Wisconsin Gov Puts National Guard On Alert After Implementing Emergency Budget Measures

by | Feb 17, 2011 | Headline News | 116 comments

Do you LOVE America?


    In an effort to prevent Egypt in Milwaukee, Governor Scott Walker has put the National Guard on alert:

    Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker, a Republican, unveiled an emergency budget proposal Friday to deal with the state’s growing budget woes. Wisconsin has a $137 million deficit this year, and faces a projected $2.9 billion budget shortfall for 2012 and 2013.

    Under Walker’s plan, public employees would lose all of their collective bargain rights, except a limited negotiation of wages. State workers would also have to contribute more to their pension and health care benefit plans.

    Unions erupted in outrage as they learned about Walker’s proposal. The Governor told Milwaukee Public Radio that he has briefed the Wisconsin National Guard to prepare them for any worker unrest today.

    Source: Business Insider

    For readers of SHTFplan, it’s no secret that the Pentagon and Military are Actively War Gaming ‘Large Scale Economic Breakdown’ and ‘Civil Unrest’. The Governor of Wisconsin seems to understand what the result is when you start making emergency cuts and instituting austerity measures.

    The National Guard has been training for these scenarios for quite some time, and soldiers returning from the Middle East are well versed in urban and suburban-style policing and warfare. In the initial stages of protests, we’ll see traditional police deployment, but once the first Molotov gets thrown, you can be assured that US military assets will be deployed on American streets. It will not be a good day for America when that happens.

    Unless the trend of broke and hungry and unemployed Americans is reversed, we will soon see a breaking point. People can only sit on their couches watching Jersey Shore for so long before their hungry bellies force them into action – well, that and if the cable were to get turned off due to an inability to pay the bill.

    Protesters In Action:

    The fact of the matter is that States are bankrupt. What we’ve seen from Governor Walker in Wisconsin and Governor Christie in New Jersey is nothing compared to what needs to, and will, happen. The estimates are that roughly 2 million government workers on the State and Local level are going to lose their jobs during this crisis. Plus what we’ll continue to lose in the private sector.

    While unemployment insurance is a backstop for now, more and more people are losing their benefits each month – and they’re left with no way to pay their mortgage, feed their families, or put gas in the car. For those now joining the unemployment benefit plans, there’s inflation to be dealt with. Thus, even though one has 99 weeks left before benefits expire, as the dollar continues to lose strength and food and energy costs rise, it becomes much more difficult to even cover the basic necessities with a weekly government assistance check.

    According to Celentian philosophy, “when people lose everything, and they have nothing left to lose, they lose it,” which means the S hitting the fan is coming to a city square near you fairly soon.

    Hat tip Steve Quayle


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      1. Comments…..when the buck stops coming then what?
        class warfare at a differant level
        people need to be carefull what they wish for.
        and accept responsablity for their actions
        if obuma telling  joe the plumer he was going to spread the wealth wasnt a big enough clue then the people of this country
        that voted him in and to this day follow him like sheople
        get what they deserve,the rest better be prepared,

        are you???

      2. Yes the herd that paid homage to the anointed double stuffed oreo cookie now want a Hershey bar with their dirty hands stretched out.  Christie didn’t vaporize.

      3. National Guard…lol

        they think they arnt next to be unemployed?

        checks in the mail……NOT!

        They will just be looking at whats to come for them..no one works for free, not even or should i say especially not the government

        Waiy until all those crotch grabbing TSA shirts get the news they are on the line too..

        its going to happen, its just a matter of time

        Im watching local Gov. possitions around here drop like flies
        the Animal Control officer in an area where my friends lives just got notice , he’s out by next friday
        and a bunch of cops got the axe 3 weeks ago, with no call back date.

      4. Im not trying to make light of this, No intention of pissing anyone off with what i said above..facts are facts,
        they didnt keep their house in order and thats what happens..
        they were not prepaired for this, and most city workers think things like this could never happen to them,, so they pushed and pushed for more and more..again what happens when the well runs dry?

      5. I live here in Wisconsin and this protest was a joke by a bynch of highly paid (over paid) gubment union workers who have to start contributing to their 401K plan and paying a little for their health care….just like all of us in the private sector who have had to suffer.  These people are whining, plain and simple.  The govenor is just doing what should have been 20 years ago, and the unions don’t like it.  Scores of teachers called in sick (one school closed) so they could go to the protest.  Other teachers took their pupils to the protest (and I’m paying for this?)  The Governor had the Nat Guard on standby as he would with any potentially turbulent event.  He is working to prevent our state from going bankrupt like CA and NY.  He did the right thing clamping down on these

      6. Im just thinking its Ironic thats all..Gov. Having Gov employees(NG) policing Gov. employees.
        and how much does having the NG on stand by cost us?
        Any teacher taking any kid to this should get sued, personally.
        that is child endangerment , was permission granted?

      7. Comments….I wonder when, they will try that in chicago? Known as cook ( crook) county to some, is in even bigger trouble.We just had our state taxes raised by more than  50%,small buisness and corporate taxes as well rose,and yet we still need to borrow nine billion to pay overdue bills. THE GOOD NEWS WAS, THEY LOWERED OUR LIQUOR TAX. From 15% to 13% I guess they thought i was going to need that extra cash.

      8. “Warning: Riots may be closer than they appear.”  We need some more high speed trains.  That will fix everything.  The media is just too impatient.  The Cambridge police acted stupidly.  I think when you spread the wealth (debt) around, it’s good for everybody.

      9. In spite of what our ‘beloved-leader’ says to the contrary and his upbeat, positive pep talks about our bright and shining future here in the United States …… everything that I can see happening around us paints a completely different picture about what we have to look forward to. 2011 promises to be a very eventful year.

        Good luck and God Bless to all.

        I feel that the teachers/educators that are now striking is un-freaking believable. I have no idea what the umemployment rate is in Wis. but there are folks out there who are losing their jobs, homes and retirements, where do these jackasses think the money is going to come from?

        I work for a construction company in Va., of the 10 employees that are left, me included, all have taken a 35% wage concession and our retirement fund is also gone. Yet, in order to keep a little money coming in, we work for less. So, why do these people think they should be given any special perks. No! They need to make similar concession…

      11. Finally! Someone that knows the proper usage of the word: ‘lose’.

        These union workers will ‘lose’ their jobs, and then, IF they’re re-
        hired, they won’t be calling in sick then, lest they not collect
        the money on their paycheck.  Their very ability to just call in
        sick, to abuse the system, shows how entitled  they feel they are.

      12. You sound abbynormal to me MadMarkie. 

        Most of you aremissing the point. The governor saidhe wouldn’t talk, wouldn’t discuss changes required to meet budgets. He wants to break the unions. Plain and simple. There is not a teacher,nurse, administrative assistant or janitor that didn’t understand there wouldbe some bargaining needed. Benefitswould have to change. But, what folksgot was a dictator saying that they had no rights. And, the National Guard would be called outif they disagreed.

        I live in Madison,not just one school closed. The districtshut down. No teachers told their kidsto protest. Teachers described the issueand kids went downtown on their own.

        If this bill passes today, we are one step closer no middleclass long term, a declining standard of living in my home town short term. Not only that this country is on a slipperyslope. Other states are watching this,and other unions will be broken, the middle class is doomed….and I guess theNational Guard is here to help.

        (No I am not a teacher. I am actually a stay at homemom.)

      14. Kaynine, God/Buddha/Allah help you all is that Emanuel gets in there. You’ve had enough bad years of corruption in that city, and that will only bring the lions closer to your door.

        And everyone is SO right about this situation. I grew up with family in teacher’s unions. I didn’t understand their impact when I was younger, but look back now with a whole different lens.

        I’ve employed a lot of people in my life. And I’ve always gotten the sob story, usually from college kids and such, always wanting more and more. All the while, half the population is skidding into insolvency and bankruptcy. And I would tell them, just as I’d tell these teachers, “Do you realize how many people would give everything they have to have your job right now? Try and appreciate the fact that you are working, and feeding yourself is not a concern that so many around you do have.”

        These teachers have no respect for what they have, and want more in a time that there is NOTHING left to give. They’d rather break the system than guarantee their own future employment. How suicidal is that way of thinking?

      15. Just wait until the summer heat comes on.

      16. Comments…..I don’t understand?  Are you saying that there is inflation?  That can’t be!  The Federal Government tells me that there is “no” inflation and that’s why my Social Security checks have gone “down ” the last two years.  Now we all know that the Federal Government never lies; don’t we.  So, you must be mistaken.  Right?

      17. It’s about time something was done to stop the unions. Why are there public employee unions allowed in the first place?  We need someone like Reagan, who fired the air controllers when they tried to strike. When the unions hire thugs to intimidate, throw the bums in jail.


      19. The metaphor here is not Egypt, but Greece! Government workers have been promised unsustainable wages and benefits over the years by clueless politicians using other people’s (read taxpayers) money. Comes the threat of default and this compensation needs to be renegotiated, look for broken windows and burning cars in the street.

      20. The fall of the middle class is directly attributable to shrinking union rolls.  Unions have been the backstop for livable wages in this country since the end of WWII.  The only group benefiting from the attack on union workers is the investor class.

        In 1983, the richest 1 percent of Americans got 11.6 percent of total income. Today the top 1 percent takes in more than 20 percent.

        The death of unions will bring about the end of the middle class, an increase in poverty and an unhealthy, uneducated population, and ultimately, a smaller and weaker country.

      21. Comments…..i love it! Unions, techers’ unions and Gov’t workers, feel the pain!

      22. Comments….. These teachers/union thugs are all cocoapuffers.  They have the same mentality as anyone on welfare – entitled.  I think it’s hilarious to watch it all unfold and come together for the common good.  Next is California, and so forth.  Bring the unions down!

      23. The rioting & protesting in the USA has officially begun. 

        Students are rioting – egged on by their immature & imbecile teachers who called in “sick” (they should all be fired unless they can product a legitimate doctors note).  One sign a child was holding said “Attacking Teachers Attacks My Future”. 

        Since when is cutting budgets “attacking teachers”?  If you factor in retirement pay & benefits those folks make about $90,000 per year for 9 months of work.  That is too much.  Sorry, your job is important is not that important and we can’t afford to pay it.  The good times are over.  Time for us all to get used to the New Normal.

