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    THE SCHAEF REPORT: Get Back! (August 2010)


    August 4th, 2010

    Comments (63)
    Read by 268 people

    Get back to where you once belonged.” – The Beatles

    image002

    With warning signs mounting, every day more Americans are waking up to the fact that the West is going through a serious, and very much unstoppable, regression – from globalization to localization, from interdepenedence to self-reliance, from speculative risk taking to conservative wealth preservation, from affluence and overconsumption to poverty and conservation, and from credit excesses to an almost systematic deleveraging. This regression (or global re-balancing) has only just begun and will likely continue for years despite the massive government interventions being employed right now designed to prevent it.We cannot stop it, therefore the most intelligent thing to do is to accept it. Once you accept it you can prepare for it, and once you are prepared for it you can face it.

    Since the government and Wall Street have caused these problems for the most part, and, incredibly, they believe that the same policies which put us on this destructive path are somehow going to take us off it, we should not listen to what they are telling us to do right now (i.e. spend instead of save and speculate with our wealth instead of preserve it). In fact it is time to do everything we can to de-couple from the culture as much as we can. It’s time to do for ourselves what the government is no longer willing (and possibly no longer able) to do for this country as a whole. There is not much time left, but we should use what little time we have to GET BACK to some concepts that we have been ignoring for far too long. Since our government will not follow the concepts outlined below, we must follow them on an individual level in order to come out ahead in the times to come.

    Get Back to Reality

    image004

    The Virtual World. Our world has become virtual in so many ways; from our bank accounts to our relationships on social networking sites. We judge our wealth by looking up our 401ks online at work instead of counting the physical assets in our possession. We judge our support systems by how many people wished us a happy birthday on facebook. We judge our personal security by the fact that we may live in a community with a reportedly low crime rate instead of our own abilities to defend ourselves. We view the world through our television sets which tell us that economic collapses always happen somewhere else. We couldn’t imagine gas stations that are out of fuel, grocery stores with empty shelves, banks with no money, or a local police force that refuses to respond to calls unless they are deemed a “priority”.

    We couldn’t imagine these things because most of us in America believe that our “civilized society” has evolved to the point where we don’t need to produce things anymore. Instead we just need to pay the rest of the world (with the dollars generated from our service based economy) so that they can produce things for us. Regardless of how fragile our social and economic structure has become due to our reliance on the strength of our currency and our inability to appreciate the gravity of a full blown societal panic, our ability to thrive in this virtual world has led to a false sense of security that is sure to catch the majority of us off guard when things begin to get worse and the reality of this economic depression begins to settle in.

    The World’s Largest Ponzi Scheme . Ponzi schemes have a tough time existing in “reality”. They typically need the “virtual world” in order to reek havoc on their victims because in the real world things are exposed, but in the virtual world it is easy to hide behind lies – because the system in which we live is, in fact, NOT REAL. When we think of “ponzi schemes” usually the first thing to come to mind for most of us is the Bernie Madoff scandal, but at least Bernie Madoff made an effort to send his clients statements and lie to them about their wealth. But our own government won’t even publish M3 (which tells us how many US dollars are currently in circulation). What does that tell you about the true strength of the dollars we hold? The US dollar is right now potentially the largest ponzi scheme in the world because no one knows how diluted its supply really is, yet it is the entire world’s reserve currency. If that doesn’t make you want to own at least some gold I don’t know what will.

    Other So-Called “Safe” Things Not Based in Reality . Why buy food insurance if you can buy and store your own non-perishable food in your home? How do you really know they can deliver on their promises if the cost of food skyrocketed? Why pay a bank to store items in a safety deposit box for you if you can get a safe and store them yourself? Why would you keep all your cash in the bank and have zero in hand in case of an emergency? Whatever happened to the good old fashioned notion of “If I can’t put my hands on it, then how do I know it’s real?”? No matter how outdated a concept you believe this to be, I am willing to bet that soon enough it will be on the forefront of everyone’s mind. Therefore, literal possession of your wealth offers the utmost security so long as your store it thoughtfully and carefully.

    Get Back to the Basics

    image006

    Abraham Maslow’s Hierarchy of Needs shows us the many needs which we humans have; some we just strive for and others we simply can’t go without. The very foundation of our survival rests on our “physiological needs”. This segment (found at the bottom of the pyramid) contains just 6 essential elements: air, food, water, shelter, clothing, and sleep. Every one of us will die without these 6 things, yet hardly anyone takes steps to make sure that these needs will be met in case of an emergency.

    The Erosion of Morality . I am not saying that his chart is perfect, but how interesting it is to see that “morality” exists only in the “self-actualization” segment at the very top of Maslow’s pyramid? Is he trying to tell us something? Apparently, according to Maslow, morals are something that most people don’t care much about – expecially in a crisis – until all of their other needs have been met. The world has seen countless examples of breakdowns of social order, but we in America still think that it mostly happens in other countries and if it happens here it is only in our worst neighborhoods where crime is already rampant. Many of us couldn’t imagine social order breaking down in “the burbs”, therefore preparing for it seems foolish to some people – even silly. However, there are reasons why gun and ammo sales have soared in the past couple years and it isn’t because Americans have taken a sudden interest in hunting. Perhaps more people are looking to protect themselves, but perhaps more people are looking to do harm as well?

    The Arrogance of Western Society . Looking at the other elements of “self-actualization” in the chart above, it should be obvious to everyone that these are concepts with which America has been obsessed for decades: creativity, spontaneity, acceptance, purpose, meaning and inner potential. Though these are not bad things to strive for in life, only an arrogant society is consumed by these aspects of life while taking their physiological needs for granted. Planning for disaster, no matter how hard it is to think about (whether economic, natural, or other) is a wonderful exercise that will challenge you to think about how you will meet your basic needs if something horrible were to occur. Most people with “72 hour kits” and “bug-out bags” tend to focus mostly on physiological needs, yet safety and security are also usually taken into consideration.

    Get Back to Quality

    image008

    Why are Recessions Healthy for a Society? As sad as it is to see massive lay offs and people losing their homes, one good result of an economic contraction is that our sense of job security goes right out the window. Why is that a good thing? Because it forces us to be more competitive. Many businesses like to claim “We have the lowest prices” - especially nowadays, but where is the quality? As counter-intuitive as it may seem, in times like these lower prices are not going to keep anyone in business. It’s quality that will keep them head and shoulders above the rest. As competition continues to thin out in the marketplace, the businesses that will be left will ultimately be the ones that have the best products and the best customer service.

