12 Survival Lessons from Ukraine: “Nothing Provides as Much Valuable Information as Real World Situations”

by | Apr 18, 2015 | Emergency Preparedness | 337 comments

Do you LOVE America?


    Editor’s Note: FerFAL has been a leading voice in the preparedness movement before there ever was a preparedness movement. In the early 2000’s Fernando personally witnessed financial and socio-economic collapse on a massive scale in Argentina. He witnessed the complete meltdown of his country’s currency and can speak first-hand about what hyperinflation looks like. As you might expect, following the Argentine destabilization FerFAL witnessed the panic, desperation, and violence that one might expect when the world around you collapses. He wrote about his experiences in his widely popular The Modern Survival Manual: Surviving the Economic Collapse. His book is loaded with practical information and advice, and remains a must-read for anyone who is serious about actionable strategies to prepare for similar events in their own locales. His most recent book, Bugging Out and Relocating: When Staying Put Is Not An Option, delves into strategies for getting out of Dodge and finding a new home so that you can avoid what  he lived through in Argentina.

    In his latest article, generously shared with our community and originally posted at his website The Modern Survivalist, Fernando highlights twelve survival lessons we can learn from the Ukraine conflict. As he can attest, nothing provides as much valuable information as real world situations.


    12 Survival Lessons from Ukraine
    By Fernando “FerFAL” Aguirre


    The war in Ukraine is a tragic event but it’s one that we can all learn from. Nothing provides as much valuable information as real world situations where ordinary people are forced to deal with extraordinary events. At the end of the day, the war in Ukraine gives us plenty of examples of what works and what doesn’t, and while personal experience is important, the wise person learns from other people’s mistakes so as to not repeat them himself.
    There are several articles explaining what people are going through in eastern Ukraine right now. This article over at dailymail provides a good visual image of what people are going through. There’s also a thread in survivalist boards where a Dunbass resident that goes by the name of George1980 has been posting, sharing his experiences. I highly recommend reading it if you have the time.

    Using this information, here are twelve important lessons based what has happened so far in Ukraine:


    1) Artillery & infantry beats survivalist hero fantasies. Every. Single. Time.

    Maybe the most obvious lesson to be learned is how miserably all these fantasies about forming survival groups, living in a retreat while fighting against impossible odds would ultimately fail. There’s simply no surviving against an occupation force when facing them as an individual or small group. Houses, towns and even entire cities can eventually get surrounded and overpowered. A single house or compound represents a laughable resistance to organized armed forces, let alone ones with artillery and air support at their disposal. Once shooting at your position is no longer fun, they’ll just blow you up. It’s as simple as that.


    A refugee woman receive humanitarian aid at the “Station Kharkiv” volunteers help centre at Krasnotkatska str. Kharkiv, Ukraine.

    2) Cover the basics. Food, water, shelter and medicines.

    In various parts of eastern Ukraine, People are suffering the lack of water, electricity and food shortages. You need to store food, food that requires no refrigeration and little or no cooking. You need water, not just a water filter (which you should have as well) but actual jugs of water. For true emergencies and survival situations, just like you can’t have too much food you can’t have too much water. Have a well, have a river, if nothing else keep an eye out for large barrels on sale and keep some full of water. Even the jugs for carrying water become valuable. Have a good supply of medicines: ibuprofen, vomit and diarrhea medicine, liquid ibuprofen for children, bandages, diapers, formula and antibiotics. Antibiotics are the difference between life and death when you need them. Have lanterns, flashlights and lots of batteries. Get and emergency crank radio. Get a solar charger for your phone and batteries. Have alternative means of cooking and heating. A wood burning stove may do the trick, but make sure you always keep extra wood stored for emergencies. Maybe you’re lucky enough to still have power, if so an electric burner can be put to good use then, saving other fuels for when power goes out. Have extra fuel in storage for your vehicle, enough to make it to your potential bug out location in case you have to leave in a hurry. Have a tent and sleeping bags. These can be used not only for sleeping in tents, but also if you happen to find yourself in a refugee camp during winter or in an unfurnished flat after evacuation or if you’re staying with friends or family.

    In a shelled city, underground is the only safe place to be, to some extent at least. An actual bunker would be ideal, but people try finding shelter anywhere underground. In buildings, windows and doors are covered with sandbags and people sleep in the interior room away from exterior walls and windows. Windows never survive shelling. The broken glass makes it impossible to stay warm in winter. Plastic sheeting can sometimes be used to close openings and still allow light in, but this is far from an ideal solution and he loss of heat is substantial.


    3) Don’t get involved.

    From a survival perspective, the best way to go about conflicts that can develop into violent clashes is to not get involved in the first place. Avoid going to protests and marches. This is especially true in cases such as the one of Ukraine, where people are seen on one side or the other during protests and clashes, often filmed. Something as simple as a rival remembering your face from the rallies can land you in jail or worse. In this kind of situation, it’s even neighbors, former friends and coworkers that may remember your political affiliation. They may end up mentioning your name to the new authorities and they will come after you.

    4) Attitude, clothes, and gear can get you killed or arrested.

    Here is where the gray man approach comes into play. Be as neutral as possible not only regarding your actions and behavior, but also when it comes to insignias, clothes, and gear. Even beards or unusual or characteristic hair styles can get you in trouble. According to George1980 “There was very unpleasant situation on the Ukrainian check-point, when one soldier wanted to arrest me as separatist)) Fortunately, my wife and daughters were with me and this soldier did not stopped me. Problem was that I have a beard and, may be, my face was very “suspicious” ))) Soldier told me that)”.

    Checkpoints in Ukraine are there for a reason: finding enemies. Having a weapon can get you into trouble, but also things such as maps, GPS, political propaganda, radios, this can all be consider espionage material. Adventurers traveling around the world have often mentioned how they get arrested in war zones because of their cameras and laptops. You’re not local, you have electronics capable of being used for communication, then you’re a suspect until proven otherwise. Lots of people have GPS, radios and maps in their Bug Out Bags. Just make sure to be smart about it and understand that in some cases, when dealing with factions fighting over power, it can get you in trouble and its better to get rid of some of it before reaching a checkpoint.


    5) Learn to deal with checkpoints.

    In checkpoints, women and children aren’t as carefully inspected as men. Private vehicles are checked much more thoroughly than public transportation. Maybe you’re better off taking a bus or train. Its important to travel light and be in good health and properly dressed to walk long distances if needed. Bribes may be needed so have cash. A hidden weapon may get you killed or arrested. Is it worth the risk to conceal a handgun among your belongings while evacuating? Probably not, but you’ll have to decide that yourself given your specific situation. Valuable items such as jewelry, cash and even electronics may be “confiscated” or downright stolen by the troops. Conceal them as well as you can. Cash and small gold coins can be hidden in shoe insoles, inside children toys or dirty diapers in the baby’s diaper bag. Coins can be sewed under jacket patches and insignias, under buttons. Women have managed to hide small rolls of cash inside them as if they were tampons, placed inside condoms. Refugees have swallowed small gold coins and jewelry so as to be recovered later. Desperate times call for desperate measures. When it comes to gold vs silver, gold is more compact and easier to hide. I wouldn’t like to swallow 1000 usd worth or silver coins!


    6) Guns can save you, but they can also get you killed.

    According to George1980 “separatists very afraid Ukrainian saboteurs on their territory and try to catch every man with gun who are not from their “Army”.”
    Are you fighting along with one of the factions involved? If not, then make sure you’re not confused with one. If you just want to be left alone, then don’t openly carry a gun. Openly carrying a weapon means you are a fighter on either side of the conflict. If you’re not with either one, BOTH will consider you an armed enemy. At the end of the day a gun can save your life, but in a world of no easy black and white answers a gun can also get you killed. Keep any weapons concealed, and be ready to ditch them, sell them or cache them depending on the situation you are involved in. Just going gun-ho is not the one and only answer to all problems.

    I sure would like to be armed if I was still in Argentina today. If there’s trouble, 1000 bucks will most likely buy any cop’s silence. At the same time, in the 70’s during the military Junta and state terrorism, going around armed in Argentina wasn’t a good idea if you wanted to avoid trouble. If you were caught and found to be armed, the security forces would immediately assume you were a montonero, a leftist terrorist, and you would be tortured, executed or go “missing”. During these torture sessions, people that had no involvement would often mention the names of innocent people, just to stop the tortures. Just being in the wrong phone list of a coworker or fellow student was enough for the security forces to pay you a visit.

    7) Get a Glock 9mm and a rifle with a folding stock.

    As explained earlier, you want to be able to conceal your weapons. Eventually, you may have to leave behind you rifle and even your handgun. You sure won’t be boarding an evacuation plane with one. What about going through check points? Is it worth getting killed or arrested? Or are you better of selling you gun to someone that is staying behind, grab a few extra hundred bucks just as you board a bus or train leaving the conflict area? You want a gun that is ubiquitous, that fires a common round and has a well-known reputation. Basically you want a great weapon that works well for you, but you also want a weapon that is eventually easy to sell as well. Conflict or not, Glocks and AKs are great staples.

    8)Passports and ID are crucial.

    When traveling away from the conflict zones in Ukraine you better have your ID. Soldiers at checkpoints will want passports, driver licenses or other ID proofs. They may not ask for them all the time, but if they do, you better have them. They will want to know as much about you as possible. If you get the chance to leave the country, you better have your passport ready as well. Other countries are already refusing offer asylum to refugees. Here is where a second citizenship would be just priceless. While others are refused entry, having an EU passport would mean you could just board a plane and start over elsewhere while others are refused entry entirely or have to go wherever they offer asylum. Because of this, having updated documents is very important.

    Many Americans fail miserably at this part and just don’t understand how important it is. My parents grew up in Argentina during the 70’s. Even years after the end of the dictatorship, I remember the look on their faces if they forgot their wallet when going out. They were terrified. Back in the day, getting stopped by the police and being caught without your “documentos” meant you weren’t making it back home that night. If you couldn’t prove your ID, you were considered an enemy/extremist/spy. The Triple A (Argentine Anticommunist Alliance) were constantly looking for left wing activists. People have been arrested and tortured just because they had long hair or dressed like hippies. You wanted to be as gray as possible, literally gray, so as to avoid being thrown inside one of the Triple A’s infamous olive green Ford Falcons, never to be seen again.

    9) Cash is king

    Food was still available in Donetsk, but people just didn’t have enough cash to afford it. With inflation being about 30% a month, food prices go up accordingly, so you’re better off with Dollars or Euros rather than local currency. They may not be accepted in some chain stores, but you can exchange them on banks or on the streets at the ongoing currency exchange rate, protecting your savings from inflation and only changing for local currency as needed.

    At one point George1980 said “So my conclusion is so: cash is main tool of survivor!”

    I couldn’t agree more.

    10) Work on your EDC

    The poorest refugees arrive by train and bus, while those with means come by car.

    When bombs began falling close to an elderly woman’s home near Lugansk’s airport, “the granny grabbed her granddaughter, and they jumped on a train and came here with only the clothes on their back,” Shapoval said.


    One day it may be all you have to work with. George1980 mentioned how important a good multitool was, how at times it was the only tool he had after leaving Dumbass and moving into an empty flat. This is a actually a great point. I always think of my everyday carry kit in such terms. If the flashlight I have in my pocket right now is the only one I’ll ever have or the one I’ll have to use to get by for years. Which one would I rather have? If my folding knife is the one I’ll have for defending myself, for prying open a window or a door after artillery hits my home or for preparing food, what kind of knife would I like to have? How about having to sell that knife for much needed cash or use it to bribe a Ukraine or Russian soldier in a checkpoint, which knife and multitool would I like to have to bargain with? What if I have to leave with nothing but the clothes on my back, I evacuate on foot with my family, everyone soaking wet, can I start a fire? As a matter of fact, do I even have enough cash to buy bus or train tickets for everyone?

    11) Open an off shore account

    Greece, Ukraine, Iceland, Argentina, doesn’t matter where it is, when things get ugly, the currency starts devaluating and banks close their doors you’ll want an off shore account. Maybe you keep some of your savings there. Maybe you make a transfer just in case when you hear some bad rumors floating around. Transfer fees aren’t very high and its cheap insurance. One thing is for sure: Just like you can’t buy a gun when bad guys are kicking down your front door, you cant open an account in a foreign country just when the local economy is about to go to hell. You need to do these things ahead of time. An offshore bank account means you can keep some of your savings abroad, move money around, move elsewhere and keep you money safe even if your country if falling apart. People in Ukraine sure understand the value of such an asset.


    12) Be ready to bug out and know when to do so

    If there is one thing we can learn from the war in Ukraine, as well as war and conflict in other parts of the world, is that not being there is the best thing you can do to ensure your survival and well-being of your family. Always have a bug out abroad plan, no matter who you are or where you live. Just think about it. If you had to leave your country today, (don’t think of all the reasons you wouldn’t, just for a second, think about it as if you didn’t have an option). Where would you go? Do you know someone there that can help you?

    Finally, know when it’s time to leave. This is something I address and emphasize in my book “Bugging Out & Relocating”. It’s about having a plan but also crucial, it’s about executing it at the right time. Those that hesitate, those that choose denial when the signs are all over the place, they may live to regret that. A day too late, an hour too late may make all the difference in the world.


    The Modern Survival Manual
    Fernando “FerFAL” Aguirre is the founder of The Modern Survivalist. He started writing about urban survivalism after experiencing first hand the socioeconomic collapse of his country in 2001. The everyday experience of living in Argentina after the collapse provides Fernando a wealth of knowledge that he shares with his readers through his blog and books. He is the author of the widely popular The Modern Survival Manual: Surviving the Economic Collapse in which he details his first-hand accounts of the hyperinflation and subsequent breakdown of the world around him. His most recent book Bugging Out and Relocating: When Staying Put Is Not An Option is based on detailed research and his personal experiences once he decided to leave everything behind.

