This report was originally published by Tyler Durden at Zero Hedge
Following the tragic events in Las Vegas, which were seemingly made even worse by a product that most people didn’t even know existed a couple of days ago, and ramped-up calls for new gun restrictions from Democrats, the National Rifle Association has just caved and called for “additional regulations” on “bump fire stocks” which effectively serve to allow semi-automatic weapons to function as fully-automatic.
Here is the full statement from the NRA:
“In the aftermath of the evil and senseless attack in Las Vegas, the American people are looking for answers as to how future tragedies can be prevented.”
“Unfortunately, the first response from some politicians has been to call for more gun control. Banning guns from law-abiding Americans based on the criminal act of a madman will do nothing to prevent future attacks. This is a fact that has been proven time and again in countries across the world.
In Las Vegas, reports indicate that certain devices were used to modify the firearms involved. Despite the fact that the Obama administration approved the sale of bump fire stocks on at least two occasions, the National Rifle Association is calling on the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (BATFE) to immediately review whether these devices comply with federal law.
“The NRA believes that devices designed to allow semi-automatic rifles to function like fully-automatic rifles should be subject to additional regulations.”
“In an increasingly dangerous world, the NRA remains focused on our mission: strengthening Americans’ Second Amendment freedom to defend themselves, their families and their communities.”
“To that end, on behalf of our five million members across the country, we urge Congress to pass National Right-to-Carry reciprocity, which will allow law-abiding Americans to defend themselves and their families from acts of violence.”
#BREAKING @NRA issues statement calling for devices like bump stocks to be "subject to additional regulations" in wake of #LasVegas – @ABC pic.twitter.com/ouMAm50OyO
— ABC6 (@wsyx6) October 5, 2017
Meanwhile, the White House has also joined in with Sarah Sanders just telling reporters that the Executive Branch wants “to be part of the discussion” on regulating bump fire stocks.
.@PressSec on reviewing "bump stocks" like the one used in Las Vegas shooting: "We are open to having that conversation" pic.twitter.com/2VacyZVjJV
— Washington Examiner (@dcexaminer) October 5, 2017
For those who aren’t familiar with how bump fire stocks work, here is a demonstration from one of the largest manufacturers, Slide Fire, which we shared with readers yesterday.
And here is a look at the product in action:
Be very careful, once you give them an inch, they will want 20 feet!!
Come on guys and gals. I am a member of NRA for 40 years and I am concerned about this issue. I didn’t know about bump stocks until now and have to come down on the side of making them unavailable. Even the military M16 only fires 3 round bursts on full auto. This is a spray and pray devise and has no redeeming qualities as far as I’m concerned. I understand that some worry about a slippery slope and I can understand that but these devises have no place in a skilled rifleman’s possession. As fast as one can fire a semi automatic with a much higher degree of accuracy and ammo preservation makes a lot more sense to me. God Bless, James
Correct James. Sorry to say. Trump will do anything to raise his poll numbers. The Republican Congress the same. The Republican talking heads all saying Bump stocks approved under Obama. Goes to show you Obama wasn’t out to take your Guns. But now Republicans are talking ban Bump Stocks. Next stop Ban so called. Assault Rifles.Be worried my friend be worried my friend.
“Goes to show you Obama wasn’t out to take your Guns.”
GTFOOH
It goes to show you that by the ATFs own regulations that bump stocks are not a part of the weapons firing mechanism as it still fired one shot with each trigger pull hence not in violation of the law.
Not my place to tell another American citizen what they should be able to possess or not. The Second Amendment was written by some of the most intelligent Americans to have ever lived. If they intended the Second to have more limits, they would have included them in Amendment.
Need alone is not the deciding factor in gun ownership. I can go out and buy a WWII tank and restore to full function and park it in my driveway. Do I need a tank? No. Do I want one? Sure, why not.
I have my own reasons for wanting to bump stocks restricted not the least of which is my concern for allowing bump stop devices to fall into terrorists hands. Unfortunately I suspect that Genie is already out of the bottle. At this point I think it is a moot point to ban the devices, but Congress will feel pressured to do something to save face.
THE NRA… CAVING IN SINCE IT’S INCEPTION.
As for you James, the 2nd ammendment shall NOT be infringed! Oh ya the NRA forgot to tell you that. It doesn’t matter whatsoever what you think, many people have bump stocks and they are a ton of fun. Maybe they can ban people like you who are statist anti-constitutionalists….
Thats why i stoped paying dues to these guys, all they seem to do is make concessions, bullshit
NRA “compromise” is how USA got where it is today.
So, I guess you’ve never heard about “fire superiority?
Or supressive fire
Like supressive fire/ movement/ supressive fire/ movement may need it to break contact,
hard to suppress a trained mark when you’re not hitting anything. All sound and fury, no damage or results. as far as volume of fire goes, as soon as you’re out of ammo, I move.
I’d rather generate volume of fire accurately via a quality trigger and actually force you to keep your head down
accuracy is superior to volume.
Let’s do a test with you and me. I’ll have a fully auto BB gun and you have a semi auto. Let’s see who gets hit the most. Deal????
With just a minor amount of practice a bump-fire system is just as controllable as any full-auto. One shot, 2, 3, …. to a mag dump. Same with staying on target. Just as good as full with just a bit of practice. A sighting system helps big-time to stay on track. I tell ya – all those who disparage bump/slide systems I seriously doubt have tried them. They work fine.
Not to mention, a skilled rifleman doesnt need a gizmo to bump fire,,,
True but it makes it more controllable. I like controllable lol.
