The following article has been contributed by Craig Hasten of The Warning Signs, a web site which provides regular commentary on identifying the signs of collapse and what you can do to prepare now.
SHTF Plan Editor’s Note: In the following article, Craig puts forth the very plausible suggestion that what we are seeing unfold in Egypt and throughout the Middle East could become reality here in America. At the onset of the crisis in 2008, those of us who discussed continued economic malaise and the global problems to come were branded as tin foil hat wearing conspiracy theorists, but many of the forecasts we made are coming to pass: Riots in the streets, insolvency of global financial institutions, sovereign debt defaults, rising unemployment, higher food costs, lower wages, and ever increasing values of hard assets in terms of paper currencies.
Though political uprisings and protests are, for the time being, isolated to the middle east and some smaller European countries, as governments and the power elite continue their interventionist policies of wealth destruction of the middle class and enrichment of the aristocrats and corporate powerhouses, we can expect to see the system as we have come to know it progressively deteriorate. As Craig rightly points out, the people can only take so much, and when austerity measures (forced spending cuts) take hold and inflation begins to run rampant, the people will get poorer. Craig asks, “What would happen if the welfare, food stamps and unemployment payments ceased?” What would people do if the dollar collapsed and commerce came to a stop because of looting and the public’s inability to procure goods through the use of our existing currency system? I think most of us know the answer.
At this point, the coming collapse of our currency, our inability to pay our debts, and the trillion dollar burdens of entitlement programs cannot be stopped. Hard times are imminent – for millions, they’re already here. While concerned Americans can continue to work to change the system for the better, it is clear that the coming tidal wave of disaster cannot be stopped. Millions of our fellow Americans will eventually take to the streets, because they simply didn’t see it coming and won’t have any other choice except to make choices that they would abhor today. The only thing you, as an individual, can do is prepare for the worst, and do it now. Be prepared to depend on yourself, family and close friends during this coming period of “restructuring,” as Craig refers to it. If it happens, and we believe that the warning signs all point to this possibility becoming reality, it will be chaotic, violent and dynamic, meaning you need to expect the unexpected.
Dangers of the Mob Mentality and the Coming Dollar Collapse
By Craig Hasten
How sad it is to see what is playing out in Egypt. What turned out to be an uprising for new leadership which had support from the rest of the free world, has now turned into a post Katrina nightmare. The initial energy of the protests which had originally been channeled in a positive way has been derailed by the ugliness of a mob mentality.
The latest wave of violence has been most notable for the widespread looting, indicative of the scale of the breakdown in law and order. Yesterday mummies in the country’s national museum were destroyed by looters attempting to steal the treasures of King Tutankhamen. One statue, believed to be of Tutankhamen, was broken into two pieces by the thieves, although officials said they hoped to be able to repair it.
Gangs of thugs have cleared out supermarkets, shopping malls and stores, as well as luxury homes and apartments in affluent residential areas in the suburbs. Gangs of armed men attacked at least four jails across Egypt before dawn today, helping to free hundreds of Muslim militants and thousands of other inmates as police vanished from the streets of Cairo and other cities.
Watching these events unfold, I can only wonder how a crisis of this magnitude would play out in the United States. How many people would be prepared if the infrastructure of our country came to a halt? What would happen if the shelves at the grocery stores were empty because trucking lines halted deliveries for fear of the mobs of looters? What would happen if the welfare, food stamps and unemployment payments ceased? What would happen if the mob came down your street, going door to door, taking whatever or whomever they choose? Would you be prepared for the ugliness that would descend upon you and your loved ones? We all saw how quickly society can break down during the Katrina disaster. In a matter of hours New Orleans went from normal, to post-apocalyptic, something the residents in that city never dreamed could happen to them. So I say to you….ARE YOU READY?
Due to the monetary policy of our government you are seeing a rapid decline in the value of the US dollar and it is only going to get worse over time. With 14 trillion dollars of debt the US is swimming in a sea of red ink. It is only a matter of time before the US is forced to default on this debt and we experience a collapse on the dollar. Now, I am surely not suggesting that this will be the end of the US as a nation, but merely a period of restructuring. This period will be nothing more that the country going to bankruptcy court to relieve themselves of the debt that it is drowning in, which will be good for the country but very hard on it’s citizens.
Sit back for a moment and imagine how well the government would function if this scenario plays out. Our government has a hard enough time functioning when times are good, imagine the chaos during a default. For starters, all checks written by the government would stop. Once again, sit back and ponder that for a minute. How many government employees would show up for work if they were not sure if they would be getting paid? A lot of services you take for granted would cease immediately.
Now what do you think is going to happen when the welfare, unemployment and food stamp payments cease? How long do you think it will take for the mob mentality to surface? I am going to bet that you will see post Katrina mob mentality within hours of the government announcing their intentions of defaulting. I say this because when this happens all banking and credit card transactions will stop meaning you will not have access to money in any form. People will realize that the food and other essentials in their possession is all they have and they will realize that they are not prepared for the uncertain times ahead. Needless to say, things will go to hell quickly! People will be desperate for food, water and other basic necessities and desperate people do desperate things.
I believe that the US will almost certainly be forced to abandoned the dollar and form a new currency. I foresee this new currency being strictly electronic at first since there will not be time to print and distribute the necessary amount of money needed for a full currency conversion of all paper dollars in the public hands. Eventually you will be able to convert the old dollar into the new currency but I think this will be several months down the road.
I realize that 99% of those who will read this will dismiss me as a tin foil hat wearing nut job and I’m fine with that. As long as I and the other 1% heed my warning and take the necessary steps needed to prepare themselves for a time of crisis I will be happy.
Visit The Warning Signs web site for more informative and insightful commentary and analysis.
Certainly what is happening in Egypt is shocking but only because we have never witnessed this type of scenario unfold to the extent that it has in Egypt. However the events taking place today were predicted to take place thousands of years ago by the prophet Isaiah. Is.19:1-22. When we look at thinks going on in the world we become alarmed and saddened. But from Gods perspective this was all part of Gods devine plan. God doesn’t screw up. Egypt, Asyria and Isreal will become one paving the way for the coming of the Lord. You won’t ofcourse here about this on the MSM. Its only in the bible.
Jesus Christ is coming and he will spare all believers the coming wrath upon the earth. The secret is to believe in him with your hearts. Its not to late to invite him into your hearts. Today.
Craig asks, “What would happen if the welfare, food stamps and unemployment payments ceased?â€
As long as they are able to print dollars, there is no reason to think this would happen. They have clearly demonstrated ( despite the occasional fake/feeble protest ) that they will print to oblivion and beyond, so WHY would they risk the social chaos you see in the middle east now by stopping ? The lack of buyers of our debt is becoming increasingly meaningless as well, since the FED seems to be willing to “buy” any amount of it with made up money.
SO, the crux of the point is not will they ever stop the checks/EBT cards/whatever…..it is:
WHEN will the rest of the world stop taking our dollar for real goods (like oil ) ?
They SHOULD have stopped a long time ago…but they are fooling themselves, just like we are, into believing an endless supply of paper has value as long as they can pass that hot potato off to someone else for real goods. AND they are racing us to the bottom to devalue their currency faster than us ( if possible ) so they can continue to send exports out.
