How To Improve Your Odds Of Surviving If A Massive Catastrophe Hits Your City

by | May 26, 2017 | Headline News | 245 comments

Do you LOVE America?


    This guide was originally published by Joshua Krause at


    The main thread that seems to run through the prepper community, is that most preppers really want to get out of the cities and live a rural life. It’s easy to understand why. Most preppers rightfully believe that the cities would be the most dangerous places to be if society collapsed. Rural areas are generally safer, have less burdensome governance, and provide the opportunity to gain some degree of self-sufficiency.

    Unfortunately, making that transition away from the city is difficult. There’s a reason why the vast majority of the population in America lives in urban and suburban areas. That’s where the jobs are, and that’s where most modern conveniences exist.

    So if for whatever reason you can’t move away from the city, the next best thing you can do is find a city that will give you better odds of surviving a SHTF scenario. I know, it sounds like blasphemy. However, not all cities are created equal and believe it or not, there are certain conditions that make some urban areas better suited for preppers over others, such as:

    City Size and Density

    The best cities for preppers are on the smaller size, with a slightly lower population density. And obviously, I’m not talking about one of those cities that is part of a larger metropolitan area. There are plenty of cities that range in size from 50,000 to 250,000 people and aren’t subsumed by a wider urban sprawl. Instead, they are surrounded by a few suburbs, small towns, or even just wilderness. If you lived in one of these places, you’d have the benefit of job security while still being just a stone’s throw away from rural areas that you could flee to.

    Conservative Values

    I hate to sound biased. Though I don’t consider myself liberal or conservative, I have to confess that cities with populations that lean a bit more to the right are much better places for preppers. Aside from the fact that local governments and regulations would be less onerous, these cities are a lot more stable. The cost of living tends to be less in conservative cities, and there usually isn’t as much wealth inequality as there is in liberal cities.

    That means there won’t be as many people dependent on the government and not as many people living on the streets. It means fewer people who are living at the end of their rope by the time catastrophe strikes. It means fewer people with a “kill the rich” attitude. So in short, living in a conservative city means that when the SHTF, there won’t be as much looting and rioting, and law and order won’t erode as quickly.


    When you’re prepping in a rural area, it’s important to consider how connected you are to the rest of the world. Since you’re probably trying to protect yourself from people fleeing the cities, you don’t want to be living down the road from an interstate. However, when a prepper is looking for a city to live in, the opposite strategy should be employed.

    Since self-sufficiency isn’t an option, you have to think about what will allow a city to recover faster from a disaster. I’d wager that the more connected that city is with the rest of the country, the faster it will recover. If you’re in living a place that is landlocked in the mountains with only one major road running through it, you might be in trouble. It’s going to be so much easier for that city to be cut off, which will make it harder for aid to arrive. It will also make it harder for people to flee. If you’re stuck in a city during a disaster, you want people to leave, and you want it to be easier for you to leave if need be. If society collapses, a city can only support a very small population, so the fewer people there are the better your odds of surviving are.

    So look for cities that have plenty of ways in and out. Better yet, pick a city that is at least near a railroad that carries freight. We all know that if there was a nationwide disaster, the freeways would be clogged for miles in every direction. But railroads won’t have that problem. And if they suffered any damage, then they’ll be a lot easier to fix.

    Are You Downwind?

    If the grid goes down for a long period of time, there is a serious risk that many of America’s nuclear power plants could meltdown, so it would be wise to live in a city that isn’t downwind from these facilities. You should also be wary of any major military bases or nuclear silos. They will be prime targets if there is a nuclear war, and you certainly don’t want to be downwind from that.


    You should also seriously consider what kinds of water resources are in or near your city. Throughout the 20th century, sprawling cities like Las Vegas, Phoenix, and Los Angeles, have grown in areas where there is very little water. These populations are heavily reliant on water that is piped in from long distances. Should society collapse, these cities will die with it. So you should find a city that isn’t so reliant on the water that comes from hundreds of miles away.


    And finally, consider how your city is powered. If the city you choose is near a flowing source of water, check to see if it’s near a hydroelectric dam too. In an urban area that is receiving at least some of its energy from a dam, it’s probably not going to take long to get the lights back on. Cities that are powered by natural gas aren’t such a bad choice either since gas pipelines are relatively stable. It may not take very long to make that infrastructure functional again. However, those pipelines could easily be destroyed during a war.

    Cities that are powered by coal would probably be the worst choice because coal needs to be delivered by truck and train. This will be especially true for cities that reside further inland, where many miles of roads will need to be cleared before coal shipments can be delivered. In most cases in America, coal is delivered by train, so if you pick a city that is also near a railway then there are better odds that your city will receive power after the SHTF.

    This article was originally published by Joshua Krause at Tess Pennington’s Ready Nutrition Website.

    Joshua Krause was born and raised in the Bay Area. He is a writer and researcher focused on principles of self-sufficiency and liberty at Ready Nutrition. You can follow Joshua’s work at our Facebook page.

    The Prepper's Blueprint

    Tess Pennington is the author of The Prepper’s Blueprint, a comprehensive guide that uses real-life scenarios to help you prepare for any disaster. Because a crisis rarely stops with a triggering event the aftermath can spiral, having the capacity to cripple our normal ways of life. The well-rounded, multi-layered approach outlined in the Blueprint helps you make sense of a wide array of preparedness concepts through easily digestible action items and supply lists.

    Tess is also the author of the highly rated Prepper’s Cookbook, which helps you to create a plan for stocking, organizing and maintaining a proper emergency food supply and includes over 300 recipes for nutritious, delicious, life-saving meals. 

    Visit her web site at for an extensive compilation of free information on preparedness, homesteading, and healthy living.


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      1. TEST

        “I hate to sound biased”

        Actually, Joshua, please DO. Truth is, the left is full of the entitlement mentality that can’t even survive their food stamp cards on the blink for day without rioting. There’s a reason for that country western song “Country Boys can Survive.”

        I’m stuck in some hellhole blue state city for reasons that can’t be helped… for now. But trust me, I – or the rest of you – will be MUCH better off around self reliant types that are invariably conservative of libertarian than some entitled snowflake that can’t even LISTEN to words that upset them.

        Lewis and Clark, the men who fought at Midway, Bataan, Normandy, or the horrible battles of the Civil War, mountain men like Jedediah Smith or Kit Carson, or my ancestors on my mother’s side that were on the Oregon Trail would be DISGUSTED with their scions. Heck, I, myself, am disgusted every time I look around.

        • YellowPokaDotBikini

          The little sleepy town near where I live, will not have any problems, we are 98% White and fairly civilized. Unless the Beer trucks can’t make their weekly deliveries, and then all bets are off. I’m guessing by the size of some of these Convenience store walk in coolers we have about a week of beer on reserve. Once the word gets out and that is gone, who knows? I’m guessing the clever Local Moonshine deliveries will come alive out of no where, like the lone ranger and his sidekick Tonto and save the day.

          We may just block a few bridges and roads to monitor traffic coming from the larger municipalities of the hoards trying to escape the chaos. We may let you pass through safely, but there is not stopping and stretching your legs, Just keep on moving, especially if you are NON-White. And there will be plenty of Confederate Flags flying to send the message loud and clear. You won’t survive if you try pulling some Sh!t!

          • YellowPokaDotBikini

            Bottom line: Those educated on the situation of what a collapse will look like, need to get as far away from the Commie Socialist freeshit army of thieves and useless eaters, that all think, everything in life is free for the taking. Because when the Government stops giving it to them, they will loot to get what they think they deserve, and they will be stealing your stuff you prepared for. That’s when Preppers and patriot shoot when they loot.

            So those areas where these useless masses live, just happen to be in larger cities. Where most of the convenience of the Government free shit exists.

            I think it is a fallacy speaking from experience, that the author here says its a hard transition from the city to the country. Wrong, once you sell your over priced property in the city cash out the equity and move to the country, you won’t have to make that much money to support the rat race mentality like in the city. Half acre in the city is like $3K in annual property taxes, Out in the country you pay like $100 an acre per year in Prop taxes. And you have plenty of room to build a garden which also knocks off your food bill, then stay off the Grid with 100% Solar and that’s one other less utility bill you won’t have to pay, get your own water well and septic and what is left for bills to have to pay? Auto insurance, cell bill, internet and that’s about it, besides Gas and fuels like propane to cook. You can live in the country on $1000 a Month easy. Just carry no other debt. And you can pay all of that Rat Race Debt off when you cash out from your City house. That’s what I did. No Brainer.

            Also keep in mind, the sooner you cash out and get out of the city now, the better chance you have to survive in the country. Imagine trying to sell your depreciated house smothered with gangs looting in a collapse. Or have to abandon it all, and flee like a refugee. Be 3 steps ahead of any colllapse, that’s what preppers do.

            • Gandhi

              We need to up the property tax on hillbilly land so hillbillies can’t afford it.

              • Gandhi

                We really don’t want poor ignorant hillbillies surviving to breed with their mothers, brothers and sisters. Heck they would all be pick’n a banjo

              • Gandhi

                Perhaps we could do it the old fashioned way and dam up the river and flood those hillbilly preppers out?

                • Jackie

                  Ghandi we know how to swim and we have boats too. Try again.

              • Jackie

                Hillbillies are not only well educated today but they know how to take a nickel and turn it into a quarter. They probably have more money than you do. Do not underestimate them.

              • Jackie

                Do not underestimate Hillbillies. They are well educated now and have more money than you probably do. I know…I am one of them.

          • BigBadWolf

            Yeah but what about the Lezbo you paid off with cig lighters for busting out post holes?
            She’s probably gonna be gunning for ya Poke-A-Dot

          • Jacknife

            You could always go to the dollar store with Jeremiah Johnson and he will pick out the best items for your stocks. Just sayin
            Stay quiet Be smart

          • YellowPokaDotBikini

            in 1906 My Great Great Grandfather and his wife gave their 80 acre farm in Wisconsin to one of their sons, and loaded up a wagon pulled by a couple of horses and took the southern wagon train trail through Texas all the way out to Los Angeles. Talk about guts. Hell today women bitch if they are more than 15 minutes away from a grocery store. Both of those Grand Parents lived well into their 80’s, which back in 1906 the average age that most men lived was 48, and women was about 52. Good genes in my family. So when I run up against some task or project, I reflect back to the grit my forefathers had and push on.

            Imagine all the problems they ran into on the way in that 2500 mile journey. I have photos of them of their 50th wedding anniversary and they look old as dirt and very withered faces, but hey, clean living and the curiosity for adventure is what kept them going. I wish they would have written some letters or memoirs about that wagon ride trip. That would be very interesting to read. Got to think 1906 there were barely any cars running. The original Ford Model T was built in 1908. And I imagine taking a train was pretty expensive back then. Even if they traveled 50 miles a day non stop, it would have taken them 50 days to make that journey. I bet it took them about 3 months to get out there. Considering it was a dirt wagon trail bumps and all. Think they were Preppers and carried a few shotguns and pistols?

