Gold and Silver Update: “Have the Courage of Your Convictions and Hold Fast”

by | Feb 20, 2013 | Precious Metals | 313 comments

Do you LOVE America?


    The last couple of weeks have seen stock markets bounce around inexplicably and reach new highs, all in the midst of an economy that is, once again, about to buckle.

    Likewise, during this time period we’ve seen the price of gold and silver fluctuate significantly, primarily to the downside.

    This has left many holders of these metals, as well as potential investors, quite nervous.

    Is this the end of gold’s decade-long run?


    Despite media claims to the contrary, there is no gold bubble (yet) and this ancient metal is nowhere close to the levels of value it will achieve as the global economic and geo-political situation worsens.

    We once opined that the price of gold would do wildly amazing things throughout the course of the various intense crises facing the world, so much so that those who own the metal will hate it so much they’ll want to spit on it. This is why we’ve recommended that those who buy gold as a hedge against the collapse of pretty much the entire world not lose a wink of sleep over short-term price movements.

    Those of us who hold physical assets do so not to make money on leveraged trading accounts. We do it to preserve our wealth over the long-term.

    Gold is money, regardless of what Chairman Bernanke wants us to believe.

    As we move forward we must keep in mind that not everything that’s happening in the ‘free market’ is as free as we may think.

    Adam Taggert of Peak Prosperity suggests that what’s happening right now is that our convictions are being tested and there’s no fundamental reason for us to back down from why we invested in precious metals  to begin with (or other collapse-proof hard assets, for that matter):

    It’s hard to swallow that these charts are evidence of a free and efficient market. Otherwise, a pattern this predictable would be quickly removed as traders and HFT algos piled in to a “sure” bet.

    Instead, this is behavior one would expect to see if powerful interests wanted to suppress the price of gold: hit the price hard and early at the start of the trading week to prevent the price from building upward momentum, as well as to make capital think twice before entering the gold market.

    Who is doing this selling at the market open? Is it TBTF (“too big to fail”) banks making profit on large short positions? Is it the Fed, through proxies, keeping the gold price contained so as not to signal how badly QE is devaluing the dollar? Allegations swarm across the Internet that it’s one of these – or both. But we don’t know for certain. The exchanges don’t make that information available to the public.

    But while these charts above are not enough evidence to prove that the gold price is being manipulated, they sure exhibit the symptoms one would expect to see if it is.

    So, the big question is: if the precious metals market is being manipulated, is it wise to be in it?

    From our perspective here at Peak Prosperity, for all of the reasons explored in the Crash Course and discussed here daily, we firmly believe that fundamentals will ultimately matter most. And when they fully express themselves, there will be a tremendous re-pricing of assets  largely higher for tangible assets that require energy to obtain, and markedly lower for paper claims on wealth (stocks, bonds, and their derivatives).

    But as we’ve often said, the corrective process may very well take much longer than we ever expected to arrive. Frankly, we’re amazed that the system has held together so well over the past 5 years with all of the thin-air money printing, trillion-dollar deficits, and $100 oil. If you are playing to the fundamentals, as we are, you need to be eyes-wide-open that you may be frustrated for far longer than you’d like to be.

    It’s only human to have your confidence shaken when the market acts so completely differently than you think it should for so prolonged a time. Chris and I feel the same pain, both constitutionally as well as in our wallets, as much of our net worth is invested in the PMs.

    But every time we go through the exercise of challenging our assumptions, we walk away feeling certain that our charted course is the correct one – and that at some point, fundamentals will prevail.

    As for what those fundamentals are, there’s a seminal piece Chris wrote back in 2011 called The Screaming Fundamentals for Owning Gold and Silver that is even more true today. I highly recommend revisiting it.

    Chris has mentioned many times that this market feels an awful lot like 2007, when asset prices powered ever higher month after month, even though the underlying data was deteriorating fast. As then, he sees a high and rising potential for a violent correction that will take the market by surprise and vaporize a lot of wealth before players are able to react.

    Full Analysis: Gold’s Regular Morning Mugging

    The take away is that the moves to suppress precious metals by the powers that be are to be fully expected. You see, while they play paper shuffle with the price of gold and cause confusion in markets on the one hand, guess what’s happening in the other hand?

    Central banks and governments are buying tons (literally) of gold and stockpiling their vaults. Others are doing their damnedest to repatriate their international holdings, as recently evidenced by Germany’s move to return all of its 3,400 tons of gold currently held at the U.S. Federal Reserve. And they are not alone; Holland, Venezuela and a host of other countries are doing the same.

    For those who are not invested in precious metals for reasons that may include budgetary issues or the notion that one “can’t eat it,” it’s still highly recommend that you watch the precious metals markets, as they provide insights into what investors and governments are doing. Massive capital flows are taking place right now in these markets, which suggests individuals, conglomerate, cartels and governments are positioning themselves for near and long-term events that will have serious implications for the entire world.

    Gold, while often cited as a hedge for inflation, is actually much more than that. Throughout history it has been a hedge against instability and uncertainty, and believe it or not, it was at one time actually used as money to exchange for goods and services, and as a way for governments to back the value of their paper currencies.

    It is still money.

    And when all of the machinations and manipulations taking place today end because of currency destruction and governments collapse in on themselves because of massive debt loads, it will be one of the few investments left standing.

    Naturam Expelles Furca, Tamen Usque Recurret
    (Horace circa 20 B.C.)

    “Nature can be expelled with a pitchfork, but nevertheless always returns”

    They may manipulate our markets, our money, and our political processes.

    But nature will always correct the imbalance.

    And, as we know, nature tends to be quite violent and destructive when that happens.


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      1. Dropped 40$ today

        • Don’t tempt me eppe!

          Silver is looking mighty fine right now 🙂

          • Silver dropped 1$ too, to 28.40. So far…

            • Here is some more information about gold and silver in the news today.

              1. What you need to know before buying silver today

              2. Unusual charts show a major gold bottom could be forming now

              3. A major gold “disinformation campaign” could be starting now
              “Notice how [the L.A. Times] reports the story:

              The U.S. government’s gold in New York is safe in a vault underneath Manhattan, and some of the precious metal there is purer than previously thought.

              The problem with this is that the gold held at the New York Federal Reserve is not ‘The U.S. government’s gold.’ It is gold held, for the most part, by the Federal Reserve for foreign countries.”

              The Daily Crux

              • Charts? Unusual? Major Gold bottom “could” be forming?

                Deja vu?

                When one walks into a Casino, who are the odds in favor of? You, or the House?

                The Key, IMHO, not to be attached or overshadowed by the outcome. Think of it as the Icing on the Cake (if one is so fortunate to walk out the door in the Black), and, the cake itself, never having entered the Casino in the first place, i.e. all the essentials, and then some, are already in place (bought and paid for), by the well prepared prepper, back at the compound.

                for the prepper all of the essentials are already bought and paid for.

                • Prior to every collapse of the U.S. stock market precious metals have sold off, then rebounded on a rocket within weeks. Please check the historical charts and validate for yourselves.

                • I agree. Gold is an investment alternative to dollars. Maybe some other investment alternatives are better priced than gold. E.g. value producing investment such as dairy farm or mechanic shop. Or Amazon or Google. IDK as I haven’t played the market in a long time.
                  I do think FRB will continue QE money bombs because, hey, why not? It sure is nice for those involved to receive a money bomb. And nobody can stop them. So, of course all hard assets will cost more in terms of dollars as QE bombs continue to blow away the dollar.

              • Hi KY,

                Yeah, everyone usually ASSUMES that what is in NY is ours, don’t they? NY has served as an International depository/clearing point since WWII and the bulk of what’s there is ‘OPM’, some is our’s to be sure.

                When the other major players back in the 50’s-60’s began redeeming gold they got the higher grade bullion in our repository’s leaving what is thought to be the less pure stock behind with us (supposedly most at Knox). However since NO ONE has assayed that in a human lifetime and same was only seen once – ONLY one room of the 10 in the Knox basement) at Congressional INSISTENCE in the early 70’s, who really KNOWS. Hell, could be a bunch of gold-plated lead for all we KNOW….things JUST keep getting more interesting by the day…don’t they?

                Au Reviour

                Adios Amigo’s,

                Auf Weidersehen zu Alles!


                • What you people are forgetting is what was or was not found in the vaults below the world trade center after the collapse, remember the rescue crews found the vault doors open and empty!!! which leads to another story. look it up for yourselves

              • It doesn’t matter…if you own gold or silver (in your hands) then you will be okay financially as long as you don’t need to cash out…if you do then do so with care. I bought all of mine at $300 and $5 an ounce. I think your best efforts are getting a rifleman’s badge at an apple seed shoot as opposed to being a holder of PMs. If you need to save for your future, I suggest you buy PMs as you can. Just sayin’.

              • Germans have been told that they have to wait 7 years to get their gold back.

                Chavez was smart and demanded that he be given his country’s gold back a few years ago, I think he got it all brought back to his country.

                My gut instincts and keen eye for knowing who the biggest and most audacious thieves and swindlers almost always are, tends to make me believe that all the gold in Fort Knox and all the gold that was stored in the vaults under the WTC on 9-11 and probably lots more that I am not aware of – has at least a 95% chance of being found sitting inside Israeli Banks and/or in Israeli owned vaults located in Switzerland.

                Betcha $10 bucks. Any takers?

            • Old school, lots of food in the pantry, debt free, good land to grow vegetables, farm animals, shotgun, plenty of ammo, a bible, faith in the Lord and yourself.

              • It is always good to diversify and one must take measures to protect what one owns but we do know that gold is considered to be of some worth since a bandit with a better weapon than you have will take your gold even though he cannot eat it…

              • Live Free or Die: Sounds like you have all of your preps. But PMs could come in very handy as a medium of exchange should you find yourself in need of something, perhaps say medical services. Trading food or ammo would not be my first choice of exchange since most of us will need just about everything we have or produce. After any collapse, small barter markets will pop up and there will be a need for something like a universal currency. Small gold and silver to include ‘junk silver’ could fill that need. If I need a dentist but he has all the corn and chickens he can handle, I will need something else, and that could be a handful of silver dimes. Food for thought.

              • It goes without sayin but a woodburner and an axe are a must too!

            • Try finding someone..anyone..who is selling silver at $28.40. Apmex is roughly 15=20% for pre 1965 silver over melt and then you pay high shipping costs.

              I just checked Apmex for a roll (20) Franklin halves..$244 for wire transfer and $251 for credit card. At $28.40 the cost would be $208 for the same roll. Then comes the shipping costs. And if you want the pretty stuff AU-Proof….wow the prices really go up.

              This last week I sold 40 ounces of pretty Franklins and netted $40.75 and ounce.

              Now I get to take the $$ and buy more preps. I do have a set amount set aside for when the SHTF. But the rest was purchashed with the intent of selling.

              Just my 2 cents worth.

              • Kindle, if you go on the Kitco website they always undersell Apmex, enough to make it worth your while. The Canadian Maple leaf silver ounce coin is selling at $31.66 today and that’s the lowest I have seen it for some time. The thing about pm though, is, how much is enough? I keep wondering just how much I should have on hand for bartering,hedging against inflation and sheltering my ‘real’ net worth. There is a limit to what I can afford and at the moment that is slim to none but when I do have a few dollars set aside I cannot make up my mind whether to spend them on pm or food. I know, I know, the old adage, you can’t eat pm but there are stages to a societal collapse and pm has its place. Should it be a percentage of your net worth as a goal or should it just be a small chunk? I suppose I feel the same way about all my preps, I can not have enough candles or beeswax or enough lantern mantles or batteries or whatever. Everything is a trade-off. I won’t be selling mine to buy preps though, as it is part of my preps. Gotta get a washboard and tub and wringer next!

                  • I don’t understand why some people fret about the price of PM’s today, unless they need to sell right now. It’s not like the price doesn’t go up again. I purchased an 18k gold, 20 gram chain in 1988 at about $10 a gram ($200).

                    Today, that same chain is worth about $800. If gold tripled tomorrow, it would be worth over $2000.

                    As I understand it, once a stock goes down in value, it stays down. Is that how that works? What happens if a formerly failing company’s stock suddenly gets a new owner who turns the company around? Does their stock go up again?

                    I suggest that if a stock can’t ever be of more value again, that playing the stock market is NOTHING MORE THAN playing 5 card stud.

                • Funny you mention washboard & tub. I just got a new washer yesterday that is only 1.4 cf. I got it cuz of the low amps to run it…i.e., I can run it off a generator without it sucking up too much energy.

                  It was a 5 towel process to get it all figured out cuz it is the type you attach to a faucet. Trying to figure out the laundry scenario in a SHTF situation. I think it may work out fine.

                  As I mentioned, I have set aside the amount I intend to keep for SHTF times…the rest I need to occasionally sell to keep the bills paid and the preps up. I’ve tripled my initial investment…years ago I sunk everything including the kitchen sink and then some into physical silver. It has allowed me to leave the slave world of working for someone else and that is priceless.

                  • @ Kindle: I bought a janitor’s bucket, which has a wringer for the mop head. I intend to use it to wash clothes, and will put the heavy items in the wringer to get the water out.

              • Just do the smart thing and get free shipping and better prices from Merit Financial. Nobody else can touch their $1.99 over spot Maple Leafs.

                • So, if I want to buy some physical silver, will this summer be a good time? I know that summer typically has the lowest prices. I am afraid I missed the boat. I put most $ into food preps so I don’t have a lot to put in silver. I would love it if it dropped way down so I could pick some up. I’ve seen some junk silver but it is selling for almost double what the spot would be on it, so I’d rather just get eagles. Thoughts?

                  • Past performance cannot predict future results on ANY financial tool….a silver dip in the hand is worth two in the bush. I am buying some tomorrow.

                • Merit has $1,500 min to order.

            • Buying opportunity!!!

