Collapse Survivor On The Reality Of Killing And Violence: “Killing Is A Nasty Job…”

by | Apr 1, 2016 | Headline News, Selco | 123 comments

Do you LOVE America?


    Editor’s Note: One of the most well informed and insightful preparedness resources you can tap to understand what is really necessary in order to survive a worst case scenario such as a total collapse of the system or a civil war-torn region is Selco of SHTF School. During the Balkan war of the 1990’s Selco was trapped and surrounded in a city where he spent One Year In Hell. People fought and died on an hourly basis over food and basic supplies. And when they weren’t fighting with each other, they were fighting those who were sent to ethnically cleanse the population. It was, by all accounts, a complete breakdown of a system and it happened almost overnight. One day people were sitting around in cafes drinking coffees and talking about the seemingly unimportant aspects of daily life… the next day they were being bombed, sniped and executed.

    In the following article Selco delves into a topic that many understand may become a reality, but one that is difficult to comprehend for those of us who have lived a life of relative peace.

    When your very survival hangs in the balance, killing and death become a regular occurence. From his own experiences, the SHTF School founder shares his views on the matter…

    selco-killing2 selco-killing

    3 Things You Need to Know About Killing
    By Selco (

    There are few things to understand if you are forced to kill someone or in if someone is trying to kill you.

    Most of the people are unaware of them but it is important to understand them.

    As I said many times before, most people simply did not face real violence before. I mean killing or fighting for life. That’s good because we live in society where those things are not needed.

    On the other side, from the point of survival if you did not went through serious violence before you lack that experience, you do not really know what to expect when SHTF So…

    People are easy to kill or people are hard to kill?

    Guess what? Both of the statements are actually true. How?

    It is simple, first forget about movie scenes where people are flying 10 meters back when you shoot at them with your handgun.

    Not too much flying there, when you shoot man from close distance couple of things can happen.

    In some cases he just flop (collapse) down, and that’s it. He is gone. And most interesting thing from that experience is sound of his collapse. It is sound like some big bag of something full of wet stuff and some solid elements goes down. Pretty much what our body is.

    It is special sound, and you willa remember it to the rest of your life.

    Let’s say here that right placement of the shot, right distance, numbers of shots, and your training and calmness brings makes this happen.

    In another case, you may find yourself in situation where attacker is coming to you, rapidly closing, you keep firing at him, distance is pretty close, and nothing happens… he is still closing, you shoot and shoot, you are screaming or you just think you are screaming, something loud keeps exploding in your ears, and you are not aware is that your gunshots or what, you are not even sure are guns being fired at all, maybe something is wrong with your gun “other guy’s eyes are getting closer and he is having a knife, he is huge, shit what is going on? Am I going to die? God? Mom?”

    And then he is down.

    Was that a guy that was hard to kill? Yes, later you figured that you shot him like 6 or 7 times, but not in correct places, he was huge, adrenaline made him forget the pain so…

    Both examples are real experiences. There are so many factors that play into this…

    So what with the questions about are folks easy or hard to kill, I suggest simple formula, if you are forced to kill someone, consider the fact that it takes lots of factors to be in right place to achieve that, but if if you are in situation when someone is trying to kill you act like it is very easy to get killed.

    Long long time ago, when I was beginner in some things, and when I did not know anything about violence, and it was very clear that I will face violence, one old dude gave me advice about similar things, he had pistol with one extra mag.

    He said: “OK, when he is coming to you, you empty magazine into him“ I asked what then? He said “then you reload and empty another magazine into him”

    I asked “Both magazines?”

    He said “First two bullets should do the job, but you just go and empty magazines at him”

    Killing is nasty job.

    Reasons for violence

    Huge topic. But lets just say that it will happen, without going too deep into philosophy. Lots of the violence will be “understandable” in a way, when SHTF. Fighting for food, water, land etc. And as a survivalist you need to be prepared for it. It makes sense to expect it.

    But lots of people will have problems to accept violence that will happen without real reasons.

    In fact, as I mentioned before, there are huge number of people who are waiting for SHTF to happen and to get violent without real reasons. Murdering, torturing, raping, imprisoning…

    You may call them sick people, which they are of course. But more important is to understand that today they are folks who drink beer in local park, or guys with who you watch football games sometimes.

    Or simply your peacefully looking neighbour. When SHTF, all kind of scum crawls out of their holes. So accepting violence in general is hard, it is easier when some people at least have some reasons but you can not expect this to be the case always. Prepare your mind for this.

    Accepting the violence

    You may have luck to live peacefully after seeing, experiencing or committing violence. Maybe you are built for that. Maybe you are what people call “strong man” inside and outside or only on one side.

    I think I remember each man who died in front of me or next to me. I remember sounds, smells, pictures.

    I forgot names and years, dates or places. But I remember moment when life goes from the eyes of dying man. Or deep last breaths from several people. Or simply smell of defecation when man is gone.

    Few times I thought I felt something like weird sensation, couple of seconds after men’s last breath, something like I could felt his soul is leaving him.

    Or I simply felt my adrenaline eruptions, or maybe I was losing my mind for a moment, who knows?

    With time you learn to cope with those things, to watch people die, either people you loved, or people who die from your hand.

    There was urban myth, that one officer from the army was asked something like “Captain, these young guys that we just killed in huge numbers, there are still kids left, they do not know anything, what do we do with them?”

    Officer said “We do what we do, it is our way of life”

    It is death. And you simply need to cope with it.

    Visit Selco’s Community Forum to discuss this and other topics

    You can follow Selco’s story at SHTF School and learn how he survived one year in hell. 


    More Excellent Reading From Selco:

    A Survival Q & A: Living Through SHTF In the Middle of A War Zone

    Advice From A Collapse Survivor: “RUN!” From Major Cities

    Collapse Reality: “If I Had to Be an Animal, I Was an Animal. It Was About Survival.”

    On Stopping Power: “I Have Seen and Been in Lots of Gunfights in Real Life”

    On Riots: Do Not Go Out: “You Do Not Prepare to Be a Hero… You Prepare to Survive”

    “Nature is Brutal… Everyone’s Life is In Danger”

    “There Was Little Room For Error… Either You Learn Fast Or End Up Dead”

    “You Have Two Choices – Fight To The Last or Run”

    Decision Making in Survival Situations: “He Died Because He Made the Wrong Decision Under Pressure”

    “Forget Good Guys and Bad Guys… The Prepared Guys Win”

    “The Media Told Us That Everything’s Going to Be Fine” – War Survivor On Why He Missed The Best Time To Bug Out

    “Many Preppers Will Die”


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      1. It ain’t gonna be like the movies. Good information from selco as always. This guy knows what he’s talking about.

        • Hope for the best, prepare for the worst.

          I hope there’s a a pretrib rapture, but preparing for a post trib rapture.

          Give me strength to guide and protect my family, Lord.

          • Sorry to break it to ya, Freeslave, but a pretrib ain’t biblical.

            There are only a couple scriptures that can be manipulated to infer that a pre-trib/prior to seven years of tribulation, coming of Christ, is a possibility. There are numerous scriptures, and some from Christ Himself, that says there is only one return and that it is after the tribulation of Antichrist, and the pouring out of the wrath upon all heathens.

            The argument can go on and on for those that have been sent a strong delusion to believe a lie, so i will not get into it again, any further.

            However; i will make this very important point for those that have decided to straddle the fence and believe in a mid-trib crapture/return. The middle of the seven years, is when some believe the “catching away” takes place. That is still a pre-trib belief, because the full on tribulation hour has not been fulfilled at that point. In fact, the previous 3 and 1/2 year period that had been assigned to Antichrist, has been shortened.

            That time has been shortened to a five month window at the end of the second 3 and 1/2 years/ 42 month period. What is the shortened time in reference to? The time of Antichrist upon the earth, which is to say Satan and his locust army….which is a five month period. Yep, the locust army is real, and it is both demonic and seen by heathen/non-believers, as just an illusion. The demonic angels and demonic spirits of the gebbor/giants, will seem all to real, and goobments around the world will have false explanations for their presence. The whole world will suck it up…hook,line, and sinker.

            it will happen as foretold, so following a delusional Preacher could be fatal for the soul, if one follows the congregation to accept a mark of the Beast System, which is not the mark of Christ/Messiah returned, as part of the pre-trib lie.

            We know truth, and follow it faithfully. Also we follow our Father’s word that not one hair on our heads can be harmed as long as we believe and have the faith of the size of a mustard seed.

            So…bring it on all demonics and their followers, for we have divine protection, that no man nor beast can override.

            • 3-S Rule: Shoot Shovel and Shut up. That’s all you need to know or remember in SHTF WROL, NEXT!!!

              This is where a lot of Gullible Religious people will be duped and killed for their stuff. Taking in strangers or feeding the homeless. Hopefully for you, it is swift and complete death. Living as a cripple suffering with no stuff, is no life. Many of the really weak will commit suicide, because they are too fearful of being killed by someone else, and take their own lives in advance on their watch. So their stuff is open game, while on Recon..


            • After 2000 years of being stood up by Jeebus you are finally figuring out it is a Big Fat Hoax, and he’s a No Show, No GO!!

              “What Religion Does to your Brain”

              The perceived conflict between religion and science has played out across history, from lectures in Ancient Greek pantheons to discussions on Internet forums. According to a new study, the origin of this clash actually begins as a conflict between two networks in the brain.

