10 Things We Can Learn From Egypt About Preparing for Economic and Societal Collapse

by | Jan 31, 2011 | Emergency Preparedness | 70 comments

Do you LOVE America?


    Egypt Riot

    As riots spread across the world, having started first in Europe and now engulfing the Middle East, most people in the U.S. outright reject the possibility that the same could happen right here at home. But the fact of the matter is that we remain in economic crisis and there is a real possibility of a total collapse of the system we have come to know.

    If the system does happen to collapse, be it because of a hyperinflationary currency meltdown, political uprising or anything in between, here are ten things you can expect to happen, just as they are happening in the Middle East today:

    1. There will be a general break down in law and order. Law enforcement will not be policing your neighborhood. This will likely lead to a community response and vigilante groups setting up neighborhood security details. The law and justice will be determined by those walking your streets with sticks and guns, so be sure to mind your P’s and Q’s. (LINK)
    2. Food and water will become scarce. The average American has about three days worth of food in their home, and likely very little water, as most are dependent on their local city for this essential commodity. As with any major disaster, like hurricanes or earthquakes, panicked people will immediately make a run for the grocery store, either before or at the onset of crisis, looking to acquire any non-perishable goods. They’ll buy everything they can in one trip, which leaves less food for the next guy. Our just-in-time inventory management systems ensure that there will be no reserves in the back of the grocery store, so once the store shelves are cleared, it will be a while before they are restocked. (LINK)
    3. Looting will be rampant. Until all of the food, water, diapers and HDTV’s have been cleared from store shelves, looters will be breaking into retail businesses in search of goods. In Egypt, most of the population is not armed. In the U.S., however, it’s a different story and the general rule on looters is: shoot them. Regardless of whether you are trying to acquire food for your baby or a free Xbox, you will be considered a looter if you enter a private business. (LINK ; New Orleans LINK)
    4. If the rioting and looting gets bad enough, expect full deployment by the military. As we are currently seeing in Egypt, and like we saw in New Orleans during the Hurricane Katrina saga, government is prepared to restore order by whatever means are available. There will be heavily armed soldiers, tanks and unmanned aerial vehicles patrolling your city. (LINK)
    5. When rocks start getting thrown, Molotov cocktails start exploding, and citizens take it upon themselves to shoot at military and law enforcement personnel, soldiers will fire back – and the firing will be indiscriminate, just like we’ve seen in Egypt and during the Iranian riots of 2009. One report out of Egypt indicates that President Mubarak of Egypt has issued shoot-to-kill orders giving the military authority to open fire on anyone it deems a threat. (VIDEO LINK)
    6. Hospitals will run out of basic medical supplies. We saw this in Haiti and we’re seeing it in Cairo. As the injured and wounded stack up, medical personnel will be overwhelmed. Basic medicines like hydrogen peroxide and antibiotics will disappear, and minor injuries may lead to amputation or death in a matter of days if supplies are not restocked. As more dead bodies stack up, this could potentially lead to widespread outbreaks of disease like it did in Haiti. (LINK)
    7. The internet will get shut down. Governments have realized that the internet is the communication medium of choice to organize protests and riots. When Iranians protested their Presidential elections in 2009, Twitter and other social networking sites were used to organize, as well as to broadcast pictures of the events in near real-time. This gives the government ample reason to shut down all digital means of communication, the most important being that government is unable to stop mass gatherings, nor are they able to control the news propaganda of the event itself. Egypt is the first country to have taken steps to completely shutdown everything from traditional internet connectivity via ISPs, as well as phone and text communications. Expect the same in your neck of the woods if and when it hits the fan. (LINK)
    8. Banks will be closed and ATM’s will be out of money. With no law enforcement, banks will be unable to operate. There will be no one to refill the cash in ATM’s, and it’s possible that even if they do have money you will not be able to withdraw it because problems with electronic processing will prevent it. Those who don’t have cash or barterable goods on them will be left with no way to transact. (LINK)
    9. The real value of gold and silver against most other assets will rise. Though only anecdotal reports exist at this time from the streets of Egypt, it’s clear that anytime governmental, economic or social instability hits a particular region, the value of these precious metals rises. The 2010 riots in Greece prove this point, as the price of gold on the street rose to a reported $1700 per ounce, even while gold in global commodity exchanges was trading at $1100. When there are no open banks or working ATM’s, precious metals will become the de facto reserve currency on the ground. (LINK)
    10. The ‘important’ people will probably get the heck out of Dodge. If you’ve got money and power, you’re going to be fast-tracked out of the region. President Mubarak’s sons quickly fled Egypt when the riots broke out. In Tunisia, the President’s wife made a beeline for the nearest international destination – with a ton of gold in tow. While the elite will have access to evacuate a disintegrating regional riot or collapse, everyday folks will likely be stranded. Expect that wherever you are when it hits the fan is where you’ll stay, so be sure to be stocked up on the essentials. (LINK , LINK)


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      1. Comments…..10. The ‘important’ people will probably get the heck out of Dodge. If you’ve got money and power, you’re going to be fast-tracked out of the region. President Mubarak’s sons quickly fled Egypt when the riots broke out. In Tunisia, the President’s wife made a beeline for the nearest international destination – with a ton of gold in tow. While the elite will have access to evacuate a disintegrating regional riot or collapse, everyday folks will likely be stranded. Expect that wherever you are when it hits the fan is where you’ll stay, so be sure to be stocked up on the essentials.

        None of us will need #10 if we have 1-9 covered.  I suspect not many of us have the will to pack up and leave.  I also suspect that the majority of us here have beans, bullets and bandaids.  Some of us don’t live in the city, and some do, but still have 1-9 covered.  Some of us won’t need No. 8 if we have 1-7 covered.  Some form of communication like ham radio.