            • If one could hold even one percent of their wealth in gold or sliver when dollar falls you at least have more then most to rebuild.

          • Wasn’t the Dow at it highest peak ever in 2007? Right before the Crash of 2008? I was watch Fox and they kept say that it was approaching its highest ever, from 2007. History repeating itself??

            Keep your powder dry,

            • @ JJsan. The dow is not even close to be at all time highs if you compare it to precious metals, real money value, in 2008. The dow would have to be way above 20,000 to even be close to 2008 levels. The world is messed up for a whole lot of other reasons that go way beyond finances. Just the mere fact that the likely last Pope is coming is one of them.

              I think that war is the number reason that like you say, keep your powder dry. There are several intense hot spots in the world. Japan and China for one are getting ready for war over those oil and natural gas rich islands that both nations want and lay claim to. North Korea is nuts and always a problem. Iran is ready to be attacked by Israel. Syria is a huge mess that Russia absolutely doesn’t want falling into the hands of NATO. Hezbollah is likely to launch some attacks against Israel for the Israeli attack on Syria last month. Central and South America are huge problems for the U.S., more than people realize as China tried to gain a true foothold there. Then there are the cyber attacks on the U.S. from China.

              Bubbling caldron of potential fire spots ready to ignite the very dry tinder that the world political scene has become. This is why I stress so much to get your supplies in order before this comes, which will likely be fast and furious and unbelievable.

            • The banksters are getting ready for another culling.

              • Off Topic: Or is it?

                A lawyer, an Illegal alien, a pathological liar, and a
                Communist walk into a bar.

                Bartender asks…

                -What will it be Mr. President?

        • This is only the beginning of the unraveling of paper gold and silver.

          I truly beleive the ride is getting to the rough parts in finances. Many thing will be floating to the top.

          Paper bad BAD.

          It started slow and is now gaining speed.

          As I have stated before I can afford to keep money in the paper markets. Both for fun and not all in one basket strati age.

          Starting last Monday I started pulling and transfer to cash assets. It is heating up and I have enough. So why loss what I have.

          This isn’t for bragging it to point out that someone with money is running now. SO look hard at your goal and it may be time possibly the last chance you get to secure your wealth.

          People I not bullshitting. Im at a gold meeting for a mine right now and we can’t figure out what to do with all the cash heading our way for capital investment.

          • I’ve long accepted that preppers are lone isolated voices of sanity whispering against the howling of the craven madness encircling the globe. I’ve stopped looking at the MSM & experts for guidance and started trying to address the basics.

            Gold has acted as a currency of the last resort for the persecuted to seek safe ground away from genocidal situations for at least 6000 years. Silver has always had a lesser, similar role to play. PM’s buried 100 years ago still have some value when dug up by the originators descendants to use in a new era. I just don’t see that changing.

            An elder once told me that “so long as you have have a shirt on your back, a roof over your head, food on the kitchen table, and the peace to enjoy your meal then life is good.” I find myself agreeing more and more.

            Incidents like the mother in London held back by police while her 16 year son was chopped up “hanimals”, or images like the pregnant mother in her child’s home nursery for law enforcement training confirm my increasingly strong belief that the key to salvation on this mortal plane is to simply try and detach, detach, detach from the system. Disengage from what the artificially manipulated markets say and focus on fundamentals. This is time to hunker down for survival, not to try and get rich quick.

            Get the basics in place, such as your water filter and seed storage, and then once you are as set up to be as detached from the system save a little via PM’s in a secure, secret place. Think of it not as an “investment” but rather insurance for your children/grandchildren in case they have to start again some place else. Many families hung onto some intergenerational wealth during the depression of the 1930’s or escaped to New lands thanks to a pouch of PM coins buried under the patio.

          • Invest in gold. Speculate with silver. Hoard your lead. They won’t be making anymore of it after the Changes.

            Brass. Breathe. Relax. Aim. Slack. squeeze.

            • FYI my AMMO store just got in about 50,000 rds of 22 and about 5K each of 45.40.9MM. even got 2K of 223. Bunch of other stuff. I did notice all the common ammo was Remington. Anybody got info on Remington’s ammo plant: size etc I know it’s not in NY with their gun manuf. Store had a line, most of the AMMO will be gone in 2 hr.

              • Hmmph!…*envy*….sniffle… 🙂

                Good Job Dude,


                • It’s worse than that, They had all that Ammo and I didn’t even buy any for myself, got a brick of 22 and mega box of 9mm for my brother, he teaches firearms safety, uses a lot of the ammo and does not wish to use his supply. (Had surgery on his knee and isn’t out for awhile) I have enough ammo for the rest of my life.

            • Well said, don’t back up.

          • “Paper bad BAD.”
            You know FB, I think that this may well be the most intelligent thing you’ve ever posted.

            To hell with paper. Hold physical.

        • $42.10

        • This will be great for shaking out all of the weak hands….

        • I want gold to drop back down in the 200.00 range. I have gold plated parts that I build for a customer of mine that I couldn’t raise the prices on to match the upward trend that gold took. My plating cost went from .05 each up to .175 each. I’m eating about half that increase. If gold drops then I’ll make a decent profit on those parts for a little while before I drop the price on them and earn a few brownie points to boot.

        • Because unless you are a fool, the boys that hedged paper is off the market, they are 100 percent prime time got a call from their broker today.

      2. Don’t sell it is time to buy.

        Unless you are selling to me then sell sell sell.

        • I agree FBP — if nothing else, continue to dollar cost average into it if you can.

          Even getting a Silver Eagle or a few pre-65 Kennedy halves (or those pretty Benjamins, not of the Bernanke printer variety) a week is a good idea in my opinion….

          We have not seen the ‘real’ crisis yet. When we do, we’re going to have a similar effect to what happened on the streets of Greece back in the midst of panic in 2010.

          Gold on global exchanges was trading for about $1200 while Greeks were rushing to pay $1700 on the black market.

          • I am waiting now on a small purchase of silver dimes and a 1/10 oz of gold…I can only afford to buy in small quantities every pay day. My question is, should I buy more todasy with it dropping…the reason I have to ask that question is, by the time APMEX gets my check, thenit takes another 5-10 days before they ship. It takes almost two weeks from ordering on phone until I get it in my hand at the house? What if SHTF next week, what will happen to my delivery being shipped?

            • BJ, I know Apmex and JM Bullion take direct wire transfers as well and those have a turn around time of less than 24 hours.

              I think even if the system gets hit there will be a period of time where infrastructure components are still running – shipping, transportation, etc should be OK for a bit.

              Of course, if we’re talking Black Swan events like war, solar flare or natural disaster all bets are off.

              I wouldn’t worry too much about it.

              With respect to buying ‘more’ today — the short answer is : I don’t know.

              Dollar cost averaging seems to be a solid strategy here.

              Gold and Silver could very well go down even more — and significantly — like 20% – 30%…

              I look to the 2008 crash for clues. When market panic sets in, EVERYTHING will be up for sale and we could see gold, silver, oil, and food drop like a rock, just as before.

              I do think a decoupling will take place shortly after the next market crash (if it comes to that, as you never know, we could see the Dow go to 20,000 with the current level of money printing).. In any case, deflation or inflation, I think hard asset VALUE vs. other assets (like stocks, Treasuries, currencies) will rise.

              I am hard pressed to say “put everything you got into gold” right now.

              Slowly but surely and consistently is, in my view, the best approach.

              • THe cost of the tranfer could not be effective in a small purchase.

                If you are doing small purchase find your local dealers.

                • Don’t let one days activity change you r your short and long term strategies.

                • FB,
                  Not just the wire transfer fee but also on the shipping costs.

                  Try and find a coin shop that is selling at melt prices..

                  • Scottsdale silver has free shipping, fairly good prices, cc, wire, check options

              • Well I have just been buying 1/10 oz gold and a roll of dimes and quarters with each paycheck. I was always afraid of getting ripped off at pawn shops and “we buy gold” stores. I don’t think there are any actual pm dealers in my area?

                I also can’t do a wire transfer unless making a purchase of a minimum amount which si more than I can afford to buy at a time.

                What is “decoupling”??

                • Decoupling is when the price of paper gold (ETF) and the price of physical gold seperate and become 2 entities (if TPTB will let it).

              • I am finally about to “renege” on the statement that I and a lot of preppers are guilty of saying; “you can’t eat gold”.

                The truth is that most, “true” preppers are already stocked and locked on a good supply of food reserves and security measures. So…. if you have reserves in paper/markets/401K, get out!

                Cash in those retirement funds and buy real silver/gold. If you are not hungry, that shiney metal sure beats a piece of paper for a reserve. Take the lumps on profits and tax exemptions and get something tangible.

                With the price of oil escalating everyday, the gold and silver markets will soon follow. I do believe.

                There may be a day when some will cast their gold into the streets because there is no food left to barter for, but that will be a ways off. When the real SHTF and we are under martial law, it is too late for stocking up on anything. A couple sleeves of gold/silver will be a lot heavier than buckets of worthless stock certificates or benjamins.

            • If I were you. Id buy a gun and some canned food.

              • For those of us with limited income, I recommend purchasing more foodstuffs and tangible “necessities” for barter, rather than investing in precious metals…..I can purchase many food items for the price of one oz. of silver….but, then again, I do not see myself “purchasing” anything of great value “after”….I pray I have thought of everything I may need….
                Bottom line….if you can afford it….go for it! And, if not, get what you can that may be “useful and valuable” in its own right later on…..

                • FOB ~

                  One worry for post collapse might be property taxes. That is one thing that you can’t really prep for without some type of currency.


                  • Daisy-bear,

                    The reason I constantly berate people over their writing is because the selling point of the media vermin is that we preppers are backwards, unread, low-information voters, while the dipshit urbanites, yuppies, and university-dwellers know whats best for everyone. Making elementary school mistakes like confusing your with youre and their with theyre is not helping our case. For their part, the idiot populace is silly and easily led. Every one of us must be using all of the brain power the good Lord blessed us with. Its the only way to beat it into the heads of the morons who surround us. Our individual salvation depends on our ability to do this collectively. I take no joy in wasting my time correcting everyone else, what I do is a sacrififce for the movement. I am not the troll Im characterized as. What I try to do is get all you old people to use your brains. I myself am constantly learning. I dont think I know everything by any means.

                    *hugs and cuddles*


                  • Daisy you may be correct….I do not own my home, but work (along with my real job) for my landlord so my concern would be if he was not able to pay the taxes….I do not believe that to a problem for him. I also wonder, if/when all collapses, whether the local gov’t will be interested in collecting property taxes over the obvious shut-down of “normal life”? I do not know, nor can I predict, exactly WHAT is going to occur, WHEN it will occur, or HOW it will transpire…..I do expect to be without power….for me, that’s a given….so I am attempting to do whatever I can within my realm of reality…to do for my future (and for others around me)what I can….


                  • D…if things collapse, no one will be paying property tax…I realize that you said “post”.

                    Once people are in the streets, the purge of tax will begin.

                  • My guess is that property taxes will be the way any remaining government tries to get its hands on people’s homes. If you look back at the south just after the Civil War, this is how the “carpetbaggers” managed to appropriate many of the plantations that had been owned by the same family for generations.

                    FOB ~ you are very lucky to be renting from someone you know well. I rent also and because the people I rent from have other properties, I’m not concerned that they will, in the future, put us out on the streets. And I am with you – I’m prepping for a no-power situation as well. 🙂

                  • E ~

                    I do understand your point. The thing is, no one is listening to you when you do that. I don’t think it is actually improving grammar or spelling.

                    I think the content of the message is more important than the linguistic elements with which it is written.

                    I don’t think you’re a troll, but I think that you would be more effective if you used just a wee bit more tact.

                    Gotta run, E. I must go cover my gray hair and try to get rid of some of these wrinkles now. 😉


                  • Frankly, I think that once down, there won’t be any tax paid until every last bit of ammo is fired.

                    Whether one wants to believe it or not, the banks, the govt, the politicians are getting very nervous.

                  • My biggest worry is property taxes and mortgage payments after a SHTF event…
                    These entities are great at the SNAFU game… and that its all “your fault for being a ‘failure’…”
                    As they take us out one at a time.

                  • If I can’t pay, I’m not leaving just because some schmuck from a mortgage company or the county sends me a letter. Somebody will have to MAKE me leave. Even if I left, there are too many vacant houses around for my family to live under a bridge.

                    Puck the banksters and the goobermint. Either would be happy to toss my family out into a blizzard and would take the clothes off our backs if they could.

                    Everybody be careful, lighting with candles couuld cause a fire.

                  • If the dollar is gone, system is collapsed, taxes and mortgages will be void. Do you think that the yuan or whatever could be installed as the wrc overnight? New World currency just like that? Smooth transition to the next lie? NFW.

                    This is the link of the chain that once broken will set off the people who have played by the rules, been self-sufficient and tolerant of them being robbed by gub, politicians and the life-sucking humans that have done nothing but take from the producers.

                    They started the system, they killed it. Their loss.
                    Don’t go away mad, just go away.

                    We will finally have what we have worked for our entire lives while fighting an uphill, bs, dishonest, corrupt lie that we where told, “that’s how it is, take it or leave it.”

                    We held up our end of the shitty deal and now we are foreclosing on them…(I am whispering now so that they really have to pay attention to ME to hear me say, “fuck you, your fucking finished.”)

                    I am an American citizen of the United States of America.

                    I will do whatever that I must do to remain free and to help those who also want the same benefits of the ORIGINAL United States Constitution so help me God.

                  • Daisy brings up a very important point, “property taxes”.

                    I don’t know about other states and counties, but here in the tarheel, there has been very little oversight of our county and state spending. Therefore the debt and budget shortfalls continue. Hence the tax burden continues. The very few, that I invite to our retreat, like to make fun of my “project piles” of what they call junk. They like to point fingers at my unusual way of building sheds and how uneven some of the additions look
                    by being somewhat out of place.