        • Eisenkreutz

          Going back to the mainland for supplies.

          • BlackMoe

            Going upstairs?

        • Rebel Son

          Hell man , welcome to the party
          I call it a target rich environment
          I’m like 18 miles outside of Detroit
          Smoke em if ya got em

          • tuesdayissoylentgreenday

            Ten four…..

          • Gandhi

            Yes, if there is a nuclear exchange I suggest you camp in the middle of the fallout field, no one will look for you there.

        • john stiner

          It means fewer people who are living at the end of their rope by the time catastrophe strikes. It means fewer people with a “kill the rich” attitude. So in short, living in a conservative city means that when the SHTF, there won’t be as much looting and rioting, and law and order won’t erode as quickly.


          However, if you look at Venezuela, the looting and rioting and conflicts appear to be organized. Organized by the opposition.

          Now look at this article:
          ht tp://

          Sen. Tim Kaine’s youngest son was one of eight people charged in Minnesota Friday in relation to their alleged disruption of a rally supporting President Trump.

          This is organized chaos by the democrats. This group threw a smoke bomb into the Trump supporters and he is the son of the Democratic VP candidate.

          The expectation is that if you go to a Trump rally you will get beat up.

          Since this rioting and “protesting” and looting is organized, being in a small town may not necessary protect you. You may just be a smaller target, but still a target.

      2. TnAndy

        If you really feel a catastrophe could happen ( and let’s face it, most really DON’T either believe it…or even suspect), then you only course of action is to move to a rural area, and work like the dickens to set up the most self sustaining place you can.

        All urban areas are highly dependent on imported food, water, energy and so on, and all of them will suffer in a collapse.

        • TheGuy

          Ok. So you can get water from a well you can get power from solar sure this is all great.

          Here’s what you can’t get:

          ? How much land do you need to grow heating sources? Someone do an article on this including the math.

          ? How much land and TIME do you need to grow adequate food? Article… MATH…

          ? Is there a doctor in the house? I didn’t think so.

          ? When you’re 75 years old and incapable of labor now what?

          ? Where do you poop? Septic? Sure great. And that… will be cleaned… out… when again (and for that matter HOW again)?

          Oh right I forgot the solar is not grid tie. Well shit. Now you need batteries. That die in 5 years. Right. And the spares don’t have much more of a shelf life just sitting on the backup shelf. RIGHT.

          Those… come from the magic battery fairy, right?


          I’m thinking town or small city. Sorry I can’t figure out how to Grizzly Adams my way out of this shit.

          • durangokidd

            Q: “? How much land do you need to grow heating sources? Someone do an article on this including the math.”

            A: That’s why some kind of solar power is ESSENTIAL to run heaters. Batteries ? Yes helpful but at least you can have some power during daylight hours, which is more than our forefathers had and they built a great nation. Lead acid batteries can be reconstituted with epsom salt, btw. Also, if you live near a Nat’l Forest you can collect firewood, cut up downed trees from a fire, etc.

            Q: ” How much land and TIME do you need to grow adequate food? Article… MATH…”

            A: The future of farming is VERTICAL, and SPROUTS are much more nutritious anyway. It’s also why you should have stores of dehydrated food. I will be spending the summer making a tonne of jerky. You should also have knowledge of the local flora and know what to eat so you can forage.

            Q: ? When you’re 75 years old and incapable of labor now what?”

            A: You will likely die. No one lives forever. That said, you should have been taking care of your body long before that and it would serve you for many years beyond that. I am 67 years old. People think I am 50. Treat your body the way you would have your body treat you. Walking is the best exercise for BOTH mind and body.

            TIP of the Day. Look for answers rather than excuses. It’s a more productive use of your time. To survive when others don’t, your glass must be half full. 🙂

            • Jacknife

              Damn you’re old.

              • durangokidd

                Yes and wise beyond my years. 🙂

          • rellik

            Where I live we have all that covered.
            I’m just on the most isolated island in
            the world. That is the down side.
            I’m prepared to go back to 1800’s
            living but only after my freezer
            BTW if you make it to 75
            I can’t say you have a lot to complain
            about, unless you are a godless heathen.
            Nobody gets out of here alive.

            • Overthecliff

              Oh crap I’m 75 now.

              • rellik

                My real plan is live to 120 and to be killed by a jealous husband.

                • Plan twice, prep once

                  Boom chaka lacka, lacka, boom chacka lacka, lacka, boom boom boom!

                • LaManiac

                  Thanks needed a laugh!

                • TEST

                  And then stand before God with that history, Rellik?

                  You are going to be dead a WHOLE lot longer than you will be alive, even if you live to 220. Plan accordingly

              • Gandhi

                Over the hill, put me in your will. That will be my way of prepping.

            • Anonymous

              Ah, the guy who likes to watch “idiot” programs like Star Trek (and considers people who watch it idiots) makes another idiotic statement. For isolation your lump of volcanic effluence doesn’t even make the top 12.


            • TEST

              Most isolated island in the world is the Kerguelen Islands, just in case anyone is interested. Something a little easier to access is Cape Breton, Nova Scotia, where I have property

            • YellowPokaDotBikini

              rellik, you don’t need a freezer if you cann all your meat and veggies. You need a good Pressure Canning Pot. American makes a good one. Start stocking up on lots of extra canning jars and lots and lots of lids.

            • TheGuy

              I’m from LA. Do you think I might be a Godless Heathen? What are the chances?

              I’ll try to remedy that but when you’re dealing with a Church… where for… example… the pastor let his 27 year old daughter die of breast cancer instead of getting doctors involved? Well, Mr. Jones, I’ll skip the Kool Aid in this neck of the woods thank you.

              I plan on having my brains implanted in a robot LOL. Beep beep.

              You have ALL that covered? Ok I saw a Youtube where some guy in Pasadena grows adequate food on a property about my size. Apparently this is not impossible. A water well around here IS… but that’s beside the point, the point is it can be done on a plot that size (somewhere else where you can do a well).

              The heating?

              I… don’t… THINK… it can be done. That’s… a lot of trees…

          • Smokey

            You need about 5 acres of woodlot to get a sustainable supply of fuelwood each year. There’s a lot of work to it, more than just cutting and stacking, you need some real forestry skills, including planting, maintaining your stands, mapping, pruning, and brush control. Can’t just go in and start cutting down trees, you’ll do fine for about 3 seasons, depending on your original stand character, but then any planning deficiencies are going to show up and you’ll be crying for fuelwood.

            The first thing you need to know, is that your 5 acres will need a few years of work put into it before you can call it a source of wood. Otherwise, all you’re doing is tree mining and that’s going to catch up with you.

            • Bert

              I love Pollarding.

              • Smokey

                Yeah, there’s reasons to do that, I’ve only seen it done for a fodder top, but if you get good fuelwood from the stem, I guess it’s OK. What’s your stem replacement period with that technique? Or are you only after the fodder top for smallwoods?

            • Rebecca

              I have 5 acres in the mountains, pretty dry. I am buffing up my food forest with native edibles, nothing much to do besides harvest after a few years. Although I live in a bigger place, I have a partially underground storage room that I could get through winter in. I have raised beds too. I have a native squash which has high oil seeds. I focus on old skills, and have a rocket stove. I enjoy the new skills, and think folks make it all about backbreaking labor, which it doesn’t have to be. I have never seen a survival video that wasn’t bs.

              • TEST

                I’m jealous! 🙂 Good for you!!!

            • Plan twice, prep once

              Many towns have ordinances that you need a permit to cut down trees, unless they are dead!

              So one innovative farmer I knew planted only elm trees along his roads and trails. Just about the time they got to a nice size, Dutch Elm disease would kill them, and Shazam…. firewood! Really choice pieces were preserved for tool handles etc.

            • TheGuy

              Yeah… I figured it would turn into a tree mining scenario even with adequate land.

              That’s… some… amazing planning there, given that… don’t… they take like… over 10 years to grow??? I mean… sigh?

              Bamboo grows fast. Also burns really sooty I hear…

          • Red Leader

            We live off the grid full time. Our batteries (Rolls) have a 20 year life.

            Plenty of down wood for heat.

            Solar well pump with extra pump and controller. Three water producing springs.

            • TheGuy

              20 years. GREAT to know!

              Ok one flawed assumption cleared up… nice thank you!

            • Gandhi

              Make sure you stock beer for my marauders and I,

          • Odd Questioner

            1) If you live near timber leases, that’s not really a problem (when SHTF, I sincerely doubt that Weyerhaeuser is going to worry too much about what someone with an axe is going to do on their property.)

            2) For every two people: 1-1.5 acres for vegetables (fenced against deer), a decent and well-insulated greenhouse (at least 12×16 with lots of shelving) for same during most of winter, a few large-enough fruit trees with variety, livestock (chickens and goats are perfect), and ample pasture for same. Takes time (and practice!), but with sufficient canning supplies, you can ease that by quite a bit.

            3) Nope, no doctor. Then again, ain’t nobody (in or out of the city) that’s going to have access to medications – doubly so once the tweakers start crashing the pharmacies together their next high.

            4) You work anyway, no matter your age. Who the hell says you’re automatically incapable of labor at 75? Got kids, grandkids? Guess who picks up the slack while you still contribute what you can (hint: you prime them –and lay in supplies– for them to come out when things start getting ugly).

            5) An outhouse is drop-easy to dig, and you can drag the shed over a new hole when the old one starts getting a bit too full. Then again, it’s not necessary if you have a decent septic system, since with care, you can make it last 40-50 years or more (you grab a bucket of water to dump in the toilet tank for flushing, which in turn helps keep things much more sanitary, no?) By the way – how you gonna crap in the city, since most sewage treatment systems rely on pumps, and water is far harder to get (unless there’s a river handy).

            6) You don’t necessarily need for batteries in a solar rig. Just run the vital stuff, and only the vital stuff (e.g. a small chest freezer) during the day (until it wears out, then you improvise like everyone else does.) Then again, automotive batteries can last anywhere from 4-10 years, depending on brand, rating, type, etc (for instance, the batteries out of a hybrid can last up to 10-12 years). If you have access to sulfuric acid, you can stretch that out to 10-15 years before its shot.

            6, part II) Solar, wind, etc are only stopgap, and cannot be considered permanent once it all crashes. You still have to account for, and supply against, a life minus electricity.

            Now -everything said, a small town isn’t a bad idea. I personally recommend it for most folks. 🙂 A city with a population above, say, 2500-3000? Nope.

            • durangokidd

              “3) Nope, no doctor. Then again, ain’t nobody (in or out of the city) that’s going to have access to medications – doubly so once the tweakers start crashing the pharmacies together their next high.”