OK….at SOME point, somebody has to say “HEY…this is Bullchit”…then everybody back up the chain will start demanding REAL MONEY, or goods, for their goods/services.  THAT’S the point of game over.
When ?  I dunno. I was thinking it should have been about 10 years ago, or more…..shows what I know, huh ?
But I still think the day is coming. World players, like China, are trying to position themselves in the best ‘bunker’ for when this day comes….buying up commodities, doing farm land contracts all over the place, and so on…..anything to get rid of their pile of US paper.
I don’t know WHAT will spark the final collapse, it may simply be compound interest on the debt that finally shows the emperor has no clothes…but I’m convinced the day is coming.
Another place to look at and its possibilities of this happining is Venesuela..Dictator..dick head and suppression for many many years ..Hugo Chavez..needs to go too
probably not a lot of people know how ruthless and corrupt this guy is
OOps that comment was supposed to go on the column “Europe’s Next”..my bad
What’s happening in Egypt could NEVER happen in the U.S. because Americans lack the BALLS to organize, protest & riot like that. If you want to get an idea of what a population is TRULY capable of, you just need to witness them in action during any major sporting event.
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Take any soccer game riot for example. Be it in Argentina, France or Egypt; when the fans face-off against the police and one of them is captured, all the rest of their fellow fans will openly attack the cops with sticks and bottles and punches until their companion/s is liberated and snatched away from being arrested.  They will overturn & burn cops cars if necessary. That’s called ESPRIT DE CORPS and you DON’T have that in the U.S.
In America, I’ve seen four lousy cops wade into a crowd of DOZENS of out of control fans during a disturbance in order to successfully pull out & arrest someone WHILE ALL THE REST STAND BY AND DO NOTHING about it. And the reason for that is quite clear and it’s twofold: on the one hand it’s due to the fact that Americans have been completely brainwashed into subservience and fear of authority and on the other is the fact that Americans are only ‘brave’ when it comes to sending a Predator drone to kill 12 year-olds in their sleep.
I agree with TnAndy – they will keep inflating the money supply till it’s worthless and we can’t buy oil any longer – then inflation will go rampant with fuel cost soaring and supply lines breaking down.Â
Everybody should stock up as much as possible (what was the “other 1%”?).
The picture looks like a scene out of middle amerika city park in the South. Probably from the ban of smoking, the Feds don’t ban guns in certain parks. Head shot anyone? They sell HD tin foil in non-stick now but you can’t make as many new hats from one roll! Were going to call it Pam Sam, your insurance company so the salmon doesn’t stick and take out your car window.
There is no telling how bad it could get.
The great blizzard of 2011 in Mid America, Â left grocery store’s shelves empty and even caused many stores to close.
If it can get that crazy, for just a snow storm that last only a day or two,  then what happens, if we do get a financial  collapse,  that shuts down banks, ATMs, and all credit  business?
I better go buy more ammo.
I don’t want to hear about how all this upcoming suffering is part of God’s plan. You can’t base faith on fear. People need hope. To say the only way to know Christ is through the apocalypse isn’t helping, nor is at all constructive, nor is it–I might say–very Christian. Remember that the concept of rapture began in 1830.
Jesus said to give it ALL away. Your cloak, your shoes, everything. Now if you want to live a Christian life, you’ll need to be prepared to live that way. I can tell many among you are gathering up ammunition and food to last through the coming storm is the way to go. Wrong. Possessions aren’t the key to spiritual growth, they are actually a hinderance. See also Matt 19:21
The Bible states that people have a natural inclination to try and accumulate the things they needs, then shut the castle gates. See too Luke 11:21.
To sit waiting for signs is laziness. People need to work together. This restructuring is an opportunity, as the Hopi and Mayans foretold. We have a choice: cower in fear or face our fears. I’d say first off get to know your neighbors. Start a garden. Tend chickens. As much as the sole road warrior-type picture might dominate our fantasies, survival will depend more on who you know. Already these Community Survival Groups (CSGs) of 15-25 people are forming. They barter among themselves, try to line up jobs, and share vital information.
As great as it is to develop a personal relationship with God, Christianity is about sharing, caring, and forgiveness. This should no more be an excuse to hate and kill than it is to sing kumbaya and go unprepared. If we’re going to get through this–and we will, albeit in a different form–it’ll rely on cooperation and kindness. Diversify your business ventures as well, according to Ecc 11-2
And I’ll leave you with Matthew 6:25:
“…put away anxious thoughts about food and drink to keep you alive, and clothes to cover your body. Surely life is more than food, the body more than clothes. Look at the birds of the air; they do not sow and reap and store in barns, yet your Heavenly Father feeds them. You are worth more than the birds! Is there a man of you who by anxious thought can add a foot to his height.”
Amen Covington!! Amazing watching God’s plan unfold. I’m ready!
Has anybody here purchased a StoveTec GreenFire Flex-M MK2 as per previous article? Looking for review from somebody here that I trust.Â
Regarding Ben Dover’s remarks above, I have to disagree that American’s are so pussy whipped. We’re just as vicious as anybody else, but we are only just now beginning to feel the frustration and anger that comes from being ignored by our government and leaders. People that live under dictatorships just have zero options for expressing anger. They can’t vote the bums out of office, so to speak. They’re stuck. The Egyptians have been getting dumped on for decades (centuries?) and they are just plain fed up and pissed off angry. If our political system continues to work for the elite but ignores the common man, then we’ll get like the Egyptians too. Americans are just not there yet . . . give it time and we’ll get there too.
By the way, governments don’t usually default by refusing to pay their debts, they just pay their debts with funny money. It’s a way to kick the can down the road and let the collapse happen while the next politician is in office, but the effect to the population and the savers is far worse. Inflation destroys society from within. That’s why our Founding Fathers refused to allow a central bank in our constitution.Â
Video for  StoveTec GreenFire Flex-M MK2.
1% of the population being prepared is not enough!!! Can you imagine how bad it would be for the 1% of us if 99% were trying to get to our stores of food? It would be a nightmare. (good reason to keep your storage a secret)
Keep working on your friends and family (without revealing too much about how much you have). I’ve gotten 2 family members to start stocking up by telling them that they are saving money by doing it because of food inflation. I told them that if food inflation for 2011 is 6% & they are earning 1% in their savings account, which is a better investment?
Ben:Â The Boeing Global Hawk kicks arses better.
Ben: Sorry, my bad, the Global Hawk is built by Northrop Grumman not Boeing. Do they call it soccer there?
This sounds a lot like an article I read back in August 2009.
http://www.grandpappy.info/honehour.htm
The One Hour Meltdown by Robert Atkins portrays an economic meltdown as a event that will bring out the worse in people in a very short time. I agree with GA Mom that discretion regarding your preps will be needed. No one will want to leave there home when food riots and mob rule make it virtually impossible to travel anything. Such an event could force you to make due with what you already have, because it would simply be too dangerous to be out in public.