Yeaa well, bump fire might not be the call for controllable, might be better with a select fire in 3 round burst, easier on your weapon too.
you are the only sensible comment i have seen, fuk a bump fire stock
No it doesn’t. An M16 fires full auto on full auto. It fires 3rd rounds in the 3rd burst mode. And by the way for the novice. If you fire one round in the 3rd mode, it doesn’t reset itself (like HK). It fires two rounds on the next pull. If you fire two rounds, it fires one round on the next pull. That is why when you buy one out of a PD or SD, it has all that crap removed. Worthless at best. “Making them unavailable”? To who? Law abiding citizens? Do you really think that some bullshit law restricting the ownership of a bump fire stock would have made any difference to this crazy bastard? You don’t get it. Criminals don’t give a shit about any stupid ass law that you implement. Period, end of story. Gee, lets recap how many laws he broke? Not enough room on this web page to post them all. And so far as being an NRA member. I wouldn’t be bragging too much about that. These money grubbing bastards aren’t too much different than the whores that are running this country into the ground. Left and right.
James I am sorry to say your an idiot
i’m with you on this one, james. if you are gonna have a ban on autos, this looks JUST LIKE auto to me. give sumthin’ to get sumthin’. national reciprocity.
National reciprocity for your .gov permission slip.
“bump-fire” (or more correctly known as Slidefire) stocks serve no real purpose other than rate of fire. accuracy is horrible, proper trigger control and technique is nonexistant, for the most part they are a waste of money. I see no point to them.
That said, I oppose ANY legislation regarding gun control, even to pointless aftermarket items such as this. Gun control is an incremental removal of your rights, period. they have already said they will never be happy without full and total gun control and everything else is a step towards that.
ShareBlue, is that you!?
Don’t worry. You can do the same thing with a length of string. So I guess they better get regulating string and para cord and rope.
No. They will take it all.
The “New York Times” wants a total ban of guns. Period. The actually use the word “total.”
The use the word “ban” routinely. “Ban” is an extra legal procedure (meaning outside the Rule of Law), that allows Hilary Clinton, the Democrats, MSM (on behalf of the “Powers That Be PTB to avoid Article V or the Constitution which requires a Constitutional Convention be called before any changes can be made to the Constitution and the Bill of Rights.
“Bans” are almost uniformly applied in almost every aspect of daily life. It is perhaps the most common method used to get around the Rule of Law.
After “bans” comes thugs, brutality, the murder of unarmed civilians by the militarized police, “Suicide By Clinton.” You get the picture.
Please people. We need to stand up and stop this.
Orange Julius will cave in too, just wait and see!
From a paper I did a few years ago. A bit dated but still useful, I think:
From a paper I did on the subject in 2012
There are a multiplicity of fatal knife attacks I could choose from in the US, but to select a recent a couple at random, there was one in Flint, Michigan, where five were killed and eight injured by a knife wielding assailant. http://www.nytimes.com/2010/08/07/us/07brfs-SERIALKILLER_BRF.html?_r=0 and one at a Houston community college in 2013 that injured at least 14, four critically when initial reports came in http://news.yahoo.com/multiple-injuries-reported-stabbing-houston-college-173356578.html or http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/04/09/17673057-at-least-14-hurt-in-stabbing-spree-on-texas-college-campus. Thankfully, race-baiter Al Sharpton has already indicated knives are a possible target for the U.S. – hear him say so himself at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nssQETWpf10&feature=player_embedded .
In March 2013, also in China, knife-wielding attackers killed 29 people and injured 143 in a frenzied attack at a Chinese railway station. The attackers, four of whom were killed by armed police, launched the horrific attack at Kunming railway station in Yunnan province at around 9pm local time yesterday. Full story at http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2570996/At-27-dead-109-injured-gang-knife-wielding-men-attack-train-station-China.html#ixzz2uozgDV6k Of course, once we are done banning knives, perhaps we can ban vehicles, too. In case you don’t remember, there have been mass killings with cars where people drove into crowds in at locations such as NYC, Chapel Hill, NC., London UK (http://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/latest-news/599033/Shooting-parliament-gunfire-UK-attack-report-terror-government-London) or Ohio State Univ. (http://www.foxnews.com/us/2016/11/28/developing-active-shooter-alert-at-ohio-state.html ) just to name a few.
The fact of the matter is, that, per the FBI, the number one weapon used in homicides is a baseball bat: in 2005, there were 445 murders with rifles, but 605 with hammers and clubs; the next year the figures were 438 and 618 respectively, and this trend continued through 2011 with 323 murders committed with a rifle, and 496 with hammers and clubs (and I am omitting the other years for brevity’s sake, not to play the usual leftist game of leaving out inconvenient facts, such as what Al Gore does with his faux global warming charade). Breitbart.com correctly concludes from this that “if more people had a gun, less people would be inclined to try to hit them in the head with a hammer.”
But here is the main point, as Bill Whittle pointed out in his speech to Congress in 2013: Hands and feet are used to murder twice as many people as rifles, knives five times as many as rifles, and medical malpractice, 300 times as many as rifles. Importantly, the reason we don’t ban knives or doctor is that, per Whittle, “society perceives they do more good than bad. And using that reasoning, firearms should never be banned as they prevent a 100 times more violent crimes than murders committed with firearms.” (see http://joemiller.us/2013/03/bill-whittle-the-constitution-is-being-destroyed-only-guns-can-defend-us/#ixzz2OqydpEPB for complete story).
Shtfplan.com illustrates the death toll from guns vis-à-vis other modes of killing graphically below (see https://www.shtfplan.com/headline-news/americas-biggest-killers-the-chart-anti-gunners-dont-want-you-to-see_01052013)
hahaha everytime something actually works the NRA is ready to ban it. yuk yuk, the only arms protected are military arms so keep giving the NRA your money suckers?
This is just one more example of how bogus NRA is. I always knew there were reasons NOT to join them.
Same here. Never joined them, never will. There are other gun rights groups that will actually stand up for all our gun rights, not just those they think members won’t complain about if they are lost.
If it wasn’t for the NRA you would be at best Australia and at worst the UK.
The political reality is we’re eating something with this.