    Also From FerFAL:

    How to Spot the Triggers of a Socioeconomic Collapse

    Preparing for Economic Collapse

    What To Expect From The Government After The Collapse


    It Took 22 Years to Get to This Point

    Gold has been the right asset with which to save your funds in this millennium that began 23 years ago.

    Free Exclusive Report
    The inevitable Breakout – The two w’s

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      1. I’ll laugh, I’ll cry, I’ll let them kiss their ass goodbye 🙂

        • I’ve said it many times.

          The decision to not get involved it yours. A strict prepper would not. However, YOU are responsible for the devolution of America into a piece of shit communist utopia like TPTB always fucking wanted. Because you are a fucking coward. Period.

          This article is focused on the realities of bugging out. Fine. But you should take all pains not to let it get to that point.

          I have some PMs on hand. I don’t think they are useful. If anything some sheeple would see that and torture your children to get more gold out of you. Is cash useful? If it’s not FULL-BLOWN SHTF than yes, cash is infinitely fucking useful and you should have a few thousand stashed on hand if you can. In FULL-BLOWN SHTF (pandemic or grid-down situation) cash is meaningless. Make sure you have a pretty daughter in exchange for some of Acid’s food.

          BWAHAHAHAHA in SHTF preppers are going to get soooooo much fucking pussy lol.

          • People like Acid give preppers a bad name. They think they are being realistic, when their morals are no better than animals. Those of us that know folks like Acid, would serve humanity best in a collapse by just putting them out of their misery. What is the point of surviving in a world with people like that?

            • I’d leave the sheeple alone if they leave me alone. If not, a bullet to the head. Period. No more mercy if things get too out-of-control.

              To Acid: be very careful what you wish for. Because you happen to like a girl, you’re moral instincts may kick in, and IF you start trusting a nice looking dame (even though you may not even think about it at the time), that dame may take advantage of you when you LEAST expect it. If you invite women over just to fuck, many could (and often do) wait to back-stab their companions when they least expect it, and then they’ll take everything they can grab from you’re property.

              Living proof: my mother.

          • Acid, we the people are not responsible for the destruction of this nation. It’s the politicians, banksters, etc., so go f#$% yourself.

            • Those responsible are conservatives that dismissed intellectualism over the past 30 years and the leftists that exploited that dismissal, taking over institution after institution.

              Leftists control most of education, the media, technology, literature, the press, science, philosophy, law, and government. And they’re rapidly taking over religion and the military.

              All that brought us to a point where a Marxist anti-American community organizer (who got his start in politics by associating with a radical leftist that was a member of a terrorist organization that literally blew things up) was elected (twice!) to the presidency of the United States.

              The president could be impeached and removed from office tomorrow, and there still would be millions of true believers looking to turn the USA into some kind of progressive utopia. They’re just waiting for a nice big SHTF moment to justify taking complete control.

              No lone wolf no matter how thoroughly armed is going to win against the zombie horde of progressive zealots controlled by the leftist intellectuals that control the culture.

              The best we can do in the short term is to survive so later we can make children, teach them right from wrong, educate them properly with the right philosophy, and get them into all those institutions where they’ll make a difference in the future.

          • I love you people but i really wish you were smart 🙁

          • Make sure you have a pretty daughter in exchange for some of Acid’s food.

            BWAHAHAHAHA in SHTF preppers are going to get soooooo much fucking pussy lol.

            The most important factor in any survival situation, is attitude. Having the inner strength to keep going, when others would simply give up and die.

            But there’s a component of attitude that most don’t talk about; resisting the urge to take advantage of others- by being a predator, a thief or generally being an asshole.

            YOU, acid, are an asshole.

            And all of your “preps” (assuming, of course, you’re anything more than a trash-talking keyboard monkey) won’t stack up against the very negative character trait that you’re an asshole.

            Hint to you, bubba: Assholes get dead a lot faster than people working together, in a tribe.

            All the sh!t you write, tells me that you’re gonna’ be deader than a sh!tbug, not long after the festivities start. Because NOBODY likes an asshole.

        • P.S. Have some dollars, renminbi, and euros around. It cant hurt.

          • AT first, a few bucks might help,BUT when you realize the chinese are here to take over the country,AND LEAVE no survivors,except the few slaves they’ll need for a while till more of their people showup,YOU WILL FIGHT OR DIE,the chinese aren’t looking to save anyone,THEY INTEND TO KILL ALL THE AMERICAN PEOPLE,that never happened in the past,MYSTERY BABYLON THE GREAT will go down like a rock,BECAUSE EVERYONE thinks they can wave a white flag and they’ll be saved,WRONG,they’ll shoot you,NO SUVIVORS,is there some part of that, no one understands……

            • Arizona: Where are you getting you information about Chinese Invaders?

              • The Chinese and Russians are here. They own us and most of US soil. It’s obvious and there is plenty of evidence and eye whiteness who can confirm this and the invasion

                • they might be here, but none of them are ever going home, we will kill everyone of them in the most vilest of ways. i have a 42 long razor sharp katana waitng for them.

                  • Bill the American is gong to kill a Chinese Communist with a traditional Japanese weapon.
                    You sir are a true “globalist”. 😉

                    • no, thats when i run out of all ammo then i will turn to other tactics, which you should learn yourself. sometimes its not always smart to use a gun /rifle in a certain situation. You are not to swift are you. learn some other tactics before depending on the gun all the time, you might survive longer.

                    • some people have no idea what humor is. get a life, Bill.

            • Lincoln said: “Not all the armies of all the earth can by force of arms take a drink from the Ohio if we are united,
              ” I can think of nothing that would unite us like an invasion. China has only 4-5 times our population. 20 rds each should be plenty. We all have that.

              • That was before nukes, drones, and helicopters. I dont think they even had horizontal drilling in the time of that NWO traitor Lincoln. Ol’ Abe was filth of the highest order.

              • Trekker said: Not all the Liberals from Boston or California can by force of arms take a drink from the North Platte if Paranoid is around, Cause he has enough ammo to take care of all of them! Trekker Out. If Needed, I Would Give A Hand!

            • Relax, i lived in a FEMA camp before. As long as you obey all orders and take all of your govt injections, and keep your mouth shut you will get a couple meals a day and a shower. But of course we called it military boot camp back then.

          • Hey Acid. You can take my ass for the price of one poxy can of beans any day of the week… But you first must promise that you’ll be really tough on me!

        • Barefoot Running

          Running causes injury BECAUSE of the high-tech padded running shoes people wear.

          Running with minimalist shoes or barefoot leads to faster speeds and far less injury rates.

          • Until you stub your toe and break it lol.

        • These articles are so stupid that it makes one wonder what the article’s purpose is?

          • Dig a hole in your yard and stick your head into it. That will help you avoid watching what transpires when SHTF. Ferfal has lived through hell in a nation looted by the IMF and Wall Street banks, and a corrupt government. The purpose is to tell you how to live when inevitably SHTF. Obviously, you do not care. Go dig.

            • You do something instead of kill the messenger:) You will need to dig your own hole if you listen to to these fools. Hahaha. But you go right ahead and shut up slave.

        • On that happy note I bought a new M1A scout in dark earth composite today and a new Ruger .357 revolver with a 6″ barrel. Springfield armory is even throwing in 3 20 rd mags free until 4/30 🙂

          • 9) “Cash is king.” Where have I heard THAT before??? Save ten dollar bills in number ten cans.

            RIP Mushroom. 🙂

              • First thing I thought when I read this in the AM was Que DK and coffee cans in 3,2…

              • @DK,

                Please tell me you put the spam link in your post. If not, there are some very big problems with the site.

                • Cellar Spider: And your comments are always sooooo fucking insightful!!! Another dumb bitch with a keyboard. Cunt!!! LMFAO!!! 🙂

          • M1A=noisy cricket

          • Reb what did you do, get your tax refund? Trekker Out. Freemen Own Guns Slaves Don’t!

            • It looks like Texas may finally be as conservative as they claim. They may soon get to Open-Carry. What took so long? Trekker Out.

              • Florida doesn’t have open carry.

                • Of course Flordia doesn’t have open-carry, other than WWTI it’s full of old, over the hill Liberals with pot bellies and flowered shirts. Trekker Out.

              • Liberal Vermont doesn’t have any permit requirements at all.

              • Thats pretty bad when russia has open carry before texas lol.

                • I posted some info on force multipliers here you may like. Watch for it when it clears moderation 🙂

                  • Mac, did you take the day off? I hope your ok!

            • Absolutely.

              An armed man is a citizen, an unarmed man a subject.

      2. Good Ukraine “survival lessons.” I really liked Aguirre’s first book. Haven’t read Bugging Out and Relocating yet. Anyone read it yet, thoughts?

        • Based on what i have seen, save your money. Buy a nice throw rug for the kitchen instead.

      3. ferfal always has very good insights, and this is no exception…

        • Ferfal does have good insights but some are conflicting. On one hand he says have a gun, then the says it will get you killed. I guess I am glad I am older, don’t have a place to go, etc so I shouldn’t have checkpoint trouble.
          Bottom line is what the Lord has planned for you. You will survive or you won’t.
          It is good to have the water, shelter, heat source, food, and a means to protect it, etc but if a large group comes calling I am done. So for me, I guess, My home will be where it is at and hope and pray that will be sufficient. God bless, James

          • James, if your home is where you plan to make your last stand, then I highly recommend that you have sandbags filled and ready. People don’t appreciate how easily bullets penetrate most homes.

            I just spent all week filling 100 sand bags. I would hate to do that on short notice.

              • This is all I’ve got to say.

                • It’s a sad state of affairs, that we even have to THINK this way. We’ve really let the elitists shake us down for too long. This article had some important tips in my case, but I resent having to plan to use them.

                  I keep hoping a meteorite or some other unidentified flying object hits DC and takes them all out. Starting with NATO and the UN HQs.

                  • Maybe you old bastards should have DONT SOMETHING DECADES AGO.

                    Nobody wants to “make a scene”.

                    Afterall, employers don’t like that sort of thing.

                    Better to just go along with communism.

                    What can it hurt. Only 270 million dead.

                    • This old bastard is thriving at his BOL. Just ordered a few buildings. A big tool shed 10 x 16 and a mini cabin 12 x 24. Both have 11 ft+ ceilings and lofts on each end for lots of storage. $10K for both. Since they are clasified as portable, there is no permit needed to put them on my property. Solar is ready now just need the well drilled for that tasty Florida spring freah water. BTW/ The hottest chicks out there are looking for smart prepper guys with their shit together. Flying a smoking hot blond babe in from Tx shortly for a week to check out my BOL. She is half my age and ready for an adventurous relationship. Had a 2 FT Gator cross my camp site an hour ago. I helped him down to the river.

                    • Acid, maybe you need to dry up and blow away.

                    • 270 million isnt that many, i only know a couple of them anyhow that are worth a turd.

                    • The smell of decay will be gone in 6 months of summer heat and flies.

                  • Sixpack, thanks for the video. I remember that song and also agree. I also resent the fact that I had to prepare for anything like this, but that’s exactly what we have to do if we want to survive such things. Once I get back to the BOL, that’s it for me. That will be my new home and I won’t leave it, come hell or high water.

                    • While we’re preparing, I stumbled onto an article I think everyone who owns property and grows anything on it, should read.

                      “Supreme Court Weighs Bizarre Private Property Seizure”

                      ht tp://www.newsmax.com/GeorgeWill/supreme-court-kagan-property/2015/04/19/id/639385/

                      I dunno Mac, I personally hate it when you post half a dozen articles at the same time. We never really get a good discussion going on any of them, before they’re old news. It even makes it harder to scan for and respond to comments directed at my posts.

                      It’s like trying to sort alphabet soup with a fork…

                  • They are only in DC a few hours each week that they are not on vacation. Vacations for politicians seem to get longer and longer. Congress and Senate is shut down/closed/on break, more often than it convenes.

                    Now a big party or convention, that is a different matter.

                    • PWTW:

                      Why loiter around the ‘halls’ when AIPAC has already told the bought and paid for politicians what they will sign, seal, and deliver to the American public? Just be prompt when we call the roll for your “yes we can” vote.

                      You know, “we need to pass the bill before the American sheep can ‘try’ to decipher what is in it”.

                      Be a good little boy and ‘we will deliver the sack of money’ you need for your re-election. Only donator bigger than AIPAC is the Military Industrial Machine, DOD.

                    • PWTW:

                      Read my comment below and tell me:

                      Checking on down this thread, my comment, at this moment, is the only one blocked for a reply. Why would that be? Is there ‘buzz words’ that set off an alarm at SHTF?

                      Suppose it has to do with the mention of AIPAC?

                    • granny, it’s yet more ” evidence” that ” they” are out to ” get” you.

                    • Yea, po granny,

                      you must be sliding off the rez too far, with those AIPAC comments. Nuthin gets them worked up as much as truth.

            • Justice.

              Now you are having fun. Moving a couple tons of earth.

            • Justice

              bullets penetrating buildings.

              Don’t forget head and eye protection from flying debris.

              • Do they make eye protection that will stop a 155mm howitzer exploding round?

              • I hope they dont make eye protection that will stop a howitzer round because all that would be left of you would be two eyeballs fused the back of the eyeglasses, with side shields of course.

          • James, this is my first time reading one of Ferfal’s articles and I haven’t yet checked his website. Most of the article sounded good but I also saw what I saw were some contradictions. On the checkpoints, there is always some way to get around checkpoints. Avoid checkpoints at all costs. I have another trip to the BOL scheduled for July but it’s possible I could be going back sooner. Most of my supplies are already there and I can have the truck loaded in only a few minutes and be rolling. I’ll bugout early before the balloon goes up when I see the first signs of it. Once I’m at the BOL, I’m bugging in. That will be my new home and that’s where I’ll make my final stand if it comes to that.

