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Understanding The Stress Response: It Can Buy You Valuable Seconds

Lizzie Bennet
March 4th, 2014
Underground Medic
Comments (231)

This article has been contributed by Lizzie Bennet of Underground Medic. Lizzie is a catastrophic emergency medical practitioner, as well as an analyst and lecturer in fields that include anaesthetic pharmacology, operating department practice, anaesthetics, and human anatomy. 

xray-closeupSurvival in extreme situations often depends on an individuals ability to respond to the threat they are faced with. The stress response in humans has for decades been referred to as the ‘fight or flight’ response.

Now if you have a couple of Uzi’s and enough ammunition none of this applies to you because you could probably wipe out any number of malcontents advancing towards your property. For the rest of you, well, I hope you find some use in what I have to say.

The Physiological Basics

When faced with a sudden or extreme threat, two body systems act together to give you the best possible chance of survival. The reaction is for the most part not under your control. Your brain and your body decide what happens, the biggest toughest guy in the bar may turn and run, the tiny young bar tender may not, 90% of what happens is decided by chemistry.

The sympathetic nervous system and the adrenal-cortical system get together at the first sign of a serious threat and if the threat persists for longer than a few more seconds both systems kick into high gear and adrenaline (epinepherine), noradrenaline (norepinepherine) and a couple dozen other hormones flood the body and the fight or flight response is triggered.

  • Pupils dilate to take in as much light as possible
  • Blood-glucose levels increase
  • Veins in the skin contract allowing extra blood flow to the muscles
  • Smooth muscle relaxes to allow extra oxygen for the lungs
  • Heart rate increases
  • Blood pressure increases
  • Non-essential systems shut down (digestion for example)
  • The only focus is the task in hand
It is your reaction to this flood of chemicals that decides what happens next. The first, often vital seconds can be wasted whilst your body decides what to do, which option will give you the best chance of survival. Your brain is processing information much faster than usual and increasing or decreasing the levels as the situation dictates. Running for your life or staying to fight is not at this point entirely under your own control, though the 10% of you not being guided by this chemical battle will have a bearing on the final outcome. If you have thought through the likely scenarios, and come to a conclusion, you will not be wasting time working out what to do.

The Psychology Basics

Highly trained individuals are much more able to overcome the flight part of the response and stand their ground and fight. Equally, in a hopeless situation they’re training allows them to make the decision to retreat faster than the average person would. This should never be construed as cowardice, it is simply a tactical withdrawal that leaves them alive to fight another day.

Sadly some of those we may call ‘The Golden Horde’ may also possess the ability to make decisions faster than the average person. Those used to living on their wits will cope better in flight or fight situations than the average man simply because they have been in similar situations more often than Mr Average. Their most common reaction though is to fight, even when if they’d listened to the 10% of their brain not being controlled they would have realized it is unwise to do so.

It’s this that marks the difference between the gangs and highly trained individuals…those who are well trained know when to retreat for tactical reasons, gangs do it out of fear, and it’s this fear that can buy you time and make a hell of a difference to the outcome of a confrontation.

I know the urge to shoot at a roving gang going door to door down your street would be strong, but if you are at home, holed up with the family and you’re drastically outnumbered this may not have the outcome that is best for you or your family.

The urge to shoot first and hope you’re alive to ask questions later is almost overwhelming in such  situation, but sometimes you have to go with the 10% of you that isn’t under the control of biochemicals coursing around your body.

People hunting in gangs have a pack mentality, they are set on a course of action and it often doesn’t enter their head that they will fail, they have not failed before, why should this occasion be any different?

That’s where control and logical thinking comes into it. Announcing to said gang that you are there by spraying the road with bullets is unlikely to deter them…they are armed, and past experience tells them that you are outnumbered. They are not thinking tactics, they are thinking of nothing but what they can steal from your home.

This makes them dumb, and relatively easy pickings for someone who is thinking tactically.

The Bones Of It

Now here I have to be careful. I have been advised by a Lizzie loyal police officer that spelling out some of the methods that can be used to stop these roving gangs could get me arrested. It’s a British thing, the government decided a while back we were not allowed to defend ourselves. It’s best just to give you some examples of how dangerous ‘kitchen chemistry’ can be, and why therefore you should NEVER resort to using such methods…

We are told never to mix chemical cleaners as dangerous gases can be formed as a result. The son of a friend of mine didn’t believe this so he tried it, and produced a nice cloud of a chlorine gas.

The stupid boy had duct taped two jam jars together and put one solution in each jar, the idea being to drip one drop at a time from one jar into the other. Of course when he knocked it over the fluids mixed, and he spent several hours in the emergency department with streaming eyes, gasping for breath, and some nice burns from splashes that had landed on his legs to boot. Here is a fact sheet telling you what you must not mix together and why.

