Financial Privacy Under Fire: DHS Freezes Bitcoin Money Transfers

by | May 15, 2013 | Headline News | 81 comments

Do you LOVE America?


    Financial privacy free of government intrusion and interference is dead.

    In what seems to be the government’s latest attack on private transactions between individuals, the Department of Homeland Security has shut down funds transfers operated by mobile processing platform Dwolla, which is responsible for managing transfers for the BitCoin digital currency exchange.

    Details are still sparse, but a spokesperson for U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) confirms that an investigation is in progress and Dwolla is no longer able to accept currency transfers for its customers.

    The U.S. Department of Homeland Security confirmed it has initiated legal action that prompted the Dwolla payment service to stop processing bitcoin transactions.

    Nicole Navas, a spokesperson for U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement, confirmed the legal action to CNET this afternoon.

    Dwolla, a Des Moines, Iowa-based startup, which raised $16.5 million in funding two weeks ago, notified users about the move earlier Tuesday. It blamed the decision on “recent court orders” limiting its ability to send money through Mt. Gox, the largest bitcoin exchange.

    “In order not to compromise this ongoing investigation being conducted by ICE Homeland Security Investigations Baltimore, we cannot comment beyond the information in the warrant, which was filed in the District of Maryland earlier today,” Navas told CNET.

    Dwolla has refused to elaborate, saying through its support account on Twitter only that “we received a court order” and inquirers should follow up with the affected parties.

    Homeland Security declined to elaborate on the warrant or court proceedings.

    The court order has yet to be made available for public scrutiny, but sources close to the Bitcoin Ecosystem have suggested that this may be the first of many coming government investigations into the cryptographic digital currency which makes it possible for money transfers to be made without intrusion, verification or a paper trail:

    There are certainly more questions than answers at this stage. We are prompted to wonder whether this is this the first of a series of governmental assaults on the exchanges? That’s what they’d target if they want to put the kibosh on bitcoin. Or, is this a case where DHS is investigating some individual or organization who may have used bitcoins, via Dwolla, for some potentially nefarious or terroristic reasons?

    Members of the PandoDaily team have spoken to sources close to the bitcoin ecosystem and have been hearing that it’s likely the former.


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      1. Yep’m, it was a good idea until it wasn’t. So who gets all the money? Another Al Gore buy carbon credits scheme?


        • Take solace in the fact that fat Al Gore is having too many steak dinners and getting too many massages and living a fat cat…like an aging boomer running out of time.

          One day you’ll watch the news and hear he had a heart attack. Then he can take all those carbon credits with him. ha.

          Just like fat Ted Kennedy who enslaved us to the poor… He won’t be missed.

          I love time.. It clarifies and solves all things.
          One cannot be king forever.
          Just this week I heard the news of some bitch I’ve hated my entire life is on her boomer death bed. Nice.
          Yes, one day it will be my turn and someone else will be happy about it.
          That’s life.

          So.. See ya Al.

        • Ya, it was only a matter of time B4 .gov interfered, oops, stepped in to regulate yet another free enterprise monetary system because THEY WEREN’T GETTING THEIR CUT, oops again, I mean taxes.

          What’s a bitcoin worth when there’s no power?

        • Really off topic, but saw yesterday they have finally successfully launched drones from aircraft carriers. No more need to get permission from fly-over countries full of brown people.

          as a former sailor myself, knowing the capabilities of an aircraft carrier and it’s squadrons, this ups the game to say the least.

          it sent chills down my spine when F/A-18’s were launched off its deck in quick succession, now they are implementing magnetic catapults. faster, cleaner launches. no need for steam.

          i would be shitting my pants if I were the USA’s enemy of the month.

          • you are the ‘enemy’ of the Government of the USA….as all of its citizens will soon find out…

      2. I would’nt give you two bits, for a bitcoin. Trekker Out.

        • Old man, you’d better listen to the ‘Kreuz and opt out of the Corporation’s Notes. Those BITCOINS are going to be worth a lot of MONEY someday. Old and set in your ways. I still love you pappy.

          • “Those BITCOINS are going to be worth a lot of MONEY someday.”

            How so? It seems to me that big brother just shut em down. It seems to me that if you cant do bidness, you got no bidness and you got nothing of value. So please explain how it worked out in your mind to say such a thing.

            • It is physically impossible to shut down Bitcoin. The gobmint cant do shit except threats, duress, and cohersion.