K2
We had better get national reciprocity in exchange(Hudson law) for a bump fire ban. You can use a 3D printer to make slide fire mechanisms, so they wont be able to control anything. I’m not happy with the NRA, but as you say, they are why we haven’t been disarmed. I also support GOA. I look to the NRA as more of the sporting side of shooting and GOA as the more militant anti government organization. I wish GOA had 5 million members.
rellik
The NRA has the political horse power in voting numbers and in the end that’s what counts.
I think a clear argument can be made for National Reciprocity that dove tail fits this tragedy. While this guy was out of handgun range historically mass shootings involve the perpetrator at ground level in handgun range. Its a very plausible argument that carry permit holders, proven over three decades as overwhelmingly law abiding, can potentially stop such tragedies. In the end a good guy with a gun, either closing in, cornering, wounding or killing the criminal ends the carnage.
The Anti Gun people are not looking for solutions only the advancement of their agenda.
If people would shitcan the NRA and support the GOA instead we would have a lot less restrictions and bullshit.
K2 I wish the GOA had 100 million members 🙂
The issue is wishing isn’t reality. You play the hand your dealt.
If we had 100 million Americans as a voting block you would can NAFTA, China Free Trade, The Federal Reserve and numerous wars / CIA nonsense.
What is the “GOA?”
Gun Owners of America.
GOA = Gun Owners of America
A web search can find it.
@ Plan twice: Thanks. I will. Been an NRA member off and on since I was 15-years-old and got my first .22.
The link is
GunOwners.org
open carry should ALSO be allowed in every state.
Rellik, the real reason we’re not disarmed is there are far too many guns to confiscate and there would be a tsunami of blood if TPTB made the attempt. Let Congress pass what they choose. Doesn’t mean I’ll follow it.
They don’t out and out confiscate they legislate. Your you have a kilo of coke in your home? The answer is no. They outlaw possession of Semi autos and they don’t go in in masse. They get them here and there, incremental. A neighbor turns you in. Your driving to work and get pulled over for the ostensible broken tail light. Bingo, cuffs, search warrant, confiscation, jail, big money. Shooting buddy see it. Their wifes tell them, “get rig of that thing” . Lets see, divorce coming $250k or the AR goes.
That would take a hundred years. There are a lot of gun owners and a lot of guns. A lot of owners won’t fall into any kind of trap they set.
They’ll scare over half into compliance with news reports and draconian sentences. Wives will chew off the ear of their husbands. Gun owners are traditionally law abiding coming from a law abiding background.
” A lot of owners won’t fall into any kind of trap they set.”
Sorry but GTFOOH. They work, the have to go to work. They’re unarmed at work. Dope dealers have far more options. Gun owners will rat out others, guaranteed.
Braveheart. Please don’t be so naïve. The Jews thought the same thing about the Germans in 1933.
If the sh*t were to ever really hit the fan the government would be knocking on your door. They know what you have and how much.
blame-e – are you referring to the HOLOHOAX?
There will be no reciprocity.
You guys just don’t get it. As “Concerned-Citizen” said: Hilary Clinton, the Democrats, the MSM, and the “Powers That Be” want to take it all.
Funny how the “worst mass-shooting in U.S. history” just happened to take place when this “silencer” bill was about to come to a vote. [sarcasm]
I think we can expand the circle of “Suicide by Hillary Clinton” to include despicable and deplorable country Western Music and Country Western music concert-goers who are gun-lovers, and Trump supporters.
You got to hand it to Hillary. No messing around in Las Vegas. Her operatives showed-up with machine guns. What’s next if they don’t get their way? M1A1 tanks? Bazookas? Hellfire Missiles? Maybe a tactical nuke?
Even before the dead and wounded were counted, Hillary Clinton, the Democrats, and their operatives (like MSM, the “New York Times” and the “Washington Post” and CBS), are back right back pushing gun control and bump stock bans. They are going to get the silencers, too. They are going to get it all. Not bad for exploiting a mass-shooting for your own agenda.
These people are compete sociopaths. They have no pride and no shame. Why do you think it is always the innocents dying?
If I could say one thing to all these mass-shooters out there: Please. In the future, please think about having these mass-shootings in Washington, DC. Leave the rest of the country alone.
I agree, DC would be better, but then they would be engaging their bosses,
The whole thing stinks of inside job
You can use a 3D printer to print up a full mil spec M4 lower,,, parts kits are easy, no bumps required
Nail,
I thought selective fire trigger parts were hard to get.
Lowers are easy as you say. M4 trigger groups are
something we have to get from the National Guard armory,
with some difficulty.
Easy as pie in this digital age,,, just be careful who you order from
I have no use for any of that crap honestly, i didnt get high dollar barrels and bolts to burn em up blowing through standard ammo as fast as it can feed,
My favorite is just punching one hole in a selected spot at 200-400 yards or more,,
I think my favorite AR is one i built from scratch, Ace fixed skeleton stock, Black hole Armory barrel, JP Comp, some tricky doohickeys and matched upper and lower, with Sierra Blitz king bullets it kills wild dogs or does at 300 yards easy with head shots, usually 1 shot and down, a dime can usually cover the groups at 200 yards off a bipod if the wind isnt too nasty
“We” won’t get shit in return for allowing a ban on bump fire stocks. It will just embolden the statists. We all know that.
Good point that people need to think about
Amen brother once again the nra f#*ks us this is why I don’t give them a dime give to any other gun right organization the nra give crap one about guns they want money that’s it they will always give your rights up eventually its the frog in boiling water thing
Without the NRA you would be defending the BB capacity in the only “weapon” you would be allowed to have, a Daisy Red Rider BB gun.
NRA accomplishments
1. Defeating the Clinton “Assault Gun Ban” with the brilliant 10 year expiration.
2. CONSEALED CARRY both Shall Issue and now Constitutional Carry
Only in dream land can one achieve 100% victories. One would be naive to think that somehow your Second Amendments is more safe without the NRA.
