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Strategic Relocation: The Reality Of Survival Communities and Ready Retreats

Joel Skousen
November 1st, 2014
Strategic Relocation
Comments (386) Read by 23,630 people

This article has been contributed by Joel Skousen and the Strategic Relocation For Sale By Owner web site. Joel is one of the world’s foremost experts on survival retreats, relocation and home security. He is the author of the widely popular Strategic Relocation guide and The Secure Home.

Click here to read previous Strategic Relocation briefings and information. 

When you are ready to start looking for a home or retreat check out the free nationwide listings at the FSBO web site. If you have questions about any aspect of relocation you can contact the leading professionals at Survival Retreat Consulting.

survival-community


SR-logoThis week I’ll take a break from discussing individual strategic locations and talk about two common frustrations that confront would-be retreat seekers that often goes unfulfilled—the desire to find 1) an already established Prepper community of like-minded people, and 2) a complete and functioning retreat in the area of their interest.

With over 40 years experience consulting in this area I usually have to tell clients that the first is nigh unto impossible and the second, though possible, is very rare.  And, when finished retreats do come on the market, the location, cost, or style often doesn’t match the client’s personal criteria.  Let me break down these two difficult issues one by one.

Like Minded Communities:  The main reason this idea constitutes “the impossible dream” is that the desire to be prepared is about the only thing preppers have in common—everything else is all over the map.   Preppers are generally an independent, opinionated lot, and it doesn’t take much to cause divisions.  It’s the inherent disadvantage I’ve long observed behind conservatives vs liberals—it only take one thing in common to unite liberals and one major difference to divide conservatives.  Most preppers are conservative and inherently more strict in their principles and preferences—which leads to this predilection for separation from those we differ with.

I can also generalize in saying that most people who are aware of the nation’s problems with socialism and globalist control have traditionally been conservatives but also below average in wealth.  Only in the past few years have people of strong financial resources decided that the establishment is headed for disaster and joined the movement.  But this growing disparity in financial resources makes it even more difficult for groups to work well together.  The lesser endowed sometimes feel that those in the group with more money have an obligation to bail out the community when funds run short.  This too leads to the break up of communities that start out with common goals.

The first of the big like-minded Prepper communities to form and fail was the movement surrounding Col. Bo Gritz who established a survival community in Kamiah, Idaho, called Almost Heaven.  Gritz was a former Green Beret officer and presidential candidate who championed many conservative causes, some credible and some not.  He was high profile, head strong and very controversial, which is not good for maintaining a low profile as a Prepper leader. Eventually financial and personal schisms developed within the hundreds of families who had moved to Idaho to be part of this like-minded community.   Many eventually sold out and moved away.  Some remain, but they now operate as individuals with informal relationships with others they trust and get along with—which, in my opinion, is the only thing that really works anyway.

Instead of finding a “like minded community” find a basic rural, conservative community with good values and then find those few families who you really click with, and develop informal relationships of mutual support.  This is done by attending churches, or local political organizations to find those you connect with. And, it’s actually better NOT to buy land contiguous to each other to avoid be labeled as a “compound.”

Be aware too that locals in any area have their “good ‘ol boys” network that control local politics.  They always resent newcomers moving in who have uniform political views—or any group ideological agenda.  When the Rajneesh sect moved into Antelope Oregon in the 80s and started to threaten the local county control system with their increasing numbers, hostilities arose and they were eventually forced out.

I run across modern day development attempts all the time where a small group of preppers try to establish a Prepper housing development of like-minded people.  They almost always fail and there are several good reasons:

  1. They pick a name like the “Citadel” or “Fortress” which gives the locals the idea that they are militaristic in orientation—with walled cities.  Not good for public relations.
  2. The promoters have to advertize the security features of the development in order to sell the idea to other preppers, which then compromises that same security because everyone knows about them.  Guess where the locals are going to come in a crisis?
  3. Because these developments cater to a very narrow market (preppers) they almost never can get the financing up front to develop all the roads, sewers, electricity and other infrastructure.  Instead, they draw up fancy plans promoting the finished product and ask people to buy lots based upon future infrastructure.  Often these developers burn up the advance money taken in with administrative expenses and never fulfill their promises, leaving advance purchasers high and dry.
  4. The locals resent any powerful minority moving into the area, and rumors start flying which builds hostility.   You can keep a low profile as an individual but not if you’re part of a large group that is somewhat vocal about their preparedness intentions.

Finding a Ready-Made Retreat:  The difficulties are numerous with this approach.  First, the number of finished retreats that are properly implemented are few in number to start with.  Second, when they do come available the location rarely matches the prospective buyer’s idea of where he wants to be.  And, third, most places advertized as ready- made retreats haven’t really implemented the full range of facilities necessary to do the job.  Let’s review some of these criteria:

  1.  The home and land has to be in a fairly highly rated area, but even more important is the specific siting of the home on the property.  It should be rural, and generally concealed from view by trees and/or terrain, and thus, not directly visible from any primary or secondary roads.   This is especially important if you intend to grow food in a long-term famine where it security of the garden area from theft is essential.
  2. Most retreats lack the most important element on the list—a concealed safe room or shelter.  I never use the word “bunker” and you shouldn’t either.  Most things like alternate energy sources can be added to a house, but if the house hasn’t been designed with a shelter accessible from inside the house, it’s often difficult and costly to add it later on.  This almost always requires below ground construction, so I almost always reject properties that don’t have basement potential.  I’m also not a big fan of prefab buried shelters because the entrance and vent pipes are exposed and vulnerable to a variety of security threats—the worst of which is trying to access the shelter in a crisis by crossing open ground.  Concealment of a safe room or shelter is important to not only safeguard your stockpiles from theft (and possible government confiscation, labeled as “hoarding”) but to give you the option to hide yourself or others from security threats you choose not to confront with armed defense.  Shelters also need a secondary escape exit.
  3. Alternative sources of water.  I like to see two sources such as a well or gravity fed spring plus some significant water storage either in tanks or in a cistern.  Wells need to have backup power or a manual pumping option to make sure they operate in a crisis.
  4. Alternative energy.  The retreat needs a generator and fuel supply coupled with a battery/inverter back system as a minimum.  Solar is great, but you can also simply keep a battery bank charged with utility power or a generator.  The battery/inverter pack keeps you from having to run the generator all day long.
  5. Alternative sources of space and water heating.  I like to see 3 types:  gas (or LPG), electricity, and wood. A wood stove is the best all-around backup heating option where wood sources exist, and with an added heating coil you can have hot water in the winter too.  Solar hot water heating systems are viable in most places.
  6. Security features:  The more isolated a retreat or cabin (where break-ins are likely and go undiscovered for months), the more you have to provide security on walls, windows and doors, to ensure the retreat and its contents are going to be there when you need them.  Exterior 14 gauge steel doors in steel jambs are important, and window shuttering systems (or Shatterguard vinyl lining) where possible if really isolated.  While window security is too expensive for most people, at least having your valuables and stores in a concealed saferoom ensures that even if broken into, your essentials will still be there waiting for you.  Modern day security systems such as ELK provide the ability to monitor your home and cameras via the internet.

There are others I could mention, but you get the idea.  Another problem in finding a ready- made retreat is finding one that has not been compromised by unwise advertizing. If the property has special security features, especially a built-in shelter, it’s important not to publish the actual  location, but only reveal it to the few qualified buyers who are willing to travel to see the property in order to have that location revealed.  Otherwise, the poor buyer is buying a retreat that hundreds of people have seen advertized, including its address.  This eagerness to sell comes at the expense of the buyer’s privacy.

You also have to consider resale value.  I know everyone says the retreat home they build is going to never be sold, but circumstances sometimes dictate a sale.  The tendency of people with lots of money is to build a retreat home as an underground home or dome home, thinking they are more secure or energy efficient.  But this is rarely true. Despite initial claims underground and dome homes turn out to be very expensive and have security liabilities in that their vent pipes are accessible at ground level.  And, they have severe resale problems.  The number of buyers willing to consider an underground or dome home is reduced to less than 5%.  I remember a Colorado underground high security home costing millions that was on the market for years before selling, and the owner lost over half his investment.  Dome or underground homes are also too high profile.  For this reason, I prefer conventional looking homes that have all the high security and self-sufficiency features implemented in ways that aren’t obvious.

Finally, as to costs for ready- made retreat homes, let me give you some general guidelines. First, you are going to have to pay a premium for the hidden features of the home.  Don’t expect to buy for the same price as a comparable conventional home—that’s not fair to the person who has done it right and taken great pains to conceal the valuable features of the high security home. Although the sky’s the limit on expensive equipment you can put into a high security home, as a general rule, it costs about 25-33% more.  For a moderate sized home it costs about $100K -150k more for a shelter/safe room under a garage, a medium sized solar and generating system, underground fuel tanks, and alternate heating equipment. Appraisers don’t even know how to evaluate these things–and if the seller is smart, he won’t reveal them to appraisers.

How can you locate existing retreat properties? Fortunately, these folks now specialize in the American Redoubt and can also refer you to approved Prepper Realtors anywhere in the United Sates and Costa Rica contact United Country-Strategic Relocation Realty. Happy hunting. Joel.

Survival Retreat Consulting: Commenting on retreat purchases with other friends, families or trying to start a group to purchase a parcel of land; Beware. Not having one single person in charge of both the search, selection and purchasing the property through an LLC with the entire legal framework in place is a waste of time. It’ll never happen and most likely end up in a court battle and lost friendships. Choose one lead dog and let that person get it done on behalf of the group. -Todd Savage

This article has been contributed by Joel Skousen and the Strategic Relocation For Sale By Owner web site.

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Joel Skousen is one of the foremost experts on survival retreats, relocation and home security. He is the author of the widely popular Strategic Relocation guide and The Secure Home.

Todd Savage is the CEO of the Strategic Relocation Group that operates Survival Retreat Consulting, Strategic Relocation Realty, Strategic Relocation FSBO and Strategic Relocation Blog.

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Author: Joel Skousen
Views: Read by 23,630 people
Date: November 1st, 2014
Website: http://www.strategicrelocation.com/

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386 Comments...

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  1. Anonymous says:

    Mac,

    Please not another… 🙁
    I can’t afford anything like this.

    More info on real prepping. Like long term storage results that people have seen.

    Thanks for the site though. 🙂

    • the renegade braveheart says:

      Anonymous, I agree. Just another Skousen article for me to call BS on.

      • Acid Etch says:

        I have said many times before that I am against the idea of prepping communities beyond family and lifelong friends. People cannot keep their fat mouths shut about prepping, groups of people always generate problems and bullshit; it’s a bad risk.

        Am I completely against it? No. But a lot of thought needs to transpire.

        This is why I forcefully advocate extreme sports, martial arts, rambling, and the like as training. You develop yourself but you also learn how to read a man’s true nature and form bonds with the small number of people that are not fair weather friends.

        Those of you who mock my alpha as fuck posts, what the hell are YOU doing to train your flabby old bodies?

        • the renegade braveheart says:

          Acid, I agree about keeping such a community restricted to family and/or lifelong friends. The BOL where I’m going is family-owned and other family within 10 miles of it. I never knew what you meant with your phrase ‘alpha as f#$%’ so I ignored that comment. Good post.

        • Outlaw says:

          Hard, outdoor, manual labor. Lots of it.

        • caveman says:

          read the bible pray everyday. ALPHA!!!!!!!!!

          • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

            Forget the Babble go chop and split a few cords of wood today. That will make you stronger.

          • Nobama says:

            I sit down and read a page a day too, before I tear it out and wipe my ass with it. Best use for a bible that I know of.

            • Mike in VA says:

              Nobama

              Why is it that you have to be rude to those who do believe. You have the right to believe what you want too. I am a Christian who honestly means that. It does hurt when I see people who don’t beleave because to me that is so sad. It is because I care about people.

              Why does it offend you so that someone suggest reading the bible? That is a question I really want the answer too. I don’t understand. I would understand if someone was being rude to you and saying things like you are no good because you don’t believe.
              I have been around some Christians that act like they are better than others. I have seen the gossip that goes on in certain circles. I have seen Christians turn there nose up at other people and have nothing to do with them because they felt they were better.
              Those types offend me. Because they are not acting like Jesus. They forget that Jesus spent time with some of the most despised people in society of his day. Would be for us today too. The damn tax collectors. He also said let anyone who has not sinned cast the first stone. So those type of Christians offend me. They are no better than you or I and should care about you and I in a loving way.
              Can you please answer my question though. I really don’t understand why it is offensive to people for someone like me who cares to just bring up God.

            • Barn Cat says:

              You will get what you deserve in hell. Mocking God and the Bible is for fools. Your punishment is eternal.

              • Nobama says:

                Nope, can’t go to hell, Satan has a restraining order against me. Go back to reading your bible.

              • Swinging on a star says:

                Barn Cat,

                No offence, but we are not the final judge as to whether a man will face eternal punishment. I believe we can judge a man by what he does in order to define his character against good and evil, but we do not have the right or authority to judge a man’s soul and what he will face when he leaves this planet. He will like all of us kneel before the Lord in judgement, but God will decide his fate, not us.

                Unfortunately many people use the word of God to be pious and better than others, that is not the way the Lord would want you to speak on his behalf. Remember, Jesus said while he was dyeing on the cross, “Forgive them Father, they know not what they do”. Every day, I learn more every day about what God would want from me and I will never know it all no matter how long I live.

              • Professor Higgins says:

                Barn Cat: Your sad little god is nothing more than a petty little tyrant who tortures people who disagree with him and won’t kiss his behind. That’s the definition of a psychotic personality. Nothing there to worship unless you’re under the strain of what is now known a the “Stockholm Syndrome”.

              • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

                Just like a Christian, always judging everybody else. What makes you think any cat is going to heaven? You will get thrown into a cage full of dogs.

            • Swinging on a star says:

              Nobama,

              Because of my belief in God, my life is full of peace, humility, kindness, hope, love and honor. I am a mere mortal just like you and everyone else on this planet. Why are we here, what is our legacy and why is there suffering? These are questions that we all ask many times and the answer is simple, in my humble opinion, we are here to leave this earth a bit better then it was when we first arrived, due to our own good and considerate personal contributions to mankind. Hopefully we do these things because of our conscience and not as a means to get to heaven. There is terrible suffering and pain that man sometimes has to endure, if it is at the hands of another man then it is an abomination that the dear Lord will address when the time comes. Man has free will so therefore he can use his life to create misery for others or joy. God is not a dictator but he will correct these wrongs when the perpetrators kneel before him one day.

              A little bit of kindness and consideration for our fellow man and the animals that we were put in charge of, must come from our heart and soul. Why, because it is the right way to live and it brings so much joy to not only the giver, but the receiver as well. God speed.

              2 Corinthians 6:14

              Do not be unequally yoked with unbelievers. For what partnership has righteousness with lawlessness? Or what fellowship has light with darkness?

              • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

                Yeah Swinging on a star, just ask the Native Americans what they thought of the Christians, peace, tranquility, hope & honor they brought here, before they massacred the natives in the name of God’s Manifest Destiny. Try picking up a history book for a change for fact checking history, before you post something else stupid, that make you look foolish and naive. But thanks for the laugh. I get a kick out of you religious folks justifying your bible babble with no facts.

            • Ms.X says:

              Nobama,
              God will remind you of what you said someday.

            • Lumpy says:

              You gays always crack me up…

            • Mike in Va says:

              WWTI and Nobama

              Neither one of you is man enough to answer my question. It was a legitimate question. You both have the right to believe whatever you like. I truly feel sorry for you both. I was not rude or sarcastic in anyway. I just asked a question. I wish you both would give a second thought to believing. The reason I say that is because I care about you both even if that is your attitude. I also wish one or both was man enough to answer the question.

              Maybe it is because you are ashamed of the answer.

          • Mike in VA says:

            Caveman

            I agree with reading the bible everyday. That is about being mentally prepared and listening to Gods word. It does not help you become physically prepared unless you follow the teaching of it.
            You have to keep your body the temple in shape and that takes hard work.

            • Nobama says:

              I agree, reading the bible is a great way to temporarily escape reality. Soak yourself in a fictional fantasy. The worst part of it is putting it down knowing you’re back in the real world. Plus it’s cheaper than going to the movies.

              • pyrrhus99 says:

                Whatever your religious view, there is a lot more reality in the bible than there is in modern culture.

              • the renegade braveheart says:

                Nobama, you make a valid point about Jehovah’s witnesses. I also believe they’re bogus. However, I would say that the communist manifesto would be a far better dose of fictional fantasy if that’s what you’re looking for.

              • Jay in UK says:

                You’re a fool. How funny will you be when you stand before the Almighty on Judgment Day? What sharp quip will you throw out then, as you’re being lowered into the Lake of Fire?

              • TEST says:

                Brilliant, Nobama. The biggest fiction is those who refuse to deal with the historical reality of the resurrection. For example, Simon Greenleaf. Greenleaf helped found Harvard Law School, or at least bring it to the prominence it has today. Most importantly, ****Greenleaf was responsible for articulating and formalizing what this whole country considers as valid evidence in a court of law.**** Did you know this, Nobama? I doubt it, but you can correct me if I am wrong. Greenleaf was Jewish. Someone challenged him to consider the evidence for the resurrection of Christ, which – out of intellectual honesty, he did. Turns out the evidence was so compelling, he became a Christian, and wrote “The Testimony of the Evangelists” to document what he found.

                The question is, Nobama – DO YOU HAVE THE INTELLECTUAL HONESTY TO DO THE SAME? Or do you remain in your own utterly unsupported RELIGION of humanism?

                Incidentally, I was not a Christian until I had the intellectual honesty to read the Bible for myself, and consider the evidence. I wonder if you have the same? Or is it that you just have your biases based on ignorance of fact?

              • TEST says:

                Interestingly, “religion” is defined by some as ANYTHING that tells us where we came from, why we are here, and where we are going. By that definition, Nobama’s humanism, or even atheism, is also a religion. As Camus once wrote, “I claim I believe in nothing, but even THAT is something.”

