Five complete lies about America’s new $18 trillion debt level

by | Dec 2, 2014 | Headline News | 182 comments

Do you LOVE America?


    This article was originally published at Sovereign Man


    On October 22, 1981, the government of the United States of America accumulated an astounding $1 TRILLION in debt.

    At that point, it had taken the country 74,984 days (more than 205 years) to accumulate its first trillion in debt.

    It would take less than five years to accumulate its second trillion.

    And as the US government just hit $18 trillion in debt on Friday afternoon, it has taken a measly 403 days to accumulate its most recent trillion.

    There’s so much misinformation and propaganda about this; let’s examine some of the biggest lies out there about the US debt:

    1) “They can get it under control.”

    What a massive lie. Politicians have been saying for decades that they’re going to cut spending and get the debt under control.

    FACT: The last time the US debt actually decreased from one fiscal year to the next was back in 1957 during the EISENHOWER administration.

    FACT: For the last several years, the US government has been spending roughly 90% of its ENTIRE tax revenue just to pay for mandatory entitlement programs and interest on the debt.

    This leaves almost nothing for practically everything else we think of as government.

    2) “The debt doesn’t matter because we owe it to ourselves.”

    This is probably the biggest lie of all. Two of the Social Security trust funds alone (OASI and DI) own $2.72 trillion of US debt.

    The federal government owes this money to current and future beneficiaries of those trust funds, i.e. EVERY SINGLE US CITIZEN ALIVE.

    I fail to see the silver lining here. How is it somehow ‘better’ if the government defaults on its citizens as opposed to, say, banks?

    3) “They can always ‘selectively default’ on the debt”

    Another lie. People think that the US government can pick and choose who it pays.

    They could make a bing stink about China, for example, and then choose to default on the $2 trillion in debt that’s owed to the Chinese.

    Nice try. But this would rock global financial markets and destroy whatever tiny shred of credibility the US still has.

    Others have suggested that the government could selectively default on the Federal Reserve (which owns $2.46 trillion of US debt).

    Again, possible. But given that the Fed (the issuer of the US dollar) would become immediately insolvent, the resulting currency crisis would be completely disastrous.

    4) “It’s the NET debt that’s important”

    Analysts often pay attention to a country’s “net debt” instead of its gross debt. If you have a million bucks in debt, and a million bucks in cash, then your ‘net debt’ is zero. It washes out.

    Problem is, the US government doesn’t have any cash. The Treasury Department opened its business day on Friday morning with just $71.9 billion in cash, or just 0.39% of its total debt level.

    Apple has more money than that.

    5) “They can fix it by raising taxes”

    No they can’t. Just look at the numbers. Since the end of World War II, US government tax revenue has consistently been roughly 17% of GDP.

    They can raise tax rates, but it doesn’t move the needle in terms of revenue as a percentage of GDP.

    In other words, the government’s ‘slice of the pie’ is pretty consistent.

    You’d think with this obvious data that, rather than try to increase tax rates (ineffective), they’d do everything they can to help make a bigger pie.

    Or better yet, just leave everyone the hell alone so we’re free to bake as much as we can.

    But no. They have to regulate every aspect of people’s existence: How you are allowed to educate your children. What you can/cannot put in your body. How much interest you are entitled to receive on your savings.

    All of this costs time, money, and efficiency. So do never-ending wars. The bombs. The drones. The airstrikes.

    This isn’t about any single person or President. The problem is with the system itself.

    History shows that every leading superpower from the past almost invariably fell to the same fate.

    Great powers often feel that their wealth and success entitles them to spend recklessly and wage endless, arrogant wars. The Romans. The Ottoman Empire. The British.

    History may not repeat but it certainly rhymes. And the lesson here is very clear: debt weakens a nation. It weakens a society.

    Generations that will not even be born for decades will inherit these debts by complete accident of birth.

    And the people in charge of the system have backed themselves into a corner where there is no way out other than to default– either on their creditors (creating a global financial crisis), the central bank (creating a currency crisis), or on the citizens themselves (creating an epic social crisis).

    Bottom line: this is not a consequence-free environment. And while you can’t fix the debt problem, you can certainly reduce your own exposure to what happens next.

    About the author: Simon Black is an international investor, entrepreneur, permanent traveler, free man, and founder of Sovereign Man. His free daily e-letter and crash course is about using the experiences from his life and travels to help you achieve more freedom.


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      1. They say this is our debt. Fuck them. Can’t wait to see them hang until dead.

        • Yep Reagans VooDoo Supply Side Economics, with over priced $400 Dollar Hammers and $800 Toilet seats for the Military and Phony Star Wars Program. And the only Trickle Down Economics We Got, was the Government pissing on our pant legs and the Drunken Bar Tab.

          • I made the best money and had the most for my dollar during R. Reagan’s Presidency. He was alot better than those that followed.

            • Creative Financing 101: Here is how the US Government Financed the Debt. RollOver Ponsi Scheme:

              Ponzi: Treasury Issues $1T in New Debt in 8 Weeks—To Pay Old Debt

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              Ponzi: Treasury Issues $1T in New Debt in 8 Weeks—To Pay Old Debt
              November 28, 2014 – 2:37 PM

              By Terence P. Jeffrey
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              Treasury Secretary Jacob Lew
              Treasury Secretary Jacob Lew (AP Photo)

              The Daily Treasury Statement that was released Wednesday afternoon as Americans were preparing to celebrate Thanksgiving revealed that the U.S. Treasury has been forced to issue $1,040,965,000,000 in new debt since fiscal 2015 started just eight weeks ago in order to raise the money to pay off Treasury securities that were maturing and to cover new deficit spending by the government.

              During those eight weeks, Treasury took in $341,591,000,000 in revenues. That was a record for the period between Oct. 1 and Nov. 25. But that record $341,591,000,000 in revenues was not enough to finance ongoing government spending let alone pay off old debt that matured.

              Record Revenue through Nov. 25, 2014

              The Treasury also drew down its cash balance by $45.057 billion during the period, starting with $126,568,000,000 in cash and ending with $81,511,000,000.

              The only way the Treasury could handle the $942,103,000,000 in old debt that matured during the period plus finance the new deficit spending the government engaged in was to roll over the old debt into new debt and issue enough additional new debt to cover the new deficit spending.

              This mode of financing the federal government resembles what the Securities and Exchange Commission calls a Ponzi scheme. “A Ponzi scheme,” says the Securities and Exchange Commission, “is an investment fraud that involves the payment of purported returns to existing investors from funds contributed by new investors,” says the Securities and Exchange Commission.

              “With little or no legitimate earnings, the schemes require a consistent flow of money from new investors to continue,” explains the SEC. “Ponzi schemes tend to collapse when it becomes difficult to recruit new investors or when a large number of investors ask to cash out.”

              In testimony before the Senate Finance Committee in October 2013, Lew explained why he wanted the Congress to agree to increase the federal debt limit—and why the Treasury has no choice but to constantly issue new debt.

              “Every week we roll over approximately $100 billion in U.S. bills,” Lew told the committee. “If U.S. bondholders decided that they wanted to be repaid rather than continuing to roll over their investments, we could unexpectedly dissipate our entire cash balance.”

              “There is no plan other than raising the debt limit that permits us to meet all of our obligations,” Lew said.

              “Let me remind everyone,” Lew said, “principal on the debt is not something we pay out of our cash flow of revenues. Principal on the debt is something that is a function of the markets rolling over.”

              The vast amount of debt that the Treasury must roll over in such a short time frame is driven by the fact the Treasury has put most of the debt into short-term “bills” and mid-term “notes”—on which it can pay lower interest rates—rather than into long-term bonds, which demand significantly higher interest rates.

              At the end of October, according to the Treasury’s Monthly Statement of the Public Debt, the total debt of the federal government was $17,937,160,000,000.

              Full Story:

              • Here is a Bright Spot for Black Friday. – GUN SALES SKYROCKET ON BLACK FRIDAY. FBI NICS back ground checks averaged 3 back-ground checks per second. –
                More than 144,000 background checks will need to be performed after the the Friday sales, CNN reported Friday. The three-requests-per-second number is three times the daily average. Some 600 FBI and contract call center employees now must work 17-hour workdays to complete the background checks in three business days, as required by law, FBI spokesman Stephen Fischer said.

