Rush To Safety: Americans Buy Nearly Half a Billion Dollars Of Gold and Silver In January

by | Jan 30, 2013 | Headline News, Precious Metals | 548 comments

Do you LOVE America?


    While public officials may be ignoring the continued deterioration of our economy, job losses to the tune of hundreds of thousands of people weekly, and the unprecedented demand for government emergency support services like unemployment insurance and food assistance, Americans who sense uncertainty in the air are flocking to the safety of physical resources.

    Our first point of interest is a recent report from the Federal Reserve that indicates some $114 billion dollars in cash was withdrawn from the nation’s largest banks in the last thirty days. Those holding their money at bailed out financial institutions are understandably concerned because the government’s $250,000 deposit insurance guarantee program, originally implemented to restore confidence in the wake of the 2008 financial crisis, expired at the end of 2012. That and the US fiscal situation has never been worse, with one Obama official recently having said the solution to the country’s woes is to simply kill the dollar.

    This suggests investors and cash savers are no longer confident in the purported safety of the country’s “too-big-to-fail” institutions.

    The next obvious question then is, “where did this money go?”

    Part of the mystery may have been unraveled when the US Mint released its latest sales and inventory report.

    According to the mint, investors purchased nearly half a billion dollars in gold and silver in the last 30 days. There was, in fact, so much money shifting into physical precious metals in January that the mint was actually forced to cease operations because they couldn’t meet demand.

    massive 7.4 million Silver Eagles were purchased from the U.S. Mint in January, considerably higher than the previous record from early 2011.

    After halting Silver coin production/sales for over a week, the Mint re-opened yesterday and demand once again surged.

    Having almost doubled from the first week in January, there remains two more days before the book is closed on January’s sales.

    At 140,000 ounces, the Mint has also sold the most ounces of gold in January in almost three years, suggesting the rising ‘currency wars’ are stoking people’s ongoing rotation from paper-to-physical assets as their ‘wealth’ slowing loses its value.

    With a Silver Eagle trading at around $31 per ounce and the gold spot price at near all time highs of $1650, the US Mint saw some $460 million dollars shift into precious metals in the month of January alone.

    What’s equally as interesting, and perhaps a harbinger of the coming chaos, is that the People’s Republic of China is also shifting a large amount of its cash reserves into physical resource based investments that include agriculture, energy, and precious metals, a move that has caused confusion among experts at the United Nations.

    With the political situation in this country rapidly dwindling because of government interference on all levels, a recession for 2013 already baked into the cake, and a global economy on the brink of collapse, there is one primary motivating factor driving money into gold and silver.


    As we’ve seen recently with shortages in emergency food rations and supplies, firearms and magazines, and now gold and silver, Americans are no longer confident in the stability of the system as a whole, and they are diversifying their assets into physical resources that will retain value should the global financial, economic, monetary, and geo-political systems come unhinged.


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      1. Gold & silver shines. REM

        • Folks, keep prepping, forget the pms for now. Suggestion: get your vehicles’ maintenance done while you can afford gas. Brakes, oil, wipers (extra sets of each) additional tires, altenators, brake fluid, batteries, jumper cables, just for starters. Welcome additional thoughts.
          Everybody has an opinion that it’s about to hit (shtf) and I believe it is going to hit warped speed before summer.

          • Forgot to mention; this past weekend’s local gun show, venders sold out of assault rifles within the first hour. One individual sold 15 in 30 minutes.

            • Gold before Sandy Hook – appox $1690

              Gold now -$1679

              Colt LE901 (AR 10) week after Sandy Hook – $2000

              Colt LE901 now (gunbroker/armslist)- $6000 and up (if one can find one)

              Maybe not the case with all “assault” rifles, but it would seem these weapons are worth their weight in gold, so to speak, or maybe more so.

              • It is asinine to spend that much

                • Maybe, if you already own plenty of protection. Imagine having no weapons for protection and you are just now learning of the coming collapse. For a professional wage earner with no firearms, the six grand for a quality weapon (and w/ plenty of ammo) is worth every penny when it comes to protecting life, limb, and property.

                  • I SAID it’s asinine to pay that much for a weapon. A newbie can buy 10 other NICE weapons for that price

                  • Yes, but $6k could buy you 10 good SKS’s with plenty of ammo.

                • “It is asinine to spend that much”

                  That’s what they said when Gold topped $400

                  • Gold is gold–no substitutes. NO need to spend $6k for a weapon.

                • It’s all relative Scott. View the price you pay for a quality firearm the same way you do gold and silver: It’s not the object that is getting more expensive, it’s just the dollar becoming that much more worthless.

                  • The dollar hasn’t devalued that much in a few days!! You’re babbling

                  • You can’t eat Gold. Gold bullets are really expensive. Most people are being raped on gun prices by greedy sellers.Most people that are new to these revelations should be stocking up on medications, food , water things they need to live when SHTF. What really pisses me off is how the prepers will rape their ignorant brethren rather than showing some compation.

                • What part of “barter’ don’t you understand?

                • Totally agree. I laugh at these armchair patriots that think they will do a Chuck Norris or Arnold Schwarzenegger when the bad guys are at the door be they government or goons. (Come to think of it they are the same.) It’s one thing to believe that they will stand up against the lead coming their way, but most will not. If they are at your door, they will likely have more firepower and men than you and will simply burn your house down if pissed off enough, with you and yours in it.

                  Six grand would be better used to store trade goods or necessities that can be shared if you are pushed into the corner. I still believe that the government will confiscate anything they consider a threat, over your dead body if necessary, without a second thought. How long can you survive without water. Nature says 4 days.

                  • @Makati!

                    May the Chains of Tyranny lie softly upon your shoulders and your future generations.


                  • Everyone has to decide for themselves what they want to do.

                  • Best to consider it the rule of 3’s

                    This “Rule of Three’s” helps you keep focused on your survival priorities in an outdoor life-and-death situation. The rule states that you can live 3 weeks without food, 3 days without water, 3 hours without shelter (in a hypothermic environment) and 3 minutes without oxygen.

              • It isn’t just the Colt LE901 its just about any military style “assault weapon” even those that aren’t really. Mosin’s were $125 here two months ago – now $300. SKS 7.62×39’s were $350 and are now $500 – probably a bargain really. I bought some really cheap lower receivers that were polymer called “PlumCrazy” and shockingly – they work great – I paid $140 for them including the complete lower and rear stock a couple of years ago (5-$700) and sold 2 – $700 in the last few weeks. Now I have 3 for free. I would not be buying any “AR” type stuff right now; for it will likely pass – especially in FREE states. Those in NY, CA, Il, (like me) sorry, better already be prepared or SOL.

                • “I would not be buying any “AR” type stuff right now; for it will likely pass”

                  I don’t know, Jim. Yesterday I spoke to a fellow who does the ordering for a fairly reputable, and very BIG gun store in my area. He just got back from all the major Gun Shows around the nation. I guess one was in Las Vegas last week and others were on the East coast. Anyway, he said most, if not all gun manufacturers had everything on hold, at least those that produce guns that are considered on “the fence”. He said, because they have their production lines on hold, that by the time they find out what is legal and what is not, and then start producing guns again, it could be a spell before we see them out on the market, again. Not sure how that will influence “retail” prices, aside from what we are seeing through the various outlets like gunbroker, armslist, etc., but he gave me the impression “certain” guns would be going up. So, it may not “pass”. Same with the hi cap mags. I don’t think they are being manufactured, for the same reasons.

                  It’s possible it could be a year before we see quantities back out on the market. Then again, if they somehow manage to sign their death certificates and ban these weapons, the prices will potentially skyrocket.

                  As Sickofhandouts said, “It is all relative”. I would say better to pay too much and have one, then not to have one, at all. Especially if this summer, specifically late August well into September, turn out to be a doozie.

                  Everyone here, at this site, is set with their weapons, but there are many more who still desire to have “certain” guns in their possession.

              • regardless of value, they need to get our guns first for obvious reasons…

                No one is giving up their guns.

                No one is giving up their gold.

                None of us are giving up…not one more inch.

                • A friend of mine asked if I had an AR-15 for sale. I told him I had one which I could let go since he was a friend. A Bushmaster with a non detatchable carry handle and a fixed buttstock for $ 1,700.00. He told me he could have bought that rifle for $ 900.00 a couple of years ago. My response was, ” yep you could have, and I did, but just like the price of gold the price went up. This was a good price for you, it would be higher for a stranger”. Needless to say he didn’t buy the rifle and I sold it for $ 2,475.00 a week later. My point is this: nobody shoul wait to get the obvious. Better get waht ya need. It’s better to have more than you need than not enough !

            • Sorry Off Topic: Good info though!

              Feds & IRS Indict: Katrina Mayor Ray Nagin!

              By Jim Kouri, CPP
              January 30, 2013


              Former New Orleans Mayor Ray Nagin, now living in Frisco, Texas, was indicted on Friday with 21 criminal counts for bribery, honest service wire fraud, money laundering, conspiracy, and filing false tax returns, according to federal law enforcement officials.

              According to Friday’s federal grand jury indictment, between December 2004 and the present, Nagin and several other suspects participated in a conspiracy to commit bribery and honest services wire fraud. The indictment alleges that Nagin, as the mayor of New Orleans, devised a scheme to defraud the city and its citizens of his honest services through bribery and a kickback scheme in which the 56-year-old Nagin used his political office to provide favorable treatment, including awarding contracts, that benefited business and financial interest of businessmen providing him with bribes and kickbacks in the form of checks, cash, inventory, wire transfers, personal services, and free travel.

              The indictment charges Nagin with accepting numerous bribes and payoffs from consultants and contractors, money laundering conspiracy, and filing false tax returns for the years 2005 to 2008.

              He served as mayor during the catastrophic Hurricane Katrina and came under much criticism for his handling of the disaster and the ineptitude of his administration. However, according to Nagin’s critics, he was able to avert attention from his mishandling of the Katrina response by blaming President George W. Bush and the Republicans.

              Nagin’s infamous “Chocolate city” comment outraged many Americans who believed Nagin and his administration were culpable for the loss of life during Hurricane Katrina and the flood that followed.

              “IRS will continue to do our part to hold the elected officials of New Orleans accountable for their actions,” stated Damon Rowe, IRS-CI Acting Special Agent-in-Charge. “No one is excused from obeying the laws of this country.”

              According to the indictment, in January 2005, Nagin created Stone Age LLC, a granite company based in New Orleans.

              The indictment alleges, among other things, that Nagin accepted approximately $72,250 in bribes from Rodney Williams and his company, Three Fold Consultants LLC. The indictment also alleges Nagin accepted bribes from Frank Fradella, including $50,000, granite inventory, and nine payoffs in the form of wire transfers from Fradella totaling $112,500. In some cases, money was deposited into Nagin’s Stone Age corporate account, or free granite inventory was provided to Stone Age.

              According to the prosecutors, Nagin faces hard time totaling a maximum of 48-years in federal prison:

              If convicted of conspiring with others to commit bribery and honest services wire fraud (count one), Nagin faces statutory penalties of up to five years in prison, a $250,000 fine, and three years of supervised release.

              If convicted of accepting a bribes (counts two through seven), Nagin faces statutory penalties of up to 10 years in prison, a $250,000 fine, and three years of supervised release on each count.

              If convicted of accepting payoffs that caused interstate wire communications to occur between Louisiana and other states (counts eight through 16), Nagin faces statutory penalties of up to 20 years in prison, a $250,000 fine, and three years of supervised release on each count.

              If convicted of conspiring to commit money laundering (count 17), Nagin faces statutory penalties of up to 10 years in prison, a $250,000 fine, and three years of supervised release.

              If convicted of filing false tax returns for years 2005 through 2008 (counts 18 through 21), Nagin faces statutory penalties of up to three years in prison, a $100,000 fine, and three years of supervised release on each count.

              The indictment also contains notices of forfeiture which puts the defendant on notice that the government intends on forfeiting any and all property and profits concerned with and/or derived from any illegal activity referenced in the indictment.

              © 2013 Jim Kouri- All Rights Reserved

              THIS Article/info is from newswithviews dot com website.

              • Fuck the IRS, i.e. Hit Men for the Mafia Fed.

              • Him and Kwame Kilpatric (Detroits Mayor who is currently on trial) need to be locked up in the same cell..forever

                • I’ll bet they were members of mayors against guns.

              • Yeah sure man, whatever.

                He could light 150 nuns on fire and walk. He’s of the priveleged class.

                • They weren’t nuns but he was responsible for leaving all those people in that hell hole stadium during the storm and then leaving them there afterwards. Those deaths and rapes were on his head.

            • …you mean he sold 15 “personal protection firearms” in 30 minutes.

              Assault rifles are fully automatic.

              • And primarly owned by the Government !

                • What are you talking about gentlemen? I have no ‘assault weapons’ in my house, only personal defense weapons (PDW’s)

              • Assault rifles are fully automatic. WRONG.

                99% of all Assault rifles type wepons sold are simi- automatic. With a class 3 permit you can buy a full-automatic.

                This is the problem… Assault rifles! The average person has no clue what they are. These are nothing but a simi-automatic rifle…

                • You just can’t “buy” a Class III, NFA weapon with a “permit” In 1986 Ronald Reagan screwed the buyers of full-auto firearms. Reagan changed the law that no new full auto weapons could ever be purchased. Only pre-86 full auto can be purchased. The bulk of those weapons are limited in numbers. Most being GI bringbacks from World War 2.

                  Sparkysilver….you make it read as though you go down to your trusty, .gov bureaucrat, pay the .gov for your “permit”, and then take your permission slip down to your local China-Mart and buy a full-auto, firearm. Not so Sparky.

          • I agree. Already did most of that. New brake rotors and pads, set of new tires, new battery, did the complete tune-up, new belt.

            Would add a couple gallons of coolant to that list, as well as spare bulbs and extra headlamps. Throw in a first aid kit, blankets, water, BOB.

            “Not One More Inch!”

            KySSG . . . out.

            • hopefully these are all cars or trucks built before the black boxes were mandated..I own a few that im keeping just for the reason they dont have this tatel tail box or the ability to shut down my ride on the wim of a Fedcoat.

              check into it if your not sure

          • 12V car air compressor. air gage. Fix a flat or green slime.
            Tire plug kit. A good scissor jack. fuses and light bulbs for vehicle.

            • Don’t forget spare recoil, magazine and firing pin springs and whatever spare parts may be needed to keep your firearm(s) in top shape. Gun cleaning supplies are a must.

              • What are the key parts to concentrate on besides firing pins? I don’t know a lot about repairing guns and not sure what to focus on.

                Thanks for any help.

                • @Kindle

                  It depends on what model of firearms you own or plan to own. With an AR-15 for example, I would just get a complete lower pars kit. It has everything you need to replace just about everything in the lower (make sure it comes with the bolt and bolt carrier). Also get some spare gas rings for the AR bolt. When they get worn, you have a single shot rifle. I also stock a couple extra gas tubes, buffers and buffer springs. Be sure and study a illustrated parts breakdown before you disassemble, trust me those little detent springs accelerate when leaving the lower receiver. Oh, and get a sturdier charging handle, they tend to bend if you get too wild with them. I like the bravo company gunfighter series.

                  General pistol parts: Trigger, extractor, ejector, recoil (guide rod) and magazine springs. Main springs if equipped (such as a 1911). Pick up a spare barrel if able.

                  General bolt rifle: Look at a bolt schematic for your particular rifle. Have a spare for everything in the bolt (Ejector, extractor, firing pin springs, etc.) Trigger springs too.

                  Shotgun: Same as above: also get an extra magazine tube spring and follower. They get weak (as all mags do) over time if you keep them loaded.

                  Revolvers: In my experience they are the toughest to work on, especially the older ones. Cylinder hand springs, trigger or main springs are pretty much all I have ever done to the ones I have worked on.

                  I would recommend you know how to replace each part you decide to get before SHTF. Nothing worse than losing springs and little pieces when getting that weapon back in the fight is critical. Newer semi auto handguns for example are extremely simple to change parts. Usually no special tools required, although slave pins help when assembly requires 3 hands.

                  I am not a professional gunsmith, just a shade tree tinkerer. Oh, one more thing, wear safety glasses if removing those springs. Losing springs and parts is bad enough, having them lodged in your eyeball is worse, especially during a SHTF scenario.

                  • Thanks BB for the advice. I have some of all you mentioned. I’ll have to print out your post and study up on in all.

                    Much appreciated.

          • Obviously some are not forgetting the PM’s, nor base metals (copper, lead, zinc) nor the vehicle maintenance, nor topping off preps, (great sale this week on canned Del Monte fruit and veggies at Kroger’s). I was stunned to read this last night.


            This was cash withdrawn the first FULL week of January. Not the partial first week, nor the two weeks following(that data is not out yet). I submit that what we read about in Greece (where’s Manos?)and other European countries with bank runs, the runs to safe haven of Swiss banks, and the buying of gold throughout Europe and Asia has now revealed itself here in the US. Runs on American banks are a reality. Just like the gold repatriation by Venezuela, Germany, Netherlands, Austria; he who gets his first gets his, anyone after that is taking a chance on not getting theirs.

            • Wilson,

              Speaking of withdrawals and banks … I had something very strange happen last weekend with our local bank.

              On Friday I deposited some cash in our our checking account, to order something on the debit card. (I have ordered lots of things this way.) When I tried to place the order – it was denied.

              On Monday morning I called the bank to verify the deposit. The bank rep said, “Apparently, the ‘machine’ had trouble reading the deposit slip. We will have to manually read the slips and will credit your account by noon today.”

              I replied, “How can that be? I have the deposit slip bank stamped with my account number, amount, date and time.”

              The bank rep had no response.

              I have never had this happen before. Has anyone else had ‘out of the ordinary’ banking experiences lately?

              • I deposited my paycheck checked the next day all was fine payed my bills check later in the week and i was overdrawn my deposit disapeared. I had my reciept the bank couldnt explain what happened but straightened it all out

                • They absolutely know what happened. They trace every penny!!!!!!
                  They are not telling you. Go back and demand an answer from the pres of the bank. He’ll, they can print you out a record of exactly what happened. How do you think they find money that is due them?????
                  Something strange is afoot!

              • KY Mom: Banks do that all the time even when it’s an ACH (electronic check) from another institution or even the government. Electricity travels at the speed of light so why the 2-3 days delay? Same as in your case; it allows the banks free use of our money for those few days interst free. Do that a few million times and the profits add up. The banks can use that money not yet transfered to back loans and to show show as assests on their books. If you or I were to do something like this we’d be arrested for check kiting. That’s floating funds between institutions with paper, or electrons, not backed by the real money for a couple of days. Hell, it’s not even real money these days, just electronic digits. But the principles the same; they get the free use of our money while we wait for our checks to “clear”. It’s a great scam the banks have at our expense.

                • Agreed. They are just taking your money and using it as theirs without giving you the interest they owe you for it’s use.
                  Twenty years ago when my husband and I were both military,my bank would deny access to our paychecks for 7 days after deposite every month. I asked the bank clerk about this and got a run around answer. So afer it went on for several months and I had complained each month, I went to speak with our branch VP. She also gave me the response that they needed to verify and actually move the funds into our account from the employers account. I then pointed out that our employer was the US government so there was no question about our funds being IN their bank on the day of deposite but if there continued to be more than a 24 hour lag I would speak with the JAG ( military legal office) about EXACTLY what the law says on this subject and I would file a formal complaint against that bank. JAG would then be required to investigate and that VP knew that. I never had a hold longer than 24 hours after that conversation as long as we were stationed there.

              • Yes, I had a big 5-digit deposit vaporize. Took 10 days to get it back.

                • Hey Guys
                  This disappearing $$$$$$$$ stuff should be grounds for extreme worry. I would venture to say that they are RANDOMLY doing this to many people. Think about it……..if you deposit ten grand and it disappears for a week………they get a weeks worth of free use of your money. If your bank is in deep dooodooo, they may be doing this type of thing to buy some time. It does not cost them one red cent to clear this up for you as they simply have somebody who “knows” what is going on handle all the customers who experience this “strange problem.” Your bank may be one of the banks that is grossly underfunded with regards to cash reserves. Doing this nasty little trick may allow them to make it look as if they have much more cash on hand. I think that they are somehow not showing the deposit “in their system” when you deposit the money. So, they use it for free for however long they can, and then you simply have a new deposit recorded on the books. I would definitely report this to a major newspaper, like FOX????? They seem to like this sort of thing. This may be going on all over the country. Just imagine how these bankers are yet again profiting!!!!!!

              • I would be in that bank right now demanding an answer from the president of the bank. If you do not get a satisfactory answer then close your accounts and bank elsewhere.

            • Dammit I need at least 6 more months.

              And I’m not going to get them, am I?

              • who knows guy…i was hoping for 7.

              • My advice:
                Get priorities straight and don’t worry about the time frame. #1 God/Jesus Christ/Salvation…….
                #2 Clean drinking water stored up or a good reliable source
                #3 Food storage(dried & canned) for six months per person minimum.
                #4 Personal protection (firearms & ammo/bow & arrows/knives/etc.
                #5 Decide on Bug – In or Out Plan, and adjust #2,3, and 4 accordingly.

                Note: If you skip #1, you are probably not gonna survive a SHTF scenario anyway, so sell out everything and buy a good fishing rod & reel, used camper and move to south Florida. A good sleeping bag in winter is all you’ll need for a heat source so sticks and limbs will fry your fish. Only pick your own oysters in months with the letter ‘ r ‘ in them. You may want an inflatable raft in case the ocean level rises the expected 10 to 20 ft. and a couple good paddles.
                PS. Don’t forget fishing rod when your done w/inflating raft. It may be a long way to higher ground.

                • You advise eating food from the Gulf after the oil spill and Corexit use? Why not just end it now?

                  • Oh Hell No. I would only eat from the gulf as a last resort. the whole south Fla. thing was pretty much a joke anyway. i used to make deliveries in Houston about three times a month until the spill/rupture. Haven’t been there or anywhere along the gulf since.

                    I have nothing against south FL, but, i wouldn’t want to be there when SHTF. My mountain retreat is far better and I know the surrounding 1000 acres like the back of my hand.

                • south Florida is one of the last places one would want to go. the rest of your list is accurate.

                  …especially #1.

                • Oysters to be harvested in months that have an “R” in them could get you in trouble. The “R’ was a reminder that the water should be cool as to inhibit the growth of bacteria. Water temps have been rising so be careful. Also I would not take oysters where they are exposed to air at low tide. I like them raw but you also take the chance if they are not cooked.