                The sad truth about people like Nobama is that there is an EQUAL and opposite need to not believe in God, as CS Lewis noted. Hey, I can do WHATEVER I want, and no God to get His grimy hands on me. So, don’t give me this “fictional fantasy” horse manure, Nobama. As a matter of fact, it was CHRISTIANS, not the Local Atheist League, that founded hospitals; it was CHRISTIANS who took in kids in the Roman culture who were left to die of exposure; it was CHRISTIANS who founded the Red Cross; it was Christians, led by William Wilberforce and others in the US, who abolished slavery; and it is Christians like me who, e.g., recently adopted a half black, half Mexican young man and put him through his certified nursing assistant degree ON MY OWN DIME.

                “Real world” indeed. Your post is both unthinking, unfair and ill-considered, not to mention utterly out of synch with both history and reality. You seriously need to re-evaluate your presuppositions.

              • Nobama says:

                Jay in the UK, and all you other bible-thumping bimbos, if your religion really believes that people that disagree with your beliefs should burn in hell then that only makes you part of a terrorist group no better than ISIS. What’s the difference between throwing “infidels” in a burning lake of fire and beheading them? Damn you’re evil.

              • THE EVER SEEING EYE says:

                Nobama

                You have the right to feel the way you do.
                But you have to remember people back in biblical days also had the faults trials, tribulations, and bad judgements.

                But they survived because they were together in mind, spirit, and heart.

                The smart ones believed in GOD and survived
                True they had to do some bad things but if you learn from what is written people will be on top and survive.

                We are all in this together.

                I am not a Bible Thumped but I still believe.

                I hope that I expressed this in the right way.

              • chickadee says:

                manifest destiny is not in the bible, it is a man made term, but you know that. Frankly, it would suit me just fine if you continue as you are and never make Christ the Lord of your life. That way I don’t have to look at your sorry, disrespectful ass across the table at the marriage supper of the lamb. If you really want to seal the deal on your as of yet lost soul then put a few words on here blaspheming the Holy Spirit and you got yourself a one way non refundable ticket to a place you don’t think exists. Go ahead, make my day.

        • Jim in Va. says:

          Acid; You assume too much…that’ll do you harm or may kill you in a tough situation.

          • Anonymous says:

            THAT is why people don’t believe in the Bible– (Jay’s ridiculous remarks!!)

            How can someone say God is Love in one breath and in the next breath, they say He will throw us into a lake of ever-lasting fire– because some of us didn’t learn the lessons on Earth we were supposed to learn– THAT IS CONTRADICTORY!!!

            You can’t have it both ways– either God is Love (and He is) or— he gets mad and throws you in an everlasting fire forever…

            Would you throw your kids into a lake of fire– forget the “everlasting” part– would you throw your kids into the fire because they didn’t learn the lessons they were supposed to learn? Why not? BECAUSE YOU LOVE YOUR KIDS!!

            Then HOW DARE YOU ASCRIBE TO OUR CREATOR– WHO IS LOVE– SOMETHING THAT YOU YOURSELF WOULD NEVER DO!!! Its is sacri-religious to talk that way! Do you actually believe that you are more compassionate than our Creator?

            God is Love. Period. So please stop all the BS. No wonder kids nowdays are turned off by religion– they are not stupid!

            • Pissed Off Granny says:

              Hate to tell you this Anonymous.

              Have you skipped the Book of Revelation? There IS a judgment day and there is a lake of fire; and GOD/Jesus Christ WILL judge and some people’s souls will perish.

              The “Father forgive them because they know not what they do” was addressed to the ROMAN SOLDIERS. Are you telling us that the jews that ask for Jesus’ death did not know what they were doing when they insisted Jesus be put to death?

              There is verse after verse of God/Jesus hating different people in the Bible that was persecuting Christians. Verse after verse telling Christians to have NOTHING to do with unbelievers, not to even have them in your house or bid them Godspeed.

              When the Book of Life is opened on judgment day and your souls name is not found there, what does the Bible say is going to happen to you?

              Don’t care what “love” your preacher/teacher is telling you about; there are consequences for our actions in this life. If you have not accepted Jesus and ask (truly) for forgiveness of your sins; judgment day is not going to be a day of loving comfort for you.

              • Anonymous says:

                Granny. You keep reciting the Bible which is just theory with Zero proof. Do you believe everything you read? Nobody has ever been saved or granted everlasting life or fire and brimstone. You need to get past those facts first before you can convince anybody that the Babble has any validity.

              • Nobama says:

                So the almighty on judgement day wants unbelievers to burn in a lake of fire, just the same as Islams want to behead infidels, all for merely disagreeing with the bible/koran. So what makes Christianity any better than ISIS/Islam terrorists? Total crap. You religious followers aren’t any smarter than mere sheeple.

            • chickadee says:

              Without Christ He ceases to be our creator and love goes out the window. The bible clearly states that if we believe in Christ and His teachings then we are sons, and if not Bastards. No bastard will enter into the Kingdom. People like you live in a river of delusion about God’s love, the bible also says He is a ‘consuming fire’. Go figure.

          • the renegade braveheart says:

            Nobama, you sound more like you believe in the communist manifesto. If that’s so, then you’re really lost.

        • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

          Spot on Acid. I always relish a challenge to push myeslf. Scuba diving and spear fishing. Gong dow to chose the fish I want for the table istead of random garbage fish on a fishing line. Free diving for Lobster, snow skiing flying 30 -40 miles an hour down a hill where and chunk of ice can trow you off balance. Going into a dark smoky burning buildings pulling
          bodies out its the challenge standing on a corner during election time calling the candidate a fraud. Alpha also means standing up for the truth and when people are getting picked on. I have given you green thumbs in the padt when everybody else dumps on you. And you take a stand and state your reasons. While the rest of the cowards just call you name without giving and credible info for a debate of the facts. Keep the good posts coming as many men have no balls anymore either low T or just keyboard woosies. WWTI. Rock on! I’m over 50 and go bike trail riding. Get busy living or get busy dying. And what are you going to do today to get your body in shape?

          • Mike in VA says:

            WWTI

            This is a straight forward question from me. You mentioned MMA style in one of your post about a week ago. Do you practice MMA?

            • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

              Yeah I have a MMA Knuckle sandwich here for ya. Stop by any time Mike in Va.

              • the renegade braveheart says:

                To WWTI, Nobama, and any other atheists here. Back in the 1970s, I left “organized religion” for personal reasons of my own, but that’s another story for another time. Both of you sound like you would fit right in on any MSM site. In fact, I’ve seen comments just like yours on MSM sites in the past. I respect the rights of Mike in VA, Swinging on a star, Barncat, and others to their religious views, even if they differ to some degree from mine. You 2 should go to any MSM site you choose and you would fit right in.

              • Mike in Va says:

                WWTI

                No problem man. Krav does not do well in the MMA. All the moves are illegal because they are directed at only vital areas.
                I would surly welcome the sandwich if you are man enough to deliver it.
                Actually I am sorry. I will not be sarcastic this time. I don’t want the sandwich and will try to avoid it. I don’t want to hurt anyone.

        • mark says:

          Most people can’t afford this type setup but some can and they are who this article was written for. I have friends who could buy 10 or more of these type retreats and others who have trouble buying a 25 lb. Sack of rice and some at varying levels between.
          Every article doesn’t have to fit everyone.
          Mac has a diversity of articles for all levels of financial means and ability otherwise he could have titled the blog SHTFFRAF (SHIT HITS THE FAN FOR RICH ASSED FOLKS) or SHTFFBAF (SHIT HITS THE FAN FOR BROKE ASSED FOLKS).

        • Night Breaker says:

          AE ,
          For once you are right on target , PT is your most valuable prep . Without being in decent shape your chances of survival rapidly fall. Extreme sports is excellent training for the younger to fit middle aged ( if you know your limitations) . Know who your friends are and choose wisely , OPSEC about your preps and a small organized group will be invaluable in the coming festivities , train and work as a team. Not getting in some form fitness is not an excuse , others like me who are on the wrong side of 55 , walking , hiking carring that pack , tactical training etc ( provided for me no cost at work LOL) and some general form of moderate exercise ( Situps, cruches , pushups ) that can be tolerated reaps great rewards. Start out small and GRADUALLY work up the repetitions ( if older get approval of you medical professional ) . If I can do it you can too. ( combat wounded, 56 yo) watching what you eat ( no junk food , cut fat , excessive salt , stop smoking , drinking ) can also improve the quality of your life , as getting regular medical checkups , making sure your imunizations are up to date ( if you do not have adverse reactions ) remember you are your best defensive implement .

          I encourage you to read the latest stories on western rifle shooters considering the developments in CT, it is one of the many flashpoints that may happen after the election, the next 72 hours may be the most critical in he history of the country since the end of the Second World War. Make no mistake many things can happen Ferguson is looming on the horizon and along with the race agitprop the MSM has been spewing recently anything can happen without warning ( BI ‘s Black Swan Event) alertness is something everyone should be practicing now . Please read my alert post in the last story and follow the links, use this as a fair warning of what may transpire.

          Use this weekend to get your last preps in , your 1st , 2nd and 3 rd line gear in order , we may be witnessing soon the end of the current regime and the last spasm of a dying leviathan . The main question you may want to ask yourself at this time , which side of hustory do I want to be on?
          The collectivists or the the individualist with liberty on your side .
          Once during a great challenge it was remarked ” So much is owed to so few” the ones who stood up when it counted , did. mighty deeds , Defended freedom at all cost and delivered a hard fought victory.
          From Lexington Green to the Mountains of Afganistan , Americans have always strived for justice and individual LIBERTY , we of this generation are no different , when confronted by EVIL one must stand up or all will perish or worse live as a slave wishing for that time of action to return so we could have prevent it .

          As for them of the past THIS WILL BE OUR FINEST HOUR .

          Even if you believe your vote does not count , just do it , numbers at the poll will send a clear message to the powers that be let it state NOMI !
          Do your duty
          See you all on the other side .

          LIVE HARD DIE FREE

          Semper Fi 8541

        • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

          The Biggest Blabber Mouths in a prepping group are the Children who don’t quite understand OPSEC. These kids go to school and talk about the same things we do here. Blab Blab. Kids watch the walking dead shows too. then talk about it at school. Comparing who’s parents are the most outlandish of their prepping, building bunkers, safe rooms, food stores, Guns and ammo.

          Parents this is how you start out the conversation with your children. “Hey kids I want to ask you a question. How many other kids that you know, who’s parents Prep??”

          Then just ask them all about other kids parents prepping. You can be sure you kids have been spilling the beans about you as well, but may not admit it right away. Cause they all try to out do the other kids with info. Even teachers may be data mining your kids about your prepping habits, like how many kids parents have guns in their houses? How many stock up on food? You kids spill the beans and you will wonder why your house was over run when SHTF, cause little johnny told his dad where they can find food. Kids sleepover they are into everything in your house. After school before you get home you kids will be showing other kids all your food preps when they are looking for snacks, before Mom or dad gets home.

          Think about that “food for thought.”

        • Mike in VA says:

          Acid

          Got to say I agree with you on this one. How many preppers do you know that could not walk a mile without being out of breath.
          I am no spring chicken anymore. But in the last year I increased what I do to stay in shape. The older I get the harder I seem to have to work at it. Now I tore my knee up. I have had around 10 people tell me heh you are not 20 anymore you know. Then they tell me I should not be doing krav maga. Even the knee doctor said it. I asked him why and he said because it was one of the more risky things you do. You have to balance life between family, work, and staying in shape.

          I bet he would not have told a 20 year old that. He is a sports medicine orthopedic doctor. That pissed me off.

          I hate being told I cannot do something. I am going back to Krav for sure.

      • Audentis Fortuna Iuvat says:

        …….Just a thought I have had more than once….a gut feeling. Has ANYBODY other than myself EVER thought that “they” are trying to get us “like minded individuals” to the re-doubt on purpose?……Or am I being cautiously pesimistic?

        • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

          No doubt the Redoubt is looked at in the MSM as the rebellious off the grid typed heavily armed to the teeth, and will be one of the first placed the DHS will attack to prove they can over take the most rebellious. Then will be a demoralizing affect on the rest of the country to submit.

          Just saying and my take. You are safer as a Lone Wolf out there than hanging out in a Militia and seen as a threat. Once you are on the DHS List, you will not be taken off. Like the No Fly List.

      • helot says:

        the renegade braveheart, lover of empire, defender of the demand you vote crowd says: “Just another Skousen article for me to call BS on.”

        Psft.

        • the renegade braveheart says:

          Helot, you have me confused with someone else. I have never said go out and vote. I’ve never even been a registered voter myself. I’ve never seen anyone worth voting for. I know how evil and screwed up the system is and have my own gripes about it. I’ve never supported the empire and never will. the system can and will fail. That is inevitable. It’s only a question of when. I realize there’s no way we’ll ever vote ourselves out of this mess. The ballot box has failed and now we have to turn to the cartridge box. Take care.

      • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

        Are you even reading the article or just assuming what it is about by the Authors name? There is more prepping ifo in the article than half of the stupid comments below here. Lol
        In the article there are prepping strategies you can employ in ypur existing home. Its not all about location. How about building false walls in your house and used as storage for weapons and ammo. Or hiding valuables out of sight out of mind. A hidden space used as a safe room and for hiding food. Go back and read the article. Just saying.

    • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

      Where to Find Like Minded Communities? Just Stay in Place, as pretty much every City in America after SHTF will be a place where the Populace will be fighting the Government. We will all be like minded, knowing the Government is massively FUBAR.

      • helot says:

        WhoWuddaThunkIt says: “We will all be like minded”

        Well, that’s a hellofa thing for you to say in light of past comments and those of others.

        When SHTF – and even now – we’ll be anything But, “all like minded”.

        RE: “as pretty much every City in America after SHTF will be a place where the Populace will be fighting the Government.”

        WTH???

        WhoWuddaThunkIt says: “Helot, I hope you don’t vote. Just makes my vote worth more. And please do encourage your other moron friends not to vote either. Thx for your cooperation.”

        Seems to me you get the goobermint you vote for and love. It’s as if you were one and the same?

        BTW, will we still be seeing your nic after the election is over?
        A Lot of people “suddenly” disappear after elections, funny that.

        • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

          Helot. I said no for you not to vote. And yes everybody else yes go vote. I have no idea what planet you came from. I already early voted. Please tell us why you think people will dissapear after the election. What is it you know that we don’t. LoL

        • oicu812 says:

          Please, both of you stay around.

          We love having your liberal and atheistic comments posted.

          It gives us fodder for our cannons.

          • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

            Notice how GAS PRICES always seem to suddenly DROP just before an Election. Like people will say, “Oh the economy is now doing so great under the current party.” Then watch them double up Gas Prices, again next month. Right now TODAY is when you buy GAS, FOOD, AMMO, GUNS, etc. Before all hell breaks loose. That means fire and brimstone for your fearful Christians.

        • mark says:

          I heard a joke the other day. It went like this:
          My Grandfather always voted for conservative constitutionist candidates before he died….now he votes for liberal communist candidates.

          Ain’t it so!

        • Professors Higgins says:

          Well, well, all the calls for an ‘October Surprise’ earlier this year, and guess what; It’s now November and No Surprise! But with your limited intellect and short term memory problems, you have all forgotten, again. All these failed predictions, and yet you persist in believing in any, if not all of them. You are either just too stupid to remember them, or you selectively ignore them as a form of psychological protection. Gasoline is now down below $3.00 in some parts of America and continues to fall, so much for $4 to infinity and the energy crisis that many predicted. Gold and silver are at 4 year lows, so much for monetary collapse this year too, just like 2013 and before. Ebola is not spreading like some reincarnation of the Black Death, in fact, it’s almost yesterday’s news and soon shall be all but forgotten, just like SARS and the various Flu scares. All these hoped for disasters have failed miserably and you’re all so saddened that you won’t have chaos for Christmas this year either. Well, if you wish, and hope, and pray hard enough, perhaps your Mad Max dreams will come true next year. Happy New year everyone!!

          • FreeSlave says:

            The stock market is at an all time high too. Obamanomics is working. Just like obamacare.

            Just keep mocking shtf preppers professor Higgins.

            • Professor Higgins says:

              FreeSlave: Your name is quite fitting; you’ve chosen to be a slave, which is far worse than being forced into it. You’ve given up free and critical thinking and settled for groupthink. People have been hawking books on the end of American society, its economy, or some combination thereof for at least the last 40 years. And suckers like you buy their books, newsletters, DVDs, and various materials so that you can ‘Be Ready’ when “IT” happens, whatever IT turns out to be. They are, and have been, laughing all the way to the bank for decades and chumps like you keep doling out the money so that you can survive Armageddon. P.T. Barnum was correct when he said that “there is a sucker born every minute”, and you’re just one more.

          • Mike in VA says:

            Professor

            I don’t care about predictions. Never have because no one knows what tomorrow holds. I just try to prepare for all threats.

            Are you a prepper?
            If not then why are you here?
            If so then you should not care about predictions but should care about any warning signs others see?

            • Professor Higgins says:

              Mike in VA: I’m here because I care about the mental wellbeing of others and I’ve seen a precipitous decline in that mental wellbeing within certain segments of the American population over the last several years. The main manifestation of this decline is worry and the anger that stems from that worry. This worry is about the future of this country and its current socio-economic functions. Many fear America’s decline as a world leader in all areas. When people worry, they begin to imagine things that just aren’t so such as secret organizations plotting their demise or enslavement. These paranoid fantasies are not new, they’ve actually been around for centuries and are a mix of Christian and pagan mythology throughout European history. You Americans fancy yourselves as being the center of the world and that some “evil” forces are at work to destroy you. But as I’ve just pointed out, that’s old news in Europe, where, by the way, most of your ancestors come from. Small wonder that these fables crossed the Atlantic with your intrepid forbearers. America is merely experiencing what all great nations do, a decline in its status as a world leader. It may bounce back, or it may be just another ‘also-ran’ like all the former European world powers. It’s not the end of the world, only America’s role as leader. You’re preparing for nothing but your own county’s “downsizing”. Sorry, there will be no Mad Max ending this, or any Christmas season. Ho, ho, ho.