              Everyone should educate themselves about HERBS and veggies. Particularly, ginger, garlic, turmeric, milk thistle, etc (read ORAC Values . Com) .

              Veggies can be grown VERTICALLY to maximize space. Sprouts and leafs have more potency than the fruit of the plant. Vitamin C is the Lord’s perfect medicine. Totally non-toxic. The more you take the better off you are. Check You Tube for the experts. It kills ALL pathogens in large enough doses. It is even effective against snakebite.

              Water has CONSCIOUSNESS according to quantum physicists and will ABSORB your INTENT, SOUND, and FREQUENCY: proven by examining the crystals of flash frozen water. This has tremendous implications for health. Again, check You Tube for “structured water”.

              Knowledge is power for survival. Educate yourself or die. 🙂

            • TEST

              Helpful post, Odd. Thanks.

            • YellowPokaDotBikini

              You don’t use car batteries for a Solar Bank. For a crude Solar system, You need deep cycle 6V Batteries hooked in series for 12V then paralleled to create a Bank. And keep all your cables the same length for consistency. Your biggest drain on resistance is the DC power, so place your battery bank as close to the solar collectors as possible. And convert the 12V into 110 Amp service. Volts x Amps = Watts. For a Controller I recommend a MPPT controller like an Outback80.

              • Ketchupondemand

                6 volt batteries? 12 volt system?
                You have some learning to do, boy.
                12 volt batteries rigged to a 24 volt system is good.
                But a 48 volt system is the most efficient.
                You claim you sell solar systems. Sheesh.

              • Odd Questioner

                That’s cute, but how many cars out there are going to have 6-volt batteries in them when it comes time to scavenge? 😉

          • Warchild Dammit!

            Guy,you can set up rain water catch systems that need no power and Bison among others makes a hand pump that will pull 500 feet vertically.On hand pump that deep have a valve under pump so do not have to prime!During winter of course need to leave valve open freezing temps,then,you are using some calories for water!

          • YellowPokaDotBikini

            To “TheGuy,” You need to do all your research yourself to anyswer your questions. Why do you think everybody needs to give you the info. Your laziness keeps you ignorant on the facts which is obvious. Solar batteries can easily last 10+ years if properly maintained. Panels come with a 25 year warrantee. My ROI on the cost of my solar system is 4-5 years, so 10 years later to spring for a new set of Batteries is cheap compared to paying for over priced electricity on the Grid, which they can cut off at any time and then you got nothing.

            Do the math yourself, I did years ago, and why I am 100% all off the grid, and you are still here complaining due to your own laziness.

          • john stiner

            Someone do an article on this including the math.

            God forbid you think for yourself and figure it out.

            • TheGuy

              I’ve tried it. My math says “impossible”.

              God forbid someone with some experience actually doing it drops a tip or two. Clearly it’s not impossible so clearly my initial assumptions are in error.

              I could clear up my assumptions from experiencing failure repeatedly and dying… or I could pick the brain of someone with experience…

              • Smokey

                You’ve gotten some good answers already, especially Polka Dot.

                You need to begin with your power needs, then work backwards. If you can’t afford the total packet, then figure a revised power need and recompute.

                You can’t start from “I’ve got X dollars” and expect to have an acceptable system to build. You’re either spending too much money and just throwing a checkbook at your project, or failing to cost out your components based on need.

                If you don’t want to pull the pin on paying for it, you’re never going to get it.

                • YellowPokaDotBikini

                  OK, Here are some Freebees.

                  Solar Sizing Calculator – ht tps://

                  Calculate How Much Power You Need- ht tp://

                  And here is one below you can build an array on your rooftop using a google type maps and calculating how much solar you can get to cover your electric bill. Just type in your address, and it does a whole lot of calculating for you. Azimuth, solar hours per day, etc. You just need to know what panel type you are using. Compare the kWh’s you can build to the Amount of kWh’s per year you use. This is used mostly for Grid tied solar systems, but can be adapted for a mass solar bank of batteries if you want to be off the grid.

                  PV Watts – ht tp://

                  And after using these calculators you still cant figure it out. Then just stay on the grid and pray with the other 90% of the die offs. lol I could teach you how to calculate all of this out for precise numbers, but first you need to be curious enough and do the work yourselves. I kind of look forward to 90% less people in the world.

            • laeagle

              Why do you guys come to this site if no questions are going to be tolerated? Live in ‘grid down’ mode and stay there. I am not sure we need your kind here. I personally, appreciate the questions! Makes you think of something you had not thought of before or an angle you had not seen. I tell my residents and fellows that there is no stupid question. There is still a lot that we don’t know! How did Zuckerberg become a billionaire in the space of ten years? How long have some of us been around?! We need all the help we can get. Keep asking questions, for goodness sake! For our sake!

              Louisiana Eagle ?

              • YellowPokaDotBikini

                That POS thief Zuckerburg became a Bullionaire in 10 years with FB, because he stole some other college classmates idea and college project for linking people together. You think any Zionist creates their own wealth himself? Ha!! Zuk the fuk is the purest sense of the typical chew parasite. Wealth by theft of someone elses intellectual property. Do the background check on that scandal. This is a fact.

        • Gandhi

          Depends on what the catastrophe is, for me it was when black people moved into the neighborhood in the suburbs. Drug dealing went up and my kids could not keep their bikes ? from being stolen.

      3. durangokidd

        “Since you’re probably trying to protect yourself from people fleeing the cities, you don’t want to be living down the road from an interstate. ”

        Everything depends upon the type of SHTF that strikes your city. A catastrophe like a tornado or hurricane is regional in character and there will be people trying to leave the area in advance of a hurricane warning.

        A major quake in the three hotspots of the USA would likely cripple infrastructure to the extent that travel is impossible. And NO the railroads will not be running and if they are YOU will not be allowed to use them. Likewise, an emp/cme would cripple infrastructure and make travel impossible.

        In any natural disaster, “be there to get there”. You are not going anywhere. If the SHTF is financial in character, or a biological attack, then there is the possibility of limited travel, otherwise, be prepared to hunker down where you are located.

        This should be your PRIMARY PLAN before developing other OPTIONS. Make a decision IN ADVANCE as to when you exercise the other options, and under what circumstances you do so.

        One size does not fit all possibilities. Let your mind wander when contemplating the variables. It will find a solution. 🙂

        • Mountain Trekker

          I went to a big city yesterday, “Casper” 55,000 which is where Paranoid lives, I coudn’t get out of there fast enough. Paranoid flee while you still can! Thermop wouldn’t be bad. Trekker Out

          • TheGuy

            My God I’d kill for a population that low. 55,000? I think fricking UCLA has a higher population than that. Hell I think even my dinky-ass university was approaching that.

            Come to LA! You’ll LOVE it! 9.9

            • durangokidd

              Yeah I think UCLA (main campus) is over 100,000. 🙂

          • durangokidd

            LMAO !!! That was very funny !!! 🙂

            Of course I would be paranoid too if I lived that close to Yellowstone and the ICBM bases in the area.

            Just saying.

            • Mountain Trekker

              The only thing dangerous about Yellowstone is the Tourist. As we say in Wyoming, Come,spend your money,now Git! Trekker Out

              • YellowPokaDotBikini

                You want to be as far away from any US Military Base that will surely be the Target of opportunity by our enemies, which our list of enemies grows daily. The #1 Target in any conflict or attack is take out the opponents communications command and control. Then fuel depots, energy suppliers, Electrical grids, Manufacturing plants where weapons and military suppliers do their craft, airport runways.

                And these Military installations will lock down the area 100 miles around with Martial Law, which then you will be basically living in their FEMA Camp.

          • Paranoid

            Casper has a lot of somewhat hidden advantages: lots of cows, refinery, 200 windmills, water power dam, gas fired . power plant, coal, red necks everywhere. Nasty winters, so the welfare crowd isn’t here. Actually, I’m in Ohio at the moment. Very nice small town, sets on top of a gas storage field, about 3500 people. Born here, good place if SHTF. Best wishes.

        • Plan twice, prep once

          Oh, Nonsense, in one hour with my chain saw and a 1/4 gallon of gas, I could bring down enough trees that no one is getting within a mile of my suburban house.

          In the SHTF world there are the quick and the dead….. Did I hear that in a movie?

          • john stiner

            shooting people wont be the problem.

            The problem will be knowing when to fully commit.

            Will the SHTF event be short lived, be long term, result in a government change, be like Russia in WWII where everybody was killing everybody with no consequences?

            If you look at Venezuela, why are they only throwing molotove cocktails instead of shooting people? And yes, they still have guns or Caracus would not be the murder capital of the world.

            • Plan twice, prep once

              What I was leaning towards with downing trees, was to block all but one or two ways in or out. Appropriate secondary obstacles make those entrances slow with no cover. One person with the right tool can command the countryside.

              Marauders from the city would stand little chance.

        • Gandhi

          The best plan is to be the pilot of space worthy fighter craft the millennium falcon in Star Wars. Or something similar at least.

          • Smokey

            That’s not a good plan, it’s a fantasy.

      4. flower child

        I hope I am at ground zero.
        Then I will be in heaven with Jesus 🙂

        • YellowPokaDotBikini

          That’s a fine fantasy flower child snow flake of illusion. How about you will be lying in a scattered heaps of dead corpses and the vultures will pick you clean, cause nobody is going to be picking up the parts. It will be every one for themselves. Jebus surely will not arrive to save you either. Why he’s been AWOL now for 2000+ yrs.

          • TEST

            Ah yes, the usual anti-Christian post from YPDB/Zeus/Apollo (and I guess next it’s Thor, Odin), whatever.

            Turns out the person who is credited as being THE leading authority behind what constitutes legal evidence in a court of law in the US was just like you, a non-Christian. His name was Simon Greenleaf, at Harvard Univ, in the 1800s. His rules of evidence are what constitute valid evidence in a court of law. In contrast, apparently, to you, he had the intellectual honesty, when challenged, to examine the evidence for the resurrection. Like many others (e.g., Lew Wallace who wrote Ben Hur, Lee Strobel, JD from Yale and award winning journalist and author or The Case for Christ, CS Lewis, called the most brilliant thinker at Cambridge a half century ago, or James Warner Wallace an American homicide detective (cold case detective, who just published Cold Case Christianity) – all were former atheists who had the **intellectual honesty** to investigate the claims of Christ, and ended up believers. Even famed philosopher Anthony Flew (you DO know who he is, right??), after lengthy discussions with Dr. William Lane Craig revised his whole life’s work and believed in God before died. Same with philosopher C.E.M. Joad.

            You routinely mock “jebus” (hint: it’s spelled Jesus) on this site. I will bet you have read not a ONE of the authors listed above, have you? Correct me if I am wrong. Otherwise, correct yourself and show some honesty. If you have not even done BASIC reading, how do you call yourself intellectually honest?