              The researchers came to this conclusion through eight separate questionnaire-studies and thought experiments. Each contained between 159 to 527 adults and compared the results of those who held beliefs in a god or universal spirit and those with no religious beliefs. The researches from Case Western Reserve University and Babson College recently published their findings in PLOS One.

              Their research found that those with religious or spiritual beliefs appeared to suppress the brain network used for analytical thinking in order to engage the network for empathetic thinking. Equally, those who were non-religious showed they suppressed their empathetic thinking for analytical thinking.

              “When there’s a question of faith, from the analytic point of view, it may seem absurd,” said Tony Jack, who led the research, in a press release. “But, from what we understand about the brain, the leap of faith to belief in the supernatural amounts to pushing aside the critical/analytical way of thinking to help us achieve greater social and emotional insight.”

              These two networks have a hard time balancing out as they are continually working to suppress the other, according to the study.

              However, the researchers say that neither of these ways of thought has the monopoly on answers to the world’s great questions; our very nature has allowed us to engage and explore our experiences using both patterns of thinking.

              Jack added, “Religion has no place telling us about the physical structure of the world; that’s the business of science. Science should inform our ethical reasoning, but it cannot determine what is ethical or tell us how we should construct meaning and purpose in our lives.”

              Furthermore, they argue science and religion don’t always have to be seen as opposing forces. As the study points out, many of the world’s greatest scientist have held spiritual beliefs, including 90 percent of the 21st century’s Nobel laureates.

              The authors concluded by saying that understanding the interaction between these two ways of thinking could enrich both.

              “Far from always conflicting with science, under the right circumstances religious belief may positively promote scientific creativity and insight,” Jack concluded.

              Main image credit: Sanjib Mitra/Flickr. (CC BY-NC 2.0)

              Source: At ht tp://ww w.iflscience .com/

              ~WWTI… Religious Freaks will freeze, Pondering, upon having to kill someone, opposed to being killed. Living upon an illusion will get you killed faster.

              • Ha! “Who,” You are so wrong that you STINK ! I pity you when you sit here on earth after the Rapture….duh.

              • Jesus died and came back to life on the 3rd day which is an indication of when He would return which is 2000 years later. 2000 years later brings us to 2030A.D.? and if people are not raptured before then, then they will be dead because at the end of the last rapture the Devil and the Devil’s angels will be thrown out of Heaven and they will have their way with what is left of Humanity.

                • What he’s referencing about Jesus Christ is that he told his followers that, (not a quote), “Verily I say unto thee that some of you shall not taste of death before my return”. Well now, it HAS been well over 2,000 years since it is written that Christ spoke those words to his disciples, and they have “all tasted of death.” So, you can’t jump his ass for something that “is written.”

            • Hey, Passin,’ Prove what you say about the Pre-Trib Rapture not coming/ happening, I dare you. I have been a serious student of the KJV Bible for over 40 some years and I say you are dead wrong. I also post detail stuff/ proof about the Rapture often in my humble Blog: TOM’S JOURNAL, for all to see and read. “God cannot lie.” Titus 1:2. Also, check out Galatians 4: 16, “Am I therefore become your enemy, because I tell you the truth?” –I am also a Disabled Vietnam Veteran: 68-70, helicopter door gunner, and also an edged weapons instructor. I teach people to throw tomahawks and knives, accurately. —Tommy Schuckman

            • There will be no Rapture where people are suddenly taken to Heaven….there will, however, be the Tribulation….The battle between good and evil has already begun….and evil is winning at the moment….look around and see what is happening all over the World, much less in our Republic. The battle will be long and hard but good will triumph in the end….the most important thing you can give to your children is knowledge….what is in your head cannot be taken from you. The more people teach the young, the better the chances of survival of GOOD people. I have posted the following before, but I think it worth reading from time to time…It is long, but worth the read…

              Washington’s Vision
              In the National Tribune, 1880, an article appeared giving an account of the “Vision of Washington” at Valley Forge. The account was told by a gentleman named Anthony Sherman, who supposedly was at Valley Forge during the winter of 1777-78. The story has been published several times.
              Some people will say that it is substantiated by the fact that a copy of the account is in the Library of Congress. This argument of authenticity is misleading in and of itself. The Library of Congress has copies of anything published. That does not indicate accuracy of the content.
              I am unaware of any eighteenth-century evidence that corroborates this story. The soldier mentioned as having a first-hand account of the “Vision,” Anthony Sherman, was a soldier in the Continental Army. However, according to his pension application, written by him, he states that he was at Saratoga under the command of Benedict Arnold at the end of 1777 and only joined the main forces in 1778 in New Jersey just before the Battle of Monmouth.
              Anthony Sherman wrote:
              You doubtless heard the story of Washington’s going to the thicket to pray in secret for aid and comfort from God, the interposition of whose Divine Providence brought us safely through the darkest days of tribulation. One day, I remember it well, when the chilly winds whistled through the leafless trees, though the sky was cloudless and the sun shown brightly, he remained in his quarters nearly all the afternoon alone. When he came out, I noticed that his face was a shade paler than usual. There seemed to be something on his mind of more than ordinary importance. Returning just after dusk, he dispatched an orderly to the quarters who was presently in attendance. After a preliminary conversation of about an hour, Washington, gazing upon his companion with that strange look of dignity which he alone commanded, related the event that occurred that day.
              “George Washington’s Vision”
              This afternoon, as I was sitting at this table engaged in preparing a dispatch, something seemed to disturb me. Looking up, I beheld standing opposite me a singularly beautiful female. So astonished was I, for I had given strict orders not to be disturbed, that it was some moments before I found language to inquire the cause of her presence. A second, a third and even a fourth time did I repeat my question, but received no answer from my mysterious visitor except a slight raising of her eyes.
              By this time I felt strange sensations spreading through me. I would have risen but the riveted gaze of the being before me rendered volition impossible. I assayed once more to address her, but my tongue had become useless, as though it had become paralyzed.
              A new influence, mysterious, potent, irresistible, took possession of me. All I could do was to gaze steadily, vacantly at my unknown visitor. Gradually the surrounding atmosphere seemed as if it had become filled with sensations, and luminous. Everything about me seemed to rarefy, the mysterious visitor herself becoming more airy and yet more distinct to my sight than before. I now began to feel as one dying, or rather to experience the sensations which I have sometimes imagined accompany dissolution. I did not think, I did not reason, I did not move; all were alike impossible. I was only conscious of gazing fixedly, vacantly at my companion.
              Presently I heard a voice saying, “Son of the Republic, look and learn,” while at the same time my visitor extended her arm eastwardly, I now beheld a heavy white vapor at some distance rising fold upon fold. This gradually dissipated, and I looked upon a stranger scene. Before me lay spread out in one vast plain all the countries of the world — Europe, Asia, Africa and America. I saw rolling and tossing between Europe and America the billows of the Atlantic, and between Asia and America lay the Pacific.
              “Son of the Republic,” said the same mysterious voice as before, “look and learn.” At that moment I beheld a dark, shadowy being, like an angel, standing or rather floating in mid-air, between Europe and America. Dipping water out of the ocean in the hollow of each hand, he sprinkled some upon America with his right hand, while with his left hand he cast some on Europe. Immediately a cloud raised from these countries, and joined in mid-ocean. For a while it remained stationary, and then moved slowly westward, until it enveloped America in its murky folds. Sharp flashes of lightning gleamed through it at intervals, and I heard the smothered groans and cries of the American people.
              A second time the angel dipped water from the ocean, and sprinkled it out as before. The dark cloud was then drawn back to the ocean, in whose heaving billows in sank from view. A third time I heard the mysterious voice saying, “Son of the Republic, look and learn,” I cast my eyes upon America and beheld villages and towns and cities springing up one after another until the whole land from the Atlantic to the Pacific was dotted with them.
              Again, I heard the mysterious voice say, “Son of the Republic, the end of the century cometh, look and learn.” At this the dark shadowy angel turned his face southward, and from Africa I saw an ill omened specter approach our land. It flitted slowly over every town and city of the latter. The inhabitants presently set themselves in battle array against each other. As I continued looking I saw a bright angel, on whose brow rested a crown of light, on which was traced the word “Union,” bearing the American flag which he placed between the divided nation, and said, “Remember ye are brethren.” Instantly, the inhabitants, casting from them their weapons became friends once more, and united around the National Standard.
              “And again I heard the mysterious voice saying “Son of the Republic, look and learn.” At this the dark, shadowy angel placed a trumpet to his mouth, and blew three distinct blasts; and taking water from the ocean, he sprinkled it upon Europe, Asia and Africa. Then my eyes beheld a fearful scene: From each of these countries arose thick, black clouds that were soon joined into one. Throughout this mass there gleamed a dark red light by which I saw hordes of armed men, who, moving with the cloud, marched by land and sailed by sea to America. Our country was enveloped in this volume of cloud, and I saw these vast armies devastate the whole county and burn the villages, towns and cities that I beheld springing up. As my ears listened to the thundering of the cannon, clashing of sword, and the shouts and cries of millions in mortal combat, I heard again the mysterious voice saying, “Son of the Republic, look and learn” When the voice had ceased, the dark shadowy angel placed his trumpet once more to his mouth, and blew a long and fearful blast. “Instantly a light as of a thousand suns shone down from above me, and pierced and broke into fragments the dark cloud which enveloped America. At the same moment the angel upon whose head still shone the word Union, and who bore our national flag in one hand and a sword in the other, descended from the heavens attended by legions of white spirits. These immediately joined the inhabitants of America, who I perceived were will nigh overcome, but who immediately taking courage again, closed up their broken ranks and renewed the battle.
              Again, amid the fearful noise of the conflict, I heard the mysterious voice saying, “Son of the Republic, look and learn.” As the voice ceased, the shadowy angel for the last time dipped water from the ocean and sprinkled it upon America. Instantly the dark cloud rolled back, together with the armies it had brought, leaving the inhabitants of the land victorious!
              Then once more I beheld the villages, towns and cities springing up where I had seen them before, while the bright angel, planting the azure standard he had brought in the midst of them, cried with a loud voice: “While the stars remain, and the heavens send down dew upon the earth, so long shall the Union last.” And taking from his brow the crown on which blazoned the word “Union,” he placed it upon the Standard while the people, kneeling down, said, “Amen.”
              The scene instantly began to fade and dissolve, and I at last saw nothing but the rising, curling vapor I at first beheld. This also disappearing, I found myself once more gazing upon the mysterious visitor, who, in the same voice I had heard before, said, “Son of the Republic, what you have seen is thus interpreted: Three great perils will come upon the Republic. The most fearful is the third, but in this greatest conflict the whole world united shall not prevail against her. Let every child of the Republic learn to live for his God, his land and the Union.” With these words the vision vanished, and I started from my seat and felt that I had seen a vision wherein had been shown to me the birth, progress, and destiny of the United States.