        This is just the beginning.  As govt benefits, entitlement benefits, etc. get cut back this will be occuring daily.  Bottom up.  Inside Out.  Riots & Protests.  Violence.  Coming to a city near you.

      24. I echo most of the comments here. These “entitled” teachers are getting what they deserve. I too grew up in a household where both my parents were teachers and I used to hear the grumblings all the time. Now that I’m an adult and out from under their umbrella I see things for what they really are, and I can honestly say they feel entitled to everything they’ve received. The sad thing is they’re retired now and are going to feel the pain big time soon as they ignored my pleadings a few years ago to put their money into something “safe” and liquid.  What did they do? They put 100% of what they had into a “guaranteed” fixed annuity. Oh well…

        Sort of a philosophical question. I’m against bailouts in general, especially the trillions of dollars that have been thrown at the banking/securities industry. But my question is, how come the Federal government can spend trillions upon trillions on the banks but cannot spend a few hundred billions bailing out the states? What am I missing here?

      25. Now would be the time to pick up those last minute items that may soon become unobtainable. When this occurs in other countries the MSM calls it “austerity measures”. Angry government workers taking to the street, venting outrage for being taken advantage of, could become the catalyst for chaotic events occurring in this country.
        Most of us here knew this was coming and have been preparing for it.There’s still time but time is running short.

        Search,,,  Obama Orders Military To Prepare For Spring Food Riots Jan 13 2011 ,,,.

        The government has known this was coming to the U.S. for a long time now. Gear Up Folks.

      26. This is a load of crap.  Aside from leaving out all the stuff in the Governors bill that effectively outlaws unions (but does not outlaw corporate contributions to the political money pot) the fact is that the Federal Government and the states spend many dozens of times more money on Social Security and Medicare/Medicaid than they do on any union pensions/benefits.  If he really wanted to balance his budget, he would be confronting Medicaid, but he’s not.

      27. GA Mom … where are your facts coming from?  My kid’s teacher makes $37K.  That doesn’t sound unreasonable to me.
        I suppose the union busters on this blog would like to do away with minimun wage, child labor laws, overtime pay for over 40 hours week work?
        What Henry Ford couldn’t do with clubs and thugs, Walker is doing with uncollaborative dicatorship.
        Who do you want educating your children or policing our streets?  People who are paid $5/hour with no education?  Can you spell MEXICO?

        • I agree, I am a state worker and am not even close to being overpaid, I live paycheck to paycheck, am late on many bills, I do not live above my means, I scrape by. These changes will take an additional 200 dollars out of my check I have nothing that I can give up, why couldn’t things have been done gradually give people some time to adjust. Wat is he out to prove and is his family making sacrifices? I think not!

      28. FIRE THEM before they get a sic permit from Obama’s Health Care “doctor” & hire the National Guard to teach.  Sounds fair to me.  He’s comparing himself to Ronnie Regan here lately anyway.  The National Guard can produce their birth certificate.

      29. BTW – McDonalds and WalMart got a huge tax breaks through loop holes in WI since Walker began in January.  Gives a new meaning to “take a break today.”

      30. Total State Population in Wisconsin ranks it at 20th in the nation, with over 5,600,000 people. This could be a litmus test for the government to determine how chaotic things could get on a national level. ( Search,,, Wisconsin wikipedia ,,,).
        This event will create a lot more concern across the country.People who have just been watching these events may now start taking action by making their own preparations.Would not be surprised to see the MSM blame panic buying for rising prices and shortages. I’m glad I became aware of what’s going on two years ago. I’m not completely squared away but will be better off than most in my area. Looks like food will become a major concern for many.
        (Search,,,, gerald celente worst economic collapse ever on youtube,,,). I saw this Feb 2009 and have been preparing ever since. Good Luck To All.

      31. Comments…..The average teacher pay for Milwaukee public school teachers is $59,000 for a 9 month work year and their benefits package comes to another $45,000.  The teachers at Milwaukee Area Technical College have a higher average salary for 32 weeks’ work (with additional pay for the 6 week summer school).  They pay nothing toward their pension, their dental plan is free,  and they pay less than 4 % toward their health plan. They just rammed through a three year contract.

      32. Bea, yes to getting rid of minimum wage. Price/wage controls never work. No to child labor laws – there for a reason. Overtime pay for over 40 hours week – why? The bottom line is we can longer afford to pay for the entitlements/benefits/<substitute your noun here> that millions upon millions have gotten used to over the past 50 years. It is coming to a an abrupt end as the system dies in fits and starts. The sooner we all recognize that the better.

      33. in Wisconsin, city garbage collectors in Milwaukee get paid more than teachers, the same is true in many states…

        in my thinking, teachers should be the highest paid.. but that is just me I guess… that isn’t the point of my post anyhow..

        the real plan is to force all states to bankruptcy..

        once a state goes that path, they LOSE ALL Sovereign status and will be dependent on the Fed gov and under their TOTAL CONTROL. (you know, the foreign owned Corporation in the district of columbia. the one that went bankrupt in 1933 and was took over by it’s creditors)

        if a state goes bankrupt they will NOT be able to tell the federal government to go take a hike in the future, as they will be owned by them, by receivership..

        it is amazing how paper monopoly money printed out of thin air gets rewarded like this… LOL don’t mind me, me just nutty 🙂

        wiki of Sovereignty:  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sovereign


        I have two teachers living on my street—I bet they’re Kentucky bred…that means they understand a job without union benefits, paid health care, and 50% pension benefits is a lot better than NO JOB!!! 

        February 17th, 2011 at 10:48 am
        That’s BS–let the depraved 60,000 a year teachers use that union due fees to invest in silver!!!
        How funny is that…are they really that stupid??  I was a teacher and any job is better than no job..ask the thousands in Chicago that lost theirs!!
        I wager that if they had an opportunity to get their jobs back without union representation(interference/bribes) they would jump at it.

      36. One can see the decline of prosperity in the USA is in direct result of the formation of public unions.  Porter Stansberry did a great piece on this in his last newsletter.  The unions wiped out the auto industry, starting in the 1960s.  After that they moved on to government.  The existence of public sector unions (and the power of states to levy progressive income taxes, which is technically unconstitutional), both the result of 1970s reforms, led to unreasonably high expectations and therefore costs.  The existence of the public sector unions allows government workers to dictate the terms of their employment AND elect their own bosses.  From 1989 until 2004 the American Federation of State, County, and Municipal Employees (AFSCME) was the largest single donor to federal political campaigns in the country.  More than 98% of their donations went to Democratic candidates.

        Unions have drive American manufacturing out of business by making unit labor costs uncompetitive in the global market.  Therefore, manufacturing moved overseas.  As a result unions moved into the only market left in America where there was a complete monopoly: government.

        This is the end of the road, and quite frankly it is a good thing.  By eliminating unions perhaps we can get back to what made America great to begin with: fantastic quality and efficiency at a low cost. 

      37. Haven’t i read on this blog that American’s are too fat and stupid to protest?  Now that folks are protesting there is something wrong with that???
        Again, I don’t think the teachers and others out there are saying they want to keep all the bennies intact, I think they are they saying they want fair representation thru collective bargining.  They want some respect.
        I just got back from the capitol.  This is the start, no another step, toward what we have been talking about.

      38. BEA…what you and all the people in Madison are forgetting is that there is no more money?  The priavte sector has been taking a hit for three years and now it’s time for the public sector to take a hit.  “Spread the hit”- get it?  Just like spread the wealth, it goes two ways.  As a taxpayer, why should I fund a teachers retirement and healthcare at extreme levels when I can barely fund my own?  The next revolt will be Wisconsin taxpayers like me that protest in front of schools and teacher’s homes about how we’re getting ripped off.  You can’t have public employees expecting to get Cadillac healthcare and pension funds when the taxpayers can’t get them. 

      39. It is about time
        the stupid lazy assed fucking
        teachers and government “employee”
        moochers start paying their own way.

        From now on you get NO free lunches from the taxpayer.

        UNIONS, now there is a group of leaching bloodsucking lazyassed maggot mobsters.


      40. Democrats always clog the toilets and raise the biggest stink.

        Ga. Mom, I agree with you. The teachers are  no more important to the overall picture that the factory worker or the janitor. i am so tired of the hirachy that these “educators” feel they should have. Horse crap to them all.

        In my day, if you called in sick and and was on National TV protesting, management would have fired your ass for no. 1 lying and no. falsifing records. Yet, instead of addressing the mob, they ought to get video tape and isolate the individuals and if they were caught lying by calling in sick, fire them.

        Keep in mind, these are the same people teaching your children. Teaching them what, to be community organizers?

      42. I suppose it would take me all of 2 seconds to look this up myself, but everyone’s input here is better than that anyway. Exactly WHERE on the performance scale do Madison schools (or WI as whole) rank in the scheme of things? Are their statistics stellar enough to support what they THINK they deserve? I know as a country, billions have been flooded into the educational system, yet kids today are embarrassingly unaware and under-educated, so much so, I wonder how they’ll survive the real world. Isn’t is Japan or Norway that injects hardly a fraction of what we do into their educational system, yet leave us in the dust?

        I have known teachers myself that could not pass a basic math test, or many of the tests they hand to their students without their coveted ‘teacher’s edition’. Not a lot, but some. And the state of WA used to have a final exam for seniors. Pass/fail! And if I’m not mistaken, they had to ditch that, as most of the teachers failed it themselves. No lie. Anyway, thought that might be worth examining.

        @ Blacksheep: Probably the most spot on in my opinion. It’s exactly why Greece and Ireland have completely succumbed to the power and whims and of the IMF (Through direct assistance of our own Fed), until those nations are bled dry of all money, resolve, or will to fight. They have accepted a deal with the devil, all for a moment’s salvation. Iceland crashed, but is already on the rise again, without such demonic shackles on them. They told the IMF to go F themselves.

        This is the crossroads our states are at. Go it alone, and face the venom of your constituency, and muddle through this somehow? Or wait for the ‘protective’ hand of the mighty O to make it all better. At an enormous price. I think I know what the government would like. And they’re salivating at what they know is coming, like a pack of wolves.