              • So, denial?

              • what’s cohersion?

                And BTW, coersion is the same thing as duress. How’s that doctorate working out for you?

                • The Stasi can interfere with the conversion of Bitcoin to Federal Reserve Toiletpaper and, if they can pierce the anonymity, they can prosecute individuals and businesses for using Bitcoin.

                  I rather liked the e-Gold system of anonymous ownership of gold. That was a huge threat to the banksters so they shut that down.

                  Seems like another version of e-Gold should be started offshore somewhere that hates banksters. Iceland? Indonesia?

                • It’s “Coercion”

            • They shut down ONE site.they did not shut down bitcoin. Some people need to learn to pay attention.
              Why is everyone so afraid of bitcoin on this website? Right now its actually a good option if your against regulation.

          • Sure they will. Just like Confederate currency.

          • @Eisencrap…

            Well first of all punk….

            How are you going to get your money out if the government has shut it down?

            You have no understanding of the most basic of precepts when it comes to this kind of thing….which is….


            Let me explain it so you will understand….

            Any kind of asset that is not in your personal possession, is based upon a promise. Which means it is based upon DEBT. As such….bitcoin is EXACTLY like those fiat FRN’s.

            And guess what Eeinstein…..if you can’t get your bitcoins converted into those FRN’s…’ve got NOTHING….NADA….ZERO.

            Get it?

            But… doesn’t really matter. Because you don’t really own any bitcoins, do you?

            You talk the game. But you aren’t really a player. In other words…’re a POSER.

            And I would imagine this translates into just about every area of your life….including your claims of “survival skills”.

            You are the Manti Te’o of the message boards. Your skills, knowledge and world experience are about as real as his girlfriend.

            • +1 for the manti teo reference!

            • Eisen crap didn’t have any money to buy Bitcoins so no worries about how he will get it back.

            • spreading your intelligence around again? they couldnt shut bit torrents down, why do you think? encryption dumbass, they only way to stop bitcoin is to turn off the power! p2p, better do some more reading, pappy!

              • If they make it impossible for you to exchange your bitcoin for dollars, what difference does it make?

                Not real bright, are you?

        • “Financial privacy free of government intrusion and interference is dead”. How ….. final.

          WE don’t know that, not that it matters a twit to me, that BitCoin has been shut down. let’s wait until the facts come out before jumping to conclusions. It may be that BitCoin is not complying with money transfer regs like the banks do.

          Bit Coin is an American company therefore it falls under US jurisprudence. BitCoin could go global as an offshore entity, like the casinos did, and encrypt their access to members.

          Lets not jump to conclusions before the facts are known. The sky is not falling, Chicken Little. 🙂

      3. Well, they can’t get my silver bitcoins. If they come looking… I spent the quarters at an arcade

        • Me to! Back in the 70’s

      4. DHS uses so many of the same terms and language that the nazis used before and during WW2. The parallel is weird, but expected. The Germans used the word homeland very extensively for example. The tactics are akin to the bust down the door and ask questions later. What is so ironic is that the government is planning very similar means of money transfers in the future that is like bitcoin, guess they don’t want any competition.

        I just waiting for that character helicopter ben or someone else to try to print up 17 BO trillion dollar coins, and they try deposit them in the federal reserve and say that the debt has been paid off. It would be laughable if all this was not so tragic.

        • Operation paperclip and its siblings were one of the best things too ever happen to germany post war. All the movers and shakers of the nazi party that could be found . Were summarily evacuated to america. Where they formed the brains and backbone of the dark pool goverment and its policies . Take a look for yourselves , sometime and draw your own conclusions.

        • My favorite of the NWO lingo..

          From Personnel to Human Resources. HUh? so now we’re a resource for them.

          What I did was enslave these bastards to me.
          At my company… I build up what I call.. TECHNICAL DEBT.

          This is where I do shit and they know now how.
          So then I get them by the balls and score big raises and bonuses.

        • Except the German were awesome with the technology they developed where as this admin is mediocre at best. The Germans were outnumbered (like the confederates) but fought with tenacity and bravery seldom seen which made them such a force to be dealt with it took a much larger force and many years to put them down.

      5. YEAH! You guys don’t steal … the ZOG FEDGOV STATEGOV’S don’t like competition …

        only the washington dc , state govs and wallstreet bankers mafia gets to steal from the once free ZOG AmeriKan peeple .

        a Corrupt Federal Government creates a corrupt AmeriKan society .


