tolerant of all religions’
All bullshit, nothing more then the people upstairs trying to evoke and stir emotions. What better way to do that then with religion especially around an area as sensitive as ground zero, with the supposed religion behind the attacks being at the center of the controversy. Don’t even take sides in this, it’s a total mute point and a waste of time to get fired up over
      Some times it makes me sit stunned in wonderment. What the hell has or is happening to our country? We defiantly know what an Islamic extremist is and what they look like and yet Obama and company are inviting them in with open arms. “AND†we are letting them do it!! This is going to sound racist and I don’t care. But take a look at what they have done in their own countries, bombings every ffing day. People being slaughtered by going to a market. Is that what we are going to allow here in America? Look at Europe, and where this group exist. Turmoil all of the time and if they don’t get what they want they just kill people or blow something the fuck up, or both. Is this what we want here? Am I wrong here? Does not their religion give them the inspiration to conduct themselves in this manner? To slaughter people wholesale without so much as a second thought. If they catch them alive, what then? Put them in prison? What the hell good is that going to do? Could you imagine sitting at your house and your wife or kids are not at home and you hear a large explosion and they don’t get home on time? Do we want to live with this? We have got to sit on this like a fat chick. Once this gets deeply entrenched in our society we will have a very serious problem. And what does Obama want to do? Pet them on the head and welcome them in with open arms. All the while referring to the Constitution, how convenient. Kids we are getting smoke blown up our asses and handing our freedoms and security off like we will never miss it. This is the beginning of an infestation. Just look at Europe and where they are at right now today.    Â
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This is all just a big distraction, but…
If the Fed can conceal what they did with hundreds of billions, why should the little people be forced to reveal funding sources? Hell, maybe the Fed is giving them the money 🙂
As for “tolerance”, Chesterton said it best: “Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions.” The modern West’s tolerance is but a sham; a brainwasher’s Trojan Horse to get us to accept all kinds of nonsense.  Tolerating erring individuals is one thing; tolerating falsehood is another.
Note to Schaef: 9/11 was NOT puled off by Moslem “terrorists.” The fact that he is repeating this nonsense, after all this time and all the easily-available evidence, is more than a little disconcerting.
http://www.rense.com/general64/moss.htm
Watch this video entitled, Iron Mountain: Blueprint for Tyranny. It is about two and a half hours long but it will help you understand why is this happening to America and the rest of the world.Â
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-6745627342652553091#docid=-652081546808629932
Islam is to blame. Â It is a death cult. Â Since it’s creation, by one lunatic, Â it has been nothing but a death trap, to every nation and every person, controlled by it.
Europe has become Eurostan. Â England has become Englastan and now they are trying their best,to make America, Ameristan!
Screw islam! Â Islam’s idea of tolerance is total submission to islam. Â Â Instead of blending into western culture, islam wants the West to blend into the same kind of shit holes, it came from.
Screw islam!  IMHO, here is tolerance….America should de-certify islam as a religion, and declare it for what it is…a death cult.  Ban it from our shores,  and in full tolerance, pay for a one way ticket, out of our country, for all who want to remain slaves to  it.
We ignore islam at our peril.  How long is the West, going to put up with Imans, teaching a fundamental pillar, of this death cult , called jihad?
The koo-koo ran,  islam’s holy book,  teaches true believers,  it is OK ,to kill and terrorize, till there is nothing left, but islam. Women are property.  Slavery is practiced in every islamic nation.  Our nation has fought wars to end slavery and elevate  women in our society.
This  “religion” of peace(death), is not culturally compatible with the American culture  and should be stopped now.   islam?  tolerance?   SPIT!
Many people here do not understand that Muslim religion was created by Vatican.  Google Dr. Rivera, he was a former top Jesuit in Vatican.Â
Xman;
It doesn’t matter who created it. The point is moot.  But “now†is the problem, in this country amongst us and our families. It seem that most wont wake up till their looking at the news one night and see that a bomb went off in a swap meet some where, killing 70 people and wounding hundreds more. This religion doesn’t care as long as it gets what it demands and then all bets are off, everything is a target then. You see if you’re not Muslim you then are an infidel and we know what they think of infidels and what happens to them.  Fight them here or over there, it’s our choice to make.