      43. Well the teachers deal with an unmotivated , rude and irresponsible group of youngsters daily. Mostly because parents have their own agendas going and dont set the tone at home for successful parenting. I have rode and continue to to this day riding a busy rescue company for local FD. Im not complaining , I knew what the job was when I was hired 20 ys ago. I deal with people daily who have crap in their paints, blood and sometimes living maggots on their person.I see things , Im put in situations and are exposed to that you people cannot fathom. Most pay 12 $ to a theatre to see what goes down on the streets of America.

        So yes I do feel entitled. I earned it. I could go on and on about the effects the job has on you mentally and physically. But unless youve done it, theres no way.   


      44. The History Channel program Prophets of Doom brought up the possibilty of societal collapse brought on by too much debt.
        (Search      Prophets of Doom on youtube Jan 30 2011   )
        The first 30 minutes can really open ones eyes to what’s going on.You don’t have to have a college degree to see that borrowing money to pay debt obligations does not have a happy ending. If this generation isn’t willing to assume responsibility for it’s action, the next generation will be expected to shoulder that responsibility. The credit card is maxed out and it’s time to live within our means. Government spending is going to contract and a lot of people are not going to like it. “Austerity measures” in Europe are a prelude to what’s coming here.

      45. Wheedle, I’ll check that out. Sounds interesting. But don’tcha know? According to our fearless leader, and his ragtag kleptocratic minions, we’re on a slow and steady slog toward prosperity! Just not as fast as they’d like!

        Now you tell me, how betrayed will the rest of the population feel, and how will THEY react when it finally dawns on them? It’s the propaganda that too many have bought into that have kept the ‘resistance’ suppressed until this point.

        And for all of the prognostications that this will go on for generations, or THAT will go on for 20-30 years… I say, all of it will play out through next year. The good, the bad, and the ugly. In the end, a new system FOR the people, a new currency, and an unrecognizable new world.

        For that, I say, let’s just get from here to there as quickly as possible. Much brighter days are ahead, and this 5-headed hydra has very little time to inflict its pain, before a ‘natural’ death puts an end to all of this madness. Hang in there!

      46. I live in TX, a right-to-work state. Little to no union presence, thank God! While the Wisconsin governor was rather heavy-handed, I’m not sure there is any other way to institute austerity. What is there to negotiate when there IS NO MONEY? 

        As far as what teachers think of themselves – well, pride goeth before a fall! Over the years, I have dealt with some pretty outstanding people who also had CHOSEN to be teachers. And they were passionate and dedicated and good teachers. On the other hand, I’ve known some who should never have gotten into the profession! My grandson has one teacher right now who sent a test review paper home for study in December, but didn’t even bother to do spell check on it! It was awful!!! What kind of example is that?? About the same as any of the Wisconsin teachers who enlisted their students in what is THEIR OWN issue! They should be fired — I’d bet that “Help Wanted” notices sent to areas all over Illinois would have the empty slots filled promptly!

        On another note, three times over the last 7 days, we have had some VERY strange instances of emergency responders (fire dept and sheriff’s office) responding as though to emergency calls. But there have been no fires, and no official reports of problems requiring a minimum of 7 deputy vehicles, screaming down the highway at 80 – 90 mph! We live just outside of town, and have seen test runs being made in the 15+ yrs we’ve lived here. But nothing like these responses. Something WAY out of the ordinary! Practicing for something we’ve never seen around here, maybe???  Just sayin…

      47. Dennis,,,, I agree that the sheeple, cocoapuffers, entitled, the sleeping giant,,,,,, are in for a rude awakening. Watching and surviving the transition is when it will get really  interesting.

      48. People think that the government has an endless supply of money (NOT).  The Unions  (which I am a member of) like to try to get blood out of a stone.  These teachers should study a little history and read about  the LIBERAL Weimar Republic. I think its time to stop and think about what the liberal icon J.F.K. said “ask not what your country can do for you but what you can do for your country.

      49. Global Rev is underway.
        repeat after me,OATH KEEPERS.

      50. Bea – you won’t win here on unions.  I agree, unions have caused more trouble than they fixed.  Time to get rid of them all.  I gotta wonder too Bea, where is the money suppose to come from?  What’s so hard to understand about no more money?

      51. What astounds me is that these people (teachers, gubment workes) don’t seem to realize whats been done to them. The Democrat politicians that are supporting them today are the same ones that did this to them. They promised them the moon over the past 20 years, and they really were not even capable of launching a paper airplane. They bought your votes and you fell for it. Now that the you-know-what hits the fan, they skip town. What you guys should really be doing, is NOT going after Walker, but instead getting out the pitch forks, tar and feathers and go get the liars that promised you what could never be delivered. THE MONEY IS NOT THERE! Plain and simple. Millions have lost their jobs. Millions have lost there homes. Many who have kept their homes are just barely making it. Don’t you get it? The tax revenues from the people (by the way, this is what pays your salary in case you are not aware of it) are just NOT there for the phony promises made to you. Wake up! Face reality and thank God you have a job and a paycheck.

      52. Bea- yes I DO want to get rid of min wage laws. Since when is it the duty of any gov agency to determine what I pay my employees or recieve from my employer?
         Who do I want teaching my kids? ME! At least I’m the one with the ultimate responsibility to see that they’re educated. If I choose to let someone else (pub school, private school, etc) do it I still have the responsibility to see that my kids are properly taught, right? Also, if you’ll look at the total compensation package for teachers you’ll see that even the ones that say they’re making 37K per year are actually costing the taxpayers much closer to the 90K mentioned in that other comment.
         What we really should be considering here is the whole concept of “public schools.” This is just one of many areas where people have bought into the idea that government can and should provide something to the citizens. The facts show that they (the gov) can’t equal the quality or cost effectiveness of the private sector alternatives. Not that I’m attacking teachers specifically. I used to be a public school teacher so I have a pretty good idea of  what their concerns are. I just don’t think the gov EVER gets it right when they attempt to do something or give something to the people. It always costs more money and delivers less quality no matter what they try to “do” for us. We need to wake up and examine every aspect of our society, and ourselves personally, where we have been allowing the gov to provide for us those things we should be doing for ourselves. The rights and the responsibilities are ours and we need to take them back.  And as for your comment about-We say they’re too lazy to protest and then we’re shocked when they do (not trying to misquote you here, just repeating the general idea) That observation was…..EXCELLENT!

      53. Comments…..I am un-employed teacher and would LOVE to have the benefits of the teachers in Wisconsin.  Around $45,000 and anotther $45,000 in benefits.  Are you kidding me?  If the governor would fire them all, he would be overwhelmed with applications.  They only need to put 12% into their healthcare, where do I sign up?  Not all teachers are shitheads that feel entitled.  Believe me we see it all.  I have kids that honestly DO NOT KNOW their last names – no fooling.  The lice, the “skivvies”,  the 10 year old that smiles, struts, and announces to the class, “I had sex with my daddy last night!”  Believe me, we earn our pay.  But many of us know that if the money is not there, it is not there.  My hubby is in private business, and it has dropped 50%.  So we dropped our living expenses – %50.   “Entitled” teachers, gov. workers, welfare, illegals  — the party is over and it is about damn time !!!

      54. What goes around comes around. teachers voted for Obummer en mass now they are reaping Obamanomics. But folks, don’t miss the forest for the trees. The danger to the middle class in America is not the unions, private or public, nor is it state workers.

        The danger to the middle class are not the unions in the auto industry, steel industry, or aerospace. The danger to the middle class is and has been “free trade” rather than fair trade.

        The danger to the American middle class is a corrupt, beloated, federal government with scores and scores and thousands of score of officers eating out our substance.

        The danger to the middle class is the pork barrel politics of DC that want $50 billion for “bullet trains” and bridges to nowhere, from nowhere, for nobody.

        The danger to the middle class are the 30 million illegals suppress wages and stealing jobs that rightfully belong to citizens.

        The danger to the middle class is a corrupt financial system that rewards failure with taxpayer bailouts for the uber rich stockholders that own the banks.

        The danger to the middle class re the globalists in BOTH politicalties who are treasonous and have sold America out to foreign interests for their thirty pieces of silver.

        I could go on and on …… look to the real danger that wants to make illegals “new Americans”, hold a referendum to impose the NAU on US as a prelude to the NWO, and seeks to dissolve our Constitution, and erode our Bill of Rights.

        Look to the traitors who hold dual citizenship who shape, favor and manipulate foreign policy, to the benefit of other nations and to the detriment of America.

        These are the real dangers to You, US, and America. Wake the fuck up!

      55. Bravo, DK, Bravo!

      56. I live in Wisconsin and am a teacher of 24 years that will be affected by this proposal (and a conservative, by the way).  The problem for us is not  that Gov. Walker is asking for us to kick in more for our benefits and retirement.  The big problem is taking away all our bargaining rights.  We would loose our seniority, we would loose any say in our working conditions, class sizes, prep time, sick leave and a whole host of other issues.  Anyone who has a masters degree or has devoted a lot of their working life to one district will feel like a target, the district can find some reason to get rid of you and hire a new, inexperienced teacher for a lot less money.  Lots of people are also unaware that Wisconsin teachers worked under  the QEO law for well over a decade.  It prevented us from getting wage and benefit package increases of over 3.8%.  With the way health care was increasing, there were several years that I had a pay freeze and even took pay cuts in order that we could retain our health insurance.  The teachers of Wisconsin did not create this problem.  We would like to be part of the solution and allowed to be party in working through this, rather than being hit with a union busting sledgehammer like this.

      57. Comments…..To all the union bashers out there do you realize unions make up less than 15% of the working people in this country. Are you really trying to sell that the unions are the problem. Wake up the most prosperous times in this countrys history coincided with the highest levels of union enrollments. Wake up the rich and powerful control 95% of all wealth world wide and your drinking thier anti union koolaid. Wall street and the bankers stole our money and are living in thier beach mansions retired. The taxpayer bailed out the banks and wall street and 1 year later the executives are getting record bonuses. Are you people really that stupid???

      58. “SOME”  teachers  are glorified students that  never grew out of their high school mentality..,  and then use the ” good for the children” thing to obtain their wants rather than the real needs of the students. 

      59. Kathy: I am not commenting again to bash teachers. A great teacher is priceless and I feel that many of the teachers I had in high school many years ago are responsible for some of the success I have had; BUT

        Where in the private sector can someone make 40K or more a year in salary plus benefits and work only five days a week, 8 months a year?
        Arizona doesn’t pay its starting teachers very well, but I know teachers with tenure like you who make 50-60k a year, and teach the same grade every year: 8 months a year, with every weekend and holiday off.