            • Back in the 90’s my brother and i went to a ministry that preached pre trib rapture..seemed there were several scriptures pointed to this..lately as he has studied this over the years and listening, watching you tube videos of credible pastors, etc. showing by scripture that the rapture will come after the tribulation..of course i was hoping it would be before the tribulation, who wants to go through that…

          • There are 3 Raptures:

            Rapture of the Christian Bride at the beginning of the 7 year Tribulation.

            Rapture of the Son of Israel(144000 Israel witnesses) at the middle of the Tribulation who were sealed when the Christian Bride were raptured.

            Rapture of the Israel Bride and the remainder who have turned to God and then Satan and Satan’s angels will be thrown out of Heaven and will destroy what’s left.

            The Harvesting of the Barley(Christians which comes first) and then later the Wheat(Israel which is last). Before the Barley or Wheat could be taken the firstfruits of each Harvest was offered to God by the priest – 4 Raptures (The first rapture was Christ and those who were taken from Hades, the Barley firstfruit, Christians), The firstfruit of the Wheat Harvest of Israel is the 144000 Witnesses.

            Jacob had 4 wives, 2 were the main wives and 2 were servants of those wives again speak of the 4 Raptures, The servants of the Brides are Christ and those that was saved with Him and the Israel Bride’s servant is the 144000 witnesses who were taken first. Note also the wife who Jacob loved Rachel was taken last as Israel who God loves will also be taken last.

            Luke speaks about the 3 raptures
            Rapture 1 Jesus is coming back from the wedding of the Christian Bride so that rapture has occurred.

            He is coming for the master of His servants the 144000 who were put in charge of His people to tell them about Him.

            The last Rapture will be of the remainder of His servants.

            Notice also that they are told to Watch for His return and the longer they stay the sever the punishment they will receive.

            Luke 12:35-48English Standard Version (ESV)
            You Must Be Ready

            35 “Stay dressed for action[a] and keep your lamps burning, 36 and be like men who are waiting for their master to come home from the wedding feast, so that they may open the door to him at once when he comes and knocks. 37 Blessed are those servants[b] whom the master finds awake when he comes. Truly, I say to you, he will dress himself for service and have them recline at table, and he will come and serve them. 38 If he comes in the second watch, or in the third, and finds them awake, blessed are those servants! 39 But know this, that if the master of the house had known at what hour the thief was coming, he[c] would not have left his house to be broken into. 40 You also must be ready, for the Son of Man is coming at an hour you do not expect.”

            41 Peter said, “Lord, are you telling this parable for us or for all?” 42 And the Lord said, “Who then is the faithful and wise manager, whom his master will set over his household, to give them their portion of food at the proper time? 43 Blessed is that servant[d] whom his master will find so doing when he comes. 44 Truly, I say to you, he will set him over all his possessions. 45 But if that servant says to himself, ‘My master is delayed in coming,’ and begins to beat the male and female servants, and to eat and drink and get drunk, 46 the master of that servant will come on a day when he does not expect him and at an hour he does not know, and will cut him in pieces and put him with the unfaithful. 47 And that servant who knew his master’s will but did not get ready or act according to his will, will receive a severe beating. 48 But the one who did not know, and did what deserved a beating, will receive a light beating. Everyone to whom much was given, of him much will be required, and from him to whom they entrusted much, they will demand the more.

        • I commented on an article recently, it was the one about living off wild game during shtf, that relates to this. Absolutely nothing will ever prepare you to take a life. People talk a lot about what they’re gonna do to bad guys, talk is cheap, but when the situation is before you…. I also commented that I’m not afraid of what’s coming but I damn sure ain’t looking forward to it. Some who have experienced a real shtf event will be able to teach you a thing or two. When I was serving, I learned as much as I could from the Vietnam vets and I’m glad I did. It damn sure saved my life. I had no illusions as to what we were gonna be doing, and I’m not saying I’m better than anyone else or trying to insult anyone either, but if you think for one minute that you have all the answers cause you have alotta guns, think again. Stay quiet, be smart.

          • If it ever came to that I know I’d probably be dead. I mean I’ve already been in two situations already (oh yeah wait three… four?) and I pretty much refused to do anything other than use a gun to cover myself as I fled. Like I mean REFUSED. Like the idea of actually doing anything else was just… not gonna happen.

            If I was in SelcoLand there with nowhere to run to and no one to call I’d be dead. It would just take me entirely too long to come to terms with it. On the order of minutes, plural. Aka eternity.

            • Combat vets will have a distinct advantage if society melts down. Find some. Connect with them. Add them to your team, or join theirs.

              Check your local VFW.

              They have been there, done that, and survived. They will get you and yours through it. Pay attention. Do as they do. DO as they say. You will survive too. 🙂

          • good post–very honest–very real

          • The only way you will be able to live off wild game is have unrestricted access to a lot of land. Even better if it is your own land. And you will probably go more to Trapping than hunting with less land access. Ever since Spring Turkey Bow season opened here 2 weeks ago, I have not seen a single Turkey. Its Odd. Like they get a copy of the hunting season dates on their Gobbler ipads. If I had to depend on wild game I will break out a few traps from my selection. I know I could catch raccoon at night in live traps, if needed. Put a few chicken bones on the pad.. I need to read up on removing the scent glands first. You can also prep with Spring Traps, Conibear 220 and 330’s, spring traps, claw traps, snare wire, Live box traps. And practice setting up these traps. Lots of good Vids on that.. Get the real deal and buy it. Look up traps on Sportsman’s Guide site. For a few bucks you can feed yourself, or have that back up plan, and throw a few traps in your BOB. My shed is full of Survival tools here at the BOL. I’m pretty ready if need to be, to expand my eating buffet. Alligator season right around the corner here in FL.


          • Jackknife, you’ll be just ‘fine & dandy’, and I wouldn’t give it a 2nd thought if I were you. (Instinct is a powerful overcomer of most anything that is “taught to you by man to be correct” …f**k that, follow your nose and instincts. Kill or be killed. Slay or be slain. Pretty simple actually isn’t it?
            Say, what you say about hunting game animals, don’t worry, they are used to it. The biggest problem we have here is that feral hogs are wiping out the deer population ‘like there’s no tomorrow’. Time to get some pig meat, but dang, these suckers weigh up to 1,000lbs “dressed”. (Thank goodness for a horse …or a four-wheeler if that’s what ya got, I guess).

        • Anon, spot on. If no one here has ever taken Selco’s course, then go to and sign up. I highly recommend it. Selco is the real deal and a gold mine of information on how to survive a collapse. Hell, I’ll take Selco’s site over Rawles’ site any day.

          • Hey Brave. You all better be aware the Free Shit Army is about 50% of the population in total, and they too are preparing right now today, for that one day in SHTF, where they can run wild, looting pillaging, and taking anything they can carry including your wife or children away.

            As a Man, or Woman head of your households you are responsible for the Welfare and Safety of your family. Be the leader. Get a good 12g shotgun and buy 00 Buck Shot and also some one ounce slugs and alternate every other round in the tube chamber. Also pick up a 9mm Semi Automatic hand gun. Hollow points “124gr +P” Learn to shoot!! For 9 mm target practice use “115gr FMJ” and go Train!! Get your Gun carry permit, and start carrying daily.


            • WWTI, thanks for the advice, LOL, but I’m already in an area where there’s a certain percentage of FSA. I also know they’re ready and waiting for their opportunity to strike. I’ll be back at the BOL before that happens. I was just at the BOL for all of last week for a ‘training exercise’, some R&R, and testing out the Mossberg 590A1 I got for my birthday. best shotgun I ever had in my life. I do have some 00 buck but need to get some 1 oz. also have a 9mm I got on Christmas Eve and stocking up on that caliber. Just recently found out the FBI is switching back to 9mm from the 10mm. Sounds like they became unhappy with the 10mm. so the other alphabet soup agencies will eventually follow suit and later on there’s gonna be a shortage of 9mm out there. so everyone here with any type of 9mm weapon had better be stocking up on ammo like crazy.