              • handofgod says:

                LYNCH HIGGINS!! He’s an infiltrator and doesn’t belong here.

              • Mike in Va says:

                Professor

                You just answered two questions for me.

                1 – One is you are not a prepper and are only here to cause trouble.

                2- Professor you are not. Well you got a degree in B.S.

                So I will not waste my time speaking to you any longer. Hope you have the greatest day my friend. I sure hope you don’t try to further your degree.

              • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

                I like the part that religions actually make the weak more paranoid and fearful and suck them deeper into their hoax of pagan mythology. As they cling tighter to their bibles, they abandon all commom sense or rational of reality.

          • Breathial says:

            Interesting take on things, professor. We’re I so inclined, I could easily get a job as a professor myself, though I doubt I would survive the built-in politics, turf wars and inflated egos that so many of my of my cohort face.

            I’d had one professor (doctorates in economics and information systems) tell me the economy would turn around, that everything would be fine. I didn’t listen to him, thank God.

            It’s easy to preach normalcy bias; ignorant people would prefer this to an ugly future. But an objective analysis of all the facts show that our situation (economy AND ebola) is anything but.

            When you make such inane comments, especially with your screen-name, it merely shows a person who’s ego is in charge, facts be damned.

            You should be embarrassed.

          • the renegade braveheart says:

            Higgins, who yanked on your chain, you bloody limey intellectual troll. Go away.

          • Daddyotis says:

            If you’re really a professor, then you are about as predictable as any academic I’ve met: smug, arrogant, so secure in their own worldview. And…if you ever needed some motivation as to the certainty of your beliefs, you can simply engage your colleagues in the faculty lounge. I am employed amidst this sanctimonious “intellectual” drivel every day, as I am employed at the University (only as a lecturer I might add…not a professor; I actually WORK for a living). For all the supposed critical thinking ability and use of the scientific method, I’ve found the majority of my “tenured” coworkers amazingly uninformed in any conversation outside of their narrow area of “expertise”. However, the raw hubris I encounter from these people as they expound on issues they know nothing about is staggering. Whaddya say, “Professor” Higgins? Are you going to wield your professorial status amongst us plebes so that we stand in awe of your raw intellect? Please do keep talking. We all await your next oh-so-intelligent response with baited breath.

            • Pissed Off Granny says:

              Daddyotis:

              Perfect response.

            • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

              Daddy otis. So what does your claim “you actually work for a living mean?” You sweat and toil over a laborous task giving yourself gratification of accomplishment?. Many people go to work every day to keep themselves busy. I decided long ago to wprk smart and not hard. There is a difference. I save my physical energy to enjoy my personal sports. My brain is aways working. Many people never work their brains and why many are stuck in manual labor jobs.

              • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

                And I would add lecturing daily drivel, by talking all day and saying so little, is kind of like the filling in a twinkee. Just another space waster with no molecular or nutritional value.

              • Pissed Off Granny says:

                WWTI:

                I agree your “brain is always working” but you seem to forget to shift it into ‘first’ before your fingers start typing.

                Matter of fact reverse is your favorite gear about 50% of the time.

          • Npgh says:

            @prof higgs…I have a prediction for you that you can bet on. AFTER the ELECTIONS tomorrow, all of the bad news will be coming out in the main stream news sources. It is a near guarantee that the Repubs will win and immigration, Ebola, unemployment, the stock market…all of it will be bad news. The game is for all of the bad policies and economy will be blamed on the Repubs so that in 2016 Democrats will have a solid win in the house and senate. The majority of people are being played while Rome is burning. WE,HERE, ARE READY. Too bad for you. The crap is going to hit the fan very soon.

            • Mike in Va says:

              Npgh

              Very interesting thought. The media does bring up more bad news when the republicans have power.
              I just believe in the long run both parties are on the same path. The path to destruction. The republicans are just moving a little slower on the path.

    • mark says:

      Most people can’t afford this type setup but some can and they are who this article was written for. I have friends who could buy 10 or more of these type retreats and others who have trouble buying a 25 lb. Sack of rice and some at varying levels between.
      Every article doesn’t have to fit everyone.
      Mac has a diversity of articles for all levels of financial means and ability otherwise he could have titled the blog SHTFFRAF (SHIT HITS THE FAN FOR RICH ASSED FOLKS) or SHTFFBAF (SHIT HITS THE FAN FOR BROKE ASSED FOLKS).

      • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

        Mark. Basically these articles by Joel Skousen tells the “Have-Nots” where to go get some Preps from the “Haves” when SHTF. When the mass population is hungry into the 10’s of Millions, they will set aside both morals and politics, and just go get them sum to satisfy their appetites. Just my take.

    • FreeSlave says:

      Mac I learned some interesting things from this article. It doesn’t matter that I can’t afford it, there were very good insightful generalizations.

    • ghost says:

      depressing article at best …

  2. the renegade braveheart says:

    Once again, leave it to Joel Skousen to try to sell preppers a bill of goods. There are already such communities scattered all over the US although I have no idea how many. When the time comes, I’ll be headed to one such community I have always been aware of in north GA. My family was born and raised in the prepper lifestyle and they all have their own homesteads. Every one of them learned how to hunt, fish, etc. at the earliest possible age, including the women. any one of those women are better shots than I am. Once I get to the BOL I’ll be learning about homesteading since that will be my new home. Going back to the city will not be an option for me.

    • Paranoid says:

      There is one secret prepper retreat that seems to work. We call it Wyoming.

      • Obtuseangler says:

        Paranoid, I was thinking the same thing while I was reading this article.

      • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

        Whyoming. ?? Go try bugging out for 30 days in winter and see how long you survive. When the Grid crashes half the population in northern climates will die. Frozen clinging to their Babble passages that did nothing for them but sealed their fate.

        • Ms.X says:

          WWTI,
          For someone that claims to be so productive you have a lot of time on your hands to make single minded comments.

        • Paranoid says:

          That’s exactly why we like it. You P whipped whiners won’t last one -20 day with a -60 wind chill. We will be happy to divide up your stuff. And won’t miss you.

          • dave in Idaho says:

            @ WWTI.. who needs the grid to survive other than some limp wristed, soft, keyboard commando… Im comfy up here.

            • Pissed Off Granny says:

              Dave:

              As a kid I was raised in Fairfield, Idaho. I remember snow so deep we tunneled out of our houses. Winter temps -40degrees. My folks were poor, couldn’t begin to recall all the deer and elk we lived on. Mom and Grandma canned during the summer so we never went without good food.

              Don’t recall any die off of the Bible loving folks in that community because of the “harsh” living conditions. My grandparents and parents lived into their late eighties.

              I would wager with WWTI that most people there will survive shtf better than where he lives. They prepare for their -40 degree shtf weather every year. Maybe 1,000 people in the whole county so easier to determine who the buzzards will be.

          • SheepDawg says:

            -20F with wind chill factor down to -60…..or what we in Alaska like to call a Tuesday.

            Seriously though, for those who complain about even 40F being cold, I pity the response given when TSHTF. Things could be so much worse in life than dealing with the cold. My ancestors survived worse conditions with less and I am here as proof of their tenacity and will to survive. I have good clothing. My high alpine, Norse, Anglo-Saxon and Celtic ancestors had much less and yet created civilizations that thrived and multiplied.

    • helot says:

      It’s interesting to me how much time the renegade braveheart spends attacking the ideas of Joel Skousen.

      I keep getting this feeling the renegade braveheart is one of those, “I’ve got mine, screw the rest of you” types which pepper this board.

      • oicu812 says:

        I don’t see that at all in Bravehaeart’s comments…oh great Obi Wan Da CriticKenobi.

        Do you keep a burr up your ass all the time or is it irreparable hemmoroids?

        R. Braveheart, like many others, are more interested in prepper practices instead of prepper places.

        The majority of folks here have enough common sense to know where tf they are gonna ride out the storm. If one needs help figuring out a good b o/b i, location, then Skousen’s site and some others aren’t that hard to find. i doubt too many are taking his advice, and the decisions where to “move the farm” or buy b. o. property, is based more upon relation to available work,water, and or friends and relatives.

        Mac does what he needs to, to keep the site going and I would do the same if i were in his shoes. i keep running across mentions of SHTFPlan, on other sites and we have a unique forum here. Yea, I’m sure we are being monitored by NSA and other “snoopers”, but fuck ’em, cause we won’t be the one’s hiding like moles.

      • the renegade braveheart says:

        Helot, did you forget to douche today? what is your problem?

    • helot says:

      Acid Etch, I will look look you in the eye and tell you that just about ANYONE is better for their daughter than you are.

      P.S.
      It’s odd how you conflate racism with libertarianism.
      Will you also be one of those nics we see disappear after the elections?

    • You need to get some serious help for your mental health issues!

    • Jim in Va. says:

      Acid you’d be last in line,behind anybody where my daughter would be concerned.

    • Kulafarmer says:

      People like you give people like us a bad name

    • Breathial says:

      Relax, Francis.

    • Charley Waite says:

      Kinda of harshly worded, but there is a nugget of peanut in Acid’s turd.

      See Fred

      http://www.fredoneverything.net/BlackPower.shtml

    • Sgt. Dale says:

      TRBH
      Hello my FRIEND! Hows it going?
      I know of a group that has been together for almost 30 years now and have add to the group. (Family and Friends that have finally woke up.)
      My family and yours are very close to the same. Hunt, fish, survive in the wild, Raise cattle and other farm animals, most important work for the common good.
      The only problem we have is getting everyone together to work on drills,, But we get some of them together when we can.
      Nobody knows what it is really going to be like because we haven’t been there before.
      I think it will be more like the 1880’s. Some one else may same it will be the stone age. Who knows?
      All I can do is Pray and Prep.
      AIM SMALL MISS SMALL
      Sgt.

      • the renegade braveheart says:

        Good evening, Sarge. Tue. is election day. Don’t be surprised if Obola starts issuing EOs on something before the week is over. I went back to the range today practicing with my 2 .22LR pistols only. Had 2 types of ammo with me. The first type I used in my semiauto gave me some feeding issues. Used the second type and no issues at all. Revolver worked like a charm. I was a little out of practice but that will be corrected now. Getting a new .380 this week and planning on getting another .22 before Dec. [early xmas gifts for braveheart]. My family is doing fine. I’m still hoping for the best and prepping for the worst. I just hope I don’t have to bugout before Christmas. [still want to get that other /22]. Take care.

        • Sgt. Dale says:

          TRBH
          Hey were they Remington H.P.’s that you were having trouble with. The darn things work great in most of my rifles & handguns, but in my AR 22. Everything else works great in the little gun. At 25 yards in my Mossberg bolt action I can put the bullets in the same hole with the Remington’s

          I’m going to vote early tomorrow. I hope my vote means something, and if the guys I’m backing don’t do what I want for this GREAT COUNTRY I’ll vote against them next time around!

          This time this election can make it or break it for the USA. (If she ain’t already dead)
          Obullshit will more than likely wait at least a week before It starts writing his EO’s. 10 Million Illegals, ban on 30rd mags, Assault weapons, ECT. Then The Shit Will Hit The Fan.

          Obullshit keeps saying he will work with the Rep. but only if they do it his way.

          Please folks VOTE—-VOTE—-VOTE It may not do any good but at least you can say you TRIDE! After all the only box we have left is the AMMO Box. (God Forbid)
          A.S.M.S.
          Sgt.

    • the renegade braveheart says:

      Acid, you make a valid point about white women being with black males, but your attitude toward women still sucks.

    • ghost says:

      once you go black, you never go back …

    • acid etch. I;ve not been your biggest fan, but bravo now for saying what needs to be said. Thanks man.

    • roddy says:

      Shouldn’t you be posting that on Stormfront?

  3. My strategic retreat location is the cab of my f150, because shtf for me and noone is helping me.

    • Nopittypartyhere says:

      Well Iowa, the bright side is your retreat is mobile, so long as you have gas in the tank. I pray things start looking up for you. Keep yourself focused on your objective, and try to not let little BS stuff get you down. A lot of us would live to give a helping hand, just don’t know how to make that happen.

      • the renegade braveheart says:

        Iowa, glad to see you hanging in there. Things will start looking up for you at some point. At least you have A roof over your head, even if it’s your truck. A lot of people these days don’t even have that. Just stay focused on what you want to achieve and you will get there.

        • Smokey says:

          Iowa, think like the guy at the AA meeting….one day at a time.

        • Outlaw says:

          I feel for ya Iowa, shtf for me and my family May 2013. Thats when the bastards at BoA stole our home, the last thing we really had left other than our preps and the equipment we need to run our business. Been living on a front porch since then, and we are about half-way through our preps, as we have had to start to draw from them and haven’t been able to continue to add as much. The good news is we have access to 2 acres, so we grew a 4800’sq garden this year. Learned lots. Put away a good amount of food for the winter. Also have some chickens, and about to expand into rabbits. Just hang in there. I promise you are not alone, and as bad as you think you may have it, someone out there has it worse off. At least thats what I tell myself. We are just the first wave to reach the bottom. Will leave the light on for those who are not in here with us yet. We sure need you to wake up, cuz we can’t hang in here much longer by ourselves. It’s long past time to get the rope and pitchforks out.

          • Vicky says:

            We are so sorry! This would be about my worst nightmare and it’s very hard to recover. I don’t suppose there are any government programs for you, even for just a little while. The gov doesn’t like people who take care of themselves or don’t vote in exchange for handouts.

            We were in a position like yours about fifteen years ago and it’s taken a long time to climb back up. The problem is, the world was a little more sane back then, and we didn’t have to actively fight the gov while we tried to survive. We had to move four states away from home to even have a chance. We sold my wedding ring for gas money and drove straight through, but I don’t even know that you can do that now. What are you going to do this winter? When we climbed out, there was no one to help, but now the government actually pushes you back down into the pot. We wish you the best but realize it was possible for us to recover and may be awfully late for you.

    • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

      I keep asking why are the current land owners selling out right now. Thought this was the place? Yes them and a million other paranoid preppers all staring at each other.

    • Slab City, dood…if you can get there ‘fore winter.

    • Tune that radio into some AM “pining music” and take that F150 down to the local watering hole for some straight up bourbon or scotch and a couple games of 9 ball.

      You will meet the nicest women you ever met after a couple hours.

      Have some fun but make sure you don’t take anything home but your own pool stick.

    • fester says:

      Iowa are you a vet?

      ‘BEING HOMELESS SUCKS AND UNNECESSARY AT THIS MOMENT IN ZOG AMERIKA!’

      if you are a ‘homeless veteran’.

      contact your states veteran homeless coordinator at your nearest v.a. hospital.

      if not a veteran then go to your nearest department of public health and also stop by your local ‘community housing assistance office’ every county , some big towns, most cities in the country has one for housing assistance.

      if you need a job go to ‘monster . com’ and ‘veteranstoday . com’ at your local ‘county job center’.

      IF YOU NEED HELP, LET US KNOW, WE CAN HELP GET YOU WHERE YOU GOTTA GO!

      .f.

      • fester says:

        if you’re physically active and like to make good money head to the oil fields in north dakota/ e.montana.

        and become a self employed ‘HOTSHOT'(oil field drill equipment transporter)!

        they start out at $25. hr +

        .f.

    • dave in Idaho says:

      I lived in my 65 Impala for 2 months.

    • helot says:

      Iowa, generally speaking, that’s a bunch of boolsheet, and you know it. So do the twenty or so Thumbs Up you got. The goobermint might not be there, but others will.

      If you ask.

    • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

      Iowa better head someplace warm before winter sets in. You will be scraping frost of the inside windshield. When on the Fire Dept we found people frozen inside vehicles. Nothing to mess with. Cold kills.

      • Smokey says:

        When my folks were in Minot, ND, the neighbor lady took her trash out to the curb, wearing slippers and a robe, one windy winter morning. She locked herself out, and an hour later was near death from the cold when Mom went out and saw her on her porch.

        Dad’s work truck had a monitored two-way radio, and an 80-gallon diesel tank. The rule was, you checked in hourly, and never turned the engine off, and never walked so much as a mile for help, you wouldn’t make if you tried.

        No one would drive past a stalled car without checking for passengers.

    • passinwiththewind says:

      My question for you Iowa is this:

      Are you a man/child of God or what?

      Have you gotten down on your knees lately?

      When a person feels they are at their lowest point, they need to get a little lower, and look up to their Creator; their Heavenly Father, that can and will, bring them out/thru anything.

      But “first”, very very important, one must “humble” themselves before making those redemptive words.
      Not one sparrow falls from a branch that God doesn’t know about, so how much greater are you, in God’s eye, than a little bird?

      If you do what is required of you, Iowa; then you will be amazed at how doors will start opening before you.
      Doors that never existed before will be in front of you and start flinging open. You have to believe and then act, because actions/works, without faith…is dead!

      let me know what you are doing, and I will pray with you if you like. When two come together, in the name of Jesus, and pray, it will be manifested in Heaven. That is a fact, my friend.

      Let me know.
      pwtw

      • Nobama says:

        You can get down on your knees for Jesus if you want, just don’t make me watch.

        • TEST says:

          Sad to see how bitter you are against God. I wonder what caused it. No, no one will make you watch, as you well know. I am just saddened that your bitterness has closed your mind and heart to simply looking at facts. The issue, it appears, is one of theodicy for you. I will take a moment now to pray for you, as nothing can break through a closed heart but God.

        • the renegade braveheart says:

          Nobama, STFU.

        • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

          Jebus can’t save you and he’s never coming back. Man has been lied to for over 2000 years that jebus is coming back. If you loaned a friend $5 and he said they will pay you back when they come back next time, how much time would let pass to realize that you will never see your $5 again? A week? A month? A year? How about 2000 years? Folks that is what you call Faith. A set of beliefs absent of any facts or proof.

      • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

        Pissinthewind. Another religious freak preying on the weak and vulnerable brainwashing them to their cult. Forget the bible bable Iowa. Just put your truck in gear and keep on driving. Head south for the winter and start a new life and make new friends. Create opportunities. Praying a a wothless waste of time for procrastinators.

        • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

          On you knees prayin is no different that giving up as a coward before you get executed. Stand up and be a man and fight for your life doing somehing about it. Think solutions not excuses. Dont submit you soul to anybody. Only sheep and cowards do that

      • passinwiththewind says:

        Looks like the antichrist supporters have been busy with the red thumbs today.

        The path is wide and those that choose to walk to their own destruction are filling it up….fast.

        It’s a sad state of affairs when someone reaches out to a fellow man, down on his luck, and gets degraded for it. The red thumbs don’t bother me in the least; it is just sad to see what has become of humanity.

    • Iowa, it’s too bad you don’t live in Indiana. A lot of the temp agencies are hiring for the factories. You won’t make anything near union wages, but the hours are plentiful and the work steady. My son was able to get a job within two weeks of putting in his application with the temp agency, and the factory hired him within three months.

      • I have a job, but my biss got evicted and moved to a different location and the internet thad taken 3 weeks this Monday to get installed. I’ve used those 3 weeks to dump 70 garbage bags of my wife’s crap in random dumpsters across town and move my crap into a storage unit. My deal is the only 2 options I have to sleep on someone’s couch, involve cockroaches, so I sleep in my truck outside. It’s raining, pouring, lightening, and I’m yelling “Bring it Lord”, because God Is Good!

    • Hey Mac, why’s my name in RED?

      • Mike in Va says:

        Iowa

        I have offered to email with you a few times. Would love to talk to you. Have been through a lot of the same things you have man.
        I am just a friend offering a helping hand.

    • Earnings and Hours Qty Rate Current YTD Amount

      Hourly – ND 80.00 27.00 2,160.00 12,069.00

      Hourly – ND (OT x 1.5) 62.50 40.50 2,531.25 9,922.50

      Bonus 500.00

      Taxes Current YTD Amount

      Federal Withholding -697.00 -2,938.00

      Social Security Employee -290.85 -1,394.47

      Medicare Employee -68.03 -326.13

      ND – Withholding -67.00 -285.00

      Adjustments to Net Pay Current YTD Amount

      Housing Contribution -200.00 -1,200.00

      Rent – One Time Cleaning Fee -125.00

      Net Pay 3,368.37 16,222.90

      142.50 4,691.25 22,491.50

      -1,122.88 -4,943.60

      -200.00 -1,325.00

      Iowa– one week less than 3 months in N D oilfields. If you have any skills at all you can get work here. 18 bux an hour stocking wal mart shelves in williston is just an example. As far as acid’s remark of getting rid of fat, 70+ hrs a week will do wonders on your waist line.

    • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

      Iowa, Get a Camper top for your back end and set up a dual battery source with an power inverter. Throw some a few solar panels on the roof, and live off the grid. Get a below zero sleeping bag, some black out film and curtains, then find a safe place to park. Cheap living.. There are lots of people who live in a van down by the river.

    • sixpack says:

      TRUE Story, Iowa…

      My dad lived for more than two decades in his truck. He finally found himself a topper for it, and he thought he was in heaven. He also lived for years in the back of a van. He just hated to pay rent to some schmuck, just to be told what he can’t do and when.

      He kept his cooler in one corner, his coleman stove on top of that and his bed down the middle. Fishing pole and rifle always within reach. He had everything he really needed in his vehicle with him.

      Before he could afford the vehicle, he slept under a bridge, within walking distance of where he had found a job. He stayed under that bridge, until he got the money together to buy his truck.

      He also parked at city parks unnoticed, using their public restrooms to clean up. He went up into the campgrounds and woods, stayed on old logging roads, cleaning up in the nearest creek. He blended in where ever he went.

      He would work out agreements with farmers all the time. He’d work for them in the fields, in the shop or on the equipment in exchange for a paycheck, and a patch of ground to park on for the duration. Sometimes he stayed in the seasonal help cabins or a bunk house. He knew his way around any farm or ranch, so he was good to go almost anywhere.

      Even roadside rest stops were his home if he chose.

      That was how he PREFERRED to live. My point is, Iowa, you have an opportunity for freedom and greater independence while you get back on your feet. It doesn’t need to be permanent like with my dad, but you should enjoy it while you can.

      The best one to help you, is you. All you’ve got to do is set your mind to it. Good luck Dude. There are many people worse off than you.

      • I could easily do the same in my van. i lived in it 4 months in nd two years ago and if I was single I would sell my property and do as your dad did. I could work maybe 3 to 4 months in the oil patch and have the rest of the time off to fish and hunt. THAT would be a freedom few ever know. we are slaves to our possessions.

      • the renegade braveheart says:

        Sixpack and Iowa, another TRUE story. In Nov. 1982, I got burned out of a mobile home less than a month after moving in; electrical fire according to the fire dept. I didn’t lose much since most of my belongings were in storage at my Dad’s place at the time. So I lived inside my 1972 Dodge van for 2 weeks until I found another place. It was just a plain cargo van with a mattress, blankets, and pillow. It was just becoming cold at the time and was hard to sleep in but I survived it. You can do whatever you want if you just set your mind to it. Have faith in God and he will see you through whatever situation you’re in.

        • sixpack says:

          I had a coleman stove and left the window near it cracked open a couple of inches. I shut it off when I went to sleep. A hot cup of coffee never tasted so good in the mornings, as it did then.

          I think it was the fresh smell of ‘morning’ that made it taste different, somehow. If I had a good van, I would be sitting on a river bank somewhere right now.

      • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

        Iowa, keep a daily diary and write a book get it published and make a million dollars. Sell the movie rights to Hollywood.

      • dave in Idaho says:

        I found out the hard way that here in Idaho, they turn on the lawn sprinklers every night at the rest stops.

      • Mike in Va says:

        Six

        You are one of several people I would like to be able to email with. Contact Eppe if you would like to do that or I can give you my email here.
        I hope you are doing well. You can tell those on here that have strength mentally. That will be the most important thing in the upcoming collapse.
        So many Americans have become such mental midgets with the give me give me mentality. They feel they are owed things and have never done a days work of manual labor in there life. They feel if we will just be nice to our enemies then they will start to love us.
        You are just one tough individual. That is the type of person I want to associate with.

        • sixpack says:

          I take that as a compliment, Mike in VA.

          I was indeed “born between a rock and a hard place” and I’m afraid it shows in everything I am.

          I’ve tried to take it to a more personal level with a couple of people from here. Three times in fact. I’m 1-1-1. One “win”, one “tie” and one loss.

          I guess the problem was, I’m not here to try to become like-minded. People can almost never be totally like-minded, and that’s okay by me. I don’t entirely agree with anyone, nor do I require that they always agree with me in order to be considered “like-minded” or a friend.

          God made me who I am, and I don’t plan on changing who he made me. Only a true friend could live with that.

          I don’t have eppe’s email, but I think he left it on a post somewhere. I’ll see if I can find it.

        • sixpack says:

          I changed my mind about playing round robin. sixpack6t9 at yahoo…go for it, mike in va.

    • Overwatch says:

      Iowa, I am very sorry to hear of your predicament. When you’re at the bottom of a hole there’s nowhere to look but up. Keep us posted.

    • Sgt. Dale says:

      Iowa
      Hey my friend you have a place with me if you want it. All you have to do is get on Rt80 and come to Illinois when the SHTF. If you want to contact me. Here is my EMAIL. sgt.dale@hotmail.com
      Sgt.

    • PKLL says:

      Iowa: set up a po box and post the address…many would like to help you…

      pKLL

  4. hammerhead says:

    Good article ,
    I built alot of safe rooms , for attorneys.
    HAHA , Always a confidentiality agreement involved.
    I think the number of people createing “safe” and secure spaces for storing valubles is underestimated.
    As well as the number of people who prepare for “whatever” .

    • Walt Kowalski says:

      “The first thing we do, we kill all the lawyers”. (Shakespeare- King Henry VI)

    • Enemy of the State says:

      Ha Lawyers..lol

      I had one all nervous and wanting me to install CCTV / security cameras on his home, yeah the story was a few guys were getting out of jail/prison after he was the one who put them there, and probably not very honestly I may suggest

      after all the F-ing we take from them I finally had my chance to return the favor

      Like Glen Frey said On the song “smugglers blues”

      ‘ol Billy was right kill all the lawyers kill em tonight”

  5. Mike in Va says:

    The post after this one is a story I decided to write. It is meant to make people think. It is not meant to offend anyone. Nor criticize anyone. It is just meant to make me and others think.
    It hurt to write it as well.

  6. Mike in Va says:

    November 6, 2016

    It has happened. The power is out. Cell phone service is down. All electronic devices are not working. I have seen flashes in the sky on the horizen. Not sure what the flashes are but believe there
    has been a nuclear E.M.P. strike. That is the only thing that cause so many electrical devices to not work. It is 02:48 A.M. here. Luckily I am a night owl. I suspect most of the world does not
    have a clue about what has just taken place. If it was an E.M.P. then many will die and we may not have power for years. I knew something was coming. Now Barrack Obama will try to be president forever.
    There will be a war for freedom in this country. I will fight for freedom until my last breath. We have to have freedom once again. If we lose this then there is no future for you my children and
    childrens children. Obama I believe set the E.M.P.’s off and now once to be dictater forever. I will write the story of what happens next when I can. Not sure when I will be able too because
    things are going to become serious life and death situations.

    February 20, 2017

    Sorry it took so long to write another post. Things went to hell in a handbasket much quicker than I anticipated. Fighting, stealing, looting, raping, and mass killings. People started acting like
    animals after about a week. There was panic and fights after 2 days. The power is still not on. Some old vehicles work and my 4 wheeler works. I am so careful to not reveal some of what I have.
    Thank god I stocked up on food, water, and ammonition. The big gas tank I got has given me a big advantage over most. Gas is extremely scarce and has been siphoned out of every new vihicle. All of my
    friends and relatives have banded together. We have barracaded the road in both directions. There are people or maybe I should call them animals coming out of the cities to loot every house
    and do unspeakable things to people along the way. We have had one fight with such a gang. We killed 11 and wounded 23 that I know of. They were well equiped and we got lucky in my opinion. We cought
    them by suprise and had them in a crossfire at the river. My cousin Jamie died in that fight. His wife and kids now stay with us. The strain and stress of this is so much worse than I expected.
    Then again who would have any clue what this would be like unless they had been in a war without power. Maybe the soldiers in the civil war would have known the strain of this. I am so afraid.
    Not of dying but of watching the ones I love die. There are several in the community who are sick right now. My wife and oldest son are 2 of them. I fear for my oldest son the most because of all
    his medical conditions and cerebral palsy. We are almost out of his seizure and Crones disease medication. There is no way to get anymore. My youngest son and his family I am sure are trying to get
    here. That was the plan anyway. He would be coming from Georgia. I hope his wife and 2 boys all make it up here with him. I am worried greatly about that too. Will post again whenever I can.

    December 25, 2021

    It has been years since I have written in this. I just did not have the heart too. I cannot believe the pain and sorrow I and everyone else has had to endure. I lost my oldest son shortly after
    my last post. I loved him so. My youngest son finally made it to me. He showed up in April of 2017. He left his wife and sons in Georgia with her family. They were well prepared according to
    him. He had a ham radio and had found out that most of the cities had deterioted into desease ridden war zones. Most are burnt down ghost towns now. He also heard that forces for freedom were
    gathering in Northern VA to mount an attack against Washington D.C. He said that is another reason he left his wife in Georgia. My lovely wife of 18 years passed away in 2018. She got a scratch
    on her side from rusty fence. It became infected. We tried to stop the infection but had no medicine’s. I think it got into her blood but she suffered so. I have fealt several times i could take
    no more. Long term food storage and other prepped items I had were used up by mid 2018. I did have ammo left. Many relatives and friends died. My son and I decided to make the journey North and
    form up with the freedom fighters we heard were there. We made it after a couple of months. Nothing is easy but we made it to the freedom fighters. Thank god the story of them forming was true.
    We have fought with them now ever since. Conditions are miserable. We heard we were winning and that government officials were found in the sewer system and killed. We overran some secret bunkers
    and tunnels that were located and killed all there. Things are so horrible. We climb over dead bodies to get to the enemy at times. Supplies are hard to come by. Some fighting has been with rocks,
    baseball bats, swords, and knives. The stench is horrible from decaying bodies. Desease is rampant. There are packs of wild dogs eating human remains and you cannot be caught by the packs when
    you are alone or they will eat you alive. The lines have become so blurred. We did not know there were other forces that formed North and West of Washington. I am not sure but think the city
    was conquered and over run two months ago. Now things are in total chaous. Anyone in a military or police uniform was shot long ago. Now it is hard to tell who is who. The only people you trust
    are those in your unit. It seems that many different groups are fighting for control. I am sure that we have been in battles with other freedom fighters. The shooting starts if you are lucky enough
    to have ammo and then you just fight to the end. Most of the time the end of the fight is hand to hand and so vicious and bloody. It is just total confusion now. No clear enemies or friends.
    Just fighting like animals. It is Christmas and I am praying to my God. I have seen how evil all men can be. That includes me. I have done things that sicken me when I think about them. I so
    hope I am forgiven for them. Yes I felt I had no choice but it does not make it right. That is all I am willing to tell my descendents if there are any left other than my son by my side.

    August 8, 2022

    A truce was finally declared. Groups were fighting groups. Anyone is government was long dead I believe but will never know for sure. My son and I both have made it through the war it looks
    like. Are we going to make it another day. Who knows. Things are still dicey and not going as I had hoped. The leaders of the groups got together and formed a new capital in Charleston West VA.
    Hate and anger still seems to be present wherever you go. My son and I finally made it back to our home. I am so thankful it is still standing. I have a few distant family members and friends
    still alive. I still feel there is not much to be thankful for. At times I wish i had just died in the fighting. Everything I fought for and did seems to be for nothing. The country seems
    to have broken into different parts. There is so much hate that if you are a certain race, religion, or did a certain job befor the collapse you are shot. Here it appears we may have to leave.
    The leader of this section of the country which now is the new so called capital of the U.S. does not allow free opinion or speach. You have to be so careful what you say. If you say the wrong
    thing then if the wrong person hears it you can be hung.

    November 27, 2025

    Thanksgiving. The power has come back on in several areas. I don’t know how it did. It is still spradic and frequent outages. There is still shortages of food and medicine. All necessities really.
    The power is on right now and we are going to have a Turkey my son killed yesterday. Good luck for once. I have 3 things only to be thankful for. We left Virginia and made it to Georgia.
    I am thankful that my son, his wife, and my two grandkids are still alive. I am thankful for the Turkey my son killed yesterday. I am 57 now and not in the best of health. I am thankful that I
    will meet my maker soon. At least I think I will. I hope the good lord calls me home from this hell we call Earth.
    All the fighting and struggles ended up meaning nothing in my opinion. Man has shown to be Evil. The war against the government in Washington was won. We put down there lust for power and wealth.
    It means nothing because we put down a large corrupt government and now the country is broken up into several small areas that are at times even more corrupt then the large nation was.
    Man has really shown that inside he has wrath, greed, sloth, pride, lust, envy, and glutony. Every little section is a group of like minded individuals. Some are certain nationalities, races,
    religions, or groups of a certain belief. Blacks, Jews, old cops, military, muslems, indians, whites, chinese, even Irish are being killed to this day because of hatred of there fellow man.
    I have learned that there are good people in all of society. None of those groups are all bad nor are they all good. We are just all men and we all have good and bad in us. We found out the
    leaders of the world had perpotrated the Emp attack here and in all developed countries. Things turned out all over the world like they have here. If man did not have so much hate for his fellow
    man then maybe this war would have meant something. Instead freedom is lost. IF you enter the wrong section you will not make it out. Blacks kill whites. Whites kill blacks. Jews kill anyone who is
    Jewish and Jews are killed by all others. It is the same for all groups. Even if you are a white european in this world you will be killed by other white europeans who don’t believe in God.
    Just becauese you do believe in God. NO one trust anyone and hates everyone who in not the same as them. I did not see this coming. All the fighting for nothing. The only way it would have meant
    anything is if there were good leaders who cared more about every man than they did themselves. I am not sure there are any men left like that in this shitty world. All is lost because of
    mans hatred for other men. If only we could just learn to love one another. Not just people who look like us, think like us, and act like us. We must learn to love all mankind. If that ever
    happens then maybe the world would become a good place again. Until it does all is lost. The war I fought in and won put down a corrupt government and established thousands of racist, corrupt,
    greedy governments. All men now seem to be out for just themselves. I fought and won a war that seemed right but made things worse. I just want to meet my maker and go to my true home.
    I hate this world. To all my descendents. If you and man does not learn to love each other then this world will be in constant choaus. I am so sorry to you.

  7. Anonymous says:

    Wow… remember the Rajneeshis in the 1980s!

    They probably are all now “Yes we can/ Yes we have no bananas” chanters! Mindlessness is certainly the same!!

  8. Mike in Va says:

    Mike in VA’s Diary

    October 31, 2016

    To my childeren, grandchildren, and all my descendents. I am writing this as a record of my thoughts and my actions. I want all my descendents to know what I did and where I stood in the
    collapse of this country. Over the past 30 years I have seen our freedom slowly taken away by members of our government and the money behind them. They have corrupted the system and designed
    it’s collapse in my opinion. Now we are only a few days from a presidential election and I have seen many U.N. vehicles and military vehicles. I fear that the collapse is about to take place.
    I fear martial law may be declared so that our current president will not have to leave office. I don’t know what is about to happen but my gut says it is not good. I have voted all along for
    the canadate that I thought would promote the most freedom. I fought what has happened as much as I could by telling all my thoughts. I also tried to change things at the balet box. I realized
    they are all in it together no matter what party they are involved with.