    Therefore, Step Up Your Game. Who are the people getting jobs in the private sector right now? The absolute best candidates. Most people are so happy to find work in this environment that they will take almost anything. Employers have a huge pool of candidates to choose from, and make no mistake, they will only pick the very best. Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac might be too big to fail as far as the government is concerned, but one thing is for sure – YOU ARE NOT. So if you are looking for work, you need to dress up, put your best foot forward and nail the interview; and if you are gainfully employed at this time, thank your lucky stars and make sure that your work is of the highest quality so that your employer can’t afford to let you go.

    Get Back into the Black

    image010

    Don’t be the Typical American – Drowing in Debt . Do you consistently spend more money than you make? WELL, THEN STOP IT IMMEDIATELY! The first step to getting out of debt isn’t actually paying off the debt itself. It’s learning how to live within your means so as to not get into more debt. You must change the direction of the ship before you can sail into new waters. Our own government doesn’t even know this, so it’s not very surprising at all that its citizens don’t know it. Look at the various ways that the current administration is sending the message that ” getting into debt is a good thing“. Of course, the government’s own debt load can speak for itself, yet their recent efforts to incentivize you and I to follow in their footsteps should be a huge red flag. Cash for clunkers was an effort to get you and I to throw away our perfectly good cars that were paid off so that we could finance a brand new car and get into more debt. The homebuyer’s tax credit was an incentive to get you and I to stop waiting for the housing market to correct itself and to go out and finance the home of our dreams right now – before the market reaches it’s bottom. One day this very same government who told you and I to get into all this debt is soon going to be faced with the choice of defaulting on its own debt and raising our taxes just so it can pay the interest on it. At that point, what used to be affordable home and car payments that the government coerced us into will be incredibly difficult to make with an increasing tax burden on our backs. Therefore, those of us with the least amount of debt will be able to absorb the coming tax increases a lot easier than those of us who are in debt up to our eyeballs when it comes. According to Marc Faber (publisher of the Gloom Boom and Doom Report) “excessive credit growth” was the main cause of the crisis we are now facing. Therefore, getting out of the red and into the black is the best thing you can do on a personal level to position yourself for what is coming.

    Get Back into Shape

    image012

    Overconsumption and Underproduction . It’s the American way, and it also happens to be the recipe for obesity. I need to hear this as much as anyone else – possibly more (as my gut has been expanding a little lately). Not only is being in shape associated with looking and feeling good, which increases our chances of being competitive in the workplace, but health is another essential need that we all share (see the “safety and security” segment of Maslow’s pyramid). Imagine any possible various SHTF scenarios. Now try and judge your likelihood of survival based on you being in shape or out of shape. Whether you get laid off and need to look your best for a job interview or you need to protect your family against intruders in your home, your are likely to be more successful if you exercise and eat right. Even when we weren’t facing a global economic crisis, being in shape has always been a part of the best practices of the most successful people, therefore how much more do we need to exercise and eat right if our environment is to get less accomodating, less safe, and even more competitive in the future?

    Bye for now,

    Schaef


    The Schaef Report is an independent newsletter contributed to SHTFplan.com by Mr. A Schaef. You can receive the Schaef Report in your inbox. It’s Free! Subscribe below by providing your name and email address and you’ll be automatically added to the monthly distribution list. The Schaef Report and SHTFplan.com take your privacy very seriously and will not distribute or share your email address with other parties.

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    Date: August 4th, 2010
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    63 Comments...

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    1. Sketch says:

      ‘morals’ is a subjective statement. do you honestly think a prostitute WANTS to be a prostitute? (okay, the SANE ones anyway). Most are doing what they can to get the other needs they have – food, shelter, drugs, etc…

      If people want to talk about ‘morality’ (or what THEY see as ‘morality’), then they should be prepared for the skeletons in their closet to be opening can upon can of worms…

      Rate This Comment: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    2. Schaef says:

      Hey Sketch, thanks for the comment. I was using the “morals” term rather loosely in my report (although I think Maslow was not in his theory). In the context of my report I am basically stating that normally “good” people will likely revert to crime once their basic needs are no longer being met.

      Rate This Comment: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    3. RedGypsy says:

      Sad but friggin true .
      Great article.

      Red

      Rate This Comment: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    4. Dave says:

      The short version of this long winded piece is : GOLD,GUNS,GROCERIES

      Rate This Comment: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    5. Tony says:

      Bought my first gun today. We all know what is coming. 

      Rate This Comment: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    6. Dave,

      You got that right! Well, maybe a couple more: God and Guts.

      We’ll call it the 5G approach: GOD, GUTS, GOLD, GUNS & GROCERIES. You will need the 5Gs to get through this.

      I really think that is a big part of our problem: Most of the USA is too gutless to face anything. Because of that, we’ve moved away from God. Whats more, our government knows most are gutless. They use it against us and to make us more gutless. Of course the people in the government are a subsection of the people. They tend to be the less courageous and least confident of them all. (…on the inside.)

      Thus, they keep kicking the can down the road never wanting to face the music.

      Eventually it has to end. I’m pretty well prepared. Just rotating food and fuel now. …and finishing out my seed bank. I know keeping seeds will reduce the germination rate but 10% is better than 0%!

      Good luck everyone. Here is my prepping slide show:

      http://picasaweb.google.com/NtRngr/Prepping#slideshow

      Rate This Comment: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    7. Tom says:

      The gun stores in my town are have back to school sales.

      Rate This Comment: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    8. Schaef says:

      @Tony – “So that’ll be a box of 64 crayolas, 4 notebooks, some pencils, a trapper keeper and a glock 17. Will that be it, sir?”

      Rate This Comment: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    9. Denny says:

      another great article!

      I’m sending it out to my family today….. thank you.

      Rate This Comment: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    10. This article brings out many facets of living in the United States that get glossed over. Again, gutless.  Mostly America is going to get the shaft because they lack a SHTFPlan.  I’d really really rather see them “GET” the Schaef! I really think its rather comical that the people that come here don’t need to come there but the people that do need to come here don’t.

      :)

      Hey Tony! What did you pick up? I hope you made a good choice. You should have read my Beginners Guide to Firearms and Gun Ownership – http://neosurvivalist.net/beginners-guide-to-firearms-and-gun-ownership/

      EVERYONE should have at the VERY VERY LEAST a single shot, break action shotgun. $100 bucks for the gun and $100 buck for ammo. Burn up half the ammo learning to shoot it. Store the rest.
      If you’re smart enough to have a 72 hour back you should be smart enough to have the shortest 12 gauge to break down and put in it.

      You’re all invited to read and comment. You can contact me personally for more information and questions at: ntrngr@gmail.com

      Rate This Comment: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    11. … This is my first tine ever Commenting to an article… But I have been following this site for some time now….