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Three ants spent the night on a lady’s body. One slept between her boobs. One slept in her ass and the other slept in her coochie. In the morning they got together to talk about their night. The one between the boobs said my room was really cramped. The one in her ass said he kept getting chased down a dark alley by a log. The one in her coochie said that’s not bad some bald guy kept coming in and spitting on me.
Eamon, I respectfully disagree with you on the conspiracy theories about 9/11 being an inside job. Even if you are right that our own government perpetrated such an act of terror upon its own people, you must admit that the overwhelming majority of Americans still believe that Muslims were responsible. Therefore, to the overwhelming majority of Americans this mosque is extremely offensive and should not be built on that merit alone.
Since when did Left Liberals give such a damn “for” any religion? I say let the NY’s deal with it in their own way. The rest of U.S. can have their opionion but NY’s should have the right to deal with it. Bloomberg & Paterson can take them all home for dinner!
Since when did Left Liberals care so deeply “for” any religion. Bloomberg & Paterson can take them all home for dinner! How cramped?
A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murderer is less to fear. The traitor is the plague.Â
Marcus Tullius Cicero
Muslims are ones to talk about intolerance…what hypocrisy! They are the most intolerant, oppressive regime of all time. They have taken over regions and country’s through fear and fear alone. What man wouldn’t love the absolute power that this so called religion gives the men?
     “Power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely.â€
Craig Winn has studied this religion for years, dissected it, and even put their books in chronological order, compelling.
“Islam is a caustic blend of regurgitated paganism and twisted Bible stories. Muhammad, its lone prophet, conceived his religion solely to satiate his lust for power, sex, and money. He was a terrorist. And if you think these conclusions are shocking, wait until you see the evidence.
The critics of this work will claim that Prophet of Doom is offensive, racist, hatemongering, intolerant, and unnecessarily violent. I agree – but I didn’t write those parts. They came directly from Islam’s scriptures. If you don’t like what Muhammad and Allah said, don’t blame me. I’m just the messenger.”
You have your degrees and PHD’s, now you better get educated on Islam … and time is of the essence!
http://www.prophetofdoom.net
God help us, but we must first help ourselves by stopping this Obamanation of Desolation!
Â
Comments…..Tom
August 25th, 2010 at 2:13 pm
Since when did Left Liberals care so deeply â€for†any religion. Bloomberg & Paterson can take them all home for dinner! How cramped?
————————————-
Now wouldn’t that be a hoot? Paterson is blind and Bloomberg a Jew. Paterson couldn’t defend himself if he wanted to, and Bloomberg would pay his way out of it.
Q: Why can’t we get an answer on whether this mosque is being funded by terrorist countries?
A: Who the hell are you to demand to know where someone’s money comes from? If you have evidence they’ve broken the law, alert the authorities.
Q: Why open it on that day?
A: To replace an act of hate falsely committed in Islam’s name with an act of community and friendship.
Q: Why build it that close to Ground Zero?
A: Why not? Al Quaeda attacked us on 9/11, not representatives of the Muslim religion. Lower Manhattan is full of all kinds of buildings put to all kinds of uses. Why can’t innocent New Yorkers build their community center wherever the hell they want?
Q: And lastly, why that building?
A: Probably because it was the right size, price4Â and location for their community center.
I worked in the South Tower, though I was out of town that day. Friends and coworkers of mine were there, and some didn’t survive. Plenty of people have died horribly in NYC — if every spot where that happened was “sacred ground,” the whole island would be a mausoleum. Our grief doesn’t give us the right to piss on the Constitution or violate the rights of law abiding citizens.
I rest my case nothing more than a joke!
@Sheldon Have you ever been sky dived out of a building without a parachute? Seconds turn into a life time.