                Other Black Friday Retail Sales down 11% or 6 Million Shoppers Never showed up to buy anything vs. last year.

                • Instant check system is now available on line, no human intervention required! So, the whining about overtime is crap.

                  Three checks per second understates the actual purchases. If you buy one gun or ten, it is still just one instant check. In the holiday spirit of gift giving, many see it as prudent to insure all family members can defend/fend for themselves.

                  I find it most disturbing that this president, instills this kind of fear across our entire nation, a president whose credibility is lower than Putin’s with the American people?

                  There s a storm coming! A great and terrible storm, God help America!

                  • Oh, P.S. Don’t forget the ammo!

              • WWTI

                This is why this cannot go on forever. I wish I knew the date it would stop. If interest rates at this point increase then look at what that does to this scheme.

                Watch interest rates and the bond market. That may give us clues as to when the domino’s start falling. Of coarse there are many other factors that could make the fall start quicker. Other countries could cause this at any time. What would happen if China demanded we pay them right now.

                The article caused me to think of how this may play out. If the people in power chose to default on debt to the American people then the country would immediately turn into one big riot. It would make Ferguson look like a girl scout meeting. If they default to other countries or the treasury then all confidence would be lost in the dollar. Prices on goods would immediately skyrocket. The process would be a little slower but eventually they would default on the U.S. citizens too. That is because interest rates would sky rocket at the same time. Then the same result would happen. The country would be a huge war zone.

                The problem is going to be world wide when the domino’s start falling. I only see one possibility for the developed countries of the world.

                What if they all got together and said we are going to reset the whole thing? New currency and clean slate. The biblical one world government. That is where I think we are heading. Do they get the U.S. out of the way before they do this? If they do then other countries are going to be war zones during that period. Do we have a major war with China and Russia first? If we do then the end result is the same. Total chaos and loss of life. Do they want a major loss of life first? I think so. Less people to control and a much easier way to convince all to except the new one world government.

                I can hear the press or governments now. We must do this because the world has descended into chaos, starvation, disease, and war. We will do this so we can take care of you the people. We care about you and are here to help. We will fix this. When that point comes most will except it. Because of the misery they are going through. There is so much pain and sorrow in our future. I hate to be doom and gloom but I see no way out of this without a whole hell of a lot of pain.

                • Legacy of the Obama ‘recovery’

                  from October 2011…
                  Obama Has Now Increased Debt More than ALL Presidents from George Washington Through George H.W. Bush COMBINED

                  “in the less-than-three-years Obama has been in office, the federal debt has increased by $4.212 trillion–more than the total national debt of about $4.1672 trillion accumulated by all 41 U.S. presidents from George Washington through George H.W. Bush combined.”

                  CNS News dot com

                  • KY MOM. Obama inherited that mess from the Rest. QE- The Bank Bail outs were designed under the Bush Admin back behind closed door, Cloak & Dagger, Skull & Bones meetings for the Bankster Zog Hoodies. Obama didn’t have a choice. It was a Fast Moving Train he tried to slow down.

                    What he needed to do was Impose massive Taxes on corporations like the Oil Co’s Windfall Profits tax that was promised, but never came about, as it was back to business as usual again. The Criminals got away laughing.

                    I would have cancelled these Bank Bailout ASAP, and let them fail and bailed out the people and account holders under the FDIC. $125K Max. Of course they doubled that to now $250K, but screw the banks for their corruption. Instead the Fed rewards them with more free money to do the same thing again.

                    Remember under Bush SR and the S&L bail outs? They bailed out every single account for what ever the amount was instead of only the $125K Max under FDIC – Bush’s other Criminal Son Neil Bush, who ran the Silverado Savings and Loan should be in Prison for giving faulty loans to all his buddies. They all got bailed out under Daddy’s bailout plan, and that is PURE Corruption. The Bush Family are a Bunch of Parasites feeding their family wealth piles of Cashola off of the Government with Cons and rippoffs. And now Jeb wants his swing at fleecing the People. F-Him.

                    • WhoWuddaThunkIt

                      It does not take a great investigation of Presidential actions to realize that they are serving the money / elite / globalist / MIC / banisters. The my guy verses your guy is cover to facilitate the Democracy process that in the end insures that your voting for “their guy”.

                      Both horses are bought in the Presidential two horse race. If Bush 41 was re-elected he would have pushed NAFTA, China Free Trade and the abandoning of Glass-Steagall. The political reality is that he probably could not have swayed sufficient vital Democrat Congressmen. I’m of the belief that Ross Perot was there to take votes from GH Bush and put Clinton in the White House. Perot sabotaged his own campaign because there was no intent for him to win. He has been an insider for decades. Clinton could and did get that vital Democrat support to do exactly what TPTB wanted and GH Bush openly supported. Clinton accomplished what Bush was incapable of doing.

                      Little is as it appears.

                    • WhoWuddaThunkIt

                      Do you think for a nano second that Obama was not picked by TPTB? Do you believe that a street organizer makes a meteoric rise from State Senator to freshman US Senator to the Presidency by happenstance? As Franklin Delano Roosevelt said, “President aren’t elected, they’re selected”.

                      Seen any real movers and shakers in the Financial Industry go to jail? Bernie Maddof was running his own personal scam not the sanctioned one that is the system. Seen anyone in Wachovia go to jail for laundering $300-$400 Billion? His AG, his Justice Department. Corzine, no charges, familiar with him? Once again, his Justice Department, his AG.

                      When it comes to foreign policy and the big money issues it wouldn’t matter if McCain or Romney won.

                    • Oh yes, Obama inherited 6 billion in Bush debt, so he just had to add 8 trillion more, how perfectly understandable!


                      And he still has two more years in office! We are sooooo screwed!

          • You really should research a little. The hammers, toilet seats and other items the government paid way to much for were just smoke screens to cover off the books spending.

            Star Wars wasn’t phony, it was an extremely effect false information program that contributed greatly to the fall of the Soviet Union without waging any war against them. It was very effective and actually brilliant.

            Trickle down, which is correctly known as supply side economics wasn’t the brainchild of Reagan. It was an economic theory used before and after Reagan. It was just vilified by the press due to their anti Reagan bias.

            And like it or not, it works much better than trying to push the economy with tax money. Sorry you failed to prosper during the greatest time of economic turn around in America. But don’t blame Ronald Reagan. Study a little history and you will see it isn’t about any one man.

            • No they probably weren’t smoke screens.

              In the ’70s I was dragooned into being a Contract Administrator for a private sector company that did D.o.D. work. I’ve seen it up close and personal. Those $400 hammers come about because of the insane purchasing process that is defined by the Federal Acquisition Regulation, (known as FAR). If some mental midget writes a specification for a hammer that cannot be met by a commercial, mass-produced product, the FAR has no mechanism whereby a Government purchasing agent can go back and say “this spec is garbage”. He has to put it out just as written, and vendors will bid to supply a custom made hammer, which might conceivably require fabrication of megabucks worth of tooling to accomplish. Bingo, $400 hammer. Never mind the huge overhead costs that accompany a D.o.D. contract. I’ve seen the Government spend $265 (their number) to correct a 75 cent error (in their favor) on a contract document. I spent 3-4 chargeable hours handing the paperwork from our side.

              Then the DCAS acceptance inspection requires slavish compliance to the insanity. I once had to tear a machine apart because the DCAS inspector detected that some of the inside surfaces were painted the wrong shade of white. Surfaces you could not see once the machine was assembled.

              The upside for me was a contract that required us to build a machine which we soon realized would not work. We told ’em. They said build it. We did. It didn’t work. DCAS said “it meets the specs, pay the man”. They paid. The requisitioning activity cancelled the contract for the last 3 machines. We made more profit on the cancellation than we would have if we’d built the three machines.

              The only organization more screwed up that the Federal Government is General Motors. Yeah, I had them as a client for 15 years. Don’t let me get started.