      So my question to any of you or Schaef himself… Regarding having your money from bank in your posession…

      What would you suggest as a storage method?… Or other place to put money? I have some cash for emergency but still have a considerable amount in the bank (a local credit union). My concern if I were to have it physically at “home”… If the SHTF, or shall I say, when SHTF… I then worry about burglary…
      Suggestions from anyone would
      be welcome…

      Thank you

      Rate This Comment: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    12. Fed Up In TX says:

      I actually had someone tell me before a snow storm last year that pizza places always deliver! 

      This is the attitude discussed above.    Do you think his security plan is any better?  Sad but a commentary on why this will be much uglier than most think. 

      Hang, the ride won’t be any fun.

      Rate This Comment: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    13. Bill says:

      Great article.  Being healthy in all areas is always the best bet.  Not many folks I know are covered in all areas.  Some are strong in areas and most are weak in most areas.   Most people think they are better than they really are in all areas.   The key in my life is no debt.  This is key for living healthy in all the other areas. 

      Rate This Comment: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    14. sanityjones says:

      It would be prudent as well to get a health checkup, and get up to date on your dental work. Yeah it’s expensive and a crappy way to spend a few grand but I know I am going to feel better going into the unknown as physically prepared as humanly possible.

      Rate This Comment: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    15. Goldenfoxx says:

      Comments…..

      Great article!  The key to happiness is no debt. Fortunately, millions can’t qualify for home loans–even the rich are skipping out on their obligations.  Not being able to get loans is keeping some people out of debt.

      About being healthy.  Pick any crowd and just stand around and look at all the fat people walking around with something in their hand to eat or drink.  Was at a big hotel in Reno recently.  Decided to lounge by the pool and relax.  I sat there in wonderment as to how some of the people got into a bathing suit, much less not be embarrassed to be seen in one.  I was thinking about how many would fair when their favorite food disappears, or no food at all.  It’s a funny thing about the human body, we are structured to eat.  Hunger will make people do things criminally that they would not ordinarily do.

      Walking daily for at least 30 minutes will keep your body and your mind fairly sound.  It can alleviate depression and hunger at the same time.  Doesn’t cost anything to do it–it’s free!

      Rate This Comment: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    16. Poster 13 says:

      Think you should take anonymous comments.  Not having your name on any extreme sites, right or left, is part of keeping prepared for anything!

      Rate This Comment: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    17. Bill says:

      sanity – My wife and I just went through a huge dental checkup and work.   $2,680.00!!!!!!!!  The good part was that my dentist always trades with me.  His dentistry for my carpentry.   It’s the best way to go.  (Except my part will be a week or more long.  His was no more that 4 hours.)  Still, I’ll trade anytime.

      Rate This Comment: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    18. Schaef says:

      @Tomato – Get a safe, keep it hidden,  and bolt it down to the surface it rests on. Some people bury stuff, but I don’t like that idea because I don’t want to spend a bunch of time digging to get to my valuables if I need to head out quickly. Obviously, a safe is only a theft “deterrant”, but that is likely all you need. When homes get burglarized the inruders realize they don’t have much time, so trying to break into your safe won’t really be an option for them.

      Rate This Comment: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    19. Tom says:

      Ketchup,
      That FRN is only paper.  Are you hoping for deflation or just trying to beat the bank holidays and shop the empty shelves?  Look down at 30,000 feet instead of what is in front of you. 

      Rate This Comment: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    20. Bill says:

      Tomato – I can tell you what I did.  I turned a lot of my cash to PM.  It’s easier to hide/store.  Some of mine is in a large safe that is anchored to the wall and some of it is hidden around my home in safe areas that I built into the home.  You could look for days and never find it.  My cash is in the same locations.  It would be nice to communicate personally with you to give you some other ideas.  Hope this helps.  It’s nice to not have to worry about the banks and/or the gangsters in washington.  

      Rate This Comment: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    21. GoneWithTheWInd says:

      It’s complicated.  Here are some ideas: 
      put your money in more then one credit union.  Lets say you have $80,000, open up four accounts in four different credit unions and put $20k in each.  If one closes you still have $60k available to you. 
      Keep $500-1000 in small bills in your home somewhere safe.  Preferably in two or three different places.
      Put a few thousand (in small bills) into a safe deposit box.  
       
      I would not pull out thousands and hide it in the mattress if I were you.  Too risky.  However if TSHTF and you can get your money THEN I would indeed pull it out and hide it somewhere on your property. 

      Rate This Comment: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    22. Bill says:

      @windy – My idea was to keep all my money out of government/harms way.   The mattress is a bad idea but most folks that have a home have places to hide things.   Once again, put your money in a safe deposit box and it’s out of your reach.  Maybe I’m just too paranoid…..  It doesn’t seem that complicated to me.   I’m not hiding millions of dollars though so if that’s the case, maybe it is more complicated.   I’d give it a try though if I could!

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    23. Tom says:

      I’d rather leave a nasty note in a “safety” deposit box.  Have you ever read the fine print? 

      Rate This Comment: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    24. Schaef says:

      Gotta side with Tom on this one…

      Rate This Comment: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    25. oneshotkill says:

      I would have to say NetRanger said it in proper order, put GOD first when the shtf that will be your best for ultimate survival. The best treasure no man can steal.

      Rate This Comment: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    26. Chris C. says:

      NetRanger, we got pretty much the same stuff, with the exception of artillery/guns which you’re way up on me. I have same ammo box – use it to store electronics in case of EMI pulse. Have chickens, garden, and large yard too. Isn’t life grand?

      Rate This Comment: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    27. comment says:

      Please…. leave “God” out of this.
      I don’t believe in one any more than Santa Claus.
      Whenever one of you invokes “God” it’s pathetic.

      It’s bad form to belittle you (much as it is a cripple), however make no mistake…that’s how I view you. You can’t get thru life without the crutch of there being a ‘supreme being’ that dotes over you.

      Please keep your illusions private.

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    28. eagleclaw says:

      Anthony Tomei has a website; http://www.futuredatabank.com/

      Interesting reading & unfortunately, the laws of probability indicates his predictions are  close or right on! 

      Rate This Comment: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    29. Mariposa de Oro says:

      “  Pick any crowd and just stand around and look at all the fat people “…hey don’t knock all of us ‘fatties’.  I’ve stopped trying to loose weight and consider my padding as part of my ‘reserves’.   That said, I’m nothing like morbidly obese.  I ride my bike to work and literally everywhere because I live on a small Pacific island.  I don’t drink any alcohol, drink sodas, and very rarely have desert.  I don’t pile the plate with food, nor I go for seconds.  Some of us just look like pears at the half century mark.  Hey,  this fat just might save my life someday.
      :o>

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    30. Mariposa de Oro says:

      http://www.infowars.com/usda-reports-food-shortages-wall-street-caught-off-guard-by-severity/

      Looks like that fatties will be dieting soon.