Schaef,
Thank you for your reply. What is your theory about how Bldg. 7 collapsed? As for this dog and pony show about radical Moslems, etc., the other comment I wrote today did not pass muster, apparently. C’est la vie. Even though it was all true and rather easily proved, perhaps it was a little too hot. We were suckered into WWs 1 and 2 (and Iraq and Afghanistan) — and the same forces that lied to us then are lying to us now. Follow the money 🙂
Pax tecum
Addendum…FWIW, I could cite 100 things Americans believe, whether from the recent or distant past, that are manifestly not true. My intellect has a duty, and is made, to conform to the truth — not to worry about the collective delusions of the most brainwashed society the world has ever known. An overwhelming majority of Americans have little to no grasp of the magnitude of the coming storm, or that it is even coming at all — yet this site, rightly, seeks to spread the truth about the ocean of manure that, as we speak/write, is in the process of hitting the world’s largest, fastest moving fan. Thank you for your labors. Godspeed 🙂
@Tom, the only reason I might sky dive without a parachute is to escape the mind-numbing hypocrisy of idiots who wrap themselves in the Constitution without ever having read it.Â
@Sheldon – With all due respect, as I suspected, your answers to my 4 questions are illegitimate. It seems that, for all of my “why” questions, your answers are simply “why not?” That might fly at home when you were growing up with a daddy who didn’t feel like explaining anything to you, but it doesn’t fly in the real world.Â
Who am I to ask where the money is coming from? I guess I could come right back at you with another question like “What is the harm in revealing the source if there is no secret to hide?” but I would rather answer your question directly. Who am I? I am a concerned citizen who believes that the source of the funds to this mosque will reveal the true motives to building it. Last time I checked, most Americans are against terrorist countries getting an ideological foothold in their major cities, not to mention the symbolism behind it all of building a mosque in a place they have “conquered”.
Your next point about Islam trying to promote a community of friendship by building a mosque there to “replace an act of hate falsely committed in Islam’s name”. Your statement is built on the premise that, first of all, it was falsely committed in Islam’s name and, secondly, that Islam should be able to decide how America copes with the tragedy committed to them there BY ISLAM. To your 1st point, it was not “falsely” committed in Islam’s name. It was thoroughly committed in the name of Jihad which the Islamic Koran demands of its followers to pursue. And to your 2nd point, that would be like a murderer’s family moving in next to the mother of his victim to show her that they are not all bad people and that it is time for her to get over it. Shouldn’t the mother decide how and when she is going to get over her loss instead of the murderer’s family members?
Next you say Al Qaeda does not represent the Muslim religion. Then why do they claim to represent it? Why do they shout “Alla Akbar!” as they cut off the heads of the infidels?
Then you say “Why can’t innocent New Yorkers build their community center wherever the hell they want?”. The truth is that you are right. They can build it wherever they want. That is not the topic of this discussion, however. The topic of this discussion is about the motives for building it in a place that pisses off so many people and the incredible insensitivity to the vicitms of 9/11 it represents. We all have a right to be assholes in America. But those who choose to be assholes tend to isolate themselves. I am wondering why Islam chooses further isolation instead of respect towards their fellow man. It seems that something which refers to itself as the Religion of Peace would want to do the latter.
Lastly, you say that they chose the building because it must be the right size, price and location, etc. First of all, the building will have to be completely reconstructed and many floors added onto it, so I am afraid you are wrong about it being the right size. As far as the price, I know we are in a real estate slump right now and some people think there are bargains out there, but lower Manhattan? Please. This is still one of the most pricey areas in the entire country, if not the world, to take on a project of this magnitude.
One thing I want to say about your last point regarding “pissing on the Constitution”. Hasn’t that been the trend in this country, for at least the last 50 years? It’s funny how those who are truly pissing all over our country’s founding document are the first ones to accuse their opposition of doing the same thing. We see it all over the place in the Obama Administration. In fact they have emboldened the rest of the world to follow suit, so it is no surprise that those who hate what this country stands for are trying to use its own founding document as something to hide behind as they try to further their agenda.
I look forward to your reply.
– Schaef
Eamon, I have seen many youtube vids and have read articles and whatnot about bldg 7 as well as all of the other “coincidences” that took place on that fateful day. Trust me when I tell you that I have thoroughly researched it. However, I am not all too concerned about exactly what role the gov’t played in it, if any.
Conspiracy or not, the towers still fell, 3000 people lost their lives, and the world changed forever.
Furthermore, conspiracy or not, we are headed for a horrible economic depression that is just getting warmed up as we speak. I am not so much concerned as to who is behind this (illuminati or whomever) as much as I am concerned about how to prepare for it. That is my attitude. Control what you can control.
Back to 9/11. Since Bin Laden took credit for it I can come to only 1 of 2 conclusions: he really did it, or he wants the world to think he did it. Either way, Islam was either directly or indirectly involved in it.