              • People rarely do introspection into how their true emotional makeup came about or is built into them. Those that go into battle are forced to look at their true emotional makeup. Many realize in battle their baser nature of animal instincts that they were born has been suppressed and compromised by the process to make us “civilized”. Education for centuries has been the cornerstone of making people “civilized”. Most see the primary focus of schooling to be learning which it is not. Education focuses on the human development processes of social conformity ad making the individual self “civilized”..

                The primary function of military training is continuous repetition focused on our animal instincts or animal self that wipe out the civilized responses of education and replace them with baser inbuilt animal instincts we are born with. The military drives home over and over “you will do it this way”. This repetition to rely on baser inbuilt animal instincts is what armies depend on to win a battle. Hence we gradually develop a “battle hardened” self.

                On the foreign battlefield comes the clash of the “civilized” self with the “battle hardened” self. It is not on heard of with green troops that many cannot overcome at first the “civilized” self. This is why armies have leaders that continue to shout “…do as you were trained to do …execute…” hoping that military training will prevail over civilized education. However, through all of a foreign war battle our animal instincts “self preservation” signals can go wild as we cross wits with these different self’s. If neither self wins than “self preservation” signals can dominate. So on the battlefield the warrior will do as his training states with his “battle” self, the civilized warrior may stay but not take on the enemy unless forced to and the warrior with “self preservation” signals may run from battle field.

                What they found in foreign wars is no one with any degree of certainty can predict how an individual will perform on the battle field when adrenaline and stress kick in. I read after Vietnam that it took from 50,000 to 250,000 rounds to kill each insurgent. I have often suspected that up to half our guys in battles just fired over the heads of the enemy to remain “civilized” and could not kill another human. There is nothing wrong with that. It’s just the way it is. But the wild card was always the animal instincts “self preservation” signals that could trip us to the opposite self or in a rare case make someone want to run away.

                So when you see someone come back from foreign wars and battles and these guys do not fit in the “civilized” world understand these people are still fighting the emotional battle in their heads that runs non-stop that says “…you ain’t civilized no more you will always now be battle hardened …But I am home not in a battle. I must be civilized …Oh no you are not get ready for battle…” . And so it goes for many today.

                On the domestic battle field in or near our homes many will all become far different warriors emotionally. It will no longer be about just “me and my buddies” surviving a foreign battle. It will be about our blood lines, wives, children, parents and civilization surviving. This means the “self preservation” signals of our animal instincts can dominate the “civilized” self and the “battle” hardened self. The difference is there is nowhere to run to. It is coming to us. Guys in this type of “self preservation” mode can flip from “John Lennon” to “John Wayne in half a breath. And that I believe can happen to anyone if they are pressed to survive even a woman.

                So if you are forced into using your animal self to be a warrior don’t be surprised when you try to regain your civilized self that your mind and body goes through a violent episode (trying regain its former self). Your animal self may not want to be suppressed from that time forward.

                So those of us that have seen what battle can do to twist a person’s soul pray to the Lord we never have to be tested on our home soil with anyone including the FSA…

                • Good post rabbitone. That is why the military went to human silhouette targets instead of round ones. Get the soldier used to shooting at a human shaped target.

                  I would like to add that if you do face that warrior self, you may be real good at it. Too good in fact and switching it off as posted will be difficult.

                  It’s crazy. Crap flying everywhere and your returning fire in a bubble or what is called Tunnel Vision, next thing you know you reach for anther magazine to reload and there is nothing. As you come back to earth you realize you have just emptied seven 30 round magazines and you don’t remember changing mags at all. But there they lay at your feet mocking you for loosing your situational awareness. You look over your buddy and he has his original mag still in his weapon, not exactly cowering, but not really in the game either. You yell at him to give you his mags because you want to kill some mofo’s who are shooting at you and he’s not in the game. Then after it’s all over you go and find the dead bodies of your enemy and know in your heart that at least one of them is dead because YOU killed him, but since you engaged more than one person all the while, probably more. Since no ballistic tests will ever be performed on who did shoot him, you chalk it up to someone else, that you really didn’t shoot him. You will play some serious mental games with your self, if you have a shred of decency in you. The only people who really enjoy this stuff are psychopaths/sociopaths.

                  Battlefield killing is easier to justify, because it’s more black and white, anyone shooting at you is the enemy. It’s where non traditional combatives screw with you, like a woman who walks up to a group of soldiers and throws a grenade or sets off a suicide vest.

                  In a domestic situation you may have to kill your neighbor for trying to force you to give his family some food, if they find out you have some. These are the days I dread deeply. If you are religious then that religion may cause you to make a more moral choice and get you and your family killed. Me? As long as I have my wife, children and grand children to protect, death will come swiftly to anyone who even looks like they are threatening us and may God have mercy upon MY soul.

            • Personally, I think that the FSA “members” number about 70% of the population and the Apathetic Sheeple another 25%, so the few left is……us.

              I tell the go,is that “think” they and their herd are coming to MY house when things break down, “…then you and yours will die at the bottom of the hill with everyone else.”

              They STILL don’t/won’t/can’t grasp the concept of any kind of self reliance, and I don’t feel like teaching them anymore at this point.

            • Don’t go putting any 9mm +P or +P+ bullets in YOUR 9mm unless you are SURE your weapon is made to handle the extra ‘umphf’ …either that or you just may split your barrel, and weapon, apart at the seams (if she has any left).
              I’m sure everyone knows that, but I just wished to ensure nobody thought it would be ‘cool’ or ‘aok’ to load up on +P ammo for their 9mm only to lose their fingers first shot fired.
              Even better, skip the 9mm’s altogether and get as many .45ACP rounds as you can to go with your choice of .45ACP Automatic. A .45 will pick a man up, turn him around, then set him back down. One’s all you’ll need …but use five anyway.
              One bad part about hollow-points is that they DO expand/mushroom when they hit ‘meat’. But to me, I’d rather have a round nose bullet “well-placed” that’s going to keep on cruising through several bodies (all lined up nicely if they are ‘green’) before stopping. Worked for me and will again if needed. Just saying…

          • Rawles aint no dummy. You can take all the courses you want…until you’re in the forest alone, you haven’t proven jack shit. If I have taken a course on brain surgery, would you want me to operate on yours? didn’t think so. I haven’t spoken to Rawles personally, but people that know him here respect him as the real deal.

            • How can that be if he has never been in a war like RVN or any other ? Many RVN Vets have a much better background than Rawles or Selco ! just because they have been there and done that in spades ! Rawles claims to be prior Army intel guy , but no actual war experience ? so what makes him have any real life experience except his own self proclaimed BS ? This article doesn’t really touch on the real issues at all about being confronted with extreme violence and death daily.
              I have a short write up on Selco at my site on the Firearms and ammo page. Been up for 3 years because I give him more credence than Rawles, who is just another salesman/internet marketer who came along before many others IMO !~

              In all honesty nearly all prepper type sites are nearly pure BS and completely worthless !

              The only reason I read Macs site is because I can tell he understands the underlying economics involved by his sources. And he realizes what we live in today is not going to end well at all. There will be some sort of RESET and it will be very violent as it all melts down. I teach people how to thrive in such an environment , not just survive ! Most do not even realize that your health and fitness are the very most important asset you have , then your mindset and then some beans and bullets and how to use them very well.

          • Agreed. Selco’s courses are worth every penny. Lot’s of useful info.

            • Just me, did you just get your ass fired from the local fusion center?
              I could have sworn I banned your ass 8 months ago.. at least now you are leaning a thing or two.. I know a man who was from Selcos region and it was just was bad as Selco told it.



            • Didn’t take that course…However…I did spend one nite in a Holliday Inn!

              Master Card….Priceless.

      2. Interesting article.

      3. I have been around life and death for 38 years I am tired.
        If the balloon goes up I am going so far up in the mountains a satellite just might find me.

        So for those who can not wait to pull the trigger go luck.
        I will not be around to see it.

        • wish you were my neighbor instead. We could use someone with experience whe the SHTF…

        • probably the best thing anyone could do.

        • Don’t worry, those who can’t wait to pull the trigger will get their chance soon enough. Just may not turn out how they expect. Anytime I ever went looking for trouble, I found it. Human predators soon find themselves to be the hunted. Those weaklings or the FSA just might set a trap for you.

          Make no mistake, the moochers are cunning, and will work very hard to get what they “deserve”, and won’t give killing you for it a thought.

      4. I hope I never have to kill another person. I WILL PROTECT my loved ones, but please please please please please I hope I never ever find myself in that situation.

        • David Gillespie,,,Jacknife….and gwerty123 my following reply is only my 2 cents worth from my experience in combat. I believe there is something heading our way and when it hits it ain’t going to knock politely on our front door to get in at our families. What prepared me the most many years ago when I was in a killing environment for about a year was that I was forced to train…train….train and then practice…practice…..practice before hand. When it hits and it is staring you in the face hopefully your training kicks in and you do what you have to do. Do not believe anyone who tells you what it will be like simply because what happens deep deep inside of you will be your teacher. Train ..train ..train then practice…practice …practice that is the take away here. Take comfort in the fact that a higher source of loving intellengence designed every one of us with a will to survive.