                  • Very good advice! I used to eat a peck steamed about once every two months until everything got so polluted. Now I stay away from all shell fish and most pork. I feel better because of it.

                • Don’t forget pets: leashes, carriers, water and food as well as ped meds.
                  And add extra clothing and shoes/socks for the people.

          • @ DRD5508,

            GOOD IDEA, here’s one for you all.

            Mobil1 makes a line of very long life synthetics that they WARRANT for 15,000 miles…would be a good thing to have in the old crankcase if TSHF. Only caveat here is the FILTER can’t go over 7500 miles…any of them. Get and keep a seperate filter on-kand and you’ll be good to go for a while. Oh, and Yes, I’ve been on this stuff for YEARS, it works as advertised.

            • OneGuy, thank you for the input had forgotten about Mobile 1.

            • Amsoil has been guaranteed for 25,000 mile service since 1972 and most of their Amsoil branded oil filters are also good for 25K.

            • One more thing, 1 year is the limit on Mobil and Amsoil. Anti wear additives are heat activated on the first use and only last about a year. The filters will start deteriorating as well after a year.

          • I think you make a point that is being overlooked by some of those who have been prepping for a while. Gold and silver are just other words for purchasing power. Unless you’re a jeweler there are not a lot of things an individual can do with them but stack ’em to preserve purchasing power. But folks aren’t looking at what that means.

            I know guys that are pouring money into PM and have ZERO long-term food, no way to acquire pure water, and maybe minimal protection. I think folks should be seriously considering the value of using money not for stacking forever but their other needs. We get into a routine–whether buying gold, guns, or stocks–and can’t seem to stop long enough to analyse if we’re not unbalanced in our buying.

            Even if we just get high inflation rather than a total collapse, it would make sense to purchase those things you both need and/or want NOW rather than pay tons more for them later. This will probably be thumbed down, but I am getting those few toys now that I’ve wanted for some time. I backed up the truck on PM in 2001 so there isn’t a lot of need to continue, as with the other preps. So why not buy a few things to ENJOY if they are going to be a lot more expensive in the future? Seems to me you just want to be able to beat the rate of inflation and you can do that by buying early just as well as saving up in an appreciating asset and buying later at a higher price.

            Just my opinion but I think folks should step back occasionally to see if they are BALANCING their purchasing strategy intelligently.

          • Good plan with the vehicles. This is a good idea for just about any time but fuel for vehicles could be a big problem in an economic collapse situation. If you safely can store fuel in 55 gallon drums, do so. If not, then perhaps some kind of alcohol fuel conversion kit would be a good option?

            In addition to the car parts mentioned, a spare starter and belts are also good to have. A few spools of auto grade wire are also good for repairs. Spark plugs last a long time but do need to be replaced eventually.

          • Don’t forget locking gas caps

        • Stock markets hit record highs yet the economy is still dying… a lot of investors out there are very dellusional. I made the mistake of buying PMs from Goldline, nasty markup I have to overcome just to break even.

          • Molon,

            I am no money man but with the fed pumping what 40 bil a day it to the market it will only keep rising.

            Let me ask the site or should I say the sites money men,
            Do ya’ll see this move in the market as one big money wash? I mean do you think the heavy hiiters in the markets are pulling stock money out almost as fast a the fed pumps it back in?


            • DPS…I am not what you would call a money man but I am deeply invested in PMs so I follow the market pretty closely. I believe you are somewhat right in your assumption that(wise)investor money is leaving the market. I suspect what is going on now is a pump and dump so insiders can make as much as they can before they pull the pin. We all know that the dollar is on life-support and I think this year is going to be the end of it. Most people don’t know it but the FEDERAL RESERVE is a 100 year charter and it is due for renewal this year so I think forces are aligning to kill this greenback this year, martial law will ensue, and the HNIC will claim a dictatorship. These are only my thoughts. I am prepped and ready, I hope you all are too.

              • WarFace,

                Thank you for the info brother, we are never prepared enough but we still keep on pluging. It just seemed strange the markets going up and all when we all know the small people are pulling out.Hope the all amke enough to go on the run for life, because when the people to catch there will be hell to pay… I really do HATE a theif..


                • No one hates a thief more than me and what is happening now in the market and with PM price manipulation is the very definition of thievery. Other governments appetite for gold lately should set all eyes watching what goes on in this country. When it is big news that the market is doing well in such a seriously dire economic situation, you should worry. I am not a prophet but I can say with certainty that the dollar will die soon and having us dis-armed so we cannot effectively protest is the end game. The ball is in motion but the sheeple missed the snap. It’s coming and it’s not going to be pretty. I really believe we are in the end of times and we are just playing out the string. I got right with the Lord, my guns are clean and loaded and my preps are complete…now we will all have to wait for the grenade to go off.

                  • I’ll be as ready as I’m ever going to be, within the next 10 days.

                • The average retail investor hasn’t been heavily invested in the market since the 2008 debacle. I think that is why the Fed stepped in to prop the market up. They are trying to bait the little guy back in so they can wipe them out and force the onto government programs, creating more government dependence…and control.

                  The repeal of the Glass-steagall act in 1999 opened the door for the TBTF banks to gamble with deposits, allowing their investment banking division to trade for their own accounts with other people’s money. Thats why there continue to be record numbers of bonues paid to bankers at Goldman and the like. How many of the super regional banks make money anymore via traditional banking means??…i.e. lending money out to people and earning a nominal interest rate. Wells Fargo is the only big boy engaged in traditional banking anymore. JPM, Citi, Goldman, BofA etc. make all their money trading in their proprietary account.

                  The market is a giant ponzi right now. Essentially the Fed prints $85 bil a month out of thin air, gives it to the primary dealers (the banks listed above) via treasuries, whereafter the primary dealers do something called a repo (use the treasury on their balance sheet as collateral, get a line of credit off the balance sheet), and ramp up stocks with the newfound credit. When markets rise, their investment on credit (margin) increases, and they sell it for profit. Zerohedge does a great job of explaining the intracacies of it here…

                  When banks profits, their employees profit and you see people at Goldman getting $600,000 a year bounses. All the while we the people suffer. Mr. Chairman (the Fed) is the most dangerous person on the planet – he rules the world with the stroke of a pen and a money printing press, both of which are more lethal than all of the world’s armed forces and military capabilities combined. Bernanke does not have to fire a single shot to enact his control; he can just withhold currency, flood the market with too much money, impose unbearable interest rates, create inflation, overvalue precious metals or oil, and most of all determine who eats and who starves by manipulating the price of food. That is just too much power for one individual/entity to have over humanity.

                  I pray this house of cards hold up a little while longer…I’d like a little more time to prep and get things in order.

                  • Not to worry folks. News bulletin stated the Fed is going to print 16 Trillion and pay off th national debt with it. We can all go back to sleep.

              • Warface, agree with you. Your last three sentences are priceless.

                • Thanks brother. History never forgets its heros and in my book, everyone who defends what this country was founded on is a true hero. All men die, but here’s the real question; how many really live? I will not give in to tyranny. I will not pass this shamble of a country down to my sons without at least trying to make a stand. I will never apologize for deviant acts of others. I want the magical country that I grew up in back. Not this liberal, queerfest we have today.

                  NOT ONE MORE INCH!!

            • It was $40billion a MONTH–now it’s like $85. NOT per day

          • We have had very good experiences buying from the Northwest Territorial Mint.

            • Except now the gov knows that you have it.
              Buy locally and pay cash

          • The banksters will soon decide it’s time for another culling.

          • The stock market has no relation to reality. And what’s going on there isn’t investing. About 75% of the trading is “flash trades” lasting 20 seconds or less–all done by banks of computers taking advantage of numerical differences to make a few pennies. If Congress would add a tiny tax per trade, that nonsense would end. But Congress is too beholden to the banks….

            • “If Congress would add a tiny tax ”

              Yea, because just passing a law or adding a tax always does what you leftards say it will. Enough fucking taxes. Enough trying to control people. WTF do you care if someone makes a 20 second trade?

              • Hey, this tax would be directly on the pigs stealing from us, and she is absolutely right about the impact it would have on these goings on. The people who SHOULD PAY TAXES, until they bleed to death, are THE WALL STREET PIGS!!!!!!!!!

          • Just wondering if that isn’t to be expected before hyperinflation. Stock markets just being pumped up by all the money being printed. While there is no real growth to warrant it.

            • The stock market now, has nothing to do with the REAL economy that you and I deal with. It has morphed into an alien being. What WILL happen is that you and I will see ever more stagnant income, higher costs for EVERYTHING we need to survive, and no way to afford what we need except to use our credit cards. Guess who gets screwed and guess who wins????? We try to buy everything on sale, when it is deeply discounted. That leaves us additional money to stock up and also to buy things we otherwise could not afford.
              One thing we have stocked up on is CLOTHING. If any of you had parents who lived through the depression you will recall stories of worn out clothes and shoes, and every other item that was needed. The clothing you have today may not last for ever, so buy extremely good/discount priced items when you find them. I figure that having extra clothing will be beneficial for bartering too.

          • The stock market in Zimbabwe soared while the economy crashed, if I remember right.

            Today I noticed that the local “we buy gold” store had gone out of business. I am wondering if less gold is being brought in (people are holding on to their gold)?

          • “Break even” is a relative terminology that assumes the status quo of valuation and a viable currency. When the dollars collapses, so will this current perceived scale of valuation. They will reset the system (likely global) and they will tell you what your gold and silver are worth within the new currency. That’s where America screwed up last time. We cannot accept any future currency system unless it is completely free of usury (and trust me it won’t be), no matter how much they say it will be anchored to something. Also, we cannot comply with confiscation. Your physical gold and silver are not investments, they are survival tools, bartering implements.

            • Good post. Let’s try for something a bit different and innovative this time.

              “they” will not have a say his time. “they” will not get to tell you what metals will be worth.

              Choose to live locally…choose a simple life of family and friends…be self-sufficient…to hell with traveling all over the world. Destroy all of this bs tech, the bankers, big gub, free lunch, corpco, etc.

              Most of us will not give a rats ass what “they” say. In fact, I think “they” will be lucky to stand in the sunshine.

              “they” will be finished this time.

              good or evil…make the choice or seal our fates.

              If you can’t take care of yourself, your family and those like you…you don’t belong on the earth.

              That is how the planet works.

              • Lastman;You want a solution check out Mike Adams sight on the article written by Carolanne Wrights article on Iceland. They have turned there economy around without firing a shot!!
                I realize its a lot smaller economy, but IMHO its a good start and the only way out of this mess!!!
                And of course nobody in the MSM is reporting on it??


                • I read about the Iceland decision at least six months ago and have not heard peep about it in mainstream media. Anyone have a daring and honest congress person? Iceland does not have the same caliber crime families to deal with, as well as factions in the CIA etc.
                  When a nation does not have these types of evil entities, at least not to the extent we do, they can kick out the big boys with little worry that they will find their brains blown out like JFK did. You gotta remember, There are HUGE CRIME FAMILIES running this show around the world. We have at least two of them here in this country. When you can afford to buy all the land that sits on top of the large aquifer in Paraguay, and bribe the govt. to force the locals who own the land to relocate…………

          • Stock markets hit record highs. The banksters are surely getting ready for another culling.

          • Molon:

            I have a few simple rules about buying gold and silver. 1st, never buy from a company that advertises in magazines or on radio or TV. Those adds cost a fortune and the customer gets to pay for them. Also, never buy from a company that wants to send you a “kit”. People do not need slick and expensive brochures. They need reliable info, good service, and the best prices they can manage.

            Buying from on-line vendors is usually OK but do a search for their name and the words “scam” or “problems”. The legit dealers will have few or no hits. Those best avoided will have many. You can also ask others on sites like this one who the best dealers are. Make sure that those who sell also buy back in case you ever need to sell.

            A local coin or pawn shop can also be a good option but this usually works best once you get to know the owner or manager. If they seem good and you become a steady customer, they will probably offer you a litter better price or some extra service on the things that you buy. Both are good. A good local dealer is quite an asset for any coin or bullion collector. If they treat you well, do the same for them.

        • The only place one could buy gold is from some jew outfit and they are not going to sell real gold for these worthless dollars they create out of thin air. The “gold” they would sell would be thin brass plated lead. Heavy and shiny at the best. You’re better off buying your lead in a small round case with some powder behind it.

          • Wrong.
            I buy gold from a local coin shop. NO markup.
            He does this for his friends.
            There are some very good people around who are not crooks.

      2. The snowball going down the hill is gathering speed and size.

        It’s official now – the economy contracted in the 4th quarter. Yet, according to the media – they are surprised by this news. No surprise here.

        Our Tax dollars at work…
        US approves A123 sale to Chinese firm despite security concerns

        “The U.S. government has approved the sale of U.S. taxpayer-backed A123 Systems to a Chinese company, despite security and economic concerns about sensitive technology changing hands.

        “…Wanxiang America Corp. has gotten approval from a Treasury Department agency to take over “substantially all” of the non-government business assets of the lithium ion battery manufacturer.”

        “The move comes despite concerns from lawmakers on both sides of the aisle about a Chinese firm taking over a company — and technology — that U.S. taxpayers helped fund through $249 million in grants. Of that money, about $130 million had been released so far, the Department of Energy said.”

        • To spell it out more clearly, the US does all the grunt work of research and development which is inherently costly (as anyone who has done research can testify) and then have the perfected technology pawned off to the Chinese for pennies on the dollar.

          In fact, with all the R&D spent on things that China has stolen from us, the trillion dollar debt should be about an even trade.

          Now to execute all parties involved this illegal transfer (treason).

        • That should be added to the list of treason too.

        • “It’s official now – the economy contracted in the 4th quarter. Yet, according to the media – they are surprised by this news. No surprise here.”

          The Sheep are ALWAYS surprised when they end up in the slaughter house. The rest of us recognize the inevitable when we see it and usually VERY early on. In multiple instances, events like this are often discussed by the so-called pundits with comments like “who could have foreseen this?”, etc. Heck, anyone who is paying attention, that’s who!

        • And, this sale is simply the beginning. In exchange for debt we owe to the Chinese, this administration and Congress are going to do a lot more of this. It has already been decided!!!!!!
          Communism, here we go!!!!!!

      3. Before you buy gold or silver make sure you have all your other preps in place. You need to get some food that can be stored for the long term. We made several purchases at Most food has a 25 year shelf life WITHOUT refrigeration. It’s tasty and NOT some mushy beef stew or salty lasagna you may have tried while camping. They have recipes and show you how to cook with long term food storage ingredients. Highly recommended!

        • Also salt, sugar, flour, noodles, raisins, soda, baking powder, strike anywhere matches, iodine, caning jars, garden seeds, but you wouldn’t be able to keep the deadbeats from stealing the produce.

      4. With all of the crazies running around governmnet, the building of D.U.M.’s,and the rumors of war around the globe, seems to me that this may be the thing to do.
        As a prepper that does not have the money to stock gold, I stock food and othe things that my family may need. A prudent person sees and listens. then puts into play what ever is needed to not be in the crowds with the sheep being a problem!

      5. Hopefully this is an indication that people realize we are being lied to by TPTB and that the US dollar is heading for a collapse. Maybe this is more an indication that people are WAKING UP !

        • I agree with that Rodster. That much money moving into gold and silver, and all the billions that have shifted into PM’s up to this point since the early 2000’s, can only mean that the people (globally) are losing trust in the ‘one world solution’ being proposed by central banks, technocrats and the largest financial banking institutions.

          Follow the money — and the money says people think the S will soon hit the fan.

          (I think the capital shift into commodities like reserve foods, as well as firearms and ammo, are also key indicators of the same)

          • Unfortunately,the manipulators force the little guys to sell on upturns,then the “big boys” and governments worldwide snap it up. Much metal is gravitating to the Eastern countries

            • Zimbabwe is down to it’s last $214 in the bank… so what!

              They could print Ten TRILLION and still be in better shape then the US!

              • actualy they already tried printing from the year 2000 to the point that poeple used to sell ZIM dollars as recicle paper and make money (Their dollar was worth less than the paper it was printed on) they now use USA dollars and South african rand. so they cant print anymore Anyone that wants to see whats going to happen in the future should read up on zimbabwe. the top gov. officials all have money and are living good lives and a lot of people are now refugees all across africa The big difference will be most of then were use to poverty and it only got worse

          • It is not just Americans rushing into Gold and Silver. There was some really good articles on Investment watch and King World News regarding this.

            A good quick read is

            People all over the World are seriously clueing into the fact holding paper anything could turn out to be a disaster. People and countries are scrambling to take physical possession while they still can.

            No one wants to be the last one to this party cuz the shelves and vaults will be empty. The banks have loaned out the physical and silver at estimated rates of 100 to 1. Germany can’t even get all their gold back from the US Fed cuz it would crash the system so they are trying to at least get some of it back. Good Luck with that.

            This stuff is real. I’ve went from being an Analyst for Corporate America to working for myself. I’ve been studying, watching and analyzing this stuff for years.

            What totally amazes me is that “they” have been able to stave off the collapse as long as they have. It only gets worse with each month that the can is kicked down the road or put another way..propping up the ponzi scheme as long as they have.

            My belief is that when it goes it is going to happen really fast cuz it’s only held together duct tape and bailing wire.

            I took everything and invested in physical silver years ago. True, you can’t eat it but you sure can trade it for something of value. I’ve tripled my initial investment and sold a couple hundred ounces of silver in the last year to furthur purchase more guns, ammo, and finish polishing off my preps. All bought from the profit off the initial investment.

            People that still have their money in banks, stocks, ira’s, bonds, etc run an extremely high risk of loosing it all. If you don’t have physical possession you don’t have it.

            Time really is running out. I know people will choose to believe what they want. Some will scoff at these warnings and provide tons of babble as to why it’s not real. I don’t care. I do my own research and know how incredibly real this situation is.

            Sorry to be rash but I’m tired of trying to convince people how real this stuff is. Scoff at your own risk. You have been warned.

            • Thanks Kindle — I totally dropped the ball and failed to mention the repatriation of German and Venezuelan gold in the article. those are, likewise, key ‘tells’ for what governments and mega-investors are thinking out of view of mainstream reports.

              • Mac, they are good key “tells” and they are going off in so many directions it’s not even funny.

                I can’t believe all these countries would trust their gold to the Fed and BOE for “safe keeping”. Are they just now clueing into the fact that the FED,BOE and others then sell/lease it out at rates up to 100 to 1?

                There is no way they can get it all back cuz it’s not there anymore. It would totally collapse the entire financial system if the banksters had to give back the gold they suposively hold for others?

                Gold is the canary in the goldmine. If the price ever truely breaks out then I would guess we have less than a month.

                • is another really good one to read. He totally is up on all the gold and silver manipulation.

                  He can actually be quite entertaining in his disdain for the banksters manipulating the marker. “They” create and sell paper silver and gold anythime there is a short squeeze in the market. The physical isn’t there so they just create more paper to keep the price down.

                • Europe put their gold here because they were seriously afraid of the Russians
                  at the time

              • There hasn’t been any repatriation of German gold. They MAY get some back in a few years,but it’s doubtful.

              • Are they not returning the gold because it would crash the system, or because they can’t return to all that wnat it repatriated–because it’s not there??

                • Both.

              • They are unable to get their gold back because it has been leased out. Sorry guys we can’t give to you right now. You see we invested it for you.

          • We are witnessing a paradigm shift of power to China. While we manipulated, they manouvered. On golden Yuan. Be the new dawn. Renminbi that.

          • Howdy Mac,

            Don’t know if you caught this or not, was up on ZH a day or two ago. The last time the Fed posted the H.6 report, a report PRIMARILY concerning ‘real’ banks – NOT GS, NOT JPM, etc – they noted that the excess deposits, ie, unloaned money sitting at Well’s-Fargo had skyrocketed to over 180 BILLION in the last 60 days. Can anyone here say ‘the velocity of money’, yeah right about as ‘fast’ as blood coagulating in a corpse. BUT THE BIG NEW SUPER-CYCLE IS HERE, RIGHT?!?

          • If you buy plenty of high quality dehydrated or freeze dried food that will last 25-30 years you will never lose money on that investment. No matter what, you can eat the food. We have stocked lots of freeze dried foods. We stay away from the premade entrees. You do not want all the preservatives in those crappy pre made packets. Look at the ingredient list on anything you buy for foods. Buy plain freeze dried meats, veggies, fruits etc. you can always do your own seasoning with HEALTHY seasoning. Buy a ton of lentils and a huge amount of the spices you would use for seasoning them. Canned tomatoes last forever, as does salsa. I wish I could find freeze dried horse radish. It is very beneficial in helping your body to not get smacked with viral infections.

        • It could be, Rodster. At least, most of us hope that this is the case. It could also be that those who have been stacking for a while are allocating more of their money to PMs than they have before. It would be hard to tell the difference between people who are new to PMs buying vs. stackers buying.

          That TPTB are lying is pretty obvious. Just look at what they say about inflation and unemployment. Both are a lot higher than the Gov or the Fed is admitting and the media are willing partners in shoveling this crap. I believe that this is done so as to not frighten and then stampede the sheeple. Anyone who shops for their daily needs, whether that be food, fuel, or other necessary items, knows full well that inflation is a lot more than the measly 2-3% that Bernanke keeps braying about.

          It bothers me more than I can say that Bernanke does not seem to know the difference between deflation and the air coming out of a Fed-caused bubble… such as with housing… or the difference between economic growth and inflation. Although I am pretty good at math (educated in the 1950s-70s), I cannot understand how Bernanke can find 1-2% growth in a 2-3% inflation scenario. Growth MUST exceed inflation or there is no growth, IMHO. Of course, I’m not a high-falutin’ economist so probably don’t really understand all this stuff. Of course, there is 3-4x the inflation rate that Bernanke admits to because if he did admit to allowing 9-10% inflation to occur, he would look like a complete fool with idiotic ideas and policies… and we simply can’t have that, now, can we?

          QE is not working and it can be proved that it is not working by the falling labor participation rate and the average losses in take home pay. Yet, all we hear from Bernanke is that “the Fed is ready to do what is necessary (read create even more money out of thin air and give it to the banksters) for as long as is necessary”. This looks a lot like the definition of insanity: doing the same thing over and over while expecting a different result. Japan has been QEing for 20+ years and their economy still stinks. What makes anyone think that doing that here will all of a sudden start working. It won’t because it can’t. It is not the solution they seek but they are committed to it. Heh, maybe they should be committed!