        How difficult can that be?

        The average worker in America faces the same risks every day that you fear. At least you have a contract for that year. American workers pretty much work at the whim of their employer and can be discharged immediately. It doesn’t matter whether you have a Master’s or Phd. If you work for someone else you must perform every day and earn your keep, every day.

        Teachers have had a good ride on the back of the taxpayer for years. Eventually you have to pay full fare. Give thanks to Obummer for that, he is the teacher’s union President.

      60. some good points here tonight   …I was a member of the AFL-CIO for a spell in my younger years, saw good men lose their jobs while those who should have been canned were protected like the world depended on it.
        I watched them destroy what were very good jobs at the time and killed the shop off…gone.. that was a private shop,when it went broke it closed,govt on the other hand may be broke but do they close up shop?(sounds of hysterical laughing,shrieking and terror)

        I dont care much for unions,they had a place,but I watched them abuse the privilege for years and now they have run out of rope,for the most part they are the leftovers of another time,they may again have a time but not for now and hopefully never like they are now!
        That being said I do not in any manner support govt employees unionizing…Period!
        Working for the govt(supposedly for the people) should never pay more than the private sector pays,it shouldnt even be close,(and forget the tired debate about attracting and retaining the “best” possible people…didnt happen wont happen)nor should employment be virtually guarenteed with great bennies till you croak
        Perhaps we are to blame per-sae for allowing our govts to make these crazy deals with people in the first place, but as others have said we are not better off for all the money we spend on govt(and govt employees are the ones who actually carry out the “inefficency and ineptness that” we see in govt daily,after all it was a govt employee somewhere who okayed paying for 100$ toilet seats and other such waste.
        One group of our society “wont” work, except to spend the welfare money…another “shows up”(usually) and expects generous compensation “hitherto and forever” whether or not they actually ever accomplish or produce anything……leaving the third group that actually works and produces something to pay all the bills for the first two groups and then try to survive on whats left while being made to feel guilty for having anything left in the first place and wanting to keep it….its vile and evil and it has to stop.
        No one is entitled to anything ,other than the natural rights of man that is their birthright…anything else you gotta work for it or you dont get it, got it?!
        People lose their land and their homes due to bad times and lost jobs…..why do govt employees think its okay for people to be pillaged by the taxman to keep them employed,but if they cant pay then have their homes and lands stolen and given to another who can pay so as to keep them all employed…am I the only one who sees this as injustice gone to seed?!
        So I cant say I feel sorry for   govt employees be they teachers or trashmen,regardless of the individual good people who are in these unions the fact remains that they are part of a “parasite” that is sucking dry the ability of the average person to survive much less get ahead and prosper,we have to say no more and cut it loose, that or shut up and die! Thanks!

      61. Durango Kidd,
        WELL DONE!! Spoken like a “free thinking” person. The old saying, ” If you think education is expensive, try ignorance”,  seem so appropriate after reading 80% of the comments. Thanks again , Durango Kidd.  

      62. If these people were exerting themselves at work they would not have enough energy to protest.  They could save money for their retirements like adults are supposed to do. Instead of doing as little as they could for their entire working life they could have tried what I have always done at work -just do something even if its wrong.

                                  peace baby

      63. GIRL: Although some of the points you make with AFSCME are correct, your statement that unions in the private sector drove unit costs too high for American manufacturers to compete etc, etc. Is not correct.

        After WWII America was the only country with a manufacturing base intact. The corporations grew and prospered and so did the workers through their unions. There has always been a legitimate role for unions in an industrial society, otherwise we would all be living in Dicken’s London.

        Workers need some rights or they would be trampled upon by big business; which is what our own history records.

        The demise of the American economy can be traced to Reagan’s firing of all Air Traffic Controller’s, who also had a union. There is not a direct correlation here, but it was about this time that George Bush Sr. enticed the Chinese to become capitalists by promising to make the Commies millionaires. They spent a decade in the City (London) studying financial markets before embarking on the sea of unfettered capitalism.

        As President George Bush Sr, began the policies that transferred American factories and technologies to China under the banner of “free trade” and China allowed the mega rich capitalists to invest in those factories and enjoy the profits thereof with slave labor and hourly rates of 20 cents an hour. (Now 40 cents unless you work in Beijing.)

        This began the wave of global capitalism that our elected representatives should have protected US from. They didn’t. That process increased on both sides of the Pacific and the Commies sent their kids to the West to learn capitalism in OUR schools. George W. Bush sealed our fate (f#cking traitor) by allowing 42,400 factories to transfer offshore during his Presidency, and the milliuons of jobs that went with them.

        Do you really think it is fair to expect Americans to compete with slave labor or labor rates at 40 cents an hour?

        When the Dutch traded $24 dollars worth of trinkets for Manhatten Island we laughed at the Indians for a bad deal. But the Indians had never seen manufactured glass, steel, or beads, so they thought the trade was fair. And it was for them. It was a meeting of the minds in a fair transactions. It was a win win scenario. That $24 worth of trinkets were peanuts to the Dutch, to the Indians these products were highly valued.

        What is fair about “free trade” that transfers American’s wealth to other nations? And who asked US if WE thought it was fair? Why should we open OUR markets to others and not put tarrifs on these products to create a level playing field for OUR citizens? When it is OUR citizens making the world safe for BIG Business?

        If the Chinese don’t like it, they can pay their workers minimum wages of 7-8.oo per hour like WE do, and we can start competing on a level playing field. As it is the NWO is moving rapidly to enfranchise the great middle class of America so that they can spread unfettered capitalism with soaring, enormous profits for them and theirs.

        This will end by ballot or bullet. The choice will be made in Washington DC.

      64. Comments…..You know what people,the republicans always point at the democrats and the democrats are always pointing at the republicans you know the right vs the left what people have not figured out yet is that they are both connected to the SAME BODY! so it become a matter of preference being slapped by the right or the left hand!Name one politician who ever introduced a single bill into law which stated giving back your American FREEDOMS in the last 30 or even 40 years??? They both have failed us miserably! Now Gov.Scott Walker is going to sic his national guard against his on people for a protest lol! Maybe he needs to watch Egypt one more time and he should notice that the people of Egypt had only a very few fire arms at their disposal that will not be the case here in US. They will run his ass right out town and I for one wont blame them.

      65. 64 posts here so far, and IMO the only one that is on point is from Blacksheep.  (Granted, many strong points made regarding politics, unions etc).

        This type of string is EXACTLY what TPTB are hoping for… Anti-unionists yelling at the unionists, teachers from different states arguing with teachers from Wisconsin, rhetorical attacks regarding the Governor of Wis as a de-facto dictator, and everyone digging in, proffering their “solution” to the “problem.”

        As that is going on, they are kicking back, blowing smoke rings from an expensive cigar, cackling through a divisive grin.

        I think I can bow-tie this one up pretty tight…”You can’t pay with what you don’t have.”  There is NOTHING any state legislature can do to fix their budgets at this point.  NOTHING.  Yes, it appears to all that Wisconsin is trotting out an aggressive austerity plan to “fix” their financial mess, but that ship sailed long ago…Heck just this week, South Carolina floated a test balloon to see if they could print their own state currency…

        I’ve read on this board (and many others) “No way they attempt to take us out, we’ve got over 80 million gun owners!”  Well, it won’t be too hard when all of those guns are pointed at each other…Think I’m wrong, just read 63 of the 64 posts above (sans Blacksheep’s of course…and Durango’s @ 8:15 wasn’t too far off either, except for that he suggests his list is the result of bad party politics vs intentionally implanted).

        Don’t get distracted folks.  And as impassioned as Mark Levin’s rant was, it is immaterial as Obama couldn’t even sit at the kid’s table of the group that truly runs the world…To suggest that he is the architect of such ludicrous policies is myopic at best.  (For those of you who still believe POTUS is the most powerful man in the world….)

        Bankruptcy, dollar collapse, chaos, despondancy/hopelessness, a new plan, a new way, a New World Order…There’s your cycle.  Now why does anyone think the Wisconsin teacher unions have anything to do with that?

        Distraction…palpable distraction.  Stay focused.

      66. Yourdaddy; make no mistake daddy just showing how complicit OUR elected, paid representatives are with respect to the problems that the NWO of GB is imposing on US, when they should be representing OUR interests and not the gangster banksters.

        OBTW, thats “disenfranchised” in the previous post I made.

      67. One member here asked where in the business world one could make 40,000 a year for working 5 days a week for 9 months(like educators do).  If only it were that simple.  Not included in your estimate is the number of hours required for planning and grading.  During my time in K-12 education, I NEVER had a week with under 60 hours of work.  As a professor, my weeks are never less than 40 hours of work, and most are much longer.   I am one of few conservative educators (I find most educators do not believe the way I do!), and I want to make it clear that I in no way agree with the educators in Wisconsin; I believe they should pay for a portion of their retirement and health care, and they should tighten their belts, just as everyone else has had to.  They definitely exhibit an “entitlement” mentality, and they should realize they are entitled to NOTHING!!  Those who lied and were absent should be held accountable, and those who “brought” learners with them to protest should face severe consequences.  What I do not agree with is those who actually believe that any educator who does their job is only working 40 hours a week for 9 months of the year.  As a conservative and a competent educator, I am also a big fan of getting the lazy and incompetent teachers out of our classrooms–there are far too many!!

      68. yourdaddy-
        I hope you and all those other paranoid, it’s-the-end-of-the-world, NWO-is-after-us-all, conspiracy theorist types are as wrong about everything as you appear to be. Any rational thinking person would see that your vision of the future being filled with doomsday and chaos is just not possible here in Amerika.  We’ve got rights. We can vote. We’ve got guns. It couldn’t possibly happen here. What really scares the crap out of me though is the constant nagging feeling I get  that tells me you aint that far from the truth. The doomers seem to be getting more sensible every day. The deniers are the ones who look like the nutty ones nowadays. By the way- if anybody hears from mushroom, tell him I’ve defected and gone over to the dark side. I’ll use my crisp new ten dollar bills to start the fire in my woodstove come TEOTWAKI. Ha!