                    Make no mistake, everything since 2000 has been constructed “stronger” than code. It may look wierd, but the hidden part is what matters. I don’t need pretty and fancy. I am just where i want to be at the end of the road and no one is gonna build/set up right on top of me.

                    The point is: When my friends make a snide remark about my unusual homestead; I say how much is your property tax bill? When they say in the thousands, I say mine is in the couple hundreds. End of subject.

                    If someone makes the mistake of trying to continue about how much their property is worth, I follow with; I’m retired and paying out less than $100.00 each month for property taxes and utilities. When you retire, how well are you gonna pay out $500.00 each month for the same, especially if SHTF and you can’t collect a SS retirement check. The discussion immediately goes to fishing or friggin.

                • Side note here….skills from the “olden days” will be highly valuable….and if you parents/grandparents are able to impart these skills…..Please do so! I am trying to do so….in my own way…

                  • I wen downe too thee crik taday to due sum goled pannen wit dat bigg yellah dogg i caul peepee —–do too his yella collah hare und mye freindz jefro-scooter und billi bob came wit us …

                    We notte fine N-E gole yet but we did finedid sum mud bugs fer granney too Cooke up over thee fires

                    She maketh a gude stu wit thee jooses frum thee crawdadees

                    N-E 1 got us a gude tipp on Howe we git us sum goled frum de crik??

                    Pwese lettuce gnoe ???

                    Thankee frum —-elvis–jefro—scooter und belly bob

                  • Don’t Tread: You’re in a fine position now because you get to keep more of your money. But in a collapse all government agencies may dry up for a long while and none of us may have to pay. But either way, you’re still ahead of the game with such low taxes. That would just suck if one of the only offices left open was the propery folks in our county.

                • @ FOB:
                  True, dat. 🙂
                  Currently working a gig in the Boise area..sales tax up the wahoo.
                  Got the urge to do a 20 min. road trip to the Ontario,OR Wally World this evening..1 case of Zippo lighters,,1 case of flints..1 case of Ronsonol lighter fluid..less than a hundred sales tax. Pissed of the Mart Cart Brigade while ringing up the sale..all in all, a fine ending to an otherwise boring day.

                • @ fob meant to thumbs up…sorry for the fat finger down!

            • that’s why I buy at local coin shops, for $1.50 over spot, and take it home with me. I can watch the spot price at home, and be at a coin shop in 10-15 min.

            • Why waste money on shipping when Merit has better prices and free shipping for first time customers? Just enlist your wife, kids, friends, and neighbors as first time customers like I do…

          • Buy Dimes Buy Dimes Start with the smallest size. Fill a bucket then go to quarters.

            Also due to the amount of fake yes silver fakes floating around (2008 Maple LEAFS)

            Stick to eagles And weight them. If it off its fake.

            Quit being dumb-ass. I saw so many stupid people at the show last week.

            I know as preppers we need numbers but some of the “people” that are coming out now. I not sure if I would have not preferred they stay in the dark. Just stating the truth.

          • Where do you get these coins (preferably not on Internet site) and how much should you pay? Please excuse my ignorance about this– I know almost nothing about pm’s. thanks!


              • Grasshopper,
                Auctions, yard sales, flea markets.
                Is where I gained the best deals over years. I just kept my eyes open.
                My ‘coin collection’ is over 20 lbs. of ‘junk’ silver coins and gold eagles.
                What I have in them is pennies on the dollar to what they’re worth now, and what they will be worth… priceless.

            • Internet sites aside, your best bet is Going to be a local dealer. Most local dealers carry silver halves and quarters… these are perhaps the best coins for new investors as they are recog nizable and have a very low chance of being counterfeit since they are legal US currency.

              I strongly recommend checking out the silver coin calculator at to get the exact spot price of a particular coin… also, when buying from any dealer, expect to pay roughly 10% above the spot price for silver coins (they gotta make their money to stay in business)

              • Mac,
                I’ve spent a lot of time in coin shop…buying and kinda selling. Granted you can get a decent deal on buying but not on selling (that’s how they really make their money).

                When the price dips really low like it is now coin shops have a tendency to take the good stuff to the backroom and only offer the beat up, crummy stuff. They are not the place to sell…they only will give you blue book if you’re lucky…


          People have ran out of cash. Everyone needed to use CREDIT NOT DEBIT cards lately. Remember Private sales are cash or trade. So many were force to buy paper guns. Many did not like it but had no choise.

          And to all the new buyers and old guys not willing to keep up with the way things work. Private sale guns are getting expensive. Accept it. Crying about it doesn’t help.

          This is pre obama time. And it isn’t December. Yes it will calm down. But if we are right the price will go even higher. If you do not beleive that then you must beleive this will work all out and be just fine.

          Remember the true private seller is now taking huge risks to bring a needed item (Gun). He is due a higher rate of return for the risk he/she is taking.

          Blogs stop telling everyone to go beat on the sellers.. Be thankful there are still some willing to risk it.

          Cash is running out at the shows.
          Support your private sellers.
          If you see what you want do hesiatate.


          • What risk is there to a private seller???

            • Going to jail. Confiscation of all our stuff.

              ATF IRS Local Police DHS.

              They want us all to be FLL. And until we fix the system you still need to work within it. When doing things in public. If you sell guns without an FLL you are committing a crime in the eyes of the ATF.

              • uh , isnt it in Federal Firearms Licence?

                jus checkin,, but you did it twice so im makin sure

                you also need to learn to remain silent..they cant pin anything on you if you sell privately, theres no laws against it
                and committing a crime in the “eyes” of the ATF…isnt committing a crime that cant be proved by laws..

                so whats the price over and above normal counter sales for a store VS private sales?..I must be woring with great guys, because i get better deals because they dont have to deal with all the BS

                what ever..sounds like gouging to me

                • I agree totally VRF

                • Yes FFL Phone size

                  The private gun market is drying up. Many small seller are running to the wood.

                  And yes selling “for profit” is a gray area when it comes to firearms.

                  I have 3 friend in Fed prison for selling gun privately at gun show. Yes they were selling so many that it bought a lot of attention to them.

                  But in the end they were all convict for

                  “SELLING FIRARMS WITHOUT A FFL” 2 years each Huge fines ANd a Felony. Plus everything was taking from them. Then they were turned over to the IRS..

                  And no they were not selling autos or out of state. Just at the shows.

                  • so… somewhere along the line tey committed a felony?

                    im sure it wasnt just the selling of arms privetly, they must have not followed a well known law..say like selling a hand gun with out paperwork? etc..

                    lets face it, they didnt get thrown in jail for private sales, they got thrown in jail (prison) for breaking a Federal Firearms law.

                  • Paper work in Washington is not required for anything.

                    They were made examples of. They allow greed to make them self a target.

                    If you read the the law it say you will not sell for profit on a regular basic without a FFL. They problem is the “For Profit” part is vague and is left up to agents and prosecutors.

                    In my area the agent say one a month is “OK”. Well most private sellers are doing 20 or 30 a show. Even more lately.

                    And the I do one or two a year guys are gone.

                    The private seller that get hit the hardest are the ones that buy at Pawn shops on paper and take them to the shows to sell off paper..

                    Read Line 16 on the forms you sign.

                    VRF I think you are basing your argument on the idea of two guys getting together to trade ONE gun.

                    I am referring to the ones that supply quality non papered guns to preppers and people who dont want the gov in their business.

                • VRF, I’m with you, something hinky here. Not quite sure what! Trekker Out.

                • Private sales will not be legal in Colorado. This way spread to the other states.

              • that is NOT true. Private party sales are totally legal still as of now at least.

                • Not if you purchase the weapon with the intent to make a profit.

                  I am not talking about the gun you have own for twenty years.

                  I am talking about the one that are gun show sellers. Many tables buy and selling on a regular basic.
                  The ones in the paper with a list. The one that buy entire estates and take them to the shows.

                  The problem is that the definition in the law is to vague.

              • In Virginia, private gun sales are legal between Virginia residents. No background check required, no FFL required. Gun shows in Virginia have manditory background checks and all show participants must either have an FFL or go through an FFL arrangement before any gun is sold.

          • Relax: You can lead an idiot anywhere; but you cannot make him think. People have had years of warning, if they haven’t seen the writing on the wall by now; do you really want them on your side?

            • I agree it just that this show brought alot of BS again to the surface in the GUN world. Just like anywhere else there are the ones that want the power. ANd the one that just what it to be right get beat up on.

              • previous comments on the pprivate sales you said..

                “VRF I think you are basing your argument on the idea of two guys getting together to trade ONE gun.”..

                and Yes i would have to admit, that is what I was basing that on, or at least at one gun show selling a few guns..etc.

                I am referring to the ones that supply quality non papered guns to preppers and people who dont want the gov in their business.

                Nice of them, but again..if they did something illegal by means of federal required paperwork and screening ( if necessary by your state), than theres the getcha

                and than the “for profit” thing can get you nailed, but every good business man has a loss he can claim, they needed to be proactive on that end of things, is all im sayin there.

                well I will also admit, it is a stickey line to walk..i just buy…i dont sell., have plenty of friends that buy and are licenced, so i dont have to anymore

                I do see your point with the hassle it can bring..because in a sense you are stepping on the threashold of ATF”s door, and that in and of itself brings more un needed attention

                • Very true they do not have the resource to police the few guns at one show seller.

                  The for profit part is so vague. Yes any good business can show a loss. But they have been using that as a per gun basic lately. Also they threw so much at them that my friends took their deal to save their pension and other issue.

                  They took 2 years not willing to risk 20 plus.

                  Strangely enough the one that took it all the way to a jury and only had a public defender actually got the least time. But he had nothing else to lose.

                • FBP is right. This kind of activity is encouraged, then deliberately vague laws are used to make it look nefarious. BATFE may let you do this for year, then pounce on you when they feel a need to justify their jobs.

          • FBP…I was at a gun show in Portage Indiana on Saturday and I am happy to report that there were lots of AR and AK mags at regular prices. Ammo has gone up quite a bit…kinda offsets the beating I am taking in PMs right now. There were LOTS of AR variants for sale, some vendors were gouging and some were very fair. As far as protecting private sellers goes, I believe that something is worth what the market will bear so people who still need to get into the AR arena are willing to pay more than a guy who has a bunch of them. I understand dealers wanting to make a buck so I’m cool with whats happening in the market right now.

            • Valpo all the way.

              Yes I notice all the stores and just everyone has dug out all that was in the back and it has level prices.

              When it comes to protecting the private seller it not just the dollars.

              Stop writing down names.
              Yes you can ask to many questions.
              Don’t argue with them about what you can do on the internet.
              Remember the private guy has it now. The internet there is a wait and a trail.
              Muck more. Just think

              • Obamanure wants the private sellers all gone. They want that paper trail. Most sellers in this area are dealers and the few private sellers that show up usually have junk and anyone with an AR or AK either wants double what its worth or flat out won’t sell. I see what your saying about private sellers but in this political climate, you may be asking for trouble selling at shows.JMHO

                • You are. A true private seller at the shows needs to know where the line is at all times.

                  I have been a serious private seller for 20 years. I have had the ATF at the house on more than one occasion. The keys it to not buckle under the pressure they use and do not let unnecessary greed to overcome you.

                  All they are doing know is pushing the seller underground. It is all ready starting. Shows in peoples garage. Flash sale using facebook and twitter behind stores.

                  And remember the value of anything is based on what a buyer and a seller agree to. Not what you think it should be.

                  Real supply and demand economics are starting to rise. And 99% are not truly prepare for it. This includes preppers.

              • FBP, I will have to drink a toast to you out of my pink Crusaders coffee mug tomorrow morning. I am married to a fightin’ Lutheran who was also a fan of the fine establishment known as Fetla’s, may it rest in peace.

            • Warface, we were hanging out in the same locale on Saturday, assuming you were at the Dunes show. I live nearby.

              One thing made me laugh: Girl Scouts selling Girl Scout cookies in the lobby of the Expo Center. That’s how bad and tough the Girl Scouts think we are.

              • Mama Bear, I miss Fetla’s to the point of tears at times. One of the best prepping stores ever. Baileys in North Judson has some items and a fair amount of good food buys (inventory changes), but it’s no Fetla’s. I wish I’d bought every single cast iron piece of cookware they had before they went out of business.

                • AHHHH Fetlas! I remember the first time I walked in would have taken a month to see everything they had. The only place in the country where you could buy an Uzi and a case of beer in the same aisle. One of the greatest stores there ever was. I really miss that place. If you couldn’t find what you were looking for anywhere else all you had to do was drive to Fetlas and they would have it. I still have some items I bought from there 20 years ago. RIP Fetlas!

                  • I know, right?!

                    I have only been there one time, as a poor college student 20-odd years ago, and found it to be disturbing and crazy and fascinating at the same time. It was truly awesome, and legendary. What I wouldn’t give to be able to sort through a dozen Enfield rifles stuck in a barrel, nowadays.

              • Shows how worried their parents are about the “gun nuts”.

              • LOTL…yeah, we had them girl scouts peeing their pants, didn’t we? My friend bought an AR and had to stand in line a couple hours to do paperwork so we had time to BS with people and I have got to say that I never met such a bunch of 1st class Patriots as I did that day. Every one was polite and kind and if you happened to bump someone, you had to rush to excuse yourself before they did, and we were all packing guns. I wonder why the Lamestream media never reports that?

            • re: price gouging

              Remember these dealers are selling something that may be outlawed at any time, leaving them holding expensive rifles that they may not be legally allowed to sell (and will soon be confiscated from them).

      3. The one big advantage of Gold is that you can take it with you. I don’t think it is any good for most day-to-day purchases though as it is just too valuable.

        If I had any cash reserves, they would mostly go into gold coins, which could fit into a belt, or be hidden in a shoe if I had to relocate in a hurry. And some silver coins for day-to-day barter.