Good Luck To All
The Normalcy Bias
The normalcy bias refers to a mental state people enter when facing a disaster. It causes people to underestimate both the possibility of a disaster occurring and its possible effects. This often results in situations where people fail to adequately prepare for a disaster, and on a larger scale, the failure of the government to include the populace in its disaster preparations. The assumption that is made in the case of the normalcy bias is that since a disaster never has occurred that it never will occur. It also results in the inability of people to cope with a disaster once it occurs. People with a normalcy bias have difficulties reacting to something they have not experienced before. People also tend to interpret warnings in the most optimistic way possible, seizing on any ambiguities to infer a less serious situation.
Denial
Denial is a defense mechanism, in which a person is faced with a fact that is too uncomfortable to accept and rejects it instead, insisting that it is not true despite what may be overwhelming evidence. The subject may use:
simple denial – deny the reality of the unpleasant fact altogether
minimisation – admit the fact but deny its seriousness
projection– admit both the fact and seriousness but deny responsibility.
Per an article on BBC news (MidEast), in 2008 Egypt unemployed
was 2.3 million: in 2020, it’s expected to be 7.1 million. Hmmm,
let’s see, that’s because the population is expected to explode their
in the next nine years. Where all all the pictures of the cute little
Egyptian rug rats? Those people (and I can name a whole lot more)
are breeding like rabbits! TOO MANY RATS IN THE CAGE!
Something has to give, knowwhamsayin, bra?
I agree, storing and buying food is better than lower interest rates in banks.  Problem is space for some; also make sure you rotate, as after y2k, many threw out food that expired incl canned stuff and dry cereals, etc.  Eat what you buy/store and  rotate.  Another way to beat inflation, buy ammo, extra coats/jackets, socks, jeans, shoes, camping gear, etc.  If things get bad enough styles won’t change much,  so buy classic styles.  I have known several people who died with “tons” of preps; much was thrown out by heirs, except for the guns, pm’s and a lot was sold too.
So this becomes interesting ,Egypt controls the Suez canal, Yemen controls the entrance to the Red Sea. Most US and Western European oil flows through those conduits.
 Our Head Puppet , has effectively slowed oil production in the US and is bringing down other fossil fuel production in the name of green. This puts us at the mercy of those who control the supply our oil imports (except Canada). The oil supply also influences our food supply (fertilizer, transportation, packaging, etc.). So how soon before we are also rioting in the streets to protest high food prices and shortages? We are approaching the that possible  point. Don’t assume we are different than them, we are not, we are just not hungry yet.
Prepping for the food end of things is very prudent, and most people just take it so much for granted
And having a long term plan for any long term problem, or loss of support system.
Hell some people i know dont even know what simple camping skills are, and others i work with that would simply be dead in a matter of weeks.
For many reasons one would believe that the geo-political economic problems are not accidental. That being said there is a goal in mind. One thing those that are truly in power need is a global police force. That in a nutshell is the purpose of the USA and has been since post WWII. Â Without it all the wealth in the world is ripe for the taking from the haves to the have nots be it nation, group or group of nations.
Whatever minimum level of political stability to maintain the above will be necessary. If the USA gravitated into anarchy the government could loose control of the military at a maximum and the ability to export US military power at a minimum because of it’s deployment at home.
Will there be some shortages at times? Yes. Well there be civil disorder at times? Yes. Will it become a Mad Max Movie? No.
In the end will the US standard of living along with that of the developed world will lower as the developing world rises? You bet. I still prefer taking my chances here. I would rather fall from wealth than climb from poverty. As a blue collar man that managed to stay employed for 30 years I made a living the BRIC citizens could only dream about and obtained considerable assets along the way. Those that bought McMansions and are saddled with the associated debt to a great degree made their own bed.
The prudent need to prepare for many eventualities and for that reason smoke alarms and fire extinguishers are sold. I years supply of food? Na.
Never under estimate Saudi to the East of the ditch VRF or the bear. What have they purchased in arms in the last decade? Never under estimate my faith!!!! I will never show you my birth certificate. Government must have a roll to play….
Oreo Cookie
I love the website, My tin foil hat is normal here… Prep On !
Comments….. Don’t know if anyone has heard about the natural gas outage affecting, New Mexico, Texas, and parts of Arizona. Her’s a blog from someone in the middle of it.
Thursday, February 3, 2011
When the Heat Shuts Down
There’s no pressure in the natural gas pipeline from Texas running west and north, given Arctic temperatures and peak demand. In my northern New Mexico nook, it was -20 F this morning; some neighbors in frost pockets woke to 25 below zero. Water pipes are bursting all over the high desert and mountains.
The electricity has failed, just now. Writing this on battery. Probably from all the electric heaters plugged in today. The local hardware store had a mob scene and a fight break out when the last heater went out the door this morning.
Businesses have had to close. NatGas may not be restored for 2-3 more days. Nights will be sub-zero. Those with woodheat are taking in neighbors and family. Those who’ve invested in solar voltaics are comfortably off-grid and have bought something real, in an economy running on the fumes of gizmos made in offshore manufactury.
Camping skills and infrastructure fixed my supper (solar oven) and heated water (solar shower.) Thank God for sunlight.
Yeehah, electricity just came back on. House lit by beeswax candles in the interim. We are living so close to the bone. Emergencies happen to people, and we’ve waged resource wars instead of investing in infrastructure repair and innovation.
http://wayfaringtraveler.blogspot.com/2011/02/when-heat-shuts-down.html
I believe what is happening in Egypt will eventually come to our country. I live in north Texas and we have experienced the worst weather that I have ever experienced in my 52 years of being on this earth. I have not left my home for 3 days. I am so thankful I have been prepping. The grocery stores are empty. I agree with Terry’s post. We were brought up to be proud Americans and that our government had a best interest at heart. We wake up to realize that is not true. I was unemployed for almost a year and I finally was able to land a good paying job again. Only Mona and Laura M. defended the people that were were on unemployment. Now, after a few months my job will be going south…like to Costa Rica. Americans are getting fed up. I’m sick and tired of it. People in our country are going to get to a point where they say ENOUGH is enough. I am praying that day will not come soon. I have been trying to prepare the best I can and payoff debt. I have faith that the God that I serve will help and protect me. My prayer is that all of you will be safe when the SHTF.  May Yahweh(God) bless your efforts and protect you.
The day Americans become capable of THIS, is the same day you’ll get REAL “change you can believe in” from your government. Â
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_3LVgeOTjqg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SaGw42DUILU
Comments….. The currency re-valuation is coming very soon. Why do you think the Chinese just made a visit to the US?? The rest of the non illuminati billionaires of the world have had enough. led by the chinese, and backed by the rest of the world, this new currency will be metals, and commdity based. details are being worked out.  All this is coming about now, because the comex metals market is going to be exposed as having no gold that they were supposed to be holding for these world billionaires, and goverments. In other words—the jig is up.
    Just follow the money trail.  Why do you think the government has been printing, and spending like mad?? They know their time is almost up. The FED is done for. The US treasury will take over printing of money again, backed by precious metals and commodities. The reset we have all been waiting for is close.Â
     There are many issues to be resolved. There is current news on the revaluation of the Iraqi denar. Google up currency revaluation, and follow the story.  It is happening now.  The changeover will happen in the similiar to when China took over Hong Kong. The swap to the new Chinese dollar took a while.
