In early August John Crawford III went to Walmart on what was supposed to be a normal shopping trip. While there, Crawford happened across an unpackaged BB gun that he picked up off the shelf in the sporting goods section of the store. He proceeded to walk around the store and make a cell phone call.
A concerned citizen at the Walmart had apparently thought Crawford was holding a real rifle. According to an Infowars report, the man called 9-1-1 and reported that an individual was walking around with a gun in the store.
The witness who phoned police, ex-marine Ronald Ritchie, reportedly told 9-1-1 he saw Crawford “walking around with a gun in the store,” and that he was “loading it right now,” and pointing it at customers and children.
He “was just waving it at children and people. Items…. I couldn’t hear anything that he was saying. I’m thinking that he is either going to rob the place or he’s there to shoot somebody else,” Ritchie said.
Two police officers responded to the call. According to the officers, Crawford failed to comply with orders to drop the weapon when police approached him.
Seconds later he was dead.
But a new surveillance video released just days after a Grand Jury found that the officers had acted appropriately and chose not to level any charges against them shows a slightly different set of events. In the split screen video below, which shows officers approaching Crawford, it appears that Crawford did drop his weapon and subsequently dove for cover. Crawford then gets up and runs around a corner, at which point he is shot at near point blank range.
Watch the raw footage for yourself and decide if police were justified in their actions:
The video shows that Crawford immediately dropped his weapon and dove for cover when he spotted someone coming towards him. As another officer flanked him from the other side, Crawford may have panicked, jumped up and ran for cover down the other aisle. It just so happened that the other officer was coming towards him at the time. Perhaps that officer, who had his weapon drawn, was startled as Crawford came around the corner.
Though the Grand Jury chose not to charge the officers, the Justice Department has promised to look into the matter.
Did police act within the law when they shot and killed John Crawford? Or is this another case of overzealous cops making a choice to shoot first and ask questions later? Or, was this just a situation that went awry when both parties – Crawford and the police officers – panicked?
Hattip The Daily Sheeple and The Free Thought Project
Seems to me that everyone freaked out here. The dude dove behind the shelves and then got up sprinting towards the cop.
Cop was running up with his gun up… and boom, it was over.
Still, it was a BB gun. I am not a police officer and don’t know all the protocols, but it looks to me that they could have given this guy a warning. The video shows it happened A LOT faster than the cops made it look like with their statements.
They made it sound like he was told repeatedly to drop the gun.. but the video shows a lag of maybe 3 – 5 seconds between when you first see police appear and when the guy drops the bb gun and dives for cover.
Also, the gun was obviously on the ground right where to cop approached, so he knew the dude didn’t have it in his hands… but shot anyway.
In a country with a national average of 2.3 police officers per 1000 people, its pretty much a given that when seconds count, cops are minutes away (if they come at all). Had this guy actually been an active shooter, those cops would have been there to mop up the mess, not prevent it.
If SHTF, do you think the odds are in your favor, with criminals and gangs forming and running wild, that you will be protected by law enforcement?
With this ratio, why would anyone trust their lives and safety to the police department, especially in the aftermath of a high impact scenario where anarchy, chaos, rioting, looting, and general mayhem ensue? Considering this ratio, does it make sense to be denied the right to own and operate self defense and protection measures that will help you stay alive and defend yourself against an enemy that is absolutely impossible for your municipal paid law enforcement to protect you from? And why would federal and state and local governments even want to deny you these protective measures when they know that they could never provide that level of protection for you?
They want the general public to be banned from possessing semi-automatic pistols and rifles, ammo, body armour, web gear, night/thermal vision, incediary devices, food storage (for more than 3 days), antibiotics and medications (more than 30 days), and relinquish their inherent rights to gardening (food production) and fresh water (because government owns all the water and its sources) along with forcing you to give up ANY and ALL possessions they deem in the best interest of national security. Why? Why would government do this?
Cops r outa control terrorist don’t go to Wally World & sit around loading BB guns.
“See something, say something”, mission accomplished – Big Sis
/sarc
Another issue to set us here against each other. Sad to see people who are on here for a while calling each other cowards. Mission accomplished TPTB
Eric holder resigning…formal announcement later today.
I guess Sharpton is in on the new pick. This wont end well.
Agreed!
The “majority” of LE have been “re-programmed” just like the majority of our militsry folks.
These days the cops, especially in bigger cities, are so ramped up and on the defensive all the time……
we call them “cops on crack”. Trigger happy idiots wanting to blow anyone “suspicious’ away before thinking thru the scenarios.
Many have set themselves up on a pedestal by carrying a badge and a gun. Their actions have caused the general public to fear them and has caused a feeling of distrust.
When shtf, many LE (at least the ones with common sense) will try to blend in with common folks.
Walking around with a badge/gun/billy stick acting like Billy Badass, will make them a target for sure.
They couldn’t pay me enough $$/NWO money, to get me to wear a uniform and a badge.
Every cop, judge, prosecutor and politician will be targeted by many, many groups, gangs, etc. I saw a documentary on the Aryan Brotherhood. In the aforementioned exposé, the AB said that they know the names and addresses of every law enforcement related person in America. When the SHTF, these people will be hanging from lamp posts.
piss in the wind
get a job, the only reason you have an opinion is b/c of the military and police protecting peoples rights
Whoever said that we are with one another?
Part of the militarized cop scare tactics.
Anyone seen holding a gun or gun like device will be killed by cops. Were seeing more of these situations.
Next up will be the CCLs w/ holstered handguns getting shot down.
Were supposed to get hardened by this shit and get used to the heavier hands of the g-man. They really want us to revolt all across the USSA.
An ex-marine that doesn’t know the difference between a bb gun and a “real” gun? An ex marine that called the police instead of taking the guy down himself? And these are the hero’s we hope will join us to fight against tyranny?
Cops trained to be afraid of everyone and everything then to use deadly force when the feel afraid?
Looks like “the best of the best” doesn’t amount to much.
GC, one article stated that the “ex-Marine” was not really a Marine. He had joined the Marines and after a few weeks had been discharged from the Marines. The real Marines that I know would have taken the guy down.
Just happened in Daytona Beach, a CCW holder was in a tow yard picking up a truck, when two men with guns approached, he pulled out his weapon and was killed as he was shot 6 times by an undercover cop. No charges filed.
Since the g-men cant control guns, theyll control people who have guns.
i want to see the person that called this in’s head on a stick! it takes a village to MIND YER OWN FUKIN’ BIZZNISS!
my statements are not againts white white people. but against the cops. the main mistakes that crawford made was being black and caring a bb gun in a store. when a scared white person calls the cops on a black guy with a gun. being black myself knows that the cops will kill the black male without second thought. where unlike when cops deal with a white male with a gun the cops try to talk them down.
the question i have for the white men here is, when you are have any dealing with the police do you believe that you might die just because some cop is having a bad day? i have no criminal record and yet when i have any dealing with the police i have to ask myself is this the day i die just because some cop is having a bad day?.
the problem that black men have is not white people, but the police who happen to be white for the most part. but don’t get me wrong racism exist in all races but not in everyone. but when i comes to cops it doesn’t matter about the race of the cops, cops in general will not have not one second thought about killing a black male.
Yeah, I figured he was black…
It seems cops have a tendency to shoot to kill (when opportunity arises) for a black guy or a returning VET.
If you’re white (but served in Iraq) you are automatically assumed guilty and expendable… same goes for black guys.
Don’t be a drama queen…and quit wallowing in your victimhood.
When you walk through your own black neighborhoods maybe you should ask, “is this the day i die just because some cop is having a bad day?. ” but insert the word “brotha” instead of cop…because the reality is that between 5,000 to 10,000 young blacks will be killed by other young blacks yet only a few dozen will be killed by cops..( which is still a few dozen too many)
PS: what kind of idiot walks around a store with a gun–BB or real not withstanding–waving it around, standing solitary in the back corner for several mins ( what was he doing standing there in the back rows alone for so long?)and even saw a family with children run away when they saw him at the end of the aisle..???
Black or white, and not justifying trigger happy cops one bit but maybe this is one of those eliminations from the human gene pool that might be not such a bad thing…..
What vid was you watching? He was still shopping. And he wasnt waving it around. when its a white guy the police talks him down. A black guy shoot first. Check the vid again. You must have been the one who called the police.
This guy just picks up a rifle and carries it around the store, and even does what looks like the manual of arms with it? He’s got to be high on something. We’ll see a toxicology report, maybe. BB gun or pellet rifle, those are sold in Walmart right next to the centerfire rifles, I’d hate to have to second guess myself as to which one he had. Certainly not going to spend time reviewing a grainy video before dealing with the guy, giving possible active shooters more gun time is not an effective police tactic.
From the video, hind sight is wonderful, isn’t it? For all the officers knew, when he dropped the rifle and disappeared around the counter to come out the other side he could have drawn a pistol. All he needed to do was put his hands up and freeze, instead he either panics or tries to get aggressive, not sure which, but either way, it’s happening too fast to allow much discretion from the officers.
Problem is in America today the average person never had any firearms training. No safety drills, no handling… Nothing. Anything they do know is from movies/Hollywood. What we really need is an IMMEDIATE return to support for the unorganized militia. What to be REALLY politically correct? Include females in millitia training.
WE HAVE COPS WHO MURDER UNARMED CITIZENS WITH NO FEAR OF REPERCUSSIONS WHATSOEVER.
– Spectrum
The POLICE STATE is ENFORCED by the POLICE.
-Semper Fortis
Agreed.
they’re gonna protect all the property so foreign countries can’t start a repo joe to get back what they loaned us even if it means citizen casualties . I was in wal-mart yesterday and even the clerk at the sporting goods counter was telling me and five other guys ..”you better get ya ammo cuz it’s all fixen to fall apart” he was talking loud too over and over at least three times the same phrase , what’s he know ? nobody was talking about world events or anything he just started a rant with the customers trying to make a purchase and went off on everyone.
A guy came one this site earlier this year, I forget on what he was commenting on, but I do remember him saying that he worked for Wal-Mart and that they (Wal-Mart) had been given orders by the government to start storing the food that could be stored in a warehouse somewhere in Dallas TX. He said some other things, I forget what all he said, but that was the gist of his comment. Maybe the other Wal-Marts are doing the same? Makes me think that maybe they are storing for something about to happen and maybe this idiot found out and well at least he’s sharing what he found out?
Sounds like another ‘I know a guy who knows a guy who said…’ kind of thing.
did anyone even notice that spooked or not he was not only approaching the le officer but the rifle itself as well.I am not a fan of law enforcement or the state,quite the opposite. but in this situation
1 there is no markings to i.d. the rifle as a toy
2 the cop may have assumed he was being charged at and or/ trying to recover the rifle he dropped, giving at the instant reasonable cause to defend himself.
not every shooting by l.e. is a murder, if i saw this video in a jury i would acquit the cop.
….am i missing something here?
You are missing nothing. You have common sense and do not jump to conclusions and assume the big bad police are out to murder people.
Control
For one I would see that the BB gun DOSENT HAVE THE Orange top to the rifle and for 2 the guy dropped the weopen and hid
Reading about this senseless tragedy opens up a huge can of worms as far as my thoughts and opinions. First off I must say the if the man who was shot had of just been wounded and survived we could just visit him and say “Here’s you sign”. Not the sharpest tool in the shed. Did he deserve to die?, absolutely not. Did the police use good judgement? Absolutely not. There was plenty of existing cover for him to use while he could have challenged him and told him to drop the gun. Unfortunately, there are stupid people out there and like it not you need to use restraint when dealing with stupid people. Its a hard part of the job but if a requirement and realization police need to use also because they are dealing with people who die not pistol targets. Were the police stupid? very good possibility. Was it racially motivated or due to overzealousness? Very good possibility. Could this had been better handled without loss of life? Most definitely. I know there people that will disagree with this and I respect that.
Part of the problem I see with all this is we must all realize no matter who you are now, black, white, pink, purple
THE POLICE ARE OUT OF CONTROL, FULLY MILITARIZED WILL GUN YOU DOWN LIKE A DOG ON THE SLIGHTEST PRETEXT.
With this being said, was this racially motivated? Let me say I am white and have personally been the victim of racially motivated crime. I get discriminated against every day by racists blacks because they are legally empowered to do so. Do I blame all blacks, absolutely not. Race don’t have anything to do with it. The cop that committed the Oakland subway killing, should be back in prison doing hard time. The cop that shot the black man in SC that was reaching for his license should have get time as well as being fired. I believe he would have shot a white in the same situation. I recently was pulled over by a black cop for having a busted headlight in the parking lot of my job. He had me spread eagle on the hood and kept saying ” Why are you so tense and displaying aggression towards me?” over and over with his hand on his gun. He finally realized the parking lot had video cameras and stopped. I firmly believe had it not been for that he would have shot me and went into the “Resisting mode and shot me”. Point is if you are black and think the blacks are the only people getting victimized by law enforcement you are living in “LA LA LAND”. If you are able to be manipulated into this movement that ELITES have created this situation for in the 1st place and deserve the socialist hell-hole they have planned for you. I’m not going on your ship. If you you think blacks have a monopoly on human suffering you are highly uneducated. You are a victim of European colonialism and Greed. Not Racism. I didn’t see anything Black leaders protest when a black cop shot and killed a white kid who had headphones on and reached in his pocket for his cell phone. I don’t see black leaders protesting black cops tossing white people out of their wheelchairs. Check the web, white people are being murdered by cops everywhere. These statements aren’t directed at all blacks (you know who you are). Bottom line is cops are out-of-control for a very good reason. Its about divide and conquer baby. So lets all, come together on dealing with this and ALL come in on the big win for freedom.
In every war in history up until Korea, 85% of soldiers would not shoot to kill. Now with modern brainwashing techniques, they are trained to fire without thinking about it and 90% of the shillitary will shoot to kill.
That is why it is so dangerous to militarize the pigs, with the results that you can see.
IT’S VERY IMPORTANT THAT YOU UNDERSTAND THIS.
Acid, what would you say about the kid’s behavior, waving a gun, even a fake one, while walking around in a store? What was anyone in that store supposed to think when they saw that kid’s behavior? IT’S UNACCEPTABLE, STUPID, AND DANGEROUS TO WALK AROUND IN ANY STORE AND WAVE A GUN, WHETHER REAL OR FAKE AND NOT EXPECT SOMETHING BAD TO HAPPEN TO YOU. WHAT PART OF THAT DON’T YOU UNDERSTAND?
Grumpy old bastard,
I was speaking in generalization.
I wouldn’t be caught in wallyworld anyways.
Dear Acid –
Pay your taxes and shut up! Get a job and appreciate you rights as an American citizen.
you stupid mother fucker you he got it in the fucking store or are your liberal eyes wide shut?
or are yu a fucking hipocrit conservative?
He got the gun in the store and was going to buy it was talking to his girlfriend on his god damned phone you fuckers that defend this kind of crap and make issues where non is deserve this to happen to you Fuck you and fuck you very much.
your probably one of the mother fucking jurests that failed to indict these mother fucking pigs fuck you and your god damned red coat loving sons of bitches you all are.
The part for your answer is he got it in the store and is not illegal to carry it around while thinking on buying it that’s the part I/ we don’t understand
nothign he did warranted any of this shit and how dare you make issue out of nothing NO mother fucker he was not waving it around not as your trying to make it out.