        I doubt you will get them through an International Airport either end though.

        • I had a teacher in High School that lived in British Guiana when they had a dictator. He defected, but first sold all of his belongings and purchased gold on the black market. To get it out of the country, he melted it down and hid it in the heel of his shoe. He said the hardest part was learning to walk and look halfway normal, as to not draw unnecessary attention to himself when leaving.

        • *Hint…

          1/10 ounce gold eagles (carried loosely in luggage) look like dimes when they go through an x-ray machine.


      4. I believed everything in this article until my boating accident.

        • You too huh?

          • …yep, and Me Three…

        • You know if the fearless leader barry really wanted to keep people safe he’d ban BOATS…ya boats…how many of my brothers and sisters in liberty on this forum and in my circles and alas even in my own life…how many have lost all their guns and tools in a boating accident…imagine how many $$$ have been lost…how much grief and heartache could be avoided if he just said “NO” to boats,think of all the good that would do…barry could save us all that loss/grief…he would save us from ourselves and keep all those fishes from becoming armed…God knows its gonna put alot of fisherpersons into jepordy!! NOTE: sarcasim is rampant throughout this post 😉

          • DROLL….VERY DROLL REB 🙂 T’anks

            “Just think of all the suffering and misery we could stop if we just BANNED them durn boats!” 😉


          • Just like every brutal regime in the world, the people in the current US gooberment will do ANYTHING to stay in power. They know that most of them are otherwise unemployable, and that deposed tyrants are not treated kindly by those they formerly oppressed. The atrocities committed by .gov will make Hussein, Assad, et al look like ameteurs.

        • Well I have to tell you. In my boating accident I had gold, guns, ammo and anti-depressants. Forget about the zombie apocolypse. Better start worrying about the fish apocolypse. Lets face it, they’re well funded, they have a lot of guns and ammo, and they’re pissed off about the pollution in their water so they’re probably taking my anti-depressants. Looks like they’ll be looking for any gun free zones they can find to take out their vengence upon people. Yikes – look out!

      5. I have never understood some people. What did you buy the Gold and silver for? If you bought it just because it’s pretty, well you can get more for the same money. For those of us that consider themselves “preppers”. A price drop is not a problem, we bought it for insurance, I have no problem not collecting on my life insurance. If you bought it to make a profit: Why did you buy something you have been told is manipulated to shaft the little guy? You are the little guy. Don’t buy PM’S with money you need to live on! Buy what you think you need and put it in a safe place

        • This is where I stand on all of it as well. I never intended to sell or trade a single ounce, unless I really needed to. My plan was to always be able to pass it along to my son. I was buying before everyone started freaking out and the whole 2008 mess. My intentions haven’t changed and I knew what I was buying into all along, financial storage with zero counter party risk.

          Also, I would never bet the farm on a silver or gold buy either, that’s just silly.

        • Paranoid,
          True, but if you have to bug out hundreds of pounds of silver can be a lot to lug around.

          • That’s what Gold is for. But mine is a thousand miles from here in a bank, I’m not going anywhere,

      6. Take the 6 minutes to watch this. This man is an officer, a man of honor. He is trained in matters such as this and his eyes are open enough to see exactly what is going on!! Listen to him and pass this on to friends who believe that America is just fine as it has been for over 200 years, it does not need to be messed with by these so called “Americans” who are doing nothing but giving America away!!!

        I listened to this, and this retired 3 star general, trained in Marxism says it point blank. Listen to this, then you decide, and please voice your opinions to your U.S. Senators and Congressmen/congresswomen…..Thank You….
        Please don’t sit back and continue to let other
        people fight for “YOUR” rights. Its time
        that ALL AMERICANS fight for everyone’s
        rights….be a part of the solution…
        email and call your Senators and Congress people

        I’m not big on conspiracy theories but much of what this General says has happened.

        Lt Gen Boykin was the commander of “Delta Force” and later commander of theUS Army Special Operations Command. He is a true American hero.

        A Bone Chilling video

        You need to watch this and then forward to everyone you know. A video that will make you think seriously! This is bone chilling and 52% of the voters did this to us by electing Obama. If you can’t play this on your computer (picture and sound) then send it to someone who can play it and go watch it with them!


        • Thanks for the link PR. This is a real eye opener. I even watched the full hour one as well.

        • Great video, thanks!

      7. Gold $1,561.70 -42.50 -2.65% – looks like something bad may be coming quickly.

        • This is just one of the many bumps that are in the road we are traveling on.

          And the one who know me the real me remember my forcasts in November. Who’s laughing now. Maybe I am not crazy after all.

          • Thumbs down because I was right.

            Or because you didn’t listen and didn’t make as much as me.

            • Apologies FBP,

              “Thick thumbs”, I had read the comment and thought it was good…accidentally hit the wrong one…

              I happen to agree witht your assesment that the market will continue to fluctuate in the weeks to come, however I think that perhaps we’re nearing that point where the abilities of those ‘behind’ the curtain’ are going to start wearing thin…specifically, I think we might start seeing a pattern of ‘undamped harmonic oscillation’ in the markets generally. I DO beleive that given the historical allure of gold that same may be at or near the bottom of it’s LAST downtrend…time will tell…


        • In a couple of months you will ALL wish you owned more gold. While the short term and mid term price varies, and the moves can be traded, the long term trend is higher.

          Much higher.

          As the price drops, remember I said it could dip to $1200 last year (its in the archives for the naysayers) the smart money will be buying. For every seller there is a buyer. Who do you think is buying at these lower prices?

          Back up the truck!

          • Howdy DK,

            Still thinking it could go as low as $1200 before the final upturn? I mean your opinion now, today? I’m curious.


            • JOG: I think there is a “floor” under gold supported by the Chinese at about $1500. At least that has been the case over the past couple of years as corrections have appeared.

              How low? I don’t know. How high? I don’t know.

              I do expect the price of gold to bounce within a couple of months. Sell your basis if its paper when it spikes, keep your physical gold. When the paper price declines buy it back.

              Preppers should concentrate on their supplies while owning some gold and silver. Gold to preserve your wealth through the Changes. Silver only for necessary commerce during the Changes.

              Hoard your lead. They won’t be making any more of it after the Changes. What you have is what you got. Be there to get there.

              Washington’s Vision. Pass that word. The American people will not be joining the NWO. The Patriot with the most blue helmets at the end of the game wins.

              NOMI. Molon labe. Engage or be enslaved.

              • Hi DK,

                Thanks for the quick reply. So much is going on right now, it’s hard to get a good ‘feel’ even for the next week, let alone any longer period. A lot of markets are getting awfully ‘wobbly’ at this point. As I’m typing this the last check on the Far East had the Hang Seng down 450+, though gold was holding right at 1560. I’m thinking about pulling the trigger on a last purchase by tommorow afternoon. I tried to gauge the last two good-sized dips and misssed both times so I’m not going to wait any longer than that if the oppoertunity still exist…if I miss again it’s no big deal, the preps are in good shape – all of them, very little is needed anywhere – still it would be nice to hit it right one last time…

                “Wahington’s Vision”….’tis a dire picture, at least in the beginning, the emd of that is to be hoped for with all the sincerity we can muster. I’m not usually one for the metaphysical…don’t take that wrong, I FULLY believe in Him and His Son and His Holy agency as well, but my background is science and yet for all that the version that I read is chilling in it’s implications… especially with the ‘other’ events on the global stage this week. We can only hope that the “Son of the Republic” was correct in his interpretation and that the vision given was real…at least the end of it. Anywho, thanks for your ‘read’ on things, I am obliged Friend, have a good night.

                The Pb situation troubles me the most, stocks are finite if things go ‘left’ rather than ‘right’ and so sooner or later

          • DK;
            In 1980 gold hit $850 before going back down to $255 in late 90’s. What is your prediction for the top, years from now?
            I am guesstimating about 8500$ based on different theories.
            Silver should hit 500$ at the top. Considering the world does not implode. But I probablly will be wrong, who knows the future. Gold has had a 12 year rise, unheard of, but it is in a correction, to be expected….
            Wish I had bought more of both in ’99, when gold was $270 and silver at 4$

            • What are your predictions?
              Just for sh!ts and giggles

              • eppe: In a couple of years gold could be quite high. In the long run a new global currency could establish a new fiat.

                Gold is the money of the PTB. Fiat is the money of everyone else unless you have some gold and silver. Amounts should be determined upon your ability to buy and the extent of your preps.

                You cannot be too rich, too thin or have too much ammo. If you can’t be rich or thin, be locked and loaded. In the long run we’re all dead. Take as many NWO Globalists with you before you go.

                Fore warned is well armed.

                • I agree, just looking for a fiat number as a top. Nothing in stone. Just guessing… Do you see rural real estate rising in value?

                  • ANON: Farmland is up now, but I do not see “rural real estate” rising in value anytime soon, except maybe near mega cities. Real estate values, like politics, are local in nature.

                    I have seen some really great rural land opportunities for personal use. There are some smoking deals available with ground water ownership; which is the real value of the rural real estate.

                    Without water rights its a parking lot.

      8. I like to read Franklin Sander’s daily commentary on gold and precious metals. It helps me to keep my chin up and remind myself that I’m on the right track.

        • not to be confused with the original MCLOVIN…

      9. Sure, gold is money. But what is money? My opinion is that money is a store of your labor and your labor is your use of your own energy to produce something tangible.It is said that your labor at 40 hours a week for 12 years is equal to the energy of one barrel of oil.The easy,cheap oil is gone.What will your labor be worth without the aid of cheap oil? Will it be worth any amount of gold or silver? Or will it be worth food and shelter? I guess it depends on where you think we are headed in the post cheap oil world. I may have some gold and silver but it has gone way down on my list of things I will need in the future. Skills to barter and an ability to grow your own food and heat with wood or solar are most important. People think PMs will be their saviour in the “reset”. There will be no reset back to anything now considered normal.If you can’t provide for your own survival you will likely starve with a whole lot of other people. I predict $5.00 a gallon gas this year and the further cratering of the economy. Anyway, that’s my plan. But, as Mike Tyson once said…”Everybody has a plan …until they get punched in the face.”

        • When it come to gas it is time to start thinking about $7 and $8 a gallon.

          And gold is for the transfer of wealth into the next system we create.

          That mean you must have wealth now. If you dont have any now dont worry about it.

          I have notice that the ones that have no way to have gold are the ones that beat it up all the time.

          • @fagboypuss ;0P … stfu , take your damn v.a. anti-psycho drugs and sit the $uck down your making no sense moron .

            look folks if you can’t afford to buy gold in ounces or grams buy silver blank ounces then (you get more for your $$$ buck buying .999 silver 1 ounce blanks) , you can all afford .999 silver 1 ounce blanks .

            buy pm’s today so you can afford to buy fuel and foods later this year and into the future .

            pm’s are ageless !!! gold and silver are both projected to grow in value respectively 120% over the next 2-4 years as there is a scarcity of each . plus russia china and germany are going back to gold backed currencies .

            and there is always a market for them some where in the world .

            protect your wealth … buy phyzz pm’s now .


            • First Fuzznuts. You have to have wealth to protect.

              Food Water A Gun Shelter More AMMO More Guns Then Silver Then Gold.

              Be nice now or you will need to buy another power supply for that pretty computer again.

              • your an idiot .

                • “youre”

                  • Yeah what he said.

                  • “you’re” Dangit, Eisen, if you’re going to be our spell checker here, get it right!
                    Or should that be spellchecker?

                  • you’re

                    Gotcha…now stop it.
                    If you’re going to act like an ass, at least get your ass correctly in gear.
                    There is no ‘youre’…
                    Oh… I see smokin already gotcha.

              • just playing devilsadvocate here..

                what if some guy with bigger balls and a better shot kills you and takes all your gold and silver?

                guess he will be the one able to fill his gas tank?

                • or, better yet..he waits until you leave to go to work, hunt, fish etc.. and comes in and takes your gold and silver?

                  • I’ve educated everyone how to shoot to kill 🙂 Go to the house next door he doesn’t have any security.

                  • hahahahaa i see the thumb down…reality is a bitch aint she?

                  • That is why I live in a commuty of like minded people. And when it get to that point everyday will be a “Partol Day”

                    And don’t keep all your gold and silver in the same place. Lots of dogs.

                    Or your cars down on the road. I learned that one the hard way.

                  • what if i come and kill you first , rape your wife and daughter then torch your house , and shoot your dog just cause he’s ugly .

                    dipsheeit .


                  • First you would have to have man part to be able to do that.

                    And my daughter would blow your balls off with her PINK Glock. And she is good with a knife.

                    My Girlfriend Pink Glock up your ass then she have you clean the mess.

                    Ex Wife I will send you the address.

                    And the dog is ugly but just as mean.

                    And Daisy supports this person.

                    Who else think he is “The Man” Let go look at past posts and see who does. Better order that power supply now.

                  • @fagboypuss ;0p … that response was directed @itsnotme dumb threatening comment of murder and robbery …

                    IT’S NOT ALWAYS ” JUST ABOUT YOU ” @fagboypuss !!!

                    “YOU’RE” just like a NEEDY woman bwiatch , always stickin your two cents in others biz , Always in need of attention and reassurance .

                    make sure you stack up on tampons you whiny bwiatch .


                • That is always a concern.

          • FBP: The economy would shut down at $7 or $8 per gallon. Not gonna happen. The economy is on life support now. War is immanent.

            Price is s function of supply and demand. Right now supplies are high and demand is down. The long term TREND for gasoline use is down considerably.

            The US now supplies 80% of its own oil and gas use. That percentage will move higher as Sheeple move into micro apts along the light rail line coming to a neighborhood near you soon.

            That’s the PLAN.

            • The prices of 7 or 8 are based on Supply disruption and taxes.
              Which will come from business shutting down. It will feed on itself.