            • So what happens if they see you going around a check point? If i was them i would blow you out of the water because normal people aren’t doing this. You must be the enemy.

              • Monkey, my whole point is bugout BEFORE TSHTF. as long as I make it to the BOL BEFORE anything happens, I’ve got it made. BTW, anyone who shoots at me does so at their own peril. I can and will shoot back in self-defense.

            • @ Brave : Their is more than one contradiction in this article and alot of it does not hold water over here. Probably 95% of 35 and younger and another 40% of older than 35 have GPS anywhere they go. It is a smart thang or an I thang. Alot of this article does not hold true for a “civilized” country.
              How about don’t have a gun but buy a glock or a rifle with a folding stock.
              How many people have never left the USA? How many of those don’t have passports? Why would you need one?
              Open an offshore account? What good is that going to do if their is no electricity or a means to collect it when you need it?
              Our local currency is dollars. So what cash should we have? It ain’t going to be worth a crap anyways.
              Between offshore accounts, dual citizenship, and carry cash, I ain’t got nothing to worry about. I am just getting by and a little prepping here and there. I don’t really have to worry about carring cash. I don’t have any extra.
              If you are on public transportation, you don’t have to worry about what is in your pockets anyways, You are headed to FEMA camp, If you are lucky.
              I don’t know. Some might think this is a good article. Not me. Sorry. Maybe if we were some place else. It just does not seem to relate to the way things would be over here.

              • Fishandmud, I agree the article stinks to high heaven. No way it relates to this country. I’m not impressed with this Ferfal character. Give me an article from Selco anytime. Now that is someone loaded with credibility. His course at http://www.shtfschool.com is well worth your time.

              • When the shit happens just be some place else watching it on TV. It is the cowardly amerikan way.

              • I have to agree fish , this nation will be like no other where things have gone bad wrong . whole new ball game .

          • Uhhh… gee. I dunno. Fast! Think! There are scenarios when you want to be armed. There are scenarios when you don’t… or wish, you had not been armed.

            Seriously. If you CAN NOT figure that out… you are not going to make it. You can’t even read the article and USE your head.

            First, you must learn to use this (points to head), before you learn to use this (points to weapon).

            I’m going to bet you are a Rambo.

            • Curtis, I did learn how to use my brain WAY before I learned how to use firearms. I’m not a Rambo and don’t even want to be. I’m not going to be a pushover for anyone regardless of what I face. Being a pushover just opens the door for anyone with bad intentions toward you to have their own way with you. Never played that game and never will.

        • Ferfal survived the Argentine crisis, but so did millions of others. They just didn’t blog about it.

      4. Good advise. But does the writer of this article believe that the smart folks here are going to stand and fight a standing army? Gorilla war fare is the only way!

        Does the writer think that the folks here are going to give up their guns without a fight. I know that they will stand and fight.

        As far as a group do you think for one second that an army is going to after a large group first or go after a small group first? For me I’ll take my chances with a larger group. (Snipers will be KINGS in those days.)

        Don’t get involved? B.S. I’m not going to stand by and let The NWO Turds push you or me around. I will do everything I can to disrupt and confuse any PTB with any means I have. Or can come up with. So Help Me God!

        Cash and off shore accounts. Cash is worthless in a SHTF scenario. Off Shore How in the hell are you going to get it out or get to it. Some one might take cash, but for me I will have Gold and Silver. PERIOD!

        I agree with 1-2-4-7-8-10-12. I don’t agree with 3-5-6-9-11.

        • 8)Passports and ID are crucial. I have got to get my passport. Canada is always an option when bugging out.

          • If I bugged out to Canada, I’d do it quietly and not at a border crossing. Backwoods all the way.

            • I agree with crossing the border through the woods under the dark of night. If stopped say “Aye” after every sentence and slide them an ounce of gold as a kind gesture to help their family out in their time of need. And brush up on hockey, curling, and lacrosse.

              • @M….that is actually spelled ‘Eh’, but sounds like ‘A’…and that is coming from ‘a true Canadian’….you all take good care of yourselves! CC.

            • Yup, I’ve done it more than once . . . errr uhmm allegedly.

              • Another thought, for those still down south, is the carribean. It’s pretty easy to leave from Alabama, or any gulf port, and get to the bahamas (which I think is still non-extradition for the US but check me on that) or wherever.

                If you just had to make a one way trip, driving into mexico might be the expected way; the carribean however is easy, casual about customs, and full of options. Plus it’s always tourist season and most any story works if you have a little money.

                Then there’s the banking in the caymans and panama, international flights from non US countries, boats to everywhere.

                • I hope you all go north and south and leave these commie bastards for me. My grandson is bringing his battalion to to help me carry my shit.

                  I know the Sgt. will be around and he’s got friends of like mind.

                  Hell, man, surrounded, we’ve got ’em right where we want ’em.

                  • Yup , got that right Old guy

            • Do not make the mistake thinking the northern border is like the southern. It is not designed to keep Canadians out. Bush and Cretien signed laws where they can come and get you legally. The illegal will take NorthCom. Our best chance is preemption. But if you do, my Canadian family says to bring your own longjohns, they won’t share theirs.

              • Seriously, preppers thinking strategic relocation to Canada should look at the world from the top down. Take google earth and rotate the north pole to the middle of the page. Imagine the bear coming to strike the eagle. Who is in between? No man just land, that’s right. No mans land. Heard that one from a Canadian. Funny there is not more of them with such long winter nights. I asked that once and one Canuck answered “Takes a lot of practice, eh”?

                • I had a grandpa, but like most of us we really aren’t sure who he was. Without paternity tests anyhow.

                • GrandpaSpeaks, I’m not at all afraid of “The Russians” coming to get me. What I AM afraid of, is my own govt who has actually, openly declared war on ME, to come after me.

                  Running across the border isn’t a permanent solution, but it might give some of us time to think, regroup and get set to fight back.

                  Going to Canada in SHTF, is the equivalent of making a pit-stop at a roadside rest area. You get time to clean up, get some food and study your maps.

          • A little known trick, when traveling internationally carry quality copies of your passport. In an encounter with police, do not give them you passport under any circumstances. Only give police a COPY of the main page. It is sufficient ID for them in all but a capital case. Once you hand over your original passport, they completely control you, and you won’t get it back until they are satisfied. If they lack grounds to hold you, you still can’t walk away if they have your original passport in their pocket!

            I was in a conflict with a Rome Taxi driver, yes the rumors are true, they are a pack of thieves. Spent two hours in a Rome police station because one idiot in our group had handed their original passport to the cop. A cash payoff was required to get that passport back. It was a very expensive taxi ride.

            Alway travel with at least two copies of your passports main page as well as two copies of your drivers license. If the original s stolen the copy can speed the replacement process.

            • plan twice,
              was in a foreign country one time and they took our passports and we had to pay a bribe to get them back when we were ready to leave, did not go back to that country after that! If they SHTF there probably will be a period of time that NO-ONE will be allowed to go anywhere, so i am not too worried about ID, will all depend on HOW bad you want to go somewhere and why as to the method of HOW you do it.

              • I have also heard of prick cops in America taking drivers licenses and then claiming they gave it back already. Rare but it happens, a copy is acceptable to present in some states, and helps n getting a replacement.

                In a SHTF situation expect all kinds of crazy antics by DHS controlled police, and the various amateur groups they use to set up checkpoints and check IDs.

                • It happened to me. My DL has always been from Washington State, since it is my military “home of record.” An Oregon cop tried to confiscate it pursuant to a traffic stop. I went to court to deal with the traffic infraction and told the judge what happened.

                  He ordered the cop to return my DL. The judge said Oregon has no authority to confiscate a legal, valid DL from a state other than Oregon. The cop was pissed. He had planned to cause me trouble, since I hadn’t actually done anything wrong. I had just refused to allow him to search my vehicle, and locked the doors behind me.

            • in Europe, customary for hotel desk to ask for and hold your passport but it’s OK to decline. and, it’s illegal to perfectly copy official US docs. Kinko’s made color copies of my passport at 75 percent size. thus, both beautiful and legal. thanks, plan twice, for reminders.

            • Thanks Plan twice,
              Didn’t realize that about passports. When I was in Guatemala and they wanted to hold my passport, I knew better than to let them have it. I think I was trying to renew my visa and they wanted to keep it and have me come back the next day. I didn’t do it.
              I wonder if anyone knows is it less invasive to fly out of Canada than the US. I want to go overseas but don’t want to deal with TSA groping.

              • I just flew jfk to ft lauderdalft and back. I got home yesterday and unpacked. Found a .45 ACP in the outer pocket, where I had missed it when I unpacked from last road trip. TSA never saw it thank goodness. But really. How can you miss a freaking buller in a case full of clothes?

          • Canada isn’t letting your smelly butt-crack across their border during shtf. Passport or no passport. Only Mexicans will be welcomed.

        • Sarge, I don’t think cash is totally worthless come SHTF.

          I want to start keeping some Canadian currency around. Also, I may set up an account ONLINE with a Canadian bank.

          Finally, I would love to get a safety deposit box set up in Canada to keep some silver.

          • Justice.
            If I’m lucky enough I will be in Tenn., in the mountains.
            When TSHTF I don’t think I’m going to get to Canada.
            I don’t know where you live. If Canada is in walking distance? By all means go for it.
            You are right about cash not being worthless. It can be used as T.P. (LOL)

            • In a real SHTF, be there to get there; or you won’t. No one is going anywhere AFTER SHTF. 🙁

              • DK, damn good point. If you bugout BEFORE SHTF, your chances of survival go up.

              • True dat

              • I agree with Durango, if you’re thinking about going to Canada or any where else in the world after the SHsTF, you’re not prepared at all, Canada don’t like us now and if the world is going down the toilet,, it will not be any better.. stop with the BS and get prepared or you’ll be a statistic, you probably will be anyway if you can’t survive within ten miles of your home.

                • We welcome all patriots.

                • OLD 70
                  Canada just might be a dream. If the USA goes to SHTF don’t you think that Canada will follow along in a very short period of time?
                  If the USA does go to STHF The Vultures will attack and Canada will be next, because who will stop them?
                  It would be nice to have a nation like Canada to go to but I don’t think it will happen. If they do take us in we will 2 or 3rd class people. If I’m going to be 2 or 3rd class people I’ll do it here.

                  • I think you are right, we would be scowled at by the population up there like Mexicans are here.
                    I would love to go north of the border but lack the support structure that would be needed to get through even the first part of the winters up there.
                    That is operating on the assumption that I couldn’t drive a truck and drag a trailer across the border.

            • my #1 thing to do on the DAY shtf is to get cash….and spend it FAST on things you’ll NEED soon…i’m about as prepped as a guy can get, but there’s always MORE to do when the bell rings….WHEN will the bell ring?….watch for a dow crash of a thousand points or so….then when it KEEPS going down MORE hundreds/thousands of points in the next few days, you’ll know after the fact, that the SHTF moment truly DID happen. the market will let you know, but you BETTER be payin’ ATTENTION!…and you better have a PLAN.

          • Justice,
            I tried to open a Canadian account online to avoid card fees when I buy Canadian. Couldn’t find a bank that would do it unless I was living there even temporarily.

        • Thank you.

        • Sarge, I also questioned those parts of the article. That shows Ferfal doesn’t know anything about Americans except for whatever propaganda he’s been fed. I’m not too impressed with the article. I like Selco’s articles better. http://www.shtfschool.com is the website to go to.

          • Braveheart.
            ‘He don’t know me very well”.


            • Slingshot, Ferfal DAMNED SURE doesn’t know me or my family.

          • Sgt. Dale, Braveheart, I am having some problems with this article as well.

            #3 Don’t get involved. WTF?
            Thats the reason why we are in this position to begin with.

            #5 Learn to deal with checkpoints. Another WTF?
            Sorry, I will not learn to deal with checkpoints.

            #6 Guns can save you, but they can also get you killed.
            Ya they can get you killed, if the other guy has one and you don’t.

            #11 Open an off shore account.
            LMFAO, ya good plan.

            #12 Be ready to bug out and know when to do so.
            And become a refugee? No thanks, the time to bug-out is well before a shtf incident, not in the midst of it.

            This guy sounds like a pacifist go along to get along kinda guy.

            In other words America, just keep doing what your doing, running, hiding, disarming, putting up with checkpoints (TSA) and you will be following this guy’s advice to a tee.

            • Outlaw, I agree. Selco has a lot more credibility than this Ferfal guy.

              • agreed.

        • Sgt Dale ,
          Simple Advice :

          Plan , Execute , Vanish

          Be a ghost , be no where and every where .

          Be a ROYAL PIA to TPTB

          What they get if they make war on the American people will make the troubles in Erie look like Disneyland.

          Semper Fi

          • Nigh Breaker
            This some of the best advised you can give out.
            Thanks for reminding me. I didn’t forget it I just didn’t think to mention it.
            Just gave you advised that can save your life.
            Thanks again!

        • That’s right SGT. They Govnt starts pulling this crap, That means attack at their personal homes where their families live. Burn their house to the ground. Start with that AHole that drives that FEMA truck home everyday. Keep a mental list of addreaaes.

        • snipers will remove any invading army and internal armies that have betrayed us. there will be tens of thousands of Chris Kyles and they will utterly dehumanize these NWO order mercenary armies hired by obongo including or own army which has betrayed us. . one sniper can hold up an entire division for hours , think of it when there are 100 snipers waiting for them, they will kill every chinese and russian invading our nation as well as our treasonous army. blowing up there buildings with them in it will be easy, they will be sitting ducks. they will be doomed, yea we will suffer loses greatly , but all of them will be dead. as for our traitorous judges and leaders they will be history and taken out and hanged as well as or militry commanders, hanged plain and simple.

      5. You hope that it will be more civilized here but you really do not think so. Ferfal and Selco have given us valuable insights on real world events when SHTF.