He was standing there looking at studd talkign ans was using his hand as we all do when talking.
Mother fucker you are not going to change this country into a god damned scared of every god damned thing and make issue when no is
FUCK OFF AND FUCK OFF HARD!
Fucking asshole
Its because he’s the wrong color. I don’t post much but the hate that comes out of certain people’s mouths just gets to me some days. The ass hat that called this in lied and should at least be brought up on man slaughter charges his actions caused this hole scenario. Also a 37 yo women died of a heart attack in direct correlation of the shooting. If the self proclaimed Ex marine didn’t make the call none of this would of happened. And in a few weeks if it comes out he got arrested for smoking pot or jacking a car last week or year it doesn’t hold anything on this story. Now I say most of this with the evidence that is provided to us I might change my opinion on it if the evidence changes like any rational person should.
http://www.inquisitr.com/1464363/walmart-shooting-john-crawford-911/ Here’s the link. Not sure how good the source is.
According to this article, Ritchie really wasn’t even a Marine, just a boot camp washout
The truth is that Ritchie was expelled from the Marine Corps after just seven weeks because his enlistment was determined to be “fraudulent.”
No it’s because he was a dumb a$$.
No it has nothing to do with color. It has everything to do with conditioning.
The operant training that social institutions want the public to have is
hold a gun (even peaceful) = get shot to death by police “protecting the public”
I agree, the next step by government will be to condition police to shoot CCW holders out of fear.
Yeah, the sad thing is, he had put the gun down and was freaking out, trying to hide/get away (though he had done ABSOLUTLEY D=NOTHING WONG!!) and got killed anyway… Moth$#&^% Fuc*&%$* cops!!!
In the old days (before the coup de etat) people could walk around, carrying a bee bee gun they intended to buy… now days, they kill you at any excuse they can get!!
I remember young boys walking through the college field with bee bee guns when I was a kid.. better not do it now days, the police state is coming into full force.
STFU.
Braveheart is 100% correct. You don’t go waving a gun around, ANYWHERE, anymore, ever – real or fake. And did you notice how much time elapsed? His behavior was suspicious. Who stands in an aisle, in the same spot, for 10 minutes?
He was on the phone, with his wife, townsaver!! duh!!
wHEN HE WAS WAVING THE GUN (AND IT WASN’T THAT MUCH OF A WAVE!) NO ONE WAS AROUND!!!!!!
I stand in the aisle and look at pens for 45 minutes at an office supply store. If some goof calls the police and says there’s a suspicious looking man is in the store do I deserve to get shot? What if you want to look at realistic airsoft guns at a sporting goods store? Does that mean the cops are justified to come in and execute you? A concealed carry guy at Costco was executed when a nervous store manager who saw his print and called the police. He was laying on the ground when he was shot.
Even on this site, where I agree with most of comments, I can see that people have lost the ability to see the big picture. Here’s the big picture: WE HAVE COPS WHO MURDER UNARMED CITIZENS WITH NO FEAR OF REPERCUSSIONS WHATSOEVER. Deaf people are shot because they didn’t hear the cop say stop, a middle aged woman shot 5 times because she would not roll down her car window. People are shot in their beds in no knock SWAT raids at the wrong address. Carrying a weapon puts huge responsibility on the person with the weapon whether they are a cop, soldier, opera singer, or mail man. Pilots are responsible for their actions. Surgeons are responsible if they kill somebody or amputate the wrong leg. We assume people are screened and trained for their jobs and take the responsibility seriously. So tell me again – Why is it OK for cops to come into a retail store and start blasting away because of a phone call? If people can’t understand that, there really is no hope.
A FREAKIN MEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Spectrum, thank you. Thank you for putting into words what I could not say myself.
This is the critical detail, as you said. People have lost the ability to see the big picture. It seems like acerbic, paid goons tear apparent any meaningful debate about the big picture by dividing communities on the merits of singular cases, arguing details that don’t matter in the broader scope to divide and distract from a larger pattern.
WE HAVE COPS WHO MURDER UNARMED CITIZENS WITH NO FEAR OF REPERCUSSIONS WHATSOEVER.
Possibly one of the singular, defining, best damn comments on this site.
C’mon csaaphill, tell us how you really feel. Don’t sugar-coat it now
. This guy is walking around the store with a gun that he took out of the package. The 911 call came in from a women that said he was acting irrationally and pointing the gun at people. He was doing something stupid. Wether he was on drugs or not don’t care. He was pointing this gun at people maybe he had a suicidal wish. He did rush the Leo in that video.
I live in this area and have been in that walmart a few times. There is very much info being left out of this article. It is very slanted against LE and it makes it seem that this guy was just out buying a BB gun. I bet this guy didn’t even have a dollar in his pocket to buy it.
Would you rather had this guy shooting at innocent people before they took him down? He was a thug. Pure and simple. Doing the wrong thing.
How many times have any of you walked around a store pointing a gun at people? Stupid dumb thing to do. One more thug.
I don’t normally have trouble with black people, but this csaaphill is just a stupid boy. It’s true no one will ever know for sure what was going through this kid’s mind, but his behavior on the video was questionable to say the least.
Got to agree w/ acid etch on this.
But you know braveheart, last time I checked the Constitution, there werent no law against being stupid. You and I surely think what that kid did was stupid but did a case of the dumbass mean he gets shot down by police? I thought we are supposed to be free in our country, aint we?
Aint no law against holding a bb gun I know of. But WTF did walmart have that gun sitting out for if it was so real looking?
Invoking Hillary:
He’s dead now. What difference does it make?
I dunno RBH, I think you may be on the wrong side of this one. Yeah, it wasn’t the smartest choice in the world to walk around the store like that, but, the kid wasn’t acting in a manner that alarmed ANY of the other customers, just that joke of a fat bastard that wants to (incorrectly) call himself an ex marine.
I think he(Ritchie) over-reacted and ended up getting someone killed.
Me thinks the crime he committed (according to RBH) was he was holding a gun (and talking on the phone to his wife) while being black…
If he had been white… another matter.
The guy dropped the toy gun and was not in possession of it when he was shot therefore the cops lives were not in any danger before and especially after, he dropped the toy. Even if it the gun was real it was not a justified shooting. He complied with their orders and was shot afterwards. WHAT PART OF THAT DO YOU NOT UNDERSTAND?
I agree. 🙂
if being stupid is grounds for murder then this country is going lose 100,000,000 or so souls to death by cop.
RB…I agree the kid was stupid and ultimately caused his own demise. I know several CC folks who would have drawn on this dumbass themselves. If I were walking through a store with my granddaughter and some thug in the back corner is waving a gun around like one of these spree killers we get almost weekly…well we might be getting a whole nother news report on this against our rights to bear arms…or against our right to stand our ground.
I most likely would have drawn and ordered him to drop the gun..if he had moved quickly, dove to the side..and/or tried to crawl back and grab the weapon…well, I just might have acted for self preservation and to protect my family/kids…
Again, you NEVER carry any weapon-no matter how lethal–in your hand with finger at trigger openly in the public without expecting someone to drop you…he was a stupid ass.
My beef is with an EX-MARINE who apparently couldn’t tell the difference between a Crossman BB gun and a real gun, in a well-lit store… and then PANICKED and called 911.
I could understand that mistake in a foxhole, or dense3 jungle flora, or even in a dark movie theatre, but not in the middle of the aisle at Walmart.
Inexcusable, on both the ex-marine’s part AND the cops part.
no he knew what he was doing it’s called swating he’s probably anti gun and dislikes it when people buy or own anything that looks like a bg black scary gun!
Yep , sixpack , panic .
Shades of selco’s story .(previous article)
Panic and someone dies .
Ex marine and former marine are too different things.
I read in a different article that he didn’t make it threw boot camp. Some sort of paperwork thing so he got kicked out. My father is a former marine and he said a marine will never call himself a ex marine and I think it came from his words I will try to find the link but I’m not to good with that stuff so give me a few.
See I told u I’m not good at this I posted link a couple comments up
DC: I am a Ex-marine and Vietnam Vet with citations, a
meritorious combat promotion, and Honorable Discharge. I always refer to myself as an “ex-Marine”; never a “former Marine”.
Your dad is full of shit, but I don’t care whether he refers to himself as a “former Marine or “ex-Marine”.
Same, same to me. 🙂
That’s ur option ass wipe
My father is also a Vietnam vet I would love for u to say that to his face oh but wait your a key board commando
That’s right DC, “Once a Marine, ALWAYS a Marine.”
What I find suspect..is that the lame stream media stated he was an ex marine right at the beginning of the story…now why was that important?..ahh the psyops cabal and the great culling. My suspicion is he isn’t a ex marine at all and is part of the controlled narrative to forment the public opinion on the vets as wacko’s. The NWO will kill anyone for the desired public control they are wanting. A real vet would know the difference of real firearm versus a BB gun..this was a crisis actor and will probably see him soon in other roles.
I think you nailed it talon.
He was/is a boot camp washout for “paperwork” issues. In my eyes, he has NO military status.
Makes perfect sense, Talon.
Crisis actor lol. He was a known local. Not everything’s a government conspiracy. Start thinking that and you’ll lose sight of the things that actually ARE conspiracies.
Of course he couldn’t tell the difference. He didn’t even make it through boots because of a “paperwork issue”
He mistook for one of his video game guns and panicked.
He was kicked out. Never made it in the Marines. He is a criminal.
Cops universally, are pussy cowards when they don’t believe they have complete control over their intended victims. There are countless examples that provide evidence to back that statement up. Including this incident.
…and the biggest pussy coward in law enforcement just announced he’s quitting…guess he’s heading for the bunker
The “I’d rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6” is racking up a pretty good body count.
You could tell from vid these cops just shot first and asked questions second at the morgue of course.
did anyone even notice that spooked or not he was not only approaching the le officer but the rifle itself as well.I am not a fan of law enforcement or the state,quite the opposite. but in this situation
1 there is no markings to i.d. the rifle as a toy
2 the cop may have assumed he was being charged at and or/ trying to recover the rifle he dropped, giving at the instant reasonable cause to defend himself.
not every shooting by l.e. is a murder, if i saw this video in a jury i would acquit the cop.
….am i missing something here?
Yeah. BB Guns don’t shoot by remote…ya kinda have to have physical contact with it, for it to be dangerous. Unless you also believe that “Guns kill people.”
As sad is this story is, this was not a BB gun. It was a .177 pellet gun; which is close to a .22 caliber rifle. And that’s probably what the cops thought it was too.
No, they didn’t mistake it for a .22. It’s an FN SCAR look alike, complete with removable mag.
Cop shot from the end of the isle. Subject “dove behind the shelves” after being shot. Cops closed the distance after shooting him to secure him and the gun. People don’t just hit the floor and die on impact with a round.
Split screen of raw footage of Walmart shooiting synced with 911 call.
callhttp://www.abc22now.com/shared/news/features/raw-news/stories/wkef_vid_189.shtml
In a store where guns are sold and people may be looking at them you would think somebody could have said something to the poor guy first – maybe from behind a display called out to him. It’s definitely over-zealous -especially on the part of the meathead who called the cops. Am I now supposed to be afraid to look at and handle a gun in a store where I might purchase one?!
The guy did nothing wrong– I watched the video over and over… anybody say anything different is nuts!
If they didn’t want him to pick up the bb gun (to buy, examine, whatever) they should not have had it in the store..
And for this he gets killed??!! What if that had been YOUR kid/brother/whatever?!!!
COPS NEED THE ELECTRIC CHAIR!!! IT IS INEXCUSABLE FOR THEM TO CONSIDER US CITIZENS AS THE ENEMY!! AND THATS WHAT IS HAPPENING– THEY ARE TAUGHT TO CONSIDER US THE EMEMY.
everydayhero
I don’t want to crowd your comment but I am having problems getting comment area to load.
Anyways, I agree, things happened really fast. I am a nurse, my husband is active duty military currently deployed in Afgan. The military is not filled with people who hate America nor is the police! I work at a jail and I work hard, my husband works hard, and we have a family! We are proud Americans! I have started prepping w/him being gone. I’ve taken pistol courses and a CHL class. I am a member of the NRA (my Dad signed me up years ago). We hunt, fish, serve our country and pay our taxes! I AM SO tired of people hating on the n-military and police!! MOST people have no idea what it is like in an active shooter situation! You have seconds! Do not judge people who are trying to serve the public or country unless you know! Pull your head out of your ass and think about who gives you that right!!
I live near this Wal-Mart, and you do not have all of the facts. Yes it was a pellet gun, but designed to look like a real assault style weapon. If you hold them up together, you cannot tell the real from the toy. He was wandering around brandishing this weapon. He was found to have marijuana in his system, and his girlfriend said he smelled like marijuana that day. If I recall correctly, his family loved him so much that they made him live with his grandparents. His family loved him so much that the very next day after the shooting they were talking lawsuit, might as well try to collect on a dead son before any facts are actually in. Their attorney is an Al Sharpton racist clone who is interested in his career more than anything else. You also need to go check out the witness statements as well as the officers statements. I am personally sick and tired of the “I’m black therefore I’m innocent” routine. If an officer does something criminal, he should be punished. But in this case, they acted appropriately and I support their actions.
The guy who made the call should be charged with murder. The kid never did any of what he said.
You betcha. I feel the same way.
I take it back I rewatched it several times, at one point it looks as though he is moving his hands up to point something at the cop.
No he isn’t he’s like wtf and runs his arm was in natural movement at that point and not in some im gona shoot ou kind of movement.
i too watched it several times
he’s like he hears somethign and probably scared shitless his natural arm movement was no where nears that of anyone going to shoot which would be stupid anyhows since it’s only a bb gun. in the video i hear a noise then almost instantly shots this guys actions were not of anyone getting ready to shoot. it was omfg and tries to run which he did and drops the BB gun. Why he runs back who knows. But no your wrogn he is most assurdely not getting ready to shoot hes like caught off guard and any arm movement is consistant with anyone whos caught off guard and about to shit his pants.
Did you notice the time stamp…time was running at live speed at the end. That was so fast that you can’t expect the cop to be perfect. They were hyped up because some asshole called in a false report. In the millisecond that cop has to determine his intentions he could be fired upon himself.
I don’t trust all cops, and a bunch of them run around looking for action so to speak. Hind sight is 20-20. And when his left hand comes up there ain’t a lot of time to debate the issue.
walks and talks like a duck….who walks around with a ‘gun” in a store in 2014? someone who is not very bright. Told my 15 year old son about it. “what a dumb ass” was his response. Need I say more.
T-town, welcome aboard, and AMEN to your comments. While it’s sad about the kid, his own stupidity got him killed.
and fuck you too for defending a obvious racist comment and anti gun one at that too and making issue out of nothing.
That’s why I don’t usually bother reading these comments any more, csaaphill…
Some of these comments are so extremely STUPID and childish…better spend ones time in positive pursuits than listening to white-trash comments.
And I especially wouldn’t go to “Braveheart” (ha!) comments.
you didnt even watch the video did you they sell them there what else is he supposed to do with it if he’s gettign ready to purhase it?
nothing he did got him killed If you watched the vidoe he didnt have it when he walked in he went to where they are kept picked it up to buy and probably had more shopping to do so what else was he to do?
By your hipocrit and obvious racist remarks, and anti gun anyone by your standards getting ready to buy a bb gun should be gunned down then?