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    31. MadMarkie says:

      Greetings All;

      1.  If you are looking for ideas for places to hide things around your home or apartment please consider getting your hands on a copy of; Secret Rooms, Secret Compartments which is written by Jerry Dzindzeleta, copyright 1990. It is still available on Amazon for less than $20; perhaps you can score a used copy for even less. Adapt the ideas, concepts and the mechanics to your situation.

      Forget about ‘stashing’ anything in a bank safe deposit box. It probably won’t be available to you when you need it most. The government has a track record of declaring a bank holiday and looting people’s safe deposit boxes.

      2.  Everyone should have at least one firearm in today’s uncertain times. If you’re just starting out and thinking of acquiring your first gun; then I would strongly recommend a .22 caliber semi-automatic rifle that is magazine fed. The Ruger 10/22 is an excellent choice when cost and having a reliable gun that you can depend on is important. High capacity 30 & 50 round magazines are available as are lots of after-market accessories. 500 rounds of high quality ammunition will set you back something like $25.00. Daddy once took a big buck with one shot from a .22 rifle that was looking into the headlights of his jeep. Illegal as hell …… but he had a family to feed.

      If you have the time before things finally go to hell and the money; then I would suggest a 12 ga. shotgun. The Mossberg model 500 with the short 18″ and 28″ barrels can be had for around $200.00. If you get the short barrel “cruser” with the pistol grip, be sure to invest in a pistol grip for the ‘slide’. Otherwise the recoil will numb up your hand holding the pistol grip (rear) within 6 rounds.

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    32. Chris C. says:

      Two comments on the article.  One, on the Cash for Clunkers, I can’t see how anyone in their right mind would have turned in a perfectly good running vehicle that was PAID FOR just to get a new car and a new monthly payment along with it. This ploy should not have worked on anyone with half a brain. That being said, I know that used cars can be enormous financial burdens, so if you were sinking $2000-$3000/yearly into that 15 year old clunker then this program may have given you the incentive to ditch it and purchase new, but only if the cost of that new vehicle and vehicle itself was a better deal than you could have gotten on any used vehicle without the Cash for Clunkers bonus. I can see some cases where it may have made sense for some people to go for this, but really all I think it did was pull demand forward, and now we have the diminished demand for new cars as evidence.

      On the over-consumption thing, I am torn in two different directions. Yes we need to take command of our health and eat better, exercise more, and seek more environmentally friendly products that have less deleterious effect on our bodies. But the main roadblock in achieving this is the constant barrage by the MSM and a complicit government that says 24/7 bigger is better and to indulge is to be an American. Look at the portions anywhere you eat out. I can barely finish a hamburger out anymore at a few of the major family restaurant chains. And often you get unlimited fries and/or soda. Who can eat all this? I come out feeling sick either way, sick if I don’t eat it and it gets thrown out (if I don’t bring it home), and sick if I do eat it but at least I feel better I didn’t waste any of it. Who started this culture of gigantic portions at family restaurants?

      The other thing is the insidious nature of food sponsors on television. Watch a television show for one hour during prime time viewing hours and watch how many commercials there are for Wendy’s, Arby’s, McDonalds, and so forth. What really gets me is McDonalds was the official sponsor for this past Winter Olympics. Can anyone say oxymoron?

      Then you have the fast food restaurants giving away plastic Chinese toys in their happy meals, just to hook these kids on their crap, and the kids end up associating instant reward with the food.

      It’s completely obvious to me now that they (our government and TPTB) just view us as rats ripe for conditioning, and are fattening us up for something awful down the road.

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    33. Tom says:

      Comment,
      We’re going to try to ignore you.

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    34. Another Comment says:

      Comment, I think you should reconsider.

      God is very important to factor in.   Christians can and will organize quickly, they’re armed to the teeth, and some of the meanest people I’ve ever met (not all but enough to worry me).

      If there is a large mob of Christians who need food or supplies and you are the odd man/atheist out, you’re toast.  They’ll kill you and take everything you’ve got because “God provides for His children” – you’re a heathen and they are “doing God’s will.”

      So.  I would advise you to think about your plan.  I’ve got my hymns memorized and a Bible tucked away so if I need to I can thump the daylights out of it to protect my family. 

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    35. Jonny V says:

      Chris C:  you should try doing what I’m doing.  I had all the same problems with the MSM as you (regarding food).  I was trying to figure out how to make my diet healthier while at the same time, working out the kinks of how to feed my family when the supply chain breaks down due to the wild irresponsibility of our government.  I feel that it is a fact that, sooner or later, we will have to fend for ourselves and not rely on trucked in food.  I also believe that this will happen in my lifetime.  Storing up cans of food seems self-defeating, as it will run out sooner or later, and canned food tastes like crap.  I want good food.

      I am converting everything in our kitchen, refrigerators, and freezers, to 100% locally produced (organic where possible).  Also, we are learning to garden, and I hope to get a greenhouse built next spring, along with a large open air garden and a small planting station for kitchen herbs and so forth.  No one NEEDS a fucking lawn anyway!

      This has been much more difficult than I could have imagined when I started.  It also raises food costs, but only by a marginal amount, not the huge amount others would have you believe.  If you factor in not eating out nearly as much (very few restaurants have GMO free food), you will find that your overall food costs go way down.  It has taken longer than I ever thought, but I am on the verge of victory, and it does make you feel VERY secure and successful.  I now know how we will eat if things go to shit.  I’m not sitting around hoping that it all works out, truth is, I no longer care if it all works out or not.

      The other great thing about this is that my money is no longer supporting corporations that genetically fuck with our food, my money is not going to China for their lead paint toys, I’m not eating processed crap from a box, both me and the wife are losing weight, no more blood pressure meds, and I’m supporting others who live in my area (farmers).  I know where my pork, chicken, and beef come from, hell I can go pick out the animal I want killed.  I’m not supporting factory farming anymore.  Hell, I only have to go to the grocery store every two to three weeks, and then mostly for non-food items.

      It does take a lot of effort, and you have to be hard headed about it and chase down lots of information about what, where, and how, but I’d do it again in a second.  This is one of the best things I’ve ever done.  It’s as good as when I was in the USMC, and nothing else has been this important or gratifying in years.

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    36. Tom says:

      Thanks USMC.