      6. “1) Artillery & infantry beats survivalist hero fantasies. Every. Single. Time.”

        You’d never guess that from reading some of the posts here.

        According to most of these posts all you have to do is wave your AR-15 around and the police and military will flee in droves. So will the gangs of thugs looking to rob you of everything you have.

        • No one seems to remember that an army in the field needs nearly a ton of stuff per man per day. A fighter plane requires tons of stuff per day in the air. Tanks 4 Gallons of fuel per mile. Artillery shells weigh nearly 200 lbs per. The only reason the war in Yugoslavia went on for years was outside countries kept up the supplies. This type of stuff isn’t going to go on here. The ONLY was major SHTF is if the Gov goes bankrupt and cannot continue the mass spending for welfare.
          In that case where does the cash to do all this come from. How many of you are going to spend April 15 doing your taxes if the Gov is bombing you. What this country has to get ready for is like Greece, no money, and no welfare. The only people that will have problems with the Army will be those in the cities that want to leave and have no place to go. How many of you think the Welfare army is going to use tanks and F-35’s. check points? What for? Get real. Without supplies. just how long do you think NY or LA is going to last, a week or two? There won’t be farmers markets’ or NATO/Russian supplies. Most of this is interesting but not applicable to a country of 3 million sq miles.

          • Paranoid:

            Your post is spot on.

            The time before the UN becomes the New World Order, there will be NO PLACE to run to or hide in the WORLD.

            Why does anyone think there will be hidey holes somewhere else around the globe? WW3 will have the whole world on fire…get real.

            • POG and Paranoid, excellent points. I’ll be in the mountains of north GA with family making my stand.

          • Yes yes! That is why i moved next door to a Walmart fema camp. Plenty of supplies there and cheap ammo.

          • Yes Para, but ain’t living a fantasy in your head fun, especially when you have others to share it with. Don’t try and take it away from us, what else are we gonna do in our spare time. But I must say, what TPTB have in store for us ain’t no fantasy. Trekker Out. Be Vigilant!

          • good one, paranoid.

        • The AR 15 is a POS.

          Stay away from crowds and carry a pack full of 30-06.

          Semper Fi

          • The AR is not a POS. Mine’s a COLT from 1974, Damn good rifle. In Ohio where I was from I’d take one any day. It’s usually wooded and you can not see 500 yds, here in Wyo no, it’s not my first choice, M1A likely is. But it’s still a hell of a lot better than just having an opinion.

            • Your AR is a poodle popper, not much better than a .22 rimfire and your choice of the POS is just an opinion.

            • AR15=POS

              • Every time I go shootin with buddies that have ar’s they spend a lot of time unjamming the POS. AK is the better choice.

                • Genius, I tried an AR once and it jammed on me. AK is better but no accuracy past 100 yards. I’ll stick with my M1 Carbine. A proven workhorse from WW2 and Korean War era. But that’s just me.

                • AK=POS buy a scar17 you cheapo slaves.

                • 1. Tell them to go get a manual and learn to clean the rifle. 2. Poodle popper or not, so what? Army 30 years ago said it took 14 times as many man hours for a wounded man as a dead one. Always shoot to wound in combat if they won’t bother you, unless it’s an officer.

                  • Buy crappy magazines=JAM.
                    Buy crappy ammo=Jam.
                    Dirty weapon= JAM
                    Worn Parts(springs)=JAM

                    Some are more prone to jams than others by dirt or burnt power residue.
                    Also tooling marks/burrs can inhibit the action and you might have to polish them out.

                    • Buy crappy magazines=JAM.
                      Buy crappy ammo=Jam.
                      Dirty weapon= JAM
                      Worn Parts(springs)=JAM

                      None of these things stop an ak from working. What if that was all you had? If your life depended on it, which would you choose?

                    • Genius.

                      I am particular to the AK-47 Legend. I have had lacquered case ammo foul the breach and have the casing stick due to heat. It cooked the lacquer and it adhere to the chamber wall.

                    • Genius.

                      One other problem I have encountered with AK’s

                      The cheap stamp receiver on the Maadi would at times have the bolt carrier would jump the recoil guide rails and jam in the aft position if not lube. The stamp receiver was not formed correctly. Made a hell of a racket when you pulled back the bolt carrier.

      7. Ukraine is not America we have our own style and our own way of taking care of business.

        Audit the Fed,
        Find the Fraud,
        Take back American’s money!!!

        • Your in lala land,
          It will be the same shit here.

          • Only if we are fighting a “foreign” army/navy. If the Chinese show up, they are just going to isolate(just stop the barges) and then kill everyone in the problem areas. I would. Genghis Khan style.
            Odds are here, where we are, it will be Americans against Americans, and both sides against the American government.
            Sort of like “The good, the bad, and the ugly” ending scene. If it is the government( most likely) then we have options and the author has some good insights.

            • America has NOTHING that China wants. Russia has EVERYTHING that China NEEDS. 🙂

              • Other than land, coal, steel ore, oil, etc etc, you know resources, but yea other than that, hmm nothing ft

                • Russian resources are untapped. China has too much coal which is why Beijing is smog city. Australia has vast reserves of iron ore and these are much closer.

                  Siberia is vastly underpopulated with no armed American citizens to protect it.

                  The South China Sea is a giant tub of oil & gas; which is why the Chinese are buildings islands to exploit the oil and protect it from Japan, South Korea, Vietnam, and the Philippines.

                  China wants Americans consumers, at least what is left of them, to purchase all of the finished goods now produced in China with DOLLARS because Russia doesn’t have dollars anymore; and rubles are 6 to 1 to the yuan, so the Russians are not going to buy them. At least not in any quantity.

                  Russians consumers use to buy their goods from Belarus, Kazakhstan, and Ukraine. Now they spend their hours spinning straw into gold. 🙁

                  • “The South China Sea is a giant tub of oil & gas”

                    The majors knew of the nervy potential in SE Asia decades ago. Think we were in Vietnam for coconuts?

                    • nervy oops Energy

                • Blondes. Don’t forget that. China wants blondes.

                  • Ah-So, You have flace like bloiled pork.

                    • that’s FACE like BOILED PORK!, you PLICK!….it’s a joke i tend to use when i go for chinese food.

                • Don’t forget food, and timber. And one more thing, women, China has killed off a lot of the girls through abortion and kept the boys. I think I read they have 100 to 200 million men that will never have a wife.

                  • 100-200 million angry frustrated young strong men. That is Army material.

                  • I know the stats for the ratio of Chinese men and women, but Chinese men don’t want to get married any more than men anywhere in the world.

                    Its primarily those men still left in the villages that are losing out.

                    From what I have read and gathered from sources on-line, Chinese princesses require that prospective husbands have substantial education and assets; and those Chinese men that have substantial assets want to play the field, not unlike men in the USA.

                    large numbers of Chinese women want Western men.

                    Chinese men are also taking wives from Vietnam, Thailand, Cambodia, Central Asia, etc, where they have a wealth advantage over the locals. So I do not think China will be going to war to obtain brides for these young men, as the West has often supposed.

                    Cash is King! 🙂

              • Siberia is an ocean closer to China than is USA.

              • China has a lack of females due to removal of large numbers of female babies for cultural reasons now coming back to cause a problems.

              • Durango,
                If America has nothing China wants, why is it buying up everything and trying to get territory near the Bundy ranch? Why are Walmarts cooperating with Jade Helm 15?

                • ENFP: When a country has as many dollars as the USA has given China, it tends to spend them, over time, on marginal assets.

                  Chinese nationals spent $22 billion last year on US real estate to DIVERSIFY their holdings, so they chose the SAFEST place to buy that real estate and stash their excess cash: the USA.

                  With respect to the territory around the Bundy Ranch, which probably receives more than 320 days of sunshine every year; I suspect it is a good location for Chinese solar firms to erect solar farms using their excess solar cell capacity …..

                  at the request of Harry Reid. 😉

      8. Do you think knives would be a good barter item in this situation? And if so what kinds? Or would they get you into trouble like the way firearms could?

        • Rusty.
          Very good question.
          I think for what it is worth that YES.
          I would look at Small and medium size hunting knife. both fix blade and hunting like Gerber, Buck, just to name a couple.
          The other knife type I would look at are Large working knifes.
          I’ve been picking up knifes for the last 20 years. Find a lot of them at YARD SALES.
          I just picked up some Gerber throwing knifes at Wall World for $20.00 on sale from $40.00. Now I need to practice.

          • How important is brand name? What would one value or trade for a knife?

            • I would say brand is quite important.
              A $20 folding gerber is worth the $20.
              A $10 no name folder is unlikely to be worth anything.

              • Rusty, for a folding pocketknife, I carry a Swiss Army. It’s made by the Wenger corp. in Switzerland which makes Swiss watches. Top quality and I’ll take Swiss Army over any made in china crap. For fixed blade, not a whole lot still made in USA, so I would be extremely selective on a fixed blade. I collect a few knives myself so I won’t buy just any old knife. Gerber is still a good brand. For a multitool, I have 2 Gerbers, one I keep in the truck and one I keep at home.

            • If I forgot my knife, broke it, or lost it, I don’t know that I would care what brand it is, I would just know that I needed one. As long as it looks like it’s good quality and not the little plastic ones that go on key chains.

              The other thing to consider is sharpening stones. There will be many dull knives owned by people that used their knifes as saws and pry bars. Or they overlooked that piece in their bobs.

              • FWIW, a little known or used method of sharpening is using the bottom unglazed ring around a ceramic cup or bowl. You can easily put or keep a razor edge on a knife using this, it’s basically just an improvised ceramic sharpening stone.

                I’ve actually used this method to sharpen my straight razor on occasion, look for a cup -or even a broken bottom piece of a cup- with a very smooth but unglazed edge (bottom rim) if you want to sharpen your razor, coarser rims are better for heavier duty edges. Don’t use the broken edges, you may mess up the edge with chipping if you have a hard steel knife.

                You can always find a cup, bowl, or a piece of a broken one no matter where you are so it isn’t something extra you have to carry with you.

                • Wade: Thanks I have never heard of that before.

                • nice tip, thanks.

              • M, good points. I always keep extra sharpening equipment on hand. Unless that knife has a serrated blade, I won’t use it for sawing anything. Need to pry something? Get a prybar. Knives are for cutting and nothing else.

              • Knives are easy to make. Just collect a bunch of used condoms, dry them and pound them like damascus steel. Makes good chewing gum according to acid etch too;)

          • Throwing STARS are legal in Arizona and much more effective than throwing knives. They also require less skill. Check your state law.

            There is NO better knife than a Marine Corp K-Bar. And no harder steel. 🙂

            • DK, I also have a K-Bar in my collection. I’m very selective on my knives also.

            • Ive got a strider that begs to differ,

              • I agree. K-Bars are crap. Only boot Marines (new Marines) use K-Bars. Striders are very nice. I got a few ZTs I really like and I just ordered a Spartan.
                Have a good one.

                • Do you notice a significant difference of the elmax steel?

                • Striders can be very good but for the price I’d rather have 8-10 K-Bars than one Strider.

              • Is a $350 knife really that great?

              • Kula ,
                randel no. 1. In stainless ,
                k- bar not a bad choice you don’t mind digging with it .
                Any knife for defensive purposes should only be used for that , use the K-Bar for all else ,
                Batoning wood etc.

                Semper Fi

            • Isn’t K bar just ordinary carbon steel?

            • Steel hardness is not as important as the steel toughness.

              The harder the steel the more likely to break and harder to sharpen even though edge retention is usually better and edge geometry can be finer to achieve a greater sharpness (think axe vs, scalpel to understand this).

              Best steels for heavy duty survival knife use would fall into the 5160 (leaf spring steel) or 1050 carbon steel range and for smaller knives that need fine and extremely sharp cutting edges the 1095 range of carbon steels. These are what you will usually find at custom knife makers, the stainless (high chromium) steels are nice but more expensive and harder to make durable under extreme use. For larger survival knives, heavy duty knives that can be used for prying as well as cutting, and swords and machetes of various lengths I prefer S7 tool steel but it is hard to find much variety in styles in this steel unless you have one custom made in it.

              Marine K-Bar knives are made to spec but usually fall into the mid carbon (1050 or so) steel ranges and are generally tempered to a medium hardness to make them tougher than fully hardened would be.

              Keep in mind that in a heavy duty survival knife it will almost surely be used as a pry bar at some point and you do not want it to break the way very hard steels will under such use.

              In addition to the steel, handle material is critical for survival use but almost always overlooked as a consideration, you want something that will not deteriorate and have a good grip whether hot or cold, wet or dry, or bloody or maybe with cooking grease on it.

              • I am more interested in a good fork. I plan on eating a lot.

              • Chinese rice is hard to eat with a K-bar.

                • Gandhi try the chinese rice with honey! I eat my peas with honey, I’ve done it all my life, it makes the peas taste funny, but they stay on my knife. Trekker Out. Just A Tip!

        • What knives would you stay away from at all cost, budk?

          • Rusty if you were addressing that question to me, I can’t answer because I am not a knife expert. Wade appears to be the most knowledgeable here on the subject. From my experience in the field, I find K-bars and military bayonets virtually indestructible.

            These are thick, and hard and you can sharpen the edge enough to make them useful for cutting; but they are not going to break and as mentioned, you can use them for digging too.

            Marines are not issued second rate equipment. 🙂

            • DK.

              Need a tool to rip, pry or break something up.
              Try the “DEAD ON” tools. You can get then at the Home Depot. Check them out on Google
              Might have been mentioned before.

              Has a skull and crossbones on it. Cool.

          • The true failures I have seen in both knives and survival saws are where the handle joins the blade. China or Pack/India knives; saws tend to break off at the connection between blade and grip.