      6. How about the Patriots mint their own silver and gold coins. The silver snake (with the ‘Don’t Tread On Me’) logo. That’s the one I want!
        Or the silver eagle.
        Or the silver gallows, commemorating the death of the nwo.
        The silver AR-15?
        The silver Not One More Inch? With a logo of DC under a mushroom cloud? Just wondering…

        • Okie, that could be a great SET to own right there!

          From The Patriot Mint.

          The Silver AR-15 — that’s one I would pass down to the kiddos 🙂

          • Sounds good, Mac. How about a 2nd silver coin set of “Public Enemies” with the top 20 or so of the usual suspects? That would ring a few bells too. I’m thinking 7 each of the top banksters, regulators, and politicians. That’d be a hoot!

        • That was tried with the “Liberty” coins. Poor guy lost everything and is facing criminal charges

          • No, the guy that was minting Liberty “dollars” was running a scam AND using the dollar as part of it. That’s why he is in jail.

            You can mint any private coin you want….we did it over at over at some years back. Did two different designs on one ounce silver rounds. One of them was a “minuteman” freedom round with a pic of a guy with an “assault” rifle ( v. 1776 ).

            Simply get a design you want ( I like the “not one more inch” slogan with an AR-15 ), pay for the dies to be produced ( couple grand )and have a private mint crank ’em out for you. You’ll have to add about 4 bucks over spot for the dies/dealer premium if you get 3-5,000 of them made/sold.

            • BS !!! It was NOT a scam—his coins were real gold and silver. I had many and sold many for a profit

            • ell well well. Andy its your

          • Anyone could do it, the guy who is facing charges got in trouble because he used the term ‘dollar’ to describe his coins. It’s a silver round, not a dollar!

            • He not only used the term dollar, but had a real complicated deal going where he ( and his minions ) tried to fool people into accepting 8-9 bucks worth of silver (at that time) as US 10 to 20 dollar coins.

              It was a scam Scott. Sorry you fell for it.

              • Post link to your claim please

              • HAHAHAHA I was selling them for double what I paid

                • OK. Was that before, or after, you made your Amway fortune ?

                  Were you also telling your buyers that a private minted coin with 7-10 bucks worth of silver in it was equal to a $20 US bill ?

                  There are a number of alternative currencies in the US, but the Liberty Dollar was the only one that landed it’s founder in jail.

                  • Hey Andy, You’re reaching a lil bit too much. You’re pretty much lying now. Notice that there were different denominations.

                    dude goes to jail

              • Yeah, it sure is a good thing that the US Treasury does not engage in any scams like that where worthless money is printed off and issued as if it had REAL value.

            • Coinbug,

              He was also in the paper receipt business…..issuing paper “dollars” for silver on deposit in some warehouse. People tend to forget that was part of the scam.

              How much are those worth now ? Less than the crappy Federal Reserve Note he railed against.

              While a “broken promise” 1960’s US silver certificate paper dollar will still buy you a small candy bar or a few minutes at a car wash, the folks holding those NORFED papers simply have collector’s items, for which there are few collectors.

              At least the folks that got sold way over priced ACTUAL coins have managed to recover their initial scalping as the price of silver in FRN terms has risen….but the Secret Service shut down Ebay sales of them…so you’ll have to pay to have them melted down into non-dollar rounds.

              • “issuing paper “dollars” for silver on deposit in some warehouse. People tend to forget that was part of the scam”

                No, he was issues gold and silver certificated. that would be used just like Fed notes at stores that would accept them. Once again, please cite the “scam”

        • Middle finger with caption:


’re either IN or IN THE WAY…BA.

        • Great idea, Oak!

          I vote for minting a coin that commemorates the New World Order of the Patriots for Freedom. Crossed rifles and handguns on one side and the other a “Vote Smokin’ Oak-e for President”

          He might not always be the voice you want to hear, but he’ll keep you laughing all the way to the end.

        • Wonderful smokin… just don’t put DOLLAR on it…

          Not nice to mess with Mama Treasury, she’ll hurt you.


      7. So what else is new? We have been talking about this happening for some time. Oh, and that killing the Dollar remark. Fits right into the Gun Grab. Helos in the air. Strange white vehicles. Whole lot of crap going on and there are no straight answers.

        Get Ready.

        Not one more inch.

        • Define “white vehicles”

      8. The snow ball has hit the ground folks and just a matter of how big it will get before it hits the village.At the rate it going it seems like the village may be doomed. Or is it?

        Not One More Inch,


        • DPS:

          No surprise at all. The feds and all the rest have lost most, if not all, credibility with the people.

          No one trusts them. I know I don’t. A good way to describe it is to borrow a line from “Con Air”.

          Nicolas Cage: “Ain’t but two people I trust. One of them is me, and the other ain’t you.”

          Gold is good. Silver is good. However, when it takes about all you got just to pay bills and keep going day to day, it doesn’t leave a lot to invest.

          So, I’m putting the fiat dollars I do have into other tangible items: long-term food, ammo (when I can find it), batteries (some have a storage life of ten years), first aid items . . . well, you get the idea. But, who knows, there may be a windfall in my near future. If so, then I can grab up some of those PMs.

          Oh, one other thing. I did finally watch that movie trailer for Gray State. Gave me a chill. No doubt it’s psyops.

          “Not One More Inch!”

          KySSG . . . out.

          • Batteries? Get rechargeable ones and a tiny solar panel. Much cheaper in the long run and you won’t run out or need to worry about expiration dates. Also better for our environment

            • I don’t care about the environment anymore. What do you think 3000 A-Bombs and Nutron Bombs will do to our environment? Are the NWO and TPTB environmentalists?

              • Ugly:

                Agreed. I don’t believe a few dozen batteries is gonna make much difference to the environment. Duracells, 10 year storage. Good enough for me.

                As for TPTB and NWO elite, they don’t care. Using depleted uranium shells shows you how much they care about the environment.

                “Not One More Inch!”

                KySSG . . . out.

                • KySSG….Thanks. Yeah, the environment is the last thing on the minds of NWO and Illuminati. They care so much that they leave chemtrails….Must get what is going to work. I did buy a crank radio. After cranking for 10 minutes and listening for 5 minutes, I went and bought batteries.

                  • I have two Kaito KA600 units that work much better than that. Get spare NIMH batteries from Kaito because the plug is a little different than the one on a cordless phone battery (the OEM plug could be spliced on a new battery in a pinch) use AA disposables, solar (built in), USB, or AC (must buy adapter seperately). I bought an RCA portable TV when it was less than $40 [now $90 🙁 ] in case a local TV station is still broadcasting. Just get or make a real antenna (Amazon or internet). I have a clamp-on lighter socket so I can use a car battery.

              • Too bad. Guess you don’t have kids that you care about

                • @scott no unfortunately I do not have kids that I care about, Cancer has made sure of that for my family line. I guess you want me to care about your kids?

              • “Are the NWO and TPTB environmentalists?”

                Hell no, they’re not environmentalists. That’s just another false flag issue for them to pump and dump. Get people all worked up and distracted from what’s REALLY going on. For the most part, that is the greatest theft in human history… the looting of the USA by the mooch class and their pin-headed politician buddies. Oh, yeah, the banksters and the elites are in there grabbing with both hands too… as usual.

            • Just remember that rechargable ni-cad and LiOn batteries have a definite shelf life even unused and a number of possible charges.

              Ni-Mh aka Eneloop batteries are the current favorite due their more stable chemical nature than li-on the next favorite. Eneloops are what we stock up along with redundant chargers that can both trickle charge and not over charge as well as condition the batteries.

              Frequently you can get lower amperage AA’s with a cheap charger on, 8 x $19.

              • Good intel.

            • The hell with the environment. The enviro groups are real terrorists – shut down coal plants, shut down pipelines, restrict land use, protect the spotted owl,the freaken snail darter, Agenda 21. Time to take out the sierra club, green peace, and all the other eco-terror outfits. Sorry if I sound a little extreme, but I am just over all of this crap

              • We need a one child policy and massively increased gas prices and harsh zoning laws restricting people from building anything.

                The earth is bleeding thanks to humans.

                We desperately need population control. Thats why I cant wait for the collapse to happen.

              • Heh, I started out being over this crap! I finally had to tell ’em… “BACK OFF, MAN. I’M A SCIENTIST!”. 😉

          • KySSG,

            I am right in line with you bud, I havn’t had a paycheck now in 8 weeks so money is very tight. I’m not whining but it sure has slowed down my preps.
            I’m just glad I put money into food storage and reloading stuff when I was flush. And with the Gray State trailer, that is so psyops. The is no way that could be produced for $6000.00

            CATMF-Not One More Inch,


            • DPS:

              I hear ya. I am working and so is the wife, but after bills and general expenses, not a lot left over. When there is a bit left, it goes into preps. I’ll probably be selling off a few things I can do without to speed up on the prepping.

              Gray State trailer for $6000.? No FN way. Someone left out a few zeros.

              “Not One More Inch!”

              KySSG . . . out.

              • KySSG,

                Take a look at this s–t.

                Obama Administration Repositioning Homeland Security Ammunition Containers

                Found it on the gateway pundit web page, sure would like to know where is going..


              • Ok it Lake Malone??
                If so, we are closer than I thought.

                • JayJay:

                  Green River Lake. About two hours, at least the way I drive.

                  “Not One More Inch!”

                  KySSG . . . out.

            • Sorry to hear of your situation, KySSG, but this IS one of those things for which people prep. Had you now prepped, you would now be in a “world of s**t”. Hope that you get through this and on to better times soon.

      9. Too bad I already spent my savings on guns.

        • full size pistol, concealable pistol, 3a kevlar vest, a shotgun, handcuffs, radio/cell, red led flashlight, door barricades, burglar bars, safety film for the windows, dog, and night vision

          that is the basic shtf arms kit

          the combat gear and rifle stuff is fantasy

          • Good list.

            “Not One More Inch!”

            KySSG . . . out.

          • @Eizenkreutz Now your talkin my language, all that combat gear is IMHO is a magnet for trouble. I carried all of that crap in the Airborne for a long time and majority of it is of no use to you other than identifying you as a threat. If you have read any of the Falco accounts about Bosnia 92-94 He states the tough guys with all the gear where the first ones to get hit. Obviously, take out the threat first. He suggested “be the grey man” and he also said take that flashlight and throw it in the trash thats the easiest way to get yourself killed. I like your shtf list and wish I had some of the more pricey items on it. Plastic riffles are just so dam expensive for what you get , a semi auto bit bigger than a 22cal looks cool but jams a lot weapon. Me I’ll stick with my ruger10/22 as a comparable option at a fraction of the cost of the AR platform.
            Now as far as PMs go Im about as ignorant as it gets but I did buy my very first oz of silver from JM Bullion monday night, got to start somewhare right. Figure I should support the shtf plan advertizers and get goin on the physical stacking. If JM works out then I see getting more involved, we shall see.

            • Not “Falco”, its “Selco”, and he runs

              He also stated that everyone with expensive houses with security systems were the first to be looted, and your only chance is to look like you dont have anything worth stealing.

              • Thats what I meant Selco and yeah that was his take on it look like you got nothing and your not worth bothering with. Be the grey man. The guy obviously knows what hes talking about, hes been there done that and got the t shirt. His SHTFschool is a wealth of great info and I appreciated reading his account, a very horrible reality check

                • It was disturbing to hear him say man alone has no chance, since I dont have a prepper community where I am. The neighbors are ignorant idiots.

                  • You must be on your meds tonight for this to come out of YOUR mouth.

                    “The neighbors are ignorant idiots.”

                  • With your prepps, when the shtf, you will find all the friends your ever gonna need, I would venture to say you will be the most popular person for miles. As folks (sheep)start showing up you get to pick n choose your brand new security team/farm hands/ hunters/gatherers/ what ever. Help will be cheap and easy to find, figuring out how to trust em and train em is gonna be the hard part. Ive just turned 3yrs at this prepping game and I talk to everyone I know about prepping, now after 3 yrs I know less than half a dozen folks that I would call preppers. However everyone knows Im one, opsec, whatever, when the crowd starts gathering at my front door, and it will, I plan on building a community of hand picked Constitutional Libertarians.

              • “He also stated that everyone with expensive houses with security systems were the first to be looted, and your only chance is to look like you dont have anything worth stealing.”

                Well, I fit into that latter catagory.

                “Not One More Inch!”

                KySSG . . . out.

              • Falco sang “Rock Me Amadeus!”

            • I have the Sidewinder 4 LED color military flashlight and the red LED can shine on levels barely noticeable up to very bright. It also has an invisible IR LED light I can use as a flashlight when I have my night vision on (great if I ever had to make a night run). They are $40, expensive but useful. They say blue is good for a blood trail, and the military has recently switched to green as the best balence between maintenance of night vision and ability to see.

              • If you do go with night vision, be prepared to spend some money, don’t go with the cheap stuff. I bought a Russian Gen 1 unit for about $150 close to 20 years ago now, and it is just about useless. It is very blurry and cannot be focused. Also, even with the attached IR flashlight, the max usable range is no more than 20-30 yards. Go with Gen 3 if you can afford it, I sure as hell can’t!!!

        • Not to worry, Scott. Your money has not been wasted or spent. It has been converted into REAL assets that can be converted back to cash at need. This is no different from buying gold, silver, land, or tools. All are good!

      10. The mint ONLY sells Eagles (except proofs) to certain large dealers. THEY have these coins for sale right now. All these Eagles have NOT been sold at a retail level.

        • From what I understand you are correct, and thought the same thing when I read the article. Dealers bought up the ASE’s to resell. However, it does indicate interest in metals is picking up. The mint’s markup on individual sales of silver eagles is crazy. However, they are readily available on the market at lower prices. Gold eagles, however, are getting harder to come by. Not much difference between the mint’s markup and dealer markup on fractionals. They will be available again in April from the mint.

          I agree with what some have said here, in that the time to buy guns and metal may have passed. Time to focus on the basics that may have been overlooked. Food, water, heat, parts, canning supplies, seeds, tools. Garage sale season is around the corner. I believe the time will come when these things are going to be priced out of reach due to scarcity, just as AR’s recently were.

          I did my time in the infantry, and have an affection for black rifles, but suspect they will make you a target if the time comes that you carry one outside the house. A shotgun with a sling, or a Winchester/Marlin 30-30, draws less attention and is a great firearm. Prices on these, and similiar, don’t seem to have taken off. They are also more practical for hunting. Still good deals out there on law enforcement trade in Glocks with 15 round mags. I picked up some .40 S&W handguns, since that’s the caliber LE likes, and I noticed .40 S&W was the only popular caliber handgun ammo still readily available around here.

          Go against the crowd when buying. While people are chasing ammo and guns, buy the things that haven’t yet exploded in price while they are readily available. And don’t put 24 zucchini plants in your garden like I did.

          Thanks, Mac. Your site goes well with my morning coffee.

          • Obtuseangler:

            Waiting on garage sales to start up myself. Amazing what you can find sometimes.

            I do have a Glock model 22 in .40 S&W. Ammo is still in good supply here. I’m now looking into a good rifle, something bigger than a .22; .22 ammo is non-existant here. Did some checking, and 30-30 can be found, so I may go with that.

            And yes, SHTFplan goes great with the morning cuppa joe.

            “Not One More Inch!”

            KySSG . . . out.

          • ObAng… LOL! 24 zucchini plants! Holy cow! My Mom planted 6 of those hummers and the entire neighborhood was awash in her free zucchini. Hey… I wonder if they could be fermented and used to make fuel ethanol? If so, there might be a LOT of gallons of fuel in those 24 plants!

          • Same here with the .40 cal ammo, my local China-Mart always has the big 250 round packs of UMC .40 cal FMJ in stock, but never has the 9mm or .45 any more. Lousy defense rounds, but great for plinking & practice.

      11. I’ve had no difficultiy getting long-term food for storage! I ordered 18 #10 cans last week and received them in 5 days.

        • Scott,

          I also ordered some long term food storage and received it quickly.

          I found the Augason Farms food storage sold through Sam’s Club is reasonably priced. I also like the “free ship to store” option.

          • KY- try the Mormons. They have a limited selection but it’s a LOT cheaper–I paid about $95 for the 18 #10 cans

            • Scott,

              I agree the Mormon’s may have a limited selection, but by far the cheapest prices. (I will add the link below.)

              The free shipping is another plus.

              • The Mormons a limited selection of basic products to the public.

                They sell hard red wheat, white wheat, flour, rice, quick oats, and pinto beans in #10 cans, by the case. (There are 6 #10 cans in each case.)

                They also sell oxygen absorbers, dry pak pouches, water filtration bottles, water filters, and some other basic items.

                Prices are very reasonable. Shipping is free.

                See the link below.

                • Yep,I paid $31 for a case of 6 #10 cans with free shipping. Best price by far

                • Nice link KY Mom just ordered the starter kit and from what I see I dont think you can beat the price with stick

          • Hey KY Mom

            Have you tried anything from Augason Farms yet? I’m making my first purchase for long term items and was scouting the. They seem to have great prices and the products all have good reviews.

            • Walmart is now selling Augason Farms on their web site
              great prices
              and you dont have to buy by the case

              • Satori,

                Thanks for the heads up on that, actually have about $200 in gift cards to Wally World still from X-mas so it looks like I’ll be ordering there.

                Thanks again!!

            • MC,

              I haven’t tried the Augason Farms food yet. But, my daughter tried some sample packs from a bucket and said they were very good.

              Their #10 cans of dried whole eggs and #10 cans instant dry milk and the 10 pound pails of potato slices were the best prices I could find around here.

            • Not to butt in, but I have tried the AF product..No complaints

              and not to be off handed but it sure would beat chewing on a dirty sock when theres nothing else to eat..

          • Be wary of depending on Augason’s time frames on their goods. Their 1 year 1 person supply for instance is just enough calories to keep you alive, it’s not enough to do any physical labor on. If I remember right, after doing all the math on contents, weight and calories per ounce it came out to around 1400-1500 calories a day.

            The 1 year deluxe package from rainyday foods on the other hand gives you 2800 calories a day.

            You pay more for the rainyday food pack but but it’s not twice as much so it’s a better bargain.

            The key takeaway for any storage foods is to work out how many calories you’re getting per dollar. I’ve done it for pretty much every one of the storage suppliers and unless you’re getting a significant sale (15% or better) rainy day is always the better bargain when it comes down to getting the most for your dollar.

            • And the LDS store is cheaper yet again, they just don’t have the variety available you need to thrive rather than survive.

      12. I loved it when they were saying Gold is not money..I thought to myself..yeah no shit its worth something!

      13. A lot of that cash went into the equities. Haven’t you noticed the rapid increase in the markets?

        • I noticed that too.

      14. This is the equivalent of 280000 people buying a single ounce of gold. What is all the hype about? This is the same kind of fear mongering the government does. Learn some new tactics. I have been listening to this economy doomsday shit since gold was below $900 in 2008. I guess if you say it enough it will come true. I would suggest you stock up on lead and be prepared to sling it when the SHTF.

        • Economic collapse is not a war zone. Youre not going to be living out your RAMBO fantasies with your camo gear and your helmet. Youre going to go to work, if you still have a job in SHTF, and have to walk around the streets with rampant crime, government crackdown, $7 gas, no food in the stores, and home invasion. That is more realistic.

          • YES—then a gov will come in and “help”
            us–when we’re weak & hungry

            • Get this straight guys…THE UNITED STATES WILL BECOME A SOCIALIST COUNTRY AFTER THE COLLAPSE. It happens every time and is unavoidable. Desperate people will call for confiscatory taxes; more government programs and such. After socialism sets in its very difficult to cut it out. Our side (politically) is not going to be victorious here. We’re just not.

              • You must be from the younger lazy generation the easily gives up.

                Whoaaa is me…..get a set or be a slave.

                • Its “Woe is me”.

                  Im very stubborn but I know a losing battle when I see one.

                  • @eisenwise-son:

                    Good Day Sir.

                    Victory starts with vision.

                    I see it, I achieve it.

                    Not One More Inch!!!

                    Vigilant Sir, vigilant.

                    ….be safe……stay the course…..BA.

                  • Why do you keep correcting grammer and spelling? It really comes across as petty. Not everyone is perfect… and maybe someday you’ll get the grammer or spelling wrong.

                    The only one that bugs me is Marshall law instead of Martial.

                  • I’m, short for I am.

                    Typical for your generation…going gets tough, give up.

                    If your giving up, quit sharing your opinion.

                    Many of us have kids and grandkids that we want to survive and be free.

                  • If I live I have not lost. If I die free I have won. Not posible for me to lose, sorry about you.

                  • Sorry but they dont have the muscle or the moxie, their scared

                • Point to where he’s wrong on that. It’s not woe is me, its reality.

              • Eisenkreutz….I sort of agree with you on this. Most Americans are not paying attention. If you talk about it, they think you are a kook. Most will get caught by surprise.

                Thus, you are right. The masses will look for a Leader that will give food and water because they don’t have any. As time goes, we are very ripe for a dictator.

                Socialism could get ushered in this way full time when the collapse occurs. You will have the ‘have-nots’ wanting what the ‘haves’ have. You will see confiscation of land, homes, and monies. I believe it is coming because there are just too many people depending on the Govt for their financial and food needs.

                We are already witnessing this in action.

                • the ones who dont think your a nutter, turn around and say if it is true i don’t want to know, or i have too much going on in life right now to worry about that.

                  LoL these are the ppl who will be looking for my group when shit hits and we moved out, once the jobs are gone we are moving out. Welcome to the Community. A job for everyone and everyone to their job. “Everyone works no one gives up. Don’t do your job I will shoot you myself.”
                  ( quote from startship troopers Michael Ironside )

                • “You will see confiscation of land, homes, and monies.”

                  You will also see a lot of dead commies who tried to steal what others who have planned have.

              • Partition. .gov will end up desperately hanging on to whatever they can, and end up abandoning what they can’t. The people screaming for socialism will shit when they see the REAL face of socialism. .gov will run itself ragged trying to stamp out the “grey” economy, and finally declare victory and pretend it doesn”t exist.

                So many people think .gov will have unlimited resources like they do now. The money river will resemble an intermittently flowing stream. The US navy will end up on the auction block for whatever it will bring, just like the navy of USSR.