     Do yourself a favor, and start checking currency revaluation stories behind the scenes. It is happening NOW!!!
Unlike Egypt, or Euroweenies, Americans are armed to the teeth. If we are so soft, I invite Ben Dover to take a walk in some of the backstreets of our big cities – whassa matter – scared? 2oo million guns pal. TYRANTS beware. sic semper tyrannis.
Ben Dover…did you ever think that you get your theory by basing it on the actions of morons? Only idiots riot over soccer games. The people in Egypt who are rioting are nothing more than soccer hooligans being manipulated by islamists and socialists. The are NOT leaders of a succesful, truly freedom inspired rebellion, they are being manipulated to overthrow one tyranny by those wishing to impose a worse tyranny.Â
You are not seeing the people that will organize a SUCCESSFUL overthrow of a tyrannical government and replace it with something akin to our Founding Fathers, (those people probably don’t exist in the Middle East or there is not enough of them to pull it off, not to mention, they wouldn’t have the support of the mobs)  A true, liberty inspired movement started by “refounders” would be undertaken much  more stealthily, much more organized, and much more “orderly” as those people would use their moral character first, their brains second, and their braun third.  Those people are biding their time, taking the peaceful , lawful path until it becomes fruitless (its getting close to that time) and then, when they can no longer stop tyranny using the system, they rise up, throw out those who have made the system unusable, and restore it.
Question is, are you a hooligan, or a refounder? Can I take a guess?
I ‘ve been prepared for years as a boy scout, I was prepared. that is what we were taught BE PREPARED GET IT??? So you throw away food that is out of date from time to time u can always give it to charity a month or so before it goes out of date. But the bottom line is Be Prepared. prepared for anything. We just went thru 7 days of freezing cold weather no running water etc. we boiled icicles etc. burned firewood newspaper etc. survived, a lesson well deserved Now plans r to be more prepared than ever. What did we miss not much. Share some things exchange others. BUT DON’T LET YOUR GUARD DOWN FOR ONE MINUTE BECAUSE IF U DO THE MAN WILL TAKE IT AWAY FROM YOU. HE IS TRYING IT EVERYDAY WITH THE GUNS, AMMO, MAGAZINES & SO ON COMPLAIN TO YOUR GOVERNMENT NOW.
Greaseman…Please enlighten on the Dinar. I was one of those that bought a few hundred thousand dollars of it (cost me $40 or so), figured it had a better chance than a few lottery tickets. Time to cash them in? Last I checked the value basically hadn’t changed.
BTW, for you doubting thomases, the Dinar is another in a long line of hyperinflated currencies…
“Unlike Egypt, or Euroweenies, Americans are armed to the teeth..”
So what? Most Americans are too intellectually soft, too physically weak, too disorganized, too ideologically & racially divided and too grossly overweight for the purposes of urban insurrection.Â
BTW, where I come from, you don’t prove you’ve got balls by threatening to SHOOT people. You walk up to them unarmed and PUNCH THEM IN THE MOUTH.
THAT, my weeny friend, is called BALLS.
Comments….. I’m glad liberals hate guns. LOL!
Just checked, the value when I bought them was near 1500 to 1, now its close to 1100 to 1, so damnit, I didn’t buy as much as I thought I did, TOO bad, thats always the case with me, not trusting my instincts enough..oh well, I made a few schemckles.
Ben Dover, the tough guy huh? You let your government take your guns away so the only option you wankers have is to punch each other in the mouths! Thats how you vent your frustration over the total control your government has over you, cause your fists ain’t gonna do shit to them…dumbass!
1. God has planned a period of wrath on earth. See Revelation 6:16 to 15:1.
2. After the rapture, when the wrath begins, many will come to faith and believe — including an entire nation of Israel! Read about it in Revelation, Matthew. Unfortunately, many of them are considered blessed to be beheaded for the truth…the better choice is to be apart of the Church, raptured before the wrath (1 Thes 1:10 Jesus, who rescues us from the coming wrath)
3. Remember, people believed in a rapture long before 1830.  Paul even used the term “caught up” or “harpazo” in Greek, to describe the event, which translated to Latin is “rapture”. I think he believed what he was saying. See 1 Thessalonians.
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Below I pasted a quote taken from http://www.gracethrufaith.com about Egypt and what prophecies relate to it.
“It’s still too early to determine the outcome of the current unrest in Egypt. But we can tell from Scripture that eventually Egypt will become a major player in the End Times Moslem world. Egypt is not included in the line up of Ezekiel 38, but according to Daniel 11:40 (where Egypt is referred to as King of the South) will make an unsuccessful play for leadership of the Islamic world during the Great Tribulation. They’ll do this by attacking the forces of the anti-Christ.
Egypt will return to God’s favor in the Millennium making favorable alliances with Israel and Assyria (Isaiah 19:23-25) but will again rebel by refusing to celebrate the Feast of Tabernacles (Zech 14:18-20). In Ezekiel 29:8-16 there’s an unfulfilled prophecy against Egypt of a 40 year period of desolation. Perhaps this is the result of the rebellion spoken of in Zechariah 14.”
The Millenium referenced above is the 1000 years of peace on earth after the tribulation.
I’m liberal, but I have guns. 🙂 and a creek, and a garden, and a defensible position.
Look, this is a huge country. The thing is that the collapse would have to be at a macro level to incite mobs like that in the US. Even in Egypt it’s mostly happening in the capitol. If it happens on this scale, you’ll have a few weeks to see it happening. As long as you’re prepared before it finally starts and work your plan, you can dig in, watch your perimeter and try to ride it out. The urban areas are where it’s gonna suck. That’s why this ole country boy left the city after 17 years, got a green patch, and is gettin back to roots.
Hells bells if it ever comes to that. I was raised fundie and I don’t buy the rapture bullshit or this being a divine plan. Eff that noise if that’s what this is. Just my opinion, you’ve a right to yours…
When the middle class starts to get hungry, then you’ll have a problem. Until then it’s easy to watch the poor starve because it’s not touching you. Not that I’ll be opening my door if the SHTF and the hungry come knocking.Â
Ben Dover is being a bit trollish and confrontational, but he’s correct that we aren’t galvanized and have many divisions. We don’t have the motivational factors, as of yet, to spark something similar. Don’t kid yourselves, we still are living a kings life here when compared to most of the rest of the world. When “soccer moms” and Joe the Plumber start starving en masse, then you’ll watch the streets fill.
However it happens, whatever sets it off, it’s highly likely we did this to ourselves. The First World in the 20th century was like an 18 year old male thinking “I’ll never die. Nothing can hurt me. Carpe Deim. Laissez les bons temps rouler”. Â
Can’t run a tab forever. We had fun while it lasted. Forget about the tip, we’ll get Hell to pay…. I’m always dubious to the end, but the signs are looking grim, so I hedge my bets. Hell I like Buffalo Wild Wings and Best Buy as much as the next guy. I hope we come through this. 🙂
Obama isn’t personally responsible for creating this mess. It was there when he came in. We’ve ALL been a part of this. We burned through our resources, wasted what we had, lived hard and fast, had it all. We thought the oil, water, and topsoil would never run out, believed or lived with the lies the corporate shills in BOTH parties told us, were misdirected by the terrorism mess, and will have spent 1.29 trillion on the Iraqistan war by the end of 2011.Â
Blame it on whomever you want, but we’ve all been riding the gravy train. Time to pay the fare.