          • Yes, we may have knocked on the same doors in the Sandbox. Train, train, train and then train some more. It has to be automatic. When you are under stress you perform how you trained. Plus think about what you are doing before hand and be open to change.

            Went on a door knocking round and I had a single point sling. I loved that single point sling, going through a building clearing it one time, mag ran dry, I dropped the M4, it swung away and I drew my sidearm to finish a bad guy off. The single point sling allowed my M4 to swing away and I had clear access to my M9. Went on another door knock and when it came time to stack on the door, I knelt down and the barrel bumped the ground. Thunk. Pucker factor and everyone looking at me with evil in their eyes. Could have alerted guy inside we were after, but I got lucky, he was clueless and we got him. That was the last time I used a single point sling. Moral of the story? Do what works for what you are doing. Think through every step of things.

            • Thank you for the single point sling info. I WAS going to use single point on my Mossy 500A.

      5. Killing an animal is certainly different then killing a human. However, you can see how people differ in ability to kill even when dealing with animals. Use runt pigs as an example, by 30 lbs. a person knows which piglets aren’t going to mature correctly, it is best to dispose of the runt pigs.

        You have people who picks up the runt, swing it against a post, it dies, they continue with thier day giving no more thought to the dead pig.

        There are other people who know what they must do, they manage to kill the pig, but it bothers them, even to the point they put off the task for hours after the decision is made.

        Then there are the people who will not kill the pig, flat out will not. They have to talk another worker into doing the task for them. In the end they know death is coming for the pig, but they can’t or won’t do it themselves.

        Then there are those who allow the pig to live. If the runt gets beat up by it’s brothers and sisters they get upset, but still will not kill the runt. They set up a different pen, and continue to watch the animal suffer, but will not kill the runt. Of course the animal never reaches market weight, no one would buy or ever get around to butchering it. Yes, I watched a family member do this. (Months later it fell on me to destroy the animal.)

        In the end some people kill animals as needed, other people just will not, no matter what. Some people, in my opinion, will never be able to kill another human in any circumstance. I doubt that all people will be able to step up and kill an enemy, even when family is threaten. I hope that anyone would do whatever it takes to protect themseleves and family, but I remain with doubts.

        • Then there are those who allow the pig to live. If the runt gets beat up by it’s brothers and sisters they get upset, but still will not kill the runt. They set up a different pen, and continue to watch the animal suffer, but will not kill the runt. Of course the animal never reaches market weight, no one would buy or ever get around to butchering it. Yes, I watched a family member do this. (Months later it fell on me to destroy the animal.)

          Yeah… that’s pretty much me all right.

          If it’s in a different pen wtf could happen to it? Isn’t it just gonna sit there eating Fritos and drinking beer and watching the game?

          I mean I get it if it’s in with the other asshole pigs but if it’s isolated? How is it suffering?

          YOU’RE suffering because you’re throwing money at it for no good reason but I don’t see how IT’S suffering…

          • Guys, Its the Rule of Diminishing Return. Calculate it out.


          • How is it suffering?

            I don’t claim to be a vet, but some animals are just not meant to live. In the case I mentioned the pig was not right in several ways. It was never able to put on any weight, or at least not near enough to “look healthy”. It always seem to strain when getting up. When walking it looked like the knees were not bending smoothly, but with little jerks. One “old timer” neighbor said it looked like a case of rickets (not sure of the spelling), but that seemed unlikely since it was fed a commericial feed so should have been correct vitamins and minerals. By the time it’s siblings went to market (220 lbs.) it was maybe at 60 lbs. All in all, it was a sad thing to watch, but my sister refused to give up on it. Can not say the animal was in pain, but it certainly did not seem to enjoy it’s life. Never pushed things around its pen like other hogs, never did that dance in a circle like pigs will do, was just sort of there. It did keep itself clean, which is usally a sign of healthy animal.

        • In the end some people kill animals as needed, other people just will not, no matter what. Some people, in my opinion, will never be able to kill another human in any circumstance. I doubt that all people will be able to step up and kill an enemy, even when family is threaten. I hope that anyone would do whatever it takes to protect themseleves and family, but I remain with doubts.

          I can think of circumstances where I would be able to.

          The problem is that I’d be entirely too late. Like basically humans are nasty tricksy lots with all sorts of psychological shit they can pull on you to either intimidate you or elicit false sympathy from you and I’d be highly susceptible to that, to the point that it would be entirely too late and I’d no longer have the option. It’s almost like you have to do it before you’re “sure”. Like you have to have a set of rules in your head and go “fits the rule… go” whether you’re sure or not.

          If I managed to pull it off at all I’d never be able to live with myself I know that for an absolute fact. I could force myself to continue if I had to but I wouldn’t be me anymore.

          Hey let’s… all just say fuck this shit and get on a boat and sail out somewhere in the middle of the Pacific and park there huh?

          • I have to really watch my wife. She’s smart, but can be a real sucker for a BS sob story. She would be an easy mark for the people using kids as a lever.

            Me, if I were to see a kid alone during a real societal meltdown, I’d be instantly suspicious.

          • There would be few ships flying American flags that were not blown out of the water mere moments after the shit began. Count on that much… I’d hate to be caught at sea when it hit the fan as “where the hell would you go?” The best thing is to register the ship in Malta, then fly a “Maltese” flag. (They don’t have a beef with anyone, so you’d be safe …or ‘safer’ anyway).
            As for shooting someone for the first time, good grief everyone hasn’t there been dozens of shootings in the paper involving teens “saving the day” by blowing away some fool trying to get into the house, or is already in the house? Well, if a teen, or even in one case an eight year old boy, I should think a man or respectable woman could do the same …and deal with it later. (It is instinctive to protect your own life anyhow …so this is all a moot point at best).

        • About 3 decades ago, I was invited to an Arabic Family’s home, to dispose of a couple of live goats, for a big dinner they were hosting. This dude with a big knife had the goats tied to the support beam pole in the basement. We went down there, and without hesitation I held them and he slit their throats, and blood was squirting all over the place. We hung the goats up from a Water pipe above the Laundry tubs and dressed them out. Within minutes he had these shaved down to the bone. That was interesting. There are women down here in FL that hunt wild Pigs with Dogs & Knives. Are you good with a knife, or a knife fight? Can you carve a turkey? Whittle a feather stick for fire starting? How many knives for Prepping do you have? A nice SOG or Gerber, with a Full Tang, and a good folding pocket knife are good. And keep em’ sharp, and carry a pocket knife as part of your every day carry.


          • If you killed the goats in front of the other goats that wasn’t Halal.

      6. Im not really sure what type of reaction I will have , but I have given the Heimlich maneuver on 2 people at separate incidences and saved them from choking .. you just act , theres no forethought to it , you just do it, well I did, everyone else froze, no one else moved

        so , maybe I’ll be one of those that just acts first, I hope

        • Enemy of :

          I, too, have used the Heimlich Maneuver to save a life.

          I think I might be able to kill. I want to kill a chicken to get the feel of it. Not at all like killing a human. The human would probably be doing something that would create a strong fight or flight response. So in some ways it would be instinctual, I’m imagining. But in some cases I think it would be a down right pleasure to kill some bastard who truly deserved it. I mean, it feels kind of warm and fuzzy just thinking about it. Guess I’m one of the psychos you’ll have to be sure to avoid if you’re an ass, child rapist, mother plucker.

          • I assisted in sending some bastard who truly deserved it to prison for three years.

            It’s not a downright pleasure. Let me assure you it’s not. Still feel like shit about that one.

          • Yes your anger would let you do this with pleasure, but because of that you will probably feel worse later. Second guessing how you could have done something different so they would not of had to die. It WILL mess with your head.

      7. in a nation wide SHTF situation with the absence of water, food and other essentials it would truly turn malicious in short order…

        the veneer of civilization is pretty thin even now truthfully…

        I’m pretty much like everyone else here, you prep for the worst and pray for the best…

        working hard in the gym so I can tote my plates if need be and working it out with my neighbors…

        I look around the suburbs/city when I travel and imagine…

        • Always carry at least one extra magazine–


          Said nobody, EVER!!!

      8. Death is part of the deal, no matter the reasons behind a situation. If you are dealing the death blow, it is always better than the alternative. Fearing death is a mistake, respecting death is not. Processing the carnage without shutting down, or going crazy is an art.

        God bless this mess…

      9. I worked with veterans that no doubt killed people. You don’t survive WWII in the USMC 1st Marine Division as a rifleman starting in 1942 and going through the entire war getting a couple of Purple Hearts along the way without doing it. I ask and he shrugs his shoulders, “Ahhh, its nothing’. They put down the rifle in 1945 and went through life peaceably. I have no idea how they coped.

        • I saw Vietnam vets not cope so well, I married and divorced one of them and met some with mental issues. Now comes Gulf War, Afghanistan and Iraq war and vets are killing themselves like never before. Even gave this condition a name PTSD. I am sure if shtf, it will be common place among those survivors who never knew the world would turn so bad.

          I wonder why the WW2 vets handled it better? Was it the training? Was it a different culture than this day’s ridiculous PC culture? I wonder about our future soldiers brought up without toy guns, cops and robbers games, cowboy and Indian play and toy guns being “bad” and banned have anything to do with PTSD?