Lol didn’t defeat the Clinton ban. The ban expired.
joe
“Lol didn’t defeat the Clinton ban. The ban expired.”
The ban EXPIRED because the NRA got in a 10 year expiration. The political reality was it was passing in 1994. The NRA banked on a better political environment a decade later. No NRA, no 10 year expiration and hence a continued assault gun ban and worse. This is the reality.
Ok, you have a point, yippee for the NRA,,,
Perhaps everybody needs to grow a pair and tell DC they can go fuck themselves,
That sounds like a much better platform to me
With all due respect, you are wrong, Braveheart.
The NRA is the oldest lobbying organization in the United States.
The sole purpose of the NRA is to protect the Constitution of the United States of America, the Bill of Rights, and the Second Amendment.
The NRA catches a lot of heat about their defense of the Second, but look at the source.
Hilary Clinton, the Democrats and the MSM obsess over the NRA’s commitment to the defense of the Second Amendment. To these people, anyone who defends the Constitution, the Bill of Rights, and the Second must be evil.
The NRA provides valuable services. They teach gun safety at YMCA camps (or they use to). They are a huge presence at gun clubs and rifle ranges all over the United States.
Granted, they are a little heavy-handed about membership, dues, and political activity. You either give or you do give. Once you say no, or not this time, they go away. They don’t raid your bank account with “automatic renewal” like some businesses do — like Barnes and Noble.
Without the NRA we would already be Nazi Germany.
Blame-e, with ‘all due respect in return’, answer this for me. IF the NRA is the TRUE pro-2A champion they’ve always claimed to be, why do we have ANY ‘gun control’ laws on the books at all? THEY COMPROMISE THE SECOND AMENDMENT! Did you know they occasionally work with the BATFE on certain gun-related issues? THE BATFE! AND THEY’LL GO OUT AND DISARM PEOPLE FASTER THAN ANY OTHER LE AGENCY OUT THERE. THEY LIVE FOR THINGS LIKE THAT. THEY ARE TOTALLY ANTI-PUBLIC, ANTI-GUN, ANTI-SELF DEFENSE, ANTI-AMERICAN, ETC. NRA IS ALWAYS SAYING, ‘FOLLOW THE LAW EVEN IF IT’S UNCONSTITUTIONAL’. THEY HAVE LITERALLY WORKED WITH POLITICIANS EVER SINCE NFA 34 TO BRING ABOUT THESE GUN CONTROL LAWS. THEY ALSO HELPED BRING ABOUT GCA 68. CHARLTON HESTON SUPPORTED GUN CONTROL. REMEMBER, HE WAS AN ACTOR. HE WAS TOTALLY ANTI-GUN WHILE PUTTING ON HIS ‘SHOWS’ AT THE NRA CONVENTIONS CLAIMING TO BE OTHERWISE. YOU CAN GOOGLE EVERYTHING I’VE SAID AND VERIFY IT FOR YOURSELF. THAT’S THE REAL NRA. THEY’RE IN THE SAME SEWER WITH POLITICIANS. WHAT PART OF ‘SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED’ DON’T PEOPLE HERE UNDERSTAND?
There was a question in that rant somewhere?
It is all a sewer in DC. A sweet cesspool. Or a swamp. Call it “Rome” if you need to. Everybody who works for the government gets dirty. The NRA has to work not just with politicians, but professional politicians.
And layoff the caps. When you use caps you are just yelling. And you are not showing respect, that is the last thing you are doing when you yell at someone. Go beat the wife, or the kids, or the dog. Jerk off or something.
What do they say? He who angers first loses.
Show a little class.
GFY – TROLL
Blame-e, OK I apologize for the all caps and everyone here knows I don’t use all caps on a regular basis. But I have the same legitimate concerns here that all gun owners have. I’ve never seen anything that gives me reason to trust the NRA. And I believe as everyone else the that the Vegas Massacre was a false-flag perpetrated by the anti-gun crowd. No matter what happens I’m not giving up anything. I don’t submit to anyone who has bad intentions toward me.
I can tell you why….”Braveheart”….because of freeloading backstabbers like you who have enjoyed your rights thanks to the sacrifices and efforts of others. Folks like you who are unwilling to join a movement or make any effort at all to work for the common good of the rights we all cherish. You, and others like you, are pieces of shit, and will be the first killed when the SHTF. You are a keyboard commando, and that’s where you end. The real fight that we all face in the immediate future will be joined by MEN, while scumbags like you, and Gandhi, and Falloutboy sit crying on the sidelines.
Jonny V, you sound just like anonymous or the other trolls. I’m NOT a freeloader or backstabber, mofo. I was simply trying to present the reality of an organization who so many think are a true 2A champion. You sound like one of those POS in the MSM attacking me. When TSHTF, I’ll be out there holding my own. I may not make it ALL the way through to the other side but I’ll last a lot longer than you think, asshole. Wanna talk about backstabbers? Look no further than your beloved NRA, who have done nothing but COMPROMISE on the 2A. Let’s see you explain how COMPROMISING the 2A is supposed to SAVE it. I’d be interested in that one.
Looks like Jonny V either hasn’t seen my response to him or doesn’t care about it. That’s OK. I know I’m right regardless.
“IF the NRA is the TRUE pro-2A champion they’ve always claimed to be, why do we have ANY ‘gun control’ laws on the books at all? ”
Newsflash. The NRA is a grassroots political group not the arbiter of law and courts. We have a government not mob rule. We operate within its framework. This is reality.
I didn’t even know what the heck a bump stock was. Can’t be accurate though right? Arnt machine guns used to suppress an enemy rather than get a lot of kills?
Jim;
Yes, that bothers me too. Three or four guns would have done the same thing.
Why two windows broken out? That would take time to run back and forth. I didn’t
see any broken windows or shooting platforms in the room….so maybe just no picture?