Teenagers are indeed foolish. There are reports from police in the US that kids are making items  based on an episode of MacGuyver. There have been some nasty injuries, and it’s a good job they used plastic bottles not glass or things would have been a good deal worse. Glass shards can travel a hell of a long way from their original breakage point.

There is even a case of a church receptionist using wasp nest killer instead of pepper spray on police advice as it shoots way further than mace. Remeber not to get a flame near it as it is highly flammable and becomes something of a flame thrower!

I digress, sorry, back to tactics. Anything you can do to put these people on the back foot is to your advantage. Hidden tanglefoot, or even a board with nails whacked through becomes invisible at night, the prime time for attacks.

Unusual and unpleasant chemical smells, loud noises, anything that isn’t expected immediately increases the stress levels of those that seek to do you harm. If these items can be placed a little way off your property all the better, it allows you to leave a few more surprises on your drive or garden should they decide to continue their approach.

Now, if nothing else has deterred them and they are getting a little too close to the door then the time has come to show your hand and if you are not lead deprived as we are here in the UK…shoot.

The delay, the putting off of firing for a minute or two has given you a couple of distinct advantages:

  • You will be mentally calmer and therefore thinking more clearly. You know something they don’t, the basis of tactical warfare for centuries.
  • You will be more in control if the situation deteriorates into one that requires direct confrontation.
  • Some of the group are most likely injured and will therefore hold back. leaving less people for you to deal with.
  • They will be confused at coming across unanticipated obstacles. This can cause loss of concentration and hesitation.

Giving yourself time to listen to the 10% of your brain under your control can, in many circumstances pay dividends that brass and lead alone cannot deliver.

Lizzie Bennett has extensive medical and trauma training and is the author of Underground Medic. In addition to her experience as a catastrophic emergency medical practitioner, Lizzie is a researcher, analyst and lecturer in fields that include anaesthetic pharmacology, operating department practice, anaesthetics, and human anatomy. She is the author of the Armageddon Files, a series on emergency medicine in off-grid scenarios.

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Author: Lizzie Bennet
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Date: March 4th, 2014
Website: http://undergroundmedic.com/

Copyright Information: This content has been contributed to SHTFplan by a third-party or has been republished with permission from the author. Please contact the author directly for republishing information.

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231 Comments...

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  1. Heifer says:

    Is it just me or is there tension in the air everywhere we go? Like everything is building up and most folks are just a pill away from snapping?

    • Well, brace yourself. Everything is proceeding right on schedule from what I’ve guessed at…

    • CWinOR says:

      HEADS UP!!!!

      OFF TOPIC BUT IMPORTANT!
      Anyone living in the PDX area (ahem…JustMe) keep a VERY close eye on Wanapum Damn! There’s currently AT LEAST a 65ft crack 75ft. below the waterline going all the way through the damn. About ten miles downriver lies Priest River Damn. Both damns were built in the same period, for the same reason: the “Vanport Disaster”. In 1949, Vanport (then the 2nd largest city in Oregon)- was WIPED OFF THE MAP. About ten miles downriver from the Priest River Damn lies one of the largest nuke cleanup sites on earth- Hanford. Add the radiation to the Vanport Disaster…and I’ll let you come up with your own sum. (and the fact that the population downriver is more than 10x what it was in 1949).

      [email protected]

    • Vicky says:

      It’s not just you. Tension is really thick and the police notes are more extensive than usual, as are domestic violence calls. Every day adds to the build up and this was a really good article. I loved the bleach and ammonia idea as well as the nails through boards. We have huge rose bushes and blackberry bushes to our east and south which may come in handy for more than food. I’m just hoping I can keep it together. I’m basically a caregiver, not a fighter, but am trying to learn how to be both.

  2. Unreconstructed Southron says:

    Calm, cool, and collected.

    Like T. J. “Stonewall” Jackson.

    • Be informed says:

      Being ready to act quickly is one aspect of just how essential it is for any prepper/survivalist. Just look at how quickly a war could break out in the Middle East or somewhere else like in Russia or the China area. Seconds count. Being aware of just how critical a situation is also and act BEFORE it hits.

      I have been harping the past few days on the fact that Russia WILL NOT allow the ukraine to go NATO, niether Georgia. Look at this comparison to a not so fictional Russia and China type NATO and how the U.S. the grandest of all hypocrites would react if the shoe was on the other foot.

      ANYONE out there that doubts just how the U.S. government and their western stooges will act upon YOUR rights, your freedoms, and how promises will be broken just ask Russia.

      Back in the 1990’s Russia was given a promise that there would not be ANY eastward expansion of NATO towards Russia. This was to guarantee that nuclear weapons would be curbed and Russia and the west would remain calm and at peach without a third world war starting in Europe AGAIN. This promise was broken completely. Now Russia is faced with yet another expansion of NATO with Ukraine and Georgia on their most vulnerable borders. The borders of Ukraine were used by Hitler and Napoleon to invade Russia’s soft underbelly.