          • WWII vets did not have it better, they merely had different terms; combat fatigue, shell shocked, etc.
            As an old vietnam vet, I merely say, killing is not nice, but, I was raised in a more or less warrior culture, and we dealt with it differently, usually it had a lot to do with great quantities of alcohol or drugs…

            Advice? If it is time to ‘kill or be killed’, have situational awareness enough to see and understand FIRST… and then, DO NOT HESITATE. Hesitation is the killer. Recognize that you are defending loved ones, that is what makes it all ok…

            Then recognize that your target’s face will be with you for the rest of your days. Recognize it and deal with it, or don’t recognize it, and become a statistic. Understand that PTSD is natural, the soul’s way of dealing with a personal ‘mortal sin’. The tragedy is moderns take the spirituality out of the human, and are left with a shell of a man, and afterwards, an empty shell… In ancient times, the true warriors accepted the fact that they would be spending some time in hell…

            Today’s feminized culture, does a great disservice to defending hearth and home. Because, by the time denial is dispensed with, it may be too late, for YOU.

            • PM, that was one of your best posts ever.

              • Thanks BH,
                How ya been? Got ur ammo stacked to the ceiling yet?

                • PM, not at the ceiling yet but working on it. I mentioned in an earlier post to WWTI that the FBI is changing back to 9mm from 10mm and the other fed agencies will eventually follow suit. If you have any type of 9mm weapon better stockpile and get all you can now. Feds going back to 9mm tells me there will be a shortage of that caliber later on down the line. Everyone who has a 9mm needs to stock up on food for their weapon like yesterday.

              • Ahhhh, once the Killing starts, you will get used to it, as in the beginning it is kinda exciting, and then later on, it will almost become another boring, daily task. May I suggest Lots and Lots of Ammo and High Capacity magazines.

                ~WWTI… Let er’ Rip!!!

                • It was once called “Seeing the Elephant”. Do you know why?

                  Its bigger than you, and once you see it, it sees you, and then, it sits on your soul, forever more.
                  You get used to it, because you sear your soul.
                  Or you are a psychopath, and just don’t know it.

                  If you are a decent person, it wears you down. We used to call it the “thousand yard stare”. They should have never just put us on an airplane and shipped us home. They should have shipped us to a base to decompress and commiserate with our buddies.

            • Piper Michael

              One should have already a set of “Rules of Engagement”.

              • Hmm, well ROE are basically Rules for Politically Correct wars…
                Let your own conscience be your only rules, and you will not be tied down in any situation. ROE’s literally tie your hands and your responses to unknowns, ROE’s got people killed in Vietnam, and… and…
                They are, if you will, the Political ‘Conscience’. If you are alone or in a group, there is only one Rule…

                Is IT a threat to me and mine?

                (Dehumanizing your targets is good advice too. If they are simply The Animals or The Monsters, that works real well with children…)

                • Piper, Brave, Sling, I agree with your assessment. Years ago there was an article in a survival magazine titled, “Deal the First Deadly Blow” and I forget the specifics but the title has stayed with me.
                  If SHTF, that’s the mindset.

                • Piper Michael

                  “Threat Assessment”. I am going to think that over. A Rule can get you killed. A change of words. Hmmmmm.

                  Good one PM. Thanks.

                • PM, truer words were never spoken. No ROE for Braveheart. I also follow my conscience. I already have been for over 20 years carrying certain self-defense items in my truck everywhere I go that are probably illegal, but I don’t care about legality. I care about staying alive. I don’t follow any stupid law on self-defense that could get me killed. I love how you and I are on the same page in the same book.

            • I agree with you on that, you know it will haunt you. It is just how you deal with the ghosts. I look at it like a switch, some can turn it off, others can’t. I still see faces, reminders in places. Anything can trigger it, a smell, sound or something as simple as rain. Yet the switch in my brain is off, so I just continue on not bothered by the ghosts. I hope to never turn it on again, time will tell..

            • Piper Michael………In some warrior cultures in ancient times there would be a ceremony in which the WARRIOR would go through a process that was designed for the warrior to accept his own death BEFORE he went into battle. This takes the emotional aspect out of fighting your enemy and it is my opinion that emotions can get you killed in battle.(I had a similar experience at Dak To fire base, So. Vietnam before we were to get hit one night- I still do not remember what happened that night) When you are dead anyway as you go into battle I would also think there would be less fear.

              • There is less fear. The first couple of patrols I was scared shitless. After a bit I told myself I was already dead and that helped my fear factor a lot. I also took Meclizine to help with the anxiety. After a while, I didn’t need it. If crap went down I reverted to my training and I did my job, like I was supposed to. I never shamed myself in battle, maybe morally later, I thought about those who I may have killed.

          • Woogle

            The justification of your actions because the cause was just. Japs bombed Pearl Harbor, Germany declares war on the USA, uncovering death camps run by NAZIs and fighting soldiers as opposed to civilians. No war since had those qualities.

            • The above had them cope easier. Transitioning from killer to pipe fitter still amazes me regardless.

          • Woogie……….WW2 veterans went over to war together (and fought together) and came home in a ship for thirty days allowing them to debrief talking to each other (they were their own theripists to each other). Within 24 hours a lot of Vietnam vets went from foxhole to dinner table at home. Starting in Korea and then Vietnam we knew when we were coming home ahead of time. WW2 vets were loved when they came home Vietnam Veterans were spit on when we came home—and the silent majority of America let it happen. These things contributed to PTSD. The one good thing and always remember this Woogie, that came out of Vietnam Veteran awareness is that PTSD applies across the board,(not only in WAR) wether it be rape, earth quakes, natural desasters,men phsycally abusing women,or any experience that is life threatening and your ego has been traumatized because you truthfully realize you are not really in control of your life no matter how much you think you are.

          • While there were thousands or perhaps tens-of-thousands who did not cope very well at all (ie; suicide, homeless, “nutty” but everyone is used to him, and so on). However, for the greater part, men were men, pure and simple. Women did their thing and men did THEIR things, and be damned anyone who did what they did in order to have us kick their asses anyway!

      10. Some want the SHTF because they believe it will provide them opportunities to shoot people, and not necessarily for self preservation. If a stranger is just passing through, and inadvertently steps one inch on a person’s property, there are still people out there who would shoot the stranger even if he did not exhibit any aggression and wanted to just keep moving on. They would not differentiate between face to face self defense or shooting the stranger in the back at a hundred yards. The only important thing is he gets to shoot and kill someone, and then brag about it.
        I am a prepper, a serious one, and am ready to protect me and mine no matter what. But if the bad guy’s intention isn’t right I’m not waiting for him to look for an advantage over me, I”ll be ready, willing, and able to shoot first. However, I have no desire to hurt anyone.
        There are a some people out there who call themselves preppers and do some preparing, but they are not really preppers. They are really malicious and antisocial misfits who who seek opportunity to live out their base nature without consequence under the guise of prepping. Their real goal is too fulfill their desire to hurt, and kill, and inflict suffering.
        The real prepper, who is protecting his property and family is not what you have to fear if your head is on right and keep moving. There will be nut cases who can justify and delight in shooting a lost child. It’s not hard to recognize them. All I have left to say is don’t come around and start shit with my group.

        • Tommy:
          I agree with everything you said whole heartedly except for one thing. “It’s not hard to recognize them.” People are not so easy to identify. I have lived a reasonably long time. I have encountered various situations where people I knew or some I had just met, acted in ways that floored me. I just couldn’t believe it. Sometimes good, other times, absolutely horrible. Good luck with your prepping. When TSHTF I have a feeling you will be just fine.

          • Tommy and B from CA, I have to agree. I’ve seen people who were dressed in suits and act in some very shocking ways. I’ve also seen people dressed in rags who acted very civilized. You just never know what to expect from anyone, even from people you THINK you know really well.

        • The crowd who want to kill somebody and not be accountable for their actions will quickly identify themselves to all around them, and will quickly become the hunted.

      11. Nearly every man in my family served our country.the You do what you have to do.

      12. There are lots of folks that have a varmit that raids their livestock or destroys their crops. And they will not kill said varmit. they trap it and try and relocate it. The try measures to discourage it. They will not take the necessary measures. And them there are some who will kill the varmit just because the think it might become a problem. Yep having the willingness & mental fortitude to do whatever that will be necessary. That core concept will be paramount to survival.

        • Old Guy,
          Exactly right!

      13. When you have woman and children to protect killing is easy..when I don’t have a woman or children killing is still easy.. you kill or be killed..



        • I think of Soviets guarding the ramparts from NAZIs with their families less than a mile behind them. A friend married a woman from Belarus. In her grandparents village the NAZIs herded the civilians including women and children into a building and set it on fire shooting anyone attempting to flee. Its some kind of historic site there today. They weren’t Jews either. You’ll fight like hell to stop that and potentially commit a few atrocities yourself in retribution. Evil often fosters more evil necessitating the Germans to fight as hard fearing the same to their families.

          • The germans lost, may have been our last chance think about it.

        • I agree with you on that, you know it will haunt you. It is just how you deal with the ghosts. I look at it like a switch, some can turn it off, others can’t. I still see faces, reminders in places. Anything can trigger it, a smell, sound or something as simple as rain. Yet the switch in my brain is off, so I just continue on not bothered by the ghosts. I hope to never turn it on again, time will tell..