Nothing about this case makes any sense. Some say in photos of his body he had black eye?
Dead people don’t bruise.
Where are all these pictures? Casino’s have daily tapes of everyone in there and security watching. Hundreds of people see and know him. What do they mean he has no social life?
Was some multi billionaire bankrolling him and he was laundering money in the Casino’s? No proof of loss…..little proof of winnings? Why would he use GF’s credit card?
Does the Casino have mooslime, mafia, communist, Asian roots….and this is how they pay him or his handlers?
Is he a “front” guy for some one?
He had gun rockets…aren’t they mussy equiptment? ( have never seen Americans use them.)
He would have to connected with 1 round every second to make over 600 hits. Don’t see “bump fire” making that possible. Where was the yuuuge pile of brass?
I wouldn’t be interested in buying one but to each his own. They don’t need regulation. However I am disappointed that the NRA has hoisted the white flag again.
If the GOA would do a massive campaign for members and show them that the NRA are sellouts I bet many would convert. People join the NRA because it is the most recognized and oldest not because it’s the best.
Politicians don’t even know that the GOA (despite their best intentions) even exists. The NRA has the voting numbers that politicians respect in areas of somewhat favorable demographics. I seen the NRA CIA in action in NJ against Governor Jim Florio who was being groomed by TPTB (attended a Bilderburg Meeting). Look up “Hands Across NJ” back in 1990/1991. Tax Protestors, many in opposition to the NRA going after the common enemy. Give you a hint. The anti tax group was not started by tax protestors.
You guys have no idea…….
Jim Florio was politically destroyed, gone from politics.
F Them!! Make your own with 3D printer!! Start making everything and SHUT your mouths!! Tell no one!
Call the NRA-ILA at (800) 672-3888 and let them know how you feel about their betrayal!
One shot, one kill.
Trade off. National Reprocity.
There will be no “trade off”.
Throwing the statists bump fire stocks won’t even slow down their march. On the contrary, “giving up” something only emboldens an adversary.
Soon the NRA will only stand for Nerf Rifle Association.
I was even going to donate to them today. But like Pelosie
said she hopes it is a slippery slope on gun control. NRA
you are over with me. Never never never give in. Is not a phrase
the NRA understands.
“Never never never give in. Is not a phrase the NRA understands.”
And accomplish what? Hitler told his troops no retreat at Stalingrad and lost an entire army. You play the cards as best you can. If you think your not eating something on this your naive. The goal is to stop at all cost putting high capacity “military style” semi autos into the regulatory / registration process of NFA 34.
Kevin2, I’ve got an M1 Carbine and 2 Ruger 10/22s that, in theory, could fall under that category. Doesn’t mean I’ll get them registered.
Foolish to admit their possession in this time and day. Let them roll them into NFA 34 and its equivalent to having an unregistered MP40 or a kilo of coke . Shoot it where? Show it to who?
The goal is to prevent them from coming under NFA 34.
Whats that saying, better to have it and not need it than need it and not have it,,,
The Deplorable Braveheart
Make no mistake, just like the drug enforcement, shooters caught in possession of one unregistered semi auto will dime out others in possession or two to get off or a reduced sentence. A decade in prison with a destroyed life gets even mafia guys to rat. They’ll get you at work when they know that your unarmed.
No they won’t. I don’t work anywhere, and they’ll never find me in “possession” of anything.
I’ll never rat on anyone, as I don’t really know anything for sure and can swear to it. I know I can pass a lie detector test. I’ve done it before.
The courts have ruled that unconstitutional laws have no more effect than if they had never been passed. Ignore the hell out of them.
Archivist, right you are. Screw them it’s only illegal if you get caught. I can’t stand RATS! If someone ratted on me they would disappear at first chance. I never rat on anyone even fookers that ARE rats.
And theres apparently lots of rats,
Archivist
“No they won’t. I don’t work anywhere, and they’ll never find me in “possession” of anything.”
You don’t work and won’t rat when faced with a decade in prison and financial ruin. That makes you one very rare individual. By and large people do work and when faced with draconian penalties will rat.
There is still plenty of power with the NRA. You being a member of the NRA strikes terror into people like Hilary Clinton, the Democrats, MSM, and the “Powers that Be.”
Remember: This country was founded by terrorists (Oops. I meant “Patriots.” Yeah. “Patriots.”)
Blame-e, I can never in good conscience join an organization that preaches following unconstitutional and unjustifiable laws that can potentially turn people into victims of crime, tyranny, etc. The same politicians that NRA works with are always passing illegitimate laws about one issue or another. I only live by the BILL OF RIGHTS and nothing else.
DB,
I’m a life member of the NRA and have been so for years.
They piss me off all the time, but they have have political clout.
I like GOA and probably will become a life member with them.
I also contribute to CCRKBA. They are radical guys from my adopted
home state.
I play both sides. I always obey all Federal, state and local laws, but in a second I’d be doing what is necessary if the Federal, state, and local laws become a threat. I suspect that
describes most people on this site.
Your stickers are on cars of people, who make me wonder how they are able to drive, in a competitive job market — people, clearly incapable of abstract thinking.
I have no intention of owning these stocks, in the foreseeable future, yet still see it as being an infringement, according to the dictionary definition of infringement.
Noone can realistically explain how a Paddock or his mail order bride comes to possess valuables, under a meritocracy.
Let’s look at some realities here…both practical and political.
1. The conditions for a high body count in Las Vegas were ideal when it comes to the use of a fully automatic weapon. Had Paddock been in semi-auto mode, he might have succeeded in killing as many (provided he was good with a rifle), but there would not have been as many wounded. The bumpfire stocks made it possible for him to do that….simply because there were so many people in a confined area. As anyone who has ever fired a full-auto weapon will tell you, they are not designed for surgical precision accuracy. They are designed for fire suppression in a combat situation, where you are trying to prevent your enemy from shooting back at you, or if you are being attacked by a numerically superior foe and you need to put a lot of rounds downrange into a whole bunch of people. Other than that….all full-auto does is waste ammo. If full-auto were the be-all end-all ultimate weapon, every man in a rifle squad would be carrying one. The most important thing in a combat situation (especially as it might relate to the average citizen) is to be able to hit what it is you want to shoot. Semi-auto is perfect for that…and it’s really all you need.