      9. Get a HD shelf from Home Despot. Put support between the bottom shelf and the floor- store your water on that low shelf, a few cases, some one gallon jugs, etc.. Then store long-shelf life items above, like trash bags, TP, paper plates, yada yada. And things you personaly like and use, and just put the newer stuff in back (rotate stock)- batts, salty snacks, high fructose crap, etc…
        In other words, start a small personal WalM*rt of your own. Add shelves as you go on.

        RE: the gray way- There actually used to be card game called ‘Illuminatae’- the rulebook advised players to ‘Not seem to be too strong lest you be percieved as a threat, but also not to appear weak and a potential victim…’

        And be ready to walk. Alot.
        Can you walk more than a mile right now before the baby fat on your thighs right between your legs starts to rash? It takes some time to get in shape- days you won’t have when the levee breaks…

        -onward, thru the fog

      10. Still don’t understand the fascination with fleeing or bugging out and living like a refugee. No thanks i will be fighting my oppressors. No matter what survival is nice but living under oppression I’d rather die in battle. That’s how I see it. I’d suggest keeping up on the political power situation and being prepared to take a side. You will not make it under your own feeble lone wolf agenda trying to fly under the radar. I would not talk about your support for a side. Like right now I know who’s side I’m gonna be on when it goes down. I’m not gonna discuss it because I don’t want to be targeted by the opposing side. But I will become active when the time is right and I’m fully aware that I may be signing my death certificate. This running scared shit isn’t gonna work for everyone. If I gotta run away then violence is necessary IMHO. No one ever talks of organizing a resistance. Just bugging out and running to some place in the woods to live off the land. Resistance is survival think about it. Sure some will be sacraficed but not without a fight I just can’t sit back and do nothing like others can. I have the promise of eternal life with Christ so what the hell do I need to be afraid of. Just because your a christian doesn’t mean you have to be a push over. I’m sick of how many churches advocate non violence as the godly thing. Standing up for yourselves is not sin. Killing for no good reason is. This is what people did before us. Now we have the take it easy and let Uncle Sam pay your way people. Where is your pride. Get off your ass and take responsibility for your lives. People take assistance because they are lazy plain and simple. I have the peace of saying I got everything fair and square. I never took anything that I didn’t earn. I’m not entitled to anything not even a job. If I want shit I gotta go get it. No one will take my home or it’s contents without a fight. This George 1980 signed up to be refugee and he tells his story I read it a couple weeks back on survivalist boards. He chose to go this route for whatever reason. Maybe it’s what everyone else was doing. I appreciate him sharing this story. It has showed me what not to do.

        • “People take assistance because they are lazy plain and simple.”

          Not True. Some people take assistance because they’ve tried and can’t do anything else. Add my disability to my age and multiply by the number of non-existent jobs available, and the only other way I could support myself is by selling dope or turning into a snitch for the govt…NO THANKS. That’s simply not an option for me.

          I’ll take the SS check for as long as I can get it, then I’ll make it as long as I can without it. We all gotta die sometime, and I’d rather die with my morals and pride intact.

          • Sixpack, I’m right there with you when it comes to morals and pride. If I have to make my last stand at the BOL then so be it.

          • You’re a good roll model sixpack. I would love to have you around when things turn proper mean.

            • ANON
              You have to wait in line I get SixPack first.
              SixPack would be welcome in my group any day!!!!

            • You guys are all so special. I may not agree with all of you, all of the time, or even some of you some of the time, but I have yet to find any one person here that I couldn’t find some sort of common ground with. Including etch-a-sketch.

              You never know. Maybe there will be an opportunity to meet more of you in the future. I’ve already met a couple of people from here, and I’d be proud to call them friends. I get the same sense from several others here.

              If we meet under heavy fire…I’VE GOT YOUR BACK.

          • Social Security is not welfare, it is insurance. We paid into SS our whole lives and that’s why we get a check every month. Don’t let any politician or talk show host tell you different.

            • SS IS welfare when they give it to a Illegal who didn’t pay in to it. Now they are income base adjusting it so they can give away even More to the gimme dats.

            • Get real, most people get everything they paid in back in 3-4 years. Ida Whittaker(SP) the first person to get SS paid in $22 and got back $22,000. Don’t care if you like it or not. The first generation got back 10 times or more what they earned. Quit whining and ask any actuary what really went on and what you “Should” get from your investment. They will tell you that SS is a Ponzie scheme and you don’t rate anywhere near what you think, and far, far less than you have been promised. Get over it, crying won’t help. The Gov and the next generation simply don’t have it and aren’t going to.
              I retired at 50, took a small buyout and have sucked far more out of my pension than I paid in, I did the math; people who rely on: “Wishing and hoping and singing and praying are F’ed.”

        • I agree not my route either…. this 1980 guy is in a typical war that has an end… ours is not so….. this is for all everything everywhere…. everywhere…..

        • Asshat, most of your post I agree with except for the first part about bugging out. I’m in a city so I’m sure you’d agree my chances of survival in a city in post-SHTF are slim to none. I already have a relative’s BOL to go to in north GA when the time comes. Been moving boocoo supplies there from my location for the past 2 years. Just made another supply run there 3 weeks ago and have another trip scheduled for July. I do agree about not being a pushover. I first saw this libturd propaganda being preached in churches back in the 70s and have stayed away from them ever since. I’ve also earned everything I’ve ever had. I don’t give up anything without a fight myself. I’m not exactly impressed with this Ferfal character. Give me articles from Selco any day. Selco is the real deal.

          • Brave:
            did you make it to the Gun Show this week? Or is the gun show next week?
            If you did. Did you score any neat things?

            • Sarge, that gun show is NEXT weekend. I think I’ll take DK’s advice and find a bayonet; could prove to be very useful one day. I NEVER leave a gun show empty-handed. Some more ammo won’t hurt, either.

          • Glad to see you are setting up your relatives for the EOTWAWKI because if you aint there… you are dead. Your chances of escaping nigtown, are slimmer than none. Quit your job and move Now. There aint no such thing as a bug out, unless its just a few miles and you are already out of town. July would be the final move.

            • D, nobody in my family has been set up by me for anything. If I wait too late to bugout, then yes I would be toast. But if I bugout early enough, I’ll be just fine. I know several different routes to get there and have tested each and every one of them. I know them like the back of my hand. I know where I can stop and get water on the way if I needed it bad enough and have a damn good water filter. I can hold my own in any situation. I’ll make it and survive. BTW, what does the D stand for? It wouldn’t be dildo, would it?

        • I’d seriously consider bugging out if artillery rounds were landing on my block. Going toe to toe with an organized fighting faction will get you a bullet or maybe a grenade.

          • Bugging out without a place to go that is stocked is insane. Unless you have no other option it is suicidal. But if your in a situation that is going down you probably won’t be able to bug out at all. A tisket a tasket, will bugout be your casket?

            • Today I talked with someone about what we see coming from Jade Helm 15. He told me he found that red dot on his mailbox. He is looking for a place in the hills to bug out with his family. I told him my plan was to bug in. He said if I am not executed, I will basically be a slave when they take over.
              I have the supplies for bugging out, but no family. I want to participate in keeping my rural neighborhood going when all outside supplies are cut off. I would only consider bugging out if a group of us were going together where invaders would not care to go.

        • Congratulations brother. You are the first contributor that I have read here that has a basis for survival. I suggest that you develop more discussion on forming a local group for local support when the SHTF. You are right on about the lone wolf idiots, strangers in an area will stand out and draw more unwelcome attention than friendly donations.

        • A hat; good post. God knew the time of our death before we were born. the commandment is Thou Shall Not Murder, not “kill.” funny how one word mistranslated can cause so much confliction throughout the ages.

      11. A lot of things that we take for granted, will be invaluable when the SHTF. All of the things we eat each day. Coffee, my wife’s cooking. I have enough of those things put away, when I won’t be able to buy it. I can’t eat silver or gold. My wife needs back surgery. I don’t know if thats going to happen soon enough. A lot of us will have to make do. With Jade Helm and a major global financial reset coming up, we will have to do the best we can with what we’ve got. I bought (3) Mosin Nagants, pre WWII that are tach drivers at 100 yds. When it gets close then It’ll be shot gun and pistol. Nobody with half a brain is looking forward to this mess. I’m not going to run away. Pray for God’s Hand to be on you and your family when this all comes. For those who have been watching, Jesus will be here soon. Then all of this will be over for good. Come Lord Jesus, Amen

      12. So its so bad where your at your gonna Bug Out…. your not thinking your gonna get in the truck and bug out do you… you’ll make a fun moving target….. and first road block you hit or the first group in another truck(s) will get you then what….better get going early… think your gonna hunt ..ha… every shot is a call to dinner and death from those close.. gonna fish are you… you know how many gun carrying people will follow you back to camp for Their dinner.

        Have a garden..instant target at your house or dogs you cant keep shut up will bring unwanted attention… your gonna barter..really with the guns down the street are you…

        You better have what you need and forget trading stuff…. this isnt like other wars from bygone days… this is to death like never before or ever again…. you simply cant trust anyone to barter with cause EVERYONE RUNS OUT OF FOOD SOONER OR LATER HERE FOLKS…. THIS ISNT A WAR – it is a new way of life but not for us…..

        • TBT, I can see your point if I were to wait until it was too late to bugout. As long as I recognize the signs of SHTF early enough, I can be out of town in only minutes and be en route to the BOL. I’m in a city and it’s a 6-hour drive to where I have to go. It’s far enough away from any urban areas that the family and I don’t worry too much about the free shit army coming around.

          • Six Hour drive= 4 weeks on foot looking for water and food while being shot at. roads blocked in Meph= foot travel.

            • D, as long as I get out BEFORE TSHTF, I’ve got it made in the shade.

        • you’re YOU’RE

        • Many in New Orleans lost their guns while bugging out. Police set up road blocks and searched cars for weapons, confiscated the guns, which were never returned, and sent people on their way. There were house to house searches for guns in New Orleans, but those are the guns the police got in trouble for taking.

          The roadblock robberies by police were rarely prosecuted and almost no guns confiscated were ever returned.

          • PTPO.

            You have to be able recognize the danger coming your way.
            Living in a fish bowl has its problems. Even afterwards when their lives are restored, they never prepare. They go about life as it was before. Stories of how they almost died will be more important.
            A lot of people will say they are going to do this or that. Fill 50 sandbags and find out how much work that is. Put in a garden, a well, latrine/outhouse or a water collection unit.
            What ever you think you need, you better get your shit together before it’s too late.

          • I predict a lot of cops getting shot.

            • Weird that prediction just popped right into my head too.

          • PTPO, local LE agencies in that region were under a FEDERAL COURT ORDER to return those weapons to their rightful owners.

      13. 3 don’t get involved.
        And that is where I stopped reading.
        It is unwillingness to get involved that got us here.
        It is unwillingness to get involved that keeps us here.

        Not going to sit back and let others decide what happens to me tomorrow in this “civil society” or if tshtf.

        • Sooo, if the Bloods and Crips go at each other in your neighborhood, which side are you going to join with and how much better off will you be than if you just stayed out of the fight altogether and didn’t take sides at all?

          Wear your red or blue hat to advertise it, of course, wouldn’t want to someone to think you weren’t involved.

          As for me, I’ll just try to stay uninvolved and stay alive till it’s over or I find a way out of it. Maybe I’ll even come back and help bury you body later on if I feel like cleaning the aftermath up.

          • Anon.

            I am laughing my ass off at the city cause a few years back the Sheriff said we did not have a gang problem. Sure have had many drive by’s lately. Oh, we get the Mad Dads and preachers and all the famous people saying what we need to do to solve it. Yeah the good little boys will be chopping your ass up with a machete or blowing to top of your head off with a stolen 9mm.
            It’s all fun and games now but it won’t be later.
            If you have made the decision to stay in place. Do all you can to make it safe. If you made the decision to bug out then you also do what you need to do. We need to help each other survive by either way you choose. Not run them down with insulting remarks but ways to make the chances of living better. It’s all a crap shoot.

            • Slingshot, similar situation where I live. We have a black mayor and black police chief who actually admit we have a gang problem but then try to downplay it. They even claim violent crimes have been reduced but you can’t tell by the number of shootings and so forth here.

          • Anon, good point about not getting involved in a fight between 2 different groups of gangbangers. Both groups are just useless eaters. Let them kill each other. Fewer enemies to worry about.

          • Choosing sides and being involved are two different things.
            In your crips/bloods example inner city clergy are known for attempting to help gang members of both sides to see the reality of gang membership and encouraging them to make better lives for themselves and the community.
            If my neighbors have a dispute I can be involved as a moderator without choosing sides.

            But then both examples are far removed from my situation.
            I live in very low density high desert and my “neighbors” are all quite some distance away. Everyone moves here to be simply left alone. And yet in my immediate area am involved. I help maintain “public” roads and know basically everyone who lives in my miles square. I am involved in my community and yet I have not needed to take sides in any of the local politics.

            I see your statement as “as long as they are burning and raping any home but mine I will sit quietly and eat my beans”.
            Well good for you.

            a few quotes
            “I am on nobodies side because no one is on my side”
            “All men die. Not all men truly live.”
            “Aye, you’ll live. And many years from now when you are dying in yer bed would you be willing to trade all those days from this one to that for one chance, JUST ONE CHANCE! To come back here and tell our enemies. That they may take our lives but they’ll never take our freedom.”

            So enjoy hiding away like a roach.
            You’ll die too.
            One of us will simply have done something with our life other than treat it like a hoard of gold to be hidden away and kept shiney, and safe, and useless.
            -William Wallace, braveheart

            • For the tl;dr people.

              You are involved in what is happening around you.
              Some with their actions.
              Some as spectators.
              And some with snide holier than thou remarks.

              Only one of those will help decide what tomorrow looks like.

        • You go run on down to the protest march, well watch k

          • You got one thing right.
            You will watch.

            As for your assumption about me…
            Assume away.