              • Old Coach. Clearfield Job Corps Center in Utah did some shady sh*t. The directors would keep students on the rolls long after students completed their training on center. More students showing as active on center meant more money, bigger bonuses for the directors and upper management. CJCC was run by Management Training Center which contracted with the Dept of Labor.
                One of the directors was fired when I started working there for keeping students on the rolls and falsifying books on dorms that never existed on center (X,Y, and Z dorms). The next director who took over wasn’t any better. He ended up getting transferred to a center in Texas after a few years of the same bullsh*t.
                The Dept of Labor and MTC audits were a farce; myself and other staff always suspected that someone was being bought off.
                As for the so-called Zero Tolerance policy that was supposed to be enforced on center (no drugs, alcohol, weapons, gang activity)? It looked good on the handbooks but that was another farce.
                A lot of Crips, Bloods and other gang members were enrolled in the program; the contract with St.Louis was cancelled due to students’ behavior that came from that area. St.Louis? Hmmmm.
                The local kids who were recruited (mostly Mormons) would come on center, see all the gang activity that took place, call home, and leave. AWOL out. Can’t blame them.
                Wanna know how gangbangers call each other out? They actually whistle at each other when something is coming down. I didn’t know this until an RA (residential advisor) pointed this out to me one night when we were watching the crowds in the outdoor courtyard areas.

                • Don’t doubt it. Early in my life I was hired by a company who got some sort of state or federal funding to “train” me. They then put me in charge of reporting my “training”. The company did zippo. All my “training” was reading I did for myself.

                  Another anecdote comes from a friend who worked for a time in a drug rehab clinic in NY. He worked hard, and got a couple of his clients clean enough that he released them from the program. His boss tore him a new one. Program got funds depending on the number of clients. Never, ever, declare a client “clean”, was the mantra.

                  Yet another – a brother-in-law ran a child welfare office in Cambridge, MA. Came to dinner one night proud as a peacock. His office had gotten an award for getting their overhead below 70%. Overhead.

                  Give Government money, and they’ll waste it.

                  • Old Coach. Give Government money and they will not only waste it but create tons of paperwork in the process. At least 80% of the counselor’s work load at Job Corps was nothing but paperwork, paperwork, and more paperwork. A counselor once asked a department head at a mandatory meeting (lots of required meetings) a $64 question….”whaddaya want us to do, work with the students, or sit on our computers and do paperwork”?
                    No answer, just a frowny face from the Student Records Manager. No raise for Patsy (the counselor).
                    It wasn’t all bad news though. In spite of the high level of corporate bullshit, staff burnout, and safety issues on center, a percentage of students did graduate from Job Corp as completers in their trades and academics. Graduation ceremonies are really something to see.
                    Some of those gangbangers actually turned their lives around and accomplished something.

            • You should really read the article fighting gear before you comment. That is when Reagan really starten putting this country into debt. And if you really know anything about history The Soviet Union was already in Collapse and Reagan took advantage and jumped on the already dead horse and said tear down the wall. Reagan was an Actor phony as they come. The most money I ever made was the 2nd half of the 90’s under Bill Clinton. I’d Love to Party like it was 1999 again. BTW/ Reagan is the Father of Terrorism as we know it today, Since he underminded The Carter Admin and Paid off tg e Iranian Terrorist by releasing like $5Billion in Iranian frozon assets for the release of the 55 hostages who were captive for 444days. Read the History about Reagan Cowardness and cause of the Beruit Bombing, Iran Contra and all the rest of Reagan smoke screen Crimes. I can’t recall said Reagan under oarh lying asshole. And the firing of traffic controllers undermining collective bargaining agreements with unions. Then dedicating Washintons airport as the Ron Reagan Airport. Reagan wad not safe at any speed. Yeah do your research about the real history not the smoke screen phony headlines. I know Hisory cause I did the research and always dug into the real truth. So yeah paying off Terrorists, how brilliant that was. Iran contra cocain cowboy!!

              • WWTI

                You do need to do a litte research on the Reagan administration. Look at the budgets he submitted and then look at what congress made him except. He did not have enough support in congress. The would have overturned a Veto.
                Congress controls the money not the president. Should Obama be blamed for our current debt. Yes because he wants it but congress shoulders more of the blame. They could change the budget at any time. They control all the funds. If you research the constitution as well that is the way it is set up.

                • Reagan could have vetoed any spending Bill he wanted. He was a coward and believed in supply side economics and trickle down. I’m still waiting for the 1980’s trickle down.

                  • Didn’t Reagan spend the majority of his time in the white house, living with DEMENTIA? As I recall, they hid that fact from the public for years

                    My question is: If the president was an old, incompetent figure-head, WHO WAS ACTUALLY RUNNING THIS COUNTRY AT THE TIME?

                  • What I said was that he did no have the power in congress. They would have overturned the veto. Congress controls all the money.

                  • Your 1980s trickle-down was all mopped up by the Clinton Administration.

                    When Reagan was Prexy, the Speaker of the House was one unAmerican Anglo-hating Irish politician named “Tip” O’Neill, a favorite of the Kennedy clan, who had little stinker Teddy in the Senate already. I grew up and went to college in Boston, where I saw that Irish hatred for Anglo Americans first hand. I don’t color all Irish persons that way, but the Kennedy Mafia was out for itself and itself alone. Drain all the money they could from the government to their friends and colleagues. It was so solid a consortium that Reagan could not break it.

                    BTW at that time the largest illegal immigrant population in New England was…..Irish. That’s why Teddy fought for the amnesty bill.

            • Yeah so how’s that “collapse of the Soviet Union” thing going lately?

              Methinks rumors of their demise were equally greatly exaggerated.

              • Well the collapse and break up of the Sov Union happened, as all the eastern block European Countries are their own Country now. And the Soviet Union is now Called Russia. lol

          • I don’t know about you, but the only people I’ve ever worked for full time were rich. So the only paychecks I ever earned were trickled down. If you squeeze the wealthy, they start laying off and slow down on their big purchases.

            The only voodoo was in the mouths of the MSM. Supply side economics had nothing to do with expensive military items. That was just over specifying requirements until off-the-shelf items couldn’t be used and economy of scale was eliminated. If you had to make only 10 special toilet seats to fit an aircraft toilet, it would cost a lot more than just stamping out ordinary home toilet seats by the millions in a factory.

            I did a lot better under Reagan than under Carter, and I believe most other people did too. I bet you did also, if you were even in the work force back then. I started my last and best job, which I retired early from, during the Reagan administration.

            • Archivist

              You are so right. A lot of people despise all wealthy people. I don’t understand there thought process. Lets for example just take there money and divide it up amongst the rest of us.
              Then corporations would shut down. This would cause most small business to collapse too. You could not get goods or services because the major suppliers would be out shut down. At the same time there would be a huge loss of jobs. So when the money would be hard to spend. You would have some money given to you but no job.

              I guarantee after much pain then we would end up back right where we are. Most of the wealthy would be wealthy again because they are the hardest workers. Most have failed been poor and then had success.

              My big complaint is how the government has rigged the system now. It was designed in the beginning to give all the opportunity to succeed with hard work. Now the harder you work the more the government takes. Now if you try to even build a shed on your property you must have permits, inspectors, and permission from zoning. A lot of huge organizations like Walt Disney could not happen in today’s world.

              There is very little chance of the middle or lower class becoming rich now. This is due to government regulation and the constant taking of money by taxation. Which makes people dependent on the government. Which is what they want.

              Original design was you have freedom period. The freedom to succeed or fail. It did not have any socialist policies at all. It is never right to take from one person and give to another.
              If that happens then the first person finally gets tired of it and decides there is no need to work hard. Why work hard to pay for those who don’t work hard.

              Who the hell designs a system where if you work overtime or a second job they take more. The harder you work now the more they take.

              Has anyone really thought about that? It was many years ago but you can get a lot of overtime working for the power company. Around the year 2000 some friends and myself did some calculations. It only really benefited us to work 17 hours of overtime a pay period. After that the tax rate became to high for any benefit.

          • wwti
            were you looking for work in the carter years?
            Reagan may not have been the perfect president but he made things a hell of a lot better

            • I was in high school in the 70’s, but never had any problems finding jobs in the late 70’s.

              Reagan was a phony fraud. Anybody can look like a Genius when they have an Unlimited Credit Card to buy anything they want. Did you even read the article above?

              • Isn’t “phony fraud” like a double negative?

                • Phony & a Fraud. Better? lol

              • WhoWuddaThunkit

                Clinton…….NAFTA, China Free Trade, Deregulation the Financial Sector. The first two took away your good job and the last one your savings and pension.

                There is no bigger phony fraud than Bill Clinton. Do you know your history?