            • Do not be suprized if all this Exact Same talking points repeated Today that we all heard 7(?) yrs ago under Bush prez about Illeagles imigrations “Reforms” and by the Same polititions on Both sides, is a massive swindle to scam every american to be forced into accepting a FED ID in the form and excuse of:

              In order to keep track of 11 million illeagles(really 30-40 million is likly) we Must have EVERY usa citizen logged into National worker data base computers.(Fed national ID).

              This way zero undocumented(Illeagle) mexicans and others will be able to hold a job unless they are in the FED ID computer systems.

              So once activated, NOBODY can hold a job unless a part of this new exciting Comprehensive Reform law pakg!

              Is the True reason(if they do this which is 99+% likly) to fed id computerize Us americans, who are legit and there really is zero need to log Us into such a system?

              Then will “Hidden” laws in it require Chip-ID cards?…Soon to be replaced by Implant-chip ID’s?…Soon to be used in a total Cashless world?

              If such things do happen…I for one do Not believe they won’t also fully Outlaw private gold/silver and all forms of use or barter etc.

              If that happens…No matter how much “wealth” you stored in metals, what if most Anyone You need do buisness with is too scared to accept barter trade of metals for Most everything that You need and cannot store or store enough of.(including property taxes)

              For avg not wealthy folks to me it seems alot wiser to spend dollars on stuf Now because just to buy gold or silver you take an aprox 5% or larger Hit/Loss due to markup prices and shipping fees etc.

              And again when you sell it, if prices remain steady as recently they have, you again lose more to sell it. Or break even Minus the orig Loss in buying.

              If today you Buy food or guns or gasoline or whatever you get the full value of each us dollar. Without even a 5% loss at point of purchase.

              Even those with alot of wealth if scenarios I outlined occure nothing will do us any real good except the total Defeat by Us of Them.

              I hate to sound pessimistic. But think it thru and compare to Prior gold bans etc, along with so many other Todays bans or attempts to ban most all we do own think be or desire to do or be…This time it will be different than all past times I think.

              Sure hope I am wrong. If not we may see a Rerun of times like past when christians only main options were to pool all cash and stuff to “share” amoungst each other when they were forced to go Underground(catacombs etc).

              Back then wealth didn’t matter as much as survival, and survival of the Entire Group/church. If any tried to go it alone to keep own wealth or whatever…I doubt they lasted very long. Also recall when they “shared” with each other it was JUST with their own believers groups. Not the entire population of other Non believers.

              We soon may see such scenarios repeated. It may become the Ultimate test of Love yer neighbor(neighbor=fellow believers and true patriots).

              • I started buying silver at $4/oz 12 years ago. There is every indication that it WILL continue to rise in purchasing power.
                Soon,you may not be able to even get it easily. Get some NOW

          • The French Revoultion had more to do with food as did the Arab Spring. High food prices and gas. Hmmmmmmm.

            Let them eat cake?

            Not one more inch.

          • $7 gas during SHTF? Dream on! Gas will be at least twice that, IF you can get any. Police, military, and emergency vehicles will have priority on any gas that is available. Once they have what they need, the rest will be sold to the public and most likely by auction. So… just how bad do you need some gas?

      15. Cash is king during economic collapse. If you must have gold, it is better to have gold jewelry than coins or bars…less conspicuous. Credit cards companies will certainly be down.

        You need to get all your supplies and equipment before you mess with this gold and silver stuff. That is priority one.

        • I feel SOME cash is necessary,along with circulated US silver coins. And I agree–get basic survival supplies first
          along with a stand alone power source

          • I dont think generators are a good idea.

            People say solar panels dont work but they sure will if you know what youre doing and you dont expect the same performance as is the case with electricity.

            One reason young people like me find the libertarian party of interest is because of the combination of conservatism with liberal interests like organic agriculture, environmentalism, social justice, etc.

            • I have off grid solar–the generators are for those long cloudy periods we get. Use propane ones–the fuel stores indefinitely

            • What are you, retarded?

              Social justice and environmentalism (as practiced by the left in this country) are both code for redistribution of wealth.

              social justice is redistribution to the poor minorities and low information white liberals and environmentalism to the wealthy elites.

              Neither of those movements has the slightest connection with libertarian freedom.

              Unless of course, when you say libertarian, you just mean the Occupy Wall Street brand that simply wants to burn down the system in order to implement their marxist utopia.

              • Occupy wall street is the exact same movement as the tea party, they just dont understand economics. You need to embrace and cultivate them.

                You have to embrace social justice (I can tell you dont even know what the term means) in order to rebuild after the collapse, a healthy middle class is necessary for a Republic.

                GMO foods are killing us. We need an agricultural revolution.

                • “Occupy wall street is the exact same movement as the tea party, ”

                  BWAAAAA HAAAA HAAAA! Yea, Not so much.

                  Yea, I do know what s.j. is and you’ve confirmed how you mean libertarianism. Psst, what you’re talking about isn’t libertarianism and redistribution of wealth will solve NOTHING. All you need to look at is the past 100 or so years.

                  You’ve confirmed that you are a leftist retard tho.

                  ALL, Note that this clown is a leftist and hardcore racist.

                  • I am a left libertarian.

                    OWS and the TP are both insurrections against our monetary system. Its just that OWS people dont know what theyre talking about.

                    My version of redistrubution of wealth involves ending the FED and instituting harsh protectionist policies.

                    Under perfect capitalism the distribution of wealth would be a flatline = infinite # of infinitely small businesses in perfect competition.

                    The reason we have a wealth imbalance in this country is because of interventionism.

                    To great a divide between rich and poor leads to a banana republic. We desperately need redistribution of wealth.

                  • “I am a left libertarian.”

                    Like I said. You’re an occutard wall streeter. Your libertarianism is only as deep as burn down the system to implement your social justice redistribution of wealth BS marxist utopian dreams.

                    Why doncha lay out just exactly how you accompish redistribution of wealth if you believe in the smallest govt possible, for instance, the type of govt our founders established. How exactly does that happen?

                    You’re no libertarian. Hell, you’re not even a thinker. You’re an addled, uneducated, misinformed, racist. Basically, You epitomise the left.

                • The only “wealth redistribution” that actually works is letting the people that actually EARN the money spend it on goods and services that other people provide!!!! It is called economic liberty, and is the only way a free society can prosper. Forced redistribution by govt will ALWAYS result in massive corruption and cronyism, just like we have now.

          • I decided quite some time ago to prep for just not having power.

            1.) My money is limited so I’d rather put it towards things more vital to our survival, like seeds, water filtration, defense and long-term food. The cost is prohibitive, and when I think of buying food or garden tools vs. a generator or solar power set-up, the gear for keeping us fed wins every time.

            2.) If stuff goes way downhill and it’s a longterm scenario, you’re going to eventually run out of fuel for most generators.

            3.)Power, while great to have, is not necessary. We lose power rather frequently where I live and it’s really no big deal because we are prepared for life without it. Took a few practice runs, but now, aside from the internet, our lives don’t change that much when the electricity is out.

            The only investment we’re making at this point is enough solar power to run laptops and routers. (I need the net for work.)

            • Daisy, I just got my first solar set up and am learning lots. So far it’s enough to run the laptop and router.

              I don’t have a lot of money either….that’s why I had to make what little I had go as far as it could. That’s when I sunk everything into physical silver and hoped for the best. I timed it right and was able to double, then triple the investment. This in turn allowed me to get the prepping into high gear.

              I too prepped with the concept of no power. It’s just recently that I have been able to expand into solar and a generator. Must admit it’s kinda nice.

              • That’s awesome Kindle!

                Is your solar set-up geared specifically just for a small amount of power or is it a bigger system to run stuff like your lights and fridge?

                I’d really like to hear more about it!


                • So far, just a small amount…light for 168 hours, computer or small refrigerator for 34 hours and 13 inch tv for 84 hours on a full battery charge.

                  I just got it a week ago and so far have only run 2 of these combinations at a time on a full charge. So far so good. Only 90 watts and two 75 amp batteries. As money allows I hope to keep expanding.

                  • The hour of run time is for 1 fully charged battery. I’m not sure what it is for 2 fully charged batteries. Still learning.

                  • That is really interesting – I hope you’ll keep us posted on it!

                  • NO way you will get that much usage from a 90w, 2 small battery system!!! 90w panel will barely charge ONE of those 75a batteries with 5 hours of FULL sun.
                    You’d only have enough to power ONE 100w lightbulb for about 4 hours because one should only use 50% of the battery power or you will kill the battery in a year.

                  • Just an FYI, make sure you have a good charge controller ( I assume you do) so that you don’t over charge or over pull from your batteries. It will automatically cut them out of the loop once they get to around 10.5 volts or 50%. When the panels are not charging it’ll cut them out so that battery power doesn’t feed back into them.

                    Going lower than 50% charge will drastically decrease their life span. Keep them on a trickle charger, a 5 (better 10) watt panel per battery should keep them topped off, or a wall charger. Batteries sitting will lose charge over time and once they get past the 50% mark degeneration from sulfination kicks in. There are plans available out there to build desulfination devices but I have no idea if they work or are a ‘run your car on water’ kind of scam.

                    Because of the 50% limit always count your amp hours by 1/2’s. If you have 2 batteries at 75 amp hours then you have 75 amp hours, not 150.

                    There are a couple of good online solar calculators that you can feed in what you have for panels and batteries, your average sunshine rating and all the appliances and their draws you plan on using which will tell you where you’re good or where you’re way off.

                    The higher your voltage the better BTW, a 24v set up is more efficient than a 12V and a 48v set up is better still.

                    For your inverters pony up the money, a good one is more like $200-$300 for around 600 watts. You want a pure sine high efficiency inverter or youre just wasting your power and risking any electronics you attach to it. And if you have to use solar to live then odds are replacements aren’t going to be a matter of running down to best buy. 🙁

                    Get LED lighting, lowest draw for highest lumens.

                    Arrange for a quality 12/24volt DC fridge, better have two, again that whole replacement thing.

                    If you can afford it, true deep cycle batteries (not the marine/rv batteries you get at walmart or autozone) like golf cart batteries although a lot more expensive give you much longer life spans and amp hours for less space.

                    Solar can make the difference between surviving and thriving.

                    But it can also paint a very big target on your back in a true SHTF scenario. You have to weigh your pros and your cons.

                    But as Daisy does, keep an eye toward not having any power and making plans on how to deal with it. One EMP/CME could take out your whole system or at least some critical components and leave you with no power and a SHFT situation at the same time. (We keep spare charge controllers and inverters wrapped in rubber inside ammo boxes. The panels themselves should be safe as will the batteries.

                    And remember to take the time to enjoy life now because if things turn really bad, you’ll need those memories to keep going for yourself and your families.

                • Daisy and Kindle,

                  I went through the exact same thought process when it comes to power. Power is a luxury and expensive as well.
                  Once I felt I had ample food stores and my security needs were met I again reexamined power.

                  I ultimately decided to purchase a propane generator becasue there almost a propane tank in every back yard and propane stores indefinately.

                  I also bought a small diesal generator because diesal lasts much longer than gasoline and a lot of diesal generators can run off old oil waste product like cooking oils found at restaurants and grease traps. You can also render animal fat into a fuel which can be run on the generator as well.

                  In addition to solar I purchased a hand crank and bicycle cranked permanent dc magnet generator from These alternators just like in your car will work forever as long as somebody is there to crank them. I charge rechargeable A, AA and D batteries with it and you could also use it to charge vast arrays of batteries using car batteries and deep cycle batteries. The possibilities are endless.

                  Lastly I strongly feel that if you prepare to live without power by default you will be prpared for almost every other SHTF scenario.

            • Daisy, P.S., thanks for your advice on the flu and shingles a couple of weeks ago. I am still dealing with the shingle healing. One place was 3 in by 2 in and is slow in healing. I’m on the 3rd round of scabs and am just now getting it to the skin surface layer. It was quite deep.

              I never did find the coconut oil because I was limited mobility wise. I tried a bunch of other stuff and found Benzocaine to really help with the pain. A thick layer of old timey Zinc oxide worked well with the blistering, protection of wound and drying out the sores.

              Just FYI for future reference.

              • Scott, that is not what my experience has been so far. I’m not having any problem charging both batteries. And I am only using 50% of battery charge and I get much more than 4 hours.

                • HisArmsWide, thanks for your useful advice and insight. I did get a good charge controller with a digital readout. I have been checking it numerous times a day to make sure I don’t go below 10.5.

                  I bought the 600 watt sine inverter a couple of years ago in anticipation of eventually getting all the pieces together.

                  I am using LED lights and a quality 12/24volt DC fridge.
                  I did go with deep cycle batteries from Northern Freight.

                  So far I have been able to easily recharge both batteries within a day. We get lots of sun in Denver and I was able to position them in a good location.

                  I still have lots to learn but so far so good. I did all this for under $1000. Which was a stretch for me…that’s why it took a couple of years to put all the pieces together.

                  Thank you again for your HELPFUL advice.

            • daisy you are become more and more a survivalist 🙂
              Getting ready for when the preps run out.
              Learn, Practice, Implement.
              You bring a tear to my eye, great work 🙂

        • Cash will be king for a week or so until the rest wake up…after that, no one will be willing to part with any valuable tangible items for something that you can’t even wipe your ass with.

          Lots will wake up quick when they can’t swipe their ebt to buy chips and a coke…if they can even find it.

        • I agree about the wisdom of buying gold jewelry. I expect some sort of transaction tax or other restriction on bullion will be implemented so the goobermint can get more of a cut (that they don’t deserve). Less likely on jewelry. Coin shops frequently buy jewelry at just below melt and sell it at just over. My wife doesn’t mind.

        • Cash is trash if the dollar does crash. Since we can’t know ahead of time whether or not the dollar will survive, we need to be prepared for multiple scenarios. Cash? Sure, but don’t put all of your eggs in that basket. Have some silver, some extra food, and any other trade / barter items that you can scrounge up. Keep your lips pressed together about what you have. Hide it, secure it, and only bring out a little at a time when needed.

      16. Concur; Get your food for long term storage, then your Weapons(self defense) and if you have extra, then PM’s.

        • Wisdom. Our order of priority is(was) water, food, shelter, first aid, defense, barter goods (including PMs).

      17. When the USA sneezes the whole world gets pneumonia.

      18. Yeah, this is a good sign. To counter though, the paper traders will simply create more paper to offset the value, whereby stabilizing the silver and gold markets as they have been doing for years. However, I don’t think their trickery will last much longer as the cat is now exiting the bag.

        On a side note, I’ve had a major boon in my area at the same time as a major indicator that things are not getting better. The Sweetbay food stores in Florida are closing a bunch of locations. I have one of those not far from my house. The first week of sales was 25% off everything. I held out for the 50% today. So to be prudent, we went and sacked the place of high end items like Olive Oil, Coffee, organic spices and other normally expensive items at 50% off.

        I jokingly said to my wife while placing an eight dollar a bottle of organic vanilla extract into the cart, “Hey, that’s 4 bucks now, about time they reasonably priced this shit.”

        So, while the indicator of yet another chain of stores dying and more people losing jobs, when you see the events occur, please take advantage of the situation and add to your inventory. The store is closing with or without your buying anything, so you may as well get what you can. Although, I did feel a bit like a vulture.

        • Joe Republic

          That sale still on?

          • Yes, for a few more days. Only thing is, the pickings are real slim by now. The parking lot has been mobbed all day. If you’re in Florida, visit the web site below for the locations closing.


            • The K-Mart here closed recently and they had everything marked up ridiculously high (like $5.99 for some cosmetic rounds, usually around $1.18) and then marked down 50%. It was a rip-off! Just make sure you know what the regular price is.

              • There is one K-Mart left near me. Walking in is like going through a time warp. It looks just like K-Mart did when I was a kid in the 70s.

              • You’re right, we checked for that. Surprisingly, nothing was marked up in Sweetbay, they just wanted to liquidate.

        • ” Although, I did feel a bit like a vulture.”

          Hey… even vultures gotta live.

      19. I don’t have anything. I’m too poor. I’m homeless. All I got is a storage unit full of stuff (canned food, etc.) and a lot of information. No money for much. I’ll be lucky if I can buy a gun.

        • I hope that the good Lord sees you through this difficult time in your life. I will pray for you my friend.

        • Cindy

          Do you have skills that are of value? I bet you can find someone, or group you could help in trade for a place to hunker down at.


          • BTW

            Not One More Inch!

        • Don’t know where you are, doesn’t matter, there are a lot of us that have guns and ammo by the ton. (It’s kind of a sickness, I bought stock to make money haven’t made a dime, bought guns and ammo for fun, made a bunch) Look around, you can find someone with lots extra, when it gets bad we will share

          • “I bought stock to make money haven’t made a dime”

            Sorry to hear that. And yet, there IS money to be made this way. Sharpen your investing skills. Make money. Use the profits to fund your preps. It is possible, just not easy.

      20. It would be nice if we had an insider that could let us know what this was all about. Anonymous should be using their skills to get this kind of information out of government databases instead of just hacking the front page and posting a message.

        We need reliable intel.

        • Timothy:

          Agreed. Anything they could get would be a helluva lot better than what we have now, which is nothing.

          “Not One More Inch!”

          KySSG . . . out.

        • Timothy,

          What makes you think Anon isn’t working behind the scenes?
          Never try and guess what others are doing, Never try and figure out what their next move is, Always figure out what your going to do when they make a move..



          • Sorry, but I think this is terrible advice. Yes one should always be prepared to respond to anything, but having intel beforehand is priceless.

            I don’t think any military intelligence personal would agree with your statement: “Never try and guess what others are doing, Never try and figure out what their next move is.”

            • Sadly,it is really tough to get reliable info. Gov lies and common folks are often blind ,misinformed or stupid

            • Timothy,

              Maybe you just missed my point bud..The point being of course Anon is working behind the scenes. The real question is are you? I’m not much of a guessing guy, I base all of my own intel on facts. I would not even try to figure out what you are thinking, I would rather spend my time prepare for any moves that would be made.
              No disrespect intended.



              • Still don’t think I am getting your point 😉

                • Timothy…

                  If I may interject a bit of layman’s instruction here…what DPS is referring to, is something known as…a counter-attack strategy.

                  DPS(& others)…monitors the enemy very closely…via the resources available to him/us(lame stream media drama/govt lies/propaganda/internet sleuthing/close individual contacts etc)…

                  …which he/we then weighs upon the scales of personal wisdom/knowledge/life experiences……..and thus he/we formulate a strategy/plan….to carry the fight to the enemies “vexing” this REPUBLIC…once we are given no choice!!!
                  Hence his focus on the important word….”FACTS”!

                  He took an solemn oath before GOD…to defend/protect this country’s CONSTITUTION…and by unspoken, but implied extension….the rest of us good folks who share his belief/dedication….against any enemy of said Constitution & the collective of those of us, who revere it!!!!!!!!!!
                  …’Nuff said about that….

                  OPSEC commands that he hold his tactics/strategy/plans…very close and unto himself!!!
                  Besides….its none of yours/mine or anyone’s business!

                  ….-(no offense intended)-

                  That said…damn near everyone here has “WAR-GAMED” manifold scenarios, per our current/future predicaments…and have settled on a ‘PLAN’ specific to the events, yet to unfold…when the balloon goes up!



                  Class dismissed!!!!

                  • Gunsmith,

                    I hate when you read my mind. besides that you spell much better then me.Oh yeah got your e-mail brother i had to make some changes so you will be seeing a new addy.



                • …additionally Timothy,

                  Allow me to compliment you, per your recognizing that good intel is priceless to any campaign/strategy. Kudos to you!

                  …on the other hand…we simply cannot expect a modicum of success, should (mission)critical intel, fall into the hands of those who were/are incapable of either understanding its consequences…or possessing the resources to utilize and capitalize on its….potential.

                  Think hierarchy!!!

                  In the civilian world, its referred to as…the division of labor!

                  • The problem is that everyone does that and while it can at times glean useful data as to people or intentions, it is hardly concrete intel.

                    Main stream media tells us what the government wants us to hear. As for the hierarchy you are speaking of, this is the same concept as the government not wanting us to have guns because we might not be responsible enough to handle them safely, likewise they think we cannot handle the truth responsibly (or that we will handle it [the truth of their intentions/plans] responsibly to their detriment)

                    I would prefer to be able to decide at all times what and how much I can handle for myself. I am certainly not willing to cede knowledge to those who proclaim to know how to better handle it, (when I have the option being the key factor here).

                  • I guess if I were to break it down into one sentence it would be this:

                    It is better to know and not act than to act and not know.

      21. If they didn’t take delivery on the gold, all they bought was a good cry in the future.

      22. I pour most of my money into important things food,gardening materials,canning supplies and all the pm’s I could get, brass, lead,powders,and molds.



      23. There has definitely been a change in the air since Sandy Hook, people are coming to the realization that we are being played like patsys, and they are beginning to get angry. I read somewhere that MSM is now down to 8% viewership, I would love to believe it, if anybody knows anything on that could you let me know? My tv goes on to watch a hockey game, yes, yes, it is a politically incorrect sport, but I still love the game, then I shut the tv OFF. Seeing people going snake shit for gold and silver is definitely an indicator, an indicator that people who have absolutely no idea what to do are trying to do something, anything, and that in itself is a good thing. There are a lot of good tidbits of advice and info on this site, and those people (I will no longer use the word folks because the pos in chief beats it to death), should heed some of these tips, such as food and weapons first, screw the bills, you can’t eat bills, get to know your neighbors, none of us can or will make it alone, we need each other more than ever.

        • HAHAHA The “rush” for gold and silver is miniscule–maybe 2% of Americans!
          You’ll know the real rush is on when silver is $100/oz and more

          • God willing.

        • “There has definitely been a change in the air since Sandy Hook, people are coming to the realization that we are being played like patsys, and they are beginning to get angry.”

          Agreed, CJM. This could blow up in their faces, Big-Time. Most people do not like being played. The media is attempting to do that and it is rubbing awfully thin these days. There are so many unanswered questions about SH and no one in the media seems interested in answering them. I dunno… maybe they don’t dare. All I know is that the info that came out of SH was remarkably skimpy and unlike any other similar event, yet these very odd events are not being investigated or explained. Was it orchestrated? I don’t know. BUT… if it was, that would explain a LOT.