Get your “emergency insurance premium” paid by being prepared, do what you can to help others while you can, and let what happens happen. God, weather, the government, the economy…can’t change any of those things really. Raise your voice when it counts and like Bodidharma said, learn to “cultivate a view of emptiness”.
Rapture is not biblical, it was just invented by the Luciferian Jesuits as stated by Dr. Alberto Rivera, he was one of the top Jesuit in Vatican in the early 1980’s, google him.
Also, I found this link about Rapture:
http://fatherjoe.wordpress.com/instructions/debates/debates/jesuits-fabricated-the-rapture/
Any moments can be ‘learning moments’ or the ugly opposite thereof.
Most people don’t like to learn, crux of problem.
Are you prepped? Good! Then, as we approach the finish line, I suggest some last minute standard preps for your neighbors. Is everybody taken care of here? We’ll be ok then.
Always love it when a street corner preacher steps into these replies and attempts to relate EVERYthing back to their warped, religious viewpoint.
Reminds me yet again why I walked away from organized religion as soon as I was old enough to think, and never looked back.
Flame away…..got my Nomex undies on……
You guys better not tease Ben Dover too much… I heard he goes to all the nursing homes, punching the patients in the mouth. As they lay quivering, Ben yells, “Who has the balls NOW?”  I am so afraid of Ben that I am moving to Montana, growing a beard, and changing my name.Â
Just Observing….Always love it when a street corner preacher steps into these replies and attempts to relate EVERYthing back to their warped, religious viewpoint.
Reminds me yet again why I walked away from organized religion as soon as I was old enough to think, and never looked back. Flame away…..got my Nomex undies on……
ShoeMaker…keep up the good work. Many need to know that it is written. There is a master plan and that it will soon unfold.
I am prepared for whatever happens. I believe that my “prep” will buy time if not for me, for someone else. If I am caught up in a rapture then I have prepard my pantry for someone left behind. If this buys them time (before being forced to take the mark) then I have done the job that I have been destined to do.Â
I am not a believer, but when I was, I would never go unprepared and just kick back and expect God to reward my lack of preparation with His divine assistance. I’m sure believers believe there is a reward for them in the next life after the rapture comes, but they still would rather not starve to death waiting out the next blizzard or cyclone or other period of civil unrest. Thats why I’m not sure references to The Word are relevant to this debate, except in a forecasting sense. Eg, if someone wanted to point out that the bible foretold current events, that is interesting. Anyone using faith in God as an excuse not to prepare, when they are well capable of preparing themselves, is not aware of The Man Upstairs’Â sense of humour.
“…What would happen if the welfare, food stamps and unemployment payments ceased?…â€Â Being unemployed means one is a former member of the working class. The ones that got up, got dress, got to the job by whatever means necessary, worked, paid taxes and are responsible citizens.  They will be most affected by the dollar collapse because they bought into the American Dream and have values and principals of fulfilling their obligations.
@peewee’s mom
“…I was unemployed for almost a year and I finally was able to land a good paying job again. Only Mona and Laura M. defended the people that were were on unemployment…”
On the November 30 - The Last Check Is In the Mail for Two Million Unemployed – From one of my postings on the topic “…Truly folks, this is different this time and so totally unfair to tar and feather the 99′r…” There are 74 posts of which I made several and there were other posters, greaseman and Durango Kid, to name a few, also in support of the unemployed.
“… Now, after a few months my job will be going south…like to Costa Rica…” I so understand your feelings and frustrations. Stupid us. We bought into the American Dream that if we went to school, worked hard, earned a decent wage, paid our taxes, the result would be a comfortable lifestyle and a modest retirement. In the interim, the rules get changed and a third of the population is left holding the bag like in a Ponzi scheme.
Looking back, I now see the American Dream as a Ponzi,  Those that got in early benefited the most as the game was stacked in their favor. As the rules changed and/or were eliminated, there was less and less for the now end users. A Ponzi. And like a Ponzi, seems many of the early benefactors: some being members of the lucky sperm club, union and trade (pension) members, salaried corporate or government workers, (sometimes having held both) or entrepreneurs in a fair playing field, have little compassion for those finding they have been sold a bill of goods and no Vaseline. I still haven’t reconciled losing my retirement investment, which was my ticket out of the city to that small prepper type community. My last post on that November 30 thread, at the bottom of the article, describes my experience in detail.
I feel there maybe some poetic justice coming to those with little understanding or appreciation of the predicament the no jobs or decent paying wages, the under and unemployed due to no fault of their own. Many of the benefactors of the American Dream have hefty 401k’s.  To a bankrupt government, those funds are mighty tempting. In fact, legislation has been drafted, and as required by law -posted in the Federal Register, public comment period has expired and committee hearing held a couple months ago – gee, tucked into some 2000 page bill or appropriation and a sign off by the President and poof!  401’s could be mandated to purchase worthless treasury notes – or worse. A change in law or rules and all the good decision making, hard work and efforts are for naught – due to no fault of their own.  I want to be one of the first to extend my condolences when that happens.
peewee’s mom, you are in my thoughts and prayers.  I say one for all every night for what seems to be coming to pass to give us wisdom and strength in our days of need. God Bless.Â
Thank you, Lady Hawk. Love to you 🙂
“You guys better not tease Ben Dover too much… I heard he goes to all the nursing homes, punching the patients in the mouth.”
I heard Americans go to all the foreign countries, rape the teenaged girls, shoot them in the head (along with the entire rest of the family) and then put weapons in their dead hands to make it look like they were ‘insurgents’.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraq_rape_case
Thunderdome (Tahrir Square). How do I get in there? I’ve got skills & nomex “undies”, I could trade them. Sorry, the brothel’s full. There must be another way? unloads hidden weapons. Perhaps you’ve got something to trade after all.
Keep talkin’. Twenty-four hours of your life, in return, you’ll get back what was stolen. Sounds like a bargain.  It’s not. It’s the law. That’s easy, pick a fight!  You pass through many TSA inspection points and get checked for weapons & tests after that. After that Thunderdome’s simple. Get to the rocks, use them any way you can.  I know you won’t break the rules, because there aren’t any.
Congratulations! You’re number 10,000 to survive the audition. I don’t know anything about petrology.
You can throw rocks can’t you? This is no enemy. It’s almost family. Oh, I see, real civilized! The reasons don’t concern you, only the conditions. Do you want the deal or not? Mmm. The first is, no one knows you’re working for the system. You hit him, you go. The second is, it’s a fair fight. The third is, it’s to the death. Who’s the bunny?
And what did you do before all this? I was an Air Marshal. But how the world turns. One day, cock of the walk. Next, a rock thrower. Well, ain’t I a got a pair, Raggedy Man. Yes, you do have quite a pair but they look as hard as a rock.Â
[laughs]
Goodbye, freedom fighter.