              • Reagan wrote his own speeches. The Halfrican can’t even order a hot dog with mustard without a teleprompter. And he was NOT senile while he was still President. That came later.

                Sad what the liberal propaganda mill has done to WWTI’s generation.

          • The free fall occurred with NAFTA, China Free Trade and the demise of Glass-Steagall which removed significant regulations from those pillars of integrity in the Financial Sector. All three took place with the signature of President Clinton.

            Bush 41 and 43 would have accomplished the above but the media lets the public know, “The Republicans are going to allow Wall Street to steal your pension and ship your job overseas”. When the Democrats do it, and they did it with the three major things above the Media is virtually silent. For this reason flag down a Democrat and as them who deregulated Wall Street and shipped jobs overseas. The Reply, Reagan, Bush, Bush, Bush, Bush,…………….Republicans.

            The ignorant get the Government they deserve.

            • Well put, and dead-on accurate. Thanks!

              Sadly, while the ignorant get what they deserve, WE have to live with it, too. TANJ.

        • Today’s National Debt Clock:

          Wow…I heard this can go on forever…

          • That clock will not go on forever. But when it does finally stop, nothing will matter anymore.

        • We the People didn’t accrue those debts. The Federal Gov did. Let them pay it. We just need to stop paying them through taxes and fines and they’ll go away, literally. I know its easier said than done, but with the federal gov running into insolvency, its a great time to do it. Tell the Chinese and the FED to go take their payment from congress and the white house. Who gives a shit! Our property shouldn’t be on the line, and if they think it is, lets revisit the Bundy Ranch. There are still a lot of blades of grass left in this country.

        • It IS our debt… even it’s technically not. You people elect people that spend that money frivolously. You people don’t hold them accountable. You people are hell bent on the ever expansive war machine and every thing else the empire acquires

      2. Socialist-in-Chief Obola raised it 70% during his reign, and he’s not done yet. We’re fucked.

        • I despise/hate,what have you obola but the debt has grown and thus snowballed each presidency,till the crash will probably double one term under next potus.I do not care about the lies they tell about debt,will not be repaid and that also includes world debts,not just the US’s,simple math shows it just won’t work.Stockpile then spread the rest of any assets if you have em in hard to steal places,as I mentioned last night in a post,vice president of the fed reserve(thieves!)said in a Aug. speech in Sweden that bail ins for US banks inevitable,will not only cause civil unrest/OK,perhaps full blown civil war but also not do much to stave off the affects of debt,you have sizable financial assets get em spead out and safe while you can,keep just enuff in banls ect. to fund say debit card purchases ect.

          • Re:Detroits Massive Power Outage Today. A main Power Cable gave way and cut the power supply to Detroits crumbling Infrastructure. Look for more and more of this collapsing infrastructure to happen across the Nation. STAY OFF OF DANGEROUS BRIDGES. At least 10% of American bridges are category critical and ready to collapse. And our incompetent psychopaths running the show are having more fun playing war games abroad than taking care of our own. I bet this winter we will see some major disasters in infrastructure fail that could collapse, and see massive deaths. What if Detroit had no power for a month in the dead of winter? How about Chicago? Prepare Prepare!!

            • Detroit Power outage could also have been a Computer hack. But they don’t want everybody to know their vulnerabilities and weaknesses if that was the case. Cause then everybody would be trying to hack in and shut-er’ down.

      3. I think Obaama just took a lesson from Darth Cheney
        remember when he said “deficits don’t matter” ???

        they’re all the same
        ALL of them

        • The 1980’s was the decade when Debt was taught to be a good thing. The evolution of the Credit Card (then called MasterCharge- They the Master and We their Debt Slaves) as the Feds- IRS actually allowed us to deduct 100% of the Credit Card Debt Interest to be deducted on our Fed Income Tax Return. Do you all recall that? I do. And eventually that is also what created consumerism as we know it today that created debt slaves. Eventually the IRS phased out the write off to only 50% then 25% then nothing and Americans were hooked on easy credit like crack babies.

          • The plan to increase debt laid the groundwork to fuel a short term economic expansion to deceive the body politic with the nonsense, “Service Economy”. It quelled opposition to the Free Trade de-industrail process that occurred in the next decade before it imploded. Too late now because, were all, “Living Here In Allentown And THEY CLOSED All The Factories Down”.

            Does life imitate art or does art imitate life? I think the former with the George Orwell book 1984 and the line from the classic movie Animal House when Otter says to Flounder after they destroyed his brothers car, “Face it, you fucked up, you trusted us”.

      4. The fed gov does nothing for me except take my hard earned wages. I think for that kind of bill I deserve a chain gun and 1 million rounds of 308 for it.

        • The good news is that WHEN everything finally unravels, if you are good enough you can most likely procure yourself one of them.

      5. All it will take is for the rest of the world to get pissed enough to stop eating our debt and subsidizing our cushy lifestyle. Do they have the balls to pull the plug? We’ll see

        • The U.S. is just one Check away from default on the Day nobody wants to buy US Debt Bonds.

          Its like Musical Chairs on an Airplane. When the Music stops, and last guy holding the Debt Bond is without a chair, and gets pushed off the plane without a parachute. And it will be a Long Fall Down. Splat!!!

          • Actually the Federal Reserve by the magic of modern money creation through means still being unraveled plausibly funnel money to a third party to buy the debt. This happened with Belgium who bought US Treasuries with a massive supply of money that dwarfed their funds. Its source is a black hole. It was something on the order of 30% of their GDP.

            Do not underestimate their ability to use smoke and mirrors. Their creativity is ingenious, their means far reaching.

            I think the music stoops at WWIII.

      6. “A dead mule turns no soil,
        but you’re welcome to keep whipping it.”

        The debt will never be paid.

        • The debt will be paid, just not in a currency they’re going to like.

          • The debt will be paid by death (War)

            • We need to follow Icelands plan. Jail the Bankers and wipe the debt off the books. Problem solved. Oh watch the Jew Parasites shake in their Rat boots over that. Whiny Piss Ants!! Here is your choice Parasites; Either leave the country or go to jail. Pick one or the other.

              • Who,do what Iceland did,they are a totally destroyed/economically ruined country!Oh,wait,yep,they told the powers that want to be to get fucked and did just fine.Done on a large scale will be interesting to see the results but am willing to give it a shot!

                • I don’t think its possible to effectively do it in a nation as populous as the US. You need to watch your politicians so damn carefully to make it happen as any bill proposed to rectify the problem would have, “A devil in the details”.

                  Small States tend to run better than big States. Smaller countries better than large all other things being equal.

      7. There’s really no way out of this without a major upheaval. I couldnt agree more about how the system is the cause of all this. This country is full of self serving assholes who do nothing but try to better their own circumstances. Thats fine for the most part but what really irks me is when those same people become so corrupt they start to force everyone to buy into these rebranded socialist entitlement programs. They regulate every aspect of ours lives and force us to provide for the worthless eaters, purchase healthcare, but into social security. Its bullshit.

        The system is outdated and over reaching. I’ll be happy when its gone.

        • In a collapse, I can see the Banks allowing those with a mortgage to only pay interest only payments as to avoid mass defaults. Paying principal down will be optional. Also include property ins and prop Taxes with the loan Interest.

          • You haven’t learned to understand an amortization schedule, have you. For the first half of the mortgage period you are already paying only the interest, or close enough as no matter.

        • I’d bet all I have you won’t be happy when it goes down. Watching people you know starving, dieing because of no medicine, hungry kids, freezing homes. Old people just dieing because they cannot do anything else. Yeah it’s just going to be a laugh a minute. Shit head.

          • People please consider this: Assuming there is a financial crisis, Does the Gov even want to save us? Lets look: Well 50 million on Food Stamps I’d say no, How about those 100’S of thousands that are in the Gov that issue food stamps No?; The 3 million in Jail? or the guards, if those people are gone who needs the guards? Or the suppliers.
            100 Million getting Gov money that aren’t working, and that includes SS and ALL the others, plus the people that provide to those people down to the farmers that grow their food.
            Realistically, the Gov can easily do without 2/3 of the people in the country and be better off. If the Gov saw a terrible crisis coming, that it could not prevent, why not just let it come? Those useful people that can take care of themselves will mostly live, those that cannot will mostly die. Isn’t that exactly what the Gov would want? IMHO the Gov knows it cannot stop the SHTF and has decided that you are on your own; because it doesn’t want people that cannot take care of themselves; that’s what got us here.Comments?