      The west uses the false pretext that any sovereign country has the right to choose their own destiny and had the right to join NATO. Like the poison of a hypocrite and the old adage of don’t condemn another man until you have walked in his shoes, let’s put the shoe on the other foot and see how it fits. How about this one for a very possible hypothetical scenario.

      A new organization is formed called the Eastern Coalition, or ECON. The newly formed alliance is consistant of the following charter members:

      Russia
      China
      North Korea
      Iran
      Pakistan
      Syria
      Kazakhstan
      Tajikistan
      Uzbekistan
      Belarus
      Iraq
      Lebanon
      Egypt
      Nigeria
      Algeria
      Serbia

      Now look at the new members wanting into and soon to be admitted into the ECON:
      Venezuela
      Ecuador
      Bolivia
      Cuba
      Haiti
      Panama
      Nicaragua
      Mexico

      ALL ECON members will get full military hardware from the founding members. All countries are sworn to defend each other if any one of them is attacked. Membership in ECON is totally volunteer and their choice as a sovereign country.

      Now if the U.S. could live with a massive military presence on its California, Arizona, New Mexico, and Texas borders from ECON forces. AND have the same military hardware 100 miles off of Florida, and a whole slew of countries to the south of the Gulf States surrounding them and that are the enemy of the U.S. and still say this is their choice and their freedom to join the ECON. Well then the U.S. was country living by its words when it has condemned Russia for trying to stop the Ukraine or Georgia from joining NATO. The chance of this happening are the same as a snow storm in hell. The U.S. and western pawns are the biggest pharisees there is when they condemn Russia for wanting to protect their borders the same as the U.S. would protect themselves against the same situation from an ECON alliance of countries hostile towards them.

      This is why the U.S. is so deeply hated in the world. Why innocent Americans risk their lives going to other countries solely because they are Americans. Why Americans cannot ever trust the U.S. government when it comes to their own rights and freedoms. Americans are generally good people, the government is what is rotten by choice and needs to start to practice what they preach and learn one word that has escaped practically all U.S. politicians, FAIRNESS.

      • Here is why ECON exists. They are trying to protect themselves against US. Sad isn’t it? We used to be the good guys until the enemy got inside the gate.

        AIPAC Policy Conference 2014

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u0mf60wqM0I

      • Thinker says:

        Good Comment BI; Did you see where the msm is reporting a test firing of a icbm missile from Russia ! And are commenting that it has nothing to do with whats currently going on in the Ukraine they had asked permission months ago to test fire!!
        I still think this all theater for the sheep.But Putin is not amused!

        • durango kidd says:

          An empire that is not advancing is in decline. Ukraine will likely be divided. There will be a military counter coup launched by the dethroned dictator and civil war will restart BEFORE the new elections that are scheduled to be held.

          In the end, Western Ukraine will militarily defeat the bid by the legally elected Dictator and install a puppet government supported by the EU in the western half of the country …. minus Crimea, the South, and the East.

          If you don’t hold it … you don’t own it. Possession is nine tenths of the law. 🙂

          • Paranoid says:

            Not that anyone should ever consider doing it; but I have wondered what the effect of one of those slug and flame throwing 12 Gauge Dragon loads would be on a 5 gallon glass water jug filled with gasoline. at about 10 yards.

            • Paranoid says:

              Or an old 20lb propane cylinder

            • Hillbilly says:

              Hey Paranoid, “Dragons Breath” as I think that you’re referring to, @ 10 yards, 5 gallons of gas? Why don’t you give yourself a little distance my friend…Try about 60 yards and a tracer. I look forward to your report.

              • Smokey says:

                No kidding. And be sure to do that in your own yard, so you don’t burn down an entire National Forest or something.

              • Night Breaker says:

                BJ ,
                That Poll is a crock of donkey dung! There are a hell of a lot of gun owners and second admendment activists in the NE , problem is the free shit army Givemedats keeps getting the same collectivist pols re-elected.and they dont listen to us. In NJ right now we are in for the fight of our lives on this issue ,
                Things are starting to turn I fell what’s happening in Conn. will be the Lexington and Concord moment, government serves at the consent of the governed and they are withdrawing their consent. There is panic in TPTB program the acceleration of the anti’s actions proves this now is the time to keep the pressure on and not let up till they piss there pants. not all of us are ball less.
                Sorry about the frank content of this rant it gets my old gunny sense up.

                liberty only exists for those will to defend it .

                Observe Orient Decide Act

                Speak up, demand action, resist no matter what what do you want to do live forever?