“I worked in the South Tower, though I was out of town that day. Friends and coworkers of mine were there, and some didn’t survive. Plenty of people have died horribly in NYC — if every spot where that happened was “sacred ground,†the whole island would be a mausoleum. Our grief doesn’t give us the right to piss on the Constitution or violate the rights of law abiding citizens.”
You sound really choked up Sheldon, “though I was out of town that day“. “Our grief doesn’t give us“.
Shaef, thanks for your thoughtful response. However, I believe your premise is faulty. Unlike the Roman Catholics but much like the Jews, the Muslims have no controlling international hierarchy. Like Christians and Jews, there are many subdivisions and sects within Islam, some of whom are actively at war with each other. Clearly, Al Quaeda claims to be representing all Muslims in order to gain credibility as a pious religious group rather than the filthy head choppers that they are. It’s the same with the guy who kills nurses, doctors and patients at an abortion clinic and claims to be representing Jesus  – sayin’ it don’t make it so. Al Quaeda are terrorist extremists. The overwhelming majority of Muslims are typical schlubs like you and me, and their “religion” amounts to a few holidays marked by meals with family. I can cite passages in the Bible that call for stoning adulterers, etc., that are just as vile as anything you’d find in the Koran. Forget which silly ancient books people read: judge them by their deeds. Al Quaeda = bad; Muslims = far to broad and diverse a category to sum up like that. Again, think of the Christians: some good, some bad.Â
The site in lower Manhattan was selected by a local Muslim group, not by Al Quaeda nor “Islam.” Do you really think they’ll be conducting anti-American activities down there? It’s not exactly off Homeland Security’s radar.
As a citizen, you have a right to expect your law enforcement authorities to certify — within the law — that no illegal funding nor activities are taking place. You don’t have the right to personally inspect anyone else’s funding sources, beyond asking politely. It’s a privacy issue, but if you’re in the “if you’ve got nothing to hide, why are you afraid of total surveillance?” crowd, I guess we’ll just have to disagree.
I don’t know exactly what you mean by “idealological foothold,” especially since Muslims have been here for hundreds of years, and many serve honorably and even heroically in our defense forces. I’m sure you know that many of the victims and first responders to 9/11 were Muslims. Moreover, we profess to have freedom of thought in this country, so it must be open to all forms of ideology. In the free market of ideas, you should have faith that the best ones will gain adherents and the losers fail. I believe Islam will continue to be a small minority worldview in this country for, well, forever. If I’m wrong, I don’t care — the Muslims I’ve known don’t threaten me or my way of life one bit.
Re: the dismantling of our Constitution, yes, it’s been going on for a long time and has been picking up steam since the drug war and war on terror. The fact is, this country was established to protect individual liberties, one of which is religious liberty (remember why the Pilgrims came here in the first place?). When I speak out for another’s religious freedom, I am defending the document on which the country I love was founded. It guarantees that we’ll all be equally offended sooner or later, as we buy our freedom with the tolerance we extend to others — even others who do shit we find repugnant, though not illegal. Â
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Your right Sheldon, they were in the front seats. They got there first.
Comments…..Sheldon, no doubt you speak words of wisdom, the fundamentals of the monotheistic faith are all one and the same, therefore good and bad people exist in all of them, look at the drunken scumbag that stabbed a cab drive in NY just because he was Muslim,who’s the bad guy in that secnario.
The way I see it your actions and words are a reflection of your beliefs, therefore all these external labels mean nothing to me.
I believe the same people behind 911 are the same behind this rumor of a Mosque being built and it’s not the Muslims, yes I say rumor because I don’t think anything is to get built. But the effects of this rumor are working according to the plan, look how much hate and controversy this issue is causing. After all the party has established that hate week should start Sept. 11 every year.
Shaef,when it comes to knowledge about Islam you’re abviously lacking in this department, may be you should do a little more home work before you unleash your ignorance.