Ok dumb ass, don’t carry an unboxed gun of any sort, around any store, for any reason, that just might get you killed (as in this unfortunate incident) if you were considering the purchase of the gun, you put it back in the box, then feel free to walk around. If said gun does not have a box, you ask store personel to assist you in getting one that does. Please do not discount the fact of “it was just a bb gun” as they also can cause serious injury or possible death.
Anon, AMEN to your comments. Csaaphill sound slike a brain-dead troll.
If I were getting ready to buy a gun (and the store clerk didn’t put it in a box), I would feel its OK to walk around the store to purchase it at the check out counter…
Basically, if the store has things in boxes then you keep them in boxes until check out time. And if an item is NOT in a box, then you carry it like that- unboxed. People generally feel confident in stores’ policies.
The cops SHOULD be executed for murdering an unarmed person who was scrambling to get away from their killing range. YOU DON’T SHOOT SOMEONE WHO IS TRYING TO FLEE AN ARMED COP!!!
so just to clarify; you are walking down an aisle with BB guns, EVERY SINGLE ONE of them is in a box, except for one which has no packaging, barcode, tag, anything (and also happens to look like an assault rifle)…You would pick it up and just wander around the store, slinging it over your shoulder like pappies shotgun, using it to move things around on shelves, and carrying it as if you were about to use it. You are just as bright as this guy and have obviously never been in a situation like the cops were put in. It is a sad, unfortunate event, but the police are guilty of nothing here. He was running towards them for gods sake after dropping an assault rifle look alike…you’re so good you would have known it was a bb gun and he didn’t have a knife, box cutter, pistol while he was running at you after you ordered him to drop his rifle huh genius?
Csaaphill, I DID watch the video and I never played any race card against anyone. Crawford supposedly found that BB gun in a package that was opened by someone else. Had he picked up another one in an unopened package, I don’t think anything would’ve happened. Why do you think it’s OK for someone to go around in any kind of store waving a gun around, even if it’s fake, but somehow it’s wrong for anyone to become alarmed by such behavior? Are you saying that everyone who sees such behavior should become a psychic and try to correctly guess what’s going through his mind? Are you saying it’s OK for black people to commit crimes against anyone they choose and it’s wrong for anyone to challenge them on that? I’m curious. I’m having trouble understanding you.
IT WAS A BEE BEE GUN, BRAVEHEART! He probably thought of it as a toy!!! that’s why he was waving it around…
that looked like an assault rifle, and BB guns aren’t toys either, although im sure he had no intention of buying it and just wanted to play…If he meant to buy it he would have picked one up in a package that had a fucking bar code genius. That is why he is dead, poor judgment, idiocy and just plain nothing better to do with his time than wander around Wal-Mart carrying a gun he had no intention to purchase and nothing else
how did you explain it to your 15 yr old?
Who walks around with a gun in a store? Why all you white gun-toting carry crazies–none of whom got shot yet by any cops.
Good point, sharon!!! all these videos of “patriots” who carry REAL guns around– take them into restaurants, etc… none of these people on this board would say ANYTHING negative about that!!! that’s OK!!! But its not OK to carry around a toy be-be gun?!
We aren’t waving them in the air like idiots. Unlike this guy.
few things your dumb obviously racist ass fails notice about those ‘white gun-toting carry crazies’…when they do open carry marches at stores, 100% of the time they are openly advertised prior…to the police! and not all of them are white you racist puke. They certainly don’t walk in by themselves and wonder around a store carrying the weapon as if they are about to use it, which is what this dipshit did. I walk around with one concealed all of the time and if I saw that dumbass I would have drawn on him and if he did what he did, I too would have shot him and been cleared. The law is the law, his actions were overly idiotic. That doesn’t mean he deserved to die but cops are not liable when someone is this fucking stupid. He wanted to play with a gun and act like a bad ass…he got to do all that. If he meant to buy it he would have picked one up in a fucking box with a barcode like ALL the other ones…
@T-town.
In an OPEN carry state such as Ohio(where this took place).?
ANYONE legally able.
Jim Smith, walking around in any store with a gun, even a BB gun, waving it in the air is just plain stupid, dangerous and unacceptable. How was the caller or the cops supposed to know what was really going through that kid’s mind? What if the kid had REALLY been planning a massacre? What would you have those cops do, just let him get away with something horrible? THINK BEFORE YOU POST A COMMENT.
Where was Walmart’s Loss prevention or security? There looks to be long guns at the sporting counter, If the firearms were there why wasn’t it manned?
Walmart bears a portion of the responsibility.
BB Guns are not locked up at Wal Mart, only firearms. BB guns come in a cardboard box on a rack as they are sold more as toys than guns.
I’d say AT LEAST charged with making a false report.
Crawford set himself up for this mess when he was going around the store brandishing the weapon like a fool.
When the police confronted him, they had to assume the worst. The police had no idea if Crawford had another weapon – maybe they thought he was reaching for another when he dove. When he dropped the gun and dove, it looked like he was trying to hide or escape. I can see why the grand jury didn’t indict. Very unfortunate situation. Crawford’s foolishness triggered the citizen complaint and police response.
well when you have only one tool
and it’s a gun
what do you expect?
500 Innocent Americans Killed by Cops Each Year
http://www.thedailysheeple.com/500-innocent-americans-killed-by-cops-each-year_122013
Americans Killed by Cops Now Outnumber Americans Killed in Iraq War
http://thefreethoughtproject.com/americans-killed-cops-outnumber-americans-killed-iraq-war/
face it AMerIKa
we’re a police state
and look at the frickign comments on here defendign this they’re the ones doing it too blame them as well.
swat them when one gets a chance!
FYI Swatign is a thing anti gunners are doing now days and video game players when they get pissed off for losing a game.
but anti guners do it to try and change things and disarm us beware.
When all you have is a hammer
everything looks like a nail.
@Masgrande
If you find yourself looking for reasons why this country is swirling round the toilet bowl while descending into tyranny, look no further than yourself!
See Something, Say Something.
“see something say something” I know this is a long draw in the sheeple herd, but lets try a different approach..”see something..THINK….then say something, a kid a BB gun in wal mart (gosh thats an unusual situation (sarcasm!) I can only ponder which of the respondents is the most indoctrinated, the serve and protect who truly have reason to fear for their lives or ‘ if they say it must be true the gub told me so”
If some idiot pointed even a toy gun at me the auto connect with MPD dispatch would be the first thing i did,
@Kulafarmer:
If that is your response; “You sir are a cowardly son of a bi**h!”
Why yes, yes i may be,
Better than bein a limp dick like you though pekker head
Kula,
Living in a gun free zone like HI, i don’t blame you for calling the police in a situation like that.
I think yourmotherwaswrong has been hijacked by eisen.
That is the only way to go from zero to schmuck that quickly.
🙂
Bazinga, I’m not sure what’s up with YMWW, but he’s mistaken on this incident. I’m trying to be civil with him but he’s really pushing it by showing his ass to everyone.
no your the one who’s wrong this kid did nothng wrong
or are you brain washed into thinking it’s against the law to go to a store that sells bb guns and walk around while shoping with it?
or are you a liberal who’s trying to brainwash people into thinking it’s wrong to buy a bb gun and maybe have more shopping to do?
or a hiporit conservative racist who can only side with leo at each and every time even when your the one there after?
I didn’t see anything in that video other than a guy who picked up a bb gun to buy and obviously had more shopping to do or whatever and talk to his girldfriend ont he phone while doing so.
If your trying to make it a crime to shop and buy a bb gun and do normal things while shoping just because it’s a bb gun your one sad case for an american because your making me hope for shtf.
Guns are not toys,
As a kid i was taught how to handle all manner of weapons by my Marine Dad,
Muzzle discipline at all times, you dont point it at anything you dont intend to kill.
BB guns, Pellet guns, same thing, they ARE DANGEROUS!
A cop responding to a call has no way of knowing some assholes intent.
We were told to ALWAYS NEVER POINT ANY GUN AT ANYONE!
Only time it was ok was the shiny little paper cap six guns we had when we were 8!
And even those my Dad would stop us and give us the speech about guns and safety then smile and send us on our way with a wink and a have fun,
So in a public place, NOBODY has ANY BUSINESS POINTING ANY SORT OF GUN AT ANYONE!!!!
JUST PLAIN STUPID, and OBVIOUSLY IT GETS PEOPLE KILLED!!!!
Kula OUT
back to my gear swap
@Kulafarmer
“Pekker?”
I believe it’s spelled “Pecker.”
BTW… “Peckerhead” is one word, not two.
YMWW, sorry but I have to disagree with you on this one. Anyone who points a gun at me, whether it’s real or not, better just expect to get his/her ass blown away. I’ll dial 911 only after the fact to tell them to come clean up the mess. When someone points a weapon at you, you don’t have time to think about how to respond to that. You have to act AND I MEAN ACT DAMNED QUICK IF YOU WANT TO LIVE. That Crawford kid screwed up royally and now he’s dead because of what he did. YOU JUST DON’T GO WALKING AROUND IN ANY STORE WAVING A GUN, EVEN IF IT’S FAKE, AND NOT EXPECT SOMETHING BAD TO HAPPEN TO YOU. If I was that cop and got spooked like that, I believe I would’ve reacted the same way. How was that cop supposed to know what that kid would really do. I’ll stand with the cops on this one. It’s tragic that the kid is dead but he brought that on himself.
the renegade braveheart says:
“It’s tragic that the kid is dead but he brought that on himself.”
Yeah???
And if it happens to you, I suppose we could opine: “It’s tragic that the kid is dead but he brought that on himself.”
I don’t get you people! You talk “freedom and liberty” out of one side of your mouth, and then out of the other, you support blatant government thugscrum abuses (murder).
Little wonder this country is going down the shitter!
YMWW, did you even watch the video? This is one incident that’s NOT a case of police brutality. What would you have the cops do? what if that kid had brought a REAL weapon into that wallyworld with intent to kill? If I had been in that cop’s shoes, I would’ve done the same thing? If you expect the cops to be psychic, you’re living in a fantasy world. this is one shooting that was justified. Let’s see YOU go walking around in a store waving a gun and see what happens to YOU. Hope you live to talk about it.
YMWW, BTW, I’m also having trouble understanding YOU, so the feeling is mutual on that one item. Why do you think it’s OK for the kid to engage in irrational behavior, but somehow it’s WRONG for anyone to react to it? I’m curious.
I have been able to see a portion of the video thus far (youtube is having issues)and from what I’ve seen and also gleaned from the comments here and other related articles, I think the police came in a little “hot” with incomplete and erroneous information.
Instead of using the tools available i.e. the video surveillance system and P.A. and quietly evacuating the store while another officer shadowed the suspect. The officers chose to go in with guns blazing. One thing that Mac’s article doesn’t say is that a bystander had a heart attack and died due to the commotion.
There were other ways to handle this, and cooler heads didn’t prevail.
YMWW, I’m still waiting for a response from you. did the cat get your tongue or can you not answer it at all?
I am with you YMWW 100%.
Good post!
all of those who are here siding with “police brutality” on this incident… I suppose you too would you all let your sons & daughters waive around a toy gun even with police on the scene.
what ever happend to accessing a situation before you run head long into the line of fire ,while we’re on the subject of “what if’s ” what if it was a real gun ,and what if it was a real bad guy ,im betting they would of got there dumb asses shot .while we’re on the what if thing , what if he was mentaly fucked up ,or what if he was just some dumb ass kid doing some dumb shit ,why take the time to try to even find out what was going on,just run in the store as fast as you can and shoot it ,dont matter what it is just shoot it,must be the new teaching curve at the accademy ,just shoot it, yea ,just a dunb ass kid ,oh ,and some ones darling son ,i can remember doing a lot of dumb shit growing up ,thank God the cops had brains and appreciation for life back then ,if it was my son id cut there fucking thoats while the slept (including the big bad marine)
Yep, the cops are militarized attack dogs. It’s been this way since for decades, but now they act like they’re in Afghanistan.
Its because the young guy was black, ymww…
I’ve been coming to this site for a long time and I’ve noticed (its glaringly obvious!!!) that brave heart and some others TAKE UP for the victim is he’s white… and if he’s black, they blame him “for getting himself killed”…really ridiculous!
no the young guy acted like an idiot, but yeah he got himself killed, just like the black kid in Ferguson, for acting like an idiot, and just like countless other black youth with little to no parental guidance and/or control, they act like idiots while they wait for their turn to move out of their moms gobt housing so they can go get their own gobt housing then talk shit about all the people that provide it for them, go rob gas stations and rough up store clerks, walk down the middle of a road and when an officer tells you to get on the sidewalk tell him to fuck off, or just pick up a random opened weapon, with no markings whatsoever, not even a fucking barcode in order to purchase it, then roam around the store with it slung over your shoulder and point it in random directions with you hand on the pistol grip…yeah not their fault all you racist puke
omfg no he was not all you see is him talkign to his girlfriend and talking with his hands which we all do that’s it. your making natural actions into something larcenous and that simply is not the case not here.
One those shopers never looked a bit scared woudn’t you think they would if he was doing all the thing you say he was?
Two people talk with their hands while talking so ya he was moving the one arm around when talking but that’s perfectly natural not bad.
Fuckers like you are taking everyday things and making them into something to call the cops over. God forbid anyone who walks and chews gum at the same time you’d call the cops on them because it looks suspicious.
FYI to anyone watching these conforstations heres where your agenda conspiracy lies is with people like this fucker here!
And if I’m downrange from your target, and you miss, tough for me, right? I suppose I’m not allowed to be armed, nor to return fire if I’m being shot at? You get to start shooting at me regardless of where I might be standing, and I don’t get to protect myself, right?
Just trying to understand the rules of engagement. Seems like I don’t have the right to live. Interesting approach.
Basically, the government sucks, John– they do nothing to help us anymore, they are corrupt as hell, they are not trustworthy, and its a shame they are dominating/ruling over us….
“Laws” aren’t real laws, since they don’t abide by them themselves. What we have are commands, which we have to obey or they will kill/imprison/fine us… we don’t need no fu… govt.
See videos of “Josie the Outlaw”. (Over coming oppression).
Walmart is a store that sells guns. The victim is waving an unboxed gun around (how could he buy it without a UPC). The cops get a call that someone – in a gun store – is waving a gun around. The cops (or anyone else) would go into that with their fingers on the trigger. Once they spot you and yell ‘drop the weapon’ you better freeze. Instead he ducks around the corner? Then gets up again? Strike 3 and you’re out! For all the pansies who want to surprise someone who is pointing a gun at them (especially in a gun store), and take a few seconds to identify whether it is a toy, they had better like pushing up daisies – especially after the SHTF.
your an idiot or didn’t even watch the video. no where did he do that but guess your an anti gunner and true facts dont matter just say what you want and manipulate those that don’t know any better huh?
Where in the video that show the police had the information the kid just standing around and talking to his girlfriend. They response to a situation as described by caller and did what they thought was correct. That said, they could have quietly clear the store before confronting “armed person” and try to resolve the situation.
The sad truth is that it’s an unfortunate incident. What he was doing may have been innocent, but as we have seen numerous times before, that doesn’t mean other people would interpret it that way. In the end, the cop probably thought he was lunging towards him to attack and so he made a split second decision. Many of us who concealed carry may well have done the same given similar circumstances. No one ever knows what they would really do in a given situation until they are in it. Anything else is just speculation.