    November 6, 2016

    It has happened. The power is out. Cell phone service is down. All electronic devices are not working. I have seen flashes in the sky on the horizen. Not sure what the flashes are but believe there
    has been a nuclear E.M.P. strike. That is the only thing that cause so many electrical devices to not work. It is 02:48 A.M. here. Luckily I am a night owl. I suspect most of the world does not
    have a clue about what has just taken place. If it was an E.M.P. then many will die and we may not have power for years. I knew something was coming. Now Barrack Obama will try to be president forever.
    There will be a war for freedom in this country. I will fight for freedom until my last breath. We have to have freedom once again. If we lose this then there is no future for you my children and
    childrens children. Obama I believe set the E.M.P.’s off and now once to be dictater forever. I will write the story of what happens next when I can. Not sure when I will be able too because
    things are going to become serious life and death situations.

    February 20, 2017

    Sorry it took so long to write another post. Things went to hell in a handbasket much quicker than I anticipated. Fighting, stealing, looting, raping, and mass killings. People started acting like
    animals after about a week. There was panic and fights after 2 days. The power is still not on. Some old vehicles work and my 4 wheeler works. I am so careful to not reveal some of what I have.
    Thank god I stocked up on food, water, and ammonition. The big gas tank I got has given me a big advantage over most. Gas is extremely scarce and has been siphoned out of every new vihicle. All of my
    friends and relatives have banded together. We have barracaded the road in both directions. There are people or maybe I should call them animals coming out of the cities to loot every house
    and do unspeakable things to people along the way. We have had one fight with such a gang. We killed 11 and wounded 23 that I know of. They were well equiped and we got lucky in my opinion. We cought
    them by suprise and had them in a crossfire at the river. My cousin Jamie died in that fight. His wife and kids now stay with us. The strain and stress of this is so much worse than I expected.
    Then again who would have any clue what this would be like unless they had been in a war without power. Maybe the soldiers in the civil war would have known the strain of this. I am so afraid.
    Not of dying but of watching the ones I love die. There are several in the community who are sick right now. My wife and oldest son are 2 of them. I fear for my oldest son the most because of all
    his medical conditions and cerebral palsy. We are almost out of his seizure and Crones disease medication. There is no way to get anymore. My youngest son and his family I am sure are trying to get
    here. That was the plan anyway. He would be coming from Georgia. I hope his wife and 2 boys all make it up here with him. I am worried greatly about that too. Will post again whenever I can.

    December 25, 2021

    It has been years since I have written in this. I just did not have the heart too. I cannot believe the pain and sorrow I and everyone else has had to endure. I lost my oldest son shortly after
    my last post. I loved him so. My youngest son finally made it to me. He showed up in April of 2017. He left his wife and sons in Georgia with her family. They were well prepared according to
    him. He had a ham radio and had found out that most of the cities had deterioted into desease ridden war zones. Most are burnt down ghost towns now. He also heard that forces for freedom were
    gathering in Northern VA to mount an attack against Washington D.C. He said that is another reason he left his wife in Georgia. My lovely wife of 18 years passed away in 2018. She got a scratch
    on her side from rusty fence. It became infected. We tried to stop the infection but had no medicine’s. I think it got into her blood but she suffered so. I have fealt several times i could take
    no more. Long term food storage and other prepped items I had were used up by mid 2018. I did have ammo left. Many relatives and friends died. My son and I decided to make the journey North and
    form up with the freedom fighters we heard were there. We made it after a couple of months. Nothing is easy but we made it to the freedom fighters. Thank god the story of them forming was true.
    We have fought with them now ever since. Conditions are miserable. We heard we were winning and that government officials were found in the sewer system and killed. We overran some secret bunkers
    and tunnels that were located and killed all there. Things are so horrible. We climb over dead bodies to get to the enemy at times. Supplies are hard to come by. Some fighting has been with rocks,
    baseball bats, swords, and knives. The stench is horrible from decaying bodies. Desease is rampant. There are packs of wild dogs eating human remains and you cannot be caught by the packs when
    you are alone or they will eat you alive. The lines have become so blurred. We did not know there were other forces that formed North and West of Washington. I am not sure but think the city
    was conquered and over run two months ago. Now things are in total chaous. Anyone in a military or police uniform was shot long ago. Now it is hard to tell who is who. The only people you trust
    are those in your unit. It seems that many different groups are fighting for control. I am sure that we have been in battles with other freedom fighters. The shooting starts if you are lucky enough
    to have ammo and then you just fight to the end. Most of the time the end of the fight is hand to hand and so vicious and bloody. It is just total confusion now. No clear enemies or friends.
    Just fighting like animals. It is Christmas and I am praying to my God. I have seen how evil all men can be. That includes me. I have done things that sicken me when I think about them. I so
    hope I am forgiven for them. Yes I felt I had no choice but it does not make it right. That is all I am willing to tell my descendents if there are any left other than my son by my side.

    August 8, 2022

    A truce was finally declared. Groups were fighting groups. Anyone is government was long dead I believe but will never know for sure. My son and I both have made it through the war it looks
    like. Are we going to make it another day. Who knows. Things are still dicey and not going as I had hoped. The leaders of the groups got together and formed a new capital in Charleston West VA.
    Hate and anger still seems to be present wherever you go. My son and I finally made it back to our home. I am so thankful it is still standing. I have a few distant family members and friends
    still alive. I still feel there is not much to be thankful for. At times I wish i had just died in the fighting. Everything I fought for and did seems to be for nothing. The country seems
    to have broken into different parts. There is so much hate that if you are a certain race, religion, or did a certain job befor the collapse you are shot. Here it appears we may have to leave.
    The leader of this section of the country which now is the new so called capital of the U.S. does not allow free opinion or speach. You have to be so careful what you say. If you say the wrong
    thing then if the wrong person hears it you can be hung.

    November 27, 2025

    Thanksgiving. The power has come back on in several areas. I don’t know how it did. It is still spradic and frequent outages. There is still shortages of food and medicine. All necessities really.
    The power is on right now and we are going to have a Turkey my son killed yesterday. Good luck for once. I have 3 things only to be thankful for. We left Virginia and made it to Georgia.
    I am thankful that my son, his wife, and my two grandkids are still alive. I am thankful for the Turkey my son killed yesterday. I am 57 now and not in the best of health. I am thankful that I
    will meet my maker soon. At least I think I will. I hope the good lord calls me home from this hell we call Earth.
    All the fighting and struggles ended up meaning nothing in my opinion. Man has shown to be Evil. The war against the government in Washington was won. We put down there lust for power and wealth.
    It means nothing because we put down a large corrupt government and now the country is broken up into several small areas that are at times even more corrupt then the large nation was.
    Man has really shown that inside he has wrath, greed, sloth, pride, lust, envy, and glutony. Every little section is a group of like minded individuals. Some are certain nationalities, races,
    religions, or groups of a certain belief. Blacks, Jews, old cops, military, muslems, indians, whites, chinese, even Irish are being killed to this day because of hatred of there fellow man.
    I have learned that there are good people in all of society. None of those groups are all bad nor are they all good. We are just all men and we all have good and bad in us. We found out the
    leaders of the world had perpotrated the Emp attack here and in all developed countries. Things turned out all over the world like they have here. If man did not have so much hate for his fellow
    man then maybe this war would have meant something. Instead freedom is lost. IF you enter the wrong section you will not make it out. Blacks kill whites. Whites kill blacks. Jews kill anyone who is
    Jewish and Jews are killed by all others. It is the same for all groups. Even if you are a white european in this world you will be killed by other white europeans who don’t believe in God.
    Just becauese you do believe in God. NO one trust anyone and hates everyone who in not the same as them. I did not see this coming. All the fighting for nothing. The only way it would have meant
    anything is if there were good leaders who cared more about every man than they did themselves. I am not sure there are any men left like that in this shitty world. All is lost because of
    mans hatred for other men. If only we could just learn to love one another. Not just people who look like us, think like us, and act like us. We must learn to love all mankind. If that ever
    happens then maybe the world would become a good place again. Until it does all is lost. The war I fought in and won put down a corrupt government and established thousands of racist, corrupt,
    greedy governments. All men now seem to be out for just themselves. I fought and won a war that seemed right but made things worse. I just want to meet my maker and go to my true home.
    I hate this world. To all my descendents. If you and man does not learn to love each other then this world will be in constant choaus. I am so sorry to you.

  9. If you let difference of opinion over religion or politics divide you or your group, you are one step closer to destruction…

    I am not religious anymore, I was raised religiously and went to catholic school, there is a lot in the bibles(all versions…) that i do not agree with, and much that i do agree with.

    Having said that, if you cannot show enough humility to respect another mans opinion without braining him with a beer mug, sticking around for mutual survival goals, or downvoting him.

    Then you deserve to be divided and conquered, and those who have learned humility and tolerance will out live you in all probability.

    q the downvotes because i dont believe what you believe.

    • Kulafarmer says:

      Yep, been dealing with that a lot on another local website,
      Been called all sorts of names and all forms of the synonyms of idiot because i am sticking up for farmers and am anti bigger government, even had one mo say they were going to come snd get me after SHTF
      I sure hope they are bulletproof
      Body armor wont matter,
      I have a toy that can lay down a blanket of 7.62x54R like a wave breaking on a pier and leaves nothing standing, you dont count the ammo by the round, you count it by the crate,,,
      I have had it with these idiots who are not capable of thinking about different views and placing them in anothers shoes, its all me me me and I want this or I want that and dont care if it costs everybody else i want my agenda,,,,
      Sorry for the rant, am fed up and ready to just walk away from all of it.

      • the renegade braveheart says:

        Kulafarmer, the rant is very understandable. I rant on occasion myself. sometimes you’ve got to let off some steam.

      • Outlaw says:

        Hey Kula, I have seen you post a few times over at Trenches. I listen to Henry’s show when I can. I agree with most of their view points over there, but they seem extremely intolerant to even a slightly varying point of view. Do you get that same vibe?

      • Anonymous says:

        This was funny, “iam […] anti bigger government”

        You just want a chin high goobermint?
        Or, maybe a waist high goobermint?

        I’m just trying to see if I understand you correctly. You’re not for “no goobermint” – you like some of it – you just wanna pick and choose which level of goobermint lords over you and hawks a loogie on you at its whim while demanding you pay up as it sticks a gun in your belly?

        Is that about right?

        • Kulafarmer says:

          The reality is there will always necessarily be some form of government.
          At this point in time the one that is supposed to be working for us has gone overboard,
          Anyone who thinks we could have a nation with no government has one hell of an imagination,

          • Old Guy says:

            For many years the wild west frointier had no government. it was called survival of the fittest. one time I was on a construction job. the foreman was a dumbass asshole. well some of us older hands decided not to work for him. So we just went home little did we know everyone else followed us. The Gut was left there by himself. Well the owners wife called me and asked what was the problem I told her that guy wouldn’t make a pimple on a foremans ass. She stated well he is gone go back and go to work. Well everyone returned and we went to work with no boss at all. And it actually worked really well. We moved dirt and got the road built ahead of time.

      • I had a grandma who used to say, the bigger the quilt, the better the chance for mistakes. This is her single piece of government advice. I like to think about that statement and add the more unnecessary stuff you can fit in as well. Ignore the folks who don’t wake up, man. The world has put a lot of effort into making sure they never get their stuff straight. It’s like trying to convince people that no matter what side the vote goes to, we’re screwed. Nobody wants their team put down. Some are so fanatical about which side they support, they get ugly about it and refuse to see that the whole thing is unreasonable.

      • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

        Let it Rip Kula!!! We are all getting plenty fed up with corruption and stupidity. The sheep are asleep as they get fleeced daily.

    • helot says:

      KOS says: “If you let difference of opinion over religion or politics divide you or your group” …

      Religion aside, there’s some politics which are fascist and socialist which require/demand the destruction of the family unit and perhaps your death, as well as the liberty of everyone.

      Do you suppose that difference should slide?

      Think on that.

      Maybe checkout Mises.org

  10. slingshot says:

    All I can say about this article is.
    Sandbags. They do a prepper good.

    • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

      Sandbags, That’s the Spirit. Just ordered a Keltec PLR-16 today. Yippi. 3.4-lbs 5.56 Pistol – Perfect for the bug out bag. Let er’ Rip!! Throw a 60 to 100 round mag on that beotch. Grounded 6 Lbs of coffee beans and vac packed them in Canning jars. Just 17 Lbs of pressure, will keep for years.

      • Mike in Va says:

        wwti

        What is your opinion on the kel tec ksg?

        • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

          Mike in VA. Yeah the Keltec 12g has 2 side by side linear magazine tubes for 12 rounds,6+6+1 which you can alternate with a switch. Put slugs on one side and 00 Buck in the other tube. Kind of pricey for $1000-Novelty. I would just go with a Mossberg 500 for $300 and buy $700 with of ammo for the same price and throw on a few 50 round 12g bandoleers over the shoulders.

          • Mike in Va says:

            WWTI

            MSRP is $685.00. You just have one heck of a time finding one at that price. I love mine. The size of it is great for movement around corners. I can also pick it up easily and stick the end out the window of a vehicle. It works great for home defense and vehicle security. Hopefully I never have to find out how great.

      • Navy Vet says:

        WWTI … That’s one bad ass lookin’ weapon. Question, does anyone make an aftermarket wrist stock for it? I’d think it would be pretty hard to control one handed otherwise, esp. with a extra large cap mag.

        • Mike in VA says:

          I can shoot it one handed but not with 3 inch shells. It is not fun one handed. I love it though for home defense.
          It is easier to defend around corners because of its size.

        • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

          Keltec PLR-16; $490. I am going to put a Quad Rail on the fore grip $100, a rear one point sling $20, with a top rail sling mount by surefire – $20. When you stretch out the sling to aim, you can rest your cheek on the sling and fire away looking through a Holographic EOTech Red dot $500. The 5.56 has little recoil so accuracy is enhanced. Plus it is a rifle round, not a 9mm. Huge difference. I will also get a better flash hider $80. It spits fire out the end. lol Wear ear protections. You can’t mounts a vertical for grip or a shoulder mount stock on the rear end. Unless you want to pay for the ATF permit. Yeah -Rip some metal piercing 62gr green tips out of it. 1-9 twist. With the short 9″ barrel I think I can only get 2700 FPS but still more than double any regular pistol in say a 9mm @1300 fps. So flatter trajectory, harder hitting and more accurate at only 3.4 Lbs. Half the weight of any other AR out there. Plus its a Piston driven, meaning it does not shit where it eats. Lifetime Factory warranty for $25 more. YTube Keltec PLR-16 for reviews. I was looking at the Sig Sauer 5.56 Pistol but is is hard to find, and they want over $1000 to $1500 for it. Out of my budget.

          • ziks says:

            As for your flash suppressor, check out the kenti-tech compensators. They really fix the close quarter ear ringers and flashes on 556 pistols. Put one on my Sig 556 pistol, and very happy with it. You can easily swap the cover and screw on a “solvent catcher” for quick and easy clean up as needed.

            • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

              Ziks, How do you like the Sig 556 Pistol? I have the 556 rifle SWAT version. Very accurate, 1-7 twist, 16″ barrel. Eats everything, never had a jam. The Sig Pistol I would mount a laser light on it, so you don’t even have to aim. Point and Let er’ Rip. Get a few 60 round Surefire mags. I found them for $89 if you want to shop it. Beats $159 Also check out, TroyIndustries has a muzzle break with breaching tips for breaking glass if needed. That’s tempting.

      • possee says:

        WWT

        Nabbed a Keltec( 9mm Glock) Sub 2k a few years back before the prices went ballistic..

        Say what they will,but this little (folds to `16″)sucker sends rounds down the range @ 100 yds perfectly..and will eat nearly every type of 9mmLuger rounds..

        Y

  11. My drone cost me a few thousand bucks , a little patience , fuel and ball bearings and any prepstead I desire is mine for the taking wtshtf

  12. Navy Vet says:

    A pretty good effort. A tad on the maudlin side, but thinking about what could happen post SHTF will make just about anyone depressed.

    One suggestion, if you’re going to write more stories and I’m not being critical here, just an observation have someone proof read your work before you publish. I’d be happy to help.

    • Navy Vet says:

      This post was meant for Mike’s short story.

      • Navy Vet says:

        As a sort of follow up to Mike’s short story, which Mac has taken offline for the moment, I ran across a couple of articles that depict a scenario for what may happen shortly after SHTF and who the potential bad guys will be and why.

        via WRSA

        ht tp://westernrifleshooters.wordpress.com/2012/09/03/bracken-when-the-music-stops-how-americas-cities-may-explode-in-violence/

        ht tp://survivalblog.com/letter_re_a_veteran_policemans/

        as always, take out the spaces

        • Walt Kowalski says:

          @Navy Vet

          I read the article you posted.

          I see only a couple of problems with the scenario:

          1. I would anticipate that very early on in this situation, all Internet and cell phone networks will be taken down by the government. That will mitigate the flash mobs from coordinating attacks and riots, reducing their communications to hand-held radios and word of mouth. While that will not eliminate rioting, it will go a long way toward degrading the ability of the low-lifes to organize to any degree.

          2. The suburban areas will be as bereft of food and other necessities as the urban areas and EBT card-holders. No food in the markets will be an across the board problem for everyone. And I see no reason for ill prepared suburbanites to be much more civil than their urban low-life counterparts.

          In short…both urban AND suburban areas are going to be hell holes….their only difference possibly being in the degree and type of violence taking place.

          Frankly, I anticipate a very early action on the part of TPTB to suppress EVERYTHING…with communications being among the first things that get shut down. It is much easier to control a population if the only information that they have is what is provided to them by those in power.