            I have read a massive number of folks like Hume, Bertrand Russell, ad nauseam during my eight years of university work. If you are going to continually come on this site and mock your mis-spelled “jebus,” might I suggest you show some intellectual honesty and actually READ all sides? As Lewis himself said, and atheist can never be too careful in what he reads! (I don’t know if you are an atheist, deist, or what, but the same principle applies).

            We get your insults and continuous mocking & hatred of supposedly non-existent “jebus” on this site. What we don’t get is your point, nor whether you have actually shown an iota of the aforementioned intellectual honesty.

            Don’t respond to me (although I’ll bet you can’t resist). Rather, respond to your OWN conscience telling you to show some integrity to do a thorough examination of all the evidence.

          • TEST

            Addendum: AWOL? Really? Our whole modern hospital system was founded by Christians. How many atheists have been helping the suffering in places like Sudan? Dr. Kent Brantley got ebola while working in Africa trying to help others as the hands and feet of Christ. My wife and I, in a similar vein, recently put a young half black/half Mexican young man, whose parents had been murdered, and then both sides of the family rejected him due to his mixed heritage, through his certified medical assistant training – on our own dime, no tax write-off. We did this as the hands and feet of Christ. The urban missions near me are the ONLY ones who will get their hands and feet dirty with the down and outers. AWOL? My own life radically changed from a self-centred JERK to someone utterly different after the risen “Jebus” entered into my life.

            AWOL? Only if you intentionally close your eyes to the incredible reality around you. And I am not talking religion. I am talking about a personal relationship with the risen Christ. Correct me if I am wrong, but tell me a SINGLE book you have read on the subject from the other side. Might I respectfully suggest that before you mock “Jebus,” you conduct your own due diligence on the subject? Strobel, Lewis, J. Warner Wallace, William Lane Craig. Read just ONE. Then let us know what you think about “Jebus.”

            • Traitor Hator

              I hear many people talk about. ( A personal relationship with Jesus Christ ) Stop sounding crazy and just say . When I became to understand and obey his message. Or when I realized his way was better then anyone else’s .

          • TEST

            … and speaking of atheist/agnostic fantasies, Professor James M. Tour is one of the ten most cited chemists in the world. He is famous for his work on nanocars nanoelectronics, graphene nanostructures, carbon nanovectors in medicine, and green carbon research for enhanced oil recovery and environmentally friendly oil and gas extraction. He is currently a Professor of Chemistry, Professor of Computer Science, and Professor of Mechanical Engineering and Materials Science at Rice University. He has authored or co-authored 489 scientific publications and his name is on 36 patents. Although he does not regard himself as an Intelligent Design theorist, Professor Tour, along with over 700 other scientists, took the courageous step back in 2001 of signing the Discovery Institute’s “A Scientific Dissent from Darwinism”, which read: “We are skeptical of claims for the ability of random mutation and natural selection to account for the complexity of life. Careful examination of the evidence for Darwinian theory should be encouraged.”

            Sir Frederick Hoyle (presumably you know who he is?) has noted “Biochemical systems are exceedingly complex, so much so that the chance of their being formed through random shuffling is… insensibly different from zero.” There must be “an intelligence, which designed the biochemical and gave rise to the origin of carbonaceous life.” – Sir Frederick Hoyle, Evolution from Space

            Or again, Dr. Robert Jastow who has written “Now we see how the astronomical evidence leads to a biblical view of the origin of the world… The chain of events leading to man commence suddenly and sharply at a definite moment in time, in a flash of light and energy” and ““That there are what I or anyone would call supernatural forces at work is now, I think, a scientifically proven fact.” (Robert Jastrow, God and the Astronomers)

            Turns out this person you mocking call Jebus might have just a tad more going for it that you are willing to admit.

            For those of you with actual intellectual curiosity on the topic, check out Dr. John Lennox, prof. of mathematics at Oxford University,, who is himself a believer in “Jebus,” as was, e.g., going back in time, folks like Isaac Newton, Francis Bacon, Michael Faraday, etc.

            • laeagle

              No one can claim to know much if they can’t make the lame walk, the blind to see, bring the dead back to life, feed 5000 hungry people from a few rolls and a couple days of dried fish, make premium wine out of water, and even walk on water! I doubt if any of the naysayers can come close to what their so called ‘Jebus’ did 2000 years ago when even the marvels of modern science were not even thought possible. We have come a long ways but Jesus of Nazareth was able to do things and harness power beyond the scope of our imaginations. There is power, creative power in the ‘Word’!

              Louisiana Eagle ?

          • flower child

            One thing for sure YELLOW POLKA DOT my pain will be over 🙂
            Yours will be long and horrible…..
            How is your SCREAMING CUP CAKE ?????

          • flower child

            One thing for sure YELLOW POLKA DOT my pain will be over 🙂
            Yours will be long and horrible…..
            How is your SCREAMING CUP CAKE ?????

            • TEST

              YPDB talks bout “reality” yet refuses to tell us just ONE author from the other side that he had read. Not one. Nor does he tell us exactly HOW he arrives at his moral pronouncements. The *reality* is, is that he cannot. Nor can any other philosopher. And it is this PRECISE issue that turned famous atheist/agnostic philosophers like CEM Joad, Anthony Flew, CS Lewis, etc. to believe in God, or why the brilliant Dr. William Lane Craig or math professor at Oxford John Lennox believe.

              I may be wrong, but what *appears* to be the case is that he is very angry about something in the past (for which I am truly and honestly sorry, if, in fact that is the case).

              I will place a little more stuck in YPDB/Zeus/Apollo’s indictment of “Jebus” (as opposed to “religion,” which I also oppose),and place a little more stock in his pronouncements about “reality” the first time he can tell me a SINGLE author he has read from the other side.

              So far, he had refused to answer, which is in itself extremely telling about who actually is committed to “reality.” (I can’t tell you the COUNTLESS hours I have spent wading through atheist/agnostic/existentialist/deist, etc. writings! Would that YPDB would do just ONE percent of that!)

        • Anonymous

          Well, I hope you’re a sincere and practicing Catholic; otherwise, you’ll be in Hell.

          • Odd Questioner

            You forgot Purgatory.

            (hint: I *am* Catholic.)

          • YellowPokaDotBikini

            There is no such place called “Hell or Heaven.” It is the religious illusion based on fear or pleasure if you OBEY their rules, like 70 virgins to dupe the ignorant out of their wealth and dignity. Once we can flush out the religious freaks and their evil teachings, the quicker our world returns to sanity.

            • TEST

              Or course, “religion,” strictly defined, is anything that tells us where we came from, why we are here, and were we are going. By That measure, atheism, existentialism, etc. are all *religion.* And the courts have defined it as such.

              It gets worse. How do you know what evil is, VPD??? As a matter of fact, even Sartre said a finite point without an infinite reference point has no meaning. In fact, you betray your own logic when you call something “evil.” Think, mon ami! There CAN be no evil if absolutes do not exist. Period, end of story. If all there is is evolution, then as philosopher Francis Scheaffer pointed out, “Whatever is, is right.”

              So cut out our use of the word “evil.” You have ZERO ability to call anything evil. Rather, all you have is preference. And note that I am not calling you immoral. Some atheists, agnostics, deists etc. live upstanding lives – at least by cultural norms.

              But, you are on to something important, and that is “religion.” Religion is man’s attempt to reach God through works. In fact, all the religions of the world do precisely that (you see, I have read the Qu’ran twice, the Upanishads, the Vedic literature, the Buddhist Pali canon, the Tao de Ching, the Analects of Confucions, etc. etc. Altho, as an aside Buddhism is more a philosophy). In contrast, Christianity is one and only thing where, instead of man trying to reach God, God reaches out to man, and ***we are not saved by works, but rather by grace.****

              Your post, YPDB, betrays some basic misunderstanding. Christianity is not a religion, and salvation is NOT by works. You have ZERO basis for calling **anything** evil, and in doing so you make not only category mistakes, but also need to – if I may respectfully submit – review the basic law of non-contradiction.

              You need to ask yourself WHY and HOW anything is “evil” in your world. I am shocked that vitriol you pour out on “Jebus” without any basis for making moral judgment at all. It is, as Dostoyevski wrote, “If there is no God… *everything* is permissible (and the results of which we have seen, haven’t we!) And yes, Fyodor DID in fact write this.

              And oh yes. “Hell” is the absence of God. Period. I was not going to Hell before I was a Christian, I **was** in Hell, even tho I had a nice successful life and was to all outward extents very happy.

              From all I read in you posts, you appear extremely angry with this God who supposedly isn’t there. Why is that, I wonder?

            • Marie

              True there is no place called hell or heaven. Hell was created to scare the people into obeying the priests. A Creator who created us humans and is supposedly our “father” would never burn his children in hell ever. Would you throw your child into a burning pile of wood or tie to a tree and burn becuz he/she did something horrible? The inner worlds, the astral worlds are what is called “heaven”. It is another dimension. There are levels there. If you are evil you stay on the lower level for awhile, but your soul does not get destroyed or burn in hell fire. It’s all about control.

        • Orion

          That was the most coherent comment I’ve read yet on this blog…

          Dependent on the situation, I would have to deduct that the city would be more advantageous than a hole in the ground or a “compound”… More readily available hiding places… More chance of scrounging for supplies also…

          Off grid means you’d better have one hell of an automated defense perimeter setup to protect yer shit… And a lot of shit to protect… Think Alamo… How’d that work out.

          NV and a sewer system map gets you what need in a city environment…

          A lot of you still believe your gonna watch this shit unfold on youtube or fox news from the comfort of your fully stocked bug out hole….. But I digress…

          “Everybody’s got a plan, till they get punched in the face”

          ~Mike Tyson

          • durangokidd

            I like the Alamo analogy, but I think it’s better than trying to scavenge. Personally, I don’t think anyone is going anywhere, and if they do, they are not going very far.

            A few, very few, M-A-Y-B-E. If they are allowed to travel at all. Most people are just not that physically fit and most cannot live off the land as they travel like the pioneers did.

            Cities will likely be locked down, anyway.

            The hardy stock that settled this nation is for the most part, long, long gone. Given the masses of snowflakes whose idea of a “hunger strike” is to take turns for a few hours at a time like “guard duty”, I suspect that masses of individuals will go berserk, run amok, and be killed within days of a “major catastrophe”.

            Those who hunker down in their “Alamo” with a tight group of like minded friends with skills will fare much, much better during the critical first weeks. 🙂

          • LaManiac

            You keep your city!I’ll take the country.The most important thing is can you be a mean SOB!!
            Maniac –out

          • TEST

            Interestingly, Orion, Ferfal, author of Surviving Argentina, feels that you are worse off in a rural area during an Argentinian style meltdown, due to focus paid on supporting the city, crime, etc. His website is here, and I would vote for you adding his site to your blogroll, Mac. He lived thru the meltdown in Argentina, so has a lot of good stuff.