        • I’m starting to “smell the skunk” of gold confiscation
          again, ala 1933! Don’t bet too hard against it….. for
          the same reason as then— Dollar Devaluation!

          • could be, they sure are working hard to take the guns, so if that went as they planned, than no one would have what it takes to protect thier wealth, or stash, or…

            good question to ask a anti gunner…ask em if they have anything..anything worth fighting for in life?

            for me..its my family,..and I want the best tool for the job

        • I predict the sun will not blow up yesterday, Your $5 Gas prediction is the same; go to San Francisco, it’s already $5

          • gas is always higher in some areas than others

            I can guarantee you if it hits $5 here

            the bottom will fall out of the local economy

            it wasn’t all that long ago that getting a parking space at
            Wally World was damn near impossible

            now,even on paydays it might be just a little of a challenge
            at best

      10. The trading volume on Gold, Silver, and Oil have gone through the roof in the last 2 months.

        Something is afoot.

        • JOHN.

        • JOHN. Hit the send button on accident. Three words GLOBAL CURRENCY WAR.


      12. Still can’t afford to buy gold, but I did get another oz of silver today. Every pay day is another oz for my family.

      13. Maybe with the prices dropping some, I’ll get two oz this upcoming payday! Woo Hoo!

        • More power to you. Just keep working your plan. Thats all one can do in the end.

      14. To any ‘nervous nellies’, go read and hold on tight to your PM’s, or get more if in the market for any.
        All really big up moves have been proceeded by massive shake-outs to the downside first, the bigger the better to come.

        Jim Sinclair is not a lone voice here…

        “My advice is to hold all gold positions and wait patiently for the correction to end. Just before the huge 1979-80 surge,
        we saw a big ‘clean out’ correction in gold. I believe history is about repeat.”
        – Richard Russell on King World News Radio

        BTW, IMO, gold/silver are best for those who already have their preps largely squared away FIRST and can see they’ll still have some paper investments and cash remaining when finally done and that it’d be prudent to diversify and convert some of that hard earned paper wealth into physically held gold/silver.

        BTW#2, silver will probably double quicker and more often than gold.

        – Shane

      15. got phyzz ???

        ignore this burp in the fiat money manipulated markets …

        just keep buying

        just keep stacking

        then forget about it till 2015 .

        2015 is the year for pm’s .


        • See Nina you are capable of giving good solid advice.

          Your handler must of given you a lashing for your above post. Your new boss is no fun.

      16. I planted a tomato plant today… and a cucumber too.

        • Dang I.M. Broke are you starting seeds? You must be in the deep south. I’m gonna start in a couple of weeks. Been by Southern States and picked up about 20 some bucks of heirloom seeds. Asked the lady workin’ there when seed taters would be in (Red Pontiac). Lookin’ for more fruit trees. Lowes has potted blueberry bushes, and blackberry canes in already. Prices are up from 9.99 per 2 gallon pot(last year) to 10.96 for the same size this year. Ima chompin’ at the bit! Wife sighed the other day and commented, ” I’m a hunter’s widow in the fall and a gardner’s widow in the spring.” She’s a good girl though and I love her dearly.

        • I love sloppy tacos

          • Date a Mexican.

        • ……i ordered two buckets of WHEAT berries
          And three gamma seal lids.

      17. I pulled my IRA out several years ago. Bought a few Xtra firearms, reloading equipment, components and put eighty-five percent of the remainder in PM’s. I just sold a couple of those firearms and turned a nice profit, thanks to the actions of our hang glider-in-chief. Now I’m watching this silver dip and I’m getting ready to pounce. I don’t own any gold, mostly junk silver(around 75%) dimes and quarters, a few 40% halves and the rest in eagles. I’m getting ready to cut loose another firearm and it should sell quickly and I hope to do well like on the others. I’ve sat back and waited for years for this time and its here. Hellova note when you reflect on what it all means and what it leads to, ain’t it?

      18. One day does not a trend make. Separating the normal variation from the abnormal variation is necessary first, then reaction might be prudent. The problem is the market is no longer an indicater of business strength or weakness due to the casino style rules allowed and the manipulators for short term gain. If you enjoy gambling, then play the market but do not believe these averages have anything to do with the health of the economy any more. Right now the 3 biggest concerns are fuel (gas)cost going crazy, taxes both overt and hidden increasing, and all the noise about sequestration from the pres being so bad, (something wrong with his being so vocal about that). Do you think he knows somthing we don’t?

        • Glad somebody else caught this…
          I think.. he’s going to fire bunches of people and blame it on the Republicans… he’s going to cause deliberate pain, when its not necessary.
          I’ll bet most of the job furloughs and cuts will be across the country where people are served, and DC will get off with a slap on the wrist.
          This sequester is like saying you’re going to cut the increase in the chewing gum budget, and he is getting all pissy and saying the house is burning, while he lights the match. The problem is, the gov can’t move money around… Congress allocates to specific uses, and the bureaucracy is hemmed in by budget ‘buckets’.

          That way he can shut down the gov, stir up everybody, blame it on The Enemy and get every body screaming for higher taxes on the rich…

          (While he executes whatever other nefarious plans he has under cover of chaos.)

          • PS:
            IOW, you can consider this the continuation of the campaign, he is working on 2014…

      19. The metals will be back. One day the Federal Reserve note will be worth nothing but fire tinder. Now would be a good time to get on the APMEX website and get some 1-gram ingots of gold.

        • Hang on SM, indeed it is.

      20. Just wondering if the Fed Recovery Can has finally come to land against the unmovable wall of lies???

        It seems that more leaks about how bad things really are are starting to gain momentum even in the MSM? Though they will blame it on everything else, but those running this country, hmmmmmmmmm;,

        But we still have a ruler who would rather campaign, than govern. I mean, he clearly states that nothing is his fault. Everyone else is to blame for the state of the economy. Could it be that Bush Jr is still calling the shots? Say it isn’t so! Tisk Tisk!!

        B Aware, B Awake, B Alive
        God Bless the Land of the Free

      21. I’d rather have physical PMs than ETFs/paper PMs as I think one day the manipulation of ETFs/paper PMs may come and it will be like the cake walk dance and when the music stops, all those with paper lose… If it isn’t in your hands, you don’t really have it!

        • I mean when the manipulation is discovered and colapses.

        • EFTs are for the traders that buy the dips. It would be a pain in the ass to buy/sell physical on the lows/highs. You said it! If you don’t have it in your hand, you don’t own it! Everyone gets all worked up about PMs. The best advice I ever got about PMs was; put it in the safe and forget you have it. Watching the market will drive you crazy. Gold always out-performs the other markets.

          • …and if you can defend it, you might lose it!

      22. I like circulated U.S. coins pre.1965 dates referred to as JUNK SILVER.
        The following are based on todays silver spot of $28.49 per troy ounce.
        Dime has $2.06 of silver
        Quarter $6.15
        half dollar $10.30


      23. Think about this:

        Obama wants to raise minimum wage to four 1964 dimes.

        Is that the change he promised??

        Stay Brave nomi

        • Gas less than two dimes a gaallon. I discussed this with a guy sitting at the bar the other day and he had no idea what I was discussing.

        • Will raising the minimum wage reduce the number of families on the welfare roles? Not likely. 50% of all welfare recipients live in California.

          Just saying. Engage.

      24. Buy all that you can!It will never be this cheap again! We will see come April! After the quarterly reports come out,the stock market has its plug pulled!and 19 months of negative growth is announced! then you will no doubt understand we are it the greatest recession!EVER!gold and silver is your only hedge on a fiat currency!

        • I’ve heard from a number of sources that before PMs explode upwards again, there will be a huge dip. I thought that happened early this winter, but…

        • This is a nice drop — better than about 45 days ago and yes, it’s time to add to the stacks!

      25. Ho Ho Ho, Christmass EARLY this year, for some…

        Au down $40.50 at the close, Ag down to $28.40. There’s no telling what the next few days will look like but IF you have the bulk of your ‘neccesities’ dialed-in, now might be a good time to spring the mouse-trap on your wallet. I say, only if you’ve fot all else in hand, remember even the PM are proxy’s for the REAL STFF, what keeps you ALIVE later.

        The PTB must really be getting nervous to make this happen, either the Central’s are nervous or the Biggies – GS JPM, BOA, etc – are attempting to flush out the shorts…murderously so, I’d say. Obviously, what you have, Keep. Best of Luck All, Keep on Preppin!!!


        • This is just some more of the manipulation to make it cheaper for China and Russia to buy some more. Its a boon and the right moment to buy if your going to hold your purchase in hand.

      26. Our New Years present to the Chinese. In reality bankster orchestrated precious metals price rigging represents the longest running public theft in history. But, with the Fed stepping up as it has, that indicates panic to me. Gold price manipulation is all they have left. Only the fear of the alternative hides the truth now.

        • Howdy GrampaS,

          I think you MIGHT just have gotten to the ‘Meat of the Matter’, it’s easy to forget that no matter how seemingly powerful the PTB are there is still a finite amount of maneuvering of the markets they can ACTUALLY do…they’re NOT Gods, and Yes, I think I see a little worry in thier hearts now, the alternative – for them – is terrible, isn’t it? Excellent observation, T’anks….


      27. I like the way Warren Buffet invests. He buys stocks with the idea that he’ll own them for 10 years. Thus they have to be solid companies with a good management team and products which are needed by most folks. Stuff like Coke, Heinz Catsup, or Car Insurance.

        I look at my stock of PM’s in the same way, buy when the market dips and hold’m as long as it makes sense to.

      28. Name Change:
        Be cautious buying silver. Antique shop in Westerville, Oh. got scammed- bought 100 Morgans and Peace dollars and they were drawen to a magnet. Looked very good, anybody would have bought. Also there are fake Silver Eagles on the market. Check it out. Reputable dealers only. But not to scare anyone, Buy, Buy, Buy!!!!!

      29. Let the bottom drop out of gold and silver while they manipulate the fiat currency. I won’t make the same mistake twice. If gold and silver really take a hit I’ll be looking to buy as much as I can.

      30. Funny timing with this article as I just purchased 47 ounces yesterday. I don’t mind it going down further as I plan on purchasing about 10 oz’s monthly. I wouldn’t mind seeing $20 an ounce, as it will stack up that much faster. I expect Silver to someday be valued correctly, not the manipulated charts they use today to keep the price down. They are touting a massive surplus from mining, but their figures are manipulated and I expect the truth about the supply to come out someday, which will drive people to try to hoard up whatever they can get. $4 billion to purchase the entire 2013 surplus by one estimate to give you an idea of how small of a quantity we are dealing with, not to mention it represents less than a hundredth of retirement portfolio’s. Investers would eat through that surplus rather quickly IMO.

      31. I might have lost a few bucks on silver investments lately, but have more than made up for it on my lead investments.

      32. PMs are only useful AFTER you have obtained all your preps AND you have several months worth of cash ON HAND. Gold and Silver are only useful for maintaining wealth. Youre not going to barter with it. Jewelry is infinitely more fungible than gold bars or rare coins. Keep it boring and dont attract any attention.

      33. I have silver I would like to keep to pass to my kids. I also keep it as emergency money. I am very unlikely to trade or sell unless something very extreme happens. Good luck to anyone looking for it, if someone breaks in and finds it that’s the least of my concerns. My dog would be dead so I would be more upset over that.

      34. Just bought more. Someday I’ll be a little old man. I’ll sleep well knowing that my pms are safe. Obama can’t steel them, nor can Congress. If they bank fire arms…I’ll melt down some silver and make a real nice gun. ha.

        This is the age of thieves.

        The boomers who have unfunded pensions are trying to steel your 401k.
        Metal up baby.

        Go with silver…it has so many productive uses…. there’s no replacement for it.

      35. Just wanted to say i’ve been reading stories and posts here for a few months now. Have only recently started prepping but i’m trying to catch up as quickly as i can. Thank you Mac for this site and thank you everyone else for the thoughts and info you provide.

        • Welcome, Darkstar. Glad to have you here.

        • Welcome aboard Dark!


      36. off topic-@Be Informed-Feb. 19th, earthquakes-
        Fiji, China, Japan, S.Alaska, Indonesia,
        S.Sanwich Islands, N.Cal., India, Santa Cruz
        Islands, Tonga. The planet was rocking/rolling
        yesterday. I would list the magnitudes, but
        this is my second posting attempt.

        • @ Emily. Had a bad day today, but I have been keeping track of the earthquake activity. Again and again these earthquake such as the one on the Mid-Atlantic Ridge contine to aim right within 10 degrees east or west of the international date line. Other areas include Vanautu and New Guinea, central to far west Indonesia, and especially southern Mexico maybe to Panama. One other area that came up a lot was the Black Sea to Greece.

          The earthquake activity you are seeing are some aftershocks, but just like before the 8.0, the other areas of the planet that are not too locked are feeling the increased tension and releasing some of this pinned up energy from what is coming. Again, distant foreshocks.

          It is very interesting to note that since recording keeping begin for all these earthquakes in 1973, ONLY 2 times has an earthquake before the one today on that section of the Mid Atlantic Ridge hit. One time nothing occurred after it, and the other time New Guniea got hit. Here the most disturbing part, that earthquake on the Mid Atlantic Ridge was aimed within about 1 degree within the southern most tip of the New Madrid. It was only a 5.0, but shows tension directed at the New Madrid.

          • Howdy BI,

            Interesting, Oh did you see the lil ‘pop’ at the bottom of the Juan de Fuca, about a 4 plus almost right at the abrupt N/S to E/W turn, west side…seems to be one of the larger ones I can recall for the last several months…excluding that other about two weeks ago. Pressure’s just continue to build over there, don’t they?