            • Take this in as many ways as you want…

              A government big enough to give you everything you want
              …is strong enough to take everything you have.

              Thomas Jefferson

              Live Free or Die…hmmm 1/3rd huh?

              • This is funny. Israel is in a Meltdown. Netanyahu just fired 2 disenting finance miniters, as I sreal becomes more Isolated in the world as Europe and South America Shuns them. Netanyahu is a psychopath wacked out and any support for him has crumbled. The US. Need to stop giving Isreal Forielgn Aid. $5 Bil a year in welfare to the crack crybaby.

                • This is even more Funnier- Its high time for the U.S. to dump Israel for good.

                  UN resolution: Israel must renounce nuclear arms -POSTED: TUESDAY, DECEMBER 2, 2014
                  UNITED NATIONS (AP) — The U.N. General Assembly overwhelmingly approved an Arab-backed resolution Tuesday calling on Israel to renounce possession of nuclear weapons and put its nuclear facilities under international oversight.
                  The resolution, adopted in a 161-5 vote, noted that Israel is the only Middle Eastern country that is not party to the Treaty on the Non-Proliferation of Nuclear Weapons. It called on Israel to “accede to that treaty without further delay, not to develop, produce test or otherwise acquire nuclear weapons, to renounce possession of nuclear weapons” and put its nuclear facilities under the safeguard of the U.N.’s International Atomic Energy Agency.

                  The United States, Canada, Palau and Micronesia joined Israel in opposing the measure, while 18 countries abstained.
                  Israel is widely considered to possess nuclear arms but declines to confirm it.


                  • Besides the US and Canada not supporting this UN Resolution, and of course Israel voted NO. Thats 3, Out of the rest of the entire World, this small tiny Island with 21,000 supports Israel. Bwhahahahahaaa Talk about being Isolated in the world.

                    Palau (Listeni/pəˈlaʊ/, sometimes spelled Belau or Pelew), officially the Republic of Palau (Palauan: Beluu er a Belau),[4] is an island country and a United States Associated State located in the western Pacific Ocean. It is geographically part of the larger island group of Micronesia. The country’s population of around 21,000 is spread across 250 islands forming the western chain of the Caroline Islands.

                • we need to stop ALL foreign aid


                  • It may happen one day all these countries feeding off us tax payers get cut off cause our country is Bankrupt. You wanna see wars, death and rioting? Ferguson world wide. Its almost there now.

              • TJ is the author I quote the most these days Talon. His wisdom seems to have been largely forgotten. It is great to see someone else posting his works. And the “Live free or die.” is the motto I had on my Harley and on my shop door. Dittos to ya my friend 🙂

                “He who knows nothing is closer to the truth than he whose mind is filled with falsehoods and errors”
                 Thomas Jefferson

                “Whenever the people are well-informed, they can be trusted with their own government.”
                 Thomas Jefferson

                “To penetrate and dissipate these clouds of darkness, the general mind must be strengthened by education”
                 Thomas Jefferson

                “I tremble for my country when I reflect that God is just; that his justice cannot sleep forever.”
                 Thomas Jefferson

      8. big deal, it’s just a bunch of numbers now.

        from 2008 on it no longer mattered how many more trillions they added to the national debt.

        zio-america was already past the point of no return in 2008.

        there is now only one way this will end…

        they are simply just going to kill the zio-america fed reserve fiat dollar.

        have a international market crash and reset day!

        everyone goes back to zero.

        except ‘you’ the common tax debt slave goyim.

        you will continue as before enslaved by ever increasing debt and expenses just to exist in their n.w.o. world.

        wink wink

        • G. W. Bush doubled the Nat Debt from $6 Trillion to $12 Trillion. And NEVER Vetoed any spending bills. As he was quoted in a financial meeting. “It must be a budget, cause it has a lot of numbers in it.” Refering to the financial budget report.

      9. Red team can fix it… Unless you’re rooting for the blue team.. then go blue team, go!

        The patriots really know how to fix it but will any of US do it? Just know, the powers that shouldn’t be, want you to try. I say what comes is coming anyway.


        Tick tock….

        • Next week Illegal immigration and possible Government shutdown. Shut it down for a few years and stop paying all politicians.

          • the politicians would just resort to what they do already..Steal from us

      10. Debt and lies are generally mixed together.

      11. Just want to throw this out there to all you wimps that keep commenting you’re going to leave if this site doesn’t shape up.

        I am one of the veterans that have been here from almost the beginning. I have changed my name and email a few times for opsec and don’t comment as much as I used to, but I read everything.

        This is Mac’s site and he can do whatever he wants with it.

        Some of you think it’s changed. Not much!! It’s the commenters that have changed. Guys like BI and JOG are still out there. If you pay attention and quit bickering and talking about stupid shit you’d know they do, albeit rarely, comment. Though you don’t know under what name.

        If you want this to go somewhere productive, just ask. There is a wealth of knowledge in this audience, just ask. You may think your problem is trivial. If it saves someone’s health, family or life after shtf, it’s worth a question!!!!
        molon labe

        • The average Car Loan is now $28, 000. About $450+ a Month in payments. Don’t get caught in that debt cycle trap while you’re upside down on the loan to value ratio for 5 years.

          • We buy used cars from older people. They take super care of them and they have relatively low mileage. Buy them with 80K on the odometer and sell them with 150k. You get them for between 3 & 5 grand. The time to buy them is when you don’t need one as great deals come on its schedule not yours.

            • @Kevin, Yep good cars from Old People. I bought a Big Grand Ville in 1979 for $600, Bought a Cadillac Seville in 1989 for $600, drove it to Florida and for a year, ran great till some A-hole hit me and the Insurance Co paid me $1600 since it was totaled. lol I bought a lot of cars and pickup trucks for under $1000 back when.

              The better deal today, is to buy a low mileage car, about 2 years old, still with warranty for half price of the new cost,then drive them till they drop or about 100K miles. The Maintenance and parts on today’s cars are costly, and why I prefer a warranty. I know diesels can run for 200K miles.. what ever.

            • Needless to say the Ford Crown Victoria and Mercury Marquis are the ride of choice.

          • 308,000 miles, bought used at 40,000 for 6 grand, do all my own work.

            Why would you do anything else?

            It’s 4 wheels and an effing seat. For real. What the hell with the $40,000 cars???

            • Before my current vehicle, I drove a BMW M3. $67K new. lol

              Oh they are nice if you like driving 147 MPH..and taking curves at 30 MPH. Had that sucker up over a bridge and still climbing faster, but ran out of bridge. We have long bridges here in FL. Got my share of tickets.

              Current SUV more practical and never had a ticket since.

        • WiPrep. Yeah OK BarnCat. I know that is you.

          • WIprepped;
            completely agree. Not sure about BI, but JOG is around as well as some of the other originals.


            • @GR, I will jump in here, how are you? I haven’t checked in for awhile, but hubby home from hospital and healing well….nurse comes everyday to check everything.

              Yes, so many of the posters here have ‘disappeared’ sure do miss BI, Daisy, Burt the Brit, etc, etc……and where is JOG? Glad to see you and a few others are still here!

              Braveheart, I hope you are ok….are you getting close to moving to GA? Take care All, CC

              • Hey CC;
                I have been wondering how you and the family have been. I’m glad to see that things are ok on your end.

                I am well, keeping busy and looking forward to winter here on the east coast. My boy’s cant wait for the snow, etc.

                I haven’t heard from jog in a couple of weeks. Not sure if he has comm issues or what. But he does tend to come and go with his messages.

                Please keep in touch. I may not post often buy I try and read daily. Take care of yourself and your hubby.


        • Well said WIprepped, well said!

          As for the article, I can’t help but wonder just what the politicians know and are terrified to tell “We the people”!

          • At this point what do they gain by telling the truth? What do we gain? If they told the truth EVERYTHING would be like 22 ammo; unavailable.
            If you look carefully they are doing what they can to help the people helping themselves. Why do you think they are minting 40 million Silver Eagles and selling them to the public?
            Wal-Mart is now selling 25 year pack food. We are now selling 8 million guns per year, Some people are getting ready; the rest, oh well

            • Where are these Wal-Marts that are selling survival food? I keep hearing about them, but I’ve never been in a store that actually stocked that kind of stuff. Does anyone have a list of actual store locations?