        • Gandhi

          I hope you are too Flower?

          • Justice

            Gandhi, you are not nice and are frequently mean!

            My two heroes in life have taught me that nice don’t mean WEAK. They were both the baddest Mo Fo Mo’s down around this town.

            I hope fate doesn’t land you in my foxhole because you wouldn’t like how that turns out!

            • Gandhi

              True, I would not want to share a foxhole with a lesbian.

              • Gandhi

                I would make a man out of your confused transgendered a$$. Then sell you to some gay mooselimbs.

            • Gandhi

              It is also not nice when people hope to be at ground zero. Those are the idiots that did not prepare that prolly won’t, unfortunately, be at ground zero and will be with the other snowflakes wanting your preps.

        • Justice

          Flower Child, I never thought I would live to see the hatred with which Jesus is regarded by many on these blogs.

          I cannot fathom one thing that Jesus Christ did or said that could cause people to either dislike much less hate him.

          These people will get to see what kind of “HELLHOLE” the world turns into without Christianity. Your getting a glimpse of it now. Just wait, because judging by the younger generation, a secular Communist nightmare awaits you.

          I no longer feel at home in this world. But I take strength in the knowledge that someone has gone somewhere to prepare a place for me!

          • Rebecca

            Justice, not hatred for Jesus, hatred for faux Xtians that are nasty critters. More and more pretend Xtians every year.

          • Rebecca

            Justice, most don’t hate Jesus, they hate faux Christians running a line of bs.

          • Gandhi

            Justice, do you know how often people say they want to be at ground zero? Most people that say that don’t prep and they will be knocking on your door wanting you to be nice and support them. Why? My friends train with me, by preps, and say they want to survive so we can help eachother out. I have a pilot doctor in the group, I am an engineer and we have military full bird colonel in the group. It is not being nice by saying she wants to be at ground zero so….raspberries

          • Anonymous

            Speaking of Hell. A Navy Seal on Fox News told Katy Perry to go to Hell over her open borders comments. I expect many more “celebs” will be told the same thing shortly.

          • Warchild Dammit!

            Justice,do not believe Jesus is hated,just a carpenter who had some good ideas(son of god is you believe),talked a lot.I also am a carpenter with long hair/talk a lot,name initials JC,no,not saying I am rebirth of Jesus!

            What a lot of folks including me hate is the warped actions done in Jesus’s name with religious institutions/evil people,and this obviously does not apply to just christians

            • YellowPokaDotBikini

              What’s this Jesus was a Carpenter gig? He attached 2 sticks together called it a cross, and now he is a carpenter? What did he build? Jesus was not a carpenter, he was a Gypsie traveling around from village to village peddling his snake water to the ignorant. BTW/ I read the Bible nearly cover to cover and took bible classes. The more I read the more I found it to be a total crock of contradicting B-shit.

              • Marie

                There used to be a book in 1970 i think it was titled The Crucifixtion Hoax. Can’t spell that. Have not seen that book in 40 yrs. Might be out of print.

            • Justice

              Warchild Dammit!, I can REALLY understand “a lot of folks including me hate is the warped actions done in Jesus’s name with religious institutions/evil people”. I’m NOT a fan of organized religion either, it REEKS of man.

            • TEST

              Interestingly, Orion, Ferfal, author of Surviving Argentina, feels that you are worse off in a rural area during an Argentinian style meltdown, due to focus paid on supporting the city, crime, etc. His website is here, and I would vote for you adding his site to your blogroll, Mac. He lived thru the meltdown in Argentina, so has a lot of good stuff.

              For WarD, the answer to his question about actions done in Christ’s name is found in Dostoyevski’s Brothers Karamazov, in the chapter The Grand Inquisitor. This is one of the most famous apologia on the topoic. Easy to googl.

              Further for WarD, CS Lewis is instructive here, noting:
              “I am trying here to prevent anyone saying the really foolish thing that people often say about Him: I’m ready to accept Jesus as a great moral teacher, but I don’t accept his claim to be God. That is the one thing we must not say. A man who was merely a man and said the sort of things Jesus said would not be a great moral teacher. He would either be a lunatic—on the level with the man who says he is a poached egg—or else he would be the Devil of Hell. You must make your choice. Either this man was, and is, the Son of God, or else a madman or something worse. You can shut him up for a fool, you can spit at him and kill him as a demon or you can fall at his feet and call him Lord and God, but let us not come with any patronising nonsense about his being a great human teacher. He has not left that open to us. ****He did not intend to****. . . . Now it seems to me obvious that He was neither a lunatic nor a fiend: and consequently, however strange or terrifying or unlikely it may seem, I have to accept the view that He was and is God. (Mere Christianity, 55-56)

          • YellowPokaDotBikini

            Religion is like pick a straw, 120 basic variations out there which may conflict with each other. The largest brain washing operation on the face of the earth is religion. They invent these fantasy martyr idols. Worshiping imaginary idols is evil in itself. Dump all this hocus pocus fantasy fraud and believe in yourself. Praying is for those who procrastinate and fail to prepare. Nobody n this earth ever got ever lasting life. Prove it if it is real. NOT. How about worship the Sun and Nature and Mother Earth which provides you everything you need in life. God or Jebus or Satin or Allah, and all of these other imaginary idols are fraud, which much of the real history has been twisted over and over and re-written to fit the writers needs to control the ignorant sheep and fleece you out of your wealth, and all common sense of reality. The weak, ignorant and lazy believe this religious crap.

            • marrohead

              You are 1000% correct polka dot!

          • YellowPokaDotBikini

            Justice says this: These people will get to see what kind of “HELLHOLE” the world turns into without Christianity.

            Kinda like when the Christians invaded N America and slaughtered the indigenous natives and stole their land. You are one ignorant F*ck.

            This is what religion teachings does to the human brain, makes you dumb as F*ck.

            • TEST

              As noted, you have done insufficient reading is appears. The Grand Inquisitor by Dostoyevsky addresses your question, YPDB. Moreover, you still have not addressed how you arrive at ANY moral absolute outside of the existence of God. In fact, you cannot, as EVERY philosopher on this planet knows (Sartre said a finite point without an infinite reference point has no meaning).

              Western expansion was done by a melange of types, some anti-
              Christian like you, some just religious but not Christ-followers, others true Christians, like William Penn (you DO know how he got along with natives, right?) The aboriginal peoples were not just some vaguely bucolic pacifists and Keven Costner would have you believe. Why did Custer employ Crow scouts? Why did the Paiute, Crow, Sioux, Blackfoot all kill each other? In my area of expertise, I used to know Frank Calder, head of the Alliance of First Nations in Canada, and I always found it interesting how the Cree got guns first – and then if you look at a map a century later their range expanded MUCH farther west. Similarly, Indians would kill Inuit (don’t call them Eskimo) on site, and in fact that partially factored in to the separation of the NWT into present day Nunavut (I have family members who lived in Iqaluit for years, and the brother of my best man is a RCMP up near Inuvik.

              Your post on aboriginal peoples betrays a very simplistic notion of what went on amongst all parties involved, and presupposes, I assume, that you think Jesse James, Doc Holiday, etc. were all “Christians,” and that the Indians never murdered each other, and were purely innocent victims (in some cases that is true. The best understanding of the whole complexity is by Native American Dee Brown, Bury My Heart at Wounded Knee.

              But most egregiously, you continue to make moral judgments (which I agree with, BTW), but ***are predicated on absolutely nothing*** As noted elsewhere, you have absolutely ZERO philosophical or moral grounds to call anything right or wrong, period. Your pronouncements can ONLY be, by definition, your **preferences** – based largely on the Judeo-Christian heritage you have tacitly accepted.

              And relative to your “hate for reality” comment below, methinks the lady doth protest too much. You talk of rejecting reality… yet I will warrant that you have never once read any of the major, highly regarded authors mentioned above. Not a one. Who, then, is rejecting reality, when you refuse show even a modicum of intellectual honesty relative to anything you have an **emotional** aversion to?

          • YellowPokaDotBikini

            How do you hate something that does not exist. You need to figure out the difference between fantasy and reality. Religion is fantasy, Life is reality. Both separate. I can’t believe the hatred on this site people have for reality. There, how does that feel?

            You need to stop hating and rejecting reality and facts. Without those you are pretty much a lame duck and your babble is pointless.

            • TEST

              How do you hate something that does not exist.

              As they say in Latin, re. your posts, quod erat demonstrandum (and no, I am not Catholic). If I may respectfully ask, read your *own* posts for the answer to that one

          • YellowPokaDotBikini

            Christianity teaches hate. You worship a Jealous God don’t you? Here is the quote out of your babble

            Exodus 34:13-15

            13″But rather, you are to tear down their altars and smash their sacred pillars and cut down their Asherim 14for you shall not worship any other god, for the LORD, whose name is Jealous, is a jealous God– 15otherwise you might make a covenant with the inhabitants of the land and they would play the harlot with their gods and sacrifice to their gods, and someone might invite you to eat of his sacrifice,…

            **So basically what the Bible teaches is Hate all others that is not in the likeness of Christianity. That’s a pretty petty and pathetic way to live your lives and why the world is in perpetual war and genocide, destroying countries, cultures and people, that are not like Christians. And stealing their assets and resources in the process. And why after hearing this Verse listed above you all then sing in chorus, “Onward Christian Soldiers Marching off to War.” Gee how loving is that? Friggin Hypocrites.

            So you wonder why I don’t subscribe to this hatful BS called Religion? That’s why. I read it and decided for myself not to be a friggin ignorant sheep like you hateful dopes.

            • awed bawl

              Religion has nothing to do with metaphysics or the outside world.

              It has everything to do with GROUP PSYCHOLOGY.

              Religion is this: everybody is expected to agree with everybody else. This agreement is called “Truth.” All religions agree with this principle, but dare not admit it. . .

              Bowing to mecca 5 times daily makes it sacred IF EVERYONE ELSE DOES IT. We agree that it is sacred- that makes it so. Agreement for the sake of agreement- that is religion. IN THIS SENSE ALL RELIGIONS ARE THE SAME.

              Scientology defines reality this way: “Reality is what we agree it to be.” Soon afterward the government agreed to call Scientology a religion.

              Which is it? Science, or religion? They are diametric opposites. . .wouldn’t you agree??

        • Paranoid

          Rather be in a Bomb shelter with a group of strippers; A lot of food and beer. Whatever else he may have been, no data indicates Jesus would have been much fun at a party.