        We are rapidly coming to the above scenario, no use in preaching to the choir.  Get it together!

      2. Goldenfoxx,

        We are waiting more riots in Greece. Egypt is very close, and our government is masturbating also (sorry for the language Mac).
        I bought some more slugs for my mossberg, a belt, i ordered water in 6-packs, and a good flashlight with a hand crank for charging.
        With my father in law, we put iron bars all around the basement doors and windows, and we changed the house front doors with high security ones.
        My dad bought more rounds for his shooting 0,22 browning and my mom is pilling up provisions.
        I wish we hadn’t reach at this point but signs show only one directions.

      3. It still amazes me that folks think they will “get the heck outta Dodge”…just where are you gonna go?  If you don’t have a fully stocked retreat set up or someone who has one who is willing to let you in, just where are you going to go?  Have you been prepping?  Do you have a pile-o-stuff ready when TSHTF?  If so, are you going to pack it up in the bug out vehicle and hit the road with no secure destination in mind?  If you just strike out blindly looking for those “like-minded” folks, you are simply setting yourself up as a target and most likely you will be forfeiting your life, your family and your stuff to those folks who will be more than happy to oblige you and simply your larder at gun point.

        No place to go, Bucky?  Hunker down and get ready.  The best thing to do locally is to try to understand more about your neighbors…although this can often be an exercise in futility as most believe (99.999%) that it can never happen here, even though it is happening right before their eyes in Egypt.  Been there and done that, I’m surrounded by mushrooms.

        Time’s a wastin’!  There is still an opportunity to get as much as you can afford gathered up.  Don’t quit now, you may never have another chance.

        May God be with you and yours…

        GMAFB – no apologies extended, intended or implied…

      4. http://www.open-mesh.org/

        Time to explore alternate Internet sources

        Have them in place before it’s shut down.  Have a land line telephone, as well, so you can make calls & use dial-up Internet…

        Don’t forget to keep your cats and dogs indoors as there might be hungry people who will try to catch them.

        Keep prescriptions up to date with a minimum thirty day supply – tell your doctor you:  are going out of the country or lost your prescription on a trip so you can get some reserves.  Pay for it out of pocket rather than let the insurance company dictate how much you may have. 

      5. Great article. Most people don’t realize what can happen until it’s too late. I’m passing this around.

      6. I’ll hold up in my house thank you very much…..Smith  & Wesson await !

      7. Over the weekend I had met with a few friends and it turned out that we were also in the company of a local (very prominent) financial advisor. We all got to talking about this financial mess we are in. This financial “guru” spoke up and said “if people really knew what was coming later this year they would be jumping off the buildings now”.  

        This comment blew me away….coming from him. This man is a millionaire many times over and he is telling his clients to go into PM’s and out of the markets……WHAT DOES THAT TELL YOU?

      8. I have no comment, I’m a clueless fungus…

      9. Still think PMs are just a ‘scam’, Mushroom? I see you’ve been changing your tune. Good for you.

        I used to wargame this scenario with my employees some time back. We ran through all the scenarios we could. What to do if the looting hit my store. Where would each of us go? Even if we had a trailer or RV full of provisions, what good would that be, if the authorities happened to cordon off the entire block around you while you slept that night, in anticipation of what they knew was coming? All dressed up and no place to go!

        And would you quit a very good job that you had, knowing the reality of that, and move out of the metropolis now before it was too late? I did. I’d rather be in control of all of my belongings and where I felt safe, while under calm circumstances, than to have to run through plan b, c, and d if it all fell on my lap in an instant.

        I know I’m not alone in sacrificing my employment to gain control of what I knew to be coming. I don’t recommend it to everyone, but I’ve slept better ever since.

      10. Comments….. I was just reading over at Mish’s blog, he’s one of few that I respect for advice adn just general information about the markets.  Here’s a blurb from his blog, I believe the advice he gave Stepahnie was about as good as it could get:

        Here is an email from “Stephanie”. She heard me talk about the economy on Coast-to-Coast AM radio with George Noory.

        Stephanie writes ….

        Hello Mish,

        I don’t know if you give advice, but I heard you on Coast-To-Coast and you seem to know what you are talking about. I am 65 years old, get $938 from Social Security, and this is all I live on every month.

        I have a CD that is about $16,000 now and is providing $75 a month. In about a year that will stop because the interest has gone down so much. If you were me, what would you invest in?

        I lost $2,000 in the stock market a few years ago and the way it is now it is rather scary. I don’t know what else to even consider and when I ask my banker he seems to be at a loss too.

        Any help you could offer would be a blessing. Thank you for your consideration and kindness.

        Stephanie – Somewhere, USA

        Clobbered by the Fed

        Hi Stephanie

        You and many others are getting clobbered by the policies of the Fed. Not only did taxpayers bail out the banks at taxpayer expense, Bernanke and the Fed continues to do so.

        By holding interest rates low, the Fed is hurting everyone on fixed income with savings in the bank or CDs. You get almost no interest on your savings, and that is robbing you and everyone else like you.

        Bernanke is hoping people like you gamble and invest in risky assets. Indeed, he is doing everything he can to force people into taking more risk.

        Don’t do it. It is not a prudent thing to do.

        The stock market is extremely overvalued here and could easily decline hard. Indeed, I think it will at some point.

        Emergency Fund in Cash

        My straight forward advice to everyone is to have an emergency fund of at least a year’s worth of living expenses in the bank before they invest in stocks, bonds, gold or anything other than short-term CDs or treasuries.

        It is obvious that Bernanke’s concern is doing what is best for banks. He shows no concern about the damage he is causing elsewhere.