              • all of of them here in SWFL carry it ,as does Rural King stores

                • all the walmarts that is

              • You can order online at any of them and they will ship to closest free.

                • I’d rather walk into a store and pay cash. I’m in eastern NC.

              • sandpoint Idaho sells it. go online to walmart and check to see if your store has it, otherwise they ship to the store free. I only have a few packs of mountain house for hiking (emergency) as I carry dried fruit, jerky and mixed nuts to keep the pack @ 45-50lbs max. I carry 40 rifle and 56 pistol rounds that add alot of weight.

              • Archivist:

                Your store location is as close as your fingertips. Go directly to the Mountain House website. By avoiding the middle man you should save some money. Depending on your order you should get free shipping to YOUR house.

            • Go to Utah and southern Idaho, where there’s lots of Mormons.

          • CWR:

            A good guess about what the politicians know and are terrified to tell the people would be who got them elected with ‘money’, and what they owe that ‘who’. “We the people” are not figured into that equation.

            Bill Cosby is having it “good” compared to what would happen to those politicians.

        • Well said.

          Must be cold up there in Wisconsin right about now…

          So you know those BBQ propane tanks? They are a wonderful, affordable and multi-use prep item. I store 8 of them at all times. Many times people will give you their old rusty crappy ones for free. Take it down and swap it out for a shiny new tank, $20.00. You can not go wrong with these.

          I use mine for:

          1)The BBQ!
          2)An 18,000 BTU Mr. Heater for the man cave
          3)Fuel for lantern and cooking stove when camping (never ever will I buy the 1lb propane bottles)
          4)Possible Ordinance in a desperate situation
          5) Trade item always in high demand… as you can cook, provide light and provide heat from a single source.

          I prep for epic snowstorms, so this makes a lot of sense. Propane is so versatile why would you not store some?

          Full Disclosure:

          I DO NOT sell propane, or propane accessories…

          Good Day To You

            • Be aware that a propane heater is very difficult to light in cold climates. When I go to my cabin,I have to warm up the propane torch using my truck defroster, then open the door, light the torch, run to the gate and heat up the lock to open it… yes, the lock is protected from snow, but the moisture still sticks the tumbler.

              • grease the tumbler, stuff it in the slot with your finger and run the key up in there a few times

                this procedure should only be done after you have cooked out the moisture already inside the lock

                also stuff some grease down in the latch side and the captured side of the hasp / hoop

                I have a sliding gate at my facility ..and its colder than a well diggers ass up here 7 months out of the year
                it also helps to put a little rubber flap cover over the lock to shed the rain and snow from entering the top of a pad lock if thats what your dealing with

              • I guess that (propane issues in cold climes) my vary some with the type of equipment. My Mr. Heater went with me last year to a snow camp at 9000 feet. Pilot light worked each time – piezo start, which was actually shocking.

                Would have gotten frost bite without it as I did not change out my wet socks in a timely manner. Aspen is a shitty firewood, burns hot and fast. Spent more energy chopping and gathering than getting warm by the pitiful fire.

                Lesson learned. And yes, I changed my wet socks out to wool socks, but the damage was done, blood retreated. I knew I was going to be alright when my feet began to hurt like hell. Always a good sign!

                • Mr Heaters are a great prep. they have several styles available. Super reliable and relatively cheap for what you get. For those that don’t know they use the 1 lb propane canisters, but can also run off of 20lb and larger tanks with a separate hose.

                  They won’t heat your house but they will keep the chill out of a room no problem.

                  Sportsmansguide has them pretty cheap right now too.


          • Yea, temp has sucked for a long time already, but keeps away the bugs and the rif raf. Keep stocking propane. It lasts forever. I’ve retrofitted one of the gennys to run on propane. I refill my smaller tanks from a 500 gal. Easy to do and it’s cheaper than gas.
            molon labe

          • I was getting mine from the local landfill ( free ). Some even still have gas in them. I picked up some thirtys and fourties because they had the old valve. Then I grab the twentys, when they have the right valve. Take them home, remove the good valves from the twentys, install them in the 30’s and 40’s. Works great. I also got a couple of 30 aluminums. Had to switch those valves out to. All it takes is a little effort. Then in the suimmer when the propane is the cheapest, I fill them up.

          • When tank is expired it makes a good wood stove for wall tent, i used 30lbder

            • A Recent October Interview Jim Rogers said “SELL EVERYTHING!!” He did also say he is investing in Food Commodities like Rice & Farming in Russia.

            • Where we live, most of the propane stations don’t check the dates if the tank looks good. So that means no expired tanks unless they get all rusty.

          • We bullet casters clear ’em out so there’s no propane gas left in ’em, cut ’em in half, use the bottom half as a pot for large melts of wheelweights and scrap lead. Wizard.

          • Townsaver, we use the one pound bottles for our torch, but we refill them ourselves with the small tanks for the gas grill, you can buy the little refill gizmo from sportsman guild for about seventeen bucks. Not trying to be a smarty pants just throwing that info out there

        • Hey WI,

          I am one of those who left, and came back. I got sick of the “keyboard commando” types who couldn’t wait to remind everyone what they would do to looters, beggers, etc. when TSHTF. I also got sick of the CONSTANT moderation. More than a few of us are still going through it.

          I have noticed glimmers of BI these last couple of months, though i admit I could be wrong. I miss a few more people as well. Heck, I even miss Eisen. Wink wink, acid.

          What are the odds that TSHTF happens this coming year?

          My guess, it has been going on since 2003.

          • Better than average, would be my guess. I feel towards the end of next year. You still have a couple pennies left in your pocket that TPTB want.

          • Define coming. You live in Motown it’s been here for 10 years. You look at the budget, it’s here. Look around the world, it’s lots of places. The Gov knows it and in it’s own stupid way it’s trying to stop it. Unfortunately the Gov has worked itself into a corner in which all the ways out are politically impossible, from the Gov’s standpoint, Meaning it would have to tell the truth; which would immediately bring on the disaster it’s trying to avoid. All it can hope to do now is suck up all the oil, silver, etc from other countries it can and hope they run out when we do.

            • Paranoid

              Your making the assumption that The Government actually directs policy of The Government.

              We in the USA are in the unusual position to see and (I’ll get flack for this) benefit from the global control TPTB have. TPTB need the US Military to be the final arbiter in any dispute. They need to have access to the mightiest war machine in history. In the end as some communist said, “Power comes from the barrel of a gun”. TPTB cannot afford the loss of their muscle and therefore need to maintain political stability sufficient to not compromise this relationship. In effect they don’t need you but they do need you not to collectively cause too many problems that may jeopardize their use of the military muscle that they consider theirs.

          • I agree,

          • What?,will admit only been on site perhaps a year and a half,was gone a bit due to computer and just life issues but being back still see a lot of folks here who’s thoughts/ideas enjoy.I realize some miss the thumb thing but you feel strongly about a post whether positive or negative go to effort time available and put in a response.

        • Correct you are..whoever you are..

          The likes of Burt the Brit and manos for starters..and don’t forget n.o…he would really get the party started!All of whom I still stay in contact with..
          There were contributors here from across the no longer.

          Now we have the preponderance of keyboard commandos based on fear of muslims,jews, blacks,terrorists, hispanics,gays,etc etc..basically your stereotypical rabid right winger anarchists on steroids..

          There’s a few us dinosaurs still hanging around..and some new ones as well who still contribute our vitriol and ideas..

          Enjoy the day


          • I do miss Burt the Brit.. she was one of my favorite when I first started reading this site. NinaO was/is another. Didn’t always agree with his point of view but he has a wealth of info.


      12. Debt is the slavery of the free.

      13. Maybe it’s just time to quit feeding the beast……..

      14. Debt is a lot like the love of money. It is a fatal disease of a republic as It undermines governments and corrupts the people.

        • That oil ain’t going nowhere. Its there, it can be reached with present technology.

      15. Ticking away the moments that make up a dull day
        Fritter and waste the hours in an off-hand way
        Kicking around on a piece of ground in your home town
        Waiting for someone or something to show you the way

        Tired of lying in the sunshine staying home to watch the rain
        You are young and life is long and there is time to kill today
        And then one day you find ten years have got behind you
        No one told you when to run, you missed the starting gun.