      6. The greater Ponzi scheme con artists don’t like it when the smaller Ponzi scheme con artists are trying to set up shop on their turf. Cry me a river since the whole thing was probably a CIA front operation to build a quick slush fund while running a beta test psy-op to see how many suckers would put faith in absolutely NOTHING. Sucker born every minute. Even if it was legitimate and organic, did you really think the criminal banksters would leave this alone? PA-LEASE!

        • They will never find my silver. And if they ban it. Silver will be the currency of the coming underworld with the coming cashless society.

          Silver has so many uses.

          If I had to dump all my silver…It’s just find a private buyer.

          Or melt it down into a bumper…paint it and drive across the boarder
          and recast to ingots for sale.

          They cannot ban silver…there’s too many uses.

          Yep.. The banksters…they are just like the mob.
          They see a competitor..and it’s smackdown time.

          The best store of wealth is raw land.
          Sure they tax you..but the holding costs are low.

          Something you bought for $10k a few decades ago…is worth far more today.

          • The value of land that is productive is worth far more than any fiat currency. If you take the cost of this land and run up the price in fiat, based on inflation, what will someone pay for it today?

            Just like the metals. What would the price have to reach in dollars before you would sell?

            I think Jim Rickards had it right in his book “Currency Wars” by stating that any world currency introduced, that was not based on precious metals would be doomed to fail. This is what I took from the final chapters. Paper is worthless unless it is backed by sound money.

            Capitol controls have been implimented in Europe. They will be here in time due to the massive QE that the ECB and FED have injected into the system.

            Just remember this. No fiat currency has survived the ages. Not one. Best to have your wealth in land, fine art, metals and tangible goods.

            Cheer up! You’re in good company.

      7. Well it wasn’t my plan to “place my trust in nothing”.

        Shit, they were giving away free money. I was gonna get the cheapest ASIC rig possible and just let it mine away, selling off every week or month or whatever was practical REGARDLESS of what the market price was doing, as long as it was non-negative of course.

        It would have had to dip below $20 or lower before it was not worth it anymore (electricity costs and payback on the rig, which is by the way cheap).

        I get a black box. I hit the go button. I go to sleep. A month later I have $150-$600 (depending on hash rate and going price) for doing absolutely Jack-shit.

        Sell it, buy silver.

        Well fuck. Now they done gone and taken away my money tree.

        I mean I knew it would blow up sooner or later, but I gave it a year. Apparently overly optimistic of me.

        • Don’t give up my friend, it only affects MtGox. You can still use Dwolla to exchange BTC to fiat from CampBX. Your “plan” is exactly what I’ve been doing for almost two years now. Only recently with Asics of course but you get the point.

          In case you didn’t know, there are several places online where you can buy gold and silver and pay with Bitcoins. So there’s another option you have.

          Bitcoin is far from done…

          • That was me as Anonymous. I dunno why I was Anonymous but eh. System error.


            They ever release the Butterfly Labs Jalapeno yet? Or is that still vaporware?

        • Bitcoin is to money as the Internet is to information. It is not good or bad in and of itself.

          Ponzi? No, limited supply, 21 million built in limit. It is inherently deflationary.

          Temporary? Could be. It is only as strong as the mass of folks using it.

          Vulnerable to counter moves by the PTB? Perhaps. But it, or an alternative, will learn and evolve around them.

          I certainly wouldn’t give up my gold and silver in lieue of Bitcoin. But I certainly do want to use an alternative currency immune to the yoke of central control.

      8. JOG, An X1.7 just occurred…I would value your thoughts, opinions and forecast for the next few days?

        God Bless,

      9. How do you buy bitcoin? We buy it with USD here in America? What backs USD? Nothing. If USD is backed by nothing and you use it to buy bitcoin, what REAL value is bitcoin? There’s a good article from that explains this in greater detail than what I’ve articulated. Not going to link to it because you need to do your own research. No more babysitting. Look it up.

        Buy gold and silver instead. The downside of precious metals ownership will be short lived.
        Lead is also a good investment if you get my drift.

        • We buy metals with worthless dollars too right?

        • Why in God’s name would you BUY Bitcoin?

          No no no no. Screw that, it’s too volatile. At least for the moment.