        Bernanke is a Coward Hiding Behind Mathematical Formulas

        I wish I could get Bernanke in a room with you and everyone in your position, and take questions from you.

        Bernanke will not do that because he is a coward. He hides behind mathematical formulas, the same ones I might point out that told him housing was not in a bubble, there was no risk of recession, and that the unemployment rate would not top 8%.

        He did not know what he was doing then, and he certainly does not understand the risks now.

        Moreover, his “Quantitative Easing” policies have helped fuel speculation in commodities, especially food and gasoline. That speculation is contributing not only to rising prices in the US, but even more so globally.

        To be fair, there are some severe weather problems in other parts of the world that affect growing conditions and thus food prices. In addition, there is massive credit expansion in China and India that puts upward pressure on food and energy.

        However, there is also little doubt that Bernanke has fueled commodity speculation with his low interest rate policies and that too has pushed prices higher.

        Believe it or not, Bernanke is worried that prices might fall. I suspect you would love to see prices fall, and so would everyone else in your situation.

        Unfortunately, Bernanke intends to keep interest rates low until prices go up to his liking, and then when prices do start rising, interest you earn on your CD will not keep up with prices.

        Bear in mind, that the Fed excludes food and energy from the prices they monitor. They desperately want housing prices to rise. However, the Fed can make money available, but it cannot control where that money goes.

        Serial Bubble Blowing

        The Fed’s loose money policies fueled a housing bubble last time, now money is pouring into commodities, junk bonds, and leveraged buyouts (once again). This is bound to end badly once again.

        Meanwhile, the unemployment rates is still 9.4% officially, and much higher unofficially.

        Fed’s Policy Is Theft

        Stephanie, it’s a little known fact that inflation benefits those with first access to money, such as the banks, the wealthy (via rising asset prices), and the government (think rising sales taxes and property taxes when prices go up).

        Everyone else gets screwed. You are right in the middle of the pack of those most hurt by the serial bubble blowing policies of the Fed.

        Viewed this way, Bernanke’s policies are nothing but theft, robbing the poor, for the benefit of banks and the wealthy.

        This is why I support Congressman Ron Paul’s effort to end the Fed.

        No Good Solutions for Those on Fixed Income

        Your dilemma is 1-year treasuries yield a mere .23%.

        Unfortunately, I have no good investment solutions for you, because there are none. You are not suited for stock market risks, and if there is any chance you will need to use your savings any time soon, you cannot afford to risk being in long-term CDs.

        Arguably the best thing for you to do is find a bank that has 1% or higher rates on savings accounts.

        Avoid Fees

        There are some other common-sense things you can do. For example, it is critical for you to avoid all fees. If you have fees on your checking account now, find a place that does not have them. Bankrate can help on CD rates, savings rates, and checking account rates.

        Invest in a Freezer

        I do not know whether you have a home or an apartment, but if you have room, get a suitably-sized freezer and only buy meat on sale. The price of meat on sale is frequently 50% or less of meat not on sale.

        Wrapped properly, many food items will last a year or longer. Use freezer paper for roasts and date every package. Packaged bacon also freezes well. I only buy bacon when it is 2 for 1. If you are nimble, learn to cut your own chicken. If not, buy the cuts you like on sale and freeze those.

        Buy ground beef on sale and make patties the size you like and freeze those. Pork chops freeze well too. I use good quality plastic wrap doubled up. Costco has excellent quality wrap in a large spool that will last a very long time. Get all the air pockets out or you will get freezer burn.

        Vacuum packaged cheese also stores well. It needs to be refrigerated and can be frozen, but does not have to be frozen.

        Buy storable commodities such as spaghetti, pinto beans, brown rice, etc. on sale. Try not to buy anything unless it is on sale. Then buy large quantities.

      11. There is nothing better than a 
        Portobello Mushroom
        covered hickory smoked filet minion thick cut steak with the horns knocked off & a piece of tail later. 

      12. If I might add something to all of these excellent comments…a young Russian man (in his 20’s) I know asked the other day about land in the mountains in our particular state – how much it can cost, taxes, etc.).  We got to talking and it came out that he was asking because his father is looking to buy some land and he was assisting in the process, being better versed in English and the internet, I imagine.  As we talked further, he told me that his father had seen the collapse of the Soviet Union.  He could see the handwriting on the wall here in the USA and was making moves to protect his family.  This revelation, shared to me by the young man, was more scary than any of the articles I have read on the same subject because it hits home in a personal way.  The fact that he is drawing parallels from the country of his origin to ours is rather frightening.

        This is preaching to the choir to all of the regulars on this site, but to those of you that are new, take heed and start now preparing for the coming storm.

      13. Honest reporting is hard to come by these days. Thank you for keeping us informed. I agree with you – the signs are all around us for everyone to see. The sorry thing is that so many people just don’t get it! They are talking about the Super Bowl at work and the latest cell phone they just bought.  What can we do to wake up these people? I have tried to talk with some of my co-workers but they just roll their eyes.

        We are putting away as much food as possible. If your looking for great long term food storage at reasonable prices check http://www.ShelfRelianceSanAntonio.com. We buy almost everything through this company. The food tastes great! They even have a food planner to help you get started.

      14. GoldenFoxx: Mish is right about one thing ….. and wrong about another. Bernanke IS doing everything he can to protect the banks.

        But he also knows EXACTLY what he is doing. No one should think he doesn’t.

        Stephanie should cash her CD out when it matures. Buy silver with a third (5K), buy preps with a third (5K), and keep a third (5) in cash. Of the $5k liquid, keep a third in checking, and two thirds under your mattress.

        Take a thousand dollars and have a good time.