2. The political climate is such that it is going to be darn near impossible for the spineless cowards we have in the Republican Party to NOT throw some kind of bone to the Democrats when it comes to this. Like it or not, a ban on bumpfire stocks will not be an infringement on our right to keep and bear arms. A magazine restriction or outright ban on a specific class of weapons WOULD. And there might even be an opportunity for bargaining here that would give us something far more valuable….like say…..we’ll go along with banning the bumpfire device if you’ll go along with legalizing suppressors. I think a legal low-cost suppressors would be a far better thing than a bumpfire device. Again….unless you are trying to hold off an amphibious landing, full-auto only wastes ammunition. And if we ever face a real SHTF situation where there is no long Rule of Law, then it is not that difficult to convert a semi-auto into a full auto anyway…..if that’s what you really need to hold off the zombies.
3. Finally…by being obstinate regarding a device that is of limited practical use, we run the risk of totally losing across the board. Face it….they want to get all the guns out of citizen’s hands anyway. But why help them by alienating people in the public who are otherwise sympathetic. I’ve been hearing people call in on the radio talk shows who are sympathetic to gun ownership…and even high capacity magazines…but they just don’t see the problem with eliminating a device that serves no real practical purpose..even in a normal self-defense scenario.
Of course, it can be argued that a ban on these devices won’t stop real criminals anyway….and that’s true. But again, most semi-autos can be pretty easily converted to full auto anyway…so a determined criminal WILL find a way regardless.
We should pick the proverbial hill that we are willing to die on, so to speak. And in my opinion, the bumpfire stock is not it. What we should be trying to do is get a national CCW reciprocity law passed and allow for the legalization of sound suppressors without a permit. A “smart” politician would see this….but I’m not sure we have any of those.
News flash – this vegas BS was another “shooting” HOAX.
I fell in LOVE with Lisa. Nothing more sexy than a beautiful girl shooting a AR.
This is why I dropped out of the NRA. I love old Ted, but he had better get his head out of the sand or they will ruin him also.
Sgt.
Indeed Sarge. She possessed quite a nice bump stock.
Amen to that.
A concordance is a Bible dictionary, which, ideally, references every written word. How politically correct are the roles of man and woman, husband and wife. Let her do what pertains to a woman, and I will be suitably impressed.
My fear is so many taking drugs now, it is dangerous to have one in a neighborhood. Several years ago, before cell phones, I saw an AK on a bipod sitting alone on street curb. Being a mother, that was a little disturbing.
Were they trying to sell it? Was it stolen? An abused woman dumped it?…..don’t know.
In a perfect world everyone should have what ever they want. BUT…..the last few years there are psychotic whacko’s out there that do some really stupid s**t.
Granted, I don’t want to be shooting with a bow and arrow when someone comes shooting at me with a machine gun!!!!
Too bad this is the world we live in. ?
They “caved”…?? HOW MUCH WERE THEY PAID? (Only relevant question).
As much as people sent them lol.
What the ‘Gomers’ in the NRA (of which organization I am a member) forget are 2 things. 1. muskets vs. military full-auto are not sufficient a physical check to totalitarianism nowadays. There is not one good reason law-abiding citizens should not be allowed to exercise their right to the same physical protection that the military and/or law-enforcement personnel use. If anything, the people should have the ability to stop any incursion upon those rights by those same groups who…. wait for it… work for them. 2. any back-woods yea-hoo can bump-fire a semi-auto rifle using no more than his belt-loop. Granted, it’s a hip-fire situation; but, it’s the same deal. Furthermore to create one’s own device is just not rocket-science. What? A stock that fits the rifle stock-tube, a piece of ‘L’-shaped material extended from that same stock? A catch to prevent the stock from falling off the tube? No, not a hard thing to make. Hell, making a smooth-bore 12 gauge out of black-pipe takes more time to ream the cartridge chamber out a bit to allow for the shell to fit properly.
Canceling my NRA membership!!
Cancel memberships!!
The NRA understands reality. You have to pick your battles.
This POS bump stock ain’t worth the political price.
This is why they’ve been so successful over the years.
You whiners who won’t join or donate need to be the first disarmed. You are the pricks who can only be counted on to talk big – never to help.
F@#$king NRA! My local gun club requires 100% NRA membership so we can get a break on our liability insurance. If it was not for that, I would not be a member of the NRA. Join the GOA, Gun Owners of America! They are a NO COMPROMISE 2nd Amendment organization and THEY GET THINGS DONE because they are proactive. CHECK THEM OUT! JOIN THE G.O.A. TODAY!
Bump Fire, I could have done this with my thumb stuck in my belt loop.
Again they blame the Gun, Not the person. There is NO answer to this.
Their system of checks have FAILED. They are full of B.S.
I am NOT responsible for another person actions. But will I have to pay/lose my rights?
Think Long and Hard, Congress, and President Trump.
I refuse to give up on any rights. NRA Money Grubber’s and full of B.S.
Rifle’s are NOT Registered to anyone. Anyone says that is Full of B.S.
NRA Has signed off on every gun control act since 1934.
Is ok now to look for atf to see about new regulations on Gas cans and gasoline, Bats, Knife, Trucks, Automobile, Plane, Ropes and Hands???
How long have bump stocks been around ? Fifteen years ? something like that…Ever heard of them being misused this way?
I haven’t.
As the man said, after 9-11 did anyone propose outlawing jet airliners? You can kill several hundred people at once in one of those things…
<bb
bb in GA
“Ever heard of them being misused this way?”