            • @ JustOneGuy. Remember the Nazca plate down towards Chile a few weeks ago, the same type of earthquake, then boom 6.9 in Columbia. Those outer parameters of plates when earthquakes occur, indicate something pushing at them. A 4.3 is not too big, as a mid 5+ I would be most concerned. That 5.0 on the Mid Atlantic Ridge today was a rare one, only 2 in 40 years, and aimed within a degree of the southern tip of the New Madrid.

              I am still saying that the Siberia quake meant something very significant. Th Asian plate is the king of them all and where it decides to go the other plates have to make room for. The Asian plate has moved and likely the Pacific plate or Australian plate are going to be the ones factored in to the next very big earthquake. Don’t forget volcanic activity either in the next 5 weeks or so is very possible.

      37. This is just a note to those on a tighter budget.

        I used to get very overwhelmed by the idea of buying PMs. Now, though, due to advice from a friend, I buy a small amount with every pay check. Even if you just buy one ounce of silver per week, it adds up. You don’t have to stash bars of gold to put some away for a rainy day. Just purchase regularly and you will build a really nice little savings. I consider this a prep just like I do wheat berries and home defense items. No, you can’t eat it but you might be able to pay property taxes with it or replace a vital piece of farm equipment that has broken.


        • OK Mom.

        • @Daisy….where would you advise one to purchase….online or find a coin shop/pawn shop? How does one know it is not fake? Thanx in advance…and take care, CC.

          • CC – if you are in the vicinity of Ottawa, the Canadian Mint is there and can be purchased from. There are a few online sites as well that are reputable.

            You can also order from Precious Metal House or Gold Silver Bull dot com – both are in Canada.

            Hope this helps.


            • I didnt say Ive never been in heat for an older woman. I just said they need to be controlled. 🙂

              • didn’t and I’ve

              • The Bible says that if your private parts offend thee, to cut it off. Try that!

          • Rocky, let me pull a rabbit out of the hat.

      38. Wal-Mart now is having everyone who works for them, take one hour off with no pay, EVERYONE. This is not much but who knows down the road. I have people who I no work for them.
        NOMI EVER

        • One hour per week for now

          • AS of today it is cut one hour aday at Wal-Mart, do to low sales

      39. This is getting really good… the ridiculous stock market and nosediving precious metals. Expect a reversal of fortunes soon! I refuse to hold federal reserve notes for more than 24 hours. They get spent on food, ammo, or silver real quick. I won’t be the poor fellow without a chair to sit on when the music stops.

      40. Thinking about selling a couple hundred rounds but hate selling at only 700% profit. Sell when there’s blood in the street.

        • Years ago there was a Wizzard of Id cartoon: Rodney and the King were talking, Rodney says to the KING “Gold is up, maybe you should sell some” King says: “OK, for What?” OK, sell some silver; for what?

          • Was he swimming across the river and wanting to lighten up?

        • D’Artagnon was the 4th profiteer. He was my favorite!
          A measley 700%… way. I’m holdin til I see the blood at least ankle deep….

          • Right on smokin…
            Myself, I think I and most will begin selling for ‘things’, when we are drowning.
            I agree with the King… sell?, in exchange for what?

      41. Go to the KITCO site. Look at the multi-year charts (2000-2013). Take a dollar bill and line up from one side to the other following the linear rise and not the highs and lows. Gold looks like it should be about $1500/oz and silver about $27.50/oz. OK, OK, it’s an eyeball thing…But as long as it stays linear, all is fine.
        The cheapest I have found silver for is at NWTM $30.32/oz – 50oz minimum with 6-10 weeks delivery. No shipping charge…
        Myself…I like dimes and quarters…Barter is the game…Guy wants 3 dimes, I counter with a quarter…Sides if/when silver hits $150+-/oz (or more?) that dime is gonna be about $10.
        One should also have a shitpile of nickels just for small change…
        Scuse me gotta go burp my PM ammo cans…

        • I buy junk silver from Provident Metals. The price is 6% over spot and it’s only that high if you pay by credit card.
          I plan on buying more with my income tax refund.

      42. Off topic:
        Some good news for a change, Jesse Jackson Jr. is going to JAIL.

        • Interesting issue as a convicted felon he cannot have a gun, but he can still run for Congress. Anyone see something wrong with this system?

          • Think about it this way. If the US Government followed the Constitution and only Congress declared war a lone US Congressman that was also a convicted felon could cast the deciding vote to send millions of people into war armed with guns while being legally prevented from possessing one themselves.

            One better is I don’t believe a felony record would bar an individual from the Presidency. No gun for you but nuclear weapons are fine.

            Go figure.

      43. Bought some silver after the close today.
        If the price drops further tomorrow, I’ll buy more etc.

      44. @BI: Just got this E-Mail. I don’t know if this means something or just B S. Will pass it on. Thx for your time.

        As both sides of the New Madrid Fault Line are pulled in opposite directions, the entire fault line operates as a slip-slide fault line. In that the land just to the west of the Mississippi River moves the greatest distance, to ease the pressure on the bow currently formed by the N American continent, this creates a void, a stretch zone void, causing the land there to drop, as we have explained. This is the region currently experiencing precursor earthquakes, the region considered the New Madrid region. But the movement is not yet happening, the void not yet being created. Instead, occasional slight slip-slide adjustments are being made, deep within the rock strata, causing minor quake swarms or sympathetic jolts in neighboring areas. The rock fingers are slipping, but not losing their grip.

        When the plate tearing starts in earnest, these slip-slide jolts will be huge, and rise up to the magnitude 8-9 range, as we have stated. These quakes will ride up to the bend in the fault line just south of Lake Michigan. Earthquake damage is primarily done when the rock close to the surface is affected, as is known by man. The quality of the rock along the fault line thus affects the shaking and resulting damage to the surface. A glance at a map of the geology of the fault line shows that the rock along the Mississippi at Arkansas and Missouri is younger, laid down by sediment, and tends to fracture broadly, thus relaying earthquake jolts over a vast area. Broad fractures also cause post quake adjustments, so the quake includes rock shuffling, all of which translates to a larger magnitude for the area. Thus, the worst of the New Madrid adjustment will be felt in this area.

        The rock strata that hold Illinois and Indiana is older, and more solid. Fracturing of the rock tends to be a single jolt, not the multiple ricocheting jolts that magnify any adjustment in the rock strata experienced by the rock strata in Arkansas and Missouri. The magnitude will still be considered high, perhaps an 8, but the shaking will not last as long, and the damage therefore not as great. Were the bend in the fault line just south of Lake Michigan not at a point where the southeastern part of the US is dropping away from the Seaway, the damage along the Seaway would be much greater. The Equator is expanding in the center of the Atlantic, and has already, by this time, ripped open between S America and Africa. The southeast thus drops toward this void, relieving pressure and friction along the slip-slide in the fault line as it runs under the Seaway.

        By the time the New Madrid adjustment reaches the bend, land to the west of the Mississippi has already dropped, pulled away, but this actually puts more pressure on the fault line as it runs under Michigan. This holds, momentarily, while the southeast starts to drop toward the Atlantic Rift, and then pulls apart sharply. Here, beneath Michigan, the jolts will also not last for long, and will also be considered up to magnitude 8. The fault line thence along the Seaway will unzip, along rock strata borders already established. Where stretch zones such as this normally have adjustments that are basically silent, they do much damage. The unzipping creates crevasses and landslides and sinkholes, and when this occurs under cities is devastating. The quakes will be considered much less than magnitude 8 but the damage will be greater, with consequent lost of life and infrastructure. A building that has collapsed because of a large jolt is no different than one that has collapsed because the ground beneath it sank.
        As is known, there is a fault line running up along the East Coast of the US that attaches to the New Madrid fault line in the Gulf. Both fault lines touch there, in the Gulf, and when the New Madrid adjusts there is a sympathetic adjustment up along this fault line. During the last New Madrid adjustment, church bells rang in Boston and cracks appeared in buildings in Savannah, GA and Charleston, SC. These changes are caused by earthquakes equivalent to a magnitude 4-5 or less, not serious.

        • @ JustOneGuy. Where do I start? Okay, first of all the pressure build up is more at about 10-12 degrees north for the southern portion of the New Madrid and about 17 degrees north for the northern portion of it, not at the Equator. Also up towards 57 degrees south of Iceland all on the Mid Atlantic Ridge. The Reason church bells rang in Boston was the size of the quake on the harder dense and very old rock strata, like the country was rung like abig gong. Most faults connect to other faults, true, but the faults running under the east coast did not act like some conduit for transferring the energy, the rock itself did this.

          When they read an earthquake they take the TOTAL amount of seismic energy the has been released. When they talk about an 8 here and an 8-9 there, what they should balking about is the Modified Mercalli scale that judges destruction and felt energy released in different spots from Roman Number I to XII, or 1-12. ALL earthquakes have different reading for different spots in regarding distance and of course underground strata and the stability of the soil itself. Some areas will get the 12, XII and be annihilated, while others may get a 9 or 10, or IX, X.

          Going up to Lake Michigan, YES. Going down to the Gulf of Mexico, MAYBE. The San Andreas fault has long been suspected of running from several hundred miles off of southern Oregon to halfway down the Gulf of California or further. If this is true and the whole thing broke, you could have a strike slip approaching high 9 range. That would be the end of California and part of Mexico. Is this true? Don’t know, it is possible but not in recent geological history has it happened. saame thing with the New Madrid. Does it stop somewhere in Arkansas, or does it continue to the sinkhole activity and beyond? Not sure, too much loose sediment that covers this area from eons of deposits.

          The New Madrid is just not visible like the San Andreas and it is difficult to tell the break lines of previous earthquakes. IF the sediment was not there, the New Madrid probably would be a seaway that ach deep into the heartland. The twisting motions talked about is accurate, by much of this influnce is from the Caribbean, Cocos, Nazca, and South American plates.

          The Equator has always been wider and has to do with the rotation of the planet, it is called an equatorial bulge and has nothing to do with the plates that has not been happening for the past several hundred million years. The Atlantic Ocean is expanding as a whole and not just at the equator. The Pacific Ocean is shrinking. This of course is on a very slow scale. Again the Mid Atlantic Ridge that runs all the way from just east of the South Sandwich Islands to northern Greenland is this rip that is talked about, not just between Africa and South America.

          A better way of describing the New Madrid as just a strike slip is a rift, again much like the Gulf of California. Whe they talk about unzipping, this would be equated to fault creep in which the buffer zone between nothern and southern San Andreas faults is. These “unzip” zones would indicate that fault pressure is being slowly released and the likelihood of an entire fault break goes down a lot. I don’t know if these crevasses, sinkholes, and landslides are the result of fault movement at all. This is extremely unstable dirt.

          I have longed suspected that many of these underground cave ins are the result of the tapping into the underground aquifers for water to irrigate crops. Also of course the extraction of natural gas and oil that leaves a type of void that eventually gives in. Also the simple climate can do this, as the drought has played so true action here. This doesn’t mean that taking out all that material for under the crust will not and cannot generate earthquakes, as Signal Hill in Long Beach California in 1933 was suspected of speeding up the earthquake on the Newprt Ingelwood fault. Many earthquakes In India and other places have been caused by dams built on top of the fault, as the faultzone is one of the prefect places to put a dam because of the arching of the canyon walls.

          I again would look at the Caribbean, The area around the Cocos plate, the Nazca plate, and the Mid Atlantic Ridge as the precursors to the New Madrid going. These are the trigger points for the New Madrid.

          • Possible duplicate,

            As always Friend, my thanks,

            Firstly – though I hesitate to ask – are you OK? You sound like you had an AWFUL day indeed…I CAN read a LITTLE between the lines having passed through some hundreds of your missives and THIS doesn’t AT ALL sound ‘allright’…not ‘prying’ here Friend.; simple concern. Somewhat seems to be the week for it, NP was way ‘off’ the other night, I’ve got something respiratory that is whipping me like the proverbial ‘red-headed step-child’ (non-Flu) with whom we are ALL familiar…one of THOSE weeks, Eh?

            I do have a question to ask you that has haunted me for quite a while – seismic, that is (if you’re otherwise down, FORGET I asked) do what you have to to get some relief from whatever has got aholt’ on you first. Thee and me (and others) who do these things that we do, often forget to TAKE CARE OF SELF properly in the pursuit of these oh-so-FASCINATING things that we chase after…I KNOW. 😉

            Anywho… the question I have YET to have a reasonable answer for is this: IF the Earth – some 50 miles or so, and deeper – below our feet is effectively a fluid or a semi-fluid (molten, or near molten magma) down to near the core, then HOW is it that we have seismic events at depths of 400, 500, 600 km deep? This one baffles me UTTERLY, inasmuch as I cannot understand how something fluid, or semi- could support any stress/strain at all in order that such would build…it’s not ‘solid’ per se. I am fully aware that there are things for which we have NO good answers at this time, if this IS one such then fine, that’s OK… I really just can’t get a mental picture of what is going on that could lead to such, so very deep in what is almost certainly a non-solid, it almost seems absurd on the face of it…dwell on that for a bit if you can, thanks in advance. 🙂

            I note that Emily is – as always – delightfully concerned for you…she seems to be a VERY nice person from all the posting’s of hers that I have read…I am concerned as well and I HOPE that whatever it is it passes soon to leave you in peace. Don’t attend to this issue tonight, at all…that is DON’T feel compelled to do so…TAKE CARE OF SELF first! Good Evening Friend…
            TAKE CARE!!! 🙂


            • Very few earthquakes are that deep, deep quakes mostly occur when a plate plunges below another plate. This causes cool harder rock to get deeper than usual. 40 years ago I remember one really deep quake was calculated to be caused by the transformation of one type of rock into another denser one. Sorry that’s the best I can do, out of that type of rock for YEARS

            • @JOG
              Reflective sound waves off a molten thermo layer?

              Simular to ocean thermo layers which subs use to hide.

          • @BI: A big THX to you!

        • @ pale rider. Sorry about addressing the comment to JustOneGuy, it has been a long ugly day, I just caught it after I sent it.