          • YellowPokaDotBikini

            Paranoid, you forgot jebus turned water into wine, Walked on water, parted the seas at a double full moon low tide. Turned a staff into a snake. A party always needs a good Magician. And if you get hungry maybe he can pull a rabbit out of his ass and it will feed a thousand people.

            • TEST

              If God exists, He exists outside of His creation, and thus is free to act outside of the natural laws He, himself, created. There is no philosophical problem with the existence of miracles, other than the naturalistic assumptions you bring to the table.

              Nor were the miracles magic tricks. They were done at a specific time for a specific purpose. In fact. for St. Paul, at one point a healing occurred on his watch – yet later he writes “Trophimus I left sick at Miletus.”

              We get it that you don’t like “Jebus.” What we don’t get – and you refuse to answer – is HOW you arrive at any moral pronouncements in a naturalistic world? (And if you do, you will be the first philosopher in history to do so) Nor do you consent to tell us even ONE book you have read that deals with the “other side,” though I have given you numerous names above, and you consistently deride others for not believing in reality. Until you can do that, your cavils mean, by definition, absolutely nothing. And that, mon ami, is reality.

              • Ketchupondemand

                Test, another great author is Joel Goldsmith. Read any of his books and tell us there is no God.
                The fact is, you have made a great, but wasted effort on YPDB, a mental midget of prehistoric times.

                • Ketchupondemand

                  (that second sentence was for you know who)

              • awed bawl

                (And if you do, you will be the first philosopher in history to do so)

                It has been done. It is called deriving ought statements from is statements. Rand has done it. John Searle has done it.


            • laeagle

              Jesus did hang out with people like us. He was not known as a party pooper. Remember he made premium wine ? at the request of his mother at the wedding party! He was critisized by the religeous folks of the time for hanging out with ‘sinners’. He was even critisized for coming from the ‘country’! The Jesus that I have come to know is the one quietly waiting, knocking at your ?so that he can enjoy the fun with you and ‘teach you all things’. Thank you Test, Justice, Ketch, flower child, and all, for your profound comments. Thank you YPDB for raising some really important existential questions!

              Louisiana Cockroach

          • TEST

            In fact, there are several references to humour. One which comes to mind is Him called the brothers “sons of thunder.” He called the little children to HIm and they came. Hardly something kids would do if He was scowling.

        • john stiner

          I hop to be sending people to see Jesus, and not by spreading the Gospel!!!!

          • Gandhi

            Hahahaha yes, let’s have a Jesus meet and greet for people who try to steel your preps.

      5. southside

        I live in Tucson where the I-10 and I-15 intersect.I can imagine the hell that will be Tucson when SHTF.Some going south who figure for some reason the Mexicans will let them in,some going north to wherever. I’m going to sit tight until the dust clears. I live just outside the city limits in a semi-rural area in Pima County.

        • rellik

          Little confusing to me as I-15 and I-10 only meet in San Diego California. I have driven both roads end to end.

          • Nailbanger

            Most likely meant to say 10 and 19

            • durangokidd

              And I-8 as it intersects with I-10 North of Tucson, near Arizona City / Casa Grande. I-19 runs South from Tucson to Green Valley and Rio Rico towards Mexico.

              A full tank of gas will not get you from San Diego to Tucson. You DO NOT want to be stuck anywhere near Gila Bend, or points West. Stay in California unless it is sliding into the sea. 🙂

            • rellik

              Could be.
              Who the hell wants to go to Nogales?
              Old Tucson had a Pinnacle Peaks.
              Really good steak place.

              • buttcrackofdoom

                LOVE that bread-and-butter and beans!

          • southside

            My bad. I-10 and I-19. Yes Nailbanger,I will ammo up. I’ve started some time

            • Nailbanger


          • BadAmerican

            IH-10 and IH-15 cross in L.A. basin near Redlands. I just drove from San Antonio, TX to the Monterey Bay. I spent a lot of time on 10. IH-15 connects to IH-8 in San Diego.

            Two is one, one is none…multiple opportunities means having multiple action plans.

            I itch…therefore I scratch…BA.

        • Smokey

          Ammo up, and think area defense. Your population of foreigners is going to be a major problem, and Tucson will a transit point for millions more.

          • durangokidd

            Good point. Not only that, but there is a radical mosque in Tucson that needs to be permanently “closed”. SHTF may provide that opportunity. 🙂

        • john stiner

          blow up the I-10 bridge over the river and problem solved.

          • Smokey

            I’m opposed to destroying infrastructure to deny passage. Just put a couple of platoons there as a denial, and fill some buses with concrete. You need that bridge later.

            We need to think area defense, and military units, not Alamos and sandbags at the front door. Choose your people and your ground.

      6. Colt M4

        Well that’s an easy fix, just don’t be in a city when the SHTF.

      7. B from CA

        White people will survive as long as they take a few precautions, put away some minimal necessities, and stay clear of knee grows. White people blame themselves when things go wrong. That’s why they are so susceptible to being guilt tripped with things like racism. Blacks on the other hand generally blame everybody but themselves. Fifty years of bs propaganda has convinced blacks that whites cause all their problems. In SHTF if you don’t take a direct hit from an ISIS terrorist or an atom bomb, just stay clear of Blacks and chances are, you will survive.


        • watching and waiting

          It is true what you posted in many cases.

          Most of you won’t believe this, but I am 61 and the same
          blame game/accusations I have heard since I was 19-20 are still being bellowed out on the news and in the work place and in individual encounters/conversations.

          • Smokey

            Fifty years of the same thing, over and over. It’s not going to make it any easier when we finally start dealing the problems in a manner that will actually solve them.

            It’s not us, the ‘other sides’ have gotten taught that we owe them, and they’re not going to go away without fighting for it.

            • durangokidd

              Self defense in a target rich environment is a beautiful thing. Ammo up. 🙂

            • Beaumont

              Noah was said to have preached, for over 100yrs.

              Of the great empires, described by Daniel — Egypt, Babylon, Medo-Persia, Greece, ancient Rome — which came back, online, after the brown out.

              Can you carry enough food, to last the rest of your life. Will there be enough, to throw away, so that you can find it in the garbage.

              It’s not fatalism to ask; we are still here. Needful things originally came from some place, and we should expect to find them, again.

              • YellowPokaDotBikini

                Noah was said to have preached, for over 100yrs.

                Oh now don’t get me started. Noah, another Biblical fantasy myth. He built an ship the size of the Bronx Zoo all by himself, and somehow convinced 2 of every animal around the entire world to come to his mountain top, (Must of sent them all email invites or something) and get on his boat in an orderly fashion, and of course he had plenty of room and food to feed them all for months on end on this large craft, and of course all the animals cooperated because the lions did not eat the bunny rabbits, nor did the bears feast on the turkeys. Oh and the Polar bears did not eat the seals, nor did the vultures eat the rodents. Its quite a whopper of a story. And if you believe this crock of BS, I bet you give money weekly to this cause, for your seat in heaven too.. lol

                Ever connect the dots of fantasy and place them into reality? Well it doesn’t quite add up, does it now..??

                • Marie

                  I don’t know if i believe in the Noah story, but if it’s true the only way he could get all those animals in that boat was to take DNA from each one and with the help of Aliens….”Let us create man in OUR image.” WHO was the one speaking? I believe we got help from other aliens way back then., and the ten commandments burned into slate/rock? Burned by a laser? Technology!!!!

            • YellowPokaDotBikini

              Blacks will only solve their own problems, when they admit and recognize, most of their problems are self inflicted.

              • awed bawl

                Crappy DNA is self-inflicted?

        • nameless

          B from Ca- What about the Wiggers?

        • Frank Thoughts

          I have also lived long and in many places. That time on this planet does teach you a few things. And sadly, yes, the behavior of kneegrows in that time has not improved. They remain the majority cause of urban crime and violence and are the most likely to be unemployed and living on welfare.

          The wisest thing you can do in any urban area is to make sure the percentage of that population is as low as possible. If they are large in numbers in your city, then get to the neighborhood where they do not reside or are the minority. Also look for a hardcore right-wing, working class white population. They tend to act as a physical deterent to any getting out of hand. Also look for hardcore ‘ethnic’ communities that do not like them. This can be advantageous as they will do the necessary fighting if a riot kicks off. The Koreans in the LA riots didn’t take any nonsense. Hispanics also don’t like them and they have hardcore gangs that can easily hold their own against kneegrows. Russians are also not big fans and they have a very nasty global network that can take revenge.

          And it is true any city that has generous welfare provision or public housing will be plagued with the worst people (think New York, London, Paris, Brussells etc.). Two things cause this: one is that major cities attract every dirt bag and chancer in the world to go to them and try and collect welfare benefits. The other is that the people in these places end up trapped in a negative culture and never leave it (think Baltimore).

          Probably doing a socialogical analysis of any place where you are going to live is the best thing.

          • Kevin2

            Frank Thoughts

            The substantial difference in cities are the demographics you describe. Largely they’re connected to economics in an inverse symbiotic relationship as the underclass fills the poor neighborhoods and their behavior will keep that area poor as no business would locate there.

        • john stiner

          knee grows? – good one.

          White people don’t get guilt tripped by perceived racism.

          Hillary tried to guilt trip all white people by telling them if they voted for Trump then they were racist, homophobic, misogynistic, Islamophobic and all the other bigoted b.s.

          How well did that work for her?

          Hillary forgot the one main rule. People don’t like being told what to do.

        • BlackMoe

          B from CA, half of the white people in my town won’t survive three days after a major event. Of those, many are libtards without a clue with no means of survival or defense, the others are EBT card carrying white trash Walmartians. We have a lot of white trash in this area. They are a bigger problem here than blacks and mexicans.

      8. Gandhi

        I think the best way for unprepared people to survive is to stay far away from me and my preps, capiche

        • Smokey

          Tell that to the lady above who has a 14-year old acquaintance who thinks a little gang of teenagers can break into a pawnshop and solve all their problems by arming themselves.

          • Gandhi

            Hahaha funny, 14 year olds might be stupid enough to try but then she would be on her own?

        • Anonymous

          I think most people just steer clear of you period. Get it?

          • Gandhi


      9. Heartless

        All good points in the article. I’d add a few though.
        1. be armed – always.
        2. get to ground level. easier to go underground or the heck out of the neighborhood if you’re already on the flat. Add in – water flows downhill as will all pressurized systems when pumps fail.
        3. get clear of masses of people. better to be alone than caught up in a melee.
        4. trust no one
        5. rely on no one besides yourself
        6. know the roads – railways, waterways included
        7. have a serviceable pair of shoes near to hand – always
        8. be a bit dirty. Cleanliness sticks out in a crisis.

        I’m betting the rest of you can add more.

        • Smokey

          About two years ago I went to our local thrift shop and bought a half dozen pair of good work/walk boots over a month or so. Put one pair in the car, and some socks. The rest are just stored away.