          In light of this, I see it as very likely that a lot of the violence will be between those in power and those who are simply trying to survive.

          The end result bad…..no matter which scenario takes place.

          I think that from the very beginning of the breakdown, the Feds will attempt to co-opt local law enforcement and either incorporate them into their operations or remove them from the equation.

          Since so much of the population is armed, I do not see them being able to be successful at maintaining their control. If that is the case, then we may well have a situation much like the Balkans, where there was indeed no one single group with absolute control. In other words….total anarchy.

          In light of all of this, it would work to the advantage of TPTB for the population to be decimated prior to any kind of economic collapse by some kind of pandemic….which goes a long way toward explaining why the current administration has had such an idiotic policy for dealing with Ebola. A pandemic gives them both the means and cover for implementing martial law BEFORE it all falls apart.

          • Horse'sass says:

            In SHTF scenario, I envision the government merely letting the masses kill each other off with their guns. In fact I have always looked at these FEMA camps as future government strong holds/ supply depots to ensure the government remains in power, not as prisons to herd dissidents. If the government can’t get food, water, and fuel to isolated areas in which plenty of warning was available, (Sandy, Katrina), they can’t/ won’t be doing it in a sudden nationwide SHTF situation.

            • Old Guy says:

              The goverments plan is based on continuity of government. That is the main focus. That is the reason for Mt Weather and the lions share of the goverments preps. The citizens are expendible. Anyone who thinks the government doesn’t believe the citizens are expendable need look no farther than all the unnecessary wars in which they use our young people for cannon fodder. They send in troops at the drop of a hat.

            • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

              I predict when SHTF that More than half of the DHS on the Payroll will abandon their Jobs and posts, and run for the hills. I also just read that the DHS has never stopped a single terrorist attack yet in 13 years since it was developed. It is a Gubberment Jobs program for the well connected, for do-nothing, no show jobs.

              • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

                Yesterday I wanted the Movie “Training day” w/ Denzel Washington. Lots of corrupt bloody action there.

              • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

                watched, not wanted.. lol

              • the renegade braveheart says:

                WWTI, I sincerely hope you’re right about any part of DHS not acting against us; that would help. although I still believe DHS can and will be defeated. You are right about them not stopping any attacks since 9-11. TSA has never stopped any weapons from getting through their checkpoints. all they’ve been good for is hassling the hell out of people for no good reason. They’re just another group of affirmative action morons.

            • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

              No doubt in any collapse and disaster, the Government will ensure their own safety, food, water and shelter first, before they help any soul out there in need. So Basically we are paying through our tax payments for the survival of the Government. I just read where the DHS Budget is like $54 Billion Annually, 190,000 Employees and the employee turn over is huge, bad attitudes and inept, and it was set up to fleece the tax payers.

              You can count on the flunky cop wannabe DHS Employees to abandon their posts in SHTF, once they see no advantage or benefit for them as individuals. So if we make them work for it, and send lead down range early on, they won’t have any loyalty to their cult. That’s when we move in, and take their supplies, gear, weapons and ammo. It took over 1000 LEO’s and 45 days to catch one guy in the woods of PA. Now times that one guy by a few Million armed Patriots in civilian civies, and its game over for them. Or until they Nuke us with drone strikes. Frequency jammers will play a deciding factor on both sides. lol Just my take on how this war game will play out.

        • Night Breaker says:

          NV ,
          I linked them in the last post , at least some one reads my posts LOL ,
          A very plausible scenario. Read the one today with the sipsey street irregulars link on WRSA
          A whole lot of hurt may be coming down post election.

          Semper Fi 8541

      • Mike in Va says:

        Regarding the tone of the story. It is my true belief and that is why I hope it does not happen. Some want it to happen right now. I hope there is a way out without the crash. If there is a way out I don’t see it. I just hope the story makes people think about what we are up against.
        I would have written a lot more details for entertaining purposes but tried to keep it short for a post on here.

  13. Mike in Va says:

    Navy thanks. Maybe Mac will proof it. I have never been the best on punctuation or spelling. My strength’s were history and science.

    I don’t plan on more stories. The reason I wrote it was to get a point across and wanted to do it in a somewhat entertaining way. I thought it might get the point across without causing arguments on here. As fate would have it the point in the story went along with some comments in this article.

    I hope everyone gets the point I am trying to make. I also thank you for offering to help proof read it. That would be a great help to someone like me.

  14. watching and waiting says:

    In my opinion, it doesn’t make sense for city dwellers to relocate across the country to a place where they are not known, to where they are bait for the locals who live there, who will be offended that they came and by the time they get there, they will be out of the stuff they packed and ate,lost, on the way and will be seeking resupply.

    Would not make sense for those who know the woodlands better than their names.

    A strategic relocation to me is a involuntary human migration from an area destroyed by war or natural disaster. Both of which it seems are upon us.

    • Walt Kowalski says:

      There is a term for people who mass migrate in order to flee an uninhabitable area…

      They are called “refugees”.

      History has shown that it does not usually turn out well for such people.

      • helot says:

        Isn’t it true that People are Only called, “refugees” if they ARE FORCED OUT and also have no place to go when they get there? And furthermore, are they Only “refugees” if they have to spend time in a goobermint camp and become a statistic on a goobermint chart because they can’t pay for their way at The Inn and the goobermint won’t let them camp on the side of the road?

        I mean, if they showed up at some private doorstep and were welcome, or if they had to pay for a room at an Inn (hotel) wouldn’t they be called unexpected guests? And be treated as such? …Quite unlike a “refugee”.

        Even if they could Only afford to camp at the side of the road, is it because they can’t pay a tax, that they are considered to be a refugee?

        What was it that makes them into a refugee? Lava? A tornado? Or,… a goobermnit edict?

      • helot says:

        RE: “There is a term for people who mass migrate in order to flee an uninhabitable area…

        They are called “refugees”.

        History has shown that it does not usually turn out well for such people.”

        You got that right. Such People were sometimes called Pilgrims and Colonialists, look what happened to them, their descendants eventually got enslaved by their very own goobermint.

        How-freaking-ever; for some so-called colonial refugees, things turned out pretty well for their lifetime.

        “Land of Plenty” they called it.
        “Home of Liberty”.

        …And then…

        Damn refugees. How dare they seek freedom, liberty and prosperity.

        Insert video from V for Vendetta, “How Dare They!”

      • oicu812 says:

        Did you know……?

        If a group of persons are given refugee status by the UN, they are entitled to a monthly stipen from predominately USSAG taxpayer dollars.

        Oh yea, and there are millions of muslims on the dole.
        Palestinians are the larger percentage receiving such.
        Yep, considered refugees within their own borders.

    • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

      True, City Dwellers will have withdrawls in the country with no Starbucks fix. Imagine this. this is True: Starbucks is going to start coffee delivery. No kidding, like how lazy and worthless can people get? And probably deliver for $10 a cup to these lazy ignoramouses, too stupid and lazy to get up out of bed in the morning to make their own coffee.

  15. KY Mom says:

    Off topic…

    Obama’s Border Policy Fueled Epidemic, Evidence Shows
    “The deadly EV-D68 enterovirus epidemic, which struck thousands of kids this fall, was likely propelled through America by President Barack Obama’s decision to allow tens of thousands of Central Americans across the Texas border, according to a growing body of genetic and statistical evidence.

    The evidence includes admissions from top health officials that the epidemic included multiple strains of the virus, and that it appeared simultaneously in multiple independent locations.”

    “So far, that virus has been found in nine American kids who died from illness, has apparently inflicted unprecedented polio-like paralysis in roughly 50 kids, and has put hundreds of young American kids into hospital emergency wards and intensive care units throughout more than 40 states.”

    The Daily Caller

    • KY Mom says:

      Direct link…

      “The EV-D68 controversy is a weaker version of the Ebola fight, where Obama has opposed stringent federal and state barriers to the arrival of foreign travelers who may be carrying Ebola.

      The EV-D68 virus is far, far less dangerous than Ebola, but it also may be harder to counter because it has now spread throughout the United States.

      There is no vaccine for EV-D68, so health experts expect more victims.”

      http://dailycaller.com/2014/10/31/obamas-border-policy-fueled-epidemic-evidence-shows/

      • helot says:

        I don’t know, KY Mom. The bits you link to about these things, they seem to fit right into the stuff Jon Rappoport writes about. When they say, “The EV-D68 controversy is a weaker version of the Ebola fight” I get the feeling it’s just more boolsheet, different story.

        Is it more about vitamin deficiencies and lowered immune systems due to already administered vaccines?
        …Have you ever looked into this? Or, are you just reacting?

        • KY Mom says:

          helot,

          Recent studies of the EV-D68 virus show that it originated in Central America. It was BROUGHT HERE by the THOUSANDS of illegals (many of school age) from Central America in recent months.

          Executive orders by Obama to IGNORE immigration laws and policies by this administration ENCOURAGED and then ALLOWED THOUSANDS OF ILLEGALS to cross the border in recent months. Some refer to this virus as the “Guatemalan flu”.

          These illegals did NOT have medical screening. Instead, they were transported by plane, bus, etc. (at TAXPAYER EXPENSE) to many different states around the U.S.

          Many MORE American children have had the EV-D68 virus around the country than have been reported in the “official” numbers. Only those with severe symptoms and had to be hospitalized were tested for the virus and numbers reported.

          Thankfully, the great majority of those who contracted this virus recovered and are OK.

          We are seeing a textbook Cloward-Piven strategy at work.

          • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

            KYMom, And right after these Midterm elections Obummer wants to import as many as 34 Million more illegals. Talk about a jobs killer for us regular Americans. I want to sit on the border with a Gatling Gun and unlimited ammo.

        • KY Mom says:

          helot,

          Regarding some becoming paralyzed from EV-D68, consider the family of viruses that it is in.

          Note: Enterovirus 68 is a member of the Picornaviridae family, which includes the virus that causes polio.

          Enterovirus 68 probed in paralysis cases of 9 Colorado kids
          “Health officials KNOW enterovirus can cause paralysis.”

          “It’s not known whether the limb weakness or paralysis is temporary or will be long-lasting.”

          Fox News

    • The Old Coach says:

      This one fact alone is going to flip the Obama-supporting “Soccer Moms” 180 degrees. They all envision their kid catching D-68 in school and becoming paralyzed, and they now know why that’s possible.

      • Walt Kowalski says:

        @Old Coach….

        And you know what?

        It’s not going to make one bit of difference who wins this election. Even if the Republicans take over the Senate. Nothing will change. NOTHING.

        At best, the Republicans will take over the Senate. But….there are two Independent Senators who almost always caucus with the Dems. PLUS…..the Republicans will need a super majority in order to effectively thwart Obama. Because he will simply veto any bill he doesn’t like. Meanwhile….he’ll continue to govern by Executive Order, and the Republicans have already demonstrated that they won’t do a darn thing to stop him from doing it.

        We’ll still have John Bonehead running the House and we’ll get some establishment RINO Republican running the Senate.

        Count on it.

        Face it….right now it’s Washington D.C. against the rest of the country.

        • Outlaw says:

          Even if the Repubs had a super majority, nothing would change. Anyone who thinks the repubs will save us is an insane.

          But, it looks as if the repubs may take over the senate. In my opinion, that is bad news, as it will pacify the fence-sitters just a bit longer. They will all say “Oh now Obama is a lame duck, no worries” thinking everything will be ok. All we are doing at this point is prolonging the pain.

        • Kulafarmer says:

          Maybe well get lucky and the Russians will nuke DC.
          Can hold them a ticker-tape parade.

      • helot says:

        The Old Coach says: “This one fact alone [The EV-D68 controversy] is going to flip the Obama-supporting “Soccer Moms” 180 degrees.”

        Do you think someone is being played for a sucker here?

        If this is true, that this is going to flip the Obama-supporting “Soccer Moms” 180 degrees, would I be wrong to say that soccer moms are freakin’ stupid? I mean, walking brain-dead stupid? Pumped up on Valium/and a whole list of other Big Pharma drugs I can’t think of at the moment, stupid?

        I guess the soccer moms are demanding fluoride for their children without questioning it, they line up for vaccines and push their children in line, and have races to fund companies which do anything But cure cancer. Why would anyone call them, “Sthmart”?

        • The Old Coach says:

          I wouldn’t say they are stupid, but they ARE so narrowly focused on the immediate problems and risks to their little ones that they think about little else. Much of their political thinking is therefor in synch with their fellow soccor-Moms, (and under the influence of their kids’ teachers), because they pay so little attention to other sources of news. When the danger of a paralyzing disease gets on the mouth-to-mouth circuit among the soccer-Mom community, it’ll be the sole topic of conversation for weeks. Make it clear, in simple words and phrases, that Obama’s immigration policy has brought this risk to their school, and whammo!

    • Off topic? That’s a good thing on this thread so far.

      • helot says:

        Ha! BJ. It ain’t the Happy Talk thread, that’s for sure.
        Now pardon me, I gotta go pick some green shoots before the new wars start that everybody is validating via their “vote”.

        … And may the Odds be in your favor.

  16. Oldboy says:

    Just buy some vacant wooded land in the middle of nowhere 8-10 miles off the main road, with a running creek or spring, 1-2 acres cleared meadow, and put a trailer on it. Done. If it costs more than $300 per acre for a 10 acre lot, you are too close to other people.

    • Walt Kowalski says:

      Unless you move there now, you still have to get to it before someone else does. (Possession is 9/10’s of the law and in SHTF..it’s 100%).

      Once you are there….you have to defend it. Good luck with that if you have hundreds of thousands of people fleeing the city.

      George Patton said that fortified positions were monuments to man’s stupidity. If the opposition has enough firepower and enough people, they will take your stuff and your life. In fact…..it wouldn’t take a big group to do it. Just someone with a rifle to ambush you when you walk out your front door.

      If you have a group of people to help you, then you might have a chance. But not many of us have that option. Those who do may just make it. Without it….your best asset will be whatever skills you have and just plain old good luck.

      Sorry to be so negative on this. But I just calls ’em as I see ’em.

      • Pissed Off Granny says:

        Great posts from you Walt….thanks

      • I think the key here is to stay somewhat hidden and ignored. That’s the main thing.

      • Mike in Va says:

        Walt

        You are dead on with your post. I listen to so many saying I hope they show up at my door. They will get lead.
        Well that is not a realistic thought. If you are outnumbered 10 to 1 you are going to die. Your family will die and who knows what happens in between.
        If the government shows up right now then they will win.

        People say I hope it happens now because I am tired of the government. They don’t think any further than that.

        Thanks for you post. Very good one.

    • Horse'sass says:

      Interesting way of putting it from a reverse perspective. My thought was to do the same, sans the trailer which would attract vandals , but instead buy raw land, get an earth digger to dig a basement, and then use some heavy steel sheets to cover it up, and maybe dig a well, and then forget about it for several months and see it is disturbed .If not , then could later haul some materials like chicken wire, fence posts, brick cement, fertilizer , water / gas storage tanks and other bulky things that would be difficult to haul to the site in a SHTF situation, yet would be too bulky and a hassle for someone to take if they stumbled upon the site by chance before TSHTF, assuming that most, like me, can not commit full time to a BOL presently. Unload your preps at the site and cover it back up.
      Another big advantage is that if you don’t have any building on it, your taxes are lower.

      • Horse'sass says:

        And, as Walt Kowalski mentioned, raw land is less attractive to squatters, and easier to take back.

      • helot says:

        If I had the means to get the property you all describe,… I’d consider flooding it as a protective defense while I’m gone.

        Thieves, bandits, marauders and the like Do Not like to work, or so I’ve read. ..And noticed.

        I mean Hell, the dang cops and DNR bastards don’t even like to get their shoes muddy if they don’t have to.

        You could call it: Moat and thorny bushes 102.

        Survival is just a damn bust away?
        Or, one foot down?
        Fish heads for everyone.

    • NorthGeorgiaIdiotsCousin says:

      If you think your going to get 10 acres for 300 an acre its agoing to be more tha 10 miles off a main road. You cant get there from here.

      • Smokey says:

        No kidding, $300 an acre around here means about 3 entire states are off limits, and they’re redoubt states.

        You can get some nice, dry, Nevada desert scrublands for about that price, though.

    • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

      Old Boy, you can find that in Old Detroit right now, but will be competing with the Rats feeding off the dead corpses yet. I read where there is some buy that put a big on 6000 houses in Old Detroit for like $3 Million dollars. Probably the Chinese.

  17. Chir says:

    Talk about OPSec failure on a grand scale… You think the Feds are not collating and grabbing information on properties advertised by Joel? Hell Joel is posting lists of locations where they can find probable “domestic terrorists” IE: People who believe in the Constitution and self-reliance.

    • helot says:

      That’s a kind of funny comment, Chir. Der Feds, have info on All the land, on every parcel and every inch, via the crop land management tools. Every Single Inch! Advertising it for sale is nothing.
      And in case you didn’t notice, “everyone” is a probable “domestic terrorists”!

      See Also: ‘Prostrate Yourselves! The Crypto Wars Are Back, and This Time Big Brother Aims to Win’

      …And that article’s just for starters.

  18. Scout says:

    So much for global warming, this is shaping up to be what I term a convergence of crises. Keep Prepping and stay warm.

    http://drsircus.com/world-news/cold-climate-disaster-coming-way

    http://drsircus.com/world-news/cooling-fast

    With Cali in drought and Fukedshimad as well, and a possible shorter growing season means cold frames, greenhouses, and perhaps this. The Walipini Underground Greenhouse

    http://www.offgridworld.com/walipini-underground-greenhouse-grow-your-own-food-year-round/

    • Archivist says:

      It’s supposed to get almost down to freezing here tomorrow night. My tomatoes and bell peppers are still bearing, full of fruit and flowers. I covered them all with pine straw this afternoon. I’ll uncover them Monday after the sun gets to them.

      A friend in SC posted some snow photos on Facebook today.