      15. i have some investment ideas for those of you who may be interested. i am not an investment advisor and can only relate to you some ideas that i have used to make money in the market.

        1) if silver is appreciating i buy AGQ.

        2) in the DJIA is declining i buy TZA, SRTY or FAZ.

        3) if oil is appreciating (like now) i buy ERX.  ERX is up 7% TODAY…

        when i get up enough courage i buy  call options of the above equities.

        good luck,

        your friend.


      16. I know one thing for sure, about the only item left on the store shelves during this time will be “Sea slugs, in their natural juices!”.

      17. I’ve got two more coats of varnish to get on the teak trim before I load the boat up with supplies/ballast, throw off the lines and sail for blue water and the hell out of Dodge.  I hope I don’t run out of booze before I hit rum island.  The double CC’s know how to turn on the auto pilot.  43 foot of water line, nicely making way.  It’s not the destination, it’s the ride.

      18. Some of Mish’s advice isn’t bad, like having a freezer. However; it sort of sounds like he’s given up on expecting deflation.

        When he says, “My straight forward advice to everyone is to have an emergency fund of at least a year’s worth of living expenses in the bank before they invest in stocks, bonds, gold or anything other than short-term CDs or treasuries.” and follows it up by saying this, “Unfortunately, I have no good investment solutions for you, because there are none.” you have to wonder.

        He obviously doesn’t expect #8. Banks will be closed and ATM’s will be out of money.  

        A years worth of expenses, that’s an awful lot of cash  (difficult to save it up too, especially for someone on a fixed income) cash that is losing purchasing power as the days go by, unless of course you’re expecting deflation along with lower prices, which the blurb above seems to indicate that Mish isn’t, so why would he suggest it?

        When Richard Daughty was asked, Does gold remain undervalued? He replied by saying, “Most definitely! And by a long, long shot, too!”

        But that’s not all Richard Daughty said…


      19. Comments…..We are having the ice storm of the century in Indianapolis; you cannot buy a generator anywhere in town; utility lines are only built to withstand 1/2 inch of ice, but we are looking for 2 by the time it is all done; weather channel predicts long-term power outages; wonder how my scoffing in-laws feel about me prepping now!  And they will surely be at my door!  Prepping makes sense!

      20. Mac to be honest there is not enough military manpower to etablish martial law .Even if the military manages to acquire all 1.5 million reserves and utilize 1 million of it’s total 1.5 million personnel in the Navy, Army, Marines, Air Force and Coast Guard, it would struggle to control 308-310 million citizens in a land mass of 9,161,966 sq km. For example there is 15,079 airports nationwide. You would need a significant amount of men to secure them. You also need troops to secure local,state,and federal buildings nation wide. There is about 20,00 incorporated place of where people live(cities,towns,villages).  Our military is 3 million men. About 500,000 of them will be used for logistics. Plus there is about 850,000 LEO,and 200,000 fed agents. This is very little to police 320 million people in an economic collapse. Think of it this way, in Iraq, when the insurgency started, what portion of the country was effectively controlled by the US Forces? Now think of the US, a population of over 250 million spread over a huge land mass. If things get dicey, I don’t know if the Federal Government will be able to control the situation for very long. They’ll very quickly become irrelevant. Control will be held at regional or levels or lower. America unlike Egypt has a much larger population,armed citizenry,divided heavily,heavily armed gangs with no morals and hatred for each other. So if there is an economic collapse the govt will be on the brinking point. It would be very difficult for the U.S. military to successfully implement martial law throughout the entire country at any given time. This would mean that they would have to secure hundred of thousands of neighborhoods, while securing all major airports, power stations, communication towers, water facilities, nuclear power plants, military bases, food distribution center, grocery stores, government official buildings and highways while keeping everyone in their homes after 6pm. They can attempt martial law like I can attempt to challenge Manny Paciquo to a street fight,it does not mean I wont get my ass kick. I pray this never happens that this great republic goes through an economic collapse that will put our nation in danger. If what happened in Egypt happened here the republic would be in chaos by now. Keep prepping,and buy as much ammo as possible because you will need it. And pray to God so this does not happen,chaos and bedlam is not fun. My grandparents were in Haiti during the uprising in 2004. It was total hell and chaos.

      21. MA: Martial law will only be necessary in the inner city of the big cities when the SHTF; primarily on the East and West Coasts, where those people who are inclined to loot and riot for any reason, like if their favorite team wins a championship, will begin a rampage. When a few of them are shot dead by the military and/or national guard, or by local shop owners, the rest will settle down.

        Martial law for Scottsdale Arizona?  LMAO! Never happen! Pass the champaigne and sushi!

      22. One thing we can learn.  Pay attention to the warning signs!!!!  So many American’s are still stuck there & hoping our govt will step in to get them out.  This has been going on for almost a week now.  Why didn’t they leave 6 or 7 days ago?  Sheeple.

      23. Goldenfoxx, about the freezer. I think it’s a great idea…. but…
        1. How much would such a freezer cost?
        2. What if power went out? I mean, I’d need an oil-powered generator to keep such a large appliance going, no?

      24. Mardochee… I have yet to disagree with anything you have ever posted. I come to the same exact conclusions, but what gets me is the wisdom you have at your age.  If you are ever in Michigan, look me up and I will buy you a beer……..

      25. Safeman..watch Craigslist, you should be able to get a large stand up for $150 or less.  I think a 5000 watt generator would be more than sufficient to keep it and many other things running.

      26. “This comment blew me away….coming from him. This man is a millionaire many times over and he is telling his clients to go into PM’s and out of the markets……WHAT DOES THAT TELL YOU?”