          I’ll bet you there are very few ‘preppers’ with the skills to even repair a boot, let alone make new ones. There’s probably not many of us with more than one set of clothes suitable for being outdoors, either.

          Gloves, boots, socks, hats, work trousers, jackets, they all wear out. Buy some, and stack ’em as deep as your ammo.

          • Nailbanger

            One set of clothes? Really?
            That would be a sad state of affairs,

            • B from CA

              Nailbanger & Smokey:

              Just because someone’s closet is full of clothes and shoes, doesn’t mean they are covered. Most people have different types of clothes and shoes. A woman might have fifty pairs of shoes, but 49 pairs of heels and one pair of tennis shoes. Her husband might have a great outfit for when he goes hunting, but only one pair of gloves and one hat.

              It’s like light bulbs. You need to have back-ups. I went around the house looking for the odd ball lights. The ones on the porch, in the refrigerator, and on the bathroom mirror. Then I realized I had two lights in important places that would require a weird light to replace. Some light bulbs turned out to be hard to find replacements for. In any case, when the bulb burned out, I felt like a genius, because I already had a replacement.

              I’m finding I use both food, clothes, and household stuff that was for SHTF.


            • Smokey

              OK, so how many sets of outdoor clothing to you have? Most folks don’t have more than one set of genuine work gear. I stock up.

          • durangokidd

            Yeah, I picked up lots of pairs of good leather gloves a few weeks back at HD for $9 a pair. Expensive but irreplaceable in SHTF. Got some extra winter gloves too at the ski shop “after ski sale”, and thermal socks, also $9 a pair. Yikes!

            Sportsman’s is a good place to shop for outdoor gear or Cabela’s but they are expensive. I thought I should pick up some steel toed boots. They may come in handy. Need to hit the Farm & Ranch store in Prescott this summer.

            Every Fall there is a “Veteran Stand Down” in Prescott. Free boots, bags, blankets, tarps, and other gear for Vets. Lunch is great and it’s free too. (About time I got something for all the BS I put up with in bootcamp and Nam; not to mention the three trips to the gas chamber and waiting in line at the VA Hospital to die.)

            There’s probably a Stand Down near you. Keep your eyes peeled. A good place to connect with like minded people. 🙂

          • john stiner

            People don’t know how to sew anymore. in the 1950s everybody sewed all their clothes.

            People also don’t know how to fix anything. Everything is disposable now.


        • Marie

          Ha ha….i was in a store today and the young guy was ordering food and i could smell cow manure all over him. I looked at his jeans and boots and yep all muddy. I love the smell of cow manure and skunk. Seriously. A whole lot better than smelling liberals in the city…..

      10. Brian

        I know how to survive most disasters that don’t kill me directly (meteor, nuclear war, etc) but it is the actions of other people that is the challenging part. Human theft and stupidity is the biggest danger of all!

        • Nailbanger

          Definitely, ditto

      11. Warchild Dammit!

        Well,as another poster mentioned a few articles back,you will be fine if you have “green squirrels”,that’s a wrap!

        While you enjoy the long weekend if not working take a moment to remember those citizens who died in wars.You can disagree completely with the reasoning/politics of the war but the dead do deserve a bit of respect,I feel unfortunately this country is headed for a internal war,would be our first true civil war,perhaps we have another though of succession,be glad to be wrong but seems the tempers growing all around.

      12. deplorable infidel

        interesting article
        If a nuclear bomb explodes nearby, here’s why you should never, ever get in a car
        ht tps://

        • JustMe

          The author talks about listening to the radio, which is all well and good… However, most radios now are digital. If a nuke goes off, not too many digital radios will be functioning, not even the broadcasters, especially in cities, most of which converted from analog years ago. Not many vehicles will be functioning after a nuke either. Otherwise interesting article, however.

          • TEST

            There is a LOT of debate about whether cars will function or not. The whole world of CMP/EMP has a lot of will qualified people with differing opinions. Do your preparations, and hopefully we will never find out, altho a Carrington Event IS a certainty at some point down the road

          • john stiner

            You cant trust what is being said anyway.

      13. Brian

        Take a good look at your house. A lot of houses have vinyl siding. The materials in the walls will probably not stop a high ordinance round. Anyone driving through your neighborhood with some military ordinance could spray each house. Most American homes were built for peaceful times.

        • Smokey

          The very reason to think area defense. Don’t let the car into the neighborhood with all the indefensible homes.

          Meet them down the road, and your platoon can deal with them there.

        • john stiner

          Cost too much to battle harden you house, but maybe one room might be ok.

          Line the front wall of the house with steel sheets and sand bags in a false wall across the front. In stead of a 4 inch stud wall along the front you would have a 10 inch stud wall.

          • Ketchupondemand

            I’m glad our house is made of cinder block with a half inch coating of pure cement on both sides. It would take a .30 cal rifle round to begin breaking away the block. Plenty of time to get out the back, (or be already vanished into the forest that surrounds us).
            That’s if you could find us. Anyone who drives to our road usually does a quick glance and decides they probably won’t get back out, just by the looks of it.

      14. Traitor Hator

        I say. Buy whatever trailer, camper , thing you can get . Stock it with water, fuel , food . And go where there is zero water fuel or food. If you think you can go to some remote lake. People will show up that only have guns and ammo. And when they get hungry guess what?

      15. Traitor Hator

        Saw a video of a white guy angry about a third world type speaking a foreign language on the phone to his mother. Do you forign Fs realize what it’s like to hear a forign language over and over its like someone saying LaLaLa in your ear for hours. If you don’t understand the language its total discusting noise? Exspecially Spanish. It’s totally annoying noise and these stupid foreigners don’t understand that?

      16. Traitor Hator

        To improve your chance of survival. I’d suggest an automatic shotgun with 12 pellet OO buckshot.

      17. Traitor Hator

        I’ve heard so many times . If your not a racist when you go into prison . You will be when you get out. Is prison not an under extreme pressure society ? Like SHTF? You will have a choice? Join your family with either the blacks the Browns or the whites. Take your pick. As always for survival we will group up. If you are white do you think you will be accepted by the blacks or Browns? Not in prison . You will be considered a race traitor and have all enemies . Like it or not ? They will try to mix the seed of man but it will not take? How many countries on this planet have a equally mixed race population and are not at the brink of civil war? Do you think when there numbers grow they will treat you like a lady? And there numbers are growing.

      18. Comanche

        No one said it would be easy or pretty….

      19. Anonymous

        I grew up in a town noted for it’s beautiful homes. The town has grown and the houses get bigger. Most of these people don’t even have a week or two’s worth of groceries in their home. I don’t care what anyone’s zip code is, a few days without food or water and civility ends.

      20. Mountain Trekker

        New movie coming out in Aug. check out the Trailer for Wind River. My backyard, won’t be many freeloaders coming here when the SHTF. Trekker Out

        • Rebel Son

          This isn’t the land of back up , Jane
          This is the land of you’re on you’re own

          Luck don’t live out here

          Got some chilling and true lines in that movie
          Maybe get to see it someday
          If this shit don’t breakwide before than

      21. Jim in Va.

        Have your own crew ready when hell breaks loose,one person can’t do it.It’ll be 24/7…can you stay awake?

        • Warchild Dammit!

          Good point Jim,will add more coffee and meth to prep supplies!

          • Jim in Va.

            As long as its high test!

            • Ketchupondemand

              Have a bottle or two of No-Doze or generic equivalent.
              Sometimes even a half of one will work for 4-8 hours.

      22. Warchild Dammit!

        Folks,hope you all have some green squirrels as a poster mentioned a few articles back!You have the meanie greenies,you will be fine!

        Hope you all have weekend off and lets remember the war dead this Memorial Day.You do not have to agree with the reasoning/politics of any war to have respect for the dead.Don’t dwell on it but remember,it all started with the dead in Massachusetts that were the start of what is supposed to be a republic(mass,what the hell happened to you?!).

      23. Donald Trump

        This site is full of ignorant bigoted racist. I’m reporting you to the southern poverty law center. I hope they find out where you all live and they arrest you for cyber bullying. Maybe you all need to be incarcerated in s reeducation camp. If that doesn’t work you should probably just be beheaded and incinerated in one of the many mobile units the government has already purchased.

        • Traitor Hator

          On the beheading thing. I’ve heard soldiers say never look at their face after you kill them . It catches up eventually. Bring them in with a black bag over their face . Behead them haul off the bodies , if you never see their face you can do it longer? Ask any knocker in a slaughterhouse. Most can do it only a short time. Because they see their eyes.?

          • Smokey

            OK, thanks for coming here and clearing up your own intolerance and rank bigotry.

            • Smokey

              Not you, TH, for the moron above.

              • Traitor Hator

                DT is being sarcastic?

      24. Ed

        In Jul 77 NYC suffered several lightning strikes affected key power transmission points. That combined with equipment and numerous other contributing factors (see Wikipedia), resulted in a city wide blackout. Widespread looting and violence occurred which overloaded local law enforcement.
        It was a total breakdown.. herd mentality. Traffic lights were out, I and my partner in an unmarked Plymouth Satellite, had to “non verbally communicate” to get through gridlocked traffic intersections, also had to drive on sidewalks. It was unnerving.
        People become irrational. If you think you can carry enough ammo, rethink that. You must band together with your neighbors also equipped into a defensive force, in a defend-able position/peremeter etc etc.
        That experience covinced me to relocate several states south.

        • Paranoid

          Anyone that can carry their ammo without a good pickup truck doesn’t have enough ammo.

      25. Him

        A major spokesman for the NWO has died. 89 years too late. Zbigniew Brzezinski. I think he worked for the Carter administration. A Globalist if ever there was one. Good riddance.

        • YellowPokaDotBikini

          Zig Brzezinski is a real POS. His daughter Mika is the co-host on the Morning Joe Show. Both of them are real POS too.

          Joe Scarborough Divorce Details: Still Lives With Ex,

          Joe Scarborough quietly divorced his last wife of 12 years, … Joe Scarborough Divorce Details: Still Lives … ‘Morning Joe’ Scarborough And Mika Brzezinski Are Engaged To Be Married

          inquisitor .com /988594/joe-scarborough-divorce-details-st

        • Neal Jensen

          That scumbag is prepping Hillary’s digs for her….lol

        • john stiner

          i never heard of him before he died, so he must not have been much of a spokesman.

          • Ketchupondemand

            John, people say he was President during Carter’s years.
            As National Security Advisor, he probably was.

            • Gandhi

              Carter’s years, ha what a cartoon carter was

      26. Him

        When the Chicago Bulls won the championship, the criminals took advantage and looted and burned and killed. The police were totally swamped and unable to deal with the situation. The News Media, in an attempt to conceal the ethnicity of the offenders, claimed that the rioters, looters, arsonists and shooters were just Bull’s fans. No apology to the Bull’s fans was ever made.