  19. Anonymous says:

    KY Mom. You *always* write good stuff. Thanks. Further to your comment, re. Obama’s border policy & EV-68 virus: Total now NINE dead FIFTY paralyzed:

    Nine children dead, 50 paralyzed. Sorry for the caps, but it appears DEAD AND PARALYZED KIDS are a small price to pay for LINE JUMPING immigrants to further a political agenda. This is *********DISGUSTING, VILE AND DOWNRIGHT EVIL***** And two days after the election, does anyone doubt Obama will be issuing his executive order to let more LINE JUMPERS across. I hope everybody on the planet sees this email and forwards it.

    “The deadly EV-D68 enterovirus epidemic, which struck thousands of kids this fall, was likely propelled through America by President Barack Obama’s decision to allow tens of thousands of Central Americans across the Texas border, according to a growing body of genetic and statistical evidence. The evidence includes admissions from top health officials that the epidemic included multiple strains of the virus, and that it appeared simultaneously in multiple independent locations.” A study published Oct. 11, 2013, in Virology Journal collected nasopharyngeal swabs from eight Latin American countries from 3,375 subjects aged 25 years or younger who presented with influenza-like illness. The study found human Enteroviruses were identified in a staggering 3 percent of all subjects. “So far, that virus has been found in nine American kids who died from illness, has apparently inflicted unprecedented polio-like paralysis in roughly 50 kids, and has put hundreds of young American kids into hospital emergency wards and intensive care units throughout more than 40 states.”
    Story was from Daily Caller a day or two ago. Don’t bother with leftist shill Snopes – here are other URLs to look at to research:
    http://www.americanthinker.com/2014/09/the_invasion_of_enterovirus_evd68.html
    http://www.westernjournalism.com/obama-adminstrations-immigration-policy-responsible-new-mystery-virus-causing-paralysis-children/
    http://www.alipac.us/f9/illegal-immigrant-related-pandemic-diseases-appearing-united-states-310462/
    http://www.thenewamerican.com/usnews/immigration/item/19091-barack-obama-is-bringing-disease-to-america
    http://www.aim.org/aim-column/how-an-obama-administration-policy-is-destroying-lives/ or http://www.bostonherald.com/news_opinion/local_coverage/2014/10/ev_68_eyed_in_paralysis
    http://www.medicaldaily.com/enterovirus-68-may-be-root-paralysis-9-colorado-children-how-viruses-infect-central-305454

    • helot says:

      Hey, Anonymous @ 8:11 pm, (nice original nic BTW)

      Via the Jon Rappoport blog, the CDC says on average 3000 people will die this year from THE FLU.

      Aren’t you alarmed?

      You’re seemingly freaking out over NINE dead FIFTY paralyzed, well that ain’t Jack compared to the 3000 PLUS that will die from THE FLU this year.

      Aren’t you upset about that, too?

      I mean, wow, THE FLU, it’s like The Blob. Run! Scream! Alarm! Threat! Threat! Threat! Mouse in the pocket and people are crossing the border as if doing so legally would screen them from THE FLU!?!

      • TEST says:

        Helot, I am Anonymous. Forgot to put my name in.

        Simply put, you are making a **category mistake.* I assume you know what that is?

        The point is – which you utterly missed – is that the EV-68 virus was **intentionally** allowed in.

        And relative to Ebola, the issue is also the same, where the borders were not locked down. No, ain’t anywhere near flu levels and yes, the PTB will use this quite possibly to create a lock-down state. However, IF it goes truly airborne, and IF the mortality rate stays 50 – 90%, I doubt you will be lackadaisically posting frivolous notes like the above.

        Yes, of course flue kills more, and heart disease even more. But those were NOT brought across the border intentionally for a political agenda. Your post needed further thought before you clicked submit.

    • KY Mom says:

      Anonymous,

      Obama is responsible for the spread of this virus. He has opened wide the borders and ignores the risks.

      It is obvious to me that the health and well-being of the American people is certainly NOT a big concern for him.

      The Dark Side of Illegal Immigration – Facts, Figures and Statistics

      “Legal immigrants are required to have medical screening to ensure that they do not bring any contagious diseases into the United States.

      Illegal aliens are NOT screened and many are carrying horrific third world diseases (such as tuberculosis (TB), Chagas disease, dengue fever, hepatitis, malaria, measles, and leprosy – now called Hansen’s Disease) that do not belong in the USA.

      Many of these diseases are highly contagious and will infect citizens that come in contact with an infected illegal alien. This has already happened in restaurants, schools, and police forces.”
      -Patriot Action dot net

      We can now add Enterovirus D68 and Ebola to the list of contagious viruses being brought into the United States.

      Remember, it only takes ONE infected child to infect the whole classroom.

  20. The Old Coach says:

    For once I can’t really be very critical of Skousen. Pretty much agreed with everything.

    I’d add only that a key criterion for me is that the area must have supported a reasonably comfortable existence prior to, say, 1840. (Assuming you are planning for TEOTWAWKI, and not just a few months vacation while someone else puts your world back together.)

    That criterion pretty much guarantees water, tolerable climate, decent soil, and access to the outside world via foot or animal powered transport to navigable rivers.

    Which leaves out, IMHO, much of the West and the Great Plains, since settlement there was very much dependent on railroads.

    • helot says:

      RE: “Which leaves out, IMHO, much of the West and the Great Plains, since settlement there was very much dependent on railroads.”

      Wow, do you Ever think, inside the box.

      But, I guess that depends upon your idea of, “a reasonably comfortable existence”?

      Myself, I’m comfortable with this bit:

      “The Vinland map, uncovered in the 1960’s is claimed to prove the Vikings were in America 1000 years ago.”

      I think maybe, a lot of them had what I’d call, “a reasonably comfortable existence”. YMMV.

      • The Old Coach says:

        During the Medieval Warm Period the Vikings may have penetrated up the St. Lawrence and into the Great Lakes region, if modern archaeology is to be credited.

        Climate was then so warm that there was a successful farming population of several thousand in Greenland, (it really was green when it was named). They were comfortable until the climate turned colder again, then they died out. Ships from Denmark stopped coming as the weather got worse, and lacking trees in Greenland, they couldn’t even build ships of their own to escape. Their fate will be the same for anyone remote from easy transport. Anyone living there after TEOTWAWKI will need tools and supplies “from away”, but they can’t get out, and nobody will come to them. On the Plains, their economy can’t even settle at the level of the legendary plains Indians, because no more bison. Do you know this story?

        http://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/for-40-years-this-russian-family-was-cut-off-from-all-human-contact-unaware-of-world-war-ii-7354256/?no-ist=

        Not a comfortable existence in my book.

      • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

        Lief Erickson discovered N America in circa 1001 year. Not that conmie propaganda 1492 they teach you in public schools.

  21. The Old Coach says:

    As far as internal friction within groups:

    Nothing unites a group like a common hardship.

    Or as Cormac McCarthy put it in Blood Meridian:

    “Men are not so much united by the sharing of bread as by the sharing of enemies”.

    Think how British unionists united behind Churchill during WW2, despite having loathed him a year before. And how that unity shattered again in 1946.

    • helot says:

      You say, “Nothing unites a group like a common hardship.”

      And yet, “that unity shattered again in 1946.”

      Ya. That’s *some* unity there.

      It smells like manipulation, browbeating and boolsheet to me. Kind of like if a boss jumps in front of his workers and says, “Everybody is going to take a pay cut! Are you “In It” with me?”

      Yeah, “everybody is [wink] “In It”… until they’re not.

  22. fester says:

    i keep playing with the idea of buying just an acre of land , building and installing a energy producing completely independent self sufficient sub-terrain home.

    turning the entire acre surface into a edible garden, small animal farm , with a natural gas waste pond , and aquaponics fishery that filters grey water out of the home and clean water into the sub-terrain home.

    BUT I DON’T WANT TO BUILD IT IN A COUNTRY WHERE YOU DON’T and never will ever OWN YOUR LAND!

    ‘sigh!’

    .f.

    • I like your thinking

    • Walt Kowalski says:

      While watching “Doomsday Preppers” sometime back, I saw ONE guy that I thought might have a good plan. He had a totally sub-terranian bunker with one VERY well concealed entrance out in the middle of nowhere that could only be accessed by a boat.

      That guy has an excellent chance of making it through because his retreat is virtually invisible to anyone but someone who knows exactly where it is.

      Anything visible above ground is just an opportunity for someone who wants to take it.

    • Old Guy says:

      A acre is 207 feet by 207 feet. Someone will own the land joining your acre. Most places a acre wont be enough land you will have to venture off your place to forage . There is a guy who lives in central park. Builds tree houses in the trees and the park folks hve been trying stop him for years. so far he has thwarted their efforts.

  23. All kinds of advice and opinions on what may happen and how to deal with it…all of them have some merit,all of them can be called crazy,why? because we are all different,ya I know the PC crowd doesnt want to hear that but its still true,regardless how whiny they get.
    We all have things in common but for the most part even in those things we dont really see eye to eye so why try…why fight and devide ourselves over it?
    Instead why not work on those things that fall outside of opinion or preference,things that ring true regardless of who we are…like we all need a good water source(or three) a safe warm place to live…decent clothing/tools/weapons and we all gotta eat so we need sources for those food stocks,then we need facilities to store that food…matters not if one prefers a root cellar full of homegrown goodies and another has a ton of MREs…sure we can disagree and debate the merits of any approach and make our best call but what matters is each of us has some way to eat and feed our own in a disaster of any kind,not weather besause I like blue and you like green we cant be friends or that you or I must be really stupid because we like the other color…apply that to anything,you got a M16 and 10000 rounds and I like my 30-30 or my .22,so one of us is stupid?…hows that an issue that we gotta fuss and fight about?…thats what liberty and freedom along with personal responsibility is all about,choices! and the freedom to make good or bad ones!
    The old “I gotta bunker and youre retarded if you dont want one” mentality is insane,we hurt no one but ourselves with the chestpounding and the disparging of how the other guy is doing his thing…at least hes doing something,that makes him more an friend or less of a threat than some parasite doing nothing who Ill probably have to feed or shoot before too long,least ways in my book it does,maybe not in yours…again its freedom to decide anything for ourselves that counts,even if we get it wrong!
    Now Im not saying we cant disagree on the wherefores and hows…there can be legit arguments made for different things,all Im saying is I see and hear way too many people opine that if you dont do it my way youre out in all kinds of ways…I got my ways that work for me and you got yours,lets help each other find what works and quit thinking we have the only “gospel of survival”else one day we may regret it! Sorry if it seems a rant its just been on my heart lately., be safe,keep doing what you can with what you have where you are! REB

    • Kulafarmer says:

      I hear ya Reb,
      Im right there right now,,,

    • Outlaw says:

      Good advice Reb!

    • Arby says:

      Sometimes things are Not RIGHT or WRONG… Just different

      Another observation.. There are two kinds of people in this world…GIVERS and TAKERS

      Unfortunately there seem to be way more Takers..

      • helot says:

        RE: “Another observation.. There are two kinds of people in this world…GIVERS and TAKERS”

        Yes, either you believe in Property rights, or, you don’t.
        There’s no in-between.

        If a person does not believe in property rights, they don’t believe that you own your own life nor do you have any liberty.

        It’s Just that simple.

      • not right or wrong,just different…and so many seem to miss that point,thanks!

    • Reb, I’m with you 100%. It’s bad enough when the enemy manages to divide and conquer. We don’t need to help them. This board and others like it are supposed to be for sharing info to help one another and not a superiority contest. The best gun for any of us is the one we’re most familiar and most comfortable with. While I like discussing the pros and cons of various equipment or tactics and have often reconsidered minor details of my basic plan, I know that in any hairy situation, my best chances lie in using those tools or tactics I’ve already mastered, what comes most natural to me and what works in my specific location.

    • slingshot says:

      Yes there are more arguments than solutions to problems.

    • Anonymous says:

      Reb,

      Great post. I’m with you.

      Ultimately we will have to band together, each in their own area where they find themselves. The survival instinct is a strong one. Not all who think they have prepped for the ultimate test will survive. A very wise man once said, “The meek shall inherit the earth”. Another place it is written that “The race will not be to the ‘swift’, nor the battle to the ‘strong’.” Patience, careful preps, prayer, discernment, learning to read the signs of the times, ready to move when that ‘still, small voice’ says it is time to go. Each one of us has an appointment, an assignment. Be there, or be square.

      Thoughts from high atop a ‘Bald Cyprus’ , Louisiana Eagle

      • Leatherneck says:

        You didn’t finish it. “…nor the battle to the strong, but that’s the way to bet.

        Lock and load and get in shape.

        Semper Fi

        • laeagle says:

          Leatherneck,

          Thanks for the additional insight. There is a lot of wisdom and insight in those ancient ‘sayings’, a lot of medicine packed into a small pill, so to say. They are like bullets, filled with explosive potential energy, some even tipped with Uranium! The wise take heed.

          I really do not understand the red thumbers. Speak up and share your insights if you have any!!

          View from high atop a “Bald Cyprus” in the Atchafalaya, laeagle

      • Good thoughts there friend!

      • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

        More often than not its the 2nd Mouse that gets the Cheese.. Patience, as most everything offered by the Govnt coming up, will be a trap.

      • Old Guy says:

        It will be survival of the fittest with a little luck trown in. The thing about old wise sayings they are fiction. there is always another saying to counter it. The early bird gets the worm. However the second mouse gets the cheese. When I go to the track its always the fastest horse that wins.

  24. southside says:

    Good, steely-eyed,up-front,no B.S. post. Mike from Va., can’t wait for your post

  25. slingshot says:

    REB.

    http://youtu.be/0Ncvuvd3fO0

    “Satisfaction”

    By The Rolling Stones

  26. THE EVER SEEING EYE says:

    Lets all go to RACOON CITY

  27. Old Guy says:

    Is your home flammable? If it is you cant defend it. does your underground bunker have its own air supply? Of course not. Someone will locate the air intake and smother you. Even the government folks in MT weather wont be safe. Whatever equiptment is used to build something can likely be used to destroy It. The plains Indians lived in groups and where easily defeated. The Seminole moved about in the swamp and where never caught. Patton was right fortified positions wont hold up.

    • slingshot says:

      Old Guy.

      Unless you live by or own a one, Strategic locations and fortress’s are out of the realm of many preppers.
      Yepper, going pack all my stuff up and move. Going underground or staying on the remote surface is a choice to be made by the advantages each one gives. You must take that advantage and exploit it to the fullest. You start small like making your front door more stronger and resistant to a kick in. A motion sensor to warn you.
      A couple of points to understand. You can make yourself completely invisible to invaders or you can make it so costly that the invaders move on to easier pickens. Each may have its own percentage of success but more likely that a confrontation will be made sooner or later in either case.
      Mainly what type of enemy force and how big a one, will determine if you live or die.

      • Old Guy says:

        Slingshot what you say is correct. What Im trying to do is not be a denialist. To be reaslistic folks will become little better than animals. Im not particulary concerned with a great horde coming from the populated citys and attacking me. Its the Local no goods & goody two shoes Types who think we all gotta share im concerned about. Im suggesting diversity don’t put all of your eggs in one basket. Im mentally prepared for the likelihood that I will lose everything. In fact Ill burn & destroy it all myself before ill let it fall into enemy hands. A example would be the local national guard showing up to confiscate and redistribute goods. Nope they wont get none of mine.

        • slingshot says:

          Old Guy

          “Goody Two Shoes”

          I had to laugh at that one. We are pretty much on the same page. In fact I think too much about it. You have to change when change is needed. Old Guys have a distinct advantage. Experienced more crap than the younger guys. Another is we tend to get mean and grouchy with age.
          Yepper, they all think they are going down and get the Old Guys Stuff.
          Boy will they get a surprise. Yes. Old Guys Rule!

        • laeagle says:

          Old Guy,

          I like a lot of what you have written. Keep them coming. I would like to try ‘not to put all my eggs in one basket’ but as, as a Louisiana Eagle, my rough nest on top of the ‘Bald Cyprus’ tree is alls I got! I appreciate your ancient wisdom though!

          laeagle

      • BadAmerican says:

        @slingshot:

        Agreed !!

        Never have all your eggs in one basket.

        One percent of prepared beats 99 percent woulda, shoulda, coulda.

        When it comes to planning, even the best pilots have a parachute.

        Negotiate like Bruce Willis in the movie, “The 5th Element”.

        ….be safe….stay the course…..BA.

    • Old Guy, I think it’s safe to say none of us here can afford to build a totally impenetrable home or bunker. Very few structures can withstand a prolonged siege. Our fortress eventually becomes a trap. We can, however, make it very costly for attackers. It boils down to how large a force is attacking, how willing they are to incur losses, and whether or not the prize is worth those losses. Mobility has certain advantages but not feasible for most of us here, especially those with families. The plains Indians main disadvantage was due to leaving signs of their movement. The Apache lasted much longer because they were harder to track in their terrain. The Seminole people had the greatest advantage because it is nearly impossible to track through swampland plus their pursuers had little or no experience in that environment and gators, quicksand, poisonous snakes and other nasty things were enough to deter most pursuers. The cost outweighed the reward. The swamp had no value, unlike the plains, and if the handful of Seminoles remained there, who cared? If we look at the recent pursuit of the cop killer in PA, he was able to elude capture for well over a month in spite of a large force, sophisticated equipment, dogs, etc., because he was more knowledgeable of that area than his pursuers. He had small caches of supplies but his main advantage was an intimate knowledge of that territory. He had over 1000 LEOs searching plus tips from the public. His pursuers had unlimited resources and rabid determination. In a SHTF scenario, none of us here will warrant that degree of determination to capture us. All we need to do is remain hidden for short periods of time and in terrain that is difficult or dangerous to navigate. And a little luck won’t hurt either.