      24. In so many ways America has passed the point of no return, and its citizens will be brutally punished before they awaken to the reality of their situation, problem that time it will be way , way too dam late

        Sad, but true..dont discount the message


      25. we need to ban Ink pens

        Ink pens sign a lot of evil laws


      26. @ eisenkreutz…how exactly will ” cash be king ” during an economic collapse where the dollar WILL BE ABSOLUTELY WORTHLESS???? You better rethink your stance on the importance of gold/silver. Cash is nothing more than a fancy piece of paper to wipe your ass with after a collapse. I understand you better have all other supplies in hand first before you get gold/silver…but the advice you are giving about ” cash being king ” after a collapse is bad advice.

        • In Argentina the peso was devalued by 70% practically overnight. Barter was common initally but quickly abated in favor of cash, people were not using metals to pay for things at stores, and there were no credit cards working. Cash was still king.

          Merchants horded items because they knew it would be worth twich as much the following day.

          • According to the book about Surviving in Argentina after the Economic Collapse 14k gold jewelry became the currency of choice with a black market forming around it. The official government sources traded gold for currency at far too high of a value for the currency. 24K gold coins received the same value as the much more common 14k chains and rings too.

          • People tend to use what they have. Even devalued money still have some value, so if that’s what you have, that’s what you use. The BIG problem is that in a SHTF situation, devaluation might not be the problem. A currency crash where the value of the money goes to zero because no one has any faith in it anymore would be a MUCH worse problem. In this scenario, barter goods would be king, including PMs.

        • Why dont you read Ferfals opinions since he actually lived throuh this stuff.

        • Being that our cash is made from recycled denim it could be re-recycled into jeans and clothing again, haha

        • When the power fails and banks close cash will be king–for a while. Credit cards won’t work.

          • No, they won’t, and THAT is when the Swedes will discover the true value of their beloved digital currency. Maybe then they can stop looking down their long noses at currency, gold, and silver.

      27. went to walmart today, a super walmart in red neck country and they were nearly out of ammo with a sign that said they would only sell 3 boxes of ammo to each buyer as a result of a run on ammo. Holy crap, that has never happened here!

        • rachel,

          its not just there, its happening all over the country. Its even so bad that the reloading stores are limiting primers to 1 box of a thousand per customer, 1 lb can of powder per customer,and good luck finding 22cal bullets.
          And around here I’m seeing people offering up to $70 for 22lr shells per 325 rounds. On a brighter side Tx has ask some of the gun makers and ammo producers to move here. They are even offering tax breaks on property and lines of credit to all that move here. It has not been made public yet, however some old money men here to me the state may end up backing these firms with state dollars..


        • Checked on Cabela’s site this morning, out of curiosity. .223, 5.56, and 9mm and some others are not even listed. These aren’t marked “out of stock”, the calibers aren’t listed at all. I’m wondering if people just now figured out which way the wind is blowing. Anticipate the next shortage of whatever, and stay ahead of it. Once “it” hits, it is too late.

          I read a book, Lights Out or one of the Rawles books probably, where they referred the “The Crunch” as the time when everything changed. Heard someone refer to the gun/ammo shortage as the crunch recently. It took me aback to actually here that term applied to these times.

          • Obtuseangler, I have been watching Cabella’s for about a month now. They first dropped the listings for 223 sometime after Christmas, then the 5.56, then…

            I ordered for 380 from them about 2 weeks ago that was “available”. I was just notified that it is now backordered until May 2013.

            It is not just Cabella’s but also Ammo to go, Natchez, and Midway…just the ones I have checked.

            Lights Out is one of my favorite book. I have passed it around to 6 or 7 people to read. I think it paints a pretty realistic picture of what we may come to expect.

          • Obtuseangler:

            Believe that was “Survivors”, one of Rawles’ books. Good reading. When the collapse came, they referred to it as The Crunch.

            Was on Cabela’s last night, and noticed that too. Some calibers are not even listed. Strange. Most times they just put up the little yellow “Out of Stock” bar.

            “Not One More Inch!”

            KySSG . . . out.

      28. go to you tube

        put this in


        Rigged Voting Machines

        yes most of us on here know this election and many before were rigged but this is a tutorial on how it was done in many states

        • yes, I know its from 06..its still relevant as back in the early 70’s when I feel some of this shit started

        • Yea, VRF, Story goes…When they quit using the old mechanical voting machines, Chicago sold some of theirs to a Soviet Bloc country. In the first election that they used them in, Richard Daley won by a landslide.

        • that link is

      29. So what happens when b.h.o. pulls an executive order out of his nether parts and says we must trade our gold for currency at a fixed price? F.D.R. did it and, though I can understand the government recalling/modifying/changing the currency it issues, that order applied to gold, not just government minted gold coinage. I just can’t understand why that order wasn’t challenged as unconstitutional. After all, 1933 hadn’t seen the total disregarding of the Constitution we are seeing today.

        Not that it matters, but if I was inclined to buy gold, I think I’d gravitate toward any form other than U.S. issued coinage. At least you could know they have no right to confiscate your private property. Drill some holes in those little gold bars, put them on a chain and call them a necklace!

        Somewhere I read that only about 13% of the estimated gold ‘out there’ in 1933 was ever exchanged. If that’s correct, a bunch of folks back then had their own NOT ONE MORE INCH moment!

        • As far as I am concerned, it is kinda just like the gun thing. I won’t turn anything in. Black market here I come.

        • The New Deal was challanged and declared unconstitutional.

          See Schechter Brothers Poultry v. US case of 1935.

          FDR had a monopoly on the airwaves and convinved the idiot populace that he was their friend.

          He ran a propaganda campaign demonizing business owners.

          • It’s challenged not challanged. Sorry had to do it, with all the corrections you have been making lately.

            • I know that. It was a typo.

        • Roosevelt’s move on gold was not aimed at the people, who did not have a lot of gold, but at the banks, that did have a lot of it. I agree that the Constitutional grounds for his action seem pretty shaky but if it was not challenged then no case came before the USSC and the matter never came up.

          Back in those days, Americans trusted their government and their leaders to do the right thing. Most of the time, they did. It is not that way anymore. We’ve been told too many lies and too much crap has hit the fan for there to be that same kind of faith. It’s about trust. Trust is not given, it is earned… and recent governments have not earned that trust. Because of this, the American people cannot be pushed somewhere we don’t want to go. We will follow when well led but not when coerced, pushed, or threatened. The current regime has not figured this out yet. They will but will likely make several more big blunders until then. They also need to learn that just because they lead does not mean we will follow… as some are now saying… not one more inch!

      30. IF nothing happens then inflation is still going to hit, and precious metals PAY. These idiots are talking about the stock market near record levels, yet it sure doesn’t compare to the price more than 4 years of gold and silver. Real value of the stock market stinks still. I think that what you need everyday is essential to have, but it is not a bad idea to stock up on some pieces of silver for later just in case the food and other supplies is not immediately needed.


        Now I would like to say something about this site and the recent asinine comments by these trolls. Everyone should be very grateful that Mac is so tolerant and let’s us express ourselves. Take it from me I so much appreciate that I am not censored like I was totally on another crackerjack site that has 1/50 or less the number of people that visit this site. On this one site you have to literally french kiss the fat ass of the owner to not be censored. In other words if your words are not totally enduring, sickening lollipop type comments, you are considered bashing and your comments are trashed.

        This site is cool, we can express ourselves and be angry at the government or other reasons. On other sites like the one I was totally banned from, you have to walk on eggshells to get a comment through. Then when you criticize an article on such a site that is harming people and you give all sorts of health facts that support this, you get barred and censored from participating adding information to help other fellow preppers/survivalists. I did on this site because in my opinion it was harming people, this advice.

        What happened? The psychiatric owner of the site did not like that I did not agree totally with the article and I guess it was considered that I was bashing the article. This would never happen on this site because Mac has much intelligence and enjoys freedom of speech, especially viweing different viewpoints on a manner. There are some very dangerous fads out there right now that are causing some real health issues, yet this one site doesn’t want to hear the differing counter agruments against something put on as an article.

        What is even worse is when someone on other sites is extremely critical of the government censorship, and then moderates everything that someone says that is not totally kiss their butts. Then they post articles, many of them that are totally to sell their sponsor’s merchandize. Forget about ever commenting on anything like this that is not completely for salesmanship of the products. What is even more amusing that while this site has hundreds of comments, this other site and some others are lucky to get to get two or more comments. Their sites putter around ranked barely in the 100 on survival sites.

        I am expressing myself like this because I am ticked off at the jackass that banned me from their site and then says how terrible government censorship is. What a total hypocrite. Also because of these trolls that are not grateful for wonderful sites like SHTFplan that are so giving and allowing for people to talk and express themselves. There are so few sites out there like SHTFplan that truly let people talk, that have not become like this survival site I was banned from that has good material on it but practices government censorship on it and ruins it.

        Just a little thought that we should all appreciate this site (SHTFplan) very much, because there are some really rotten sites out there. I don’t directly bad mouth (by name) other survival sites because they do good for people to prepare, but others probably have experienced the same crap on these other sites of being censored by the owner(s) that won’t allow any criticism of their articles, even when it is doing health harm to others.

        • Be Informed: 6.7 & 6.8 in Chile. You are right once again.

        • That’s an amazing story. I always find your comments logical and well thought out… Even when you’re pissed, you sound logical!

          Guess Chile was it, but it still wasn’t as big as we were expecting after all those polar earthquakes….

        • BI, you’re right on target…6.7 earthquake in Chile. Dude you’re good.

        • Beinformed
          there loss is our gain

          you can now spend more time here !

        • You are right. Mac is the man. I would say Mac for Prez, but I wouldn’t want to insult his intelligence and usefulness. Grin

          • @ Jim(another Jim). When you try very hard to help people with what you know, and you have someone with something up their ass delete what you were trying to do to make sure that others did not suffer from the recent health fads that are dangerous, it is very frustrating and disgusting that these other sites are on the web and call themselves free thinking and open. These sites even encourage communication, yeah only enduring french kiss the owners’ every last word as the word of God.

            This why I so much encourage anyone here to please not ruin this site for everyone else by spewing out troll like garbage like joker in NC and some select others do. We are so LUCKY to have such an excellent site such as this that allows all of us some much leverage with what we say. Please everyone appreciate that this site is around and let’s all do our best to help Mac and the site continue to flourish and provide all of us with what we all may not have soon, freedom of speech. BO and the government would love to get rid of sites like this that are about free thought.

            • BI ~ I’m so sorry that happened to you. And I have to say, I’m shocked. You always strive to be helpful and you give so much valuable information.

              I always find it especially baffling when places that espouse liberty and critical thinking don’t want people to think critically and speak freely.

              We value your input here very much! Thank you for all that you do.


              • @ Daisy. I am shocked also because I offered information from several health sources and how dangerous it can in large amounts. This was coconut oil that is a new fad in which it has 92% saturated fat. I know two people that I probably saved their lives by stopping them from using coconut oil in excess. These two people each had strokes, and after I warned them of coconut oil, both of their heads cleared and their thought processes came back. The laric acid is wonderful germ agent but linked to clogged arteries. Palm kernel is 86% saturated fat and butter is only 51%.

                The one book Prescription of cooking and Dietary Wellness by the Phyllis A. Balch, CNC and J. Balch, MD warn extensively about coconut oil. The recent fad of the benefits from coconut oil was done almost entirely from the Philippines, one of the number one exporters of coconuts. Movie theatres use coconot oil for their popcorn to make that famous smell. It was equated that the amount of saturate fat in a small popcorn cooked in coconut oil was equal to 2 Big Macs. It is bad for you, but if a person chooses to use it this is their choice entirely. I was just trying to point out all these health facts over it.

                I also pointed out that coocnut producing nations have some of the lowest life expectancy rates of the world. So consuming coconuts did nothing to improve life time rates, if anything it caused a shorten life rate. Dr. Oz would have a real debate over this with me, but I just know that people that have at least eased up on the coconut oil that have not suffered health catastrophes feel better and their thinking process improves remarkably.

                I do understand that virgin coconut oil theory that it is suppose to be safe. However I say firsthand someone that was quite trim use this daily and then get blasted with a stroke. The best oils to cook with are the following: Olive, canola, walnut, safflower, avocado, almond, sesame and flax seed. The worst are Coconut, peanut, palm, palm kernel, cottonseed, and of course the animal based and crisco. Again, if someone wants to deep fry twinkies and enjoy them, this is their choice. I just wanted to present my case to help people make their own choice and I was deleted. In fact I was deleted thereafter because I was not kissing the walrus scum boot feet of the owner of the site.

                I don’t tell people what to do with their private lives out of respect. I just want to show people a different viewpoint based on statistics. I enjoy numbers because they don’t lie, and when someone like Dr. Oz comes on and says eat as much coconut oil as you want, and the World Almanac shows what happens to coconut consuming people like in the Philippines where the average male lives 68.7 years as opposed to a male in Canada that lives 78.8 years, well. Coconut eaters don’t live longer like some fountain of youth miracle, they die sooner 10 years sooner in the Philippines. Another coconut producing country is Samoa, the male life rate there is 69.6 years. Almost all coconut producing countries have male live expectancies under 70 years and the females are below 75.

                As you can see this is simple an argument based on logic and raw math. I wasn’t telling anyone that they had to stop, just pointing out the consequences. I was banned for months after this and was not even allowed to participate in any discussions. It was also because I did not want to give out my email address. I gave up using email after two viruses fried two of my computers, even with Norton protection. Two other viruses made for expensive repair. It is awful to see your computer go belly up, twice. I simple didn’t trust this site, that had already been hacked twice before. This pissed off the owner also that I just wanted to protect my computer.

                I am glad not to have to walk on eggshells anymore anyway. I did enjoy giving survival people ideas, and the articles posted are sometimes quite good and do good for others. The commenting process is what totally sucks on the site. I am not out for revenge for the BS, I really just wanted to express myself that we are so lucky that Mac and this site doesn’t practice these terrible commenting regulations like this asshole does. I really want to compare a very bad survival site for expressing yourself to this very excellent site for commenting. We should not ever take for granted this site and appreciate the openness. This is why I become so pissed off when trolls attack people here, because it is such a good site and a rare one. The success shows from hundreds of comments each article to a pantry couple if these other sites that censor people like some government does.

                By the way Daisy, thank you for all you do, in fact thank you to everyone that spends their time to try to aid others to prepare in what is coming.

                • @ Daisy. One other thing. I was banned from people seeing my comments for months, but I could still send comments in which the owners of the site could then delete them. What irriatated me so much was that recently I was totally banned from sending any ideas on preparation or anything else. I thought that I could do some good by sending the site some ideas on preparation for what is coming to this world. This was also denied as I got a message that said I didn’t have permission to comment. This was the true insult that said, shut up you creep to me. This just made me appreciate the freedom of this site that much more so. That was truly what I was trying to put over to everyone, appreciate SHTFplan.

                • That’s ridiculous BI.

                  Now, I have to respectfully disagree with you regarding the coconut oil. I think it’s the best fat that you can buy. It contains essential fatty acids that you can’t get anywhere else.

                  People often underestimate the need for fat in a truly healthy diet. It’s a vital nutrient and C-oil is a great source of that nutrient.

                  That being said, moderation is the key. Of course you can’t suddenly consume an extra 500-1000 calories a day in c-oil and expect to remain lean.

                  I use virgin organic coconut oil in place of butter and shortening in nearly all baking recipes. It is far healthier. Depending on what the recipe is, I also use it in some other types of cooking – it’s incredible in Thai-inspired stir fries.

                  It also has many excellent topical uses and when combined with another oil, like olive, makes a fantastic base for healing ointments.

                  The key, in my opinion, is to use d-oil moderately, like you should use any type of fat. Use it in place of other fats in your diet, not along with them.

                  Just my .02 on the topic. 🙂

                  • We have done the research on coconut oil…it is king.

                    Everything Daisy says is correct and alot more.

                  • Oh – BI – the “ridiculous” comment was not meant towards your thoughts on Coconut Oil – I just reread that and saw how it looked! I was referring to the treatment you received from the owner of the other site.

                    My apologies for the poor way that was communicated!

                  • @ Daisy. That is what is a constructive debate is about, different points of views. I have seen firsthand what coconut oil does to the body. It is excellent anti-viral and anti-bacteria, but when consumed in excess it leads to heart attack and stroke. I go by the coconut eaters of the Caribbean and other tropical zones and their life expectancy is dramatical lower than other countries. In my opinion and other health people I know it is not good for you. The other oils are, as lauric acid is linked to clogged up arteries. I have seen firsthand people that have used it for years experience all sorts of heart related problems and then when they ceased it, they got better.

                    By the way the life expectancy for Thailand is 71.2 for male and 76.1 for females as consuming coconuts has done nothing to reach older age of say Japan that is 80.3 for males and 87.2 for females. Fat is important granted, but the right type of fat. Coconut has proven by those countries’ people that consume it die sooner. I am just going by the World Almanac book of facts that shows people in coconut countries have drastically lower life expectancies. Coconut has not saved them for longer lives, if anything it has shorten their lives.

                    It is one thing to debate an issue, and it is another thing to ban someone from communicating because they did not like what was said. I go by statistics a lot, and this is how I predict earthquakes, the math doesn’t add up with coconut oil in countries where the natives use this all the time. Their life rates should be up where Japan is, but it isn’t. This is besides the point. You are correct, no one deserves to be treated like this because they present a differing point of view. When someone presents a logical agrument then both parties use their minds to think out what was said and a postive exchange of thoughts happens. This is good.

                    That asshole that runs his little nickel and dime operation simply deletes anything that he doesn’t agree with, rather than try to present an agrument in favor of his point of view. This is what is called a peckerhead that has to be right all the time and anyone calling him for a mistake or a different opinion is simply censored. This sucks and what was bothering me so deeply, and why I wanted everyone to aprreciatwe this site where freedom is king.

                    One another thing is that I don’t want to tell you personally what to do, I just want to present statisitics to everyone and let them make up their own minds. I have found numbers do not lie, and to me coconut is dangerous as almost all people in countries that eat it regually don’t live too long. Oh Daisy, thank you again for coming to my defense, you are all right in my book.

            • BI,

              You are on the money regarding some crackpot sites, and yes every once in a while it is good to be reminded of how fortunate we are to have a site like this that is firmly rooted in freedom. Also please keep the seismic activity reports coming, I am always amazed how you can pick up on clues that others may miss, not to mention your accuracy is phenomenal.

              • It seems like some sites were constructed and maintained not to educate, but to make money. The owners of many of these sites could care less about preppers or survivalist, all they want is our money. Say anything negative about one of the site’s sponsors or sponsored products and you’re out.

        • BE Informed, your not from this country are you? Where were you born? Have you stated where you were born and i missed it? just very curious, thats all.

          • @ kaynine. I am an American citizen born in the United States. I have watched the country I was born in decay in all facets. I have watched the leaders become worse and worse. I have seen the people stop caring about anything other than whom wins Dancing with the Stars. I have seen most people become total mental sloths. I have seen the country in which I was born, go downhill from about the late 80’s early 90’s. I have the maverick way of thinking that was so much more common decades ago in the U.S. Thankfully there are still some people left that have not been poisoned by society, this type of people are the ones on this site.

        • What’s the name of the “other” site? We can get all liquored up Saturday night and do a drive by.

          • @ Homie G. Dawg. Thank you for the support, but I have a kind of different philosophy that I will not harm a fellow prepper/survivalist directly. This person still operates a site that provides some really good information on prepping, it is just the comment regulations that royally suck. I always try to aim for the better good, and any survival site that gives us information that can better prepare us all, it is serving the purpose.

            It may sound stupid but I truly think that practically all preppers/survivalists have that special uniqueness about them, and even when one of them decides to be a total economy sized peckerhead, there is a chance that they will learn from being an asshole and see what they are doing is rotten. If not, at least they provided valuable survival tips that we all can use. This is why I get some ticked off at joker in NC and finx and other trolls that just come on to this site and are total liabilities. These butt whiffs irritate people and cause people to refocus their attention away from what is very important. I have asked these pimples on the asses of life to please contribute something or at least be respectful of the site, the readers, and Mac. Instead they spew out vulgar abuse like a backed up toilet. These characters are what we need to get rid of.

            It is getting worse and worse each day and I just hope everyone is really preparing mentally for the day when life changes abruptly into the direction that most of us have been trying to prepare for.

            • BI,

              Know the site well, if he don’t like it then it going to be seen..


        • Hey buddy, i resent that comment about cracker jacks…
          Always enjoy your posts.

        • BI… there is a chart available on the Internet that tells us all we need to know about the stock market. It is a chart of the Dow 30 Industrials, as denominated in gold. Basically, it shows how many ounces of gold it takes to buy a share of the Dow 30 stocks. This chart does not show the rosy picture that the chart of the Dow 30 vs. the US dollar does. Hmmm… why is that? Could it be because the US dollar is one sick puppy that is so weak it is making stocks look better than they really are? Why, yes, it could!

          Now, add to that the $85B Bernanke is pumping into the banks each month and figure that at least part of that ends up in the stock market. This is why we have market “growth” without any economic growth. Truth to tell, this kind of growth is usually referred to as “inflation”.

          All previous recessions ended with a large jump in domestic output and employment. This time? Nope, very little is being created in this funny-money economy, either as goods or as wages. This is not a real economy. It is a smoke and mirrors, house of cards economy fueled by monopoly money that is printed up out of thin air in virtually unlimited amount. It is then used to buy real things, so of course there is a huge separation between the prices of what is real and what is not. This is a lot of the reason why gold and silver are priced so low.

          I believe that Peter Schiff is correct and that the market / banking crash of 2008 was not the Greater Depression that he had forecast years before then. It was really just the warm-up act. Although it is very difficult to know when the real crash will come, my best guess is that it will be in 2014-15 and it will be a real doozie. It will make the 1930s look like the good old days by comparison. Of data, I have none. Of experience in the market, I have much. Every market has a “feel” that one can ascertain after many years of study… and this market feels as if it is about to roll over into a serious downturn. If it does not, I will be THRILLED. But the odds of not having a huge crash in the next couple of years seems remarkably low.

      31. Who is going to pay for all these Mexicans?

        We should just let some female Mexicans in to be our concubines. Theyre cheap and easy. And they dont take up much space.

        • There it is! The meds wore off. You should get checked for bipolar disease.

          • The wealth inequality in this country only exists because the government is propping it up that way. With small government, a natural redistribution of wealth will occur.

            • With small government, a natural redistribution of wealth will occur.

              Please explain what you are talking about. Do you even know?

              natural redistribution of weath? There’s no such thing. I think you’re trying to describe ‘get off your lazy ass and work or go die somewhere where I dont have to look at you’.

              • In other words, that’s called earning and that is not redistribution of wealth.