I’ll place bets that this is a false flag. I’ll go further, it was planned long ago and meant to be used with Hillary as President. Lee Harvey Oswald was the created patsy when he fled to the USSR in 1959 before JFK. A 100% US intelligence operative.
Next years news is being created in offices today, believe it.
This whole thing stinks, is following Matt Brackens Enemies too close for my comfort, theres no way a 64? Year old guy with no military training could pull off that many hits in that short a time at that range even with the density of the group etc,,, and with a bump fire? Yea right, maybe with a well seasoned AR, you could bump through a few hundred rounds, a newer one would be jammed after 3 mags, if you ever spent time behind a bump stock you would be questioning this whole pile o shit too,,,
I want to know who was evacuated from that floor when they were clearing it,,, shooting stopped after whoever opened up on the security guard, he left the floor temporarily, wheres camera footage? None? Really? In Vegas? I dont buy it, not at all
Nailbanger
The questions mount while the answers diminish.
The guy in Vegas could have killed more had he simply loaded his 50lbs of tannerite and ammonium nitrate into a small plane, fueled it to capacity and crashed that into the crowd. The airport was right there, so his approach would have appeared perfectly normal. There’s not a doubt in my mind that would have created more casualties.
Likely 10x or more in a packed group of 22K.
This entire thing is a stage set of what TPTB want banned in one fell swoop.
Lots of guns
Lots of ammo
Lots of high cap magazines
All of the above far more than used in this attack.
I knew it was a matter of time before they found a way to expose the lethality of slide fire stocks.
Of course the politicians are playing dumb when numerous slide fire stock videos have been on YouTube for years.
Does anyone know if the suspected shooter had night vision or thermal on his scopes?
Even with assisted optics firing from that distance with a slide fire stock doesn’t seem to add up.
I believe there was more than one shooter.
If you look at the overhead view on Google maps,the music carnival was surrounded by multiple angles of fire.
Just like Dealy Plaza.
I would not be surprised to find out this was a CIA operation.
“I would not be surprised to find out this was a CIA operation.”
I’de be surprised if it wasn’t; shocked in fact.
DON’T LOOK NOW, BUT “BUMP FIRING” A SEMI-AUTO – a OR aK, CAN BE DONE WITHOUTL ANY DEVICE! It’s not the stock, it’s the agility to hold your trigger finger stationary compared to the trigger. The banning or classifying the bump fire stocks will do NOTHING to protect the public. It WILL make the politicians look like they are doing something..at the expense of the citizens!
The NRA is trying to take some of the air out of the attacks on gun rights that are forthcoming.
They will survive.
Can I say this about full auto, or bump stocks. Anyone in the millitary will say the drill Sargent told them clearly, never use full auto. There may be a moment when it makes sense, but until that moment that most soldiers will never experience, don’t do it.
If you have a system that will empty a magazine in two or three seconds, you might as well be shooting a single shot shotgun! Pull the trigger, reload, wash rinse repeat. I’d take a Keltec 14+1 that could shoot 15 pellet buck 15 times. That’s literally 225 .30 cal rounds down range.
That said a bump stock could be made on almost any 3-D printer in a few hours, or a standard stock converted by anyone with minor skills. Skills by the way that most Jihadists seem to lack.
From a prepping perspective I don’t feel threatened if bump stocks are banned. As a citizen I’m annoyed the second amendment is so easily overthrown. It is a clear indicator we are in need of it more than ever, our freedoms are clearly under attack like never before.
This guy in Vegas was a freaking nut. People like that in my opinion are tools of Satan, possessed some would say. Satan has little time left and knows it. This is why Vegas happened.
Will a nation lash out and punish a 100,000,000 gun owners because of one nut job? I mean they never banned planes when they were used on 911? You bet they will, the progressive globalist serve the same god as the Vegas shooter. Jesus taught us about how a house divided would fall. He was warning us not to mistake Satans seeming mistakes, as actual errors.
“Will a nation lash out and punish a 100,000,000 gun owners because of one nut job?”
First of all, anybody who owns a gun is considered a “nut job,” by people like Hilary Clinton, the Democrats, MSM, and the “Powers That Be.”
Second, the United States has more prisons and more prisoners than any other nation in the world.
Blame-e, someone would have to take 100,000,000 gun owners alive before they can do anything to them. While they might get a handful at the most, there’s no way they’ll take most of us alive. The gun grabbers are the ones who won’t be going home alive.
Don’t be so sure it was that one man….
PTPO, I can agree about the bump stocks but TPTB will be signing their own death warrants if they try to come after 100,000,000 gun owners. The nutcase was the only one of the shooters that was neutralized while the rest got away. So someone wants to lash out at us? They need to be careful what they wish for. I’m still not giving up any guns under any circumstances. My rights are not negotiable.
I’ll be going to a gun show in my area soon. There’s nothing I really need, but I really want to be a fly on the wall there. I’m pretty good at getting people to talk as I smile, nod and listen. I do want to know what people are really thinking in these dangerous times.
To my fellow preppers, gun and survival shows are full of people some listening, some talking. OPSEC. Emotional thing in the news move us, don’t be moved. OPSEC.
I don’t like machine guns myself a waste of ammo. Don’t see anyone really needing stuff like this. But when I think about it bad guys are gonna have shit like this because they are sick and will use it. Don’t think this can be legislated away. People know the concept of bumpfire and can easily duplicate it at their workbench cus of its simplicity. The times are just more dangerous now. Don’t think an assault weapons ban will work because these things are widely proliferated. You can get an ar for around $500 so it’s affordable. Anything lawmakers do will fail. Best way to not be a victim is not be in a crowd this goes for sports games concerts and especially church. Church makes me nervous cus I know Christians are persecuted. I haven’t stopped going though but as for everything else forget it.
Asshat
” Don’t see anyone really needing stuff like this.”