          MAKE Bitcoin. Yeah it’s slow. It’s also free…

      10. Thats what the plane is doing circling over Quincy. Looking for the Kenyan’s Bit Coin collection.

      11. It’s not real unless it’s backed by the federal reserve…

        In the federal reserve we trust.

        • @Bill,

          LOL, good one.


      12. Next on the agenda, investigate the 2 bit president, then the 2 bit congress…

      13. jog, i dont think most of us mind you going ot, esp while this event is occuring. time is precious and scrolling thru old topics looking for new post takes needed minutes away from reading the new topic. until mac can get a jog forum page set up, please dont worry about the ot red thumbs. we are here for preparedness; your flare updates help tremedously.

        thank you for putting in the time and effort into reading those solar sites and breifing us so we can use our time to keep preppin’!

        @ bi, ditto, just replace “jog” with your handle and “solar” with quake. 🙂

      14. It’s DIGITAL, that means it’s very easy to steel!
        Stay away from any “future” digital cash scam.
        BUY “PHYSICAL” Gold or Silver!

        • No you don’t need to buy bitcoins you can make them on the internet.

          A lot of you don’t understand how bitcoin works.

      15. this may be an ignorant question but here goes: what happens to all the bitcoin holders when tptb shut down the internet..??? jus’sayin’

        pray for the best while prepping for the worst

        • ar. if the internet is off you have bigger issues than where is my money. besides the computers will assemble into a network. its called ad-hoc network mode. and bitcoin is technically awesome and will be improved with dedicated smart card based qrcode hardware.

      16. There will be NO competition. The rulers have decreed it under the “color of law”. Free men are to be made slaves while they strip mine the world of wealth and you are made to pay tax “tribute” at the point of a gun. Eddie Bernay’s “advertising” campaign is in full force over all media getting the serfs to love their slavery. In the end, those who say they are doing “God’s work” by stealing from the poor will never make it through the needle’s eye. Hang some bankers.

      17. When I first heard of Bitcoin the first thing I thought of was three card monty…
        I suppose that’s just me …

      18. I have a question.
        Can I buy Bitcoins with my EBT card?

        • No.

      19. Enjoy….

        Dear elected official—
        I am writing to you today about a particularly vexing issue for a few Americans, such as myself and others who are not besotted by the Kardashians and Dancing with the Stars and actually watch C-SPAN.
        I think that it is time to dispense with the obfuscation prevalent in all strata of government that the United States of America is still a Republic and is the home of a free market capitalistic society. At some point in time in the past few decades, the Republic was subject to a coup d’état and the United States morphed into a fascist state, aka a Corpocracy. Since it isn’t exactly a secret that Stalin was absolutely right when he said, “it only matters who counts the votes” and that Corporations write the legislation that they then pay politicians to pass, I believe it’s only right to call the “spade a spade” and dispense with any notions otherwise.
        I can only imagine that formally recognizing this change of government would be a great relief to politicians everywhere, especially in Washington DC. It must be very difficult trying to live a dual life of pretending to be a public servant while “seeing to the needs of your clientele”.
        I have given much thought to the framework of how the Corpocracy might operate as outlined below:
        1. The name, “United States of America” needs to go but the name “United Corporations of America” obviously won’t work, since as you are very well aware that multi-national Corporations, sovereign wealth funds, government owned companies(GOC) and secret societies all contribute towards policy and legislation that is enacted. My recommendation is simple—the name of the country will simply be referred to as the entity or name determined by the Company, industry group, Sovereign Wealth Fund or GOC that holds the office of President, or whatever you choose to call it. I recognize the fact that this may end up being rather confusing, especially if a Chinese GOC were to win. Maybe we’d be called Little China or China II. (Off topic, I think I want some Kung Pau Chicken tonight). I’m confident you’ll be able to work the finer details out and avoid any potential trademark infringements.

        The other option would be to sell the naming rights to the highest bidder every couple of years. I’m not a big sports person but I see a winning marketing angle when I see it. I remember when college football changed all their bowl games to the name of their sponsors—Nokia Bowl, Papa John Bowl, etc. The Holy Country of Goldman Sachs (they’re doing God’s work according to Blankenstein) or perhaps Halliburtonland or Monsantopire. The possibilities are numerous.