      69. Ok. Durango’s clarification noted.

        62 of 64 posts are now off-topic in this string.  🙂

        “A house divided cannot stand. ”

        Wisconsin, what say you?

      70. Love the satire SmokinOkie.  Good sense of humor!  But out of deference to Mushroom, no need to go there…Keep the $10 FRN sacred.  🙂

        Not to interject too much levity into your comical post, but honestly, no “doomer” here.  While many will disagree or ignore me on this point, what we are about to face is God’s Perfect Justice.  However, because God is defined as “Love” he is also consumed with Perfect Mercy.  As humans, we cannot reconcile the existence of these two within the same being.  He can.

        So, via the third person of the Trinity, The Holy Spirit has been going door to door clamoring for everyone to PREPARE.  Some hear him, some don’t.  All I can tell you is when he has completed his act of mercy, his right arm of Justice will swing (aka “Doom” in your definition).  While I won’t say I welcome his justice, I won’t be fighting it either…

        As a human race, our lights are going dim, and our lamps are almost out of oil…we’ve grown very dark .  Allow me to offer some examples.  Feel free to add to or disagree at your discretion.

        -There is very little love shared with neighbor (heck, just look at how some treat others on this board alone.. and we’re supposed to be like minded to boot!).
        -There is very little respect left (especially with our youth)
        -We’ve been trying to remove God from the public square for decades.
        -Greed and corruption are not only rarely punished, but rewarded.
        -There are violent tensions between races, genders, social classes, countries
        -Values such as sacrifice, self-control, ethical character and standing for what is right are foreign concepts.  In fact, most electing a life-style with these values will be regarded as, “judgemental or hypocritical.”
        -Litigation runs rampant (Corporate, Civil, Criminal)
        -The sacred institution of marriage has been re-defined as “any two people who love each other.”  Who needs a stinkin’ piece of paper anyway…Let’s just live together in a civil union, it’s the same thing…(Let me assure you, in the eyes of our Lord…It’s not).
        -The race to capture, understand & control Stem Cells has become Machivelian to where we’ll kill (i.e. harvest) the unborn for our “possible” future benefit.
        -Families are broken all over the place.
        -Sexual deviancy is choking the world to high Heaven.  Internet pornography is a multi-billion dollar industry and has been for many years.  (And is one of the root causes of the point made directly above this one).
        -And Mike Hukabee is absolutely correct.  Just recently, he said, “That the most important issue facing us as a nation is abortion” (the holocaust of the unborn-phrase mine).  More important then “the economy” or “The fiscal budget.”  A world that will kill their defenseless children while in-utero to promote and defend the satanic euphemism of “Choice” has lost its way.

        The blood of these martyrs CRIES out for justice…

        And it looks like they’re about to get their wish.

        PS (The good news here is that when he’s finished levying his hand of Justice, ALL men will know & worship him…the way it was originally intended…I’m just hoping I can make it that far.  If not, see you on the other side.  First cup of coffee is on me.   🙂 )

      71. To say that unions  make up less than 15% of  entire work force, so they aren’t the problem … That misses the whole point of whats going in with the states being on the verge of bankrupcy. The major causes of the states budget deficts are directly caused by public employee salaries, benifits and pension programs. It’s estimated that cost of state employee wages, benifits and pensions for California are consuming about 80% of their budget ( this percentage comes by removing revenue received by the state that is “pass through” revenue – money that is passed directly to local governments ).  The national average for public employees unionized was 36% in 2010. Don’t have the exact number for California state workers, but I would assume it’s higher than 36%. There is no reasonable arguement to have any public employees unionized.  Are we to believe that without unions, the police, fire and sanitaion departments would be hiring children and only paying them 50 cents an hour? When I lived in California, warnings were raised 15 years ago about the devastating effects to come when the state would no longer be able to pay the benefit and pension packages in the years to come. So why on earth would politician after polictician continue to allow the state to enter into these budget busting compensation packages?  Because they would be garanteed millions in donations from the unions and assured another term in office.

      72. Comments…..I’m a state employee (not Wisconsin) and I work extremely hard for my measly paycheck.  I’m a single mom who was out of work a couple of years ago so applied for a secretary job opening and thankful I got hired so I can support my family.  I work hard every single day and it’s barely enough to make ends meet and upsets me deeply when people put me down.  They just don’t know all of the tons of work I have to do every day, all the while having to keep a fake smile on my face.  I am so totally stressed and exhausted!
        Blessings to all.  

      73. The unions are not the problem. Average teacher makes between 40 to 60 thousand a year. That’s not a lot of money when have someone with a degree.  Benefits have been cut back, pays of been frozen. To adjust for the coast of living and merely maintain the current living standard these workers need to make between 50 to 70 thousand a year. Yes, they are being UNDER PAID as it is. 

        just 40 years ago americans who live comfortably on a single income. Now it takes 2 incomes just to maintain the same standard of living and many of that is also substituted with credit cards and further debt.  min wage should be 12 dollars an hour today.    

        the unions do still have some ability to bargin but that power is fading fast. And private sector means nothing today since all good paying jobs are being outsourced to India, china and other nations where wages are cheaper due to our crooked banksters and thier own greed.

        I don’t blam them for striking and I hope to see more people organizing into unions either official or not and standing up to the cuts. It’s not a matter of entitlements but rather a matter of maintaining what little we have left before we become a nation of slaves.

      74. Cindy- a lot of people work hard for their money. And the way the economy has tanked, there’s been plenty of suffering to go around. But if you want to be upset about something,  think of this- The amount of your pay check is directly affected by the resources your employer, in your case the state, has available. I’d be very pissed if I saw other employees making twice as much as me protesting and screeming bloody murder because they would now be required to pay for a small percentage of their benifits, or because they are being told that keeping their job could now depend on how well  they do their job. 
        I can’t speak for everyone here, but I’m not putting you down because you’re a state employee. I fully understand that many state jobs are necessary and it’s commendable you are doing all you can do for your family.I hope only the best for you, but that won’t happen if your state goes bankrupt because of it can no longer pay the wages and benefits of those that don’t work hard like you do.

      75. Here’s a story that you guys might find interesting:


        This is an  area of the NE where I grew up. In the local news yesterday, the reports are, that most of the police officers are now marching on city hall. And the city sent about a dozen and a half of the newest recruits packing with their pinkslips in hand.

        So you have a police force not patrolling the streets, but rather BLOCKING them. OK, they had a major point to make. I get it. But you’ll also see, that none of the remaining ’employed’ officers were willing to take concessions to save their brothers. That’s interesting to me. They’d rather demand that these rookies keep their jobs, that the city keep paying them with what they don’t have, rather than personally sacrificing to make that happen.

        And as a personal anecdote, when I was growing up, one of my best friends became a firefighter. I think we were all about 21 or 22 at the time. I came to learn from him, that after 20 years of service, no matter your age, you got to retire with 80% of your total income. For life! So at 42, my friend was retired from the department, making more than most people make in their working lives!

        I’m not knocking him. There might have even been a little envy there, as I toiled at my own job for some unknown period in my future.

        But the kicker to that was, they averaged the last 3 years (?) of their income, to base the 80% formula upon. And this included any OT they could rack up! So a firefighter making $60k a year during his working years, could potentially double that if he could wrangle the OT hours. And really pump up the last 3 years of income, which would remain to be paid for an eternity!

        So the point is, this stuff is rampant. And what happens when all that gets pulled away from under them? Now that he’s retired, with no backup plan that I know of, how safe is that cushy pension? And how will he and others react when it’s all they thought they needed? There is about to be some unbelievable battles going forth, in every community. This is just a glimpse of the next brush fire. No pun intended.

        p.s. Every community in this area has also found its entire snow removal fund depleted! None of the cities have any idea how they will pay for any new storms. So add that stress to the mix.

      76. p.p.s. In case the irony was lost on anyone, my old community has potential legacy costs of $80-100k/yr (for life) for retired firefighters, yet cannot afford to clear snow from its streets. I think that is the very definition of unsustainable. God help all those that find these pensions null and void in the days to come.

      77. The Mississippi P.E.R.S. requires that an employee contribute 7.25% of your paycheck into the system. Why is that so horrible to these union employees that they have to contribute anything to their own pension.

      78. Sad comments today…I’m wondering when someone is going to blame teachers for the ignorance and hatred exhibited by most posters on this article.  Just like a school of sharks after one smells some blood.  Gotta find something else reading…

      79. Sad comments today…I’m wondering when someone is going to blame teachers for the ignorance and hatred exhibited by most posters on this article.  Just like a school of sharks after one smells some blood.  Gotta find something else to read!

      80. Thanks SMOKINOKIE for the laughs, your satire was hilarious. And Thank you Yourdaddy for the awesome post….your posts always bring me back to what’s most important and that lifts me up, which is hard to do these days with the constant news as it is.

      81. Debintex: I was the one who posted that comment and frankly I anticipated that response from a teacher. First, with summers off, Thanksgiving vacation, Christamas vacation, Spring break, MLK holiday, labor Day , memorial day, veterans day, presidents day etc, it really comes down to about 8 months a year. Oh, did I mention SNOW days?

        I appreciate some long hours during the week, but managers in the private sector do that all the time without extra pay too. And ALL year long! How much planning do you need when a teacher teaches the same stuff to a new group of kids every year?

        Sorry Deb, no sympathy for teachers here. Our schools are a shambles, money doesn’t help, and the kids for the most part are failing to keep pace internationally. It may be the fault of parents too, but hey teachers have to be held accountable for a pathetic product!

      82. SmokinOkie: I’m thinking mushroom got busted trying to pass all of those crisp new ten dollar bills he was printing. Just saying.

      83. Durango,

        First, I am not in support of these educators, and I totally agree that sympathy is not warranted.  All of us must “tighten our belts.”  

        I have to ask, have you ever taught?? I would guess not, otherwise, you would know that snow days are made up on other holidays or at the end of the school year–they are not simply discarded, unless a district applies for a waiver through the state. 

        If you have not taught I respectfully suggest that you have no idea what goes on inside the school walls today.  I would love to be a fly on the wall as you grade 120+essays over a weekend simply to make sure your learners get the feedback they need to become competent writers, and then hear your perspective; for educators who actually teach, this is regular practice.