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    37. Goldenfoxx says:

      Comments…..
      Mariposa de Oro, every Thursday I take my 86 year old mother out to lunch, sometimes we go to a local buffet.  Ever been to a buffet and notice all the fat people and what they pile on their plates?  Many of them are young, too young to be morbidly obese.  If they have children, it’s interesting to see what they feed their kids as well.  Pizza, hot dogs, macaroni and cheese and jello.  Then several trips to the dessert bar. But it’s not just places like this, one can view what they put in their shopping carts at the grocery store, and then hand over their WIC coupons, or their food stamp debit card.  Do I have a right to complain–damn do!  As a taxpayer they purchase unhealthy foods with my money, then go to the doctor when they get sick with my money.  They can buy the most sugary unhealthy cereals like (Cocoapuffs), and the government allows that. However, the government demands that I have health insurance or risk a fine or go to jail. What’s wrong with this picture?  I can’t afford to be fat cause that BMI chart will always be staring at you when you go to the doctor. He/she may tell you to go home and lose weight. But the fat person on welfare?  Come on in!  Flame away, but it’s the truth.

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    38. Tony says:

      NetRanger,

      Ended up getting a revolver 38 Cal 4 inch barrell 6 shot. I would still like to get a shotgun like you said.

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    39. Jonny V says:

      GoldenFoxx;  You should see ‘em at the Costco just before the store opens…….You can get your ass rammed and run over by a belligerent mother with kids so that she can get to the sugar isle before you.

      What we’re talking about here is the “need” to consume “mass quantities” (remember the Coneheads on SNL?) before anyone else.  That’s who we are now.  That’s why I made the changes to our families diet that I did.  I don’t want to be part of that anymore.

      It’s the closest that people like you and me can get to “checking out” of the system.  Don’t give them your money.  It’s the ONE TRUE VOTE you have.  You can use it every day.

      Tony:  you did real good buying that 38.  Go buy 1000 rounds of “lead round nosed” ammo and learn how to shoot.  The thing that decides who wins and who loses in gunfights isn’t the weapons that each of them have, it’s the skill each of them have.  There are numerous factual accounts of people armed with 22′s defeating individuals carrying 45′s in gunfights.  In these cases, the person with the 22 was skilled at shooting, while the person with the 45 was counting on his weapon to make up for his lack of skill (the macho factor).  Read “Stopping Power” by Evan Marshall (he’s a former cop).  He uses 1000′s of cases to build a comparison of pistol calibers based on the results of actual shootings, not just some crap someone saw on a movie where the bad guy was blown back 15 feet.  That’s all a bunch of crap, don’t fall for the macho trap………..

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    40. Tom says:

      Learn how to compete like a cop going out to survive another night or on another tour to the land in the sand & feel the trigger creep. 

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    41. @Johnny V

      LMAO! – You’re right about that. No one really needs that  lawn. You won’t be able to get gas for the lawnmower anyway.

      @Another Comment

      Excuse me? Your athiest and “odd man out” people better hope they fall right into those armed Christian groups. Your comment about them being mean are absolutely asinine. I don’t know what kind of moronic propaganda you’re you’re trying to spread. All I know is that the Christian preppers (like me) are storing extra food for the Athiest and Heathen idiots, like yourself. Though they (and you) may go to Hell, we intend them to be reasonably comfortable and fed. No man will find a more charitable and tolerant bunch than the armed Christians in my neighborhood. Viscious if confronted forcibly. They’ll defend their family and survival with their life. Come in humbly and ask, we’ll split our last bean with you 4 ways. We are COMMANDED to take care of you. Even though you’re on the wrong road, we have to take care of you. Why? Because you’re our brothers and sisters. Jesus died for you just as he did for us. The fact of the matter is, in a true Christian’s eyes there are no heathen and there are no odd men out. There are only sin laden humans that need salvation. People like you that spread dangerous propaganda will get exactly what you deserve. Your arrogance will get you killed.

      There are, however, lots of “pew fillers” and “church socializers” that do many things “in the name of God” that are, well, not really faithful Christians. They use Christianity as a tool to get where they want and get what they want. But, you, as an anti-Christian fool, would be too ignorant to know the difference. I pray you’ll find your way. But, if you don’t, its your fault. All you have to do is ask.

      All I know is that I’m setting on 30 acres. If you can find me, come on over. You’ll get something slapped into your hand: shovel, gun, chainsaw, splitting mal, screwdriver, water can, skinning knife, seeds, mowing scithe. At 8, 12 and 6 you’ll get a bite to eat. And at night you’ll have a roof over your head and you’ll be warm in the winter and way to hot in the summer! Some nights you might have to stay up half of it with a gun in your hand.

      I forsee a tent city in and around my place. I hope it doesnt happen, but, I’ve been led here and given this chance, how can I now say, “No! Its all mine and I’m not going to share!” I would be no better than the “heathen” or the “athiest”.  

      …and what if you’re wrong? What if there is a God? God living is Good living any way you slice it. So many think it enslaves. It does not. It frees. It is your blindness that keeps you in your shackles.

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    42. @Comment

      Will you sacrifice any of your labor or comfort for your fellow man? Christians will. Even if you take God out of the equation, in the midsts of Christians is where you want to be. Oh, they may annoy you with their preaching and God talk. Just consider putting up with that stuff to be payment for the meals and the roof over your head they will provide to strangers.

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    43. sam says:

      Comments….On the topic of sugar and diet , most  people don’t have the right education to make the right choice when it come to diet. Describing disease in one word is easy DIGESTION when this process is upset that’s when the pain starts and the body starts to fall apart. It amazes me how many people are not aware of what their body PH should be, there are some who look at you funny and say PH what is that. Beacuse of such ignorance parents allow their children to drink high sugar soft drinks frying their brains, not realizing that such drinks cause permanent neurological damage. The bodys PH runs at about 7.35-7.45 on average, a Pepsi has a PH of 2.5 when you have such drinks  the bodys immune system goes  into shock for up to 4 hours causing alot of stress on the system.  “”Sugar is a true vegetable acid””Lavoizier. When you or your children are addicted to sugar, you’re actually addicted to acid.
      Then you have the next worst addiction COFFEE this has to be the worst poison anyone can put in their system, Coffee is %29  nitrogen, that’s 58 times more than the body requirements.
      When you stop poisoning your body you will have peace of mind, as the old saying goes “”a sound mind only exists in a sound body” end ot story.