        In response to this, I am a business consultant and I know of several long term clients that are financial advisors and managers that are actually closing their businesses down before the end of this year.

        January 31st, 2011 at 3:42 pm

        Good advice–not like the guy on one site who announced he had paid two mortgage payments ahead and now when he could get more money,  he’d start prepping???
        I seriously laughed and thought—he has his priorities out of order.

        Durango Kidd
        January 31st, 2011 at 7:46 pm
        GoldenFoxx: Mish is right about one thing ….. and wrong about another. Bernanke IS doing everything he can to protect the banks.
        But he also knows EXACTLY what he is doing. No one should think he doesn’t.
        Stephanie should cash her CD out when it matures. Buy silver with a third (5K), buy preps with a third (5K), and keep a third (5) in cash. Of the $5k liquid, keep a third in checking, and two thirds under your mattress.
        Take a thousand dollars and have a good time.


        Agreed—but we keep no money in the bank–I order online something??  I cover that with just what’s needed; other than that, no money in the bank…we pay mortgage at Bank of A…the other little utilities, cash.
        I repeat, no money in the bank…they may keep all deposits when they have that ‘bank holiday’.

      29. Comments…..Safeman
        January 31st, 2011 at 10:42 pm
        Goldenfoxx, about the freezer. I think it’s a great idea…. but…
        1. How much would such a freezer cost?
        2. What if power went out? I mean, I’d need an oil-powered generator to keep such a large appliance going, no?
        ————-That was Mishe’s idea for an individual who e-mailed him. I see no flaw in Mishe’s opinion for a senior citizen.  We can go with what if’s unto you know what. Maybe giving her some peace of mind for having something stored goods will carry her through. Let me tell you this, I will care for the elderly before I care for the abled bodied cocoapuffer who has done nothing to sustain themselves–I have no sense of helping  those who pump babies out just so the taxpayer cares for them.

        I’ve been storing supplies and food for 2 years and have enough for two for over two years…forget freezer..we aren’t getting a generator because it’s too hard to store fuel, etc.

        Canned chicken dumplings, beefstew, salmon, tuna, chicken, turkey, small hams…all canned goods. spam, luncheon meat, potted meat, vienna sausage..

        If the electricity goes, how much gas can you store without a huge tank?? The neighbors will get free beef from us before I let it spoil..someone in this household ordered the half beef before thinking it through!!

      31. JJ: She needs to keep her checking account for open for her SS so maybe $500 in the bank. I don’t see a “bank holiday” coming, only QE2 and 3. If the banks are not operating the PTB have no money and cannot make a profit.

        It is THE essential service for them, which is why it will be available to US.

        Behind the power curve on food prepping? A little low on budget?
        Put in a years supply of oatmeal.
        You can cook it and eat it hot on a stove, fire, or in the microwave.
        You can pour some milk on it and eat it like cereal cold.
        You can pour some water on it and pretend it is milk.
        You can eat it dry like nuts.
        You can mix raisons and nuts in it if you got them to spice it up a little.
        It is pretty cheap to put in a years supply, and while you may not eat like a king the moochers and freeloaders are not going to be too thrilled either.  But if times get really bad, you and they will be grateful for it.
        I consider my supply of oatmeal my basic foundation for food prepping.  Everything after the oatmeal is gravy.

      33. My position has always been to think outside the box.  I too am a SS retired lady  and I don’t use a brick and mortar bank.  My SS check is direct deposited to a Visa card at one of  those online check cash places.  Direct deposit no fees. 

        Since the date of the deposit is fixed, on receipt of deposit, I immediately transfer to another Visa (same company)  to pay bills online and charge for purchases (like Costco and Sam) using $100 cash back each  transaction to drain account and have cash.  I can also get cash redrawals  from their outlet sites.  By end of the day, funds are either stuff or cash.  Nothing to be “holidayed”

        Over the last few years have brought three freezers – a compact and two mid size – from Sam’s all under $200 each.  Energy efficient.  I’ve “invested” in solar and wind.  My set up doesn’t run the whole place – but I can compartmentize  – as in running lights and several crock pots for cooking, freezers and water cool fans.  Reconfigure and can run apartment 110  washer and dryer (unplug freezers).  By mix and matching can live a comfortable lifestyle using most of the amneities I have.   

        It’s about the batteries and inverters.  I’m transitioning from a set of 12 year old (8) AGM glassmat to the ole 6D “cat” lead acid batteries as they have the thickest lead plates and I now know how to recondition (3 to 4 times).  The AGM’s still have some life and will be repurposed on other projects like dedicated to the communication rig.

        My investments have been in “preps” and there hasn’t been enough to have CD’s, so when I read let it “mature” isn’t that gambling?  That all is well?  Looking at current events, would it be better to have operational wind and solar, ham radio and supplies or a deposited CD????

      34. Ok I have to ask bc it keeps coming up: what the h is a cocoapuffer???

      35. If anybody has not herd yet MOUNTAIN HOUSE is OUT of  its #10 cans of its products !  Not a comforting thought . It is getting to a point  that Mr. and Mrs. America are waking up and prepping  now . meaning as time passes less and less will be available as more and more look to prepare. And last but not least time is just about up.

      36. Get out of the system, store pms, food water etc. don’t listen to Mish, he means well but he’s an office boy.It’s to late for most of you,should have figured out the flava in 07-08.We get farm goats chickens pigs dogs freezers.20ft containers with 2-3years supplies.Too many mushrooms out there won’t believe til there is blood in the streets some are my own family and friends. Pms are for AFTER when we need to rebuild. See Dmitri Orlov “Reinventing Collapse”.Pm,Rare earth,Potash. oil and Gas,resource stocks get certificates in hand for AFTER. This probably Won’t happen but just in case….. We are in the “Fourth Turning” See Martin Armstrong,FOFOA study learn adapt…
        Survival of the fittest is an ageless law of nature, but the fittest are rarely the strong. The fittest are those endowed with the qualifications for adaptation,the ability to accept the inevitable and conform to the unavoidable,to harmonize with the existing or changing conditions.