      32. I wish I had invested in canned soup a couple of years ago

        the can that is now $1.25
        was just 50 cents 3 years ago !!!

        • and the can got smaller. But it has too much salt in it anyway.


        Not to be off topic here, but I believe this deserves some attention.

        I find it incredibly fishy and coincidental that this shooting happened to a recent public figure in the midst of an assault on our firearms.
        Would I be going off the deep end if I said this could have been an assassination, or purposeful assault for the purpose of passing tighter gun regulation?

        Here is a snippet from the article:
        “As Congress holds a much-anticipated hearing on gun control, there was a disturbing reminder that gun violence in America never takes a break. It’s been reported that Hadiya Pendleton, a 15-year-old girl from Chicago, was gunned down on Tuesday, just days after she performed with her school band at President Obama’s inauguration. Pendleton — an honors student, volleyball player, and majorette at King College Prep — was shot at a park just blocks away from her school.”

        • GK… I am ashamed to say I thought these very dark things as well. (same with the horrific Sandy Hook news that just doesn’t have all the puzzle pieces included in the box, etc. etc.. it’s really starting seem contrived).
          Anyway – I had to have a few minutes today; reminding myself that no matter how evil, how defiled it may really be…. a young life is yet again the product of this insanity we try to find some definition.

          I detest having these thoughts when not long ago news of such travesty made me turn to prayers for these souls, not feeling like a conspiracy theorist against my own .gov.

          Unfortunately… I have run too far down the rabbit hole to suspect that, yes – Dear Alice – anything is completely possible. I really do miss the days when I would have LOUDLY replied “You, sir, are a nut in need of help”. Those days it was much easier to move about the zoo. It’s all become very surreal.
          These days – My prayers are more in earnest for we are in seriously deep quagmire.

          ~..~ reminder – keep your hands inside the cart at all times, some beasties make up the ‘rules of play’ as we move along the trail.

          P.S. good call BI… I had no doubt and only sorrow for any loss that didn’t have your warning.

        • GK – I read it on the Fox website and the very last few lines said she was not part of a gang, but the other 12 or so people she was hanging with were gang related. She should have picked her friends a little better. Sad, but true.

      34. BI, 6.7, Chile, 15 minutes ago.

      35. BI, 6.7 in Chile 20 minutes ago…

      36. one thing to not forget when talking about preps

        don’t overlook your pets

        remember the fate of the dogs in ONE SECOND AFTER ?

        I keep a one year supply on hand now

        5 gallon buckets with gamma lids the way to go

        • Satori, One Second After seered that in my mind. Kitty food is always on the list to keep stockpiling.

          • No pets here, but I have Kitty Litter!! LOL

        • How do you keep it form going rancid? Store bought dog food, because of the fat content has a somewhat short shelf life. It can actually spoil even if sealed. I’ve been looking for a long term dog food alternative for stocking.

        • Guess I’ll go stock up on cat food. They sit and stare at me until they are fed.
          I don’t have a basement so boxes and cans are everywhere. Here in the south, we eat grits. Its a cheap item and filling. Eggs are $2.79-$3.50 a dozen. MY FAVORITE BACON (Wrights) IS $8.00 a package and its less weight. Lipton tea, oh they think I wouldn’t notice, their bags are half the amount filled and higher priced. Cheese, I pay $13.00 for a large grated bag at Sam’s and place in about 6-8 smaller bags and freeze. I have had to use some of these items. I have a husband with Alzheimer and an adult son with a lung problem that lives here. The co-pays for the son is taking a lot of the money as he constantly having tests, shots, treatments and visits to doctors. Something breaking down all the time. Trying to keep my car going and its had $2000.00 worth of repairs this year. It just doesn’t seem get any better. I do have some gold and silver and trying to hold on to it. In Washington, the truth is, ITS A BIG COVER UP.

          • Grandma, Best wishes to ya…it looks like you have a couple of challenges. I hear they make us stronger.

            My truck is 13 years old and is still holding up well. I keep about $2,000 in silver tucked away for emergencies….like vehicle repairs.

            Hold onto your silver & gold for as long as you can. I think it is going to bust out soon and then you’ll be able to get more for it.

            Hang in there.

            • My truck is 1999 with nearly 250k miles, it is just about ready to fall into pieces on the side of the road. Vehicles don’t last too long with all the salt they put on the roads in Maine in the winter.

          • Grandma,

            You in Tx? if so any where close to the Panhandle?


            • No DPS, I’m in Georgia. Just missed the tornato yesterday. Kindle, my car is a 1999, so 13 years old also. My husband has a Toyota truck but he can’t drive it. Its been sitting up for a few years. It only has 23,0000 miles, bought new 2002, has same tires on it, they got to be rotten. Need to fix it up for sale.
              Plan to hold on to silver and gold. My question is, when do you know when its reached its peak?

              • “Plan to hold on to silver and gold. My question is, when do you know when its reached its peak?”

                Knowing when anything is at a peak or a trough is VERY difficult and even the best of investors cannot often tell. There are two things that you can try, though. First, there may come a time when there is a mania in silver. We had one back around 1980 when silver went to $50 an oz. There was silver being bought and traded everywhere. The same thing could happen again but, as with most things, there is no guarantee of that. Second, you can do what I do in such cases and take the cowards’ way out. Do some dollar cost selling so that your sales are spread out over time and not all at once. If you sell all at once and it is still low, you can lose big. Again, no guarantee with this but it should be about as helpful as dollar cost buying. The final thing is less of a plan but also happens sometimes and that is to sell when we must.

      37. Israel strikes some kind of military convoy in Syria according to FOX news.

      38. I’m sorry to be totally off topic but I bet someone here can help me. I dug out from my basement an old cold blast lantern. I figured it ou pretty well, but now that its lit I can’t figure out how to stop it! The wick adjuster doesn’t seem to work and you can’t blow it out. Any help?

        • You need the wick adjuster to work to put it out.

          Just cover the chimney and smother the thing or use an extinguisher.

          Dont pour water on it.

          Youre going to burn the house down, little girl. 🙂

        • I had the same problem with an old oil lamp I got at a yard sale – I snapped the adjuster right off. Tried pliers and all sorts of stuff and still couldn’t turn that silly thing.

          I finally ended up having to leave it lit until it used up all the oil (there wasn’t a whole lot). I put it outside in my yard on top of a big rock when I went to work and by the time I got home it was out.

          Not stellar advice, I know. 🙂

          • Daisy,

            Go to the Lehmans web site and pick up a couple of Diertz lanterns, very cheap and will last you forever. Stay away from that chinese junk they tend to catch on fire. LOL right before Christmas this yr they run the Blizzard lantern for 9.95 each with free shipping so you know what my friends and family got for Christmas gifts.



        • Dollars,

          Lehmans also still has parts for those old cold blast, they even have new ones.


      39. central Chile just got hit with a 6.7

      40. There is a calculate move on to extract the gold from the population at large. Open a lot of “CASH FOR GOLD” stores, put the economy in the crapper, allow the price of gold to rise incrementally and substantially.

        When the average Joe is stretched at the end of the month and needs a few bucks for the mortgage, groceries, or living expense – hell, there are even “CASH FOR GOLD” stores right INSIDE the grocery store for your convenience.

        Over the past year and a half the gold has dribbled IN to the PTB and OUT of the hands of the population at large. Once the vein they are mining, (you and me) runs dry and they believe they have all they are going to get — then and only then will the price rise DRAMATICALLY.

        For the past two years we have been in the calm before the storm. These guys are generational thinkers. Only this time, like their rush to disarm the population has shown, even the PTP can not control the precise TIMING of everything. That is why it seems things are unfolding at such a fast and furious pace.

        The shit is about to hit the fan on high speed…
        and there ain’t nothing no one can do to stop it.

        • “These guys are generational thinkers.”

          Yep. So am I. My PM stash is to support my family if the SHTF while I am alive and for my kids and grand kids after I am gone. I have instructed them in its value and the fact that it is insurance against financial disaster. Hopefully, they have gotten that message and it will serve its intended purpose. If not, well, I tried.

      41. 6.7 in Chili just now – (double confirmation this time…)
        How does it tie into 5+ off Oregon coast last night?

      42. You better enjoy this site while you can cause you know what is coming down the pike. Mac has held back on a few of us with our outspoken and highly inflamatory speech. Even the trolls have a word or two.
        I am going to say this again for it is worth repeating. Especially to new preppers.

        Start at todays editorials and go back. I mean WAY BACK. You will start to see information that is not throughly covered by the News Media. You also begin to see the common ground that link media events. Very low key. Just by reading the titles you can get a feel of why things are going south.
        The problem with all this is that we have inadvertantly snared ourselves by willful investigation of events. By George, most of us have gone down the rabbit hole and have swallowed many a red pill. The more we read the more we get angry.
        Discharge your anger by preparing. Learn a skill. Do some drills. Make It Work! Know that there are others with you. That in the end we will overcome.

        Not one more inch.

        • Slingshot,

          Very good advice Sir,I have said this before but our mind is the key to good prepping. Learn those skills ppl,find your own weak points and work on them. Become a asset to any group you join or may need to join.
          I’m one of those lucky one, not very smart but have been able to fix anything all my life.I can take your truck down to the frame and rebuild it back new, same goes with most all motorcycles.
          I can fix your plumbiing or just build you a new log cabin.
          I can grow pretty much anything without having to use power equipment as well as setting up rain harvesting systems.
          The things I’m not good at I work at learning them everyday,even while I reading these comments.
          Something I have also been doing is adding all the info from my computers to a flash drive including all those books I own, just in case you have to bail.

          Have a good one.


      43. I had 2.0 Chili dogs for lunch today and
        16oz. Dungeness crabs for dinner last night.
        This is some scary stuff!

      44. Bought an AKM last year and started buying pre-’65 coins before that. Glad I did both.

      45. This past election Obama got 50.9% of the vote.
        He made it by the skin of his teeth and probably
        the rigged voting machines. He had better be very
        aware the other 50% are ‘on to him,’ and will fight
        him every step of the way. He may be a ‘great’
        orator, but his Actions speak louder than words.
        I suggest he Support and follow the Constitution and the Bill of Rights, don’t run roughshod over them.
        I can’t watch or listen to him, everytime he is on
        the t.v. I turn the channel.

        • He make it by the skin of his skin.

          Only stupid people are taken with orators.

        • Emily,

          Has there been much talk up in NY about standing up to those BS laws? I have not been able to find out anything other then 1 gun assc taking it to court..


          • we marched on Albany and have held MANY town meetings

      46. Thanks, Eisenkroutz and Twodogs– I appreciate you’ll’s comments! I’m considering going to a better location which has cheaper rent, closer to family, close to the mountains/national forest and where a lot of people already are preparing for collapse (living sustainably in groups). I do have a camper truck with bed in the back. I’m trying to decide if I should move all my stuff first and then buy a gun and look for place to hunker down– or buy the gun and then later move to better location. I’m concerned about possible ban on guns. money is tight! (On social security). Once settled, could work part time.

        • Buy pistol first.

          .380 is good for woman or 9mm if you can be accurate with it.

        • Cindy,

          If you have never shot a gun then buy a decent 12 gauge shot gun. It would cost you way to much to learn with a pistol. Plus to stay good with a pistol you need to shoot at least every 2 weeks, To be very good with a pistol you really need to shoot a couple times a week.



          • Cindy, if you are small frame or slight build go with the 20 guage shot guns. 12 guage is good but it kicks my butt after a few shots. I recently switched out to a 20 guage and am extremely happy with it.

            • I am a small framed woman only 5’1″. I didn’t do good with a 12 gauge and dh got me a youth 20 gauge and I love it for my short arms.

              • @ JayJay and kimintn. The nice thing about a shotgun is you have a wide variety of shots to choose from. While you can’t find the 000, 00, 0 in a 20 gauge you can still get 2 and 3 buckshot that would take care of most anyone. The diameter of the 20 gauge makes the ought sizes too inaccurate to put into the shotshell. I think the 20 guage is .62 or .68. Gunsmith could tell you much more about this than me. Even larger birdshot is good for close up. Slugs are more expensive, usually 80 cents to a dollar each, but the common 20 gauge slug is about the same size as a .50 caliber. They hunt big game in many areas using shotguns because the round doesn’t travel nearly as far as your hunting rifles. Many areas have too many houses close by to each other. The sabot slug can take down almost anything, but you cannot use it in a smooth barrel, tears it up.

                With anything shotshell or slug the higher the velocity the better the punch. I have regular slugs for the smooth barrel shotgun that list it at 1680 feet per second. That with a 20 gauge and a slug about an 1/2 inch hollow point is going to stop anyone if you can even wing them. Even size 2 buckshot is like throwing 18 size .27 caliber pellets at an attacker. Even one of those placed right is putting the maniac down.

                The common .22 is a good choice also, but again I would look for the higher velocity bullets. Most long rifle are about 1100-1200 feet per second, but the Stinger .22’s have a velocity of 1650 feet per second. They are about 13 cents each as opposed to 3-4 cents each for the regular .22 LR, but it is worth it. You can feel the difference and you have more stopping power the higher the velocity, kinetic energy. This is why it ticks me off when these antigun grabbers demonize the AR-15 which uses .223 which is nothing but a jacked up .22 that is travelling at about 3500-3800 feet per second. You look at the actual projectile from an AR-15 and it is tiny, less than a quarter of an inch. The velocity is what has the stopping power.

                • 5.56 doesn’t come close to 3800fps. .22-250 does, but I hear it ate up barrels in automatic rifles much too quickly.

                • YES–Stingers are the ultimate for a .22

                  • Also maybe look at the Aguila Super Maximum. Excellent .22 round

          • another plus is shotgun ammo is still fairly cheap and somewhat available. and aim on a shotgun much more forgiving than a pistol. wont need to burn thru many rounds before you get the hang of a shotgun.

            • oops, yeah, what dps said!

              • KininTn,

                LOL i can not be said enough.



            • You can also pick up sights that attach to the vent rib of a shotgun. Inexpensive. 50 yard range with a tight choke. Picking some up for spring turkey season.

        • Listen to DPS. Shotgun is a good call.

        • I disagree with most gun recommenders, Buy a good 22 pistol or rifle. AND SHOOT IT. Ammo is cheap, If you are not used to recoil or blast, 22 won’t bother you, Any round you can actually hit someone with is far superior to any round you can’t. Just keep shooting till you run out of ammo. All kinds of studies have been done and it really does not matter what you hit people with, when you hit them, they run.

          • @ paranoid – that is good advice, except if anyone is just starting to look for .22 ammo, it’s been mostly snatched up.

            @ cindy – as for deciding between a 9mm vs shotgun, if you only have 2 bullets (i know, rounds…humor me) would you feel more protected with 2 9mm bullets or 2 shotgun shells?

            • also, if push came to shove, and you have little experience with firearms, you’d have a better chance hunting small game with a shotgun than a pistol or rifle. not that cleaning wouldn’t take some time…. 🙂

        • A woman’s first weapon should be a 20 gauge shotgun. It’ll work great for self defense up to 50 yards and be useful for small game and deer hunting. I have personally taken 2 deer with a 20 gauge

          • Just watch out for the recoil on some of those ultra-lightweight 20’s. I bought a Mossberg Bantam 500 20 ga for my kids that weighs about 5 lbs, maybe even less. I have run all kinds of ammo through it, from light 2 3/4″ game loads to 3″ mag slugs, and every one kicks more than the similar load in my 7 lb 12 ga over-under bird gun. The 3″ mag 20 ga slugs kick way more than my .300 Win Mag bolt action rifle. Just saying that lighter is not always better.

      47. emily–I felt the same way about Bush. He turned my stomach.. couldn’t bear to watch him on TV. I used to be a staunch democrat. Now, I abhor both parties. They both suck.

      48. On the 15th day, on or before Jan.30 there would be a large earthquake in one of the following areas: China, Japan, Western Indonesia, New Guinea to Fiji, Northern Chile to Ecaudor and Mexico. 6.8 in northern Chile just like where it should have been from the past earthquake records from the polar and sub polar quakes. Talk about close.

        I honestly did not think it was going to be correct this time, this was the last day. Right on target though, as I warned VRF that this area was prime time for an earthquake hit. I did think it was going to be larger than 6.8, more in the low in mid 7 range at least. Got the correct location though.

        This doesn’t mean the earthquake danger is over, by no means is it over. These polar earthquakes indicate more to come, probably larger. Let’s watch the plate boundaries for a couple of a days and it should start to show the next target. It might over the next few hours. I did have much question as today was getting old, but it happened, so this system still works. i can’t believe that it actually works this well.

        • our ears and eyes are up boss, were still on alert

          Much thanks for the work you do

        • Sorry BI was supposed to be thumbs up…

        • I look for you every day! Thanks for your work!

      49. @ PrepperGal35. Please read comment 1087632 that I sent to JustOneGuy last night on the previous article about the Nazca plate and the Juan De Fuca plate as when the Nazca plate has earthquakes on the western side of it, this means that the plate is in motion towards the South American plate (colliding with it) and a large earthquake follows, thus today’s 6.8 in northern Chile. The Juan De Fuca plate is just like the Nazca plate as it is colliding with the North American plate. You had a 5.3 on the western side on that plate last night. Yes there is a danger to the Cascadia fault. More earthquakes on the western side of the fault and look out.

        Also just this morning on post 1089813 on also the previous article at 11:14 AM I mentioned that unless there was a big earthquake today, on that 15th day of the present cycle that something horrible was coming. Well it did happen, but what I see there is a lot of energy that still needs to be let loose. I still can’t believe that I said northern Chile just a few hours ago and then bang it happens. I tell you I was getting worried that the system had a flaw in it and I would have to rethink everything tomorrow on the 16th day, but evidentally it doesn’t.

        • @ PrepperGal35. Strange that it came up Anonymous, must have been something I did to lose the name Be Informed. Had this happen before, better check this keyboard, the keys sometimes stick. I will be watching the earthquake map for more activity.

          • Thank you BI for the reply especially if it’s repeat information.
            With so many of us replying it’s hard to scroll through and find what you might have missed – though I try to look for your responses!!!
            Can’t wait until we have one place to post the earth signs!

      50. beinformed is getting SCARY good at his predictions… 6.7 mag in chile..AS PREDICTED.

        nice work once again beinformed

      51. @ swami…you had 20 chili dogs? holy shit, You should enter the NATHANS hotdog eating contest in NEW YORK.

        • @badpooch — 2.0 (two point 0) chili dogs.
          Swami does not see Mustard belt in his future.

      52. Got buyers remorse. Just spent $500 online for solo stove, rice, breakfast stuff, and couple other things. I always get buyers remorse even when I buy some silver. Why is that?

        • Ugly,

          I just don’t get it, I can see the food and other items.
          But the solo stove? How much are these things? I guess when the time comes and I need a little stove I will just make one out of a old 1gal metal can. Just cut the top off and take your can opener and punch some holes around the base. Guess I just never really needed all the cool stuff…LOL. Keep prepping brother and you will feel better when it all gets to your house.


          • DPS….The solo oven plus the pan (yes I bought the pan too) was about $110. I also bought the fire starter.

            When I buy, I buy. I wait, then wait, then wait, then wait, then I suddenly buy and then I get buyers remorse.

            It looks pretty durable. You have to remember, I am not the most advanced prepper. I cashed in two mutual funds that were not doing anything, so hopefully I make some wise decisions. I am keeping my best mutual fund (gotto take risks and also trust)

            I will use the can idea too now that you said that.

            I think I will make my own solar oven. Any ideas? I’m thinking of black steel with two window panes. I will have a box where the window pane will cover it, but also a extended top with a window pane at 45d angle with a layer of aluminum.

            PS. Glad I saved some money for the waterproof matches.

              • JayJay….looks like you got a good deal. Oh well, I bought what I bought. I’ll let everyone know how it well it works. Thanks for the link.

                • Oh, I actually bought it for a charcoal starter–but after seeing all the ads for a solo stove, adapted it.

            • Ugly,

              Hit youtube up and just type in Solar Oven. Made one last summer out card board alum foil and a old storm window pane I had laying around worked pretty damn good.

              And don’t waste you money on the fire kindle crap, go buy you a bag of cotten balls, small jar of vasoline, melt the vasoline and pour it into yhe cotton balls. You can light up even damp would with that.


              • or save your dryer lint.

              • DPS….Thanks for the good tip. I am getting a notebook to write this stuff down.

                I already bought the stuff online with credit card. It was spendy, but I have no regrets. I will use the stuff. But I will also do what you have suggested.

                For about $480 I bought the solostove, the pan for the solostove, 4 gallons of powdered fire starter, 5 gallons of rice, 120 breakfast meals, a breakfast packet to eat first, and free shipping.

                If I use about one tsp to one tbsp per firestarter, then that could be used for well over 500 meals.

                I have a IR Temp Gun. I will make a solostove from a can and punched holes as you say. I will check the water boiling time and the IR temp between the two methods. I’ll let you know. If solostove lowers the cooking time, then it will be worth it.

                On your solar oven, what temps do you get from inside oven versus what the ambient temps are on full sun days for both?

                • Ugly,

                  Never checked the temp, just know after 8 hrs I had some damn good chile. I will make another one soon and check the temp, my window supplier sent me one of those new themo’s you just put the laser on anything and it tells you the temp..


                • A good design (home built or commercial) should be capable of hitting 400 degrees in the summer. The more reflective area you can get focused on the inside of the box the higher it will be.

                  If you build your own be wary of using any materials you wouldn’t want to eat, especially those that will off gas. You can use a sealed cooking container to help with that.

                  You can just google solar oven designs to get a number of good ones.

                  We have both a homemade and a store bought and they both work about as well as the other. From late spring to early fall we do a lot of cooking in them avoid heating up the house which you then have to pay to cool back down. Cooking outside with solar is free both ways, no cost to cook, no cost to cool back down.

                  FYI the same concept of solar reflection can be used to heat water, get an old water heater and strip off the outer shell and insulation and paint it black with stove paint. Then cover some plywood with foil and contact cement and arrange them around the water heater. You’ll have boiling hot water with just a little sun. If you can also work out a way to pump that into a high density storage system you can have all the hot water you need all night long. 🙂 We don’t have this in action but I do have all the parts necessary tucked away around the location.