        • A lot of us have already been involved. What about the Bundy ranch defenders? They had to take that stand.
          I figured I may be on the list because I was formally involved speaking against an Agenda 21 issue affecting my community. They filmed the speech and my name was on the proposal telling the committee what we wanted for our community and why. We won our case. I also wrote a pretty scathing letter to Democratic Congresspersons.
          Yes, some of us do have to be involved. Since I am over 70 years old I figure I should be involved in this way as I have lived my life. If you have children yet to raise, maybe you shouldn’t be public about it.

      14. How does bartering work where you live?

        Hey that house down there is shooting at people so after they stop I bet they’d like to trade some…… I just wander down with my goods…

        Guess what? You got everything they want..(to barter for of course

        • That is, IF they don’t shoot you before you get to make your offer…

      15. Hey everyone! I’m looking for advice and techniques on what I would need to do in a survival situation, such as an EMP, global pandemic or natural disaster. Anything suggestions are great! Thanks!

        • Use one hand to cover your eyes and the other to grab your balls!

      16. Speaking of tampons, the silicone menstrual cups are a better option (opinion) than stockpiling tampons for a woman in the long run because they can be cleaned and reused for years though tampons are more versatile. It can be used to plug a wound or as a makeshift bandage, to start a fire with the cotton, as a crude water filter, the string can be used as a wick, and as barter.

        Glocks and AKs are great guns-especially for caches. There’s a Youtube video of a G21 buried unprotected in the dirt for 2 years and a rusty AK found in a buried cache for 18 years. Both worked. The Glock had some rusted internals but passed a 500 round test and the AK was just oiled.

      17. Something about this article sickened me. This author is a not a warrior in any way. This whole grey man thing is a crock of shit to me. If this shit happens in America it is your right and duty to resist tyranny. What we need to study is how the insurgents are operating against our own troops. There are many lessons to be learned. Get with Veterans and pick their brain about M.O.U.N.T operations in the Sandbox. Study how drones work and there capabilities. This is not some 3rd world shithole this is the United States of America. We the people either defend it or lose our birthright.

        • Arizona Ron:

          I agree!

          • You tell ’em all granny girl! You’ gonna be the first one on the firing line too, ready to launch them ole pee soaked depends at the first sign o’ trouble!

        • it is called “MOUT” not MOUNT. Being grey, means thugs and their thugettes shouldn’t pay attention to YOU, let them find someone else. Nothing wrong at all with being gray.
          As for “insurgent study”, WE, Americans are NOT middle-eastern jihadi wanna-bees, therefore, or culture and behavior is NOT at all like theirs. Nor will it ever be. While we can study what they do for “research” we should never ever “think” that the “jihadi” way is appropriate for any American to engage in. Think Revolutionary War history, it’s a far better study, and still more tactically and strategically relevant to today, than anything “jihadi” related. Then again, you are an adult and can resolve your own salvation.

        • Arizona there is a very good book I’d recommend you reading. It’s is called Resistance to Tyranny by Joseph P. Martino. It will give you a lot of what you are looking for. Even more important are the sources he gives. This guy use to write military doctrine for dealing with insurgents. This book is written for the insurgent (in our case patriot) perspective.

        • I agree with you Ron but the Grey man idea has merit. You want to be a British Redcoat standing out in the field that’s Ok by me. I’ll be that gray/brown lump of grass and leaves about 400 yds away.

      18. Six pack I agree there isn’t a lot of jobs. It is hard for older folks to land work too. But to say they have tried to find work is bull. There are jobs people feel are beneath them. That’s why they don’t take them. Ss is for retired or disabled folks that have doctors saying they are disabled. Ss is being abused by lazy bums. I work with guys that have shit they should be disabled but they won’t let em out of the workforce. When 3 different docs say your disabled but you are not able to get ss and lazy bums are that is injustice. I’m in the state with the highest unemployment in the nation and I got work paying double anywhere else I’ve worked. How’s that for tried to find work. To say there is nothing out there is false. It might not be your dream job but it is more dignified way than hand outs. I couldn’t live on ss not enough $ for me but if some want to accept it that’s their business. I like to have enuff $ to do things and I’m a highly motivated individual not an armchair survivalist. Got a lot of things going on doing a garden which I do every year. Get more veggies than I know what to do with. They end up rotting on the vine and I compost them. I don’t give them away anymore because I figure why should others partake in the fruits of my labor. Don’t they do it enough already. I work 60 hrs a week and do gardens rabbits and other projects. I look at it like this I will not flee and run to the woods I will fight till my last breath. It’s my choice I’m willing to live with the consequences. It’s ok with me if others want to be refugees I just don’t.

      19. Since the Vietnam war, the U.S. military has been in the ‘hold the cities’ mode. They will hold the cities and try to take the countryside. It failed in Vietnam, Iraq and Afghanistan and it will fail here as well. They don’t have enough troops, including DHS and various agencies to control the countryside in this vast country of ours. And they can’t put enough people at checkpoints to stop and inspect every car or truck during wartime. So if you can get to the countryside with enough people, you have a chance to survive.

      20. With modern weapons and night/heat vision scopes, etc. Know the chances of just slipping through the woods are impossible. Years back the Army figured out that in less than 36 hours they can shut down an area. This is not 1942 folks, it is not Rambo. A conventional war would only happen if we had a EMP. One must be ready to be mobile, with the basics in a pack. (Think Camping) One must be in shape, and fight only if there is no other option. Skirting around a conflict and picking your battle with or without groups. Knowing generally a area of the country, not staying in one location very long. Till things become polarized and organized to the point where you can make a difference. Because if shtf, chaos will reign supreme for a long while. Avoid the chaos, protect your own, once you’ve managed to stay alive through that, chances are you’ll know which side your gonna fight for. Also by then you will know how much of the crap you have in your stash is worth its salt. I can make 800 yard shots, but it does no good if your taken out by a rocket 5 minutes later. This ain’t Hollywood… God bless

        • All the wars in the last 40 yrs were to attack countries for regime change and their leadership that would be ZOG Israel friendly. Zero success. Time to let Israel meet their maker and give every country the green light to carpet bomb Israel back to the stone age. And kick all the Jews out of America prior.

      21. I’m gonna barter some of my extra glow in the dark, electro-vibro lime-green, candy-coated sweet and sour butt-plugs. Just the used up ones what are all wore out. Somebody will be desperate enough and want them, then I’ll have all the silver and gold coins I need.

        • Oh Acid…You do make me laugh. I love your posts.

        • Acid, no one is interested in anything like that.

          • Old Bitch,

            Look at the name. I didn’t write that. Cultivate your powers of perception for SHTF.

            • Acid, OK, even if you didn’t, my powers of perception are just fine.

      22. Well now the USA has sent forces to the ukraine because too few americans had the backbone to stop the bankers who control americia we are on a war path with a super power.

        draw a map of the world and mark in red any country who has sanctions againt them by the USA and you will sonn see a cancer that needs to be stopped.

        People in Europe don’t wants americans starting trouble over here and they will soon turn on americans and the puppets leaders when bombs start to fly because most people know that it was not Russia who invaded the Ukraine but americans using money from the bankers and these americans will fight anyone so long as the money is right.

        Boy will these 300 so called trainers in the Ukraine get bitch slapped when they meet russian forces face to face and then they should be asked if the pay stub was worth it

        • Fell sorry for these poor slobs, being sent there in the hopes that they would get killed to serve as an excuse for escalated involvement by USA.

      23. I just cannot agree with your analysis. You ssem to be against people taken up arms and hiding. Some of this is true to a point. But we are talking about a civil war with the US government. First and foremost, the US has never, NEVER—won a protractive gorilla. It just seems your article wants the people to lie down. As I agree, about not showing your face at rallys and protest, You cannot run and cower, unless you want to live as a sheep for the rest of your life. Lessons in war can be learned from the Vietnam, Afhangstan, and others. The people can win a war against the government.

        • The war in Ukraine isn’t over yet. Maybe he is hoping the Russians will save them. In that case, the best option is to bug out or lay low until it’s over.

      24. The writer of the post made several good points.
        I like the point especially made remaining away from protests and violent resistance. They are going to be too busy with them to worry about you.

        I have always been an advocate of not bugging out unless I had to and there was no other recourse: Like extreme earth changes.

        Some who do bug out to the woods or else where probably have not considered the fact of the use by terrorists of a WMD and how to survive that situation. There are positives and negatives to every plan/situation.

      25. reading all of the posts just now combined with the story made me think i might need to add few more months of food and h20 to my shtf prep closet so i can stay longer in the woods.

        plus add a 2nd decent extra backup chainsaw and gas cans to my truck tool box so i can close the fire roads door behind me when i bug out to the woods with big ole’ tree’s laying across em’!

        * the ones who survive are the ones who bug out first and are mobile enough to get to remote communities and camps far away from the dangers of the war torn cities and towns.

        those who stay out of sight , stay out of the zog dhs gestapo piggy predators minds!

        stay frosty everyone!

        • sl. We know all your zones.

          • ‘oh goody company, would it be too much too ask that you pack some bar-b-Que sauce in your pack!’

            ‘long.pork it’s what for dinner when the shtf in zog amerika!’

            @ss-3 ‘just a suggestion, you might wanna pack a lunch and leave a ‘last will and testament’ behind when you come to visit.’

        • Solus: You have a good point. I encourage people to lay low for the first 30 days and let things shake out. For the first few weeks we won’t even know who the real players are, we won’t know who is a danger to us, and we will be fed a healthy dose of disinformation. Some information will be lies and some will be inaccurate.

          There are many who assume that anyone in uniform will be the enemy. This may not be the case and they may get in to a fire fight with soldiers simply defecting.
          Another thing people don’t seem to realize is that seeing the military patrol the streets will be a blessing for many people not a call to arms. For those in cities or around cities that already have gang related violence seeing a Bradley patrol their streets might very well mean that they might be safe from organized gangs like ms13.

          I tend to think that cities will set up “green zones” like they did in Baghdad. And yes they will disarm you as a condition for being allowed in there, but those in rural areas will be left to defend themselves.
          For people that don’t choose to “trade security for safety” it will be critical to be able to gather pieces of information and determine what is really happening from all the crap. It will be a test in critical thinking skills that is pass/fail test.

          • For a great example of pieces of information and connecting random dots to form inaccurate or premature conclusions.
            Read today’s hodges article “jade helm is tightening the noose”.
            He may very well mean well but is a clear example why people need to read these pages and do some more research. Jade Helm is something to keep an eye on but we don’t have all the information yet to draw the conclusions that Dave has.
            I want everyone to notice that while he is calling for action for all his readers, he is considering making plans to leave the country.
            Enough said.

          • Two issues, One, try staying low for 90 days, not 30. People in large cities have very little food so in 30 days they will have run out for a week or two so they will be shooting each other fairly soon, most of the suburbs have more and it will take them a bit longer to settle down. Second, I don’t think the PTB will even try to create Green zones in the large cities. Why would they? Cities in this country no longer provide things we want. They are zones of needy. The Gov will let them burn out. The checkpoints in this country will be trying to keep the scum inside them.

            • Paranoid: Both valid points. I should have stated minimum 30 days. Regarding the green zones and this is only speculation but I think they will need a place for command and control were the brass can feel safe. A so called green zone will give people the illusion that they are there for their safety but in reality that area is just a buffer zone between danger and command.

          • M

            I agree there will be adjustments in the first 30 days. A lot depends if people have electricity and water service. Timing is critical. When to do things as needed and not show your hand. How long will your neighbors stay in their homes is a critical judgment.

          • M. We in the country already fend for ourselves. We don’t need no stinking FEMA MRE handouts. Who wants to live in the inner city Green Slave Zone?

            • WWTI: you asked who would want to live in Green Zones? Most everyone who lives in cities will want to live there for protection. People that haven’t prepared properly will beg to be let in fema camps for safety and to be fed that mre.

              By the way congrats on your move and doing so well. I am not sure I would be comfortable living around the gators you have in your state. When I lived in GA I could never get used to water snakes and gators.

            • WWTI, I tried an MRE once and spit it out. No MREs for me. Been buying some Mountain House over the past year and that’s the only freeze-dried food I found that’s even edible. I tried the other brands and they tasted like MREs.

              • Besides the fact that the ingredients on MRE’s read like something out of dow chemicals dumpster!

        • solus lupus.

          It is a long stretch to think that there will be plenty of like minded people who hook up to live in the wild. Imagine the exodus from the cities that end up on your outdoor lawn. No skills. No food. No weapons. Only a bunch of freaked out gammers that will want to be fed and sheltered.
          Also I am going to stay in my home where I am the BOSS.
          Not going to put up with others people’s stupid decisions that would get me killed. I can do that myself.
          it’s the small shit that will get you killed.

          • Some of us are already in the woods. Caches everywhere. Caches include traps and other food gathering stuff. Beaver, squirrels, rabbits, muskrats, birds, etc. are caught without the need of gunfire. Good food, skins, and fur.

            Now if we can just get you city folks to stay home all will be right in the world.

            Commies are everywhere, particularly in the concrete jungles.

        • An extra chainsaw is a great idea. Spend the extra for a Stihl (or if you’re a logger by trade you’ll already know the better brands).

          For hurricane Opal my Dad and I had 4 chainsaws and plenty of gas. With help from my brother and his buddy we made a lot of friends and some pretty decent money for 4 days work.

          Bar oil keeps a long time, an extra chain is mandatory, and store ethanol free premium with Sta-Bil and rotate. In a pinch you can run it on ethanol from your still once all the gas is gone; just always use fresh EtOH since it’s hygroscopic (will absorb water).