      45. “Sucker’s Rallys” are for stocks.

        “Sucker’s Sell-Offs” are for metals.

        Don’t be a sucker.

      46. @Darkstar – Welcome to the site!

      47. The post promoting the PM market are misleading. Some of the post appear to be attempts to inflate the price or to outright sell metals. Unless someone else knows of a better price, there is usually a 15% premium on both ends of the transaction placing a buyer in roughly a 30% hole. If you think the price is going to rise substantially it the premiums wouldn’t be a concern. I however believe there are better investments it the SHTF. I wouldn’t trade anything for PM if they bottom fell out of the economy entirely. I would hoard the items often listed on this site that relate directly to daily living. PM do not produce income and therefore are a commodity. If you want to speculate, have at it but remember that is your goal. If anyone knows where to buy PM without the premiums I would be very interested. This is a legit question and I am not trying to make a point or be difficult.

        • Roy,

          You must be shopping in the wrong places if you’re paying 15% premiums.

          APMEX has US gold eagles, 1oz, for about 4% each way ( buy/sell ).

          Tulving runs 3% but you do have to hit 20oz minimums.

      48. Here is what I do not get, someone please straighten me out on this.

        Given China has X amount of gold (officially 1054 metric tons, potentially 3300)

        Given their oil consumption rates (the number escapes me… I had a link but lost it)…

        Given that the price of gold and the price of oil will both rise (unknown as to what rate this will occur at)…

        By my estimates, if China had the big amount of gold, and committed cultural suicide by cutting its oil use in half…

        All that gold would last them 6 years if traded for oil.

        This… solves… what exactly?

        • Ah grasshopper,
          You are thinking wrong.
          They are the worlds biggest producer of gold now, they sell NONE to outsiders. Looking at current valuations is not the right way to look at it…
          Right now, they are using paper dollars to buy up everything in sight. Including OIL WELLS… and GOLD.
          Then when they get to be the Big Dog on the block,
          they get to play The Game, like we do now.
          They can put up gold backed paper Yuan, and bonds.
          And have the gold to back it as fractional reserve as many times as they wish. All they have to do to destroy the dollar is announce a gold backing for their currency, and POOF, and the Arabs will demand gold for oil, and the America we knew, is gone.

          Everything depends on the outcome of… the currency war, which will probably lead to the real thing, when, they’re ready.
          They are playing for keeps, while we play tiddly winks.

          • The Arabs have been collecting gold for their oil. Been doing it for many years. But not at the “prices” we are used to. Their deal in the ninties was one ounce per hundred bbl’s @ $1000.00 per ounce. ( when gold was $300 for everybody else).

            They have so much cash, they could overwhelm the system at “our price”. They deal in the “future” real price. They deal in terms we don’t see or understand. This “theory” is long and deep work by others. It is well explained, but somewhat complicated. When it “clicks”, it’s all crystal clear.

            Today’s gold “price” for these Giants is $50,000.00 per ounce. They can hoard ( think of multi-billionaires), but they can’t buy massive qty’s at $1700.00. It’s not there. They can buy all they want, at $10-15-25,000.00 per ounce.

            The current “gold market” we see and operate in is a totally manipulated, massively overpapered, fiat protecting, illussion.

            Stop and think. If you had billions to sling around, like the opecs, and dove into the market @ $ 1200-1900.00 per ounce, what would happen. Oh, no,no. You got your windfall. When you woke up one morning and relized you were in control of the most valuable natural resource in the history of mankind. Oil. For free, to you. The “system” (manmade or natural) will only allow for one windfall. You are “allowed” to preserve your wealth, when the “great reset” comes, but not another windfall. New price= $50,000.00 usd +. You can aquire all you want at a dicount to that price, say $20,000, and that’s still a shit-ton. But you can’t, won’t be allowed to, crash the system. ( that is left to TPTB). Make sense??? I had to read, re-read, reflect, re-read, until it “clicked”.

            Now it all makes sense.(in a senseless world). Why do the Chinese buy our debt? Because it keeps the current system going. They know they will never collect. Not Dollars. They will collect in the “New System Reset”. When they’re gold reserves go to $50,000.00+ per ounce.

            Cash for gold ads are fleecing the sheeple. The few at the margins who hold “physical only” will share in the windfall. Paper will burn to the rafters. New system will be based on High Value per Ounce Gold. Can’t predict the timeframe. TPTB will do all they can to keep the current game going. But they are ready for the reset. Some are more ready than others. We can only hope our brilliant leaders didn’t drain Ft.Knox.

            I stand on the shoulders of others posting this. It changes your perspective of everything.

      49. I would say that people should be more interested in silver as it has more practical everyday industrial uses than gold. The fact is that gold is going to be used in many of the very high tech manufacturing that might not be functioning too well after the collapse. Silver though has some of the lesser technogical uses and might on the basis of actually use become more valuable than gold to make “things” work. Gold is something that people love to have, but silver is more durable in uses that might be in more demand, depending on what happens.

        I still say that stockpiling common ammo is something that will bring a hell of a nice barter value, maybe even as high as cigarettes and alcohol. A firearm is a paper weight without ammunition. Bricks of .22LR maybe only 3 cents each round but can get maybe a can of food per 3-5 rounds. Never be surprised what a desperate person looking to hunt a rabbit or other game will give you for ammo.

        I would say at this point to make sure you have enough food and water before purchasing anything in the precious metals. Then should be the other necessities that we use everyday. After you get an adequate amount of supplies, then consider silver, gold, and other metals. In a true SHTF event most people are going to be too terrified to get rid of anything they have at first, especially for precious metals. Would you trade some of your food and supplies for a few pieces of gold when it looks like there won’t be a civilization around to make anything but food and supplies valuable?

        Hunger is awful, thirst is pure anguish, life without basic needs is hell. Stock up first on what you need, enough of it. Then consider the precious metals. This is just my opinion on what makes more sense with what is going on and down in this world.

        • Couldn’t agree with you more!

          Consider the fact that even the right wing neo con pro America right or wrong radio pundits(Limbaugh.Savage.Levin)have all publicly stated in the last few weeks ,respectively, that the system is ready to implode and have addressed the drone and dhs procurements as well.which up until now, has only been the subject by the likes of us here and other so called conspiracy sites.

          When right wingers start sounding the alarm bells all of a sudden..I take they they are the last ones to ever admit it!

          Never mind the left..they are all in the tank for government..

        • Thanks and well put. Another way of making the same point would be a persons mind set. Most posts regarding lists of items to stock up on. These are great ideas but need to be expanded. Preppers understand the importance and need for the common items. I would include other items that preppers have no need or want for but fools would trade for. Some examples could be more than basic items that people would miss not having like perfume, candy, popcorn etc. not great examples but I am new and haven’t thought about how to do all of this. Think what a housewife or business person would miss the most. Like food with little nutritional value. People would give a lot to have a luxury they missed. Ideas? ???

          • Sorry. The above post is from ROY. I didn’t fill in the name line.

            • From what I’ve read about other nations that have suffered TEOTWAWKI, you’re right on target.
              But one of the biggies I read about is;

              TOILET PAPER

              • That’s one thing I’ve stored plenty of: it’s easy to store, lasts forever, I get it on sale. Maybe use it for bartering

        • when it comes to prepping

          ALWAYS start with the basics of life


          wanna get an idea what it’s like to go hungry??
          watch the movie Stalingrad or the movie Attack on Leningrad
          people were trading valuable jewels for a can of food
          of course this was after all the pets had “disappeared”
          and they were peeling off wallpaper so they could eat the
          flour paste
          cannibalism was the end result
          when “meat” started to appear
          everyone knew where it came from
          they just all pretended they didn’t

        • @ Satori,

          HEY…ARE YOU UPSTAGING ME HERE! Just kidding. 🙂

          Good observation Bro, the 11671/11678 complex has undergone a significan amount of growth in the last 48 hours and is currently larger than 360 Soler millionths in area….this is still NOT a large spot by any stretch of the imagination. It IS however becoming more complex as well and as of this evenings NOAA Daily Solar Update is classified as “Beta-Gamma-Delta”, which happens to signify a significant complexity in thier estimation.

          Ove the last 12 hours the average X-flux outputted has risen a gull decade of magnitude and it is exhibiting several pre-flare characterisitcs. The possibility of an M-Class flare exist and will likely increase untill the spot feoups pass around the western solar limb in approximately 3+ days. The measured Penticton Solar flux regidstered as approximately 107 and this is an abrupt increase from yesterday’s reading.

          There are no other notable spot spot groups on the visible solar face at this time and further, the SECCHI data does not indicate any identifiably notable new regions as pending emergence along the eastern limb for approximately 4 more days.

          Some moderate disturbances were visible in the terrestrial magnetometers today briefly during the 12:00 – 16:00 UTC time frame however all have subsided significantly since that period.

          There is really nothing further of note for today.


          • ” look at the Brain on Brad!”

      50. I mean isn’t that kind of akin to prepping for Argentina when a huge asteroid is headed for you?

      51. $28.41…getting close to buying time…..

      52. i don’t have much money so i bought more food, water and lighters for barter.

      53. @Be Informed – I am sorry today was a bad day.
        I hate bad days. I hope tomorrow you have a good
        day, a good wk, and a good month. Thank you for
        your response, your time, and effort.

      54. Note our our valued customers-

        Targets R Us regrets to inform you, we are out of stock on the Pelosi and Feinstein targets until further notice. Our supplier can only print 100,000 per day and demand had far outstripped production capacity. Also, there is a 7 week back-order delay on the Napolitano targets. We apologize for any inconvenience.
        We do still have a limited number of Holder targets, including the popular ‘Slow And Steady Takes Out Fast And Furious’ model. However, these are going quickly, so order now!
        Thank you for your patience during this time of target shortages. Hopefully, there will soon be many, many more targets available…

      55. You have to ask yourself a question. Do you feel lucky? Well, do you? Punk.

      56. The targets holds no fear, say it.

        The targets holds no fear.

        You welcome the sound. In fact it’s the sound that sets you free. You are a prisoner on this block until that sound sets you free.

      57. I’m actually pretty stoked about the price drop of PMs. Will be watching carefully the next day or two. Heading to the bank tomorrow to prepare a wire transfer of some funds I have been saving just for this moment. A shake- out was overdue. In fact, my thinking had always been that such an event would occur a few weeks or months before the equities markets tank. The day is coming for a huge correction, 20% or more.

        Equities are in a bubble, and some of the small time guys have been jumping in the past few months. But increased stock prices are only the result of Fed pumping. Fact is, the world economy continues to worsen, world trade is horrendous, and central bank balance sheets are lies built on lies built on even more lies. The recent Fed minutes are lies again, intimating that QE will likely come to an end, citing an improving US economy. Improving? Really? The real inflation, GDP and unemployment numbers are actually worsening.

        But hey! Who benefits with a decline in gold prices? This is the question to be asking. Smart players have been gobbling up gold in record amounts, and the paper traders like JP Morgan are doing everything they can to suppress old prices. Gold at cheaper prices! That work or these folks, so I m going o let it work or me.

        Just two rules to remember. First rule is he who has the gold makes the rules. Second rule is, if you figure out the rules they are playing by, you can do pretty damn good surviving and prospering. All this said, I do agree that the first priority for all of us is to lay up sufficient preps, supplies and tools, firearms and ammo, and make sure you have a safe,secure place to go. Indeed, all the gold in the world won’t matter much in the initial weeks and months, maybe even years. But ultimately, gold and silver are stores of value, and we will need investment if we are to re-build and restore our Republic.
        I don’t need much to be comfortable, but I am going to be damn sure I have done all I can to make life reasonably comfortable for my family when SHTF.

      58. All you guy’s comments are freaking boring! This must be a website for the oldfolk! Damn your boring comments!!!

        • Let me guess, you want comments about how so and so would *uck Britany Spears, or how long is Kobe’s junk? You need to go to Yahoo for that trash. You’re either young, dumb, and full of _____ or older, immature and trying to make believe that the 45 is the new 25.

        • @ Concerned
          Atlantic Ocean son, what a boring comment, can’t you whipper snappers do better than that, by jingo! (sarcasm)

      59. Free sex for JJ Jr.

      60. All this money being spent on hording gold. It will drop back to normal before you know it. All all these people spending all this cash on gold and silver will be out money and the people selling it will be laughing.

        • Sell me your’s. Joke’s on me!

          What’s “normal” Hutsy? How old are you? I would guess about……25. Close?

          • 25! I wish! Early 40’s No one can perdict whats gonna happen but whenever there is a mad dash for something at first its gonna be crazy but always seems to calm down thats what I see. Yeah I could be wrong and I see how things are changing these past few years but ya never know. And btw I come to this site because I love it, some of the comments on here are the best and I never get tired of reading post on here. And to have someone comment and set me straight on my thoughts and ideals is great.

            • I mean no disrespect. The fun and learning is in the banter.

              • I don’t take it as disrespect there is nothing wrong with communication between people with the same views. I love to read different views on anything I post and feedback from anyone or any info on anything that’s why we are here. I’m new and learning a lot so please comment anytime I enjoy the conservation.