We call it Mac’s World. That’s where Nabisco town gets its energy.
What, oil? Natural gas? Pigs & pv. You mean pigs like those? That’s right. Bullshit! No. Pig shit. What? Pig shit. The lights, the motors, the vehicles, all run by a high-powered gas called methane. And methane cometh from pig shit. Mr., who are ya? No-one. What’s your name?Nobody. No Mr., I can feel it!  The dice are rollin’!
I ain’t Captain Walker. I’m the guy who carries Mr. Dead in his pocket. It’s a class job. One mistake, and it’ll blow the crap out of this place! Literally…..Â
For God’s sake, what now? Who run Bartertown? Dammit, I told you, no more embargos. More, Nabisco. Who run Bartertown? Who… run… Bartertown? You know who.  Say. Master Nabisco. Say loud! Master Nabisco. Master Nabisco… what? Master Nabisco runs Bartertown. Louder! Master Nabisco runs Bartertown!
Lift embargo. Shreaded BBQ pork for everyone! The KFC is closed down.
@Just Observing – Very interesting you’d use the “Flame” analogy. Its not the flames of men I’d be worried about. Sounds like you’ve made your choice to be against God. I wish I could change your mind about that. I don’t know you or your experience with “organized religion”. Obviously, it wasn’t a good one. All I can do is pray that you’ll change your mind and come back to God.
Kind Regards,
Â
My hope is that I did not offend anyone with my post. I have received tremendous help from all my prepper friends on this site. I cannot tell you how I appreciate you all. Thanks so very much!!!
If the NFL locks out its players then you know the big event is due sometime in the 2nd half of 2011. The NFL is closely aligned with the elite power structure and have been tipped off in the timing. Another confirming sign is the abrupt departure of famous celebrities such as Oprah, Larry King, Olberman etc. As for Egypt, the regime change in N. Africa was planned an instigated by globalists to transition the M. East from US control before the aforesaid implodes. It’s as simple as that. Ironic as the Suez crisis heraled US world ascendance while Mubarek’s downfall signals the imminent death of the US.
Get your house in order.
@ GoldenFox…
Out of natural gas in NM? We own natural gas wells there and many company’s “capped” them not to long ago. There’s no shortage and we get a myriad of offers every day to buy out our royalties. Another manipulation by an industry.  My 2 cents.
Comments…..
FarmersDaughter
@ GoldenFox…
Out of natural gas in NM? We own natural gas wells there and many company’s “capped†them not to long ago. There’s no shortage and we get a myriad of offers every day to buy out our royalties. Another manipulation by an industry.  My 2 cents.
That’s what the article that I posted above said – specifically Taos, NM. You can google for more info, but go to the link I provided and there’s more links to follow.
Comments…..
BTW, where I come from, you don’t prove you’ve got balls by threatening to SHOOT people. You walk up to them unarmed and PUNCH THEM IN THE MOUTH.
UHHHH, military in tank…proceed, yeah, right!! and if you have no gas mask …they have vomit gas now, not tear gas.
Comments…..
We’ve ALL been a part of this. We burned through our resources, wasted what we had, lived hard and fast, had it all. We thought the oil, water, and topsoil would never run out, believed or lived with the lies the corporate shills in BOTH parties told us, were misdirected by the terrorism mess, and will have spent 1.29 trillion on the Iraqistan war by the end of 2011.Â
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
SkepticalSurvivalist…I’ll tell you like I told my church class…I AM NOT guilty of this chit happening now or the past 4 decades…
that’s just the story the guilty want told OVER AND OVER AND OVER……
If I loaned you my car and you were speeding and killed someone, it’s not my fault!!! end of story.
Comments…..
FarmersDaughter
February 4th, 2011 at 12:30 pm
I don’t tink fuel is the problem…frozen lines are.
Skeptical Survivalist…Well said but I do think Obummer was the very capstone in an already well made plan. He is an empty shirt, a shill, a debouched immoral cretin who proud fully executes his script with soulless abandon.
When will it all end you say?
When the checks stop and they start dropping cash and MREs from aircraft over the major cities. This will spawn the very riots they have professed to contain. We happy few who live away from the cities will be much better off. The power may stop, the water may not pump but we can continue onward—- we are Americans and some have forgotten what that means.
SECURITY, FOOD and WATER. That is what you need to survive the first month. After that you need to have your wits about you—this aint Kansas no more Toto and the old rules just won’t apply. My wife still has on the rosy glasses so I have to prep in other ways and that sucks but I’ll do it for our family. Be strong, be generous, be kind but be SOMETHING! If you’re not pulling your weight don’t expect anything from me. Sacrifice, intellect and hard work and you’ll survive. Teach your children to hunt, fish and shoot NOW!
We have met the enemy and he is us
Stealth, I know that Rawles over at survivalblog has some tips on trying to interest loved ones in prepping. I’m sure it’d be worth the effort to find. He said to break them in slowly, not force them, or panic them, but to gently bring up some things that could happen, in a gradual way. And I’d add farming to the list of skills b/c everyone will be out hunting and shooting all the game and fish, so they’ll be gone.
Now as for shoemaker. I disagree with your interpretation of Revelation. I don’t see that book as talking about America but rather ancient Israel before it was destroyed in 70 A.D..
“God has planned a period of wrath on earth.”
If we fail, it’ll not be because of God. It will be because of us. If we let the inevitability of the punishment control us, we can’t prepare for God’s kingdom to come here, as it will after tribulation. The wrath is a product of sin but Jesus came to heal us, mercifully. To insulate yourself in anticipation of tribulation doesn’t follow that example.
“2. After the rapture, when the wrath begins, many will come to faith and believe — including an entire nation of Israel! Read about it in Revelation, Matthew.”
Be more specific please. It says in the final days, many will come to Christ, not during tribulation. It’ll be too late then. You should knwo signs and symbols are required by those without faith.
This is an analogy to our lives, not that of the world or its end. We all die (unless we’re saved, then we will never know dying.) Then it’s too late to come to Christ. So yes we need to make right with God, but not because of the Rapture or tribulation, but because we are lost without Christ.
As I said before, fear is not Christian. It can no more deliver people to Christ than any other negative emotion. Christ is about love and faith, the opposite of fear, though one must fear God.
You cite “1 Thes 1:10 Jesus, who rescues us from the coming wrath” which isn’t what Jesus does. It’s up to us to follow Jesus’ example, and Jesus wouldn’t leave this world and abandon sinners, because sinners are those he came into the world to help. Jesus would give his shirt, so all this prepping and hoarding is selfishness unless it’s used to help those suffering. And we don’t have to wait for some apocalypse for that, do we?
“people believed in a rapture long before 1830.”
No. The doctrine was created less than two hundred years ago. If you are a literalist, you need to know which interpretations came out of the blue 1700 years later. There’s no grounds whatsoever for the idea that saved people will be swept up and others Left Behind. And if Rapture can occur, it’ll be at odds with all Biblical interpretations prior to 1830.
The 1983 penny and prior years busted 3 cent melt value today. What will the nickel be worth in a few years when the dollar is not worth toast?