        Regarding your analogy to private sector managers, I am sure you recognize that many of  those managers  receive performance bonuses, while many educators do not–and those managers are free to FIRE poor performing employees; educators have no choice about the learners they teach or the materials of which those “products,” as you called them, are made.  As such, where a manager can discard faulty products to get an outstanding end result, an educator cannot. Crap in–crap out–with only few exceptions.   As another educator noted, you cannot imagine the stress of dealing with “faulty products” on a daily basis and trying to meld them into some semblance of an educated human being.  

        On a positive note, I totally agree with your statement that our schools are in shambles, simply realize that , in general, educators are inadequately compensated for the number of hours worked.  If you have not taught, you do not know. I will end on that note…We will simply have to agree to disagree.

      84. “Educators” are more than adequately compensated by taxpayers for the number of hours they work and the job that they do. In fact a poll here, I suspect, would agree overwhemingly with that observation.

        If “educators” are so inadequately compensated as you suggest, I suggest they go out and start a business of their own instead of doing the taxpayers the favor of working for less than they are worth!

      85. I agree DK, they are paid pretty well with very good benefits and a pension program that is just unrealistic and unsustainable. Crabbing about long hours??? I think the summer makes up for that. And if your still not satisfied, find another line of work. Like C Christie in NJ said “I am not making you be a teacher”
        People know what they are going to school for and if you go into a career not knowing what your getting into then you should of done more homework….JMHO
        Having said that I don’t like the Guard being called in, and think that should set any American a little on edge. I don’t like all bargaining tools dismantled either, otherwise I fear the pendulum swing back the other way…..wish everyone could agree in the middle to what’s right and fair.
        I say demand them all back to work immediately or they are fired. Once back to work, reprimand them for such unprofessional and irresponsible behavior. Then find the ones that “took” the kids with them and arrest them for child endangerment and/or kidnapping. Renegotiate  a new more realistic deal in light of the times, if union is unwilling to be reasonable, lock them out and hire new. National Guard isn’t necessary either, call the state police and locals and have them stand by only unless violence broke out, then arrest them. Problems all solved ??

      86. Comments…..Walkers bill exempts the police, state trooper, and fire unions.

      87. Oh how I wanted to stay out of this fray, but try tp play psyops on me jusy pisses me off.

        Whenever someone drags up the “chi..” word, I know they are trying to force a guilt trip on me. I was an NCO in the army. I had to deal with the ash and trash who graduated from the “chi..” institute of learning. Keep in mind that we hire the least qualified to teach the “chi…”.  Straight out of college and no work or life experience. STFU

        Unions and benefits. Let us assume I hire Joe at an houly cost of $20. His labor needs to earn me a gross income of say $30 per hour in order for me to get a ROI of say 6% after all costs.

        I take all the financial risks, but bring in collective bargaining and my ROI drops. How on earth can we support the idea that the employee has a right to my earnings above what I offer? In a natural system, if my offer is too low I fail to attract and retain the best employees.  As the person with the financial stake, should I NOT have the right to hire and fire in keeping with me having the sole right  to decide on the efficiency of the operation?

        I have been in unions, been a company man in union shops and owned/operated businesses.  I can say with certainty that the issue is all about security. Job security, health, retirement and wage. We have effectively used unions as social insurance. It failed long ago and now we collectively are facing the coming shit-storm.

        Now add in the inflation hiding component provided by off-shore manufacturing and the general public never saw this coming storm. Folks, we moved into the age of consumerism in the ’50s. We moved continuously toward an ownership society fueled by debt. In order to keep consumables reasonably priced, we had to reduce costs. All tax revenues are paid by the consumer. Reduce consumption and we reduce velocity of money resulting in reduced tax revenues.
        Now look at unionized government employees. They produce a marginal service at best. In many areas, privatization has resulted in reduced costs and only slightly reduced services. The reduced services component was typically in the customer relations dept. Private companies aren’t gonna wipe your whiny nose or pat your back.

        You fail to report for work, here is your final paycheck.  No, fire them all. De-certify the unions. Eliminate collective bargaining because it never helped ME!!! My labors helped collective bargaining by raising the average productivity per employee. And in every union shop, there were a substantial number of marginals that retained their job only because of the union.
        BTW, I am the final word on my children’s education. And why would I pay more for a 3rd grade teacher with a masters than one with a bachelors? Why are we paying for in-service days without students and those days being counted for instructional days.

        If you don’t like the hours, pay or benefits, find another line of business. In 15 years of formal education, I can count the really good teachers on one hand. As an example, in all my college math classes, the instructor was so poor that I asked for and got the approval to self-pace and test out. Algebra 1,2 and Geometry done in 10 weeks. My high school calculus teacher was so bad, my cumulative math GPA went from 3.8 to 2.8 in one year. And he was the shop steward.

        My daughters left the local high school because they felt it was a waste of time. One to the job corps and my youngest to a residence high school where she excelled. She now has children and is finishing her degree. I bring this up because she is having problems with the teacher corps or is it corpse.

        I hold hookers in higher esteem than teachers. They are paid by performance not some fool merit system where everyone mysteriously has merit. If everyone gets merit pay, perhaps the bar is set too low? But wait a minute!

        Teach to a standard, right? And if the teacher fails, what? Try again next year? Hired for 3rd year and twamzonko, tenure.
        Here is the reality. I can and have taught better than most all the teachers I have ever been around. I demand self-discipline from the student. Failure on their part results in termination of my services. Tough shit!
        Governor Walker, drive on. Maybe PoS* Governor Parnell (R-Ak) will learn something from you.
        * Piece of Sh..

      88. OTE: Typically from my experience, a worker must generate 3 times the revenue that they are paid hourly, so that if you pay someone $20 an hour, they need to generate $60.

        My rule of thumb.

      89. @DurangoKidd: Thank you for addressing my comment.  I appreciate the discussion, as I typically lurk only.

        I understand and see your point.  It would be interesting to see your take on Porter Stansberry’s article on this- it really opened my eyes to the sheer numbers involved with unionization.

        On another note, I used to work in aerospace, and we were dealing with the remnants of unionized labor.  Because of all of the union bureaucracy, the productivity level was dismal.  Most of the union shop guys were itching to get out of the union, as it stifled their ability to move up the workforce ladder.  Additionally, rewards were based on tenure and not merit, which did little for motivation.  Add in affirmative action (which was mostly a problem because certain genders and races knew that they would not get fired) and the program I was on was one of the least productive. If the industry had functioned like this in the 50s and 60s America would never have gotten to the moon. 

        As a California resident, it is increasingly apparent that the public unions have a large hand in the demise of the economic situation  currently.  Not sure how it is in other states, but unfortunately most public employees are the least productive people, and are rewarded with pensions and many benefits those of us in private industry are not afforded.  As for myself, two degrees in engineering and industry experience are not enough to find a decent paying job in my field.  As a result, I have taken to free-lancing.  Any time I am not working, I am technically unemployed, and I do not receive state benefits for being so.  Taking responsibility for oneself is a fantastic lesson and has taught me to live within my means.  The problem, it seems, with entitlements is that human nature has a tendency to forget how to be self-sufficient.

        Agreed on your points of global offshoring- much of the work in my field in particular has moved to India and China.  Until tariffs are re-instated, this problem will persist.  It will take many to realize however that they will need to give up the convenience of cheap, mass produced goods and sometimes do without.  Unfortunately at this moment it seems that a catastrophe will necessitate that action for most.  It is said that human nature has a tendency to change only when it is at the very precipice of disaster.

        Have a great day and thank you again for the conversation.

      90. Clarification: In the third paragraph:

        “As a California resident, it is increasingly apparent that the public unions have a large hand in the demise of the economic situation *in California* currently. “

      91. @DurangoKidd: Thank you for addressing my comment.  I appreciate the discussion, as I typically lurk only.

        I understand and see your point.  It would be interesting to see your take on Porter Stansberry’s article on this- it really opened my eyes to the sheer numbers involved with unionization.

        On another note, I used to work in aerospace, and we were dealing with the remnants of unionized labor.  Because of all of the union bureaucracy, the productivity level was dismal.  Most of the union shop guys were itching to get out of the union, as it stifled their ability to move up the workforce ladder.  Additionally, rewards were based on tenure and not merit, which did little for motivation.  Add in affirmative action (which was mostly a problem because certain genders and races knew that they would not get fired) and the program I was on was one of the least productive. If the industry had functioned like this in the 50s and 60s America would never have gotten to the moon. 

        As a California resident, it is increasingly apparent that the public unions have a large hand in the demise of the economic situation  in California currently.  Not sure how it is in other states, but unfortunately most public employees are the least productive people, and are rewarded with pensions and many benefits those of us in private industry are not afforded.  As for myself, two degrees in engineering and industry experience are not enough to find a decent paying job in my field.  As a result, I have taken to free-lancing.  Any time I am not working, I am technically unemployed, and I do not receive state benefits for being so.  Taking responsibility for oneself is a fantastic lesson and has taught me to live within my means.  The problem, it seems, with entitlements is that human nature has a tendency to forget how to be self-sufficient.

        Agreed on your points of global offshoring- much of the work in my field in particular has moved to India and China.  Until tariffs are re-instated, this problem will persist.  It will take many to realize however that they will need to give up the convenience of cheap, mass produced goods and sometimes do without.  Unfortunately at this moment it seems that a catastrophe will necessitate that action for most.  It is said that human nature has a tendency to change only when it is at the very precipice of disaster.

        Have a great day and thank you again for the conversation.

      92. The existence of unions has meant better pay and benefits and even working conditions for many non-union workers.  When Reagan took over the presidency, 27% of our workforce was union. He hated unions, so he went after air traffic controllers, people who help keep air travel safe….rather stupid,  I think.  He also started outsourcing our jobs to China.  Lots of factory workers were union.   Bush’s 8 years saw 42,000 more factories close. Why? Because the republicans chose to give extra tax incentives to companies that would offshore jobs.  Today, only 7% of our workers are union.  Of course, while Reagan and Bush were breaking unions, they also hurt thousands of workers who were NOT.  The CONS really don’t care about more jobs for Americans. In fact, they have done absolutely nothing for jobs.  Besides that, they decided to work 2 weeks, then take a week off, calling it a “constituent” week.  They are not qualified to run the House or Senate and have already made many mistakes in their efforts in the House.
        Wisconsin Governor Walker should be blamed for the deficit. The state was hyeading towards a $130,000,000 surplus.  He chose to give $140,000,000 in tax breaks to the wealthy,  then try blaming state workers for the deficit.  The facts I have given prove that he is just another dishonest Republican. They constantly lie to people, just like the right-wing talk show hosts.  Those hosts are paid BIG $$$$$ to LIE to their listeners.  You can’t trust Hannity, Beck, Savage, O’Reilly or Limbaugh. The last one has been paid about $2,000,000,000 over the years to speak for the wealthy and the right-wing in general.  MONEY CORRUPTS  those who have no souls!  That includes the billionaire Koch brothers.