      • Old Guy says:

        Fox your pretty much on target with your assessment. The Apache where living off the horses. They ate horse meat. The army shot 1000,s of wild horses and starved them out. Germonimo surrendered because the children where starving. Im pretty much wrn out today. Went and cut a Pk load of firewood. Then dug a wheelbarrow load of sweet potatoes. Now Im sitting here and eating supper. Rabbit Sweet corn and baked sweet potato. All grown & processed by us. No parasite,s Got any sales tax revenue or other undeserved benefit from my meal today.

        • I’m still putting up the last of my firewood too. Been doing it for over 50 years and I don’t know about you but lately I find it a lot like work. My supper was all homegrown as well – lamb, squash, string beans, and my own mint jelly.

  28. islander says:

    man , I cant help but feel I am already in the perfect place if things do go bad . the island is almost 5400 sq. miles with a population of less than 14,000 . most of them would try to get off island closer to family if shtf . bummer for them . my family , the white side , has been here since the mid 50’s . the nates since who knows when . not going anywhere .

  29. For those who enjoy reading “doomer fiction” – check out my new novel Winter Fall. A dedicated prepper living in the wilds of Upper Michigan takes in his brother’s family in when the Yellowstone Supervolcano goes off in a real TSHTF scenario. This book focuses on the psychological aspects of “making it” in a destroyed society. Check it out on Amazon today – “Winter Fall” by Byron Tucker.

  30. pantsupdontloot says:

    Col. Bo Gritz, unfortunately I remember him, the worthless retire military officer who after all else in his life failed he faked a suicide attempt to get his wife back. Like most retired military he would starve to death if not for the taxpayers. If this is the best we can do for prepper articles then I bid a fond farewell and good day to all.

  31. nopittypartyhere says:

    My place in MS (still can’t get used to calling it my place) is 13 miles out of a small town. Everyone on our road knows each other we grew up together, and we have enough folks we could set up rotating shifts on road watch. The road is only 2.5 miles long. The coyotes and bob cat are so bad it would scare the sh!t outta the wussy herd that may come out of town if they tried to cut through the woods. Every other night sounds like an episode of werewolf down the hill from my house.

    Just last year a black dude fled the cops into the woods a couple miles up the highway. He got lost in the woods, they left him there and they found him dead 2 weeks later from exposure. Low temps were in the 30-40 range.

    The EBT grubbers be it white or black or brown don’t all have as much sense as some folks give them credit for.

    On another note canned lots of blackberries yesterday, headed out to top off some preps we’ve rotated. yall have a good one.

  32. martin says:

    Anywhere in America is pointless. Only the blind and ignorant will still be living here when it becomes a dust bowl of fire and radiation. Anyone that looks at these things knows that it will be burned and to and end never to be inhabitable again. It is happening every day small and big signs are all around. Just pay attention. Look at other nations and what they are planning for us all. Unless you really think some republican/democrat politician is going to save you? Huh! If anything we are about to go into a third world war and it’s not going to be over seas like some Hollywood movie where you get to sit and watch. It will be your kids dead on the floor, your neighbours and family running for their lives to the borders to escape the coming destruction. You better leave now and make your way to another nation now, if you want your kids to live. Because here they only have death and destruction awaiting them. You will be the illegal immigrant that nobody wants and you will be hated. It’s all in the bible. I know some of you scoff at this, that’s okay I don’t really care if you believe it or not, that’s your own opinion. I do and the signs and the news and the facts are all around and all you have to do is pay attention to see where it is all going. You will die if you stay here. Your kids will die and they will suffer tremendously. It will happen because it is supposed to happen. It is written and it is a matter of time. God help you all!

  33. talon1776 says:

    A few topics ago., I posted that a return to paper balloting should be reinstituted to bring back credibility to voting. If more states adopt this position.,maybe we won’t need to relocate and go hide.
    http://thehill.com/policy/cybersecurity/222470-states-ditch-electronic-voting-machines
    Live Free or Die…I want my vote to count…looking at you Philadelphia
    Talon1776

    • Enemy of the State says:

      and do this right now!

      Maybe its time we start auditing political figures

      all of them..

      how do state reps and senators become so rich when they are to be serving the citizens on a politics wages?

      All of them need to be audited before we send in another dime of our tax dollars

      Independent citizen audit of the politico’s

      lets get that on the ballot!

  34. Barn Cat says:

    Prepper communities will be a huge target after it hits the fan. Even your firewood will be a target. You’ll need a way to hide it or defend it.

    • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

      Even in the city you better stock up on firewood. How else will you cook your food. Split it and stack it and cover it from the rain. Get some cheap cement blocks $1 ea. and build a Fire Pit/ Rocket stove, with a grill rack. Tomorrow may be too late to get your back ups in place. Every day work on these projects. Make a list and start knocking them off one by one.

    • Archivist says:

      Half of the FSA probably wouldn’t even know what to do with firewood.

  35. Copperhead says:

    Strategic Relocation:

    Now boarding; flight HCBM1 for Mars Survival Community 1-Alpha. All that is required is a tooth-brush and two changes of underwear. For me it makes as much sense as any of the other places that have been mentioned before. There’s no place like home; born here and will die here, plain and simple as that. ALL ABOARD!

    NOMI

    • Have to agree with you Copperhead,folks who wanna go are welcome to,fair weather patriots someone once called ’em…Ive said it before this ground is the ground my fathers spilt their lifesblood into/onto…aint going nowhere and if that means I die here then so be it but I will make sure the land is well watered with TPTBs blood before I go if God so wills,live free and blast the moron tryin to stop ya! REB

  36. helot says:

    I’m surprised there hasn’t been a blog entry about this on shtfplan:

    “this is probably the most important political speech since Churchill’s “Iron Curtain” speech of March 5, 1946.
    In this speech, Putin abruptly changed the rules of the game. […]

    today Russia sees the outbreak of global war as almost inevitable, is prepared for it, and is continuing to prepare for it. Russia does not war—nor does she fear it.” …

    From a ZH article titled, ‘Putin To Western Elites: Play-Time Is Over’

    • eppe says:

      Helot….

      eppe says:
      Comment ID: 3257888
      October 30, 2014 at 7:34 pm

      Selco just posted a new one on AK’s…

      Putin is putting up the toys…

      ht tp://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-10-30/putin-western-elites-play-time-over

      People like this comment. Do You? Thumb up 8 Thumb down 0

  37. Hmmmm.... says:

    500 recorded cases of Enterovirus D68 in this nation. Right?
    It is brought in to this nation by Central American kids. Right??
    Where are the C.A. kids with this?? Are they carriers only and not getting sick??

    Lucy, you got some ‘splainin to do!!

    Or, are the C.A. kids’ cases being hidden as the reports tell us the Ebola(or whatever it really is) cases are
    hidden/carted away by CDC to die?

    I just don’t get it–if imports/illegals are spreading this disease, where are they?

    I just have a sneaky suspicion this Enterovirus D68 is a reaction from something in the vaccinations given to our children. It’d be interesting to see how many that died, are paralyzed, or infected are current with their vaccines and which vaccines have been given!!

    What kind of parent would even allow 38-40 vaccines to a child before age 5??
    An adult body would have difficulty managing that assault; imagine a 3-12 month old body trying.

  38. vtfree2 says:

    small base, small target.

    thumbs are a ploy to get commentators to come back.
    more visitors, more advertisers, more money.

    Help support my site

    victor tango freehold2

  39. Had a visit today from a fellow prepper who has read just about every book or article on the subject. He’s memorized the specs and ballistics on more calibers than I knew existed and about once a month or so he buys a new weapon, each one better than the previous one and every one, according to him, is better than anything I own. The problem is he’s never put himself or anything he owns to the test. Today he informed me his new find could hit me at over a mile away and I’d never see it coming. I’m sure in the right hands his weapon could hit a target a mile away. He personally couldn’t hit the ground with his hat but good manners prevented me from saying so. What I did point out is that there is no line of fire to my place more than 150 yards and most considerably less, so the longest range weapon in the most capable hands would be no more effective here than my old hunting rifle. I mention this now to point out that the right terrain can level the playing field very quickly.

    • WhoWuddaThunkIt says:

      Ballistic plates and kevlar helmets. And never stand in place for long.

    • Texas Slouch says:

      I find that very, very hard to believe. 1 mile? That’s BS. What most folks don’t fathom is that straight-leg regular infantry only shoot out to 600 yds. I think even a scout sniper would have trouble hitting something at 1 mile. People watch too much tv. I am calling that dude’s proclamation BS. That takes a special skillset, many years of training, and constant shooting. I recommend the Tibasaurusrex on Youtube series. Tibo is very humble and a great teacher:

      • Tex, if I called bs on this fellow every time he spewed it, I’d sound like a broken record. My point was that hi-tech equipment loses its advantage in certain locations. Even if he’d said a quarter of a mile shot which many folks could make, my location still makes it impossible. Anyone who can get a shot at me, I can hit with open sights.

  40. TEST says:

    Question for you electronic whizzes out there. The SHTFPlan sister website, Daily Sheeple, talks about getting DC to DC converter for crises: To wit:”…consider getting a DC to DC converter. This piece will adjust any given voltage, into a higher or lower voltage. I’m betting that this gadget will be far more overlooked than the power inverter, which is typically made to turn 12 volts DC into 120 volts AC. What most folks don’t consider however, is that the sources of energy that will be made after the collapse will be made from improvised parts, and will be highly irregular. Whereas you can buy a solar panel or generator right now that produces something close enough to 12 volts (which is pretty standard), the improvised parts of a post collapse generator aren’t likely to produce the more typical 12 volts that most power inverters are designed for.”

    If you check various websites, there is a a DIZZYING ARRAY of choices and possibilities. (e.g, one site at random I checked was http://www.powerstream.com/dcdc.htm ) Does anyone know **** WHAT one should get? I.e., what specs? Input of 6V? 12? 72? Comments anyone?

    • slingshot says:

      Test.

      I have a (100, car cig. plug type) 300, 1000 and 2000 watt small box size inverters. Converts to 115 vac. Use 12 vdc caterpillar battery to run them. A couple of other 12vdc car batteries and a couple of 12 solar that can do 24vdc charging. I have a generator 3000w with charger but can also use the truck to charge items and batteries. So I am on the 12vdc to 115 vac side.

      You can get 12vdc light bulbs at Lowe’s and string up some low energy usage lighting. There are also 12vdc fans.

    • Kulafarmer says:

      Personally, I think its better to stay away from electonic or electrical stuff as much as possible for SHTF planning,, some stuff you cant skimp on, NV, lighting etc,, lighting is easy with LEDs and 12 volt batteries, a couple small panels and a good jel core battery like an Optima and some cheap LEDs from Amazon can work wonders for lighting, and will last a long long time, you can now get rechargeables in almost any size, and is a good idea to have both the chargers and spare batts in quantity if you can afford them, are good for barter if nothing else,
      I like the goal zero panels, durable, and easy to deploy, there are many out there now though,
      IMHO,
      keep it simple
      the more stuff you have to deal with the more things to go wrong, plus if you need to move fast for any reason how the hell are you going to drag that stuff with you, lets face it, nobody knows what the future holds, the KISS principle has worked well for a long time,

    • Kulafarmer says:

      something else to keep in mind,,
      IF you are pretty good at fabricating stuff, you can rig up a bike with a heavy steel wheel say a plate of 1-1/4″ plate cut perfectly round and fitted where the back wheel goes, and run a serpentine belt with a few of those OEM replacement 200amp output alternators and can generate a lot of power fast, a modified excercise bike works too, the size diff between the wheel or resistance wheel on the excercise bike and the small pulley on the alternators gets the RPMs up where you can easily produce full power or close to it

  41. possee says:

    Really?

    Like 90% of us have the means for purchasing strategic locations for survival…

    According to prior articles most of us are unemployed,underemployed. or a paycheck away from homelessness..

    So what is it?

    And whom is this article targeting…the hedge fund managers on wall street perhaps…

    I had always thought this site was for us average folks who see the handwriting on the wall despite our means to achieve such luxury as Mr Skousen espouses..

    Perhaps this site is not meant for the likes of myself..

    as the likes of Daisy,Burt,manos, and so many others have been long gone from here and moved on..as they lived the reality of it..and contributed so much..

    Kudos to Sgt Dale,braveheart,lastmanstanding,Kulafarmer,etc whom are still here

    possee

    you are sorely missed

  42. KY Mom says:

    Is this Ebola outbreak much more of a potential threat than they are telling us?

    “we have just learned that the federal government has ordered 250,000 hazmat suits and is sending them to Dallas.”

    Many insurance companies “are now specifically EXCLUDING Ebola from their policies…”

    “U.S. and British insurance companies have begun writing Ebola exclusions into standard policies to cover hospitals, event organizers, and other businesses vulnerable to local disruptions.

    “Renewals will also become costlier for companies opting to insure business travel to West Africa or to cover the risk of losses from quarantine shutdowns at home.”

    Zerohedge

  43. Socrates says:

    I’m still not convinced that relocating *anywhere* is going to help. The Ruskies mean business, even if the U.S. does not…

    Russia Conducts Full “Nuclear Triad” Drill, Launches Topol-M ICBM
    (from ZeroHedge site)

    While east Ukraine, aka the Donetsk Republic, was voting over the weekend in what the west pre-emptively classified as another sham vote as its outcome would merely push east Ukraine even closer to the Kremlin, Russia was busy conducting its most comprehensive Nuclear preparedness drill in recent history, one involving the entire “nuclear triad” consisting of strategic bombers; submarines and an the ICBM shown below on Saturday morning.

    As reported earlier by the Barents Observer, the silo-based Topol-M intercontinental ballistic missile was launched from Plesetsk in Arkhangelsk Oblast. A few minutes later, the dummy nuclear warhead hits its target on the Kamchatka Peninsula in Russia’s far eastern corner, the Ministry of Defense reports.

    The Ministry, conveniently, adds that the Topol-M missile has an “extremely high accuracy of target destruction.”

    This took place after a close encounter on Friday, when Norwegian F-16s were scrambled from Bodø airbase for the second time this week as a group of four Tu-95 strategic bombers were approaching from the northeast, Norway’s TV2 reports. The bombers, flying out over the Barents Sea from Russia’s Kola Peninsula, were accompanied by four Il-78 tankers.

    On Wednesday, a similar group of four strategic bombers and four tanker aircrafts were flying southbound along Norway’s northern coast. Six of the aircrafts turned around and flew north again over the Norwegian- and Barents Seas before heading home to Russia. The two last flew all the way south to outside Portuguese airspace before heading north again.

    After scrambling fighter jets from Norway and Great Britian, NATO said in a statement that the Russian bombers pose a risk to civilian air traffic.

    “The bomber and tanker aircraft from Russia did not file flight plans or maintain radio contact with civilian air traffic control authorities and they were not using on-board transponders. This poses a potential risk to civil aviation as civilian air traffic control cannot detect these aircraft or ensure there is no interference with civilian air traffic,” NATO said.

    Tu-95 is a turboprop aircraft built during the Cold War to carry nuclear weapons and is because of its long range included in the strategic nuclear forces.

    And then there were the nuclear subs (of which one was supposedly lost somewhere near Stockholm only for the rumor to be quietly vaporized).

    The third arm of Russia’s nuclear triad, the submarine based ballistic missiles (SLBM), were tested on Wednesday, when “Yury Dolgoruky” launhced a Bulava missile from submerged position in the Barents Sea.

    This was the first operational test launch of Bulava in line with the program of combat training. All previous launches were part of development testing of the new weapon.

    It is also the first time a Borey-class submarine had a full set of missiles on board when the launch was conducted. The Borey-class submarines carries 16 missiles that each may hold as many as 10 nuclear warheads. “Yury Dolgoruky” got her full set of Bulava missiles in June this year.

    • Kulafarmer says:

      If your not living there now you never will be!

      There really is nowhere that will be safe, maybe safer, but almost none 100% safe
      Might as well just enjoy while we can, prepping etc, just falls in with the other hobbies, grow the garden, store up some food, play with the hunting gear and camping stuff and explore the technical aspects of reloading and long range shooting, spend time pulling the bow string and doing shore fishing, theres not enough hors in the day to do everything let alone get bored, lifes busy, all else fails hit the honey do list,,,,
      Breathe
      Enjoy

  44. Anonymous says:

    Posse and Socrates,

    Good point, Posse. I, too, am not wealthy (that is left for the Learjet leftist bankster cronies like Jon Corzine and the Hollywiered limousine liberals). However, after saving for years, I WAS able to come up with 45k to buy some property in Nova Scotia, Cape Breton area. The nice thing about this is that it is not anywhere near anyone’s target, and is completely outside of the affected range of where an EMP strike by bad guys might be (generally thought to be somewhere over KS or thereabouts, radiating outwards). The other plus is that you get your money out of the USD, and it is NOT reportable like a bank account. Also, if someone wants to sue you, they will probably not even know you have the land. Meanwhile, if there is some kind of 401 k confiscation, how are they going to confiscate that? Halifax is about 3 -4 hours away if you need a big city. In a SHTF situation, NO ONE is going to Cape Breton, I can assure you that! I.e., no Ferguson or Rodney King style riots. I used Dignam.com, which has been around for 100 years, and am very happy. They sell property across Canada. One final note: Most of Canada is in a housing bubble – however, the Maritimes are not, so prices are still ok there.

    So, you don’t have money now, but if you do down the road, just a thought. Sometimes things change. I hope they do for you!

  45. The Prophet says:

    Started to watch a rerun of “American Blackout” the other night. 5 minutes into the movie, everything went black. Creepy. Grabbed the gun next to me and cleared the outside of my place. Got in the car and checked out the ‘hood. Determined right away the cause was high wind knocking a tree into the power line. Returned home and stood down, but at the ready. Power back on after 40 minutes.

  46. Enemy of the State says:

    Maybe its time we start auditing political figures

    all of them..

    how do state reps and senators become so rich when they are to be serving the citizens on a politics wages?

    All of them need to be audited before we send in another dime of our tax dollars

    Independent citizen audit of the politico’s

    lets get that on the ballot!

  47. Anonymous says:

    Troll, is that you?