To those who cite religious text: if you bothered to impartially investigate the origins of your institutionalized beliefs, you’d know full well it’s all a corck of BS written by humans who were no more illuminated THAN YOU ARE YOURSELF.
Ben Dover, you are without a doubt the toughtest, greatest fighter of all time.  You know so much about committing atrocities…. are you an expert? You single out Americans… how about being fair and saying that nearly ALL the people of this sick planet commit horrible atrocities. You phony, biased idiot.
Ben Dover
“I heard Americans go to all the foreign countries, rape the teenaged girls, shoot them in the head (along with the entire rest of the family) and then put weapons in their dead hands to make it look like they were ‘insurgents’.”
Yep and they got caught because unlike many other nations such acts are not policy. Hell Saddam pushed men, women and children off of high roofs to their deaths as a matter of official policy.
We have our faults but no powerful nation could hold a candle to our overall treatment of civilians captured in war. In the running is….Germany, USSR, China and Japan.
No brainer.
1. The only reason I cited Bible passages or replied to your post was to display what I believe to be the best, most literal interpretation of scripture. I wasn’t writing any of it to encourage prepping or to discourage it.
2. If you don’t like “rapture” how about I just say the Church will be caught up or removed from here prior to the tribulation.
3. I can see you are amillenial or preterist. I am pre-millenial dispensationalist. Therefore, I beleive that during the church age, Jews and gentiles were born again into one body, the church. After it is caught up or taken away, God’s attention will again return to Israel, and Daniel’s final “week” will begin (a week of years described in Daniel. During this time, many will become saved, but will not be considered the church (they become the wedding guests to the marriage supper of the Lamb and his bride, the church). It appears many of them will lose their lives under the anti-christ. After the seven years are over, Jesus will return to earth to establish his kingdom in physical form. None of this is an analogy. We know this because other prophecies have been fulfilled in a very specific, exact way. There is no reason to analogize the remaining unfulfilled prophecies away. Take Daniel 12 and compare it to a world history book. Take the prophecies about Jesus and see how specifically and exactly they were fulfilled. Revelation and Matthew 25 will be no different.Â
3. “Jesus, who rescues us from the coming wrath” was a direct quote from 1 Thes 1:10, so I’m confused why you say this isn’t what Jesus does.  Again, I am not explaining any scripture to encourage prepping. Go back and read my original post.
4. For the sake of debate, let’s say you are correct that the idea of a rapture was not an interpretation anyone held prior to 1830. Why would it matter when people had that interpretation? The point is that we are looking for the most accurate interpretation, given by the Spirit.Â
“..how about being fair and saying that nearly ALL the people of this sick planet commit horrible atrocities”
True, BUT:
a) They’ve already either been PUNISHED, destroyed or are dead.
b) They never masqueraded or misrepresented themselves as a “force of freedom & democracy”
c) NONE of them has actually USED WMD’s against other humans on quite the same scale (think Hiroshima & Nagasaki)
d) NONE of them ever infected the entire global economic system with purposely designed fraudulent financial paper documents. Just wait until the rest of the world follows the papaer trail of all fraud & embezzlement BACK TO WALL ST. It’s already starting to happen!
Oh, and YES! I AM one mean ornery MF. Tread carefully.
🙂
@ Kevin: Yeah, they got got THIS TIME and received what amounts to a trivial WRISTSLAP. Just try doing crap like that against American citizens within the U.S. without getting MULTIPLE life sentences, no parole. RES, NON VERBA!
@ Kevin-  OOPSY, I meant to say; “ Yeah, they got CAUGHT this time…”
“I can see you are amillenial or preterist. I am pre-millenial dispensationalist”
Just when you think that the fine art of Hair Splitting could be refined no further….
The best post in this thread was up near the beginning
(Good post TnAndy).
Everyone … knockoff from battling each other and invoking your deities and re-read TnAndy’s post. He calls it right.
Expect the federal gov to keep printing dollars till the world says “No Mas”.
These .. are the good ‘ol days.
Once the world turns its back on the dollar you’ll never have it so good again. Yes, even now is good compared to a post dollar meltdown future.
Prepare your self’s accordingly.
Comments…..  Guys, just a note of warning here. I watched some youtube vids about the currency revaluation coming very soon. Here’s what I saw , and digested as best i could.. Fact, the Chinese Premier’s recent visit this past week. He wasn’t here discussing idle chit chat, if you catch my drift. Hillary Clinton  has called in all the Ambassadors for a big  pow wow–(got to check that one out ). Obama making a trip to Canada for a pow wow-what’s that all about–hummm.???
   The info that I saw, says the Chinese are running the show now on a global settlements fund that will be distributed to 140 nations, and all these nations will have a new currency, and it will be backed by 80% commodities, and 20% precious metals. The US will bring out a new dollar that will be printed and distributed by the Treasury dept, the same way it used to be. The supposed breakdown recently by the government printing presses, was a ruse for the new dollars to be printed and distributed. The distribution to the regional banks has been done.Â
    The Chinese dollar will be the new world reserve currency. Oil will be traded , and valued in dinar. This currency has to have a value set for trade, and this has to be completed before rollout of the new dollars. There are many complicated steps to be taken as you can imagine. all the ducks appear to be in line now.  This rollout should be similiar to the changeover that happened when Hong kong was returned to the Chinese from Btitian. The currency had to be done over time, and it was. it didn’t happen overnight. The people have to accept the new currency. I heard from the video, that the exchange rate will be a 1/1 ratio. One new dollar for one old one. Now to the next info.
  The FED will be no more. The US treasury will again be doing what they are supposed to be doing all along. The Chinese have been ironing out the details  for a long time.
They are running the show now. The implications for this are gigantic, as you can imagine. Can you say panic, as Americans realize they have been lied to all along, and cheated endlessly by their own government. Our national debt , if I understand it right, is to be defaulted on, and written off, but I’m still not totally sure on that. But , if the FED is dead, as I think it will be, this debt will be written off. Fannie Mae, and Freddie Mac–over and done.  Why  do you think Fannie and Freddie changed their web address ending from dot org, to dot gov. Because you can’t sue the government, and they knew that was coming… Follow the logic guys. Everything the government has been doing , aka, spending every last dollar we didn’t have, was because they knew this day of reckoning was fast approaching.  it all makes sense.
     This next week should be a dousey. What better weekend to roll out a new currency, when everyone is distracted, than superbowl weekend. I can tell you I’ll be looking for the rest of this story every waking moment. I’m going to make a trip to the coin store tommorrow, and buy some more silver. The price of PM’s should explode next week. if the weekend price starts to go up dramatically, this would be a good indication that some people know what’s coming.
     And last, but not least—-GOT PREPS?????
greaseman – where did you see the vids?Â
Ben Dover – yep, admittedly so
as for TnAndy’s post, with deity debates aside:
There is still plenty of reasons why violence could be seen in America. There are forces that gain power when the masses are stirred to rioting. That is how they bring about their “change”. The end justifies the mean to these people. Imagine a scenario in which the powers that be use the polical pressure to be responsible in printing to limit payments for welfare, etc. This is designed to cause an uprising on purpose that they use for their benefit. It won’t take much for them and the media to paint for us a gigantic crisis that only they can solve.Â
Interesting read Greaseman. Not so sure about one to one exchange unless they have quick chess move. I wonder which dinar? Makes more cents to me than anything else. I’m sure North & South K came up along with the football problem. This weekend, not yet…
Thoughts on IRS debit card tax return like Katrina Greaseman?