      37. JJ, dry ice as a back up is cheaper than a generator short term.  Double insulate the outside of the freezer and put a radio shack digital thermomiter probe inside with the display outside.  A Sundanzer freezer can be powered by 2 pv panels or AC & auto DC back up.  A 1KW generator is more than ample to keep it cold.  Quality only costs a few dollars more.

      38. @ Tom

        My first thought after reading your post about dry ice was doesn’t that put one in the “store” and harms way?  It’s a good idea – saw where the store keeps the dry ice in a compact freezer with insulated blanket on top. 

        Wonder if it would be practical and cost effective to pre-event and position??? 

      39. one think was left out, over here most everyone has a gun

      40. Mardochee and WW,
        Good statement. There are simply not enough of us (LEO”s) to go around rounding people up and taking there preps or guns. Not to mention, there are an awful lot of us who stand by the US Constitution and will not be participating. If things are bad enough, and we do show up for work in lieu of being with our families, we will stand by our oaths to ‘protect and defend the constitution’. From what I have seen, LEO in the western half of Michigan and the UP definitely have a harder leaning to the right and are believers in the 2nd Amendment, avid hunters, and the right of people to carry concealed weapons.
        I found this interesting in talking to a fellow LEO. We are both vets, active and National Guard, though I do not know what particular NG unit he is with, in Michigan or not. His unit is scheduled for a rotation through Iraq or Afghanistan in the next year, but oddly enough, they are not training for this during the 2 week annual drill this summer. Their training will focus on Field-Force, civil disturbance, and riots.

      41. Most dry ice factories are in industrial areas but I have seen it sold at Publics during hurricane season down in FL.  You can’t pre-stage store it for very long unless you keep it in a double insulated container that is completely full but it would be uncommon good sense before large ice storm or hurricane.  Even if the dry ice factory lost it’s electricity they would be open.  That’s when their best business is!  Get to know them at the front counter.  The trick is to have a freezer that is full which stays frozen much longer.  If it isn’t, fill jugs with clean water containers that you can drink out of or put jugs of milk in the freezer to top off before the electric goes out.  When you lose electricity, pull a frozen jug of milk/clean water out and put in top of fridge to help keep it cold.  Another trick is go to Lowes and get some shiny bubble aluminum roll insulation.  Cut a large piece and put on top of frozen food.  Up right chest freezers are best, they keep the cold air in when the door is opened.  If you get a radio shack temp gauge and play around with some dry ice with the freezer un-plugged you will see how long your freezer food will last.  3-4 ten inch long & one inch thick squares of dry ice will bring the internal temp down to 20-30 below zero for a 2-3 days.  Tape freezer door joint with aluminum tape also if you don’t have a generator and if your power is out.  You wouldn’t like to drive around in a rental car that doesn’t have a gas gauge that doesn’t work, why would you have a freezer full of vacuumed meat without a temp gauge? 

      42. 11Bravo….it does scare me that so many think the “PO-leese” are the enemy and are going to  kill them at the first sign of civil unrest.  This is going to cause them to just start shooting at every uniform they see, which will in turn bring about the state sponsored violence they fear, or force all of the LEO’s to quit, which will leave NO protection for those who have not thought to prepare to protect themselves.  There are some bad eggs in every group, but I know a number of cops/sherriffs and they are all on our side and will NOT go against us, unless of course they have to start defending themselves. I think the ones you have to worry about are the big city cops, they are the most cynical and ptone to violence after years of dealing with scum.

        Yes you are right, most everyone outside of Metro Detroit  (where the ghetto folks and the yuppies  are democrats), and some  pockets of entitlement leeches (one of our Northern counties has one of the largest government dependent populations per capita in the country) are very “right” leaning.

        Gerrymandering and the unions are the only reason we have been under lefty control for so long, and why we been reduced to  third world country like conditions in the city of Detroit.

      43. oh, and 11bravo, thank you for your service……

      44. I keep forgetting to tell you all,   A book destined to be a classic is out on the shelves, “As Wind in Dry Grass”, by H. Grant Lewellyn.  Its about a prepper, a loner, who finds himself in the middle of what we all talk about on here. A fascinatingly good story, its very reminiscent of something the Guy who wrote “The Road” and “No country for old men” would write.

        Its not overwhelming by any means, but there are comments made by characters in the story that may make you think the author is racist, and others that make you think the exact opposite (the white hero has a only been in love with a black woman).  It is very contradictory but some of it can be taken the wrong way by sensitive people.   I think the racial /antisemitic stuff is just the author showing that it still does exist to some extent in EVERY race and group, that it always will, and that it does have some impact on humanity’s actions/fate  .  Read the whole book before you make any judgements on this aspect of it or you will miss out. 

        Either way, it is a grisly, sad, yet fantastical story of the end of America.  The author for sure reads websites such as this  along with the conspiracy websites as everything from 9/11 to vaccines, to chemtrailing, NWO, ewtc, etc are covered. The author is not taking a side or agreeing with any of the conspiracy theories, but he knows his characters well (the ones who will be part of the post survival scene). It is very current (obama is the president) and VERY apropo!!  I litereally read it in 2 nights, I couldn’t put it down.

        Albert Smythe is  going to be mentioned in the same sentences as John Galt and  Randy Bragg.