        Maybe some of that money could be used to pay off the national debt that was caused by bailing out for profit corporations, waging wars to secure resources for use by for profit corporations and subsidizing for profit corporations indirectly by providing food stamps and health insurance to name a few since said corporations do not feel the need to pay employees a living wage to be able to afford these things no less the product, in many cases their employer makes or sells. Nah, since you’re a Corpocracy, it’s only fitting to declare bankruptcy, incorporate under a new name and repeat. What a great model!

        2. All existing political parties would cease to exist. New parties would consist of related industries- the military industrial complex, Wall Street, Healthcare/Pharmaceutical, or perhaps a consortium of corporations, such as ALEC, etc. with similar missions, strategic plans or business objectives. Candidates for political office would have to declare a party affiliation or run as an independent. Independent candidates would represent the exclusive interests of a specific company, sovereign wealth fund or GOC.

        3. Federal elections would continue to be held at the frequency outlined in the “God da**ed piece of paper” formerly known as the Constitution and Bill of Rights before reportedly being renamed by George W. Bush. Now you may be asking, “Why continue with the pretense of elections when we both know Stalin could have only dreamed about electronic voting machines with no paper trails in his wildest fantasies?
        Thanks to the rampant success of public schools throughout this country, most people have no idea what form of government we technically have, or how it is supposed to operate according that pesky piece of paper previously discussed. However, giving employees and consumers (formerly known as Americans) the illusion of choice at the ballot box on such important issues as gay marriage and abortion, as advocated by Leo Strauss, goes a long way towards keeping them entertained and having something to discuss on Facebook when the Kardashians and Dancing with the Stars are in re-runs and in creating brand loyalty to the Corpocracy.
        With the further corporate takeover of public education by such outstanding entities as the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation and Intel via the Common Core Standards, it should be easy to re-write history to include this change of government and to educate future generations on the merits of this new form of government and to dismiss any notions about that archaic form of government known as a republic.
        One small problem remains for the Corpocracy though and it relates to those employees who know the truth regarding the Corporate takeover of America, take issue with it and earnestly believe in the virtues of democracy and a Republic form of government. These employees should be declared guilty of insubordination to the Corpocracy and thus classified as a Domestic Terrorist. Provisions of the Patriot Act and NDAA should be invoked in these instances and these employees interned at one of the many for profit prison industrial complexes needing 90% occupancy to meet the profit margin requirements of such companies as Microsoft and Target and the portfolio yields of others such as General Electric and Merrill Lynch investing in this sector. Furthermore, ALEC’s Truth in Sentencing could be further revised to meet the Corpocracy’s overall financial and social objectives. These moves alone should dramatically increase our Corpocracy’s competiveness against the Chinese Corpocracy.
        Last but not least, the symbol of our majestic Corpocracy, the flag, will need to be redone. I would strongly recommend that NASCAR be retained to advise on the proper placement and fee structure to maximize revenue via the placement of a stock symbol or logo on our, advertising piece- oops, I mean flag.

        Last, but not least, I have re-written the Pledge of Allegiance to reflect our Country’s new form of government.
        “I pledge allegiance to the flag of (insert name), and to the Corpocracy for which it stands, under Mammon, stock dividends, authority and impunity for few.”
        Thank you for your thoughtful consideration in this matter. Please be advised that the proposed Pledge of Allegiance is copyrighted material and that the author (me) is entitled to remuneration for such usage in accordance with all applicable laws. Furthermore, I am available for contractual services during the formal transition phase to the Corpocracy. Please contact me directly to discuss services needed and for rates and fees.
        Your Constituent

        • Ah man, I’d give you 20 thumbs up for that one if I could.

          Don’t forget, all those insubordinates in the for-profit detention centers can still be useful!

          Like… assembling Ipads. Or Cruise Missiles. Or playing pay-per-view Death Race. Cheesy movie, but not a bad idea…

      20. Tick removal…

        Please forward to anyone with children… or dogs, etc.

        A School Nurse has written the info below — good enough to share — And it really works.

        I had a pediatrician tell me what she believes is the best way to remove a tick. This is great, because it works in those places where it’s sometimes difficult to get to with tweezers: between toes, in the middle of a head full of dark hair, etc.

        Apply a glob of liquid soap to a cotton ball. Cover the tick with the soap-soaked cotton ball and swab it for a few seconds (15-20). The tick will come out on its own and be stuck to the cotton ball when you lift it away.