Former National Security Adviser Zbigniew Brzezinski publishes a book, The Grand Chessboard: American Primacy and Its Geostrategic Imperatives, in which he portrays the Eurasian landmass as the key to world power, and Central Asia with its vast oil reserves as the key to domination of Eurasia. He states that for the US to maintain its global primacy, it must prevent any possible adversary from controlling that region. He notes: “The attitude of the American public toward the external projection of American power has been much more ambivalent. The public supported America’s engagement in World War II largely because of the shock effect of the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor.†He predicts that because of popular resistance to US military expansionism, his ambitious Central Asian strategy can not be implemented, “except in the circumstance of a truly massive and widely perceived direct external threat.†[Brzezinski, 1997, pp. 24-25, 210-11] The book also theorizes that the US could be attacked by Afghan terrorists, precipitating a US invasion of Afghanistan, and that the US may eventually seek control of Iran as a key strategic element in the US’s attempt to exert its influence in Central Asia and the Middle East.
Schaef,
Thank you for the reply. We will have to agree to disagree on some things — no biggie. As for facing what is clearly before us and doing what is in our power to prep, good luck and Godspeed, as no one has ever seen the things we will soon see and there is no handbook for this one 🙂
Sheldon, you say “The site in lower Manhattan was selected by a local Muslim group, not by Al Quaeda nor “Islam.â€Â ” How do you know this if we don’t know where the money is coming from?
Also, I agree that there are many religious books (including the bible) which seem to promote violence, but it seems that Islam is the only one acting them out all over the world (on civilians, no less).Â
The “ideological foothold” I am talking about not only represents the mosque itself and the teachings of the Koran that will take place there, but the symbolism of its proposed location and time of opening. They are knowingly launching themselves upon the world’s stage with this project to try and make a statement. The problem is that it is the wrong statement in that it is extremely arrogant and presumptuous.
You say that this country “must be open to all forms of ideology”, and I think that this is what is at the crux of our disagreement. “All forms of ideology” is a very broad statement (even more broad than me lumping all Muslims together). How many ideologies hate freedom and everything else America stands for? I would say more than a few, and Islam is definitely at the forefront. So why would letting those ideologies be allowed to grow in our country be a good thing? It seems as though Islam gets a pass because it has so many followers and because of that is considered one of the major religions in the world. Few really look very closely at its teachings, for if they did I am quite sure more people would have a problem with it. That is the price we pay for our ignorance and political correctness.Â
What bothers me the most is that Sam and yourself still are not addressing how the families of the victims feel about all of this. Your arguments still rest on principles instead of common sense and respect. And that is what this issue is about.
That’s right, common sense and respect. Why aren’t there any Japanese steakhouses near pearl harbor? Why isn’t the US building a bunch of Christian churches in Iraq or near near Auschwitz? Why aren’t there statues of Harry Truman in Hiroshima and Nagasaki? Because common sense and respect tell us that those wouldn’t be prudent things to do.
p.s. Sam, show me where I am ignorant on this issue. Just saying that I am doesn’t mean anything at all. There are over 160 verses in the Koran that call for Jihad against the infidels. With exception to the few million Muslims in America, that leaves the rest of us fair game for the slaughter. And, as I point out in my article, most “Muslims” are not true Muslims because they don’t take the Koran seriously. If they actually did, God help us all.Â
Comments…..Schaef, I say you”re ignorant because you no nothing of the Koran and it’s meaning, the word Jihad doesn”t mean to fight and cut peoples heads off, translated into english it means STRIVE, so when it”s mentiioned it refers to those who strive in the cause of God, meaning to strive for truth freedom and justice. The Koran does not command the Muslims to force their religion on anyone, for it clealy states “” There is no compulsion in religion””. The sad thing is most Muslims are just as ingnorant of the Koran as you are. Linguistics is my hobby I am fluent in the Arabic tongue and fimiliar with the Aramaic and hebrew linguistic structure.
The word Koran translated into english means Transcendent, most Muslims that you ask don’t know that. As I said God’s message to all is one  and there is good and bad in every society.
So you go ahead and read your Ingsoc dictionary that says Jihad means holly war, and make sure you keep up with all the updates and changes of meanings the party makes everytime a new version come out.
Schaef wrote: “Also, I agree that there are many religious books (including the bible) which seem to promote violence, but it seems that Islam is the only one acting them out all over the world (on civilians, no less).”Â
You might want to do some research into the ‘Tall-mood’. As for “acting out” the teachings thereof, that is already the subject of many websites. If you want to do some ‘on the ground’ research, go to Palestine.
Christian churches close to Auschwitz? You been drinkin da kewl-aid again, Schaef? All joking aside…please expand on that idea. Yes, the water can get deep really quickly…and no, I do not care what “most” of the world believes, on this or any other matter.