      93. These unioin scum!  There needs to be hundreds of thousands of unemployed former gubment “workers”.  The government produces little of value, and what it produces efficiently is dependancy with no accountability!! 

      94. Why would the above comment need to be changed?  You don’t like the facts that it contains?

      95. Calling in sick to go protest is fraud. 

        I heard some of the students protested at their closed schools with signs saying “what about us?”.  They are upset because they won’t get out for summer on time. 

      96. Is it GRIL or GIRL? Anyway, don’t lurk. Intelligent comments are always a treat here. 🙂

        There is much to be said for and against unions and those of US that have lived long enough have seen both sides. Whether one is for or against unions, the issue of economic fairness must be addressed in America, and NOW!

        I am a professional (from the wrong side of the tracks) that makes his own way at great personal sacrifice. I don’t say that to complain only to explain that I understand the arguments for and against.

        Even offshoring some manufacturing had its purpose, which was to avoid n-war with the Red Chinese. That purpose has been more than served. Balance needs to be restored again in America and that requires a level playing field.

        If the average worker in America must compete against Chinese workers making 40 cents and hour, then teachers, police, and government workers; especially in Congress, need to be competing against their counterparts in China too!

        Whats good for the geese is good for the ganders because the geese pay for the ganders. Its time for special priviledges for government servants to disapear: at every level. If they don’t like it let them compete in the marketplace like the rest of US.

        We need to start with the gangster banksters, Congress, and work our way down. Ganster banksters need to be paying a “franchise fee” to operate every year because they have a banking monopoly.

        Congress needs to give US their health care and retirement program or they need be in ours. Fair is fair. No justice, No peace!!!!!!!!!!!!

      97. Hi DurangoKidd, and again, thank you for the discussion. I appreciate the welcome.  It should have been “GIRL”- a nickname I garnered being the only female in a laboratory during my engineering internship many moons ago.  I’ve outgrown the title, surely, but it stuck.

        Absolutely agreed that the branches of government/banking cartels are the real problem.  In this case absolute power has absolutely corrupted.  Additionally the governmental regulations at the state level have become unconstitutional and need to be addressed. However, until some critical mass of people begin to recognize the root of this problem, not much can be addressed.  It seems that the problem has gotten so out of control that it can no longer be remedied through traditional means (elections).  This last vote on the Patriot Act has shown us who has already been bought off, which is disappointing to say the least.  It does seem however that Ron Paul and his movement are gaining steam, which seems to be a step in the right direction.

        As for industry, it does make sense to offshore some manufacturing, and either way it has already happened.  The real problem is that with the manufacturing goes the technology, and this is a real detriment to American industry.  The best and brightest scientific minds here invent fantastic technologies only to send them off to another country to steal.  After my time in American aerospace I worked for a well-known Japanese technology company, and it was interesting to see how little was invented.  Rather, the company would “re-engineer” (aka steal) technology from Silicon Valley start-ups.  Americans really are some of the best at inventions and innovations, and it would be a shame to lose this strength.

        I would like to hear your ideas on how offshoring manufacture averted a nuclear war with China.  This is the first I’ve heard of this idea, (I always, likely incorrectly, assumed it was a financial decision), and I would like to learn more.

        The real detriment to offshoring is that many great mechanical minds in America will no longer have opportunity to develop their talents.  In my area (southern California), almost every other job advertisement in the tech/engineering fields would prefer bilingual employees (typically Mandarin or Hindi and English). 

        Agreed that the marketplace needs to be just, across the board.  Interestingly when I worked aerospace many thought we, since we were on government contracts, were the Golden Calf.  It was shown that we were not.  Eventually if the government can find a way to offshore government positions they likely will also. 

        In reading an interesting comment above, I must concur that perhaps this is all a ploy to get us serfs to turn against each other. The real strength will be in working together, against the true criminals, as you have already identified.

        Thank you again for the conversation, and hope you have a pleasant evening.

      98. GIRL: Capitalism and communism are diametrically opposed. Even Russian communism was more socialism than communism after Stalin. Maoist communism was as radical as it gets.

        Russia and China split. Russia perceived China as a real threat and rightly so, because it was too radical. Russia wanted to nuke Red China while it was still an imature power and brought the idea up to US. We said “No”, because at that time the US would have received the fallout and we would all be dead. That was in the days before neutron bombs.

        Nixon sent Kissenger to engage the Chinese about Viet Nam, but also about joining the world community recognizing that without communication and some level of co-operation, isolation and conflict would result plunging all of the world into nuclear war.

        Eventually, Red China replaced Tiawan on the UN Security Council. After the death of Mao and internal strife that sent intellectuals into the fields, China regained its footing and was struggling to modernize. This effort was stimulated by the success Reagan had with Gorby, and then Yeltsin after him that brought Russia into more co-operation with the West.

        George Bush Sr, was Director of the CIA and then Ambassador to China and engaged the Chinese to join capitalism as communism had clearly failed to feed China and make it a great nation. With new Chinese leadership at this time looking to actually raise the Chinese peasants to a higher standard of living, the die was cast to experiment with special economic zones in Shanghai as a way to introduce the Chinese to capitalism. These zones where widly successful.

        The Red Chinese sent scores of people to the world money centers, particularly London to study and analyse the financial markets for more than a decade and honed their skills in finance. At the same time the Communist Party Leaders sent their kids to the West to learn western management, finance, etc. When they finished their MBAs and Phd’s they came home to run new factories built by NWO capitalists. Using stock, options, and warrants, these managers became the wealthy upper class in China.

        We also tranferred the w-88 warhead to them so that the major n-powers, US, Russia,China, India, NATO would all have neutron bombs so that any conflict breaking out among others would not poison the entire planet, particularly US as it is perceived in some circles that competion and proximity are likely to breed conflict as India and China mature.

        By locking ourselves into the Chinese we become the natural market for them, and them US, eventually, as parity is reached.

        Having crushed Russian communism, unfettered capitalism made its way to China under the banner of “Free Trade”, a philosophy never before uttered between nations in the West. It was intended to transfer some American wealth to China to bring it into the modern world and of course make the international banksters enormously wealthy.

        George Bush Sr proclaimed a NWO as President to justify the transfer of American means of production offshore talking about American ‘competitiveness, rather than explaining that American workers would have to compete with slave labor and workers who made 20 cents an hour.

        That mantra of ‘Free trade” and American “competitiveness” which continue to this day is a cover for the gangster banksters who have gotten uber rich exploiting the Chinese workers. Like the Indians in Manhatten, the Chinese worker who pays 50% of his earnings for food thinks they have a pretty good deal: and it is when the alternative was the mass starvation of tens of millions of people.

        What started as an idea to bring China into the family of nations has blossomed into a Frankenstein economy for American citizens because the Congress has not put a limit on the transfer of American production offshore. Enough is enough.

        When you add the encouragement of 30 million illegals into the employment picture for US citizens (think supply side economics) suppressing and stealing the jobs of Amercans with OUR governments consent you understand that these developments are intended to destroy the middle class inn America, leaving only the rich and the poor; with the poor fending for themselves without the protection that their elected representatives (who have created a separate cozy economic environment for themselves) should have provided.

        The intent now is to bankrupt and indebt the American people while transferring the means of protection offshore, making the uber rich insanely wealthy using taxpayer funds as free cash flow to Big Business. Its a crack head financial high of insatiable greed as the rich cannot spend or even invest their vast sums wisely.

        With unrestrained Illegal immigration the NWO uber rich hope to over ride the US Constitution by REFERENDUM using 50 million “new Americans” of latino decent to impose the NAU upon US. Its a crafty strategy that has been exposed and the truth about “illegal Immigration” is now widely known.

        READ: SHTF Illegal Immigration for an education.

      99. Durango Kidd,

        Thank you for the education on the origin of offshoring. Surely many (including myself) had no idea of the complexity of this issue, although now that you have so thoroughly explained it, it seems to make perfect sense.  Things never are as they seem. The part about the w-88 warhead in particular I have not heard before.  Might I ask where I can find further information on this? Is there a book available that goes further in depth? This topic is fascinating.

        The portion about illegal immigration does make perfect sense and I had derived much of this before.  Living in southern California, where sometimes it seems every other person is an illegal immigrant from a Latin country, one gets used to the idea that California is really part of Mexico.  Unfortunately the vitriol gets spewed at the immigrants, when in reality it should be directed at the uber-rich bankers that would profit from the NAU. 

        Your explanations are much appreciated. Thank you for taking the time to write such a comprehensive answer to my simplistic question. Next read will be the SHTF on Illegal Immigration. Best Regards.

      100. GIRL: You won’t read about the W 88 warhead story in any book anytime soon. That secret was passed by a Chinese American scientist at Los Alamos to the Chinese, with American govt consent. in much the same way as sensitive n-triggers were “mistakenly” sent to Taiwan.

        Accidents like these do not happen with N-warheads and technology.

      101. Read top headlines here:   http://www.drudgereport.com/


        The total compensation of a West Bloomfield teacher grew 173 percent over an 11-year period, going from $47,346 to $129,637, according to information that was presented at a school board meeting in December.
        The teacher’s salary started at $31,881 in 1999-00 and grew to $85,836 in 2010-11. Meanwhile, insurance payments climbed from $9,309 to $19,304 per year, and retirement contributions jumped from $3,717 to $16,854 per year.”

      102. One of the best arguments detailing the problem with public employees can be found here

        Notice what FDR had to say about Public Unions.

        Wisconsin has been blowtorched. Bulldozed and empty factories, abandoned houses, overflowing homeless shelters, crime ever increasing. The Public Union created tax hell and killed the goose that layed the golden egg. The whole economy needs to be reset to $8-10/hr minimal benefits jobs. What can the taxpayers then afford? Economic collapse is coming, we can do it in a spirit of cooperation and share the pain, or in a total collapse and chaos. My preperations bet on the latter.