      61. Have any of you ever thought that the big boys in the investment world are spouting off a lot of truths out of context to fool the sheep into believing the bullshit coming from the controllers of wall street? Do you ever notice how they switch back and forth between the concepts of “gold and silver” AKA precious metals, and “physical assets”? This is not a coincidence and is done intentionally to keep the goyim AKA sheeple, in line. The only people that can afford to buy gold in any appreciable quantity are the super wealthy, bankers and governments, especially private bankers who control government because they can print all the fiat money they want. Governments and bankers buy large amounts of gold with all the free money they print, or imagine into existence while the goyim sheeple are left with piles of worthless paper, junk and debt. Governments don’t have to work for a living or earn their money the old fashioned way like the rest of us. They run printing presses and counterfeit trillions of dollars and steal our labor and wealth through interest and debt and coerce their enforcers to charge the rest of us with crimes if we resist. The rest of us must work for a living and use our worthless FRN’s (Federal Reserve Notes) to purchase goods and services or physical assets to survive. Regardless of the truism of how gold and silver consistently maintain value throughout the ages, you can’t eat gold or silver and I don’t know anyone who will take a gold eagle or a bag of silver dollars at market value in payment for goods or services. If you don’t believe me then take your 15 gold eagles down to the auto dealer and see if they’ll take them in exchange for a new car. Take your 50 silver eagles over to the tax collector and try paying your $1,500.00 property tax bill. You will be laughed out of the room. Technically, the market value of those coins will cover the value of your purchase/debt but their face value won’t. Anyone stupid enough to pay $1,600.00 for a $20.00 coin deserves whatever else happens to them because of their stupid decisions. Again, I don’t know anyone who will take gold or silver at market value in exchange for goods and services. Try buying $1,800 worth of food with your 1910, 20$ St. Gaudens Double Eagle!! It won’t happen. You people need to wake up to the fact that the controllers of wall street are using historical fact to perpetuate their paper fiction to keep you all in line and stirred up. Use your worthless FRN’s to buy goods and services and hard assets now while you still can. Use your worthless FRN’s to pay off all your debt (home, car, credit cards etc…), If you are lucky enough to have anything left over then go ahead and spend it on PM’s (brass and lead). Trade your worthless FRN’s for guns and ammo while you still can. Buy tools, long term storage food (grains and legumes) and medicine. The value of gold and silver vs FRN’s relative to the cost of goods and services is manipulated and this is an indisputable fact of life, yet 99.9% of humans have no control over this and are basically victims of the zionist controlled government printing presses. The value of gold and silver and its relationship to FRN’s (or any other fiat currency for that matter), is manipulated by a hand full of powerful psychopaths who don’t give a shit about you. They are debt masters and the people are their debt slaves. They control governments, and politicians are their errand boys while the cops and military are their enforcers. All the technical babble of how gold and silver have held its value throughout the ages is true, but, in a world where the price of everything is controlled and manipulated by the psychopathic assholes who want to enslave you, the value of precious metals is meaningless. The value of precious metals is meaningful only in a world where they are used as a medium of exchange for goods and services, or when the value of a country’s fiat currency is tied directly to gold and silver (for convenience) and used concurrently as an exchange for goods and services and that world does not exist in America today, or China, or most other countries. All the so called experts are braying like a field full of jackasses about buying up gold and silver before it goes off the charts but if you listen to the experts (even though they may be technically correct regarding relational value), the only thing you, the goyim sheeple will get in return is a piece of metal, the price of which, was manipulated to begin with and which you will never be able to exchange for the same value in goods and services except for its face value. Use your worthless FRN’s to buy goods and services while you still can. You will have plenty of time to stock up on precious metals after the fall, when the value of everything is reset and prices and value are more in line with the reality of the labor market for goods and services, and physical gold and silver will “hopefully” be used as a medium of exchange. Buying an ounce of gold for $1,600.00 is one thing but to buy an ounce of gold for $1,600.00 while it is stamped with a face value of $20.00 or $50.00, and not officially used as an exchange medium for goods and services is the epitome of foolishness. Even in today’s horrible economy, $1,600.00 of FRN’s will buy a hell of a lot more goods and services (guns, ammo, food, medicine and medical care) than a $20.00 gold piece, regardless of gold’s historical or manipulated intrinsic value and regardless of what the so called experts say.
        China and other countries are stockpiling precious metals to shore up their own fiat currency for the future of their own country. China, in this context is not a person, but rather a country that, like zionist controlled America can steal the wealth of citizens everywhere by organizing their debt into currency and other papers, and by using others debt and their printing presses just like the bankers in zionist run America, while duping other countries into taking their fiat currency or American FRN’s in trade for that country’s gold and silver. The only difference between Chinese government bankers and American government bankers is that one publicly speaks Mandarin and the other speaks English but they both understand Yiddish. The American dollar is still the worlds reserve currency (it is anyone’s guess how long this will last) even though it becomes more worthless with each passing day and China holds a lot of American debt. The Chinese are not paying with gold or silver for all the goods, services and assets they are buying up around the world, they are paying with goods and services or trading worthless American FRN’s/debt because they know the gig is up for the American dollar. They are slowly dumping their holdings in US dollars/debt by trading them for hard assets around the world. Just saying… that’s what I think. Now, I’m through huffing and puffing I can go back to sleep. Tomorrow I will go out and trade some of my stack of FRN’s for a nice rib eye and bottle of wine and a few useful things that will assist me to deal with the coming collapse. After the collapse, I will trade some of it, along with my labor, back to the uninitiated for hard currency (gold and silver) and move on with my life.

        • So Crabbe, buy gold and silver, or not?

        • Hey Crab;
          Bullseye, my friend.
          As long as gold is valued by the measure of a floating
          fiat currency, rather than the fiat currency being held to a ridged value of gold, the value of gold can never
          be a static measure of wealth, You said it better than I.

      62. Been buying for 6 years….buy only with long term savings.
        buy on dips and hold …
        unless you see the corruption and deceit begin to recede …
        unless you see liberty gaining over tyranny …
        unless you see reality setting in vs wishful thinking
        unless you see the situation and fiscal responsiblity returning….


        Be it sheets of aluminum… silver … tires in a warehouse etc.

      63. Heads up…

        I think I smell a rat..

        we all know big buiz is in bed with big gov. excuse me if i feel this might be bullshit, or a bullshit way of removing some more ammo from the public..

        it just seems convienient timing wouldnt you say?

        WINCHESTER® 5.56mm M855 62 Grain PENE

        Olin Corporation is recalling one lot of its 5.56mm M855 62 Grain PENE centerfire rifle ammunition

        Symbol Number: ZGQ3308
        Lot Number: WCC10M106-004

        could be legit..glad i dont own any of these..still makes me go hummmm..

        • although they do say , once you send in your ammo, they will send you replacement ammo.., could this begin some tracking?..or should i not be so suspicious?

          • A very odd thing for Winchester to do. I’d hold fast and keep the ammo. This type of thing is unheard of.

      64. Hutsy,

        Define “normal” in a world gone mad with printing presses.

        Normal could easily be 3500 or 10,000 an ounce….or 20/oz in “new” dollars once they destroy the current one….but then bread would be back to 3 cents/loaf and gasoline 10 cents/gal.

        • Well normal in my younger years was not 3 cents for a loaf of bread or 10 cents a gallon of gas. I dont live in the past and cant really compare that with this things do change with supply and demand so inflation is normal. Yes the past few years everything is going up quicker than you would expect I understand that. I know anything could happen at anytime and we are on a thin line of total break down. But im not rushing out and hording everything I can find because there is a chance its gonna calm down.Yes I have been stocking up because this site has opened my eyes on a bunch of things so every payday I buy little extra food and things I will need to supply my family. But some things are just mass paranoid people freaking out and driving the price of crap through the roof just a opinion.

          • There is no normal. What is normal for one is not for another. Normal is what a society deems to be normal within a set of parameters to coexist peacefully. Even that fluxuates.

      65. I’ve posted this before, but believe it’s worth repeating. We purchase everything on our budget with a credit card which we then payoff at the end of each month so as not to pay any interest. This is like an 1 month interest free loan.
        The card gives us 5% cash back bonus for using it, which we take and purchase silver on a dollar cost average basis.

        Thus we get an interest free monthly loan and our silver is bought by the credit card company! As long as you use self control and not purchase beyond your means to pay, this works!

        • now , this is how its done

          Barrett’s Position Regarding the Assault on Liberty
          February 20, 2013

          Barrett opposes those who are illegally disarming the American public from their efficient arms and creating superior armed elitist government agencies.

          Elected state officials of New York, having been sworn to protect our Constitution, have instead committed an offense against it and their citizens by stripping inalienable rights duly protected and guaranteed under the Second Amendment. By their deliberate and sinister actions, these officials now cause their state and local policing agencies to enforce these unconstitutional and illegal so called “laws”.

          By current law, Barrett cannot be an accomplice with any lawbreaker, therefore, cannot and will not service or sell to New York government agencies. Barrett also applies this stance to the individual elected official who, as a matter of public record, has voted for or created regulation that violates the constitutional rights of their citizens. This is an expansion of our 2002 ban against the California government due to their second amendment infringements, and shall apply to any future violators.

          In the course of world history there have been officials that strip inalienable rights from the people that were given to all by our Creator. Most of these officials inevitably come to trial, some do not.

          Intentionally violating constitutional rights by officials that have sworn to uphold them should have severe prison sentences.

          With the clear vision of horrible events in history repeating itself, all manufacturers of firearms or related equipment remaining in partnership with such violators should have a respectable fear of being found with the guilty on their day of trial.

          During this era of assault on liberty, Barrett will remain steadfast in our efforts to serve law-abiding citizens of all fifty states, and stands together with you in the struggles we will fight and win.

          Ronnie Barrett
          Chairman and CEO

          • Sounds like Barrett has our six. Thanks for that post, VRF. Nice to see something positive for a change.

            KySSG . . . out.

          • @VRF
            What the heck is wrong with you! Don’t you know that one of those .50 cal assault weapons can kill people 100+ miles away? Also, that they are so powerful they can shoot thru a M1A1 Abrams tank or shoot down a 747 airliner.

            My God man, other than pea-shooters, sling shots and paper clips, no one should own a weapon powerful enough to kill, THAT’S THE GOVERNMENT’S JOB!

            These Barrett guys sound like a bunch of “gun nuts” to me. I would write more on the subject, but I’m late for my yoga class because I’ve been watching Whoopie Goldberg on The View.

            Chow baby!

          • I heard from a reliable source that if shtf and the blue helmets are seen stateside attempting to releave us of our freedom…that Barrett would be passing out product to those in the neighborhood (Louisville, KY).

            That is the kind of thing that I want to hear.

            In fact, I would love one myself…just hold one of those 750 gr. rounds…you don’t even need to see the rifle.

      66. God bless and RIP Bob Chapman who I heard on a radio show back in 2008 telling us gold and silver was the ONLY thing to put your money. I followed him on every show and he was right. I miss Bob Chapmen who passed away from cancer in June of 2012. He told us they were manipulating the price of gold and silver. They were purposing holding it down but they can’t do it forever. He was the best and honest person to tell you the truth. He said the hold system will come down because there is no way it can survive. I miss this man Bob Chapman.

      67. Do you know of anyone who would turn down a silver dollar or a gold coin if given to them? Yet they will never pay cash for one and tell you crazy for buying precious metals.
        Listen if you don’t like precious metals in your pocession, don’t buy them. Can’t stand the ups and downs of the market. Don’t get in! Save yourself some stress and move on to other things needed to be done.
        Metals are not for the faint of heart. They are wealth preservation. Another avenue that can be used to prepare.

      68. I know what will happen to the price of silver.

        If I buy a lot of it the price will keep going down.

        If I don’t buy any the price will go back up.

        Happens every time. nomi

        • that’s the test for those of us that have always worked to make ends meet, have a nice home and a few things…

          keep stackin…it is our only way out.

          believe in and hold real things…that is how the earth works.

      69. Gold and silver are for people looking to preserve wealth.
        That is a topic you broke-dicks don’t have to worry about.

      70. Yep, you got ’em with that one Soros. I totally 100% agree with your first sentence. That is why I sold most of my stockpile for $1400.00 oz. a couple years ago and invested in powder,primers,brass and bullets. To PRESERVE my wealth. It seemed like a good deal then with only $100.00 oz invested from years past. It even seems like a better deal now with rising costs of reloading supplies. All that shootin’ we been doing for pennies per rd. makes it oh so sweet.

        Not braggin’, just the’am.

      71. More b.s. on “why” people “need” useless metal. The reason is directly linked to the profit margins / revenue being received by the author.

      72. Gold and Silver may be better than currency but I invest in things that will help me survive a land without laws and a shortage of common decency in mankind.

      73. A recent audit of the NY Feds gold reserves stated that there was only 466 tons held. It becomes problematic for them when Germany asks for it’s gold back, doesn’t it?

        Not sure what or who to believe on this, but I have been running on the assumption that the US holds most of the gold reserves, but now it is more than likely that its all paper assets which are as valuable as the USD (ie, nothing).

        The only reason we are buying oil from the Saudis and other foreign countries when that is no longer necessary is to support the USA (petro dollars). If we stopped buying their oil, the USD dies. It will die soon no matter what the illegitimate US Govt does. As an American, I cannot wait for the USD to die because with it comes with the death of the globslist controlled US Govt. I welcome it and will participate in destroying those globslist scum.

        National Security is not for we putrid Americans, who this government hates, it’s to propect their interests….it’s called Continuity of Government (COG) and they would sooner see we Americans die to serve their own interests. I feel the same way about them.

        Remember this: Whoever shoots first loses, so let them shoot first. It’ll be there first and only shot the fucking bastards!!!

      74. If the economy crashes, I can’t eat silver or gold- I want food and water and those who have gold and silver will die, then I’ll just take their gold and silver. LOL.

      75. –Gold $5000 by 2016

        –Silver $100 by 2016

        –DJIA 30,000 by 2016

        Long term U.S. Treasuries, U.S. dollar, EURO–all collapse in coming 3 years.

      76. Old but true saying:

        Gold is the barter of Kings
        Silver is the barter of Gentlemen
        Goods are the barter of Merchants
        And Debt is the barter of Slaves

        Guess where America is?

      77. My husband deals in bullion and rare coins. A fellow dealer emailed him a notice about CT wanting ALL Sellers of PMs to obtain detailed contact info as well as copies of digital photos/IDs linked to every transaction and reported to local police WEEKLY if requested?. Fortunately, he knows our state rep really well and will be speaking with her to try and stop this.

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