If anything, this shows that when you are confronted by a cop with a weapon drawn, every move you make needs to be slow and deliberate. It’s the only way to have any hope of diffusing a dangerous situation. If you are not a threat, you had better act that way.
Winston, AMEN to your comments. The kid brought all of this on himself and paid the ultimate price for his stupidity. if he had left the BB gun alone in the first place, he would still be alive.
I won’t be that harsh. Had he just put it down slowly and followed the officer’s instructions it’s likely that they would have had no reason to shoot. If you react quickly though, and the officer already had reason to believe you were up to no good (hence the drawn weapon), what is the cop supposed to think? For all he knows, you are about to pull another weapon and are just stalling for seconds to do so. I feel bad for the kid and his family. No one should have to lose their life over a misunderstanding. My prayers go out to them.
how? where?
The fricking cops shot like a split second after confronting him so how was he to just simply drop it as you say?
What i saw was him like wtf and try to run which is a very natural and human responce. If they weren’t shooting almost instantly he would have had time to act the way you say and respond as they say but almost any human in this situation is going to act the same way and dont say they dont’ because what i seen was a very natural reaction that any human would do. but they didnt give him even a second to even explain or react just started shooting.
I wish the jury would of indicted the cops and Ritchie too for if it wasn’t for his exagerated call the cops would not be all hoped up to shoot in the first place.
I blame Ritchie first, for he clearly is a anti gunner who thinks people shouldn’t be buying bb guns that look like modern sporting guns/aka assault weapons which they are not for the truly only assault weapon is a fully automatic gun not semi.
Ritchie is at fault about 60% cops 40% for they didn’t even give this guy time to even comply just start shooting.
Did YOU watch the video? It wasn’t a split second from the time to confront until he went down at the end. it was 3-4. There was diving around getting up then going down again. The hand motion I spoke of was a split second movement as he started to stand up.
You guys are idiots. The suspect had no weapon when he was shot. Period. after following instructions. The lesson here is cops can shoot you and kill you and get away with it. All cop had to do was deck the guy. Bad cop. Trigger happy cop. Has no business carrying a weapon himself.
Young mad was murdered. State should pay restitution to family. Period.
Also, echo or voice path probably made the young man think there was a real shooter there and coming up behind him. Probably why he ran. Or heard someone say “shoot him” or a gun click.
I don’t have the greatest hearing. And if I wasn’t paying attention I would not know some officer was talking to me. There was a case in NYC where an elderly man crossing the street was attacked by a cop because he didn’t realize the cop was calling to him. The old guy had nothing in his hands otherwise the cop would have shot him instead of banging his head into a wall.
If you’re in a store, talking on the phone–and not even facing in the direction of the cops–how would you know what was even happening?
Not necessarily true, Winston.
In Delaware, a VET who had served 2 terms in Iraq was just sitting on his front porch and was approached by goons in black outfits who tazered him hundreds of times, killing him. He was trying to raise his arms up in surrender but was killed anyway. ALl he had in his pocket was a pocket knife… they suspected him of selling marijuana.
Yes, but that is not the incident in question here and so has little to no relevance to this discussion. Every incident needs to be taken on a case by case basis as every case involves different individuals and circumstances. I am in no way saying that cops do not make mistakes. Nor am I saying that cops are universally good guys. They aren’t. However, in the majority of cases you will not get shot for slowly complying with the officer’s demands. Since this would work in the majority of cases, it is the most logical course of action. I’m just not going to jump on the cops every single time a shooting happens. They make honest (but tragic) mistakes, just like any other human being who is put in what they may perceive as a life or death situation.
Masgrande, welcome aboard, and I have to agree with your assessment. If Crawford had simply left that damned BB gun alone in the first place, none of this would’ve happened. I have to side with the police on this one. It’s unfortunate that someone had to die, but the police weren’t sure what to expect when they answered that call. My retired police relatives told me they would’ve done the same thing had they been in that situation. Crawford was a fool and paid for his mistake with his life. If DOJ gets involved in this one, the 2 top black scammers, Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson, will be right behind them. The New Black Panther Party might also show up. And all the while they’ll still ignore the thousands of black people KILLED BY OTHER BLACK PEOPLE all over this country every year.
left that damned BB gun alone in the first place
so now it’s against the law to buy a BB gun then?
EXACTLY. Wal-Mart SELLS guns. If Wal-Mart sells guns and a person is there evaluating a gun. Then murdering them for doing so should be a capital offense. Imagine if you or I had pulled out a concealed carry and shot that young man!
Plus, the person who called 9-1-1 and filed a false claim should be at least confronted in civil court. Their dishonest actions lead to an innocent young man being murdered.
Why the heck wasn’t the gun in a box?
“had he just left the bb gun alone”?…really? so, I can’t handle any object before I buy it?…here’s a hypo.situation for you braveheart…..you go to your favorite store to buy that new “whatever”…a knife, a pair of pants, a pack of gum…you pick up said item and turn it over in your hands…..a busy-body is lurking nearby and calls the cops because he/she/it feels “scared” because the bad man might put on those pants and the button might fly off and hit someone or the bad man might chew some of that gum, blow a bubble and get gum in the busy-body’s hair………the cops come (weapons out-’cause there’s a terrorist with gum-hell, it’s c-4, that’s what the 911 caller said)…cops come, shoot you,(we’re all gonna miss you, braveheart) grand jury says ok……..why didn’t you just leave the gum alone?
Oh yeah masgrande, it makes perfect sense to go “brandish” a BB gun in public, WITH A REAL GUN HIDDEN IN YOUR WAISTBAND… that’s some common core thinking for sure. Maybe the guy was just saving the best for last, right? Or he had to improvise because his glock was out of bullets?
LOL…stupid sheep.
Where?
So were to not buy a bb gun anymore and maybe have more shopping to do before going up to the cash register to pay for it?
is that how this is done now?
Fuck you yur one of those swaters and need swated yourself fuck off.
Where?
he can’t buy a simple BB gun no more without you people calling the cops? is that it now?
you sound like one that swated him and deserve to be swated yourself.
for your assanine comments on trying to tell people that one can no longer go to buy a bb gun and maybe have more shopping to do and walk around with thier item they plan on buying fuck you people.
Mac, I’ve viewed the video but to be fair, that’s not enough information in which to decide whether an indictment would be warranted.
I would like to know the content of the statements of the officers and of the 911 caller. I have read other reports that are unsubstantiated that the 911 caller may have given “bad” information when he called 911 thus heightening the intensity factor of the responders.
Also, lets not forget the laws of the state in which this occurred. Is “open carry” allowed?
Based on the video alone, it gives the impression that this shooting should not have occurred.
One must remember there were a number of factors that were at play in this incident for all involved parties.
Mindset for all in at the top of the list. For law enforcement, the militarization of forces comes to mind. The “see something say something” can be interpreted to mean “active shooter” for responding personnel.
Finally, I for one, would much rather have the law enforcement officer of yesterday then the current cadre of law enforcement officer.
IMHO.
When my father and his brothers were growing up in small town America he said a cop would have walked right up to you, gun, knife, bat -whatever, and told you to put it down. Any move other than compliance would have seen an instant hail-storm of punches beating the living crap out of you because when he was growing, “men” acted like, “men.”
Now they’re pretty much scared of their own shadows.
I wonder if the guy who (falsely) reported this is sleeping well at night.
Beau, how was that guy who dialed 911 supposed to know what that kid would really do? What if that kid had REALLY been planning something horrible? From a distance even a BB gun can appear to be real. You almost have to get right on top of it to tell if it’s real or fake. If I’d been a CCW holder in there and encountered that kid, I would’ve also assumed the worst. Any one of my retired police relatives would’ve done the same thing and they’re ‘old school’ cops, not the current breed we have out there.
Do a search on this and you’ll see the ‘former Marine’ has changed his story in significant ways. I would still like to know how he sleeps at night.
I tire of hearing ‘former marine’ or ‘veteran’ as though it convey some special status. You’re not a hero just because you put on a uniform and went to some other country and slaughtered the enemies of banksters (while making a fortune for the likes of Raytheon).
The “special status” conveyed here, is that of all the sheep walking the aisles of wally world, A TRAINED MARINE, a person who should’ve been as familiar with small arms as he was with his own boots, who should’ve been drilled to be able to field strip their rifle IN THEIR SLEEP, would make such a mistake.
It’s not as if he was several blocks down the street, under heavy fire or in the dark.
Of all people, a marine should’ve known better.
That’s just how I see it.
The cops are mostly stupid and scared of everything, but they could’ve handled it differently as well.
he’s not even a ex nothing he washed out couldn’t make it or got caught lying on his paperwork.
so he’s a wana be hero trying to make up for his not making a marine.
they don’t make marines like they used to
They don’t make cops the way they used to. There are ten jobs more dangerous than being a cop, none of them allow you to commit murder out of fear. You are 8 times more likely to be killed by a cop than a terrorist, your children can be stolen by CPS for letting them play outside alone or in a local park, and no one is responsible. Cowards.
Considering the numbers of unarmed people shot by police (mistaken cell phones, computer controllers, “furtive hand movement”)it’s not surprising the kid dropped the bb gun and dove out of the way. Suspects have been shot while fully subdued and IN HANDCUFFS and I bet most of the Police Cheerleading Squad in here supports that as well.
Here’s a short vid of British Police handling a guy, brandishing a machete and a hammer, chasing cops with it.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/law-and-order/10516818/Bedford-machete-attack-captured-on-CCTV.html
And this one:http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=british+police+capture+machete+wielder&FORM=VIRE1#view=detail&mid=CE8CEC3A89902A7481D2CE8CEC3A89902A7481D2
But keep supporting the public equivalent of Murder Inc.
The guy who jumped the WH fence was a former war hero too.
The kid was walking around for quite a while in a casual manner. I think the caller overreacted.
Was it stupid to have the BB gun? A little, but not illegal.
The cops could have viwed the security cameras first to assess the situation.
They should have handled the situation by quietly getting people away from the supposed threat and then using the PA system to have him drop the gun. Their aggressive approach could have trigged an exchange of bullets with innocents injured if he WAS a bad guy.
That would have been the sensible way to go? Maybe the cops were looking for a little excitement so they decided to play a 1st person shooter game, thus ending an innocent kid’s young life over a BB gun?
Yep.
I don’t believe the caller (Ritchie) overeacted, I think he is a trouble maker who used 911 to make a false report which resulted in some ones death.
nope you didn’t i knew you hadn’t watched it but now you confirmed it you sir are making an issue out of nothing or tring to make people think that buying a bb gun and maybe carrying around warrants people calling the cops.
No sir not on my watch that wont happen for each and every incident I will be telling the truth and not allowing your archaic comments to go unchallenged.
this is at bravestupid above! not sixpack or whoever this commet is comine under.
Csaaphill, you’re just another fool who doesn’t “get it”. If Crawford had picked up another BB gun in an UNOPENED package, I’m sure nothing would’ve happened. Crawford used some bad judgment.
Maybe the cops used some bad judgement?
Csaaphill, you wouldn’t know what truth was if it bit you on your ass.
I just don’t know, Braveheart…. the LAST time I looked at a BB gun, the fucking thing had a …. wait for it…. wait…. A FUCKING ORANGE PAINTED BARREL!!!!!!!!! was the cop AND the “marine” color blind?
And how do we know that wasn’t the last model of that bb gun so he was going to buy it as is out of the box
BB guns (Like the Crossman that LOOKS like an AR-15) THAT WALLY WORLD SELLS, DOES NOT HAVE A ORANGE MUZZLE! So all you nay sayers demanding the cops know better, look at the “Weapon” before commenting how everyone should know its fake…
http://mobile.walmart.com/#ip/Crosman-Tactical-.177-Air-Rifle/19426351?type=search
Do you see a orange tipped barrel? Its not an airsoft gun, its a bb gun, capable of injuring, and POSSIBLY killing someone.
The saddest part of this I can only call a series of bad choices…
1. An individual picks up a bb gun NOT in its original package, walking through the store, pointing it at people / objects
2. The “Marine” didn’t know the “gun” was only a bb gun, because he washed out and didn’t finish his training on weapons I.D. (plus, beyond 25′, the gun looks real)
3. Cops are ingrained to come home every night, (imagine that) at the expense of casualties in the public.
Its a tragedy, but this was a tragic event, and they do happen…
Prepper Tip of the Day
Tips from MSM: How Not to Get Raped By a Police Officer
http://www.activistpost.com/2014/09/tips-from-msm-how-not-to-get-raped-by.html
ok
so today’s tip ain’t that great
He was murdered by the police due to incompetence from the police.
Peter, no, the kid should’ve left the damned BB gun alone and nothing would’ve happened to him. Are you saying it’s OK to walk around in ANYONE’S store waving a gun, whether real or fake, and expect everything to be OK? No, that is UNACCEPTABLE, STUPID, AND DANGEROUS BEHAVIOUR. The police did the only thing that could’ve been done. The KID was incompetent, NOT THE POLICE.
for one bravestupid he wasn’t waving it around irtationaly as you say he had it to buy just hadn’t went to the cash regiter yet why is it you fuckers always stick to this he was waving it around when clearly he was not.
dont give me shit about at the aisle either for he was taling to his girlfriend and fyi people do talk with thier hands while talking or do you not kno that>
FYI YES THE PIGS ARE WERE INCOMPETENT see I can cap to fucker.
Csaaphill, OK, that’s it. I’m through trying to be civil to you. You keep using crude language and can’t even spell half of the words you post. I’m sure you would stand up and support all of the crime that takes place within your community. What about all of the BLACK PEOPLE WHO ARE KILLED BY OTHER BLACK PEOPLE, NOT WHITE PEOPLE, IN THIS COUNTRY EVERY YEAR. YES, BLACK-ON-BLACK CRIME IS WHAT I’M TALKING ABOUT. THAT ISSUE NEVER GETS THE KIND OF ATTENTION IT SHOULD FROM THE CORPORATE MEDIA. WHERE IS THE OUTRAGE OVER THEIR DEATHS? WHY DOESN’T ANYONE PROTEST AGAINST THAT? YOU CAN ALWAYS COUNT ON THE USDOJ, AL SHARPTON, JESSE JACKSON, NAACP, ETC. TO COME OUIT OF THE CLOSET FOR ANY WHITE-ON-BLACK SITUATION BUT WHEN A BLACK-ON-BLACK SITUATION OCCURS, THEY ARE NOWHERE TO BE FOUND. SO IF YOU WANT TO CONTINUE BEING A STUPID IGNORANT BOY THAT IS YOUR CHOICE SO GO MAKE LOVE TO YOURSELF, FOOL!
The police didn’t do the ONLY thing that could have been done.
They failed miserably at assessing the situation and only managed to escalate.
The kid’s body language was relaxed, he wasn’t skulking the aisles looking for an avenue of opportunity.
How do you expect a 22 year old kid to react to being confronted by people with at least one “tacticool” weapon and shouting instructions. I bet he was scared shitless and his flight instinct took over..
The officers, so jacked up on adrenaline, weren’t exactly a shining example of restraint either i.e. shooting the kid after he was down.
This whole situation was COMPLETELY preventable if Walmart would have had an employee at the sporting goods counter or loss prevention paying attention to that fancy-ass camera system they have.