Schaef asks:Â “So why would letting those ideologies be allowed to grow in our country be a good thing?”
My answer: Because the alternative — i.e., prosecuting people for thought crimes — is plainly unacceptable to anyone who’s read the 1st Amendment. I’d love to be able to shut down all the forms of institutionalized idiocy I see around me, but I can’t do so without the certainty that someone will try to shut down my brand of idiocy. Suck it up, Schaef: as Americans, we — and that includes the families of 9/11 victims — have to tolerate all kinds of offensive crap from our fellow citizens. When that offense crosses into illegality, call the cops; otherwise, mind your own business.
Your claim that Islam is the only religion actively trying to conquer the world is somewhat humorous, especially when the the USA is profoundly Christian, our military is loaded with Christian fundamentalists, and we control far more of the world than any other country. If you were a Muslim, what would you make of this: http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/us-military-weapons-inscribed-secret-jesus-bible-codes/story?id=9575794
That said, I agree with other posters that this whole non-issue is a political fabrication designed to divide and polarize the electorate in advance of the November elections. It’s a distraction, as per usual.
What nobody seems to want to address is this: Since when does the 1st Amendment mean people can build a church wherever they please? Also since when does the usual leftist standard for religious practice ( it’s only ok if no one gets offended) no longer apply?
Sam, still no comments on respect or common sense toward the victims of 9/11? Wow. I must have really pinned you if you are gonna grasp at straws and revert to arguing linguistics and interpretations of the Koran.
Comments….. Schaef, I thought I made myself clear that this whole thing is just a rumor to create animosity, that answers your question that they’re not being disrespectfull because they have nothing to do with 911 or building a Mosque in the area.
As for reverting to definitiions, I don’t see how you call that grasping at straws, I simply answered your question as to why your are ignorant, because you said just saying so doesn’t mean that you are, what I am saying is your whole hate mongering article is based on false interpretation.
Then again I forgot, we can bash Muslims and Chritians all we want because it’s free speech. Yes, tap tap tap you pinned me I give, Peace, have a nice weekend.Â
Schaef,
While you are busy patting yourself on the back for “pinning” Sheldon, how about addressing the matter of the truly wild teachings of the Tall-mood, Holocaustolatry and the ever-profitable and useful “shoah business”, the Gaza Flotilla massacre and ensuing PR nightmare, etc.?
http://theuglytruth.podbean.com/2010/08/20/the-ugly-truth-podcast-aug-20-2010/
There is a segment of Islam that wants every American killed.Your wife…my children…all dead.They had repeated demonstrated their desire with 9/11 an example ..among others.Hamas is an internationally recognized Islamic terrorist organization.The person trying to found this mosque,which is to be built on the ashes of almost 3,000 innocent Americans was asked. “Will you say Hamas is a terrorist organization”.This person ..who casts himself as a “bridge builder” between our cultures refuses to denounce Hamas and says the US was indirectly responsible for what happened to them.And some have the nerve to ask….why Americans has an issue ?
The funding issue: http://onlinejournal.com/artman/publish/article_6274.shtml
While claiming some want all Americans dead is quite the comment, CC, and there is little doubt it could produce fear in some, you might want to consider the benefit of providing sources to back it up. Do you know much about the history of modern Israel? Have you ever heard of the Balfour Declaration (1917), the USS Liberty (1967), etc? There is little doubt that terrorists comprise part of this equation, but most are confused about their identity and are looking for them in the wrong places (no, I am not referring to OBL hiding out in caves wherever it is most convenient for the plans of the US military, etc).
http://zippittydodah.blogspot.com/2010/08/enemies-of-humanity-and-their-empty.html
This is the true spirit of the IDF, supposedly the world’s most moral army…
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2005/nov/16/israel2
Ground Zero Mosque Distraction, Israel Lobby, Apple and Orwell – Sunday Update
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yV56P159egU&feature=player_embedded
http://theuglytruth.wordpress.com/2010/08/30/islamophobia-israel%E2%80%99s-most-cherished-weapon-of-mass-destruction-destined-to-destroy-the-west-if-not-stopped/
Schaef,
If you went on vacation until after Labor Day, just remember to leave your white shoes in the closet afterward…we look forward to your return…