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    44. Jonny V says:

      Net Ranger, I see that you’ve got 30 acres.  That’s a good sized amount of space to do stuff with.  Myself, I’ve only got 1/3 acre, but I think with good planning, I can get all the features in that I want.  The end goal for me (and this size spot of land) would be to (mostly) support 2-4 adults, and be a place of relative security.  The greenhouse and the garden are keys, I just have to work it out absolutely right……

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    45. Hermes says:

      Speaking of the sad lifestyle and health habits of our “Advanced Civilization” I think that people’s diets can be as deleterious to their health as the most popular “pleasure habit” I can think of other than food: Corporate cigarettes. I know obesity (or fat to avoid being PC) was mentioned, but I have to say that I see/know quite a number of average build people with considerably poorer health than some fat folks I know. Living in Louisiana definitely exposes one to some of the most uneducated and unhealthy people in the country.  Fortunately Louisiana doesn’t have a monopoly on these traits by any stretch..  No offense smokers, but I hate cigarettes. I don’t know about national statistics, but it seems like there are a lot of smokers in Louisiana. Everywhere I go people smoke: my family, friends, coworkers, pregnant moms, grandpa’s, teenagers. Its almost epidemic. I see cigarettes as just one more sad degradation of humanity, albeit with each and every smokers free-will making the decision.  Nonetheless, I hate to see a young girl smoking just as much as I hate to see my brother smoke. I’ll admit I’m not perfect, shit I’ve used my share of mind altering substances. Not that they are all bad, even if the legal system tells one otherwise. But ask yourself what are the only substances that the Establishment tells us are acceptable??? 1)Cigarettes, the largest preventable cause of death in the world!!! More people die from cigarettes than all drugs, legal and illegal combined along with suicides. And yet an ounce of marijuana is a felony offense?
      2)Alcohol – Uncle sam doesn’t mind alcohol, with all of its consciousness expanding,.. uhh I mean numbing potential.
      3)Prescription drugs — Now some might say that these are medicine and surely they aren’t to be used as drugs. “Antidepressants” = Antidepress = ProHappy.
      So essentially they are give to you to make you “happy” or to at least numb, stupify, euphoriate, and make you smile enough not to kill the family and coworkers. Sounds an awful lot like most “illegal” drugs ultimate objectives to me. This legal and social paradigm (projected through state education curriculums and mass media) regarding “legitimate” and “illegitimate” drugs naturally provides to framework for a monopolistic market for mind altering substances. I’m not pushing any specific agenda, but along the theme of health habits (earlier posts about fatness and unhealthy food) I believe that the subject is relevant and worth more than a cursory examination.

      Are cigarettes more damaging to society (in economic terms – public health systems, and human terms -lost family, friends) than marijuana? How about psilocybin mushrooms?  With a legal and government system, which ritualistically utilizes statistics, why aren’t the statistics regarding these topics weighed in an unbiased way? Certainly all drugs require vigilant use, and foreknowledge of their potential benefits and risks for responsible, functional use. Anyone who has used mushrooms, or just pot in an environment as safe as the average joe beer drinker does on saturday night, knows that what he does is neither criminal nor immoral in nature, even if the propagandized public can’t see otherwise.  Ok I think I’ve rambled enough for the night, so I will hide my face and quietly exit through the back door. Peace. Ohh yeah anyone who wants to see an amusing clip check this out (don’t get angry if the music doesn’t suit you, sorry)
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R2F_hGwD26g

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    46. wooba says:

      A great article that, always good to be refreshed, to be kept on track.  It’s all to easy to forget the imperitive after a few days and begin looking at wide-screen video units I don’t need.

      On this question of keeping money in the bank or in a safe, or in the ground I think the bigest obstical many of us face “me included” is our own psychology.  If you have an average income and you have 60 000 dollars saved in cash ( besides your hoard of PM’s)  It’s not easy to pull it out of the bank and start burying it.  I’m used to the bank protecting my cash and I have to fight with myself to get it out.  I have roughly 10% in my own possession and I worry more about that than the cash in the bank.  Mind you, I live in Australia and here things are a little different as we have 4 major banks and they are a cartel.  We also have a federal guarantee, at least for a few more months…

      I think I better get some more out…

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    47. Tony says:

      Jesus Christ is the foundation of everything. Knowing Him is more important than storing food and owning guns. What good is it to gain a few years on earth to lose your soul to hell?

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    48. Sam says:

      Comments…..Hermes.believe it or not I  had coworkers and family members quit smoking but they couldn’t quit coffee, or they found it harder to do so. Coffee has got a higher nitrogen content than cigarettes that makes it more addictive and dangerous to your health, but no health warnings exist on coffee cups like cigarettes.
      There is more nitrogen in coffee than there is in manure making it a highly carcinogenic substance, hell in China and the Philippines there is a animal called Kopi Luwak, this animal eats the coffee cherry digests it and shits it out, people go around picking up this shit, they wash it and bag it , this shit sells for $600 a pound.
      You can have the best organic food on earth, but the minute you contaminate that meal with coffee, cigarettes pop, alcohol etc., you’ve defeated the purpose, “Pandemics are caused by insufficient or unwholesome diet” Adam Smith.
      Eat well, study hard, pray to the almighty and thank him for everything he’s giving you, and live long and prosper.

      Sam

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    49. sanityjones says:

      @ NetRanger,

      Great comments about the lifestyle and commitments of true Christian people. I am exactly where you are as far as mindset, acreage, and philosophy; thankful for the potential opportunity to serve my fellow man in our walk through the valley of the shadow of death. May God bless ALL who post here, Christian or not.

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    50. Jonny V says:

      I wish more so called “christians” would get a clue from folks like NR.  I spend a lot of time railing on religion, but it was never really Jesus (or any other religious honcho) that offended me so much, it was their followers.

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    51. oneshotkill says:

      @ NetRanger                                                                                                                You and yours will be in my prayers brother.                                               JESUS IS LORD

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    52. Another Comment says:

      Jonny V, I think you’ve summed it up better. 

      NetRanger, I have spent years “religiously” attending church, my entire childhood, some college, and occasionally as an adult.  And I can tell you some of the Christians there have been the foulest excuses for humans ever.  And they exonerate themselves by using God as a cover.  I could give some shocking examples.  No propaganda, actual observations.

      Not sure how you know the Muslims or Hindus or Jews have it wrong either.  People ranting about how God will “get” them and they’ll burn in hell sounds just as strange to non-Christians as if I were to start ranting here that Zeus would strike you down with a lightening bolt if you didn’t start animal sacrifices.  Just because you’ve swallowed Christian pabulum doesn’t make it “right” or the only path one can choose to walk.  Maybe you’ll be the one to burn in hell after Allah sends you there.

      I like your other comments exclusive of religion, though.

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    53. TripodXL says:

      Comments…..