“The kids body language was relaxed…” Are you kidding me? That’s zero indication of intent or anything else meaningful. Have you seen the school surveillance video of the two cowards at Columbine walking around casually, drinking pop in the lunchroom, and behaving exactly as you describe?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_QKbIb8wcz0
Interesting documentary about nomads in Amerikkka. There are three million of them, of which the vast amajority are retired old people in RVs.
What’s that have to do with the price of eggs? 😉
I guess it would depend on the eggs..
Ssshhhh. We’re trying to keep that quiet.
The truth of it is that many young professionals are choosing to go “nomadic” if their career choice allows the to telecommute.
App developers, web designers and so forth make up a pretty good percentage of that group..
Then you have your workampers, people that travel the country doing many different jobs such as ranch work, harvesting, camp hosting, gate guarding, traveling fairs and shows etc. And alot of us aren’t retired
If your interested, look up “The Slabs” sometime. Off grid living in the california desert.
Gonna set a record for thumbs down on this one..
But while the current trend is to blame cops at most turns and pick apart decisions they make in seconds (or less), I tend to think bad decisions a small percentage of them make, is then stereotyped into most or all of them.
This guy seemed oblivious to his actions, (wielding/swinging around a real looking firearm) while talking on his cell. How much responsibility does Wal-Mart share for having or selling real looking rifles outside a box or package?
This “militarization” of the police anger is mostly, (again, mostly) displaced. Have crime trends not gotten more threatening and deadly in the last decade or so? Are criminals not confronting officers with gunfire at an increased rate? Are the firearms criminals are confronting officers with not more deadly than the six shooters from decades ago? Have school shootings, (with rifles, assault weapons, etc) causing more and more deaths not increased?
How foolish and weak did LAPD feel during and after the North Hollywood Bank Robbery?
Most times I see the riot/military equipment get broken out by them is IN RESPONSE to something. Shooting, major crime, or a large amount of people becoming very violent, (Fergueson?).
I’m most concerned when the Feds roll with that equipment because you know some fustercluck like Waco or Ruby Ridge is about to go down. Typically not local LE.
It is tragic because this kid died because he was not intending to cause anyone harm. But while we get to sit comfortably looking at the video, its hard to second the officer’s actions given the nature of the information he had, the fact the kid was holding a real looking rifle, and then his actions once he saw the officer.. Just sayin’..
Silver Lodge, I have to agree. The kid’s stupidity speaks for itself. That’s what got him killed. We’ll never know what was really going through his mind at the time. I’m REFUSING to second-guess the cops’ action on this incident. They did the only thing that could’ve been done. What if that had been a REAL ACTIVE-SHOOTER SITUATION? I wish these people criticizing the cops would stop and think before making a stupid post.
No. The kid was walking around for quite a while. The cops came in like Bulls. You probably think they should use 15 man SWAT teams to serve warrents and take custody of baby deer.
Don’t forget, the meter maids need an MRAP to write parking tickets too…
Don’t recall anyone hearing or seeing any shots from this ‘active shooter’? Least not until the cops arrived and did the shooting?
Silver Lodge, BTW, I’ll probably get a lot of red thumbs myself, but I don’t give a shit. I stand by my comments. I’m not here to please other people. That’s not part of my DNA.
If a BB gun is so f***ing dangerous and it can get you killed at Wally World then it needs locked up.
Good thing it wasn’t Black Friday.
Ms X, cops have shot people dead over cell phones, lit cigarettes, ipods and coffee cups…shall we start locking those things up too? Shall we put away anything some stupid, scared cop could kill people over?
Maybe all shopping should be mail order only, that way, there wouldn’t be any more opportunities for scared cops to play with their guns in stores…
sixpack,
I was being sarcastic. This was an unfortunate incident that shouldn’t have happened in the first place.
Then we both think alike.
At the Wal-Mart stores that I have been in all guns where they be air or not is locked.Most of the stores put the air rifles on cable with trigger lock.If I wanted to handle a certain rifle I have to get a clerk to unlock the damn thing.
No stores in ohio lock up bb and pellet guns. No biggie, most of us know better than to run around pointing them at things. I picked up a full size 1911 replica BB gun at Gander a few weeks back. Looked and operated just like the real deal, bought it to practice room clearing and draw and fire around the house/yard. I unboxed it to check it out first but I treated it just like any other ” firearm” when I did, and rebooted it before leaving the isle. It’s a bad habit to get out of safety routine. Once we stopped teaching our kids firearms basics and responsibility, that’s where much of our current issues stem from IMHO.
Wal-Mart bears no responsibility for the fact that somebody unpackaged their merchandise (in an attempt at shoplifting?) and some idiot picked it up (remember, a GUN), walked around with it, and tried to evade police (who pretty much always carry guns, no suprise there), and died doing it. Go to a gun show and mimic the ‘kid’. How do you think that’ll turn out?
Call me rasis, but blacks often try to confront police. Cops expect such behavior. The guy with the gun normally wins such a confrontation.
That’s what it looked like to me, like the kid was trying to casually conceal it under his clothes somehow, but it was too long. It looked exactly like a botched shoplifting incident to me.
Actually no. Violent crime with firearms is down about 50% from its high of a decade or two ago. It’s just much much much more propaganda’ized now. It sells page views, add impressions and papers to splash teasers about an incident involving a firearm which builds the impression it’s worse than ever when the reality is it’s lower than ever.
The majority of firearm events if I’m not misremembering the CDC report are suicides.
With all the craziness infecting many police departments and the many news stories about trigger happy or even brutal cops, and after the Ferguson thing, much less simple firearms protocol in public spaces…
All I can think of is, “You can’t fix stupid”, and that goes for both LEO’s and people. A situation that could have been completely avoided if the kid had been taught common sense and/or the cop less eager (note him running in full tilt with weapon out and likely safety thumbed off). I didn’t hear any dialog between them – was there any??
LONER, if the kid had never touched that BB gun to begin with, nothing would’ve happened. The kid was the one who screwed up, NOT the cops.
So a kid goes into the local Walmart and let’s say he decides to buy an air rifle? So he gets the said rifle then goes on about whatever shopping he has left? Why does carrying the air rifle around the store give the police the right to kill you? I have bought several air rifles from Walmart and carried them around because I had more shopping to do? Damn! I guess I was lucky the police didn’t come in and ventilate me with their AR-15s? That’s BS and anybody who doesn’t see that is either obtuse or in denial!
Were those said guns you bought torn out of the box? Were you for some idiotic reason wandering around the store with it? Even though the kid was not breaking any laws, common logical sense should have prevailed. Still a tragedy.
Kids are allowed to be stupid, we even expect them to be, but the man we trust with a gun, a badge and a free pass to use them both, is NOT allowed such lapses. Cops are supposed to be TRAINED… kids are not.
What kind of idiots are we, if we don’t hold the man with the gun to a higher standard of responsibility, than some dumb kid at wally world?
How safe does it make you feel if we don’t?
I highly doubt Walmart has microphones near all their cameras and unless the officer was wearing a body mic you wont hear any dialogue. how is the officer stupid? can you tell the difference between an air soft gun and a real rifle from 30 feet away. I guess he should have gotten shot to verify it was a real gun before engaging.
As a civilian I’m sure you have completely different ideas on rules of engagement when it comes to protecting yourself or your family. If I was off duty, Had this kid pointed that gun at my child or my wife I would have engaged him. He isn’t in the sporting section where all the other guns are or with a Walmart employee. He is by himself in the corner of the store.
That’s ok, ill keep doing my job and respecting the constitution while you all belittle and second guess every fucking action of police instead of blaming this complete jack ass for probably trying to look like a bad ass thug from a rap video.
Good point about leaving the sporting goods department. How many here think it would be a good idea to take a gun from an employee and walk around the store with it?
How many people here think the employee would LET THEM walk away from the counter with a real gun? It still looks to me like the kid was shoplifting, and doin’ a pretty poor job of it at that.
Last I heard, misdemeanor shoplifting was not a capital offense.
There is no “BB gun counter” at wal mart. He picked it up off the shelf……
Cant fix stupid,
But apparently you can kill it!
Kulafarmer, I’ve got your six concerning YMWW. He doesn’t understand this situation at all. Like you said, can’t fix stupid. Damned sure can’t fix stupid like YMWW.
braveheart
looks to me like we need to rethink that one.
Looks like you really can fix stupid. Shoot em dead, like the cop did, then you got a real permanent fix.
You just aint thinkin this one through clearly.
How about a swat team busts through your doors some day thinking your a lone wolf? Theres a bunch of your comments here where you spout off what you plan to do if this or if that. We dont have the real right to free speech anymore and the cops say so. Whats stopping them from singling out someone like you w/ a no knock one day? Stupid is as stupid does. Does that mean your stupid earns cops the right to kill you for what you say here?
Calgagus, I understand your point and I know you mean well. Maybe you’re right to a certain degree. Maybe the cops could’ve done something different. Maybe Wallyworld’s in-house security could’ve done something first. I’m not at my best right now. 2 nights ago I got some bad news. One of my brothers-in-law was killed in an armed robbery outside of a supermarket. The robber took his wallet with only $5 cash, 2 credit cards, and a debit card, and just gunned him down like a dog. So you can imagine the kind of mood I’ve been in since then. Calgagus, you’re right. thanks for setting me straight. I don’t mean any harm.
Braveheart, accept my condolences for your family loss. Losing someone is bad enough but when its from violence, its all the worse. Cant imagine the mood your in and cant say I know how you feel but just know youll be in my thoughts and our family prayers this week.
Hope we all get some more definition on this Walmart shooting in the near future. Was thinking about this off and on yesterday.
You take care and take some time off to grieve. Well be here solving the worlds problems when you get back.
If you see something say something.
http://youtu.be/hBcY4216dQI
Frank, I saw the video, so I’m saying something about it. A LOT about it.
Kulafarmer says:
“Cant fix stupid.”
You’ve got that right!
BTW… When was the last time you looked into a mirror?
Huh?
@YMWW,
I think that could obviously be said to a lot of patriot impersonators.
You stand more of a chance to be killed by a “police officer” or some representative of government, than by being killed by one of those so-called “terrorists.”
These PSYCHO-COPS (brain-washed by anti second amendment training and conditioning) killed a man wielding a toy “air soft” weapon… not a BB or pellet gun.
This death is the result of gun control hysteria, committed by political enforcers (police) who have practically no accountability for their actions, protected by systems and laws created by the political elite.
If you or I shot someone wielding an air-soft gun–we’d be indicted, convicted and sent to prison… then our property and bank accounts seized in civil actions.
Police face no such consequences–they are indemnified and protected by their political masters… even when they commit outright crimes. You have little or no recourse against these thugs and thieves.
As seen in this video–the thugs/cops overreacted and murdered this guy over the claims of some dope who called in on the phone. They murdered this guy because of all the anti-firearm propaganda pumped into their pea-brains during training.
he was murdered because of a ex u.s. ebonic marine.
this ex u.s. ebonic marines lack of situational awareness got a innocent civilian killed, shot down like a rabid dog.
gotta wonder how many other innocent civilians are killed, suffer needlessly due to ex u.s. ebonic marines utter ignorance , ill training and psychosis.
r.g.
Stupid is what stupid does. That’s all I got to say about that.
2 things here I want to address:
1. The rule of deadly force must ALWAYS be justified.
Not theorized, postulated or second-guessed. If the perp has dropped their so-called weapon and has NO OTHER WEAPONS visible, than deadly force is NOT authorized. PERIOD. You cover the perp while your backup makes the takedown and handcuff. You DO NOT shoot first and then handcuff them after you’ve already discharged your service weapon. OR you use NON-LETHAL means to further subdue the perp, and only if required. Lethal force is ALWAYS supposed to be the means of LAST resort, not first. Who the hell ‘trained’ these monkeys?
I don’t care if you feared for your safety and pissed your damn pants. Keep shooting un-armed people and pretty soon they are going to start walking up to your police cruisers and shooting you in the face through your window.
2. Wal-mart (and others) are going to STOP carrying BB guns, ammo and ANYTHING that could be considered a ‘weapon’. You know…to make their sheep, I mean customers, feel ‘safe’. Don’t want anymore 12 year olds playing with the BB guns and cops accidentally shooting multiple customers on accident. Clean up on aisle 14 and all that. Another sneaky way to remove guns from the public, for our ‘own’ safety from the roided out, heavily militarized police forces!
Socrates, if I am on a call such as this and I see an unarmed person going for a gun, I am going to perceive that as a threat and they are taking fire. You and your thought processes are ridiculous. You can wait for them to start shooting at you, I won’t. What training have you received in this area?
pussy
by your own admision you said you will kill an unarmed person! So when their hands are up you’ll still shoot too?
wheres he going for a gun? Please tell us?
Whats that you say oh he ran back around the corner into a hail of bullits and you call that going for a gun?
Really? Are people that stupid to think that they will be able to use their BB gun against real guns? Don’t think so. He was panicked and trying to get away was already shot once or twice, and was just tryng to get the fuck out of there. Going for his gun got a laugh!
must be a real hero type to shoot unarmed people huh?
much like beating up women or children takes lots of guts.
by your own admision too your a cop so can’t say yur not now. they/you’d already opened fire on him while he was tring to get the fuck away from them so how is a one second comply and shoot percieved as a threat?
No clue what you people see but I see a guy whos startled and seeing guns pointed at him trying to get away. The arm movement of him holding the gun would be the same if he was trying to get away. Comeing back around the corner and gettign blown away isn’t him going for his gun it’s him being scared shitless and panicked. MUrder!
@eric
That’s a fear reaction..
The officers approach was all wrong. They show plainly that they fail to control the adrenaline rush of the moment.
It’s hard to think clearly when faced with a situation such as this. That is why PO’s are supposed to undergo rigorous training to combat it. They need a refresher course and the boy got a funeral because of it.
ScareyPantsHeart… you are one of the biggest trolls on this site. Not the brightest bulb in the socket there. Talk about repetitive, you get an emmy for that distinction. You come across as a rightwing GOP fascist pig. You and your precious big bertha.
aljamo, if there’s one thing I’m NOT, that is a damned troll. also, I’ve NEVER been a registered voter either. I don’t trust either party. I’ve got a brighter bulb then you think, mofo, so go f#$% yourself!
sorry thumbs downed your comment before reading it thought you were condoning lethal force.
Thumbs up 100% I say it’s passed time to take on tyranny just waiting fo people to wake up and be pissed enough to not care any more!
It looks like I’m setting a record for waking up some trolls this time with the red thumbs I’m getting. At least I know I’m doing something RIGHT. Making trolls happy is NOT part of my DNA.
Generally speaking, for police to use lethal force, three criteria MUST exist.
1) The threat must have the ABITLITY to inflict moderate or greater bodily injury.
2) The threat must have the INTENT to inflict moderate or greater bodily injury.
3) The threat must have the OPPORTUNITY to inflict moderate or greater bodily injury.
If these three criteria are not met and the police still use lethal force, it is not a righteous use of force. Period.
Unfortunately, the victim is 6 feet underground and cannot give us his side of the story. Civilized society cannot survive for long with cowboy police using lethal force as their first and ONLY response to unknown situations.