        This technique has worked every time I’ve used it (and that was frequently), and it’s much less traumatic for the patient and easier for me.

        Unless someone is allergic to soap, I can’t see that this would be damaging in any way. I even had my doctor’s wife call me for advice because she had one stuck to her back and she couldn’t reach it with
        tweezers. She used this method and immediately called me back to say, “It worked!”

        • This is the reason I come to this site. I love useful info like this.

          So everyone in my family pretty much knows I’m a prepper and think I’m crazy. We went out for Mother’s day with my parents good friends; and of course the subject arose. When they asked why I prep I explained the number one reason is the state of our economy.

          He tried to tell me the debt goes through cycles and the cycle will soon correct itself. I said my entire life the debt numbers have yet to start going backwards so I don’t buy that crap. I have begun not even trying to educate people anymore because they simply trust everything will remain peachy as it always has been.

          My response to prepping when someone asks is this. I have four tires on my truck but still carry a spare.

          GOD Bless and the only PM worth stocking up on is brass and lead!!!

        • Good article Satori…thanks for posting.

          I’ve forwarded it to all….er…uhm….both of my friends.

      21. @ JustOneGuy. I saw your comment on another article, but I really want everyone to see what I wrote to you because it affects everyone so deeply, our freedoms as people. So I decided to cut it and paste it to here rather than somewhere else. I tell you I just can’t stand what is going on with the attacks on the 2nd Amendment, it is attacks on freedom for all. Those anti-self defense radicals don’t comprehend that they are cutting their own throats willingly by trying to destroy the 2nd and other rights of the Constitution. It is amazing to me that someone would not want their country protected, and that means leaving the 2nd. Amendment alone completely.

        This is exactly what the enemies of the U.S. want, a type of polarization and in country fighting about whatever. You see China and you can bet that China is absolutely on the side of the anti-gunners and the more dissent they can cause on every level, the more of a strategic advantage it is to them. While there are the people that vigorusly defend the foundations of the Constitution, especially the 2nd. Amendment, there are those that are obilivious to just why they do, for the protection of EVERYONE and the country as a whole.

        Someday if the world somehow survives, those freedom to bear arms might be Star Wars type blasters or Star Trek type phasers or disruptors. The 2nd. Amendment was written to protect people’s right to protect themselves and the country from threats. You can imagine how these anti-gunners would react to people owning advanced weapons that would make the best firearms of today look totally archaic, like the musket single shot primitive firearms of the 18th and 19th century, Still those ignorant anti-self defense individuals state that the 2nd. Amendment only meant single shot black powder long rifles. Of course it meant self defense with whatever was needed to defend yourself and country. The AR-15 and similar firearms are just an adaption of the times, and EXACTLY what the laws of the 2nd. Amendment meant.

        It is beyond belief for me and so many others that anyone in this country would not want their own ass protected from internal and external threats to their own freedom and safety. The 2nd Amendment is meant to protect everyone, yet these anti-gunners only see that these weapons have been used by a very few isolated lunatics, just the same a couple of losers used a couple of pressure cookers to maim and kill. The usefulness of pressure cookers from food preservation has a billion times more value than IF someone uses it for a component in a weapon. There are many other everyday household items that can be that component, like the canisters of some vacuum cleaners. They would want these banned also.

        The so called assault rifle is nothing but the same type of defense used NOW as in the 18th. century and the 19th century, as the long rifle was one of the most advanced weapons of that time. Yet that imbecile foreign piers morgan and others consider a SEMI-automated rifle to be a weapon that no one ever intended for the civilian population to own. The 2nd Amendment meant that the civilian own the choice self defense of ANY time for protection of self and the U.S. If that is an AR-15 now, and a Star Wars blaster in the future, the 2nd protects that right whether those pacifists like it or not. The Constitution is meant to protect everyone whether it is political correct at anytime or not. So frustrating that there is now such a large crowd of morons that can’t see this.

        • “…the 2nd protects that right whether those pacifists like it or not.”

          I kind of take exception to the term “pacifist” being used derogatorily, to describe gun-grabbers.

          pac·i·fist, [pas-uh-fist] noun
          1. a person who believes in pacifism or is opposed to war or to violence of any kind.
          2. a person whose personal belief in pacifism causes him or her to refuse being drafted into military service. Compare conscientious objector.

          I AM A PACIFIST by definition. I do not want to fight or engage in violence and I generally abhor the idea of war.