Ben Dover : ” I am one mean ornery MF. Tread Carefully.”  You buffoon. I learned a long time ago that if you encounter a nut who focuses all the worlds’ evils on America, then you can’t converse with that person.  So, small person, just sit in your tiny apartment and scribble your hatred, ignore any facts that don’t fit your puzzle, and perhaps someday out of frustration you will immolate yourself. Oh, and since you are so tough, let’s meet for a fight. I will be at Tony’s Pizza, Sunday at noon. I will be in the white station wagon. We’ll just see if you show up.Â
Emptyhand - You better watch out… if you go to meet Ben Dover, he will punch you in the mouth! I heard that Ben is very tough. He earned his name in prison! He bent over many, many times for the other prisoners! If getting humped in prison was preparedness, Ben would be all set for 500 years!  So, emptyhand, don’t be a stupid idiot. Stay away from Tony’s.
Just a question – if the currency collapses and the mobs are out looting, who will be keeping the electric grid and the internet up so the “electronic currency” will be usable? Why should the power plant workers and the electric linesmen continue working while the mobs are roaming their neighborhoods and threatening their families? Hey, you want to see what a post-apocalypse America is like, shut off the power to NYC or Chicago for two weeks.
The author is leaving out two huge sectors that could and would become involved: 1. Veterans pensioners and recipients of disability (meds, care, etc.), and recievers of Social Security benefits (SSI, SSDI, and earned retirement). Add to the chaos those combat vets suddenly off their medications, SSDI mental cases off their meds, and retired soldiers with nothing to lose. The problem won’t just be angry welfare cheats, it goes much further.
This is the unmarked FEMA SUV:
It would be nigh to impossible to top the English in terms of conquest and murder…..the federal govt of these United States is the one guilty of the evil done in the name of America…America is not the guilty party….America and the fedgovcorp…..there is a difference!
The “American Dream” is too often mis interpeted, it is NOT about buying anything one wants and ammassing goodies…..its the dream of “Personal Liberty” that drove the fathers….being able to procure “stuff” is simply a byproduct of that dream being obtained….there is a difference.
Oh and as someone above stated…I am not responsible for this mess…..I dropped out of the ratrace years ago and never looked back…no debts and no credit and no health care,and almost no money…the blame for this problem lies squarely at the feet of the fedgovcorp and their cronies they did it,lay the blame at their feet alone,unless you are a party to the deed,then straighten up!
“… learned a long time ago that if you encounter a nut who focuses all the worlds’ evils on America, then you can’t converse with that person.”
What inane BS.
First, when I said I’m ‘mean & ornery’ I was being facetious, which means JOKING in your 5th grade English. Second, I don’t focus “all the world’s evils” against America. I simply focus on mentioning the evils AMERICANS commit, openly sanctioned by their own goverment. Wanna join me as I run thru the check-list very briefly?
-War Crimes
– Crimes Against Humanity
– Use of Torture
– International Financial Fraud on a Scale Never Before Seen
– Waging Wars of Aggression
– Lax Punishments for Rape & Sex Crimes commited by its Troops Overseas
– Pre-Meditated Murder as Offical Foreign Policy
– Running a Worldwide Web of Clandestine Detention Centers
– Securities Fraud
– Use of High Frequency Trading Programs to Front Run Stock Markets
– Currency Manipulation
Tell me BIG PERSON, are you FOR or AGAINST the aforementioned? Because what ^I^ learned long ago is that degenerate criminals will ALWAYS deny their crimes and always try to deflect the blame elsewhere instead. Kinda sounds like you’re in that group.
NO WONDER you don’t ‘want to talk’ to me.
als and perverts by the scruffs of their necks and drop them all naked into Fallujah, with a sign around their necks saying “Allah sucks a big one!”.Â
Then I’d sit back and enjoy my popcorn as I watched REAL justice you can believe in.
Looks as though Muslims are the only true hardcore riotors these days….France a while back….tunisia, and now Egypt.
Well then again, there was Thailand….however, I would visit Thailand during riots without fear …they don’t mess with tourists or foreign media….
Comments….. vids I mentioned are from youtube. They are posted by:
connectingdots1
 Watch his last few vids. They are very telling. Everything that has been happening over the last year or so will start to add up. Our government obviously can’t come out and tell people the dollar is a done deal. it will take the accceptance by the people of the new dollar. it will be backed by tangible assets on a global scale. There are plenty of billionaires in the world who aren’t illumanati, and were getting screwed by the crooked banksters running the Comex precious metals clearing house in London. The crooked banksters have been selling silver that they don’t have. The billionaires have been asking for their precious metals stored at the comex, and it isn’t there. it’s all a scam. hence the soon to be outrageous high price for silver to come.
   The manipulation of the metals market is coming to an end. The FED, who is a big player in the fraud is done for. The Chinese are holding all the cards, and together with the rest of the world are forcing the changeover of the US currency, as they don’t want to get left holding the bag, and along with the rest of the world, are refusing to accept the worthless US FRD note anymore.
    The worm is getting ready to turn. I personally see this as a positive thing. The demise of the FED, a bunch of worthless cheating scam artist, who have ruined the lives of every tax paying citizen in the US. AND, very soon, our fearless leaders all, who let this scam play out, will have to answer to 300 million pissed of Americans. This is the reset of the economy that we have been waiting for.
   We will however, be owned by the Chinese. And , if you bought precious metals like many told you to do, you will fare quite well. You’ll just have to learn to speak chinese.
  There are many scenerios that will be played out, but there is no doubt in my mind that change is coming very soon.Â
     I’m sure that I will relish the opportunity to say a few, “I told you so’s” , to some of the people I have come across, and they said, “oh that could never happen”. We will see won’t we. Silver is looking better everyday. Got metals?????
No, Ben Dover, I don’t want to talk to you…. I simply want to BEAT YOU UP.   Remember…. Tony’s Pizza…..  high noon.  Bring an ambulance with you, to haul you away.
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“””The 1983 penny and prior years busted 3 cent melt value today. What will the nickel be worth in a few years when the dollar is not worth toast?””””
 the 83 penny is junk, 97% zinc, about half the 82s and all the pre 82s are 95% copper and 5% zinc.the change over was about Oct.82.
“…What would happen if the welfare, food stamps and unemployment payments ceased?…â€Â
 If the above happened here, It would make what’s happening in Egypt look like a bunch of grade schoolers playing. All the social programs in America is the glue holding the US together, when they stop, people will know exactly what SHTF stands for.
Hey everybody!!!!  Just to let you know, Ben Dover never showed up for the big fight. I waited over two hours at Tony’s. I shadow boxed, stretched, practiced leg kicks, and even put a rear naked choke on some guy walking by. Then I went home. Ben, you are a chicken livered, yellow bellied, no good scaredy cat coward.