You’re absolutely right… In the video it appears that officers didn’t give Crawford an opportunity to comply with their commands before they opened fire on him, then shot and killed him after he dropped the weapon. Atleast that is how I saw it.
Same here Frank. It looks like they were shouting commands as they were firing their weapons. Summary executions are something right out of Nazi Socialist Germany WWII. Disgusting to watch.
Even the government of CANADA knows the POlice in the U.S. are too far gone.
Canada Warns Its Citizens Not To Take Cash To The USA
(from ZeroHedge site)
The Canadian government has had to warn its citizens not to carry cash to the USA because the USA does not presume innocence but guilt when it comes to money. Over $2.5 billion has been confiscated from Canadians traveling to the USA, funding the police who grab it.
If you are bringing cash to the land of the free, you will find that that saying really means they are FREE to seize all your money under the pretense you are engaged in drugs with no evidence or other charges.
It costs more money in legal fees to try to get it back so it is a boom business for unethical lawyers to such an extent than only one in sixth people ever try to get their money back and the cops just pocket it. That’s right. Money confiscated is usually allowed to be kept by the department who confiscated it.
This is strangely working its way into funding police and pensions.
This is identical to the very issue that resulted in the final collapse of Rome when the armies began to sack cities to pay for their pensions. We are at that level now with respect to seizing whatever they want knowing you will have to spend more in legal fees to assert your rights that do not really exist.
Those trying to flee tyranny elsewhere can not bring money with them for the police get to take it on this end.
This pretend war on terrorism is really a wholesale war against the people. It serves as the justification to seize whatever they desire ever since 9/11 as reported by the Washington Post.
Don’t worry it’s only a few rogue cops taking a whole lot of money.
I didn’t spend one dime on legal fees when a detective confiscated my money and property back in the 90’s. All it took was one well written “notice of intent to sue”, sent to the Captain. That opened up an IAD case, and my stuff was promptly returned, without ceremony or apology.
Oh well, you celebrate the wins, and shuck off everything else.
Looks like 2 factors at play. Number one, the “ex-marine” can’t identify weapons. Number two, the kid picking up a BB gun and walking around the store. The story didn’t say how old the kid was. Oops, and of course the actions of the morons, err I mean cops.
After watching the video multiple times the officers could have interpreted that the suspect was moving towards the gun as it is lying on the ground and as the officer is moving towards him. We don’t know what commands were given to the suspect. I feel bad for officers who have to use deadly force. This officer will have to live with this for the rest of his life. This website is fully of anti police trolls so I could give two shits if you agree or disagree.
Maybe they should have called out to him from a distance to drop the gun? Not rush him?
they sure know how to yell orders when they want to, dont they?
Eric,
I am not anti-police. I am anti-tyranny and anti-bullying. When the police demand unflinching compliance without question, using any means necessary, and they are more intimidating than criminals, the community has a serious problem. How many videos do we need to see of police acting like armed psycho mental patients to understand that there is a systemic problem with police officers across the U.S.? This is not an isolated, one off, problem. It’s everywhere.
Its true, there are bad cops. No doubt about it. Trust me I know I work with them and its freakin impossible to get their asses fired. But all I see on here is police bashing. I bet you don’t realize that there are in total about a billion police contacts a day in the US. Now, do a little research and break down the number of uses of force or more specifically police shootings. Then look up the number of shootings by civilians on each other. You will see that number of actual incidents of deadly force are so miniscule that your fears are completely unfounded and propped up by the very media that you demonize. Yet when the topic of police misconduct comes up you are right beside them shouting with metaphorical pitch forks. I will agree that We do need more educated, constitution loving patriots on the PD. Ill keep doing my best to educate others and set an example.
Eric, the reason I hold police to a higher standard is because they are sworn to uphold and preserve the sanctity of human life. Not certain lives, in certain neighborhoods, on certain days of the week. Respect goes both ways. If police disrespect us, we will have no respect for them.
I am speaking from experience. Every interaction I’ve ever had with police was a negative experience, and I’m an average law abiding citizen. If I had to choose between dealing with a cop or a criminal, I choose the criminal. At least I know where the criminal stands.
If you automatically enter into a conversation with someone assuming that person has ill intent your attitude and body language show your true feelings. I responded to an alarm and some snot nose kid said the same thing. He had a terrible attitude the entire time I was there. I made it a point to kill him with kindness and respect. I deal with bad people all the time but I don’t take it out on good people. I question your behavior if you have had many run ins with police that turn out unfriendly. A lot of the people, adults specifically, that I deal with don’t take responsibility for their actions get upset when someone tells them they are wrong. People I deal with are usually selfish and immature. Unfortunately most of my contacts with people are when they are at their worst.
Yeah Eric it’s your fault you gave them a ticket or arrested them for beating there wife. Being sarcastic. I just don’t think it looks to good for these cops. I would like to see the uncut version of the tape.
>>”I question your behavior if you have had many run ins with police that turn out unfriendly.”<<
Question my behavior all you want. I'm old enough not to give a crap. I give EVERYONE the chance to be a decent human being at first contact. I will give them the benefit of the doubt right up until they show that they're hostile. That's when my behavior changes to less than friendly.
I am not a docile idiot who bows down to authority. I'm an American Citizen. I believe I have a right, no a responsibility, to constantly evaluate those in positions of authority whether they are elected or appointed. If you treat me like a human being, as you would like to be treated, I will gladly reciprocate. But don't for a second think I am easily intimidated.
When a cop goes berserk screaming at a citizen who is doing their best to be civilized, that cop has crossed the line and he cannot hid behind his badge. If his peers will not reign him in, the People will eventually do so.
We're not paying hard earned taxes to be victimized by both criminals and police. I'm too old to tolerate that crap from anyone.
I don’t think there are as many anti-cop trolls as you would like to think. There are more people that are angary and scared more than anything. The military gear, para-military tactics, and overly aggressive hostility towards the public combined with a faltering economy has people very concerned and for good reason.
“This officer will have to live with this for the rest of his life.”
At least he gets to live. The kid just got dead.
Why would a cop “feel bad” about doing something he doesn’t see as wrong? Especially when society seems to agree with him.
To Mac and everyone else: I stand corrected by Calgagus. I was basing my previous comments partially on emotion due to me losing a family member to an armed robbing POS, so you can imagine my state of mind since I received the news. I watched the video again and reconsidered everything I posted previously. Calgagus was right; I didn’t think this through 100% clearly and that is NOT like me at all. I now see the police could’ve handled it differently. I now realize Walmart’s in-house security could and should have intervened to prevent it from escalalting. Everyone here knows my position on tyranny, gun ownership, etc. I’m just as much against rogue, out-of-control cops as the next person. I was going through a rough time emotionally and just now trying to get over it. I now realize this is one time that I DESERVED to get a lot of red-thumbs for my comments. I now stand corrected. Calgagus, once again, thank you for setting me straight. Mac, thank you for allowing me to still come here and contribute to these articles. I really screwed up on this one.
“This website is fully of anti police trolls…”
Perhaps you’d feel more at home over at PoliceOne where they don’t allow any “anti police trolls”.
At least here they generally allow free speech unlike the “Constitution loving” police trolls over there. lol
Trigger happy PIGS!! Fuck them bitch cops.
An unarmed citizen was shot and killed. Under no circumstances is this to be tolerated in a free society.
When I was a cop deadly force was initiated in very defined circumstances. “I feared” or “I thought” or “maybe he” were clearly not included. My consciounce and the law dictated that I had to be right every time. That’s why I wore a bullet proof vest.
Holy crap these people are out of control! Isn’t anyone smart enough to just say “hey put that down before you freak people out”? Cowards. You just got a kid murdered for being a coward. Now you people are saying he deserved it? He deserved to die on the floor of a Walmart? How disgraceful each and every one of you are sitting back in your comfy seats judging death like its a game. And the scary cops couldn’t take a second to use the overhead intercom to say “hey you, drop that gun” first? No other way huh? This is cold blooded murder. Guess it’s more exciting for you to watch some poor kid get shot down! What happened to humanity? Common sense even! How do you even justify this in any way in your black hearts? If there is a hell it will be filled with people like this cops and you ignorant soulless poster
This boy did not deserve to die for such a small mistake. What if it was your son this happened to? Bad
I don’t have issues with cops normally, but in this case this guy playing with a BB gun should not have been shot to death! As soon as the officer seen him drop the gun that should have been the clue to not use lethal force? Even if he was running, you don’t shoot the guy? They didn’t have to kill him and they should have been prosecuted for it! Too many of these unnecessary killings by cops these days over trivial stuff usually? And the idiots calling 911 instead of at least confirming whether he even had a firearm instead of a BB gun!
Should this have happen, absolutely not. The way I see it; this pure reactionary training on the police side, on the other side this is pure stupidly. The police had the person in a corner; they had ample cover at the ends of the aisle, no one else where in danger. So from the cover; drop the weapon, hands in the air and walk backward toward me. If I thought the person was armed and going to do harm, I sure wouldn’t go running down the aisle at them, because this leaves you with only one option shoot. The training of police seems to be now; POW THUMP, POW THUMP, POW (warning shot), HALT. I think the police are running scared of what is on the horizon for they know it is coming. For me the moral of all this; If you’re going to be stupid, you have to be tough (both sides)! As for the red or green I don’t give a Rat’s A$$.
River Rat at the ready!!! NOMI///MOLON LABE!!!
TSORIITA/GPTDY!!
RR
You hit the nail on the head . You couldn’t have said any better!
Sgt.
Sgt: Been there and done that a long time ago, I’ve got only one T-Shirt. You SIR are one of the FEW. Stay safe my friend from down state.
PS: Eric Holder resigning look out for Oct. something in my gut tells me something is up BIG TIME soon very soon!!
River Rat at the ready!!! NOMI///MOLON LABE!!!
TSORIITA/GPTDY!!
Say you are shopping in Wal-Mart and police run in and say “Down! Down. Shooter!” What do you do? You try to hide behind the police. Uh oh, they shoot you dead on a Wal-Mart floor instead. It was they who created the “terror” situation so they who are responsibly for the outcomes. Not every person running to hide behind a policeman should be shot dead.
River Rat says
“I think the police are running scared of what is on the horizon for they know it is coming.”
this is where I have been with this police state since the start of this shit
Man you know 50 years ago the thing was who won the ball game last night.
Or who went out with who and did they do anything?
Or the new cars that came out.
Now we can not wait to pull the trigger on someone one way or another, and splatter each others brains all over the place.
We all got it coming when the world goes
POOOF!!!!!
We deserve to be extinct……………
For God’s sake. Shit journalism in original article. He was not killed ‘for’ brandishing an imitation firearm, he was killed ‘whilst’ brandishing one. Here’s the difference:
‘Killed for’ – brandish > disarm > arrest > interrogaton > indictment > remand > trial > found guilty > sentenced to death > 10 years on death row > many appeals > execution
‘Killed whilst’ – brandish > shot dead
The kid was stupid, the cops were scared. Bad mix, sad outcome.
With all the cop-bashing, it’s no wonder that only the dregs, bullies and scumbags are left in PD’s. Why would good men put their lives on the line daily, and willingly put themselves in harms way? The attitudes of people towards cops (and cops toward people) needs to change, otherwise things will only get worse.
This boils down to bad parenting, which is rampant in the USA today. Mike in Va, left an email, 2 days ago, go look…
Eppe will do man. Hope your day is great.
Ok for my lone coment to the ones defending this guys death fuck off. your the most sorriest bunch of people to breath and should give it back.
When is it a crime, wrong unethical, irational, stupid, or whatever other comment those people have made about this guy walking around the store carrying a BB gun?
Did they read this story on some other site and already have preconseived ideas as to what happened? For no where in this video was this guy pointing it acting like he was about to shoot anyone, or acting irattionaly in any way. That did not happen. Don’t call the standing at the aisle acting and pointing for he most ssuredly was not he was talking to his girlfreind and using his hands to talk as we all do so NO!!!! don’t use that as your poor excuse to say he deserved it for he did not.
So that said for those that believe were living in a police state and see this as abuse of the cops notice the ones who defend the cops they are the enemy as well and well deserve to be swated too.
FYI (legal note not condoning calling the cops to gain political power over people, but just saying my opinion and first amendment right).
Now Swating is an anti gun thing that people are doing it’s called seeing anyone with a gun no matter what or where and calling the cops and making ut like it’s an emergency when none exist.
Liberals your a bunch of messed up police state athoratorian pig huggers that think the state will grant you safety without taking your librty which is completly wrong. Conservatives or Republican your pretty much the same and only scream cop fowl if its a situation that calls for gun confiscation. Boot licking and screaming molon labe don’t mix it’s either Molon labe all the way or nothing.
to those of us that are sick of you both listen up this is where your agenda conspiracy lies. It’s with these assholes that can see a video like this and see something that clearly never happened and try to make you believe it’s real. they are the one who are afrai of their own shaddow and can’t think beyond what the system has told them is the correct way of thinking. I go to a lot of alt news web sites as this one and they all have stories of overbearing Gov, but when a true example shows it’s face most seem to can’t boot lick quick enough.
Me, I’m Molon Labe all the way and not just when its guns but all these kinds of things.
This Ritchie guy called the pigs for nothing more than to usurp his power over another either because he washed out of the marines and now is a wana be hero with this see something say somethin crap or becuase he’s a prick who thinks a black man with a BB gun somehow represents a threat. What this guy did was get this guy killed for is inept attitude towards black people or his own short comings as a human being and person.
Libertarians tea party take note: both sides are out to get us all killed for were mainly Christains and believe in liberty and the bill of rights and they have an agenda to uphold so will do what it takes to manipulate you and others into believing certain actions are bad and need to be.
The day we cant go to any store to purchase a BB gun and do what should be considered normal and not irational which it has been up until now is a sad fricking day.
Notice too how both sides ahve sided against us because they fear what we stand for which is freedom.
Sadly though I beleive more or what is common every day occurences will be deemed irational behavior and get more of us killed and that isn’t right.
First off clean the slate remake the bill of rights and put in better protections against such a thing then maybe I or anyone else that feels this way might respect cops again but until then hell no.
people of natural behavior watch your backs too for I believe this is the making of the devil and these people will have you killed if you even look like your natural.
so watch your backs.
Daniel 2 vs 44 NoW!
watched it again and one second is all he had to comply not even that.
Those protecting this evil corrupt system are wrong.
he was like oh shit and went to run BB gun was in the left hand and down to the ground at the time. what some would say was raising it to shoot are fucking mistaken for that’s what you do when your startled, by any noise. a persons arms would raise like that to run so bullshit to those who think he deserves this.
you can clerly hear the pig say drop it when crawford had already droped it on the ground. At that point he was unarmed and posed no threat so when he comes back around the corner which I dont get unless he panicked he ran into a hail of bulits at that point.
Murder Murder Murder!
Cops should of been indicted and Ritchie most assuredly too.
Fuck Isis liberals and Conservatives are the bigger terrorists here.
independence or Constitutionalists are just trying to get back a Republic.
Guarantee if he was white … he’d be alive now.
regardless of whether he had a gun…. these cops would have shot him if he had just had his finger out !! …. he was executed for being wrong colour in a racist country of paranoid retards.
Well statistics, and their own lack of respect paint a grim picture for black men in america. Image IS everything, so stop with the “hood rat” ,”gangsta”, “thug” crap, and show some self respect.