        Consider… yes, much more cost cutting needs to be done, but when such a mild and simple proposal can’t make it through, and everyone cries, go for someone else… it’s going the total collapse with chaos, mass death and destruction. I’m prepared. Are you?

      103. Not sure about any warheads, but one little ditty hit the news and conspiracy theorists trot it out every now and then.

        Motorala went into the satellite phone business. Yep folks, they were the first commercial sat phone provider. As I recall it was the Iridium system.

        Anyway, service was expensive and the primary customer was Dept of Defense. A problem arose, not enough money and NASA launch fees were going out of sight. Motorola appealed to the White House and Congress.

        The result was POTUS Clinton transfered missle guidance systems to China. In return, Motorola got the rest of the Iridium constellation boosted to orbit by China at cut-rate prices. Clinton got reamed by the public over this.

        The rest of the story? The Iridium system went bankrupt. Motorola was out of the satellite phone business for the time being and another company bought Iridium at firesale prices, something like $0.04 on the $1. 

        In bankruptsy, capital losses are written off with only a tax deduction to show for it. Keep in mind that the lost tax revenue from the deduction must be made up for by the rest of the consumers.
        GIRL, thanks for using the term “critical mass” in describing political movements. Anytime a group cooperates to effect change it is politics. Few realize that for any endeavour, there has to be a minimum number of engaged cooperators. Below this number, participation drops. Pass it and everyone jumps on the bandwagon.
        Another well put point is tenure-based salary increases rather than genuine merit. If a teacher says, “Hey, I can handle another 8 students,” and can still produce the product we the people contracted them to produce, merit pay just might be in order.
        In Alaska, teachers have 2 powerful unions. They use the “chi…” word regularly. Being friends with former and retired teachers, I often heard about why the tenure. Typical reason: to prevent firings over politics. The local school district has bought out more than 1 contract to molify the union and conform to our State Constitutional “right of privacy”.
        NOTE: If considering hiring a former Alaskan, keep in mind that the only thing a past employer in Alaska can legally answer is, “Would you hire this person again?” Their employment history is PRIVATE. Many a past employer has lost in court over violating the “privacy clause” and the piece-of-garbage fired employee walked away rich.

        Such are the effects of  “privacy” being enshrined in the Constitution. I bring this up for a reason. Currently there is a bill introduced in Juneau to mandate placing questions on the Constitution in our 12th grade exit exams as well as mandating the teching of it. It has stalled. Guess who is arguing against it and trotting out wild cost estimates to implement it? And at the same time, NEA-Alaska is lobbying hard for more education monies. The Governor, in a televised news conference, stated that increased education funding over the last several had failed to produce noticeable results.

        Personal obs: The worst teachers return for a Masters in School Administration.  Guess who become administrators and appeal to politicians/public? Guess who are considered the experts? Remember, trust the experts. They are pivy to information we can’t concieve of. Oh yah?
        I concur with so many other posters. Identify and fire the teachers. Decertify all public employee unions. Cut wages and benefits. Let’s just do it the easy way. Decertify the unions and run our schools as a service industry. Business managers run the operation and the product is a qualified graduate. No product, no pay. More product- more pay. Teacher and managerial staff pay based upon performance.

        Oh that’s right. We have unions to prevent such a travesty. Can’t we all just get along? Trust us, it’s for the common good. (Just who decides common good? Oh, and on who’s authority? Can us commoners participate in this process? Okay, I understand it is a credentials issue. Explain to me again about what the red and blue pills do.)

      104. OTE……..you’ve used this a couple times now and I have to ask, whats the “chi” word??


      105. Sorry about that. I made a false assumption. The “chi…” word is children. It is commonly used by passive-aggressives to instill guilt and shame in those foolish enough to question any and all budgets for children’s services such as education, foster homes, headstart, child care, yada, yada. I have yet to meet a teacher in K-12 who isn’t profficient in its use.

        I am not susseptable to its application. In fact, it pisses me off and I counter-attack verbally. They are not my friends and are actually just the hired help. Same as any gov’t employee including our elected representatives. Hired help is supposed to listen to the employer. Unfortunately, the employer is an idiot. Idiot, the incapacity to learn.

        In the case of the US, we are a committee who’s members generally trend towards the idiot side. There are exceptions, but passive-aggression usually keeps them relatively quiet and relegates them to sites like this.

      106. I live in Wisconsin and I would love to hear from others (from this site) who live in Wisconsin. Shoot me an e-mail: [email protected]

      107. Last night I heard on the news  report that Wisconsin doctors were writing back-dated medical papers for the protesting teachers.
        So maybe I have too much time on my hands and I think too much. Does the medical billing support the paperwork? If not, fire the teacher. If the billing supports the paperwork, medical billing fraud. And once proven, fire the teacher and throw them in jail.
        Now if I were an out of work teacher and I was willing to take almost any job that paid enough to survive, I wrangle every bit of video covering the teachers protesting and identify everyone of them I could. Almost instant job openings. Were I a Wisconsin resident, I would do the same. These people were hired to do a job and not draw pay to protest. You are sick in bed or you are teaching. Their pay HAS NOT been cut yet. These protesting teachers are  defrauders of the contract stipulations and are stealing money for every hour they aren’t in the classroom.

        For Wisconsin residents, I haven’t read your state Constitution, but most provide for each assembly in your legislature to have the power to discipline its members up to and including expulsion. I would ask “Why are the democrats not facing disciplinary actions by the legislature?”

        Oops, forgot that the herd mentality exists in Wisconsin just as in Alaska. Never mind.

      108. @overtheedge,

        Thank you for the comments on my response.

      109. @overtheedge,

        Thank you for the comments on my response.  The critical mass idea seems to be supported by the exponentially growing members of society who are gathering information from alternative sources (such as this one) as well as supporting alternative candidates such as Ron Paul.  Have you ever heard of the Hundredth Money concept?  In theory when some critical mass of a monkey population learned a skill, in this case washing potatoes before consumption, monkey populations who had no contact with the original washers spontaneously began washing as well.  Now, there are some questions as to the legitimacy of the original experiment (the monkeys with the potatoes) but it does seem that when an idea hits some critical mass (some might call it the collective unconscious, as Carl Jung did) it will become mainstream and thus overtake older, outdated ideas.  It does seem to explain why in the past similar technologies have been invented at the same time by societies who had no contact with one another.

        To your point about merit pay vs tenure: At one time I had a short-lived relationship with a fellow who was raised in the Communist bloc.  Although a gifted scientist, he struggled in America (and this was during the “good” days of industry).  The problem is, he was raised in a place where one was given housing, food, etc without having to work, and so he resented having to work to provide those things for himself.  As a result, he, and many of his contemporaries, never fully realized their talents, as the incentive to work was secondary to the incentive to think.  Additionally, the work necessary to survive in America was too strenuous for this fellow, and he eventually returned to his home country.  Many of his peers in that country were anxious to have capitalism, but when they saw the amount of work Capitalistic societies require for simple survival, they quickly rescinded many of their original comments.

        In America, (in theory- and perhaps aside from the modern finance industry), we are raised in a meritocracy.  From a young age we are rewarded for good behavior, study habits, etc.  For adult American workers, a professional system which does not function as a meritocracy is counter to everything one learns as a child.  It is disconcerting to have to play by “new rules” suddenly, as is the case with the union or communistic reward systems.  I was raised by a “pull yourself up from your bootstraps” type of family, and as such learned that hard work is it’s own reward.  It seems that the current generation of young Americans has not learned this lesson, due to the progressive “dumbing-down” of the American educational system.  My good friend who is a retired schoolteacher has said that in the last 20 years or so the curriculum has progressively become a play towards the lowest common denominator, and that the “no child left behind” act accelerated this.

        Emotional manipulation does seem to be a commonality when discussing teacher’s unions and social issues these days, but that obscures from the real problems with the current structure. No amount of pulling on heart strings will absolve the fact that the states are broke and no amount of emotionality will create the money needed to provide the unrealistic sums which have been promised for pensions and benefits.  It is unfortunate for many who have worked hard to see the possibility of their benefits disappear, but until we have a society, a critical mass, at a level of conscious enlightenment, these entitlement reward systems will not continue.  As it was in the Communist bloc, for one person who worked hard, there were many who did not as they knew they would not starve or become homeless.  Perhaps a system where the best of the unions and the best of the meritocracy is merged would be the best compromise, but as with anything there will be people who fight against and for all sides. 

        Thanks again for your response to my comments, and I enjoyed reading yours.

      110. Well, I live in WI too. for the first time, I am proud of a governor. The union goons WEAC(teachers) use their own insurance program without any competition-$68 million dollars savings if the plans were put out for competition.
        Teachers unions use kids at marches, whenever there’e a bond issue. If it doesn’t pass the kids are threatened, well there’ll be no football or drama clubs. Plus , I won’t write a reference letter to you for college.
        they contribute to every democrat in the state. AFSCME for all the other government workers and the trial lawyers. Those 3 groups terrorize this state.
        The same dem legislators that ran away to Illinois-dems will do anything to avoid work-last session at a secret midnight meeting raised taxes without any discussion, embezzled money from a patients’ fund contributed by doctors, stole money from that tobacco settlement bullshit and raised taxes and fees on everything from nursing room rates to vehicle registration.
        Walker got his start by ending a pension scam in Milwaukee county. Those fucking scum had retirees making more money on pensions than the scum did while they were working. There’s lots more, google Tom Ament,he’s the scum that Walker beat. 8 years ago.
        Walker’s the best, we’ll support him to the death.

      111. Wisconsin will not be any better off with a CON for governor than it was with its last gov.

      112. I have not gone theu all the comments so If someone has brought the most important fact in this matter up then please forgive the double post. 

        It is a complete conflict of interest for a group of union workers to be able to collectively bragain with the same people they have elected into office. That is basically the same as letting a pack of wolves and  herd of sheep vote on whats for dinner.

        Even 2 of the biggest leftist icons in our history have condemned collective bargaining by government workers.

        AFL-CIO president George Meany once said “It is impossible to bargain collectively with the government.” Even FDR warned that government unions striking against taxpayers is “unthinkable and intolerable”.

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