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    54. @Jonny V

      Honestly, I rail at religion a lot too. People “use” religion as a tool to accomplish evil ends. The Islamic extremists are the same way. I imagine it irritates the Muslims when people put them into the same class as the terrorists just as it irritates me when they talk about the crusades and Christianity and all the evils that have been done in the name of Jesus. People “use” religion to, as Another Comment says, exonerate themselves.

      @Another Comment
      Stop arguing! We don’t disagree only on this one point: I know very few “Christians” (quoted to mean people who call themselves Christians but are only surfacial) that are vicious killers. I think, again, like many evils, that kind of garbage exists in certain urban and suburban areas where people move in and out. They’re really all just a little better than strangers.

      I find the image you painted of “Christians” killing or excluding the “odd man out” to be repugnant and disgusting! Certainly not the way it is in my church. You can take the most sinful, disgusting, morally decrepid person and set them in my church and we’ll have him/her adopted and invited back the next week. …and if it were TEOTWAWKI, we’d feed them and beg them to stay. You don’t seem to understand, we have no other option. We came with nothing and Jesus gave us EVERYTHING. How are we to act when people come to us with nothing? Believe me, if you find a group of Real Christians, they’ll even respect your stance on things that they don’t agree with *INCLUDING* atheism or other religions. We love everybody. We’ll certainly argue with you about it, but, that doesn’t keep us from feeding you and being hospitable.

      @Mac
      I must appologize for hijacking this comment section. I just can stand when someone appears to misrepresent, what is to me, the greatest gift life has to offer.

      All I can say is me, my 30 acres, my 2 daughters, my son, my wife and the 50 or so families that live within a 20 mile circle of my church will do our best to take care of whoever wanders in. We’ll feed them, cloth them, take them into our homes, give them supplies to travel on. We can’t out give Jesus but we’ll sure try. All it takes is a little humility and to simply ask.

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    55. TripodXL says:

      Comments…..
      Schaef……….great article, hits many nails on the heads.

      Is that the Michelin Kid???? in the MacPicture?
      NR  The 5 Gs are an awesome concept.  Love the slide show, jealous.  I have great respect for you.  On the guns here and another comment to Tony, I somewhat differ. Been a martial sort of fellow since I was drafted in 72 and just retired 2 mos ago.  Also teach the gun stuff.  Tour of SEA, various military events of opportunity,  SWA desert 2x and other contracts.  First, don’t get 1000 rds or $100 worth of ammo, if you are a new shooter it isn’t enough.  It is better to shoot 10 well thought out rounds every day than it is to shoot 200 one day a week.  However, more is always better as far as practice.  This is one area you don’t want to skimp on, neither do you want to be overly extravagant either.  I will pontificate here.  You need a handgun and .38 spcl is fine.  What I would do is, as money and time permit, is purchase a Dillon Square Deal reloader and you can reload a $17  box of .38 spcl for about $3-7 and at a 3:1 ratio you can practice that much more.  1000 rds will set you back $17 x 20 boxes (50 rds/bx)= $540.  The SQD is $366 all set up to reload.  1000 lead bullets are $65 and 1000 rds of once fired brass is $70 from Dillon (and the brass is reusable indefinitely). Primers are about 1-1.5 cents apiece and you will use about 4-6  cents worth of powder per round.  This equals 6.5 cents per bullet and a total cost per round of 10-14 cents/rd and this is on the high side from overestimating.  As far as the rest of the guns, to keep this from being too long, you need 4 guns, in the following order.  A handgun, a shotgun, a .22 rifle and a compact centerfire rifle.  Not to dis your .38 but 9mm is std military ammo, so it will always be around and more probably available.  12g mossberg pump full length  riot shotgun.  A 10/22 Ruger, period….50 rd mags are expensive and not as sturdy as 10 rounders and they cost 7xs as much.  Just buy more 10 rounders.  And now, I can hear the gnashing of teeth, get an AR-15, shoots std military ammo so it will always be around.  Yes, you can find cheaper guns, a single shot shotgun but is this what you want to use for serious work against someone with a 12g pump?  Yes you can find a bolt action .22 for half the price but here again, would you like to go HTH with your bolt against a 10/22, prob not.   And so on.  The AR is a lot like Windows versus Apple, yeah the Apple does a lot of things better but if you need to fix something you have to find someone that speaks Apple.  The AR-15 is ubiquitous, anyone that has been in the military or is a gun guy should be able to field strip it and troubleshoot it easily and teach you the same thing.  Would be happy to help and give you any info you need, just leave an email and I will contact you privately.  Good luck.

      Money in the bank….don’t.  Just use what you need there to pay your bills and keep as much as you can on hand.  Yes, this is going to be and E-ticket ride and it ain’t gonna be fun.  If you put money in 4 different institutions (be they banks or credit unions they are all some version of FDIC, which means zip) you will just have to stand in 4 different lines to try and get your money, same for SD boxes and if tshf you will probably have a chaperone to “help you ” with your box.
      As far as being in good shape, that’s a no brainer.
      Safes, when the price of your guns equals that of a gunsafe, you should get one.  A safe! not a stack-on metal cabinet.  Put it in a closet and bolt it to the floor with grade 5 or better bolts.
      Tomato, you will need FRNs, even though they are worthless, the sheeple at large still think they are money and until we are wheeling it around in wheel barrows they will still take it.  You need small denoms.  1s, 5s 10s, mostly 1s.  You will need these while they still spend.

      Comment; God will not hold you accountable for the actions and words of other people,  only yours.  Peace, be still.  GBY
      I don’t have a lawn, I do garden, the only green I care about is that that helps me.  If bugs are eating the garden that you will depend on for the next year, YOU will spray them.  I try not to, but…..  I do my best to not support corporations I don’t like but if Wal-mart has the best price then that’s where I go.  Don’t cut your nose off to spite your face.
      As far as Lt Evan Marshal’s stats, yes they do prove some unconventional things and a hit with a .22 is better than a miss with a .44 mag. And I do sometimes carry a .32 Tomcat with Silver tips in it.   However, Evan will tell you that bigger is still always better.  It’s not about macho, it’s about technique, skill and practice all of which must be learned through significant effort.  I used my son, who weighed 78 # at the time to demo the course of fire for my CHL classes.  He used my full sized .45 1911 with standard ball ammo (hard ball) and would shoot very small one hole groups at 7 yards, including rapid fire, just to demonstrate to all the girlie men in my class that it really is technique and skill, that comes from lots of  practice.  If an 11 year old boy can double tap, head shoot and do rapid fire with a .45 then so can most people.  There is a reason the FBI went to the 10mm.  Of course they had to make it easy for the “Sheila’s” to shoot and thus the .40S&W.
      JV 1/3 of an acre is plenty of room if you use intensive gardening techniques.  A good reference is “The Square Foot Garden”, but it is written by someone in New England and is good for up there but it still makes a good reference for starting in other areas, you’ll just have to adapt it.
      Coffee is good for you in moderation and is a good source  riboflavin and pantothenic acid.  Research shows that it aids other anti oxidants as well as has some of it’s own.  In the short term it increases your alertness and others studies show that it helps alleviate mild asthma symptoms, has an anti diabetic effect (type 2) as well as coffee drinkers have a lower incidence of colo-rectal and pancreatic cancers and are less likely to develop Alzheimer’s disease.  Based on many studies over many years with thousands of participants.  And, before you say it, they all can’t be lies.  There are very few negative studies about coffee.
      NR, you seem like a thoughtful and caring person, not so sure that I can accommodate everyone that comes to the door.  While I believe in the Lord, I also acknowledge natural selection.  I feel that most people (not all) got where they are by themselves and through their own misguided lifestyle.  It’s like the Michelin Kid in the MacPicture, while it isn’t his fault, it is his parent’s fault and when he grows up (if he lives that long) he’ll be the same way.  Until the scales fall off the people’s eyes and they see what is true and what is worthwhile they will plod along their path of blissfully ignorant destruction.
      Enjoy!