Not directed at anyone in particular, but you know who you are.
When I was living in California, about 20 years ago, I heard gun shots out in the parking area. I called police, and when they got there, they came to my door and pounded real loud, BOOM BOOM BOOM. Surprised they didn’t just bust down the door. I opened the door quickly to find a woman cop with a gun trained right on me. She said, “Where’s the gun shots?” and I said, “Out somewhere in the parking lot”. She looked at me with big wide eyes and said “You’re lying. Someone downstairs said they come from upstairs and since you are the one who called and lives up here, we’re going to search you and the apartment right now”.
Five officers came in, laid me out on the floor and cuffed me. My wife was sleeping in the bedroom with our 2 week old baby. They busted right in there scaring the hell out of her and our baby, yelled at her to get up. Baby starts crying, woman cop tells us to shut up the baby. They search our entire apartment, then our two vehicles and ran both of us for background checks.
The woman cop was out of her mind. She suggested that our newborn baby was not ours. She said “Is this baby yours?”. My wife said, “I have the c section scar to prove it is, and our hospital bands”.
It was the MOST insane thing I had ever experienced. And THAT is when I got the hell out of that state. I knew the cops were going nuts back then and now it’s just worse.
I am glad that happened to you for calling the cops. I hope you learned a lesson
Like I said: NEVER CALL 911!
Keep loving your oinker friends. I’ve told you how many times before on this site, the only thing cops do is>>
HARM, MAIM, AND KILL. PERIOD. They get off on it.
And yes, the time is soon coming when people will be walking up toward there crusier and shooting them in the face.
The more the better.
Lets say that your a CCP holder and you shot this guy in the mistaken belief that it was a real gun and he was a threat to you any others.
I need not even say anymore as the outcome is obvious.
Why is Law Enforcement any different?
In closing they sell toy guns in that store that look damn real. Wal Mart Security was no doubt notified that the police were on their way. This poor guy is dead but a piss poor attorney has some deep pockets to get to with this as Wal Mart has a lot of responsibility here.
If you watch the video CAREFULLY, it looks to me like the kid is doing the manual of arms. Watch what he does. He’s a young man, imitating what he has seen soldiers do. I didn’t see him point it at ANYONE. I AGREE the marine who called 911 should be charged as an accessory to murder, or AT LEAST for filing a false claim. We no longer hold police responsible for ANYTHING in America. They are the one percents’ stooges. PROTECT AND SERVE? BULLSHIT!
I’ve tried to view the video multiple times and it won’t work at the moment. Mac’s link is good, I think Youtube is having the issue.
That being said. Where was WalMart’s loss prevention department in all of this. Obviously (from other comments, the kid is plainly on camera walking around the store with the BB gun, he’s on camera picking it up. Why wasn’t there another officer reviewing security footage while the other two were making their approach?
It’s bothersome that an ex-marine wasn’t able to tell the difference between a bb gun and an actual firearm, he obviously followed the kid around log enough to allegedly witness him “loading” it while talking on a cell.
This sounds like a perfect storm of mis-information and an overly aggressive tactic used by the Beaverton Police.
These trigger-happy cops just murdered him. Period.
If I had a split-second to respond terrified, thinking I was about to get shot, I might run also. Wouldn’t you? Or would you just stand there and get shot?
These cops gave him NO CHANCE to respond in any way other than what he did — run terrified for his life — and obviously in retrospect, justifiably so.
Until cops in America are held personally, criminally, and financially responsible for their actions – especially when they shoot people – their rampant murdering with impunity of civilians nationwide will never end.
And what’s up with the ex-marine. Why couldn’t he tell the difference between a real gun and a BB gun in the first place?
We are so screwed people. Time to take a DHS class and get my license to kill! Don’t you all want one? Thats the only way to be safe is to join the thug punks…..and be armed to the teeth!
i’ve been thinking the same thing. better to be a slave in the big house than a slave in the field.
you mean sign up for the target on your back? no thanks
besides I’d have to down grade my IQ to half, and gain at least 100 pounds
IQ to half? You’re not very smart then, are you?
😉
But, really, these guys, ugh! What can you say?
I think if the guy had just stood up, flat against the end of the aisle, officer bacon and officer donut would have come, bearing down on the end, seen each other’s guns and shot each other.
There was no coordination there. What a couple anti-tactical-tards! Come on. Did they fail training? Remember: distance is your friend. Don’t get rid of your friends.
nice little expose on the fraud that is our government
http://youtu.be/ESZN_YDE-TU
some people waking up slowly
some like this guy
WIDE awake
This Man Was Shot For Following Police Instructions
http://crooksandliars.com/2014/09/man-was-shot-following-police-instructions
and the cop gets charged with aggravated assault ???
WTF ???
Italy stages Ebola evacuation drills – nurses union says US not ready for cases, an outbreak would be ‘pure pandemonium’
http://theextinctionprotocol.wordpress.com/2014/09/25/italy-stages-ebola-evacuation-drills-nurses-union-says-us-not-ready-for-cases-an-outbreak-would-be-pure-pandemonium/
Do a little research and you will find that Bevercreek, oh has had two shootings by police and guess who was involved in both.
So, a cop executes an unarmed man. The gun that he dropped wasn’t even real. The grande jury says they acted appropriately and people excuse it because the guy panicked and that made the cops panic. Except he had a reason to panic, as several armed men (with real guns) ran at him screaming. The cops on the other hand are supposedly trained to handle these situations. Pretty sure if I killed someone because I panicked I would get hit with manslaughter at the minimum with a good lawyer, but somehow its OK for cops to panic and execute someone. Cops should be held to a higher standard as they receive training and then are entrusted to uphold law and order. “Panicked” as a defense can only apply to the gentleman who was shot.
Essentially this was an accident. Had this happened to a civilian, a non-badge wearing individual, they’d still be in jail. But, cops? No. They’re probably on a beach somewhere, drawing pay, sipping lemonade on “Administrative Leave”. “Administrative Leave” = “Still Stealing From The People While On An Extended Vacation”
This is just a video with almost no audio.
Many questions.
1. Was he shooting the gun? If he was a 177 pellet gun in a confined space like that, sounds like a 22 going off.
2. Was he saying anything to the people in the store he was pointing the gun at? If he was he was lucky no one with a CC was in the store!
3. What was he saying to the person on the phone that he had up to his ear? Or was that phone not being used and voices were coming from it.
4. Was this guy on drugs? Prescribed or other wise.
5. Was this guy suicidal? If so maybe he wanted to commit suicide by cop.
6. Did he shot the gun at the cop before the cop shot him? If so when the gun went off it sound like a 22.
7. How many times was the guy shot?
8. How much training did the cops have on knowing what different firearms look like?
9. Hard to tell but did the Pellet gun look like an AR15?
10. The Marine that call this in, is not a Ex, he is a former you are never not a Marine even if you retire! Being a Marine he must a seen or felt something about the guy with the gun. He did the right thing by calling this in!
11. What kind of a rap sheet did this guy have?
12. Was he gang affiliated?
13. Was he trying to get into a gang?
I have more but this enough for now!
This video from Jones doesn’t tell you anything. I’m starting to see that Jones is becoming money hungry and going over to the other side.
The legal system is that a grand jury hears all the evidence and decides to push forward with a case or not. There wasn’t enough there to do so.
All the Cop haters will be giving a lot of thumbs down on this but that is Ok.
Braveheart:
Damn man you have been getting jumped on big time. I agree with you on about 95% of what you said above. This doesn’t mean you are wrong or I’m right it is how we feel.
Hang in there old friend. You still have many friend here.
Thanks for taking some of the flack. That just means you are over the target!!! And they are not shooting at me. YET!!!!
AIM SMALL MISS SMALL
Sgt.
I just saw something I didn’t see before in slow mo.
14. It looks like he sees the cops or they shot at him? He drops the gun and then tries to return back to it when he is shot.
Sgt Dale,
Most of your questions are irrelevant because, first of, the cops completely blew this.
On one hand, we complain about the cops being “militarized” but not even a non-member of either cops or military (and someone who has had 0 formal training) like me knows: THEY FUCKING BLEW IT!
You never bear down on a guy like that. You never get into close quarters like that. Distance is your friend. Don’t run your friends off where you’re facing a possible enemy.
I could have controlled that situation and I think Ritchie is a paranoid coward and the cops are trigger happy incompetents!
I have a policy: NEVER CALL 911. Why? Because only paranoid, incompetent children call 911 because they’re too scared or too stupid to act. Ritchie’s call initiated and aided the incompetence of these trigger happy assholes.
May they rest their heads on a hot rock in the Hell that they created for themselves!
Crawford may not have been an angel, but, your questions show me that you’re already trying to excuse the officers. I believe you to be of good concience, but, you are displaying the perfect example of why these bastards won’t be held to account: support from all their LE buddies. Too bad this won’t go to trial. Too bad I’m not on the jury.
NR
You stated no formal. I have and they have training. If he would have pointed it at me and shot it and it sounded like a 22 going off. I would have pulled the trigger. I would have regretted for the rest of my life shooting some one with a pellet gun, but I wouldn’t have know it at that time, and what to say the pellet gun wasn’t a ploy and he had a Glock or a 1911 under his shirt and when you put your guard down he shoots you it?
They didn’t blow it. The turd should have never taken the gun off the rack and should have never been waving it around. He started the damn thing! Not the cops.
So If he wouldn’t have taken the gun off the rack like most decent people he wouldn’t have. The cops wouldn’t have been called.
Do you see where I’m coming from?
Thanks for the debate.
Sgt.
Face it Sarge, they blew it.
Their first mistake was not evaluating the situation properly. No one was running out of the store in a panicked state. The only party alarmed was this puke of a boot camp washout, a person whose story has changed significantly since the incident.
Did the officers even contact the complainant before they entered? They obviously failed to contact store management/security to view any of the video and watch and evaluate the suspects behavior.
They didn’t evacuate/clear the immediate area or store. Therefore risking additional lives if there would have been a firefight. You know as well as I do a 5.56 or .223 round will go through store shelving pretty easily.
The officers failed miserably to utilize the tools available to them.
They rushed in, guns drawn, high on the adrenaline rush and rode that wave to its ultimate fruition.
Watching the video, the kid’s flight instinct was in full effect. Again, triggered by an overly aggressive approach.
Ohio is an OPEN carry state.
Referring to the young man in the video as “The turd” shows your disposition and bias towards your “brothers in blue”
Take this however you please. Military grade weapons do NOT belong in the hands of the common street/patrol officer, not until the populace as a whole can have them legally.
Sarge, good day to you, sir, and thanks for the support. Calgagus was right to a certain degree, but I won’t admit to being 100% wrong. I’ll still stand by my comment that the kid shouldn’t have been walking around with a BB gun in WalMart OUT of a package. had it still been in a package, that would be different. could those cops have handled it differently? You know the answer to that question better than anyone else here. I’m still in a daze after the bad news about my brother-in-law getting wasted for no good reason so my previous comments were based partially on emotion. I look at that video and I’m hard-pressed to find any fault with how those officers responded. Damn, I really set a record for getting red thumbs this time. maybe I did something right after all. I just did NOT see any evidence of police misconduct in that video. It all appeared legitimate to me.
dude did you not read the text as the video played?
it says then and there they are displayed unpackaged so thee was no package to begin with.
first off he never pointed at no one those people were not ever afraid of him
LEO are human – most (MOST being key word)don’t want to kill. Many have never drawn their gun. Adrenaline is high due to fear. We have no idea what was said to the officer either. But they are hired and supposedly trained to protect us from ourselves – to get in the middle and DE-escalate. Even our military is taught DE-escalation for urban situations.
The kid was dumb, but many kids are, especially those raising themselves – single parent families or absent fathers. The employees either panicked or washed their hands of this one as well. The young man was ignorant and the employees lazy – why was the gun unpackaged and left on the shelf?
IMHO, blame can be laid on both. That being said, it should have been the officer going in to determine the situation and DE-escalate. That is supposed to be his/her job. How is it that everyone understands DE-escalation in our military and our own LEO do not?
What I saw was an officer intent on eliminating a ‘threat’ – not a policing action at all. Running in with weapon drawn is crap – the key here being the running. He already knew what he was going to do – there was no assessment of the situation, just putting down the threat. It was over in seconds.
There is blame all around – tragic. The sad part is that now the officer feels vindicated and is reassured that this was the right approach – producing more of the same in our future.
scared little puppies is why they ran in like that and acted as such
these cops are all afraid as hell of all of us, because they have created this US/ against everyone else syndrome
and its coming home to roost
plus they are buying into all the gun hoaxes that have been played upon us all by this admin.
soon the tables could turn and really give them a true reason to fear us..all of it perpetrated by their actions
somethings up
ht tp://news.yahoo.com/official-says-holder-resigning-attorney-general-145625458–politics.html
Black man in a store with a rifle? Shoot first, talk later. If you thought otherwise, you wouldn’t last a minute in the the city. Fools. Well, it was a pellet gun, well, he put it down. And you would know, under pressure that it wasn’t a real gun? You would know, under pressure that is was the only gun he had? You would know, under pressure he was alone? No accomplices in the other aisles? Fools. Your hatred of the police is so intense that it blinds you to the real world. You don’t deserve to survive. Choke on your own drool.
Brother, cops aren’t the problem… neither are white people. It’s time for the black men and women of this great country to hold themselves accountable for the situation they are in as individuals and as a community. Take some responsibility and grow up, it sucks I know, but well worth the struggle.
Brother, cops aren’t the problem… neither are white people. It’s time for the black men and women of this great country to hold themselves accountable for the situation they are in as individuals and as a community. Take some responsibility and grow up, it sucks I know, but well worth the struggle.
LMS
Someone with common sense!!!!!!!!!!!!
Sgt.
LMS, AMEN to your comments. the black community really needs to clean up its own act.
I’m not seeing the reason for outrage for this:
– The kid had zero common sense in gun handling (a BB gun is a gun). What safety minded, responsible person would open carry like this kid? Not me.
– It looks like a real gun
– Because he walked away from the gun section, no one (including the cops) would have known it was a BB gun or from the store itself.
– The kid is not following Jeff Coppers Gun safety laws at all (a gun is ALWAYS loaded), the kid knows it looks like a real gun, why on earth would you not treat it like one? Why wouldn’t you understand that it looks the same to others? It doesn’t matter that no one was within 20ft of him, guns can shoot through multiple walls, and in a store that is generally full of people, it would be common sense to not pick it up and walk through the store with it.
“But it was just a BB gun…”
It simply does not matter, BB guns on the rare occasion CAN kill people, and since it looks like a real gun, you follow the gun safety rules regardless.
Was he pointing it at the cops? No, but there is no way ANYONE (including me, especially with children) would be able, or willing to get close enough, to look at it and say “oh that’s just an unloaded Wal-Mart BB gun”.
Open carry requires the person carrying to be safety minded and have common sense. None of which was exhibited here. So lets stop trying to blame this on everyone else except the person who should have just left the gun on the self, unless he wanted to buy it.
Want to wave it around like an idiot? Buy it and take it home.