The intent of the Second Amendment is to have “We The People” to have parity with the established military. Its not about fun/sport, hunting or defense from criminal attack.
Just one thing.
Listen to the audio above of the bump stock and then hotel audio. Close your eyes when you do. Play them back in different order.
There is a definite difference. IMO, it has to be an AK or some kind of import. The sound is just too smooth. The AR just doesn’t have that sustained, high rate of fire. That was why the M249 was developed.
Hw come the bump stocks were ok with the ATF under Obama but now its not ok? Personally I don’t want to spend the money for one and shoot that amount of money that quick at that expense either. To each his own. Democrats need to learn lessons on weapons,especially on silencers. They are not as quiet as you might think and it would be stupid to put one on a weapon with a bumpstock. It would be less accurate and it would melt in no time from excessive fire. there again,too expensive for my taste. I’ll stick to ear plugs. Again, to each his own and dems leave us the hell alone!
Effective fire,
Bump stock or OEM full auto aint effective fire
The nra is a complete joke why do you think they got into the insurance business. They want to be the biggest company when all gun owners are required to have insurance and have there foot in the door with carry guard they will agree that gun owners should be required to have insurance and spin it to sound good to the fools. There only concern is money and powerl
1) Bump fire stocks have never been used for a crime prior to this event, as far as we know.
2) Bump fire stocks are TOYS for people who like to shoot firearms faster, exactly the same as collectors of fully automatic firearms.
Banning an object used for a one-off crime is stupid. It deprives law-abiding people who use them legally of their entertainment.
There is a little notion called “freedom” which everyone who proposes banning these devices fails to recognize. People have a right to do what they want provided THEY don’t hurt someone else. The fact that a criminal uses the same object as those people to do a criminal act does NOT justify depriving those other people of their freedom to use that object.
Not to mention the obvious slippery slope which occurs when you start banning things people “don’t need.” That SAME argument has been used repeatedly by the anti-gun crowd to demonize semi-auto pistols and semi-auto rifles and magazine with greater than 10 rounds.
People don’t NEED a car that goes faster than 55mph, but we don’t ban them even though it might save thousands of lives every year when people exceed the speed limit.
People who who propose banning an object because people don’t “need” it are part of the problem. That includes the NRA who apparently is caving in in order to avoid further negative press. I get that people want to “make a deal” but there IS NO deal to be made. Ban one object on this basis and you’ll end up with no Second Amendment eventually.
It’s that simple.
I’ll add that technically speaking these devices do NOT turn a semi-auto weapon into a fully automatic weapon. They just enable the trigger to be pulled faster. The definition of a fully automatic weapon is one that fires multiple bullets with each trigger pull; semi-auto is one bullet per trigger pull and this remains true for bump fire devices.
People who get that wrong are just helping the enemy.
One murderer (we only know what the government has told us) is said (again by the government) to have used a bump stock and >150,000,000 Americans are penalized before the evidence is even presented. Apparently unalienable rights are not afforded due process and it would seem to be such actions are endorsed by the civil rights organization known as the NRA.
The left calls the NRA evil. Today I fully agree, they need to just go away.
Only your enemy wants you disarmed. We should thank all our wonderfull LEOs who swore an oath to the constitution. For enforsing blatantly unconstitutional laws?
Let’s ban a piece of plastic. #3D printers. Lol
The second like all the other admendments is a God given right. Its not the property of the NRA to bargain away.
I am so glad that I have not given them shit in over 15 yrs. Now I can go shopping for a real organization. Yellow cowards!
And now, here come the phone calls/telemarketers from the NRA, asking for donations.
They are dead to me.
Fuck the NRA
The NRA is to gun owners what the GOP establishment is to republican voters.
Canada couldn’t get its citizens to register their guns . Spent a billion bucks on the program. They finally gave up .
Confiscation etc won’t work here….if they tried it would not end well .
time to repeal the NFA and the unconstitutional ban on automatic weapons. Time for going on the offense, people, not time to sell out any additional rights. the GOP seems hellbent on delivering an Obama agenda item and blocking any of Trumps. Time to put the GOP on notice.
“time to repeal the NFA and the unconstitutional ban on automatic weapons.”
There is no doubt of its unconstitutionality but the political climate does not exist to get the votes to do it through the legislature. The courts have walked around the Second Amendment like a soldier through a minefield avoiding contact at all cost. The best hope, the only hope is through the back door of the 10th Amendment which is gaining support.
Tenth Amendment
The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.
The interstate commerce clause has been used since Roosevelt to circumvent the 10th Amendment. If the weapon is manufactured in a given state its not in “Interstate Commerce”. Those weapons for sale beyond the state boundary are. This don’t condone its up from unconstitutional nature but offered a potential remedy without the USSC directly addressing the much feared Second Amendment.
How about simply banning Democrats, BLM, Muslims, and Antifa from owning any firearms.
Hell, ban anyone with left wing political veiws from owning them. They seem to be the ones causing the violence.
Sounds like you people are in need of a little pep talk. From the archives of keep and bear arms a memorandum on arms and freedom by Brian Puckett with thanks to oathkeepers.
ht tp://www.keepandbeararms.com/information/XcIBViewItem.asp?ID=526
There is a way to shut-up these deep pocketed, communists,
anti American, demonrats for good.
If they will agree to these terms. Sign an agreement….
and Deposit $500 million dollars for each class action lawsuit.
And agree to pay each and every person who is injured, killed,
or harmed because of the criminal actions of an intruder, thief, attacker,
kidnapper, or any Government employee, contractor, agent, or anyone,
who so ever, uses a weapon against any “innocent law abiding” person…
(especially those who are denied the “right of ownership” of said Illegal
or legal weapons used by the said person’s above).
Even if they agree to these terms….they would / could never live by them……?☹️
all wars are bankers’ wars
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=20&v=5hfEBupAeo4