                  I don’t care how bad the S hits the F, I’m not giving up hot showers. 🙂

        • It prolly has something to do with uncertainty. You’re prolly not rolling in dough and combine that with the uncertainty of what’s coming and you feel sorta guilty for spending the money when you coulda done…

        • Ugly… when a person gets “buyers remorse” it usually means that they are unsure that they have done the right thing by making that purchase. Consider why you are buying certain things, what they mean to you, and what could happen to you if you don’t have them. Buying silver and gold really isn’t spending your money; it is only converting money from one form into another because silver and gold ARE money. They can be converted back into paper, at need. Also, gold and silver are best used as inflation fighters over a long time period, so try to ignore the short-term price changes. For me, owning silver means I no longer have to care about these little price moves. 🙂

      53. @DtoD
        snuff off the air supply…should have been a snuffer with it

      54. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them, and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for, that is the beginning of the end of any nation.

        • Agreed. That is exactly what happened to the USSR. Everyone sat around on their ass waiting for someone else to create something that they could all then share. Unfortunately, Atlas shrugged and then there were no more goodies for the benefit of those who did not create them. I’m sure that it was a terrible shock for half of their population to awaken one day and discover that the unearned benefits spigot was not only turned off but busted off. Pity that the USA has not learned a thing from the Soviet experience. Lessons like that really should be heeded.

      55. No big secret. All the smart and wise people have been turning their paper into PMs,protection (guns/ammo/security), and food stocks for years and months. A larger number of people are now waking up and not a minute too soon.

        Where you place your priorities is what is important and different for persons depending upon their locale and their needs. Each has to sail their own ship when it comes to investing for the future.

        Now, on the lighter side….

        Grandma’s Boyfriend

        A 5-year-old boy went to visit his grandmother one day.

        Playing with his toys in her bedroom while grandma was dusting, he looked up and said, ‘Grandma, how come you don’t have a boyfriend now that Grandpa went to heaven?’

        Grandma replied, ‘Honey, my TV is my boyfriend. I can sit in my bedroom and watch it all day long. The religious programs make me feel good and the comedies make me laugh. I’m happy with my TV as my boyfriend.’

        Grandma turned on the TV, and the reception was terrible.

        She started adjusting the knobs, trying to get the picture in focus.

        Frustrated, she started hitting the backside of the TV hoping to fix the problem.

        The little boy heard the doorbell ring, so he hurried to open the door and there stood Grandma’s minister.

        The minister said, ‘Hello son, is your Grandma home?’

        The little boy replied, ‘Yeah, she’s in the bedroom bangin’ her boyfriend.’

        The minister fainted.

        Now, that’s funny…..I don’t care who you are!

        • holy crap – glad I hadn’t taken that drink of dr pepper yet!!! I’d have to buy a new laptop!!! Don’t think I could tell the guys at Best Buy that I had to replace my computer cuz I snorted my drink out of my nose!!!

          dty – thanks much! I needed a good laugh today!!!

        • Damn it!! Sprite just went up my nose!! LMAO!! Can’t tell you how much I needed that laugh.

          “Not One More Inch!”

          KySSG . . . out.

      56. Very few people are buying gold or silver. Half a billion dollars for a population of 300 million is about 1 or 2 dollars per American.

        I think more money went to buying guns and just paying bills. A lot of people are struggling and not working enough hours. I think most of the money is from people dipping into savings in order to live.

        • Totally agree Barncat,
          I give an uneducated guess that the majority of the 114 billion $$$ that was withdrawn was used to pay off debt incurred during 2012 and previously. I’d say taxes ate up the most and then credit card debt due to Christmas and Holidays. Most people were probably thinking like we did; This may be the last Christmas without the world being in total chaos and the dollar collapsed with America’s debt in bankruptcy, so were gonna make it a good one. Now about the other 30 to 40 billion. I guesstimate that the majority of that went to buying firearms and ammo. Say 80 %. Another 5 or 6 billion went towards stocking up on food stuffs and heating fuel for the remainder of winter.

          A majority of Americans are still seeing the vivid images of the devastation left by another major disaster hitting where it shouldn’t have. Sandy slamming the mid-eastern shores. Many of those victims have had to rely on savings accounts to try and rebuild their lives from the ground up. Most insurance companies “stiffed” them.

          If only half a billion of that 114 billion went into buying gold, than you can bet the remaining cash wasn’t put into stock funds or stuck away under a mattress.
          It went to good use. A few million was probably pissed away by old farts at the casino, but hey, you can’t take it with you. Our government will make sure of that.

      57. Greetings Folks!
        Just a few of my thoughts on the PM’s…
        Gold is nice,silver is easier to use for day-to-day transactions.Having said that,the best PM is…YOURSELF.It’s YOUR set of skills and/or abilities that will keep you alive when TSHTF.Even in the Death Camps in WWII Nazi Germany if you had a skill(barber,dentist,etc.)they set you “apart” from the rest of the “lost” heading for the gas chambers.And remember also,that having a STRONG faith in God(2ed Tim. 3:16) via knowledge of his word kept more than a few going when many others just gave up and died in those dark times.Some Christian friends of mine who lived thru that told us stories of those dark times then.One out of four of even their “group” did indeed perish,but there was a 100% death rate for almost everyone else.So you decide what’s more valuable to you….
        In Germany when the “Sheeple” finally woke up(mark my words,they WILL wake up here too!) to the fact that the “Fiat” money was losing it’s value TOO FAST that things went well and truly FUBAR for the Weimar Republic as a whole.
        When things were truly friable,Hitler appeared on stage.We know how that turned out for everyone…
        Best to the Folks here,

        • If history is any guide, and it often is, sheeple do not awaken until they hear the frantic bleating of the first of them being butchered. THEN they come FULLY awake!

      58. Hi, Kindle, the lady at the gun shop suggested I buy the Mossberg Maverick 88. She said when you make the sound of loading it (before shooting), it has such a distinct sound, it will usually convince any home invaders to leave. It sounded GOOD! (I am small framed, slender). Thanks!

        • I have a Mossberg 500 field/deer combo and have had much better luck with it than the 12 guage. The Maverick 88 was sold out otherwise I would have seriously looked at that one. It’s cheaper and will do the trick.

        • Just a word of tactical advice..up to you or anyone else on here to listen to it.
          That shot gun(or any shot gun for that matter) should already be loaded,(yes one in the breech with a full magazine)and ready to rock..dont ever give your assailant the heads up. The element of surprise should never be discounted as your 1st step in survival

          The only time some one should hear you rack a round into its chamber is after the first round has already found its target.

          yes, Im dead serious


          • VRF:

            Agreed there. Five in the tube and one in the spout. Double ought buckshot.

            Pretty happy with my Stevens Security model 320. And just as a heads-up, Cabela’s still has a good supply of shotgun ammo.

            “Not One More Inch!”

            KySSG . . . out.

            • Agree that a good shotgun is a real jewel. I like my Mossy 500 a lot. Have about 250 rounds of #4 buck for it but want to get more plus some bird shot shells as well. Gotta love the #4 buck. 8 rounds of 27-pellet whup-ass! Recoil is a bit on the heavy side but I like it. 🙂

        • Indian

      59. Germany wanting it’s gold back from Federal Reserve storage speaks volumes for a lack of trust in the system. Nothing I read is changing attitudes to positive. People and governments are opting for increased financial security. Even those hoarding cash are still hoarding.

        Cash will have a decreasing value as governments take the only route available and increase it’s supply.

        • The lesson here is that nobody knows a central bankster like another central bankster! The fact that these people do not trust each other should tell the rest of us all we need to know about them. They are a sticky-fingered lot, so don’t leave anything of value within their reach!

      60. Don’t know if it’s been up here yet but just had a 6.0 in the Solomon Islands about 45 minutes ago…..quite a day so far!

      61. 6.0 quake in Santa Cruz Islands, this is exactly the line between New Guinea and Fiji Isalnds that should be getting hit from the precursor polar and sub polar quakes. A little small, but still shows where the activity should be on top of the northern Chile quake today. China and Japan are still very much in the crosshairs, along with western Indonesia and the Mexico and Caribbean area. There have been way too many earthquakes on the plate boundaries since the 7.5 in Alaska. I am now going to look over the past polar quakes and see if there is another date to aim for.

        It is really weird how many more big earthquakes there have been after the polar quake cycles started at 15 days. Then 16 days later the number sharply drops off. The moon’s cycle is 29.5309 days and I can assume that half of this is almost 15 days, and when it waits 15 days I can assume it has to do with the moon being halfway through its own cycle and the gravity pull or push is such that this helps trigger it. The moon sures affects the tides, I don’t see why it couldn’t affect the “liquid” rock below the crust. This is of course still speculation, but it makes sense.

        • now a 6.4 in the Santa Cruz islands almost an hour ago. Things are starting to get active!

      62. I love this sound… Clack..Clank! Fire in the hole.

        For a short stint, I worked as an assistant range manager/shooting instructor at a Sporting Clays/Shooting Range Club. I never got tired of the sound of gunfire and the smell of burnt powder. Many times i have went through 300 shotshells in a slow morning or afternoon. Burning through ammo at the pistol range was just as fun. Never could have as much fun as I wanted when burning up rounds through the .454 Casull or the 44 Mag. Costs get into the hundreds very soon, even when reloading.

        Nothing compares to the click-clank of a pump shotgun or the clink-clunk of jamming a round into an auto 12 gauge.

        I’ve seen little women, 5′ about 90 lbs., handle a 12 gauge like a pro. It just takes time and practice and patience. A knowledgable, and easy going instructor, with plenty of emphasis on “safety”, can speed up the process and be a real asset. Lighter loads for the 12 can make all the difference and then work up to the heavier. The 20 is great also. With heavier loads, the 20 will get the job done. Just don’t expect the same knockdown power at longer ranges with the 20.

        I always enjoyed teaching/instructing the women more than the men. Most men were too macho acting to listen and learn, while the women were all eyes and ears and seemed to really enjoy the experience, especially for the first few times out. They also retained more of what i had taught and showed them from the previous time. Good shootin’ ladies!

        • don’t tread:

          They do make a sweet sound. Had to get a recoil pad for mine. Tired of having a bruised shoulder for days on end. Guess I’m getting old. *sigh*

          “Not One More Inch!”

          KySSG . . . out.

          • I know what you mean KySSG. going on 57 years but feels like 77 most days.

            A good fittin’ shotgun is essential for bustin’ lots of clays at a time. Especially for smaller framed persons with short arms. i would recommend that women shooters get their shotgun fitted to their body by having the stock cut and a shoulder pad added, especially on a 12 ga.

            The ole turkey gun had to get a butt pad a few years ago. No more bruising.

        • Makes me wish that I had my grand dad’s old goose gun. He called it “Long Tom”. It was a 10-ga. single shot with a 36″ barrel. Bringing down a couple of geese or a turkey at 80-90 yards was no problem at all and many a depression era meal featured goose or turkey as the main course.

      63. Not one more Inch.Headline logo goes with Dont Tread On Me!

        I am worried about the future events and have followed all comments for the past four years on this site and others that are similar. I am awake and I understand what is at risk and in peril. I have prepped to a degree but I need advice. I have a certain conviction over 12 years old that scares me so that I cant carry. How can I “seal” these records. Nothing before or after said offense. Obama did it, can I?

        • Depends on your state of residence. Here, you can purchase through a private sale without having to divulge your personal info or do a background check. Of course, if you’re ever raided before tshtf, they will likely arrest you again and confiscate the gun! But like I said, depends on where you live…

        • REEL: Do this. Aprox 35 States have what is called a Set Aside-Expungment law. Some states automaticly restores civil rights IE: be able to again Vote-Hold public office-Own guns. The time frames vary state by state but example mich a NON specidied felony=3yrs and rights is restored.

          BUT a specified felony IE: a felony that includes Guns-Dope-Violence/harm othes, OR..If ANY part of orig crime would be Likly to cause phys harm to others.

          Then it takes 5 yrs wait and in both 3yr or 5yr cases the time to wait 3 or 5 yrs Begins AFTER All time served-All fines paid off-And full release if any probation or parole.

          AND for ONLY specified felony besides 5 yrs wait to be able to again Vote or hold public office(those are automaitc after 5yrs) BUT to restore Gun rights…You MUST apply for a Hearing to Local county Gun board for an official hearing to Restroe gun right…Board Must allow you a hearing, and you need majority yes(2 out of 3) vote.

          If you do that stuf, or if its the lesser deal of 3yrs Non specified felony you are good to go.

          CHECK YOUR State! It may be different, and if you live in the aprox 15 states that do Not allow such?…You are screwed for life. Because you Must do this stuf in state where crime occured etc.

          ATF 1968 firearms act fed laws has a clause that also lets atf restore gun rights. BUT No longer avail due to Klinton era 1994 Schumer and his dem antigun pal finestien freeked when they realized of that clause in fed law.

          So them assholes antis Began in 1994 to Not allow yearly atf budget cash to be used to restore gun rights any longer!

          The ONLY Two other options I am aware of are #1 A Govner Pardon, or, #2 A US Prez Pardon…Depends on Your govner if that will work(Try set aside expungment first if avail) and forget a prez hobammy pardon(unless you are a black panther who hates whiteys, of a duel citizen of usa/Isreal perhaps).

          I hope this info assists you. Non violent felons should get gun rights back like states do after certain wait period etc I believe. Especially with so many stupid laws today and so many felonies that should be misdomeanors eh…Good Luck! ps probobly can do Online state gov search for this info.

          OH alomost forgot!!! depends on state, but some even with gun rights retored you may still need go to see orig judge(if still on bench) by: file a Motion to set aside/expunge crime. That wipes it clean for ever and only if apply for cop job or couple LIMITED other reasons can ANYBODY ever see the files after doing that.

          Mainly limited means its only allowed ONE time in lifetime and ONLY for one single offence, cant have ANY other offence even a single misdomeanor to file motion. Judges can look into closed files to see if it was done prior in another crime set aside by same person.

          Any illigit looking at sealed files is a crime for who did it unless meets Limited reasons.

          Even if cant do actual set aside wipe it off clean etc you still may restore to own and use a gun. Check Your state laws. Sorry if sounds confuseing but most laws are eh. I got several buddys who did complete set aside so it will work if avail.

        • You could always go with black powder guns. I really enjoy my 45 cal. six shooter. Not a lot of punch past 20 yds. with a round ball, but it beats the heck out of sticks and stones. A 12 ga. shorty/riot gun w/ double or triple 0 buckshot is a deadly weapon for short range. You can just about cut a man in half with the darn thing.

          • I was thinking the same thing. Check the laws to make sure, but generally a muzzleloader is not considered a “firearm” for purposes of a prior felony conviction. At least that’s my understanding. Check with your local sheriff. Single shot for rifles, generally six shooters with pistols. They are cheap. I have a .50 caliber black powder rifle that is a beast. Single shot, but aim small. Extremely accurate to 100 yards or so. Also, can be purchased online, as no federal background check is required. DYOR.

      64. lead and brass are the new gold and silver, but good luck finding lead or brass

        • Brass is hard to find but lead can be found at garage sales sometimes.

      65. Remember all the nuts that kept saying invest in beans guns and bullets. Well a case (1000) of cheap 5.56×45 several years ago was 100 dollars now cost about 300 if you can find them. Guns aren’t doing to bad either. Now when the beans jump up 300% it will be to late to invest in anything and I am not sure gold will do much good.

        • yes I remember those “nuts”..I was one of those people trying to spread that message..

          • I was being facetious, but I couldn’t tell you how many people I know that spent a small fortune on guns and didn’t buy hardly any ammo. Now they would be glad to have a case of wolf ammo for 300 dollars. Heck I just sold a SKS and 2k rounds for $700 to a friend that is now worried about the future and can’t find a rifle and ammo. When I purchased them the ammo was $100 per 1000 and the SKS was around $100.

            • When I bought my first SKS about 20 years ago, I could get a case of 1200 rounds already loaded on stripper clips for $85. Ahhhh, the good old days.

        • Another Kentuckian? If you’re new, welcome. If you are not, welcome back.

          South-central here.

          “Not One More Inch!”

          KySSG . . . out.

          • I am from around the Franklin area

            “Not One More Inch”

            I prefer “Molon Labe”

            When the Persian army demanded that the Spartans lay down their arms their reply was Molon Labe (Come and take them).

            • I liked the line in the original 300 Spartans movie. When the Persians told the Spartans to surrender, the Greeks said no, the Persians then said that “our arrows will blot out the sun”, and the Greeks replied with, “then we shall fight in the shade”. Probably not historically accurate but still a good line. 😀

        • Yep. Preached it for years. Now look what has happened in just a few short weeks.

          Wally World has been out of 22 ammo since before Christmas. No expected restocking date.

          The local gun shop still has some but the price has doubled and there is a 500 rnd limit.

          The shooting suppliers i usually buy from on-line are and have been sold out of all cheap,bulk 22 LR. Their expected re-stocking dates range from April till Oct.

          The High Capacity Clips are sold out of most calibers, especially the 22 calibers and restocking dates are weeks and months out with limited supplies available.

          The good news! Dry pinto beans are still available at Sam’s for about .80 cents per lb. in 10 lb. bags.
          Any for less than a $1.00 per lb. is still a bargain. We got glass containers filled & sealed away for that “rainy day”.

          • WTH is with all of these supposed ammo shortages? When the Fed Gov bought 2 billion rounds of .40-cal ammo, there was no shortage of that round anywhere. Now, when the citizens buy about the same number of rounds but in several calibers, NOW there is a shortage. I call BS on this.

      66. Buy FOOD & water filters now. What you going to buy with your gold in the future? FOOD & Safe Water right? You can buy Food and Water Filters now for a whole lot less than you can get them for with your gold and silver in the future. Maybe in the future you can buy a two Lb. bag of rice for a Silver Dollar, (which may be worth $600, $800, who knows), but a two lb. bag of rice in walmart will cost you now a couple of bucks in funny money, right now. Stock up NOW and IF you have anything left buy silver American coins (pre-1965) Dimes, Quarters are best as it will be less you will have to get in change when you barter for goods, and who wants funny money for change that’s worthless. And everyone recognizes these coins as silver and knows they have a silver content and are valuable.
        Prep Hard, Prep Fast

        • Though I am not a big supporter of holding gold or silver. I will have to say when the Roman Empire fell their coins were still in use for centuries because they had a known amount of precious metals.









        • My God given rights are not subject to anybody’s opinion poll.

          Anyone wants my guns is welcome to try to take them.

          I will deal with their attempts with extreme prejudice.

          • I’m not in love with a gun. I just need an answer to one question–What do you have in mind that you are hell-bent on me not being able to say no to?

            • Im in love with my guns.

        • Eisenkreutz ~

          I keep hearing these numbers too – and I honestly do not believe them.

          I think this is just more propaganda from the “Ministry of Disinformation”.

          I believe all these reports about the majority being pro-gun control are just created in order for people to believe that is what they should do. A lot of folks aren’t good with formulating opinions, so they just go with whatever everyone else thinks. This is all created to sway the opinions of those who cannot think for themselves.

          I don’t believe it for a second.


          • Are you the organic prepper? I own a farm that hasnt been planted in many years. I wonder how dificult it would be to get by without using any fertilizer or pesticides whatsoever.

            • Do you have any equipment available on your farm? You need to turn the soil over to get the ball rolling.

              Any others in the area with the equipment to do this?

              If you have a farm that is idle, you need to get your ass motivated and get started. Lots of us here grow most of our own food.

              Getting a food growing op together might bring all of the “idiots” around you into your camp. God helps those that help themselves. Over the years I have found that the best things come from helping others and sharing.

              You will find that it is easy to pick out who stays and who needs to go by what they are willing to share and contribute back to the cause.

              Those that use people, do it ALL the time. They will be dealt with shortly.

              Get your ass in gear young man. Personally, I believe that the true farmer has been shit on and he will be the key to what is coming…I can get damn near everything that I put in my mouth within 20 miles from my home and I live in the mountains. I have some beautiful fruit trees that produce and most are shocked that they would even grow here.

              I’m rambling and need to get going…start small or you will be overwhelmed. Get a plan. You are a smart guy, learn to channel your energy into something beneficial.

              This is it. We will help if we can.

              • I don’t know much about farming but I do know the most important thing is to have the land turned up as that is the hardest to do. But I found that there are a lot of people around that will bring a tractor and turn up a plot for a fee that is well worth it if you ever tried to turn up the land by hand also they are usually knowledgeable on what you need to get started. I am sure if there are several people in an area they would be even cheaper.

                • Oh heck yeah! I started doing a patch by hand, and it was backbreaking. It took me 2 days to get a small section dug up. I called a guy with a rototiller and for $35 my entire backyard was complete in less than half an hour!

                  Best money I ever spent! Also – you can get them to rototill in a layer of manure and leaves to enrich the soil over the spring thaw, then come back and rototill it again at planting time.

            • Yes, that’s my site.

              You can get by without any of the chemicals, absolutely. It’s more work and takes a lot of research. I’m fairly new to growing my own food but managed a fantastically productive organic garden last year in the city on 1/10th of an acre.

              You want to get your soil tested, then look into natural amendments like manure (from organically fed animals if possible, bonemeal, bloodmeal, all sorts of stuff! You can make different beds and create the perfect soil for whatever you choose to grow. Different foods require different pHs, so your garden will be far more productive if you adapt it accordingly.

              Pests can require a lot of hands on work, but in my opinion it’s worth it. Some bugs you have to pick off by hand and some can be gotten rid of with methods like a cayenne pepper spritz on the leaves. The little vegetarian animals that like to visit are often scared away by the presence of bloodmeal because they sense a predator in the area.

              I figure that spending the amount of time I’d spend at a regular job tending an organic garden more than pays for itself. Purchasing organic produce can be very expensive and would not be within reach for us but by growing and preserving our own, and purchasing only to supplement it in the winter, we are able to achieve a kitchen that is about 90% organic.

              Good luck!



        • ever hear of propaganda? its the same shit Hitler pulled, Dont buy it for one second

        • However, according to the same survey:

          85% do NOT want a BAN
          20% are undecided
          15% did not respond
          30% voted for contestant number 2
          Nobody won the free iPad 2

          • Statistics can be made to say whatever the pollster wants. I can prove carrots are deadly – 100% of people that ate carrots in 1871 are now dead. 67% of people that died unexpectedly had eaten carrots in the last month, etc etc etc. Look at the numbers and methodology behind any poll before putting any faith in it.

        • Assault weapons ban, my ass. In 1776, the American patriots and the British government had exactly the same weapons technology. Smooth bore and rifled flint-lock muskets. Today, the Gov has belt-fed FULL auto weapons. Considering this and all the whining being done about our SEMI-auto clip-fed rifles, where are our 2nd Amendment rights not being “infringed”?