        Heres the link…


      45. I want to make a disclaimer, I am in no way affiliated with the book I recommended, I would just feel derelict if I didn’t let you all know about it, it is THAT GOOD!!  Rawles book “Patriots” dealt with the current situation and possible outcome,  but can’t compare in writing and story quality as Lewllyn shows us in this book. (no offense James, I still liked yours well enough as yours is more informational, but his story is art)

      46. When I lose electricity, I flip the transfer switch and operate on the PV solar that normally feeds back to the grid. 

        Highly recommend it.

      47. Who run Barter Town?  Nabisco

      48. Comments…..I have been seriously prepping for the past 2 years.  I am not looking forward to the second half of this year.  My kids live in a large city close to 400 miles south and I worry whether they will make it up to my homestead or not.

        If Americans can not see the writing on the walls today, they will not be able to see it until they are hit over the back of the head with what is to come.

        I am set up pretty well, but feel and need to get in more medical supplys.

        Good luck to all of you.

      49. I’ve considered a generator myself, but unless it is ultra-quiet, I think it draws the undue attention of the have-nots. My first thought would be (If I were of that mindset), “If they have a generator, bet they have lots of other stuff in there worth protecting”.

        Just a thought.

        In terms of fridge and freezer, start prepping with several rectangular holes dug on your property, away from the line of sight of the main road or traffic area, and in a shaded area. Make it secluded. Insert a good size Coleman cooler or two, fill it with your food, and close the lids. Ongoing temp will keep you in the safe, low 50-ish degree range for refrigeration. Add your dry ice for frozen goods. Maybe one with (freezer), one without (fridge).

        Spend a little time putting together a nice  cover to camouflage it all, made from wood, pallets, rebar, or the like. Be creative. Set it into a nice groove that runs the perimeter of your coolers, the width of your homemade lid/cover, so that it stays flush with the surrounding terrain. ‘Install’ surrounding vegetation to the lid. No one will have a clue, unless they know what they’re looking for. The Coleman lid and additional cover lid you create will keep the animals out. Your food will stay cool. And access will be easy when you need it.

        Refrigeration on a permanent basis, bo matter what happens to the electricity around you.

        Good luck!

      50. Willie, thanks for the book review. Adding it to my Kindle today!

      51. The most quiet generator that I haven’t heard was a few pv panels on the backside of a roof.  Next to that was a honda EU3000is on a 20-50% load. 

      52. You can baffle your generator inside the garage in a by containing it within an insulated box with an exhaust hose  going thru a window, etc.

      53. One hopeful lesson we can take from the crisis in Egypt is the way when law and order broke down and looking began citizens within neighborhoods for groups to keep their community safe. Crisis seems to bring out the best and worst qualities in human beings. For sure some will seek to take advantage of the lawlessness, but many, many more people will band together for mutual protection. We’re social primates and tribalism is hardwired into our DNA. Many of us would secretly revel at suddenly feeling useful to our communities, rather than the apathetic consumers we are while things are going smoothly.

      54. Your backup generator should be a large (multi-fuel) unit, custom fit with a large car muffler, mounted inside the garage, and plumbed out the back wall into a thickly brushed area (roses and other thorny plants work well).  If you’re really handy, you can construct a sound-insulated box for it to be mounted in to keep the noise in the garage to a minimum.  Running the exhaust into an exterior sound-insulated box offers the ultimate in noise control.

        Oh, and by “large”, we mean a minimum of 8000 running watts, enough to power the average 3-4 bedroom home.  It should be connected to a back-up panel (baloney cord is OK) and make sure that the main house power is off when the generator is in use.

      55. My Generator  has a very quiet muffler..but a few years back when we went thru that power grid down on the NE..it was just enough to make me think of how to shut it up more..

        a Hole in the ground…with a small roof..and in the roof..a box fan to keep the air circulating around the generator to keep it cool..

        walk about 15 feet away..cant hear it

        as far as a freezer..my climate is taking care of that now..but in the summer, thats a different story.

        seasons can play a big role in what you have and how it will or wont work for you at that time.

        dont forget your already stored water…do you know where its at in your home? even if you havent bought any bottled water.
        think about it…gallons of clean water already stored in your home, and you didnt bring it in….do you know how to get to it? and where it is?

      56. So long as you can feed that large generator.  Can you imagine $10/gal fuel?  Once you have a high quality tri-fuel small generator, then it makes more cents to purchase a diesel or propane 1800 rpm gen set over 8KW.  Water cooled/1800 rpm steps up into quality.  The cheap “portable” gen sets that brag about high amps don’t have the constant rating output after the gen head warms up (30 minutes).  You get what you pay for and you can’t return it.  Generatorsales.com has the best selection I’ve seen.


        sd..you’re views on oatmeal are my views on rice–I have a Coleman camp stove; stocking up on Coleman camp fuel….that and a wood/coal military tent stove can see us through for a long time.

        50 lb bag–500 servings…$22.00

        Stock up!!


        Thanks–Tom..appreciate it—my problem has been for  months before the beef arrived…food or generator…I just never got to that point of..”okay, enough supplies and food”..now let’s go to LOwe’s!!
        We have been using SS check for stocking…use if before we lose it attitude…
        I also feel setting the thermostat at the lowest will help save if we lose electricity.
        Thanks for the info for this ‘budget’ conscience household.

        If it isn’t, fill jugs with clean water containers that you can drink out of or put jugs of milk in the freezer to top off before the electric goes out.  When you lose electricity, pull a frozen jug of milk/clean water out and put in top of fridge to help keep it cold. 

        Thanks, Tom..you’re just full of info—I have heard about the full freezer…full freezer= lots more cold ??