        • john stiner

          I always wear my Bulls jersey when I go looting and robbing.

          Don’t you?

      27. TEST

        More from the disgusting, fascist left, from the President of the NY Young Democrats.

        De Blasio staffer busted for porn of men having sex with kids as young as 6 months – was president of NY Young Dems
        May 27, 2017 | Carmine Sabia |

        An employee for Democrat New York City Mayor Bill de Blasio was arrested on charges of child pornography after his stash, featuring kids as young as 6-months-old, was discovered.
        Jacob Schwartz, 29, was found to have more than 3,000 pictures and 89 videos of children between 6-months to 16-years-old that he downloaded from the Internet, the New York Post reported.
        Schwartz is a Democrat insider who heads the downstate region vice president of the New York State Young Democrats and served as the president of the Manhattan Young Democrats, until they fired him following his arrest.

        • Traitor Hator

          See also. Italians in uproar over child porn.

      28. logicrazy

        It depends on what type of disaster happens, but being mobile is my plan. Till things settle down I will be on the move. Low tech, and simple with a cache in several locations. High tech gear available, but not carried all the time. If one cache is compromised 9 more are available. My money is not tied up in one location. Hmmm…

        • GrandpaSpeaks

          A horse, of course, is the perfect bug out vehicle for your excellent plan.

          • Marie

            But people will kill you and then eat the horse!!

            • awed bawl

              Force them to eat their own horseshit!

      29. aw come on

        everyone assumes that once the grid goes down that’s it, naah, all the whities will work like mad to get grid back up again asap, all ya need is a years worth of food and water and a safe place to shelter. Look at Germany after WW2, they cleared absolute rubble by hand and anyway it won’t happen all over usa all at once stop whining sissies..

      30. Brian

        If your community has an association and there is a meeting, be on guard for anyone applying the word “our” where it shouldn’t be used. Our food supply. Our first aid supplies. Our this and our that. Chances are that your community has no community food or first aid supplies and there is no chance of starting one. Also, someone will probably suggest setting up a supply of food supposedly earmarked for the neighborhood children. Each person will have to decide for themselves on this one. There’s looting by unauthorized people and looting by people who consider themselves authorized. Case in point, the idiot police supervisor in New Orleans during Hurricane Katrina who decided to confiscate everyone’s guns. FEMA and other emergency agency personnel feel that you preps are theirs for the taking for the greater public good. Keep your preps hidden

      31. C

        Come on people! Name some cities!

      32. BogBadWolf


      33. BigBadWolf

        What’s it gonna take?

      34. Brian

        A lot of Americans will die from stress caused by SHTF. We probably will not know how many but there will be quite a large number. A lot of Americans have undiagnosed high blood pressure. Going without a good night’s sleep for days at a time. Listening to kids complaining about being hungry with no food to feed them. Confrontation with other people. All this stuff adds up in terms of increased blood pressure. This stress might very well kill more Americans than bullets, disease, and starvation combined.

        • Traitor Hator

          And strong men’s hearts will fail from the fear of what’s coming? Luke 21:26 .

      35. Asshat

        whutta people gonna do when they lose their hot water and the sterile environment they live in becomes dirty. I’m a filthy animal don’t shower daily don’t shave at all. The yuppies with their clean pressed fancy clothes smelling like a French whore. I’m gonna just be looking at these people have a total meltdown shaking my head. This is what I mean about hardening up to reality now. You come around all clean and smelling like cologne after the balloon goes up you might as well wear a target.

      36. phicrappazappa

        Lock and Load.

      37. Nomadic

        Last night I read a report that claims a new study reveals that 40% of Americans have no one they can confide in. Wow in 2006 only 25% of the population reported they had no one to confide in. In 1985 Americans had 3 people they confided in.
        This new study suggest that people are living lonelier isolated lives and the Internet is largely to blame. (esp. Facebook & Twitter)
        Also older Americans who start to feel more vulnerable as they become physically weaker are developing unsubstantiated anxiety disorders that might also be attributed to the www.

        • john stiner

          in the 1960s it was air condition to blame for not knowing your neighbors.

          In the old days everybody would sit on their porch in the late evening because the house was too hot. Everybody knew their neighbors then because would all sit on the porch and visit.

          Now we have A/C and no porches and don’t know our neighbors two doors down.

          Interesting how technology changes lives.

          • Smokey

            In the early 50’s, we bought the first 19″ TV console on the block. The kids would all come over with the folks, eat popcorn, and watch the shows. The adults would sit at the tables and play cards, Canasta, Pinochle, what have you.

            The Honeymooners was watched by all of us, everybody loved it. So for a night a week and a weekend, we all shared.

            We’ve lost that interaction with each other.

      38. rabbitone

        My parents beat depression era values into me in city living in bad times. So when I got to college I had a chance in economic classes look up many practices using money. Things like bankrupt cities issuing script (money) in lieu of wages surprised me. But the one that kept popping up were the odd uses of PM’s..

        Many communities accepted gold and silver as payment in full for local taxes at a hefty premium. More than a third of the small/medium land deals in many states were done exclusively in PM’s(because of the falling value of the dollar). Many edible commodities could be purchased in bulk at farmers markets with PM’s. However, what surprised me most is PM’s did not seem to play much of a role in direct barter between individuals. At that level skills, shelter, fuel, fresh food and water were much more in demand.

        • john stiner

          As a test of my bartering with silver rounds I put an add on the local facebook buy and sell page.

          5 ounces of silver to cut down and haul off a tree. Amounts to about $75 to $85 dollars.

          someone agree and started work within an hour.

          I did see that same person later in the day at the local gold and silver buyer trading it into cash, but this guy looked like a meth head. Of course, regular people would not do that type of work because they already have jobs.

          • Warchild Dammit!

            “Of course, regular people would not do that type of work because they already have jobs.”WTF John,I have work as a carpenter but do side cash gigs for extra bucks,that along with having long hair makes me a druggy?!The guy may just be hurting financially/just wants some toy monies ect. or need the cash to pay bills,thus,can’t stack metals at moment.I will say for 80 bucks better be a small damn tree though!

            • john stiner

              It was the teeth that made him a meth head, not long hair.

              And it was not very big, about a 2 to 3 hour job.

      39. Nomadic

        Cities that are powered by coal would probably be the worst choice because coal needs to be delivered by truck and train. This will be especially true for cities that reside further inland, where many miles of roads will need to be cleared before coal shipments can be delivered. In most cases in America, coal is delivered by train, so if you pick a city that is also near a railway then there are better odds that your city will receive power after the SHTF.

        Have you heard of this new fan dangled thing called the grid?
        Many power plants are located in what are known as sacrificial areas.
        You eat the co2 but another state gets the power. Can the grid be undone with the flip of a switch and return to local transmission/ distribution. I’d be finding out before considering a city because it has train tracks and a power plant.

      40. Asshat

        In mass there was a drug bust the other day. They got around 30 people in the bust and took a lot of drugs off the street mainly fentanyl the news said this isn’t good they said there will be a spike in robbery crime because any remaining drugs will go up in price. This tells me they can get drugs off the streets if they want. They just busted the supplier and a new supplier will be taking over. We never talk about how the world of illegal drugs will affect the survivalist. I’m gonna say it will affect you more than you realize. Remember the drug that was turning people into flesh eating zombies. Go on you tube and look it up. It’s not bullshit now put guns in the hands of these addicts they will kill you and take your shit to get high again. Right now they just steal shit that isn’t bolted down and pawn it. Don’t dismiss this issue have a plan.

        • Reader1

          At least the Fentanyl kills addicts. We could use more Krokodile here, too. That sh!t dissolves addicts from the inside out.

        • Traitor Hator


      41. Traitor Hator

        Has anyone else seem large amounts of locomotives sitting on the side tracks back to back needing a paint job? As in they are not even keeping up maintenance. Like all the cargo ships they say are sitting. And could you imagine how much fuel is wasted shipping everything from China instead of making it hear? I read that McCulahe chainsaw co. Moved their factory to Mexico. But the theft problem put them out of business. Maybe that dosent happen in China?

      42. Traitor Hator

        If you drive 30 min. To get to work, that’s 30 miles? So if or when an EMP hit while you are at work , and if strong enough to disable modern cars , the roads will be blocked with dead cars ? So you have to walk 30 miles? Id love to have a skate board in the trunk. Is there water on the way that dosent need an electric pump to get ? If not I fill a couple water jugs and start walking? 30 miles carrying 2 gallons of water? 3 miles per hour average? 10 hours of walking? Will personal protection be vital in the first 10 hours? The gunfire will start effecting your sleep on day 3? Seems like most people could walk home from work? But then what?

      43. TEST


        Just a thought (no worries if you disagree). What about putting as well as Fefal’s Surviving Argentina site at and on your blogrolls at left? The only reason I mention this is that it’s nice to have alt sites to read from, and these two – at least IMHO – are worth consideration. Fernando Aguirre, aka Ferfal, survived the Argentinian meltdown a decade ago so has a log of insightful stuff to say, IMHO

        • admin

          Will do ! Thanks !

          all three are great websites !

      44. Traitor Hator

        Groups with enough money and power to manufacture , buy and distribute millions of RPGs. And have them ready for the domestic enemy after a fake EMP? False information given to pilots, for bombing runs, missile coodinates faked. Obamas men taking out the few remaining loyal commanders. And there could be millions, mostly Muslem imigrants already experienced fighters. Super well armed and supplied. Our loyal soldiers would be held back from areas that the domestic enemy was pacifying. Is that how the bolshavics did it in Russia? Our military is semi hardened to EMP. So they could electronically stop or fake all comunications. With the civilian population in the dark and fed false information they could manipulate everything and butcher us just like they did to the Russians. We will go into another dark age? Tortured slaves? And their time is running out.?

        • Reader1

          That doesn’t sound likely.

      45. Traitor Hator

        Regarding organized religion. What’s the most graven image on this planet. And who is worshiping it ?

      46. Traitor Hator

        Remember. Lift up a rock and you will find me, Split a piece of wood and I am there.

      47. Brian

        In Venezuela, crime gangs have taken control of the roads into the cities. They stop trucks carrying fuel, food, and other supplies. It is easier for them when the cities and small and have fewer roads in. The national government has lost control.

      48. Gerold

        Both FerFal (Argentina) and Serco (Bosnia) advise against remote Bug Out Locations (BOL) although everyone talks about “heading for the hills.” They recommend small cities and establishing small groups with like-minded neighbors. In remote locations, the distant neighbors won’t hear the marauders take their time torturing, raping and slowly killing you and your loved ones.

        Also, there aren’t enough hills for everyone.

        As well the hill people who already live there don’t want you. They see you as intruders and will act accordingly unless you’ve already set up a BOL long before and gotten to know the locals.

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