        And you run and you run to catch up with the sun but it’s sinking
        Racing around to come up behind you again
        The sun is the same in a relative way, but you’re older
        Shorter of breath and one day closer to death.

        • Yep ,Pink hit the nail on the head

          • Hey .02;
            haven’t seen you post in a while. Hope all is well on your end.


      16. What ever happened to that story that was on here about the guy and his family during a shtf? I don’t remember the site. Anyone know? Thanks.

        • I think they had 4 episodes, and then nothing. I don’t remember their being an ending.

          • Thanks fish.

            • September 07 is the last one I found.I could have missed one though. All you have to do is keep scrolling down through the articles.

          • that story was kind of gay. Jason Jones? lol

        • Check out shtf school. Selco has had more happen in his life than hopefully all of us combined ever will.
          molon labe

          • I did not really care for that little fake story much. I will check out Selco’s though. I have been reading here for over a year, just not posting much, until recently. Sorry your freezing. We were 80 today. Still gardening. We do still have our bugs though, year round. I am one of the natives, so they aren’t to bad for me.

        • Aftermath on

          • Thanks Smith.

        • ive read 16 episodes so fer

      17. My gambling debts to the Mob don’t matter either, they’ll just “forget about it”. Right. HELP!!!!

      18. It only matters who you are and what you stand for.

        Things I do believe will only continue to get worse from here in a biblical sort of way: I however will continue upright and “finish the game”.

        Bought a new solar oven and cooked a chicken with rice in it today! Very tasty indeed!!!

      19. Today my wife and I debated putting the last two Christmas items, for our kids, on a credit card. Christmas is already going to be meager, but we decided it is better to not incur the debt…I know right? Such a weird idea…turns out that debt is bad.

      20. Got a job. Finally. Taxes took $150,left w/$500. Rent is $400. Go figure

      21. I pay cash for everything. It is difficult only because it requires patience ,never my strong suit. I am saving for a new bug out location in rural West Kentucky. As I no longer have a bank I will have to pay cash. I am praying fervently that the damn doesn’t burst till April as I can buy the property by then. I also bought a vacation to British Columbiawith my wife for Christmas. I know this is extravagant but my reasoning is I feel this may be the last real vacation we will ever be in a position to take. Do you guys think I am wrong. I have been prepping a while and could buy a lot of stuff with the money I am using for the vacation. I guess I feel you can only smell a rose when it’s blooming and I think the blooms will soon be a memory. How do you guys handle these type of feelings.

        • Your marriage is more important…

        • Anywhere near Webster County? I had family that moved there from NC back in the 1850s. I went there to do research. The little town of Dixon has one stoplight, but the local library has the best genealogy collection I’ve ever seen in a library that size. They even had a book containing some of my genealogical writings.

        • I did the same thing this last summer. I took the family on vacation to Montana/Idaho/Washington. And I spent a lot of money that could of been put down on land. But we made wonderful memories, met some great guys from here on this board and discovered where we truly want to be and to live. Now I am trying to get that money saved back up for a land purchase. It is a tough thing to weigh out for sure.

          I will tell you this for sure…..if we could go back and do it again. We would of cut the trip shorter and cut the money spent as well. Go have a blast but be frugal where you can.

          Dave in Idaho,
          Seen 5 acres yesterday for 35 or 39K
          But I want 10 🙁

          • Ever seen yellowstone, Nat. Pk.?

            Awesome, landscape and wildlife. Good relatively cheap vacation if you stay in Cody,WY and other directions just outside the park.

            The fifty mile (or less) trip from Cody, along the Shoshone River, into east entrance where Buffalo Bill’s House stands, is awesomely beautimus.
            Teddy Roosevelt said it was the most scenic drive anywhere in the USA.

            After doing it in 1994, I am inclined to agree.

            Better get it in this coming year; early summer. The whole thing just might blow away soon.

            • Should have seen Yellowstone before the fire went through. Flagged on road repair there one summer. That was before they removed most bears into the ‘back country’.

              Every where there was a bear ‘jam’ there was a traffic jam. Trucks hauling hot oil would get held up by the ‘jams’. Truckers soon figured that out. They bought alka seltzers, put them in food, threw them to the bears, the bears would start foaming at the mouth…..end of the tourist traffic jam!

          • Location, Location, Location. 5 will get you 50,000 as there is forest everywhere…and no way to lock you out.

        • We prep for the worst but can’t stop living in the mean time. If your money situation allows you to take a vaction do it while you can.

      22. Interesting coincidence. $18 trillion is just about what the Government has spent on the “War on Poverty” since Lyndon Johnson.

        • Well,

          But the good news is that Poverty is just about licked.


      23. Anywhere there is Marxism expect huge debt. California, USA, Ontario, Canada have HUGE debts.

        When you have a lesbian Marxist Premier in Ontario whose mantra is feminism, what would you expect from the nanny state if there is no incentive to work, and alas et al, the feminists are complaining that men are staring at their exposed cleavage in the workplace.

        Marxism is a disease and it must be stopped. America was not founded on Marxism or matriarchial Queen Elizabeth rule. Leave those degenerate ideologies to socialist Canada.

      24. The debt does not matter: it is how it is accumulated that matters. If it is spent on revenue-generating activities (the military-industrial complex, ports, airports, R&D, etc.) then it is worth it. If it is spent on EBT cards, welfare, parking people in nowhere land, useless university degrees etc., then it is not well spent.

        Think of any country or economy as a machine. Build a better machine, give it some high-quality oil, and run it hard (think Germany, or China) and you have a money-making machine. Build a sh#t machine, throw in some sand and leaves, and then just add water instead of oil, and your machine will smoke (Ferguson, riots, crime) and eventually grind the gears down and fail.

        The only efficient money-making element in the US now is the military-industrial complex. It runs a global shake-down operation that works. It funds all of the major science and research, including all the cutting-edge stuff in Silicon Valley. In short, it is the only game in town. You are a total retard if you are not in on this and are instead just kicking dirt, wandering around some inner city ghetto somewhere. Get with the program, join the crew.

        • I am an efficient money maker. Why would I want to get in on the military-industrial complex that Eisenhower warned us about, when I can play a little on the computer at home and get paid in cash? I haven’t worked hard in 30 years, unless you count working for myself on my house and preps.

          As far as “the only game in town,” well I don’t live in town and don’t plan to.

        • Frank Thoughts

          “The only efficient money-making element in the US now is the military-industrial complex. It runs a global shake-down operation that works. ”

          God how I hate to agree with this thought but your 100% right.

      25. Looks like today is going to shape up to be another one of those days , still on station in occupied Amerika , they are expecting riots today in NYC , another grand jury acquittal for a police officer suspect in custody death . This one is different than the last one. , I feel it’s going to be end game soon , the regime is doing its best to inflame tensions to the point of no return without realizing the consequences. Our local command authority is OPENLY DEFYING orders from the department HQ leadership . Things are really turning ugly , this has the rank and file squarely against the CIC whose meddling is only going to bring this to something NO ONE WANTS TO SEE. Once this begins it will have to just run its course , there is no going back , we have reached the point of no return.

        Stay safe all , pray for our republic , this is not a conspiracy anymore , the worst is yet to come.
        Dark days are ahead , prepare like you have never prepared before for an undetermined time frame.
        Trust in a just God.

        Semper Fi 8541

        • @ NB… I think this has come back to bite them on the ass. The people they are trying to get to riot, are too lazy from never holding a job, being on EBT, GMO, crack, meth, and 40 malts. I noticed they have to IMPORT rioters.. alot of commies and pallirags.

        • Are they thinking this one will come back “no true bill” too??

          You gotta be freakin kidding me???

          So now the deadly choke hold that the autopsy report says killed him is on video and still “no true bill”, at the very least for manslaughter?

          Then maybe it is time for a civil war?

          • Just saw the alert on my phone… no indictment of the NYC cop.


            • Infuckingcredible…….when the war starts, I hope all understand where and why it started.

              “It’s not about black and white, it’s about the blue.”

            • Now if you got a text from Kate Upton that she wanted I date that would be surprising and just about up there in possibility of indicting a cop for excessive force that results in a death. Even more rare a conviction. Then the most rare of all prison time.