      26. A lot of folks seem to have a ‘vision’ of what they are prepping for – but when the situation in Ukraine doesn’t fit their vision, they do not seem able to adapt. Ukraine is not a wide spread TEOTWAWKI situation. It is a regional civil war situation where troops from one side or the other remain in some control and travel is still possible. The author describes what is needed to survive that scenario. In this case, you hide your guns to avoid confiscation. Being a grey man is critical. You can bug out because travel is still possible to a civilized location. That foreign bank account looks good once you leave the danger zone and want to live elsewhere. And you will be shot on site if you walk around carrying your AK-47, or refusing to open your door to be searched. Given the other story about National Guard troops patrolling residential streets in California, and given the government actions after Katrina, it is easy to see a similar scenario in America.

        The author’s ideas will not work in a totally lawless world populated by gangs, or in a world where there is no longer any food distribution, or a world with mass riots and looting, or a world where you are being rounded up and hauled to FEMA camps, etc, etc. But just like in Ukraine, you have to be flexible with your preps and adapt to reality – not to your personal vision.

      27. Anyone wanting to know what real life survival is like in a fully materialized degrading of government and civil war should watch “The Killing Fields”, the story of Dith Pran and his eventual escape from Cambodia during the Civil War there.

        As you watch it, ask yourself how you would/will fare in such situations. I’m thinking it may end up at least that bad here in at least some parts of the country.

        I think too many here are watching “Mad Max” or “Red Dawn” and thinking they are a realistic portrayal of what they will face. You’re better off making your plans on things that have actually happened and are still happening than on speculative and entertaining fiction. People tend to repeat history as adjusted for current conditions, not invent new history (at least until the Second Coming when things will finally change for the better).

      28. Passports and id please if I’m traveling I’m not showing it I don’t have it is what m gonna say. I don’t want to be identified by troops at a roadside checkpoint. That’s nuts to allow yourself to be identified by anyone in a shtf situation. I wouldn’t be traveling the roadways or established trails. I would be blazing new paths and doing anything to make anyone tracking me fail. Setting up booby traps along the way. I wouldn’t care if it took me longer to get where I want to go being in a hurry will get you killed. But this won’t happen because I’m not bugging anywhere. The Americans I know will not be forced to be refugees in their own country to have to live like third worlders. We are to exceptional to fall for that crap. But if that’s what you wanna do have fun living hand to mouth. Keep believing the people who say I’m from the gov and I’m here to help. The FEMA camps are built for you. Communal living at it’s finest you can share your wife with the men of the commune.

        • Most of the wives i had would consider it a privilege and patriotic duty to satisfy every swinging sausage in camp. Wear a rubber. So acid etch has some chewing gum.

      29. Good advise, However the US is large and diverse with over 300 million folks. If it goes down I really feel there will be know place to run. Life is wonderful, but free is how we were intended to live. If there are occupying forces whether ours or theirs life is not worth the compromise. We are in the pot already and starting to boil. What will happen here will not end well. I think what I am saying is, Pray, Prepare, don’t accept what will come, pick your battle. But in the end don’t think it will get any better. With that said the only thing I think Americans can do is Arm themselves, become self sufficient, don’t become involved unless you don’t have a choice. Plan in your mind ahead of what will take place or your reaction to it. In times of chaos and power outages and technology do not hold up as well. There are a lot of us to kill, and control. We can hope they don’t start with us so we can learn from their mistakes. May God have Mercy on us. God does not expect us to submit to evil. He has said to occupy until he comes.

        • Thank you Dennis.

      30. DO NOT cut the first two trees down. Find two about the right distance apart. Pull them together and tie. this will save a lot of work and make your structure a lot stronger.

        • Also consider use of insulated Aluminum siding rather than tree branches

        • Paranoid, Solus will out woods you any day of the week.

          “Tie two trees together” is that the best you can do? Where’s your video?


            easy everyone, we all come here to communicate and share idea’s to make ourselves better preppers and thereby increasing our own chance to survive whatever may come in tumultuous years ahead for us all as zog amerika goes bust by nwo neocon zog design.

            An ideal shelter would be one that was facing south/east, far enough on the down slope of a hill that it blocks the cold north wind, where you create a partially shallow dug cave into a low mound or a shallow rock cave as the backing of the shelter so it shelters you from the weather and wind , absorbs heat and radiates it back upon you from the semi circle backed rock wall and dirt banked fire at the entrance of your emergency shelter, which would reflect the heat into your cave/ lean-too shelter. the cave should be big enough for to you comfortably sit up in it and lay down to rest. small is better and warmer.

            the fir tree branch lean too-roof and side fir walls with a sloped roof sealed with a foot thick forest floor leaves and pine debry to shed rain and snow creates a perfect pocket of heat to survive a cold night(use wrist thick size young sapling poles to build the frame structure). you can even further build a 4 foot high sapling and brush wind break wall on the outside of the fireplace to further block wind , reflect and trap the heat generated by the fire, ensuring you also connect this wind break wall with the side cave lean-too wall on the windward side of the fire with your lean-too shelter cave. this will stop the wind from stealing your life saving fire heat. some folks even build a raised sleeping bed platform to get you off the body heat stealing ground, this also allows a warm pocket to form beneath you from the radiating fire which is a good thing.

            this is the perfect emergency shelter if trapped or lost over night in the frigid woods. it will keep you alive. if you are unable to build a fire. simply seal up your entrance with forest brush and leaves and pack your cave with dry leaves and grass so you can then burrow into it and sleep in a warm body heated cocoon. it’s key you insulate yourself from the cold body heat stealing ground.

          • 1 Note the initial problem she had keeping the thing together, won’t have that if first two or three trees are not cut, 2. AL siding was a Joke! You won’t last a week, if you cannot laugh at the end of the world, you cannot survive it. 3. Solus maybe far better than I, but I still put meat in the freezer this winter, did you? 4. No way in hell am I running to the woods, so the gal was interesting but I knew how to build that shelter 50 years ago and it’s way to big for one.

            • Para we may need to make contact somehow, sometime. You do know for Wyoming, you live in a rather large town. As far as bugging out goes, location is the main factor in whether to stay or run and many really don’t have anyplace to BO to. Where I live the only reason to BO would be for a more stratigic location. I know of so many vacant cabins that my biggest problem would be which one to go to, and some are quite remote. As I’ve stated in other comments, I can throw a lot of food and ammo as well as clothing into my horse trailer, hook it up and be in one of numerous spots on a couple of gallons of gas, in probably 30 mins. I am also many many miles from a city of any size. And if need be the horse trailer makes a pretty good camper, and I don’t just talk the talk, I have made many shelters in the unknown. Nuff Said. Trekker Out. South Pass, Meeteetse, Burrus, Sweet Water Jct, Who Knows? Maybe Fort Washakie!

      31. Since ammo prices have gone up and the shortages are still there. I have noticed the sales of air rifles have soared. Lots of .177 cal. off the shelves and high velocity pellets is a favorite. Some .22 cal. with velocity between 950fps and 1100. Do not expect super accuracy till you break the rifle in. About 100 to 200 pellets. Single break action type air pistons.

      32. Of course you can’t have and article like this without my personal comment. Texas is not Ukraine. I just read the latest David hodges on thecommonsenseshow.com having a surface to air missle battery in Lubbock Texas. Something very serious is about to happen..now what the heck is really getting ready to happen. I encourage all shtf posters to see that article, we need some opinions.

        • I read the article. See my above comment about Hodges.
          People that have decided to take on the responsibility to report this stuff and act as a balancing weight against MSM need to realize that their information needs to be accurate and if they are reaching for conclusions they need note that they are doing so.
          Hodges in the first part said he was considering making preparations to leave the country, and at the end of it was calling for anger and action from everyone else.
          Enough said.

          • Hodges is definitely on the red list. If you are on that list, you have to be somewhere they can’t find you.

        • Hodges writes a decent and accurate article occasionally.

          Most of his stuff is worth reading for at least a part of its content, but the overall article and the slant that he puts on things is usually best ignored.

          I’ve known several guys, one outstandingly alarmist one that everyone here probably knows of, that have been preaching imminent doom and disaster for at least the last 20 years. Writing books and selling gold and disaster supplies and such tends to push you that direction.

          They all write some good stuff in one way or another and all their writing contains at least some useful information but with a slant that makes it wise to take their imminent disaster predictions with a large grain of salt as you read them.

      33. Nothing that you have said makes any sense, I had a Russian up in my face in the galleria area of Houston demanding to see my friends computer because she posted on her face book page about the Russian spestzatz occupation. 10 mins later this extremely muscular Russians male entered the tattoo shop on us..

        Him- what is his place
        Her- it’s a tattoo shop. May I have you.
        Me- what, where are you from
        Her- do you need a tatoo.
        Him- is that your computer.
        Me- you need to leave now, what do you want.

        Me- what do you do here

        He had that Russia accent

        As I walked toward him, I noticed his extreme, may I repeat EXTREME MUSCULARITY. Being a former competitive bodybuilder who competed and won contest, I for one know the training that’s required to get in shape and he is no older than 27 yrs old, and is 6 ft tall. The same identical physical description uses by the people that Quayle, Hawk, Hodges and others have reports on from people who have spotted then at different areas of the country. So M don’t come in her and try to BS us, we are not stupid people, nor am i.

        Me- you better leave because I am from the north side of town and I am lot afraid of you.

        I then walked him outside of the store, my female friend was really scared of him, but not me. I fear no

        Then he started to size me up, being being a martial artist practises SI LAT, I was under the impression that he was getting to attack me by his physical positioning, he then decided to walk away..this punk was a Russian spetzatz. He was going to attack me it was obvious.

        Before he left.

        Me- where are you from

        Then he enters his car and left.

        Isn’t interesting to note that my friend posted the article on Facebook and 10 mind later a Russian male shows up in a white lexus with no tattoos in a tatoo shop asking her about her computer and kept stearing at it, obvious working for DHS, further backing up all the stuff that Quayle and Hodges have been wearing us about. It seems like every time I post something about Hodges or Quayle, Chinese soldiers in the Sierra Madras getting ready to invade us, I come under attack. Someone who does not post on this site suddenly starts posting and now this same person is telling us to make soldiers disarm us, and now how to handle soldiers coming into your area and advising us to let them disaarma us, when they come to our streets in our neighborhoods. What’s wrong with this picture. You people are monitoring this site and trying to stear attention from the facts aren’t you. There is nothing for me to gain by lying to the shtf audience..this Russian incident changed my life. Russians are in Texas and they are here to take our guns and kill us intern us in camps attack our women along with the Chinese communist PLA forces, and this is just a sickening fact of life MR M. So don’t come here trying to discredit me.

        • I wasn’t trying to discredit you at all. You asked for opinions on Hodges article and you got it. You are doing more damage to your own credibility than I am.
          I am simply stating that Hodges would have us believe that Russians, Chinese, Drug lords, Isis and everyone else is coming through our southern borders. All he can produce as evidence is a picture of some russian brass posing with american brass at ft. carson. Nothing else that I have seen.
          So while the Russian and the Chinese are here to work with DHS and american forces to imprison citizens he wants to try to peddle his theory that we will simultaneously go to war with them in the arctic circle?

          I don’t know, maybe you were confronted by Russians. I can tell you that you wouldn’t make a credible witness from reading your rants.

          • sympathy for you Mr M.

          • I don’t know about Hodges’ credibility on the subject, but they are coming thru the border and have been for a while. Ranchers down here have been finding their trash, prayer rugs, etc. The chinese are paying big bucks to be brought over. Drug cartels are growing daily in Texas. Down in the valley they have found tunnels with rpgs, tanks, military uniforms, grenades.

            They may not have their own you tube channel yet, but they are here.

            • Loulou: I won’t debate that anyone who wants to come through the southern border can get through. I will debate for what purpose though and I should have explained it better. Hodges thinks that Russians and Chinese forces are coming over the border to help the american forces round up people that disagree with the gov’t. Then they are supposed to fight WWIII in the arctic circle at the same time. Makes zero sense.

              • I think the Chinese plan to protect and control their investment. The Russians who are here may be solely mercenaries promised the spoils when they get rid of us. The Russian government may not be involved at all.

          • The “story” as related in the poster’s miserable post, makes as much sense as his lack of Russian to English translation capabilities. He’s not a “native” English speaker, so, that makes his “story”, just that, a story designed to impress people who read this bovine excrement and believe his drivel.
            AS for him being a credible witness….I would bet Hillary’s hard drive destruction “testimony” has far more credibility than anything that clown can make up.
            Good for you for calling him out. He’s a phony, and his semantics prove it.

        • Oh, Hout/etc ………

          That wasn’t a real Russian, it was just a ZOG in disguise.

          They do that just to mess with ya, ya know?

      34. Bugging in is always better than bugging out. The only time bugging out is recommended by any serious survival expert is if death is imminent and there is no other option (i.e. airstrikes on your position, structural damage beyond repair, outnumbered with no hiding place, etc).

        Speaking of hiding places, a good movie to watch is “The Hiding Place.” It shows a Christian family hiding Jewish refugees during WW2. Their hiding place ideas are pretty solid and some of their techniques are time tested. There’s a lot to learn from this film whether you are religious or not.

      35. Air rifles are a waste of time really. They are good to teach kids marksmanship. You can kill small animals like squirrels and rabbits so they are not entirely useless. I find that they are underpowered to kill small animals. It’ll get the job done if need be. My beef is look at the price of them if they were under $50 for a good one sure definetly worth it. For $150 you can boot in a few more bucks and get a 10/22 which is a nice gun that as you get a few more bucks you can make upgrades. I don’t have a 10/22 myself I like them though. I got a hk mp5 sd 22lr I love the thing has a walther barrel shoots great can adjust bolt speed will eat any 22 ammo I can get. I got it a while back cost me $500 and mags are around 30 a piece. Nice gun though. Your right though about the cost of air gun ammo being cheaper but that can be offset by the cost of co2 cartridges. 22lr ammo is almost impossible to find and if you do it’s way overpriced. People come here from Connecticut and are happy to pay $70 for 375 cci mini mags I would not pay that ever . I’ve seen 10/22 sell for $229 at the gunshop I think boot in the extra $80 and get real firearm.