Exactly. People try to empathize too much. They imagine this happening to themselves or their kids. Well, this wouldn’t happen to me or my kids because we’re smarter than a box of rocks. Common sense you don’t go around waving a gun at people. It’s a tragedy for sure — that he died and that he was born and raised to be so stupid. One final crucial point that supports the above statements: The cops were called because of the gun, but he was SHOT for lunging at the an armed swat officer.
no they were called because of anti gun liberals who want to have all gun owners killed that’s why!
they were also called because of some cowardly none ex marine because he didn’t even make it wanted to have him killed that’s why.
Anon, AMEN to your comments.
omfg get off the he was carrying it or open carrying it will you people how else was he to purchace it for christs sake?
carrying it around the store has nothing to do with it its you anti gun liberals attitudes and trying to make a MT out mole hills and indocternate us all or force evilution on us all by saying somethings wrong when it isn’t and if it is or becomes that way fuck it this aint amerca no more then!
The gun was not in a box, go to Wal-mart and see for yourself. All he had to do was look and see that all the other guns had boxes. He should have left the gun on the shelf, picked up one that was in a box (you can’t purchase it without the ISBN code on the box anyway, or have you been to Wal-mart recently?)and purchase it at the gun counter like any other normal person would have done.
Its called common sense, and he didn’t have any.
And what makes everyone think he was going to purchase it? I haven’t seen anything in any articles yet that either he said he was, or indicate he was going to. The only thing I see in the video is that he took advantage of the fact that the gun (let not be stupid here again, it IS a gun, not a toy, like some news articles have said) was out of the box to play with it.
And no, it’s not Wal-mart’s fault either, there is no way for them to keep track of the huge amount of much stuff that gets un-boxed. If anything he should have known the safety issue and told a Wal-mart employee.
And me, an anti-gun liberal? No, just an anti-idiot, anti-victim mentality conservative, that lives in a gun friendly state, and pretty much ‘carries’ 24/7. How many liberals do you know, know about Jeff Copper and Gunsite? Or about his gun safety rules? I would make a bet that before I mentioned him (go a head Google him and then tell me you knew the whole time), you didn’t know who he was either.
Law enforcement…just gangsters with a façade of respectability bestowed on them by their overlords to enable their power and control over the “common man”.
I laugh at the ones who claim to take an oath to defend the Constitution and yet go out every day and violate it.
Here is a good read on the constitutionality of what all those cops do daily…and it is written by one of their own and not a “sovereign citizen” as they would call a freeman. A member of the CSPOA (Constitutional Sheriffs and Peace Officers Association):
http://www.realtruth.biz/driving/supremecourt.htm
Hold on to your seats folks because this will rock you. The rumor
Mill in Washington is that Obama wants a Supreme Court Judge to
Retire quickly (I.e., Ginsberg) so he can nominate his pick while
Harry Reed and the Dem’s still control the US Senate. Remember, this
Is a LIFE TIME appointment. Who is his rumored pick? Are you ready
For this? “ERIC HOLDER!!!”
Remember Harry Reed changed the rules of the senate so the
Republicans couldn’t stop it either. What then people? What do we do
if this happens?
I’ll tell you what. If Obama want’s a communist long term legacy,
Putting Eric Holder on the Supreme Court would do it. That
Possibility should scare all of us. Can you say
“Good-bye 2nd Amendment” for starters?”
Our only hope is that no one on the Supreme Court resigns or retires.
River Rat at the ready!!! NOMI///MOLON LABE!!!
TSORIITA/GPTDY!!
VRF says:
Comment ID: 3232187
September 25, 2014 at 10:12 am
somethings up
ht tp://news.yahoo.com/official-says-holder-resigning-attorney-general-145625458–politics.html
River rat- it all has to start some time. Now is as good a time as any. Ginsberg is currently the most liberal judge… so, Holder gets her job…. explain why this matters. Also, I ask myself “if this REALLY matters at all”? This charade will end… in time. No worries for me. If it gets real, then I guess it gets real. We all gotta do what we think is right. Politics for me means very little at the present time… I just want to protect my family any means necessary. AND I have a bunch of “mean”. Oh.. why worry about the losses of any MAN made rights? Mine come from God. Carry on, soldier.
Just when you think it can not get any worse. Holder on the Supreme Court. No Hope and Plenty of Change.
We will be a Third World Country within five years. If we last that long. The shit never stops.
Holder resigning,hmmmm….,a judge has ordered justice dept to release F&F records by Oct. 22,not as they asked for another delay till mid terms,Judicial Watch along with support of GOA got done what congress could not.I wonder how many hard drives crash/office memos catch on fire ect. before all this comes out in theory Oct. 22.Holder resigns early so if charges from this or any other debacle can be pardoned before obola leaves office,every now and then a little good news,thanks to to the judge who finally put a end to the nonsense,at least we hope.My guess is any damning evidence will be ignored by msm until after the election,Mac,might want to keep a open space on site for Oct. 22/23!
A few years back…10??? I was in Safeway in the early evening. I ran into a neighbor who started talking about this “Sweet” muzzle loader he had just acquired.
He wanted me to “check it out”. Unfortunately I am known to be the local gun guy, so I get to do a lot of work on neighbors guns…
Hey don’t get me wrong, I like to check out guns…
I was just about done shopping, so I told him I would meet him in the parking lot. He left, and I finished up my gathering.
Before I could get out of the produce section, there he was…Gun in hand.
Several “special incantations” later I noticed that no one was even so much as batting an eye. The produce manager even walked over and joined the look see”.
All I wanted to do is extricate myself from the premises as quickly as possible, but this idiot was in full blown proud new “father” mode and followed me to the check out stand…
Again, no one seemed to notice. It was like he was invisible!
The whole time I am shitting bricks. I expected the cops to SWAT us at any second.
I finished paying and left the store…Out in the parking lot the same thing happened…Nothing!
Had I pulled this stunt I would be spitting pavement to this day.
I carry concealed, and on of my big fears, is some Libtard spotting my pistol as I am scrounging something off the top shelf.
ad he pulled this stunt today, I would have probably ended up as collateral damage!
All In all, this shows how well the “programming” has succeeded…What will it be like in another 10 years???
it’s time the 300 plus million people got a handle on the one million minus LEO before it’s too late, it’s almost like they’re training for a dictator like Hitler to come along and start giving orders
this my friends is what is refered to in the military as a clusterfuck
everythings wrong and nothing is right
So you’re young. you’re black, and you decide to walk around WalMart with what looks like a real gun.
Nope, I don’t see where anything could go wrong there.
Cops responded to a call of armed man waving gun in store.Cop that fired was focused on suspect running back towards dropped firearm,not the firearm itself.
Seems Mr Suspect probably should have stayed on the floor.
Looking at a video later and saying”that was wrong” is armchair quarterbacking.
You get the advantage of taking hours to second guess a man who had fractions of a second to make a decision.
Guess person playing with a gun in a store isnt a great idea in some places nowadays.
Whats your solution?Disarm police?…Ok…And do away with 9-1-1 while u are at it because no unarmed cop is going to answer it.
Whats my solution? Disarm police: Yes. Might arm them with some brains. That would be good. I know! Realistic looking toy guns like the one they killed Crawford for.
911? Its the number for the Janitor Squad. Dump it in the river.
Save lots of lives with those two solutions. Keep lots of lives from being ruined. Whats your solution? Just let it go?
In the end, we need cops that are problem solvers, not mercenary cowboys. Actually, their mercenary skills fail too.
These stupid coLEO (Color Of Law Enforcement Officer) stooges probably thought they were going apprehend the next Sandy Hoax shooter. They see the gun and their imagination goes NUTS with their grandious delusions.
They need to back off, resolve the situation.
Were that me they were attempting to gun down and I were intending to do people harm, I would have shot both of them in the head before got halfway down the aisle. These dipshits are dangerous to themselves and the public. …and its the kind of dangerous that you can’t fix.
Both were exposed and stupid about it. You never just walk out in the middle of the aisle. 1st rule of survival of a shootout: USE COVER! 2nd rule: USE CONCEALMENT!
Not only that, what if it had been a real gun. Suppose it was an AR and the guy had body armor and a shootout had ensued. DAMN!
These two assholes needed to remember:
A) There is no hurry.
B) They have nearly unlimited backup.
C) THERE ARE PEOPLE IN THE STORE!
Stinking reckless morons! Not to mention them murdering this guy, what about the kids and moms all over the store? You think that shelf of towels or canned goods is going to stop 5.56/308/40 bullets?
What would I have done different?
A) Get an employee to watch the monitors and report the guys movements over radio to the other employees.
B) Get the police there, but hold them at the entrance.
C) Get all employees with radios to clear the store of customers best they can, especially in the area of the gunman.
D) Once the store is mostly clear, send the cops in to make contact and ask the guy whats up.
I’d bet you 100:1 that this guy thought these guys with there to rob him. Ha! I guess they were: rob him of his live.
Could you fucking cops, please, just ask? Please? Before you start gunning people down?
Street justice may take care of these guys if the “Just Us” system won’t.
You’re not going to allow the cops to enter the store?
Might want to think about that again.
if i was the judge I would NOT go after the cops!! yes if could of been done diff but the dumbass walked all around the store with it what the hell did he think would happen .He thought he would scare a couple people and have a good time!! but if I’m in wal mart and see a guy walking around like him I’d do the same thing don’t judge till you have been shot at !!
Come to think of it,I LIKE that idea.Make ALL Cops,feds, State and Local unarmed security.Drop the 9-1-1 system for all but fires and medical.
Legislate police response to report taking and investigative only.
No arrest powers.
Then sit back and watch.
Anybody been to Oakland or Detroit lately?
I submit this plan.EVERY time you go to a store or other public place,call 9-1-1 and describe some random person,black/White;Male/female,as walking around waving a gun.Get police to respond in an aggressive way by making the person sound as dangerous as posdible.
The expected reaction will generate such an anti-armed cop groundswell of outrage that out officers will either be disarmed or quit in disgust over the resulting restrictions on use if force.It will make Tennessee v Gardner look like cookies and milk.
This will be the quickest way to get what you seek.
Put the SELF back in self defense.
When you play games don’t cry about your prize
This jackass was 22yo. walking around with a very real looking toy gun. He was not some 8yo playing in the toy department.Yes he did drop it but he than charged the cop.I just hope he didn’t do any breeding….we have enough stupid DNA walking around. I have to come down on the side of the cops in this one.
Looking at this video, it looks like straight up murder. The young family with the kids standing in the same isle didn’t feel threatened and neither did anybody else from what I can see. The guy was talking on his cell phone minding his own business and BAM! Like a batman show. They killed him. No chance for talk or anything. Just BAM! So the only people that felt threatened were the cops and ex-marine Ronald Richie? I’ll remember not to carry wires or battery’s next time at Wal-Mart, some ex-military guy might call the cops telling them I’m trying to blow the place up.
What ever happened to non lethal force? If there was no attempt to point the weapon at an officer in a threatening manner there was no need to vent the guy. If anything a non lethal shot to subdue and gain control at most here. That in itself is highly questionable from what is shown in the video. These guys went in hard and blazed.
So cops can go around and shoot citizens at will, but citizens can’t own firearms. When you give up your rights and behave like cattle, you will be treated as such make no mistake. Those against citizens with firearms take note. This will become the new normal and skin color won’t matter. This is what it looks like when you give away your rights and become a police state. The tilt of power from the masses, to the few.
Laws don’t hamper a criminal, that’s why we call them criminals! It only harms the law abiding. Criminals, politicians, attorneys, all love laws and so do funeral homes. When your dead, your dead a long time. This poor SOB is in heaven going damn, it was just an air rifle! Personally, I would be pissed off!
The right to bear arms means just that, no restrictions apply. Mind you, I’m not against some sane restrictions. The problem is once you give in it’s a snatch and grab. Restrictions & laws lead to confiscation. It’s just never enough for the powers that be. Power is all they live for, and ultimate power is all they aspire to.
The argument that our forefathers couldn’t possibly foresee modern weapons is BS. In fact when we began as a country the militia had the superior firearms. That’s right,… the citizens had the upper hand. That is the way it was intended.
Case in point is Cuomo’s Safe Act. Cuomo’s Safe Act here in NY is a prime example. Slow methodical confiscation. A law rammed through in the dead of night with no chance for a citizen to say a word against it. Sounds a lot like how the Federal Reserve was introduced doesn’t it.
Cuomo, your an intelligent fascist traitor to your flag, country, state, and it’s citizens! I hope you get kicked out of office. I despise you sir. The gun grabbers will not stop and by the time folks wake up, I fear it will be to late. No political lines here, you are all Americans and that should be your banner,….not party affiliation! It’s just propaganda folks. Divide and conquer! The 1st rule of battle.
If this played out as depicted. To the departed I’m sorry that happened to you bro, god bless. To the family I’m very sorry for your loss. Someone should be held accountable. Civil servants should be held accountable for their actions, the same rules apply to you as with us. You are not above the law just because you enforce it. You are to lead by example. Not do as I say and not as I do.
Oathe keeper
82nd Airborne Infantry
The only shots I hear in that video/audio were fired while Crawford still held the gun. I hear no shots after that.
The store policy is that all gun purchases, including BB guns, must be paid for in the sporting goods section. Only certain clerks are allowed to do gun sales since actual firearms require a federal background check with the ATF prior to customer taking delivery. After background check and/or simple checkout (if BB gun), the customer is *escorted* to the parking lot with the gun in packaging. Additionally, hunting/fishing licenses are purchased at the sporting goods register.
Questions:
(1) Why was this rifle not in the packaging?
(2) Why was the rifle not checked out at the sporting goods section?
(3) Why was customer allowed to move gun from sporting goods section all around the store?
(4) What the heck were Wal-Mart employees doing this whole time? Where was the designated employee who is supposed to man the firearms/sporting goods register?
LEO shot first, asked questions later? Agree.
Customer was not exercising good judgement? Agree.
Wal-Mart allowing this to happen? WTF?
Yep. Completely imprudent to walk around a store with a gun in tow…Makes absolutely no sense! Cause and effect folks. Had he not done that (strolled around a “non-weapon related store” with a weapon) he’d be alive right now. Blaming the caller is fruitless as while he may have embellished, it’s completely reasonable for a Walmart patron to react that way when they see someone strolling through the aisles with a weapon. The police clearly acted rashly as they approached an armed man without caution or haste…Who does that? Just charging in with weapons drawn is the fastest way to get oneself killed. They clearly could have responded more prudently.
But in the end, this man lost his life because he didn’t think rationally of his actions.
-Dad
OH! What a surprise. ANOTHER Ebonican doing something stupid and and anxiety provoking in public! This is called “The Non-survival of the Stupidest”.
This is spilling over onto liberal web sites only because Crawford is black. If he was white and dead, liberals would be cheering the cops for taking out a dangerous “wingnut” open carry wannabe.
That was murder.
Book em Danno,
But…..
We live in two worlds – the world of what should be and the world of what is. In the world of what should be that young guy is alive because no called the police. In the world of what is he waved a gun around inside a store and died because of it.
The battle between ideology and reality rolls ever along.
Black Operation. Fake Store Clerk, probably new hire, waits for opportunity to sell BB Gun to Customer. Alerts Fake Customer who Calls in Cops, who may or maynot be in on the plan. Unawares potentially happy customer minding own business suddenly confronted by cops thinking a madman is in store with gun. Shoots innocent customer. PTB win another success as idiots think guns get you killed. More idiots then think Bill of Rights are bad. America becomes even more totalitarian at the hands of the corporate rulers.