      60.      Looters shot on site here after Katrina.  Military did a cameo four days later, then left.  Local PD non-existent.

      61. Thermodynamics, physics & a little bit of chemistry JJ. 

        Insulating an air cooled gen set “can” cause problems.  Depends on the air flow on engine & gen head.  The new variable speed pure sine wave gens are best, one cools the other.  The engines only speed up to put out more amps while saving fuel and are safe for electronics.  A large aux transmission oil cooler can be plumbed to an older gen set oil drain.  I’ve done it to a honda EM3500 (dual lines) but you MUST have the correct fittings to screw into block or you will crack the engine block from vibration & stress.  The external tranmission oil cooler acts as a heat sink which enables the gen set to have other options avail.

      62. Go Rural Now – The farther off the grid the better. Now is the time -  tomorrow is too late. 

        I am already there – way off the grid in Northern Canada – ready to rock. Unlimited streams, Unlimited fish, Unlimited firewood, Unlimited Animals to hunt,  Get the picture ???

        Go Now!

      63. One more thing – when driving into Canada, with your 4×4 loaded with survival gear,  just say you are “going camping and fishing for about a month.”  Have printouts of National Parks / Provincial Parks / Lakes, etc. that are open year round in case they ask specifics. No sweat !!  Welcome to Canada .

      64. The other thing you can do is install one of those big steel rings in the concrete of your garage floor (near to the door), and then run a grade 7 (not regular old grade 3) chain through the frame of the generator and then lock it to the steel ring and close the door.  Add a sign that says “Owner does not call 911!” and viola!, you’re all set!  Make sure that you have NRA decals in plain sight on your vehicles, and leave some empty shotgun hulls laying around……Even an idiot will get the message.

      65. Hi OUT THere????I just came across this articel about Egypt.-I find it very interresting to se that some peopel having eys and commen sence but the majorety are brainles?or they hope things wont happen.?WRONG-There is one “”””SCENARIO”NO ONE hase paid “ATTENTION” The “MEGA 2012 SOLAR STORM>Wich will be a real test for those wich have made comments about the Middel east revolution.Please  “CITICEN” get ready for that test for “Survivel”A lots of peopel have loughed at me,saying “”ANOTHER Y2K?dumm morons a total different scenario.I ask the Qustion”:Whey hase Bill Gates-and the Rockefellers “FINANCED” the “SEED VOULT” in Norway in the Permafrost region and have collectet all availebel Seeds in a case of a natural Dissaster????So man kind can strat again?Also in the 80tis they startet to built 5 underground “CITYS”???also in Norway will be finnisch this year2011?Just IMAGEN what will happen when there is no Electricity world wide  when this solar storm willhit HE?All thos e prudent suggesrions will be very “USEFULL” for that “EFENT”So please click on the net “SOLAR STORM2012WARNING”and any similar websites on that .Also dont believe that it will be the end of the world,far from it,the good book{if one beliefe it}SAYS–NO one knows the Hour ,eithe me {Jesus christ him self}or the Engel only THE Father.AmenLuke Chpt21–.My self I went thrue hard schip and hunger in war thorn Europe  and for that reason I am fully aware  when the SH–t hits the fan.Get READY>we are in the “END TIME OF THE HUMAN RACE.Judments are comming,Noah preached 120 yrs of a flood and they loughd at him untill the flood came and took them away.-I only can say have Faith in our Maker and be of good cheer trust in his protection,solong you are obidient in his Law.all the best.Hubert——–

      66. I believe everyone should find other ways of making an income at home and working  it as hard as you would for an employer.  Save as much as you can and find ways to pay off your bills as fast as possible this would help you and the country.  It’s also good for the environment as well, because you wouldn’t need to drive to work everyday thus saving money on gas. Whitch by the way I have heard others like the news that gas prices will top $5.00 a gallon by the end of summer or earlier. If your like me and you have nowhere else to go or can’t afford to leave then concentrate on yourself and your families good wealth and health.

      67. This is the site I check daily for solar flares ” http://www.swpc.noaa.gov/“. Yesterday when I couldn’t get my cell or laptop to work the right way I checked and we had a minor radio flare up.  I highly recommend a dehydrator as well as the extra freezer. This site shows how easy it is for newbies to get started.
        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DfQg0hzFihM&playnext=1&list=PLF11C16F2856F4096. It really is just that simple. Try to ‘go off the grid’ for a week at home and you will quickly realize what you’re lacking 🙂 That way you can fix the problem now rather than when it’s too late.

      68. yeahhh well i know the solar storms are coming

        but i cant afford to prepare

        believe me I know what I need
        I know where i need to go

        JUST CAN’T DO IT!

        THis new world order is designed to bring depression to the burst of spirituality taking place

        DONT LET IT


        There is a truther on EVERY street corner in EVERY town in EVERY country

        A tiny flame can brighten up a pitch black room
        But no amount of darkness CAN EVER shut out a well lit room


      69. get a volcano grill (you can use it with propane, charcoal or wood); get a Ghillie kettle (you can use pretty much everything, even dung to get the water going – to make oats or coffee). Store soap, buy a washing board (how else are you going to do laundry?) + tub,
        make your own toothsoap (olive oil, coconut oil, dr.bronner’s soap, essential oil = mix = excellent). store tooth brushes and floss etc. Invest in good sleeping bags for whole family and get lots of candles.
        last but not least be saved through Yeshua! HE is the only way to be save after you are done with all this rubbish.
        German greetings to all!

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        It’s triggered by the fire displayed in the article I browsed. And after this article 10 Things We Can Learn From Egypt About Preparing for Economic and Societal Collapse. I was excited enough to drop a comment 🙂 I do have 2 questions for you if it’s allright.
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