          However, even a pacifist is capable of recognizing a situation where violence is useful, necessary or even required. I DO NOT WANT TO HARM ANYONE, but I WILL DEFEND MYSELF OR OTHERS if necessary.

          Further, gun-grabbers are NOT necessarily pacifists. Most of the prominent gun-grabbers own guns and many have personal armed guards to protect them by force. No, gun-grabbers are definitely NOT pacifists—don’t believe me, just approach one aggressively and see what happens.



          They want others to THINK they are against violence, when what they are REALLY against, is VIOLENCE THEY CAN’T CONTROL OR ABATE. They don’t want for anyone to be a threat TO THEM, and they see anyone who might be able to challenge THEM as a threat.

          BIGOTS AND LIARS…COWARDS…but not pacifists.



            Then you are not a pacifist.

            A true pacifist will not engage in violence under any condition…..period.

            But you are correct…..those who would seek to disarm us are NOT pacifists either. They are tyrants.

            Libertarians operate under the philosophy of not INITIATING force….or using violence for political purposes.

            • Pacifists are opposed to violence, but not incapable of it, except in extreme cases.

      22. BI–

        Completely agree with you on the need to protect yourself. We are increasingly becoming a bifurcated society where young people and many immigrants believe in the nanny state and where personal responsibility is an anathema and all parts of the person are to be yielded to the state. As dead as this country is now– when everyone under the age of 40-50 is dead (those who still may believe in what this Country is supposed to stands for and has not had the hard core indoctrination foisted upon them in the public indoctrination camps-aka public schools) the USA will officially be dead as all vestiges and remembrance of the former glory of the USA as a Republic and free market capitalism will be gone…

      23. Defense distributed used the bit coin and is currently
        in hot water with the Feds .

        That was probably their excuse to “shut down ” the bit coin.

        I had never heard if bit coin until I went to defense distributed site .

        My research led me to believe it was a scam.

        Seems like many will be left holding the bag, whilst someone else runs
        away with the full bag.

        I recently heard of a online video game that works the same way, where you can “buy” and “sell” your assets on the game for real money.

      24. If DHS can target bitcoin, they can target anything they choose. Nothing they do has any legitimate basis to it whatsoever. Howdy, BI and JOG, off topic I read your comments #1667879 and #1668428, especially JOG’s with great interest; once again nothing I can dispute. Howdy, CL, I read your letter to the politician with great interest; it’s so sad what our country has become. braveheart

        • braveheart-

          I’m so tired of the façade that is our gov’t. That’s the reason I wrote it, sad thing is most people wouldn’t even care or notice…

      25. BI, just read your post to JOG and I’m still livid myself over the attacks on our gun rights. i’m still on razor’s edge. Something big is coming soon. I can feel it. Check out my comment #1670841 at the last article. I gave up on Eisen and let off some steam; things are not going too well for me this morning. braveheart

      26. Eisen, looks like your brainstorm about bitcoin turned out to be a flop.

      27. Lets see if the next step is to stop all private transfers of gold and silver. They’ve done it before and can do it again. They hate anything that they can not trace and control.

        • They’ve banned drugs too.

          It’s worked out well, don’t you think?

          • yeah, but you can’t order meth or coke online with your credit card. You have to pay face-to-face and usually in cash.

      28. Silver is down almost a dollar today. Buy on the dips.

        • I did.

      29. So we start with BITCOIN and wind out way thru the paranoid rants about jews, the price of gold and silver, home schooling, earthquakes and the Constitution.

        Can you say CUCKOO? Geez o ma.

        Take a deep breath. Take your meds. Enjoy life.

        No one is coming for your guns, cukoo clocks.

        As far as SHITCOIN……. you can’t just go out and create a currency. It would kind of cause a tiny problem if every kook with a cuckoo clock was creating currencies.

        This is the USA. Use that paper stuff in your wallet. If you have the brains to have a job. Oh…Paper is no good? Send it to me. I’ll use it.

        • F.O.A.D. troll

      30. An account got seized because MT. GOX was not properly licensed as an MSB. This has nothing to do with Bitcoin at large but is an action against an improperly licensed business.

      31. If you don’t have it in your physical possession, you don’t own it…

      32. btw…i buy gold and silver WITH my bitcoins i mine. but its easier to hide my bitcoins then my gold and silver!

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