      14. Why would the bible warn us of this It wants us to be prepped. Or it wouldn’t warn us? Isn’t it obvious? Who ever pays attention to the bible will be ready and survive to see the new world. This is not the end of the world . It is the new beggining. The evil ones will be destroyed.its the great culling

        • Lone Wolverine a typical Religious nut with deep seeded illusions of Granger. Anybody with their noses too deep in the Bible will live to see the New World Order. Wake up Sheep!! Reality is what you need to pay attention to. Go breath the air, get a pulse on your community. Throwing the dice with a 2000 YO baseless faith to make life decisions will get you dead faster.


          • Illusions of grandjure I’m nothing in this. Many scientists say the more they learn the more they realize . How many things are unexplainable. How many things where ounce believed impossible . Everything? We think we know everything . We think we are right about everything. Dilutions of grandjure.

      15. Im that guy that don’t want anyone steppin one inch on my place. There is a fence and purple posting paint. Don’t trespass and your ok. I own several places. I don’t live at but one of them. They are not abandoned. If you don’t own something leave it alone. Follow those rules and I will not be necessary for me and mine to have to harm you.

      16. Fifty five years ago, I was 20 years old, and in Vietnam. The memories still come flooding back, some times at night. I can tell you this: If you take a human life, you will remember it for the rest of your life, no matter what the situation was. And the older you get, the more it will haunt you. In that Clint Eastwood movie where he was a Korean War Vet, and the kid asked him what it was like to kill somebody, he replied, “You don’t want to know.”
        That says it all.

        • Yes sir, you nailed it.

      17. I like most of you can’t wait to see the new beginning . What is total paradise ? How could heaven be so good? These promises made by God ? How could it be possible? I guess we watch and learn? As it says no matter how terrible please come lord. We can take it. We are ready. We will not fail you this time. We will fight. Everyone of us. Please lead us . We will follow.

      18. War veteran . Are you kidding me. Do you see them doing anything. Are they cowards ^? Or loving there pensions . Veterans are ?.? The domestic enemy??? Pull your head out of your they are what? .? We will win. They will lose. Keep the faith.

      19. Most fighting Wars are just targeted bomb dropping Terrorism with the Result being Genocide with many innocent casualties. You should feel some guilt, cause nothing you did was for Freedoms here in the US, it was for the Fascist US Corporations and banksters. And that goes for every War since Viet Nam. All based on Fraud. You were an accessory to murder and war crimes and invasion of another country. You were young and dumb, and that’s why they picked you. Not sure if you were a draftee or volunteer. If you knew you were going to be drafted in the army, you could have joined the navy beforehand. Lucky you made it back alive, but Viet Nam was another failed war to control countries. What did you think you were fighting for? The purpose for killing people? Boxer Mohammad Ali answered that Question. At least he had a moral conviction between right and wrong.

        I know the US Military today, Bans Youtube at Military Bases.. They want to keep their Soldiers dumb and ripe to commit murder. And its all OK, cause they hijacked the American Flag to wear on their sleeves and that makes it right. You Military Folks should slap a McDonalds Golden Arched Arm patch or an EXXON Flag emblem on your Uniforms. Because that’s who you are really fighting for. You have done nothing for the American People. ZERO – ZIP – IMHO.


        • Yes. It’s written that the devil rules. But not for much longer.

        • Yes many of those gullible young folks who are in the military actually think that they are fighting to protect American freedoms. And the fact is all they are is cannon fodder for the NWO ,UN and agenda 21. Cassius Clay was right. The thing is old politicians start wars. young people fight them. Are those old politicians worth dying for? What a stupid thing to think anyone elses star shines brighter than your very own! Was Shafty Kennedy or LBJ worth dying for? Is Obama worth dying for? Will whoever becomes our next president be worth dying for? If you have children do everything you can to discourage them from enlisting in the military.

          • Roger that, on your last sentence.

          • Old Guy……..Another take on what Cassius Clay said about old politicians starting wars was when in one of the last Rambo movies where Stallone had taken a group of do-gooders up stream (I believe it was Burma because Stallone used real Burmise rebels in this movie)and he said that, “The old men start the wars, young men fight the wars and everybody in between looses”. This scene may have been edited out and was shown at a later date. All wars are money makers AND I MEAN ALLLL WARS. I was told that the Vietnamise people were my enemies until one day I watched a Vietnamise farmer plant his rice and I was blessed with GOD’s clarity because I was shown that there was no difference between this farmer and a farmer in Kentucky planting his tobacco. They both were at the mercy of the weather, they wanted something better for their children, and they wanted their families safe and happy. Today the big boys are telling me that Moslems and Islam are my enemies. Fool me once a long time ago and I learned the hard way. I WILL DETERMINE IF ISLAM IS MY ENEMY TODAY by first turning off the “Adult babysitting box called TV” and act accordingly. CNN, MSNBC, FOX or O’Riely will not tell me what to think.

        • Congrats, you just made 55 million+ enemies for life.

          • Equorial,
            Sorry buddy, but speaking the truth about how our armed forces have been used and abused by tptb does not denigrate our soldiers, it denigrate our leadership. It also kicks parents in the pants for not having realistic conversations with their sons and daughters that serve. Most of the men in my family served and I am quite proud of them. They same the same as they’ve gotten older. Too many people today want little comfort bubbles instead of truth. Tell the truth to a leftie and he’ll call you a rightwingnut. Tell the same truth to a rightwingnut and he’ll call you a commie. Sometimes I despair of all y’all. Then again, as I was told on this site, Trump talks to grown people like they are 4th graders. And it gets him adulation. I talk to you like you are an intelligent adult. Doesn’t work quite as well. I will never talk to you like you are a 4th grade moron, though. Stay safe.

      20. While finding a degree of interest in the variety of opinions being shared and generally understanding where many good and sincerely well intended folks are coming from with all of this, still I cannot separate myself from the hideous aspects of humanity and failed social system in which this level of raw savagery would be all that remains.

        I’ve been around well past the sixth something mark, done some rather extended traveling during those years, and seen maybe too much along the way, while being painfully aware of those who have tragically confronted and endured much more.

        I make no judgements on any who earnestly endeavor to walk and conduct themselves with honor, personal integrity, and compassion towards others, and I’m sure that there are many who struggle with these nightmarish scenarios as have I.

        Strictly at the personal level it remains for me that violence is not the answer to anything at all, and the pages of history are replete with the horrid lessons affirming this single truth throughout humanities existence. Violence has always and continues to contain the seeds to its own end, and that lesson will continue to plague all who refuse to follow that misguided path along with the endless agony and suffering endured by countless others who are dismissed with terms such as “collateral damage” and similar references.

        If all of this should be what the future holds for humanity, I will be thankful when the end of my journey has arrived and parting will hold little sadness for me…

        • Maybe violence isn’t the answer? However when a varmit is killed because they do bad things. That makes certain they don’t do those bad things no more times. That strong arm cigar thief in Fergison Mo. He wont do that no more times!!! Take my tomato plants. If im to harvest any tomatos. I have to kill the tomato horn worms. They are the larvae of the beautiful spinx moth. even if the worm isn’t on my tomatos . I still kill it because it has the propencity to cause harm to my tomatoes. and I would kill the moth also. That’s why we will have civil unrest and Race war,s. We cannot all just get along. They cant get along with each other let alone someone of another race.

      21. Its strange what goes through your brain. The firefights are a blur, but always remember it is kill or be killed. If you hesitate, or think instead of act your toast, done, in a heap shitting on yourself as you take your last breath. I still catch myself avoiding choke points, and open spaces, crowds, checking rooftops, and such.

      22. (After I killed/saw a man die) ” … I felt a weird sensation… like his soul was leaving him…”
        No shit. Ya think?
        Its the only mention of anything spiritual in the whole article, almost as if its an annoying memory.

        “Everybody wants to go to heaven,
        nobody wants to die.”

        We live HUNDREDS of lives.
        Just ONE fucked up murderous incarnation can set your spirit back many lifetimes, as you have to learn the SAME lessons again.
        The Problem is- this is the last chance. When you check out of this one, where you are is where you’ll be at for a LONG time- this side is where you can advance and there will not be a body for you. All dead.

        Killing to survive until you starve and die means you’ve been suckered by the illusion.

        And the punchline is… “I am he and you are me and we are all together…”

        LAST CHANCE to pull your head out of your ass, Dad.

        • I have already lived a good many years. Had a fruitful life. Our preps are not for the wife & I. They are for the grandchildren. Not for strangers. Not for friends. Not for refugees. They are to help my grandchildren to survive and maybe carry my DNA on down the line. Whatever horrible things I may be forced to do will be to protect them. Possibly in my next reincarnation I will become their grandchildren? We tend to reincarnate back into the same family,s. Doing what is necessary for my grandchildren,s survival will not damage my soul or bring on bad Karma. Old age is rapidly catching up to me. And its catching up to many others who would also be effective against the NWO. So im going to do a horrible unthinkable thing. Im voting for Hillary. Im as ready as I will ever be. Its going to happen. Why delay any longer? Trump will not solve the problem. there isn’t any viable political or Ballott box solution. Man I wish That Nibiru fantasy was actually true. I would consider it divine intervention.