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    56. Jonny V says:

      Hey NR, I get you.  I honestly think that if I could, I’d be an Amish person.  I admire their ability to ride things out and to stick with it, even when the going totally sucks.  I like the idea that they are master craftsmen, with people willing to pay a lot for their goods.  To me, they represent what “honest” people should be.

      Some idiot posted on this site a couple weeks back, about how the inner city zombies would come out and shoot up the Amish and the farm type people when the SHTF.  I disagree.  I’m willing to bet a good amount of “junk silver” coin, that the Amish can out-shoot the gang-bangers any day.

      I have a lot to learn.  I’m just trying to learn it without all the old superstitions attached.

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    57. Jonny V says:

      OK Tripod!, even Evan will agree that a hit with a 22 is better than a miss with a 44, however, that is dodging the point.  My point is that most people buying guns right now are doing so for “macho” reasons.  They are hoping that the mere sight of their 1911, M1, M14, M16, etc, will be enough to deter a gunfight, or if one breaks out, to WIN the gunfight, just based on the SHEER REPUTATION of the guns involved.  The far and away VAST MAJORITY (99%) of current gun owners, have little to no experience SHOOTING GUNS.  That’s my point…………..

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    58. Bill says:

      Great comments one and all…….  NetRanger – Thanks for your words! 

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    59. Jonny V says:

      Tripod, (and anyone you are advising) one more thing.   Spend the extra $50 bucks and buy a Remington shotgun.  The Mossberg is a piece of crap.  The boys in the field say so, and the cheap price they charge for them says so.

      The Remington’s design has remained unchanged since the 1950′s, coincidence?, hardly.  They got it right the first time.

      The Mossberg was named the combat shotgun of the USMC due to political maneuvering and intense campaign contributions, and those are the ONLY TWO REASONS.

      Go with a proven history, and what you can trust, not a mossberg sales pitch.  Spend the extra $50 bucks and get a shotgun you can hand down to your grand-kid, not a piece of crap.

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    60. TripodXL says:

      Comments…..JV, no, actually the mossberg IS the correct comabat shotgun for the military, I know, been there.  The Mossberg and the Remington are both in the inventory along with Winchesters, but Mossberg updated their design in the late 90s and went to a double rail pump slide and a more robust ejection system.  It is the USMC choice as well as the military in general because they all passed the field trials at Eglin AFB and Mossberg was the lowest bidder.  I have used them in the desert for breaching, CQB (that means neutralizing targets, get the pic) and general crowd control.   They are sturdy, simple and robust.  Have never had one fail.  Since you are the anti-corporate type maybe you shouldn’t believe all the hype from Remington corp. group.  Just said that for the critical thinking skills, as I think Remington is a fine product, but it costs more than Mossberg and all other things being equal you go with the best price.  Now, if you said that  25 years ago, you would be right but that is not so today.  Don’t talk about things with such strong opinions when you don’t have a real world clue.  OBTW, what unit did you serve in??  11 years AD special electronics SEA, 21 good years as a combat engineer 2x SWA Panama Just Cause 1990 Serbia etc., 34 for pay, son USA Ranger, 2nd Rgr Btn, son USAF B2 technician, wife USAR officer.  I have the cred!

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    61. Jonny V says:

      You’re one of those “new” Marines  :)  I was just a regular old grunt with 1st and 3rd MarDiv (s).  And for your info, 25 years ago, I was handed a Remington by my armorer and I LOVED IT.  I have seen the Mossberg, and it looks cheap and flimsy plastic (to me).  There are others who have served and don’t like the Mossberg.  Further, I have never heard an account of a Remington 870 ever jamming or failing it’s user in any way at all.  It came with a double rail and a robust ejection system from day one.  That’s a 100% track record for over 50 years.  The Mossberg does not have this sterling reputation.  I base this opinion on not just the one I used in the Corps, but the three I’ve owned, the ones that my dad and grand dad had, and the ones owned my guys I know.  Altogether, around a dozed different ones over a time period of 30 plus years.

      I was one of these nuts in the unit who loved to shoot.  I volunteered for every shooting and blowing up stuff detail that came down the pike.  I should have been an armorer.  I love to clean and work on weapons.  I used to spend my saturdays in there loving on my girl (the black chick with the bayonet lug).  When I left the Corps, I had five rifle expert badges (highest score 242/250 Camp Pendleton, 1986, on the KD course), and the weapons qual page in my SRB used two pages.

      That’s the other thing too.  You kids don’t have to shoot on the KD course anymore do you?  You shoot in some sort of video game thingy.  Carlos Hathcock is rolling in his grave and vomiting right now, probably shitting himself too.

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    62. Jeanne B. says:

      Comments…..I do want to address the man who wrote the comments about Christians turning against non-Christians in hard economic times.   I have been a Christian for over 40 years and will admit that I’ve met a few who call themselves Christian but don’t hold themselves to Godly standards.  I do, however, know many more who would share with you and your family, pray for you and encourage you.  Jesus never taught his people to kill or steal anything  but rather He taught them to give to those who can’t repay and to have compassion on people who are hurting or injured, even if it cost them time and money. 
      I do hope and pray you will have the opportunity to meet some real Christians who sincerely follow the principles of Jesus Christ.  God will surely provide for His people in hard times but not by violence against anyone else.  I will pray for you, buddy.
      by the way Schaef, – a great report.  I’m sure you make your mama proud.

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