          55% want a ban? Well, so what? 75% did not want Obamacare but that did not matter to TPTB. We got it anyway. If the US House passes anything of a kind, they are toast. Yes, every last one of them because there will no longer be any need whatever for their “services”.

      68. Less than 1% of the nation understands gold and silver coinage. Most thought the Susan B. Anthony and the Sackajewa dollar coins were gold. How many know the metallic composition of our coins? Credit cards are king and cash is too ghetto to carry around. So what do you expect. First they thought the dollar would always be King and listened to the elite,(Barbaric Metal) destroy precious metals by manipulation, as per timing the metals market with major take downs. High Speed Trades with unequal long and short trades. Now as the trades are called because of TOO MUCH PRINTING/Debt and more Down Grading, precious metals are again in the forefront. Hmmm.
        I have been in this arena for a long time and would ask you as to why would our stock market risen to heights that took them eight years to reach. Considering the economy and the erosion of the World Reserve currency, what foundation does it stand upon? Is it only the full faith and trust of the Federal Reserve?
        Those who sell their gold to the mall vultures will regret it later. Whoever coined the phase, ” Sell Your Broken or Old Gold”, was a master at deception.

        • Ah gots me a hunnert dollas for Granny’s wedding ring. Gonna buys new sneekas!

        • “Considering the economy and the erosion of the World Reserve currency, what foundation does it stand upon?”

          It stands solidly on a giant rock called “inflation”. Printing several trillion new dollars and dumping them into the banks tends to do that. Inflation now stands at about 9.4% annually per economist John Williams at This is merely the bow wave of what is to come. All the while, Bernanke is telling us that inflation is right on target with his prediction of 2.5%. Hmmm, really? What does your own buying of food, fuel, ammo, etc. tell you about inflation? 2% or 10%?

      69. And how are you going to sell your Gold in a heavily monitored and cashless society? What about the paper trail that could lead The Man right to your door?

        Invest only in that which can be bartered. There is a list somewhere of 99 items that will most be in demand.

        You are probably alright with Silver, but tobacco pouches would be more in demand, or medical supplies.

        I think ‘The Man in the High Castle’ gives a good idea of which areas could potentially be under tyranny, and those that will be left to fend for themselves, at least initially.

      70. Does anyone know where to buy silver where they don’t charge you 15 percent on the buy and sale?

        • 1.5% buy, sell free.

      71. Mac,
        To understand what’s happening you really have to understand the gold basis…Professor Fekete has a wonderful article on what’s happening. Basically if the gold market moves from contango to permanent backwardation, we… are… done…

        WE are playing games with the gold market, Germany is part of the game. Gold is the final ‘debt resolution’ currency.

        My prediction several months ago, is that the PTB/the Dark man and the Dems, are not worried about the debt because they will pull the trigger on the ‘Lincoln option’… IOW, the Fed’s charter is up this year… they may just go with US Treasury notes/credits and pay off the debt with worthless scrip… and after that… only God knows.

        • PM…Several on here at times have mentioned a 99 or 100 year Fed charter. I have searched US code and all I can find is that the Federal Reserve has an open ended charter since the 1920s that can only be ended by congress. I have been searching for concrete info on the 100 year charter for a couple years now. Personally, I think this is an internet myth. Do you have a link to show where this is shown in the US code? Thanks.

        • A really skulduggerous plan would involve moving ALL US debt to the Fed’s balance sheet and then ending the Fed. POOF! All gone.

          “Gold is the final ‘debt resolution’ currency.”

          According to some economists, gold and silver are the only debt resolution currencies. Unbacked paper money is not payment in full of a debt. That paper is a “note”. This is significant because a note is a debt obligation and not payment at all. A mortgage is a note and so is a promissory note. Gold and silver are payment of debt and not a promise to pay at a later date. When gold and silver were circulated as money in the US, the currency was then called a “certificate” and not a note.

          Be that as it may, we have somehow allowed ourselves to be conditioned to the idea that these intrinsically worthless notes are actually money. As long as we ALL think that, the system blunders along. If a currency crisis were to occur, however, a lot of people would stop thinking that and unbacked paper coupons would cease to be “money”.

      72. @Mac….thanks for article on PM, specifically silver.

        I bought dimes at first, then went to the silver rounds, mainly the US Silver eagle.

        I am thinking about selling or trading the dimes I have that are 1960-1964. I will keep the others. What is your opinion on the dimes?

        From now on I plan to purchase one ounce US Eagle rounds.

        • Ugly, DO NOT sell the dimes…
          I have mostly junk silver, why?

          Because it is easily recognizable by IDIOTS…
          Recognition will be part of the battle in future transactions.

          • Piper Miachaels….Thanks.

            I was going to keep the pre-1960 dimes, just sell the 1960-1964 ones cause I have plenty of those. Now I won’t sell, I’ll keep.

            For curiosity, how does one use those dimes in bad times? Lets say silver goes to $90 an ounce, thus one of those dimes would have silver value around $6. Would someone really trade something or buy a dime for $6?

            I will keep my silver and hidden. Thanks for the input.

            • I bartered a shotgun for 17 silver dimes.

            • 90% silver, like your pre-65 dimes, has a value of “times face”. Today it is 23 times face, so each dime is worth $2.30. How much above or below face you receive is up to the parties in the transaction. That has to be agreed to up front. Then both parties have to agree on a dollar value and divide that by the multiple. For example, you want to buy a $200 item for junk silver at 23 times face. Divide 200 by 23, which is about 8.7. You trade $8.70 face, or 87 of your dimes, for the item.

              I have made trades this way, and it only works with people who understand it. People understand out to use iPhones, so they could figure this out quickly with practice. Go to the coinflation website for up-to-the-minute values of junk silver.

      73. @ DPS ~ Hi Dps, no I have not heard of anything.
        People I know are not happy with the severity of Cumos
        law. You heard more than I did, with 1 gun assoc. taking it to court. This state is Democratic, *I’m not*, but still, I am sure there are some Dems that are not pleased with the gun law. I hope some get fired up and bring more legal actions against it. I just have to wait and see.

        • Emily,

          Working as we spaeak about rounding up some new contacts up there will pass along any thing I find out,



        “Nouriel Roubini & Max Keiser & James Turk: Preparing For A Perfect Storm, ‘Next Stage’ Of The Global Financial Implosion Will Occur By April!! Foreigners Are Pulling Their Gold While Central Banks Are Losing The War To Suppress Gold & Silver Prices.”

      75. This is an important conservation, violence is a problem, too many, you must act, Americans are counting on you, aim well!

      76. off topic
        but a serious warning on an unseen war

        “A cyber war has been brewing for at least the past year, and although you might view this battle as governments going head to head in a shadow fight, security experts say the battleground is shifting from government entities to the private sector, to civilian targets that provide many essential services to U.S. citizens”

        let me emphasize that last part

        “security experts say the battleground is shifting from government entities to the private sector, to civilian targets that provide many essential services to U.S. citizens’

        better keep some cash on hand at all times
        no telling when all your little pixelated $$$ will go by by
        and never let your gas tank get less than half full
        pulling into a service station on fumes and finding your debit/credit card won’t work will be a very unpleasant surprise

      77. here’s a little something to give you pause

        “China Averts $482 Billion in Local Bank Defaults via Massive Rollover Scheme; Extend-and-Pretend Chinese Style”

        “The Chinese banking system is insolvent. Of course, the entire global banking system is insolvent, but today’s spotlight is on China. Please consider China averts local government defaults.”

      78. A very short note…
        My next PM purchase might be a “Personal Mossberg”.
        Any one have a idea where you can still get them customized?

        • GrayFox,

          Just pick you up any mossberg and do it you self.
          I did that for my daughter, she got the mossberg Mav. 12 gauge we took off the long barrel put on the 18 1/2 inch,
          pulled of the stock and added the kicklite tactical stock. She weighs at 100lbs and shoots the hell out that 12 gauge. Buy shotguns now as they are still very cheap.


      79. Another bigger earthquake in the Santa Cruz Islands, 6.2, exactly where it should be happening. Along that line from New Guinea to Fiji. Now the areas have had a 6.8 in northern Chile, and a 6.0 and 6.2 along that line. Other areas to still watch are China and Japan, western Indonesia, and the area around Mexico and the Caribbean. I also would still watch western South America because of all the action on the western Nazca plate. I am watching the Cascadia and the San Andreas closely.

        As more polar earthquake present themselves the overall picture will come into view. I would say that China and Japan are still in very troubled danger for the next 12 days because ofthe series of quakes on the 27th, 3 days ago. 15 days after Jan.27 would be Feb.11 for China and Japan. I would say about a 75-80% chance right now. This may go up or down a little depending on new precursor quakes.

        • Howdy BI,

          I see you ‘on it again’ Friend, splendid prognostication!!! I was just over at USGS and wqhen I turned the magnitude setting up to ‘5.0’ and the slider for age down to 2 days I was astonsihed to see that we’ve had 14 tremors world-wide fitting that criteria…getting wild methinks!!

          A thought occured to me the other day – a BAD one, that is – that with al that we see going on in the Human sphere at present, “Are we missing something here?” For variosu reasons the standard sleight-of hand that the “Invivles’ use when fealing with thinhs thinhs a taf blunt this time…are we being misdirected here AGAIN?
          Dwell upon it for a few quiet minutes if you would…I have the neaking suspicion that what we’re seeing now ‘Ain’t all there is’….. but what could be BIG enough for them to risk so much openly…what possible motivation could be so exigent as to impel them as they currently are? What are we missing here….

          • the typing in the previous is CLEARLY the result of too much Nyquil….

        • and another 6.0 in SE Alaska this morning! eep!

      80. I’m wondering if it would make sense to leave some of our money in stocks. If it’s going up due to inflation, despite the state of the economy, won’t that continue? I believe in spreading out our assets, in PMs and having cash on hand, and haven’t taken it all out yet because stocks rising due to inflation seems better than the same amount in cash. What do you think?

        • I think that diversification is one of 3 good things that small investors can use to our advantage and am a big fan of using it. That said, I am an even bigger fan of not losing a lot of money in a market crash, like 2008, so use trailing stops to limit my downside risk.

          Yes, the economy will likely continue to move higher for most of 2013. I am VERY concerned about 2014-15, however. A huge drop in the US stock market during this time would not surprise me at all.

          For now, most of my investments are in ETFs. Like stocks, they can be sold at any hour of the day that the US market is open. They can also use various stop loss orders. Their cost is low and they are tax efficient. I still have a few mutual funds but will replace them with their ETF equivalents.

      81. @ DPS ~ Thank you for your time and effort.
        Please do keep me posted.
        If there is anything I can do to help, let me know.

      82. those of you that are looking for answers as to how we got to this point in time >>>I just spent the last hour or so reading some remarks from I would say a very smart fellow if you have time check out and scroll down left side until you see some articles by Kirwan and read the topics under his name He also references shtf plan in these writings esp Cheney Bush Obama a wealth of info here MOlon Labe

      83. @ ugly..not only should you keep the dimes….you should continue to buy well as quarters, and troy ounces.

        • What a great article!!!

          • I especially liked the part where he drew the distinction between big city union PD’s with the top brass installed by the mayor or city council (cronyism) vs. Constitutionally elected Sheriff’s Departments. Made a great point.

      84. I was watching some of the comedy show that was the Senate hearings on the gun control issue. Most of us do not favor Lindsey Graham (me included). However,I have to give him his due in this hearing. He definitely stood up for AR owners and hi cap mags. He said he himself owns an AR15 and hi cap mags and would never be in favor of banning either. One of the Dem senators questioned LaPierre about the people wanting these weapons to protect against government tyranny and he agreed. The bald headed, raccoon looking, tin chested,chief of whatever LEO,said that kind of talk personally scared him. While I didn’t watch the entire hearing,it seemed to go well for gun owners. Of course,I am biased and others may have gotten a different view.

        • “The bald headed, raccoon looking, tin chested,chief of whatever LEO,said that kind of talk personally scared him.”

          The Declaration of Independence and The Federalist Papers would scare the shit out of him too but I’ll bet he never read them. I’m a bit concerned that the people in authority have no clue regarding the origins of the country and the intent of the Founding Fathers. If one repeats their writings with no embellishment your looked at as an anti American nut quoting some foreign enemy. Few I believe would recognize the source of their statements even within complete context. If shown the history of the language they must be dumfounded. Communists once in power reinstitute re-education. We need some re-education here and now because far too many in authority along with the masses missed it the first time around.

          How can they help guide you forward if they don’t have any idea where the hell you been?

        • “The bald headed, raccoon looking, tin chested,chief of whatever LEO,said that kind of talk personally scared him.”

          What an absolutely perfect moment to ask this fellow why the thought of personal liberty scared him so much.

      85. BI,

        Another big’un west of Craig, Alaska @ 09:35 UTC,
        a 6.0 as currently listed

        • @BI, What do you think about the volcanic connection to the earthquakes. Seems there’s alot of volcano activity where the earthquakes are swarming???

          • @ you don’t need to know and JustOneGuy. The 6.0 in Alaska was an aftershock to the 7.5 a few weeks ago. What got my attention was the earthquake activity around Mt. St. Helens. When this erupted back in 1980, Mammouth in California has a series of 6+ earthquakes and they were thinking that the Long Valley Caldera could go off. This region of California is capable of at least a VEI of 7, probably not quite a super volcano of 8, but close. The last VEI 7 was MT. Tamboro back in 1815 that brought about the mini ice age.

            A volcano can be thought of as a valve and the symptom that things deep down are really heating up in certain spots. This is the way heat convection works. Earthquakes go hand in hand with volcanoes as both are actually symptoms of each other. A large enough earthquake can split open a fissure under a caldera that starts a chain reaction that won’t stop until the pressure is released, a catastrophic eruption.

            I still think from the plate reactions for the past few years, a super eruption is more likely in the southern hemisphere. New Zealand is really the highest danger point for this. It is not Yellowstone to worry about, it is Mt. Taupo in NZ everyone should be most worried about because a large enough earthquake there can cause a bypass of all the events before a supervolcano goes off. It can haoppen in hours or days rather than the classic build up of a supervolcano that normally takes months.

            Another massive supervolcano is Mt. Toba in Sumatra, Indonesia, ONLY a couple hundred miles from the 9.1 mega quake in 2004. IF you get an earthquake of similar size under Toba, it is extremely likely it would erupt. The last time it erupted 74,000 years ago it exploded 2800 cubic KM of ash into the air and dropped world temperatures almost 20 degrees. Sumatra is a very dangerous zone for mega earthquakes as just last year the largest strike slip mega quake occurred near there. Technically Toba is at 2 degrees north, but close enough the the equator and the southern hemisphere.

      86. I keep a nice little safe of silver. If it all collapsed and hyperinflation hit… make sure you have enough silver to pay your property taxes to not lose your house.

        In 401k land… I was stuck there…but I got self directed trading.
        I bought an allocated metal stock… CEF on the amex.
        Allocated means they do not lease it out.

        I cannot get my 401k money out…so it was the next best thing.
        IT’s in Canada.
        If the use does s 1933…and gold soars…then I might do very well.

        But… Obummer is going to take the 401k.

        You watch.
        An old jew told me this.

        Obama is like a nig with a credit card. ha

        We’re so fucked.

        • Ask your boss to fire you–then withdraw your 401k–then get hired back (after a little bribe)

        • “Allocated means they do not lease it out.”

          No, allocated means that they are not supposed to encumber your metal, not that they haven’t, can’t, or won’t. Things like this are sometimes referred to as “MF Global moments”. Clients there thought that they had allocated gold bars and they did. That did not prevent some from disappearing or others from being given to other clients who did not own them by the bankruptcy judge.

          Congrats on trying to secure your property, though. I sincerely hope that it works out for the best… and it may… but the guarantee of that may not be as strong as you think.

        • 170,000,000 people killed in the 20th century by their own country more than was killed by all the wars. Gun control is something they all had in common.

          I think all gun owners should see this.

      87. The family of a 7-year-old New York boy is suing police and the city for $250 million, saying cops handcuffed and interrogated the boy for ten hours after a scuffle over lunch money at school.

        • I know what you mean KySSG. going on 57 years but feels like 77 most days.

          A good fittin’ shotgun is essential for bustin’ lots of clays at a time. Especially for smaller framed persons with short arms. i would recommend that women shooters get their shotgun fitted to their body by having the stock cut and a shoulder pad added, especially on a 12 ga.

          The ole turkey gun had to get a butt pad a few years ago. No more bruising.

          • double post delete #1092940 or ignore


        • mr p, those ALL CAPS are really annoying.

      89. @ Dont Tread…..Try the new Mossburg 535 12 guage it shoots everything, even slugs without changeing the barrel. Low kick very smooth. comes with two chokes for turkey and two chokes for buckshot. Nice gun! Also it is a pump and will hold 5 shots with plug removed.

      90. @ Angelo

        Thanks for the info. I live in Virginia near va. Beach area. However the case was in Hanover which is very strict and would not make a deal in 2001 with my case. I could not get it dropped even though claimant did not want to proceed. Minor assault charge however against a family member the ruling was that “Any unwanted touch is an offense. My charge was that I pushed not struck, grabbed,or restrained. Still charged, I completed the mandatory social service recommendation and my two year priobation has long past without incidence. I thought that after 12 years this would fall off. I have behaved admirably. Do I stand a chance?

        • REEL ISSUES: What you described does not sound like a felony, more like minor-misdomeanor. ATF considers ALL convictions that Carry Over a full year jail as a felony. IE: One year AND even one day xtra sentence to jail nulifies gun rights.(even if stay out of jail on probation as long as Could go to jail more than year counts) Your crime dont sound like no year or longer offence though.(?)

          As for expungments set asides keep in mind depending on Your state laws, if like in Mich. You can set aisde either a felony OR misdomeanor. BUT remember this process can be done ONCE per lifetime of You. Like a 2nd chance and you wont get another!

          be a shame to waste it in misdomeanor if you later got a felony and cant do it then!…Its a personal choice what works best and state laws decides it also.

          Its worth doing to regain gun rights I believe. And if you go before a judge on a motion to set aside?…IF judge asks “Why dhould I do this motion for You”?

          It may better to reply “I want to better myself and apply for a Satet job aka state cop or Fireman etc where you need a clean record.

          Dont say to get gun rights restored! What if judge is lib dem antigun asshole?!!..Cop Job or job in works around kidies sounds alot sweller eh!

          Are you screwed under domestic violence act aka Lautenberg act?…Thats a Misdomeanor yet aft added it to list of remove gun rights if convicted etc…Not sure but that also can be expunged.

          When that lautenberg act occured several yrs ago(10?) In Detroit areas Hundreds of cops per week had to get in wiped off record to still carry guns!! Cops!

          Boy I sure Hope you can restore gun rights and LOOK into Your state laws on this issue it may be very easy to do or even automatic done as I wrote prior!

          Wont cost a cent to do online search. You can do set aside motions withOUT a lawyer too. Just Study the law related and READ all instructions on Motion paperwork.

          In Mich you Must use Proper court accepted motion forms, but can buy them at a store one block from detroit courthouse area. And for like a Dollar or less per!

          Stay On this You can do it! or at least has tried right!!!

          • Doesn’t matter if it is a felony or not, under Klinton, the govt passed a law that removed a person’s 2A right for misdemeanor domestic violence charges as well. Absolute bull shite.

      91. @ justoneguy…I have been thinking the EXACT SAME THING…what are we missing?

      92. Dumb sheep. Anybody not buying food right now is a fool, soon to be a dead fool. Drought now impacts 81% of the all the major growing regions in the United States. Prices are going to triple this year. The government is buying up all available food supplies RIGHT NOW.

        What good is gold or silver going to do anyone? Even if the dollar collapses (unlikely), nobody will accept your gold or silver.

        Sheep. Still too dumb to learn anything.

        • Anyone not growing food is dead.

        • “What good is gold or silver going to do anyone? Even if the dollar collapses (unlikely), nobody will accept your gold or silver.”

          Yeah, what good have gold and silver EVER been? The world has never ever had a SHTF situation before so this will all be new to everyone.


      93. China encourages its citizens to buy gold.
        The US marginalizes gold buyers as kooks.

        I suspect both governments plan to actually or effectively confiscate the gold through some mechanism. While that is bad, China will have enough gold backing to appeal as a world reserve currency, while the US dollar will be shunned.

        Gold, that “barbaric relic”, shall retake its rightful place, as will also the “outdated” US Constitution.

        • Dream on.

      94. This will make you laugh. I was in a high level meeting with all the boneheads with masters degrees. We were talking about our insurance business. I started talking about the global economy and how the dollar will be devalued. This would cause many of our customers issues. They all looked at me like I was a wack job.
        That was 2009…gold was at $900. Today… $1600+.
        I sold all my stocks and loaded up on metals.
        Who’s the wack job now!

        Education is great…
        But they are taught not to think for themselves.
        Upset. No.
        Be glad all the zombies are asleep.
        It makes it easier on us to do well.

        Folks… if there’s s bear in camp ready to eat folks… you just have to be faster than the teletubbies. Fat TV bastards.

        Final thought… don’t rely on folks who cannot take care of their own bodies.

        This fat clown was giving a presentation on how his little project was going to save huamanity….then the donuts arrived. This guy never did anything….made a mess of things… was loud and sucked up all our time…then magically when he was to deliver… oops…he got a new job. Just in time.

        So then….I get dragged into his next round of bullshit.
        I asked him in front of all, what about his last big project.
        I walked out on him and took the entire meeting with me.

        Don’t be scared to go… WTF.
        Us all buying metals is us saying WTF to the powers that control our currency…
        We will not comply. Opt out.

      95. Do you realize when I am target shooting with my AR in 20 years with my grandchildren I will have most of you to thank for it?
        Because of the stand most of you take in the next few years,we will,one way or another,not let 2nd amendment oath breakers have our guns.

        I will say,dont forget the patriots,to my grandson or daughter.

        And I will be speaking of you.

        God bless.

      96. Watch where you store your PM. A few days ago a home invasion occurred in SW Florida in the otherwise very safe area of SE Cape Coral. The homeowner according to the news had $48,000 in PMs in his safe and was forced to open it at gun point.

        The book Surviving The Economic Collapse In Argentina said that many people had two safes, one hid, just for a situation like this.

        “Loose lips sink ships”.

      97. They were buying guns – not gold.

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