          • Thank you “Old Guy” for your Apr.2, 2016 at 5:02 article. I am a 71 year old combat veteran and cannot run and hump the boonies like I use to. I believe there is something heading our way and have had a problem on how I might fit into a group if I am in a group. We can contribute something to the group and your prepping for you grandchildren has shown me that my direction in a group may be better served looking to help or nurture the younger people (maybe in a back up mode). Your article has shown me that there may be more to contributing to a successful survival group than just having a healthy “trigger finger”.

        • Wise words Rocky. Re-birth explains most things, like why some are born into abject squalor & poverty, others into luxury (and others still into spiritual circumstances).

          Every thought, word & deed has its inescapable consequence. Sadly we are far from realising that truth.

      23. Yea I killed a Hundred chickens and I only remember the one that flew away with out his head. 50 feet and back into the boiling water to rench his feathers off.

      24. I think the reason why people will not kill other people because of one word HOPE !

      25. Kevin2, keep up the good posting… what’s coming to America. will. Aka the Natzi’s look like a joke.. chi-coms. Russians, jihadiat. Cubans and they have all one thing in common.. they are murderers, rapist, killers.. I will never be in a posiotion where I am kneeling in front of a guillotine..this not Mt way of thinking..i will shoot back and kill them on site..when they come.. I met a man from Germany on time that told me that he was in Germany and was 10 yrs old at the time when the Russians entered the city.. the bombs kept dropping, then the soldiers invaded.. he looke through his Window and was with his family and kept seeing groups of Russians entering each house and apartment on his street, its pow, pow, pow, then he kept hearing the women and girls screeming nonstop getting raped by soldiers and then he realized after his father told them that the women and girls are getting raped.. he then told me that more troops came in that the screaming went on for 4 more days and that they are hiding under so much rubble that they were not caught, then the trips left a few days later, then they went out to those buildings and what he told me next is so bad, bad bad, that I am not even going to type it in this post, too graphic.. he suffers from mental post trauma of some type and takes a medication for it, he was in his seventies when I met him 20 yrs ago.i didn’t know at the time that I would be a man who was going to be living in America and seeing this happen to me and the people in my city.. 2016-2019.. one can only imagine the horrors that awaits us, once the foreign soldiers enter my area..i am not concerned about dred lock coming at me during callapse, they are easy to take out.. I am concerned about combat soldiers..they are trained. Like I have said before don’t let me capture one of your soldiers in my area..that soldier will pay a heavy price. I have no fear anymore….not posting on this site will not save my life and this is why I talk the way I do.. it’s all real. When I die I am going straight to hell, because of the bad horrific atrocities that I inflicted on the soldiers when they come, I will be like Satan incarnate himself.. straight to hell I go, right to the lake of fire.i don’t listen to crap like tho shall not kill, my ass. Phuck that crap.



        See you all in hell.

        • For what it is worth, in The Ten Commandments, if they had been translated correctly, would have said, “Thou shalt not commit murder.”
          It is absolutely a God-given right to kill to protect your OWN life. Need the supporting verses? In fact, God, many times, told the people to go forth and kill everyone in a land:man, woman and child …all of them.

          Besides, they have clearly stated they intend to kill me. So, I intend to kill them while in the act of trying to kill me …if not before, which is preferable.

      26. the most dangerous time will be the transitional time when it first hits the fan…

        those who can make a quick adjustment into the mindset necessary will be those who have the greatest chance to survive…

        having a community of likeminded individuals will be a key to longer term survival… unfortunately,there is no way for a husband and wife to effectively hold a farm/home by themselves…

        someone wants to parlay, they will have to approach in the crosshairs from a good distance off, to negate the effectiveness of any partner they may have…

        when it all does come down today’s problems will be like a walk in the park…

        • having a community of likeminded individuals will be a key to longer term survival. Just where could find one or two like minded individuals et alone a community of them? You need to face the facts. DTA Don’t Trust Anyone. When push comes to shove those like minded individuals will stab you in the back. The black folks are a community of like minded individuals. They will gang up on and kill whitey as a group. And lacking a common enemy they then turn on each other Black on Black crime and murder is rampant. Nope me and mine are more like a wolf pack. Small in number We will work together. to try and protect & feed the youngest and not allow any other wolves into our pack.

      27. THANK YOU..THANK YOU..THANK YOU for posting, “Collapse Survivor ON the Reality of Killing and Violence”. Only a tiny few of the Prepper and Survivalist internet websites will talk about post violence after SHTF or talk about 3-5 days after shtf looting starts and if left unattended will form hunter killer teams when a natural leader takes over. Women were being raped after Katrina (25 to 30% of N. Orleans police ran off for good)in a hospital until our gov. sent contractors in to settle the situation. (I knew one of them……he was a bad a*s in South American firefights because he had never been up close to his handy work until shooting of a rapist in the hospital). Please prepare for the worse case “scenario” as best you can when you train..train…train and then practice..practice…practice.

        • William Snapp

          Stick around and see how crazy it gets here.

          We were crazy when we got here, but we’re All Right Now.

          • yeah (tic) yeah (tic) yeah (tic)

        • WS, welcome. You’re in the right place.

      28. William Snap, welcome to the board.. I don t hesitate to talk about women issues in high is site. In every case of war, natural disasters, including soldier entering the area, the civilian men launch attacks on girls and women within 3-4 days, the soldiers go in and continue to rape, murderer and pillage.. you would think that another man is logical like me, you or others, think again, these assholes are more concerned about clearing their prostate gland post shtf than stability of populations. They are worst than animals, not even male animals behave like that in the breeding season…single women are in extremely severe deep unimaginable deep sh…t post shtf, war, environmental, callapse, invasion..Chinese soldiers will be the worst of it all because the last time any of hot hot soldiers touched a woman was when they exited time mothers womb from child birth. what do you think they phuckers will so once will make the jihadist look like a total joke..they raped all the falls students after the Tiaman..Square massacre, thousands of them raped, murdered.. 90% of women in most cities have no clue what will happen to them. Keep it up ladies, keep giving your boyfriend crap, let pissing off your husband’s..your gonna learn..War is the ultimate lesson for bad women..I am not advocating or wishing bad things on you crappy women.. but you all need to get ready, prep up and arm up.
        Luckily mine listens to me and does not argue.. start dating real men and get away form the gay metro sexual porches driver telling you crap that he eats out most of the time and does not cook at home.. What you have is total complete useless suited up office worker dumbass that won’t be protecting you. The dumb phuck’s does not own a gun. phucker can’t even provide the basic necessities such as food or water when shtf strikes..

        Women you all are completely phucked..

        The women in the cities will pay a horrific price. That is what leads to their extinction, with only 5,000 of them over the entire continental US..if that’s what happen post hurricanes, then what happens when War breaks out., worst 10 times worst. Remember the nigger thugs at the Trump rally were threatening to rape all the women, and were out there with semi automatic rifles firing then into the sky..this is just unbelievable to see this type of crap yet not surprising to see these felon criminals roaming the streets..beating up cops and crap.. you thugs keep it up, your gonna learn..


        • One thing that is enraging is that our POTUS saw to it that women would be allowed in any and all combat situations. This just adds to the complicated “mess of war” that the boys have to deal with and NOW they have to keep the women from getting raped. Who exactly is the SOB that brought this one to fruition? He needs to be shot, right after he’s hung.

      29. Please allow for one more comment. We,Americans will NOT survive a collapse like that in Bosnia. Selco talks of coping. Coping with the daily indiscriminate killing,raping,and violence that happens in a SHTF scenario.No,this generation is so soft that when some bozo wrote”Trump” on a college “safe area”,students flooded the administration phones with feelings of anxiety,and demostrated for an investigation.This generation is so medicated they would’nt know a true ‘feeling’if it slapped them in the face. They will fold,collapse themselves,and lay prostrated for the rest of their lives. No,there is no ‘coping mechnism’ left in our country anymore. There will be mass hysteria and God knows what else Kudos to you,Selco,for telling it like it is.

      30. Southside, I can only think that Selco speaks of a ‘coping’ perhaps being more of a, “well, they are 1200 miles away, and I am not leaving my family to attend to theirs. The others will be right in the same area watching, yet few will actually involved themselves. We somehow been taught NEVER INVOLVE YOURSELF! (And it is rare that someone DOES ‘involve themselves’ as compared to 25 years ago as compared to 250 years ago)! Think about it! I and everyone else should feel ashamed, but we CAN “wise up” to what has been done and do a bit of “damage control” to get this nation back on course. Obama has done nothing that cannot be undone (everything he’s done has pretty much ended in failure anyway).
        So will his ‘final plans’ for us. Ready, ‘locked & loaded’.

      31. I’ve killed. I will again. The thing about killing isn’t the moment it happens, it’s the years afterward. If you train, you will be okay. Your muscles have a memory. If you want to get philosophical about it, yeah, youre a wastecase. Nevertheless, you are an imperfect being, subject to many stressors that that you have not been equipped(brainwashed) to deal with. What you expe
        rience will be unique to you. Though it share some commonality, you will digest this individually. Death is a very personal experience.Even if it is someone else’s. Don’t covet it. Don’t run from it. Watch some nature shows and know that the cold hearted conspirators of death are just scientists…and judge as you have been judged. Only one thing is certain…you will die. You will cross over as the millions before you. ONLY then will you know, or not.

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