              You have a far better chance of hitting PowerBall as maybe two dozen or so are that fortunate annually.

      26. Throwing money at problems is the sign of weak leadership. In this world of political correctness effective solutions are subject of scorn and outrage. The fact is that we are no longer able to support this government. The next time you pay taxes, remember some of your money goes to countries with a space program, its called foreign aid.

      27. Quit feeding the beast, I’ve said that for years. We pay no taxes, our living is from cash only means and yes it can be done. Oh my they will come and arrest me if I don’t pay my taxes, look they don’t have the means to come after 1 million let alone 20 million+. If they did, a little residence will go a very long way to stop it. The old saying of don’t bite the hand that feeds you; well the government has NEVER HEARD THAT OLD SAYING. As long as you feed them they are going to bite harder. This is all MHO. Phil Collins song says it all, “I Don’t Care Any More”.

        MTCFMF!!//RIP America.

        • AMEN!!!
          we must be kin

          • Kula: Got you brother we went to different schools together. Stay safe.

            MTCFMF!!//RIP America.

      28. John B. Glubb (Glubb Pasha) and The Fate of Empires –

        Pretty much sums it up. The USA is at the end of it’s cycle and these are the years of the death throes. Not everyone will make it, the USA will endure much the same as ancient Greece, Rome and Great Britain have, but no longer be calling the shots.

        Prepare accordingly.


        • Well, it could be that we are simply turning the American Republic into the American Empire. Remember that the Roman died at the hands of a bevy of corrupt leaders. Then in 43 BC came Octavian, later to be crowned Augustus Caesar in 27 BC. First thing he did was to clean the deadwood and corruption out of the Roman Senate and clean up the justice system. During and AFTER Augustus was when Rome hit it’s zenith. The Western Empire had it’s ups and downs, but it lasted another 400 years.

          • …the Roman Republic died…..

      29. While it is basically impossible to avoid consumption taxes (unless you make all your major purchases in a country with low consumption taxes), you can certainly avoid all income and other taxes with the right moves ( The first thing is to find out what is the deductible for lower income workers in your country. It varies from country to country but it has been going up since 2008. Make sure you never declare earnings (or having employment income) that exceeds that figure.

        The next step is to off-shore the ownership for any assets or large savings you have. Then set up an off-shore family trust or shadow business and make that the owner of the assets, not you directly. For example, set up something called Excalibur Investments and base it in the Caymans or Luxembourg. Give it a bogus business (call it something digital or financial speculative) and then have it own the cash assets and any hard assets you have (house, shop, etc.). Pick up a foreign passport: Brazil is good. Marry a local babe: use her name as the Chief Executive Officer for your business. Use her name for all bank accounts. Because of FACTA you will need to do all overseas business through her name. Have a pre-nup set-up so that it is on paper that your wealth is shared with her 50/50. If she wants a divorce, it is still better to have 50 per cent of the wealth tax-free than 100 per cent in the US hit with masses of taxes.

        To the tax authority, you are as poor as a church mouse, barely getting by (something they love to see – they might even give you an EBT card and housing support). But offshore, you are a 1 percenter with an investment company in Luxembourg. Live frugally in the US: get a crappy apartment, ditch the car, own next to nothing apart from some kitchen utensils and a nice collection of wine. If the IRS sets up a camera on you, all they will see is some sad sack living in a crappy apartment.

        Take regular trips every few months to your offshore haven and manage your affairs there. Once you have got your wealth growing again, start picking up larger assets outside the US: a new home (you can get property very cheap in Spain or Portugal now), a failing European business that needs US-style business smarts and service, minerals/oil/gas/gold etc. Just toe-touch with the US if you have to but keep everything of substance outside the country.

        • Why you must be so frank, Frank (Skousen)?

        • How many people visiting this site do you really think could afford to buy businesses in Europe? If I had that much money, I certainly wouldn’t throw it away on a European business that’s already failing. I would buy a perfect retreat stocked with a lifetime of food and other supplies. Then I could sit on the front porch and enjoy the next 30 years, if I manage to live that long.

          • I take your point but the way around that is to play to your advantage as a foreign investor. Just as in the US, Europe has changed the tax laws to favor foreign investors over locals. It is an advantage and you could claim all sorts of support. Better still, on paper change your faith to Muslim and you can claim support as a ‘minority’ businessman (Europe has affirmative action laws like the US: the plus is that you do not need to be ‘black’: just an oppressed minority). Tell your new wife to walk around in a hijab and the tax man won’t touch you. In the UK, call yourself a Beacon Business Investor of Islamic Faith and the security services will give you money for telling other Muslims not to commit acts of terrorism. Keep your wife in a separate apartment, and she can claim welfare and housing benefit and child support. This can reach £50,000 a year depending on the area. Take your surplus and offshore it into an account in Luxembourg.

            Do this for a couple of years and you will have a tidy sum of money.

      30. Frank,some interesting thoughts,that said,you pick up say a euro business better have it as a overseas entity.The reason could be failing is all the taxes/regulation of country located in,you don’t want to get caught in the trap that killed the last owner.I would say personally do not have enuff to make the foreign investment setup viable as many do not.Once basic supplies taken care of spread assets in land/metals what have you.I understand the low profile of living in a crappy apt. but also want to enjoy the time I have left and want to be in a place feel at least have a small chance at surviving if a hard/quick crash comes,at least long enuff to do the right things!

      31. The national debt isn’t mine. Im completely debt free. I don’t owe anyone a dime. Now a lot of the goverment debt is spent on secret facilities. Places like Area 51. The underground city at MT Weather Ect. Those exist solely to ensure continuity of government. When the collapse happens everyone who depends on the government. They will see that enabling freebee and stipend disappear. left to fend for themselves. Those bunkers like Mt Weather need to become toombs. Things are pretty good for me at present. I was really hoping to live out my remaining years or decades drawing my Social Security Ponzi check and playing hobby farm. Ive realized That my dream is unlikely to continue.

      32. “The way to crush the bourgeoisie (Middle class) is to grind them between the millstones of taxation and inflation.”
         Vladimir Lenin
        Founder of Russian Communism

      33. All of collapsing Corporatist Fascist Murica is a complete LIE and FANTASY-from the illusion of freedom and democracy in a collapsing Orwellian Fascist Corporatist controlled complete nightmare, to the toxic poisonous disgusting vile food and drink the Corporatist Fascist Genocidal filth government approves for human consumption. The same Corporatist Fascist Government approved food and drink that is causing obesity levels to continue to rise, diabetes to continuing rising, and all auto-immune diseases to skyrocket, such as Celiac Disease. All from the poisonous toxic GMO containing foods and drinks, like SODA POISON, destroying the good bacteria in our guts, while also destroying our immune systems. NO other way an intelligent FREETHINKING human being can describe what is happening in Corporatist Fascist is GENOCIDE plain and simple you COWARDS afraid of the TRUTH, in the so-called “Land of the Free, Home of the Brave”

        • Ron Ahern:

          Great post. All the censure of peoples posts do not change the truth of what is happening to once great America.

        • Is anybody forcing you at gunpoint to eat and drink that shit?

          Yeah, I didn’t think so.

      34. With Everyone Focused on Ferguson, Obama Quietly Passing 3,400 New Regulations Before Thanksgiving

        any time you are distracted ( for sure fabricated just for this purpose or many purposes) this is the game they play

        is that not treasonous ? is that not untrustworthy?
        is that what you expect from a representative republic government?

        when we all wake up to the fact that our government and representation is not of the people by the people we have the RIGHT and the DUTY to abolish this government ..

        High time people .. theres way more shit than this that has hit the fan.. when do we all collectively say enough already

      35. way off topic
        but very interesting piece on fracking

        Hard Times in a Boom Town: Pennsylvanians Describe Costs of Fracking…osts-fracking/

      36. “And the people in charge of the system have backed themselves into a corner where there is no way out other than to default– either on their creditors (creating a global financial crisis), the central bank (creating a currency crisis), or on the citizens themselves (creating an epic social crisis).”

        Or get us into a major war (Ukraine anyone?), WWIII, and default that way. Of course there won’t be any winners in that one. Either that or counter-revolution/Civil War here.

        And so this Fourth Turning keeps heating up.

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