        • I disagree about the air rifles being useless. They do serve a purpose. I’ve got an old Crosman .177 pellet pistol I was practicing with a helluva lot after Sandy Hook and the ammo shortage started. I was practicing with that in my backyard on weekends to save my stash of .22LR. i agree the air rifles are overpriced, but so is everything else. You’re right about the 10/22 being a good rifle. I bought one back in 2000, the stainless model, and never regretted it. I have several 25-round mags for it and never had any feeding problems. Ammo and co2 cartridges for the air rifles are still in good supply.

        • I kinda like my Marauder,
          Baby was a bit over 700 though

      36. I’ll be lucky to last a week, but i’ll give it my best shot. (pun intended)

      37. OT
        Lookingfor a consensus on what peeps think about this Jade Helm crap…

        • Kula: After reading that thing on Judicial Watch about the Isis camp found I am paying a bit more attention to it.

          On a personal note. Are you in an okay place in your life right now? Your tone in your writing has changed a bit. Wishing you well that’s all.

          • Just going through some stuff and am tired of the BS, we need a 180 for the country.
            Thanks for asking though

            • I agree about the 180. But I think we as a country are setting ourselves up for a perfect storm financially, economically and militarily faster than we might realize.

              I still have some loose ends to tie up but if things were to fall apart tomorrow I could do without them which gives me a calm I didn’t have some years back.

              As far as working through your stuff. I usually head out in the woods for a few days for perspective and direction. But work it out however you do it friend.

              • Need to spend time in the greenhouse, thats therapeutic, also going to start planting corn and carrots and such, out in the fields is best therapy

                • Kula,I to am at a mental breaking point,I just realise many have it off worse and thus am grateful.Like your gardening,shooting my bow brings me a state of mind that is good and helps with the days grind,happy gardening!

                  • Relax; It’s so far out of our hands that it’s not a problem. Whatever comes people have faced far worse before. Buy a retriever puppy and explain it to the dog. see how it looks at the problem. By 100 lbs of dog food and relax. Only got one life, guaranteed to die once.

            • Kulafarmer: Read you 5 by 5 also tired of all the BULLSHIT and yes we do need a 180 in this country. I’m so afraid that the compass is broken and completely locked in the wrong direction. Prepare buddy and stand tall as I know you ARE. Every night has it’s dawn.

        • Consensus is that it will take place for unknown reasons that we may understand after they become apparent.

          Hope that helps.

        • Kula… Jade = STONE…. Helm = to GUIDE a ship. Ever been to Georgia?

          • Georgia guidestone.

        • Kulafarmer: My take on Jade Helm 15 is this: I’m torn in some different directions on this event. 1; Just the last major test on how the American people will handle troops everywhere, how the military will preform in the streets, and how so called anti-government groups will act. 2; Total lock down of the SW U. S. for the elites to bug out to. 3; Totally open the gates for a invasion of foreign army. 4; Or just all total BULSHIT and it’s just what they say a training drill, but on this one I think not, everything that is going on right now in the country says something huge is coming and I mean HUGE. Like I said before the Shit-Sandwich is about to be served to us open faced and things are going to get very ugly. Remember every night has it’s dawn.

      38. Just throwing this out; About Wal-Mart, Sam Walton served in the U.S. Army Intelligence Corps (Military Intelligence Corps) as supervising security at aircraft plants and prisoner of war camps. He served at Fort Douglas, Salt Lake City, Utah. Connection????????? You be the judge.

        Now check out the patches of the M. I. Units; now look at Jade Helm 15 Emblem, do they all look common in design someway?

      39. It used to be you could retreat and regroup and live to fight another day. This is how war grinds on for years. If the enemy is amongst us then there is no running to anywhere. If we don’t advance we are being pushed back to a corner . This is a dangerous place to be IMHO. I know all my neighbors even some I’d rather not. The fact is we can’t all run to some stocked retreat in the woods. Some are not physically able to and why should they leave their home. I’ve seen people that won’t be able to do certain tasks but they can sit in a chair with gun and watch. Or they can’t travel on foot through rough terrain to get into a position but they can cook good to be of some support. If we are all trying to survive then we should be doing our part. People we are on our own we need to look out for each other. Never mind the gov they have let us down and are a failure if you still want to believe they are here to help your gonna end up in a FEMA camp plain and simple. I really don’t think the gov can hurt us if we don’t let them. Some people have a very defeatist attitude and say things like the gov has tanks armor cannons aircraft blah blah blah. If that’s the case the the second amendment was out their for sporting and hunting purposes. There is not enough soldiers and cops to control the masses if we are united. The only thing that can stop us is the bomb and I call their bluff they will not use it because it will destroy the planet and the tree hugging libs won’t do it no fucking way. Plus if elites managed to survive everything would be destroyed their standard of living would be shit. Your only defeated if you throw up the white flag and surrender. So far that’s what most folks are doing.

        • Asshat, I do agree with that entire post. good post.

      40. Let you know when they roll down I-10 from Tallahassee.

      41. I was referring to the misscle battery on Lubbock Texas, not for and opinion on Dave Hodges. I was inquiring about the Jade Helm and what that battery may have meant as in and opinion by many of the legitimate posters on this blog, who’s word is trust worthy unlike yours Mr M..

      42. Squirrel, he didn’t look like the guy, the Russian identified himself as Russian and he was in a shorts and t- shirt and very serious and aggressive looking, so serious I have to admit I was afraid of him because he was one very tough looking dude..however I did warn him nicely, that I am not running anywhere.

      43. Read off of Mr M comments. He tells us to do as we are told by the soldiers when they come to your house to disarm us.. Nice try Mr M, you are not wining this one. You are not one of us, I read that comment very carefully. My grammar is bad, but my reading skills are on the money. Good buy M, it’s over you are not one of us you are a fraud trying get in on the comments to mind control us back to the accept you defeat we are taking your guns crap. Everyone read everyone of his comments again, and you will see what I am taking about. I came under one sever attack over a month ago by Kanine, telling me that my post was crap, that Chinese soldiers are not in Mexico that I was insane and need it to get my head examined, nice try Kanine, aka Mr M, your another agency employee, get your azz doing. another task and get the piss off this site. Mac, please ban this jackazz.

        • Uh oh. Through your superior deductive reasoning skills you caught me.
          Fucking Retard

        • So tell us exactly what you are going to do when they come for you.

          There is a knock on your door, out of the blue, and you find a soldier with an M4 standing there with an armored vehicle in the street and several other soldiers backing him up.

          Maybe say “wait a minute till I go get my gun and shoot you”?

          You don’t comply you die, and you’re unlikely to pull off anything that does them any harm in the process (even simple police standoffs usually result in either surrender or death, and the police involved are usually unharmed in the process). You’ll also be portrayed as an evil villain and used as an example to get support from the majority of the American public for more of these actions (think Koresh).

          You’d be better off thinking about alternative resistance strategies than just shooting any armed people that show up in some official or unofficial LE capacity to search your home and confiscate whatever it is they want to confiscate, they can call for backup and go unprosecuted if they kill you, you cannot (if you live through it, that is).

          You’d also be better off not talking about such things publicly (this forum is publicly), or to anyone else for that matter, since it is not what you don’t say that gets you in trouble, it is what you say. The majority of criminals who aren’t identified at the time of the crime from forensic evidence left there are caught later on because they couldn’t keep their mouths shut and talked about it to someone.

          FWIW, I’d guess that anyone posting here is already on some suspicious person list somewhere at some agency. There is no anonymity on the internet so watch what you say and do and don’t advocate anything illegal or that can be construed or presented that way.

      44. Copperhead thanks for posting your comment that is a sickening fact of life about Sam Walton, I have read that before. Looks like he needs to upgrade his foundation and plumbing to better serve his customers, the Chinese PLA. He has done such a good job in the past, now with his criminal experience prefected, he can now station Chinese communist soldiers in civilian clothing running his stores with the Chinese Red Star patch emblem, showing their support of the dictator, the chinese president, that he is going to follow orders and disarm us..with the confidence of the upper elites, they even got to set up the first live firing squad in Utah.. since the Mormons are about to get back all the federal land back under their control, the elite felt it was time to get firing squads ready.. looks like Sam is Gearing up to reduce America’s populous..time to update Walmart plumbing, it’s all adding up. Really think about it.

      45. I know we need to go where it’s safe in the green zones. And that people will the running toward them..seems like a lot of suggestions in your part. I can tell by your writing style that you are a soldier and your not a good one that is on the people side. I have red between the lines Mr M..Yes I caught you 1000%.. you are the one using profanity in this site and directing it at me. I know when I am being attacked for credibility. I have a friend that is a real scientist that builds free energy technology and anti- gravity devises and I know things that a so serious that I cannot post it on this site because I would out him, and I have seen with my own two eyes, the things he built and I have told the folks commenting on this site the God honest truth about what he was told and I feel that it’s my responsibility to let people in this site know what they need to know how bad the situation is. And I have learned things here that I did not known from experienced preppers. I have read Selcos..course, and I have read Failure of Civility. Its really going to be bad, and they already know it’s bad, and I decided to post here to help answer a few things and present some serious facts without outing too much. But its it enough to make everyone get the picture. You only come under attack for credibility when your presenting the truth.. so keep cussing at me, swearing it me talking me down, it’s not going to work. I will be posting what I know on this site. I know your type. I am done with this thread. Any more crap coming from you won’t bother me, I know too much and know big people that have confirmed alot things and David Hodges, Steve Quayle, Doug hagmannandhagmann.com, Dr James Garrow, Hawk, Pete Saltilli, Alex Jones, economist V, and others are 100% on the money as to what Jade Helm 15 is really about and the facts are very startling.. I am done with this thread, attacking me will not work.
        We are not going to go back to sleep and it’s not going to make the readers who reads this website go back to sleep.

        • Someone could bounce a ball in front of you and call it an anti gravity machine and you’d most likely believe it.

          Now go play scooter.

        • ” David Hodges, Steve Quayle, Doug hagmannandhagmann.com, Dr James Garrow, Hawk, Pete Saltilli, Alex Jones, economist V, and others are 100% on the money as to what Jade Helm 15 is really about and the facts are very startling.. ”
          Same group I listen to. Might add to that hummingbird027.com
          I have learned a ton of things from Hagmann and Hagmann. Very startling interviews. The latest had to do with Methodical Illusions book from a flight attendant who knows the real protocol for how they would handle a highjacking. She has done a ton of research showing who is behind 9/11 and it wasn’t Arabs at all, no planes hit buildings, it was all methodically planned even years in advance!

      46. Today let us not forget the insanity of Waco and the insanity later of Oklahoma brought on by the govt. actions at Waco.Waco was my Kennedy moment,lets hope history does not repeat itself but if it does,fight hard and strong,till then,prep mentally while enjoying the day.

      47. Walmart is the number one retailer in the country their moves need to be followed. They are shutting down stores you can’t spin that radio shack closed stores some others in the mall too closed. If you ask media they will say those stores weren’t making a profit that’s why. The economy is going down it’s plain to see. Walmart didn’t tell the employees till five hours before they closed and they had some phony excuse about the plumbing this excuse left them the option to change their mind at the last second if they chose to. Everywhere I’ve worked always closed down on a Friday they get your last check and tell you it’s the end of the road. Very shady stuff IMHO. But I can’t say it wasn’t in the cards. There is so much commercial space for lease it’s everywhere. They were building more and more store space. They aren’t building more factories. How many stores do we need out there. I’m glad I’m not in retail work. The economy is going down period people’s wages don’t keep up with the cost of living and people are in debt they don’t have the $ to buy cheap consumer goods they have to keep a car on the road and pay their bills. They are not gonna keep extending credit to people and they are not gonna pay more$ Thats why the economy is collapsing. The so called experts should tell the public the truth. They won’t because state run media will fire them if they do. They have to keep up the lie. People that are unemployed should be protesting at corporate headquarters of these companies. Then their state capital. The average worker has become throw away just like the consumer goods.

        • Ass hat, you are wise beyond your years.

        • Wonder if anyone’s interviewed the employees about the plumbing, seems like they’d be aware of it more than the management that gave the orders since they’d be dealing directly with it on a daily basis.

          (FWIW, don’t rule out a simple deliberate bio/chemical/radiological contamination as a possible reason for an emergency shutdown, the way the left likes to criticize Walmart I wouldn’t put it past them and it would make a slick ISIS terror attack or major extortion plot as well. And, of course, it could actually be simple plumbing problems giving a plausible excuse to shut down money loosing stores without having to admit they were losing money.)

      48. Well, if the US were to have another civil war, unlike the first one with only two main factions, but this time it is a free for all. Warlords and factions everywhere trying to divide up the promised land.
        Tired of it all,government checkpoints, faction checkpoints, bribes, food shortages, threats, no peace, a simple common man named Bill working at Palo Verde Nuclear Power Plant decides to have a melt down.

      49. Some thought on this conflict.

        Ukraine did not have much of a gun culture before 2014. Very few people owned guns. If you have a gun in the region where the fighting is taking place, you are very likely indeed involved with one side of the conflict.

        People did not need second passports to go abroad. Russia took in Ukrainian refugees. Some people, who went to Russia were actually former anti-Russian activists. However they preferred to be a refugee in a country they hate to living in a war-torn country.

        Cell phones work in the war zone reasonably well. Combatants on both sides use them to coordinate their actions.

        • Alex- just lol
          All my friends escaped to Ukraine from Donbass. Never even heard about any pro-Ukrainian in sane mind go to Russia – you just full of shit m8

      50. What ass hat said holds up..1000%.

      51. I’m getting to old for this struggle, been ready since Y2K and still nothing has been fixed in this country.

      52. It was an interesting read.

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