                Live free die hard

                III%

                Semper Fi 8541

              • @ Night Breaker,
                Thanks I hope you are right. When I read that last night, it really ticked me off.

            • Why not a pop up sprinkler system hooked to gasoline/diesel mix and a Dragons Breath?

          • JustMe says:

            Given that Russia will dump US Bonds, probably eagerly followed by China, should the US, and or EU do anything about Russia in Crimea, not much is likely to happen beyond what has happened. Unless, the parasites decide to use this as an excuse to crash the USD…

            As for “fight or flight response”, one phenomenon not mentioned, is the occasionally mentioned “time distortion”. As the body “chems up” for the next response, the brain can breifly go into a sort of “hyper-activity” mode, giving what appears to be “slow motion” to external events.

            This is often noted in vehicle accidents, when the participant appears to see events in slow motion. The brain is operating at an increased rate. The brain is capable of operating at this rate for extended periods, and very capable of taking in more data, and or stimuli, than what is considered possible…

            • sixpack says:

              I’ve personally experienced “slo-mo” mode and that is exactly what it is—like watching a video clip in slow motion. There is so much clarity it seems overwhelming. The trick is to be able to REACT.

              If you are able to jump out of the way, or throw your arms up to protect your face in time, you’ve just made the best of a bad situation.

              To me, THAT is part of survival instincts.

      • Mountain Trekker says:

        I’ve never heard so many people, Bad Mouth the U.S. and come to the defense of Russia and that Communist Thug Putin. Yeah I still have my guns! How many Russians or people that live in Countries that walk on egg shells daily because at anytime the USSR will come back into existance have a means to defend themselves. Communism is Communism where ever it’s found. And there are a heck of alot of Communist in Russia, but it’s starting to sound like there are to many here. And they ain’t jews! Trekker Out.

        • Trekker I totally agree with you. Russia especially Pukin are commies which means no freedom.
          While I don’t agree with much of what our government does or even says. If something breaks out between us and them, I will definitely will be pulling for my home team.
          SCREW COMMUNISM. No matter which country they live in.

          • Be informed says:

            @ ed. I think it goes a lot deeper than people supporting Putin. It has to do with someone willing and has the capability to stand up to the U.S. government tyranny. People are constantly talking about what the U.S. government will do to our rights. Here is some country that has been backed into a corner by imperialistic actions ALL BECAUSE THE EMPIRE USA IS IN BIG TIME DEBT. Debt that the U.S. government brough on all by themselves. Now because the U.S. is in such deep sh$% financially they are looking for other countries to bail them out. They are using their influence and the military evenutally to solve this problem. BAD MOVE. Empires never learn this does not work.

            Ukraine IF left alone without the west trying ti instigate all of this uprising would have gone on had elections and then who knows. Ukraine has no right to be admitted to NATO the same as Mexico or Canada has no right to join an enemy alliance and put hundreds of cruise missiles right on the border of the U.S. This is really what this is all about NATO and Russia.

            The U.S. is a hyprocrite that TALKS about democratically elected governments. Then when there is a coup that favors the U.S. everything is wonderful. A coup that takes over a U.S. friendly ally and they are quick to send in the military to “restore” the government. This is manure and why the U.S. is now the most hated country in the world, even more so than Israel, because they are hypocrites. They can’t even shallow their own words.

            This is the danger of a really bad government. They will turn on their own people. I agree with you screw communism. I also say screw imperialism that the U.S. is so much about. The common other names for imperialism are feudalism, slavery, serfdom, peonage, villenage, also exactly what communism is EXPANSIONISM. The U.S. with imperialism is the same head of the same beast that is communism. Communism and imperialism are the same word with the same results, the people are F’ed.

            • sixpack says:

              People don’t want to hear the truth BI, it makes them crazy. The truth is, from a neutral point of view, that the U.S. is much more of an imperial threat than Russia, but old propaganda dies hard, doesn’t it?

              • EXACTLY!!!! SIXPACK

              • Tor Minotaur says:

                Who has the means and will to stall or stop this relentless push towards universal individual poverty and powerlessness?

                Military and police account for 26% of the world’s 875 million small arms.

                Nations with highest percentage of 650 million privately held small arms.
                US 42%. India 7%. China 6%. Germany 4%. France 3%. Pakistan 3%. Mexico 2%. Brazil 2%. Russia 2%. Yemen 2%.

                Nations with the most private guns per person
                US 0.9 Yemen 0.5 Switzerland 0.5 Finland 0.5 Serbia 0.4 Cyprus 0.4

                *numbers from 2007 world small arms gun survey

              • The facts are this:

                1. The US Government is a pack of lying, theiving, murdering bastards. They invade countries and then disguise their invasions and manipulations as “spreading democracy” when, in fact, they’re not they’re simply keeping the Gangster Banksters / NWO / Globalists, etc, in power.

                2. The Russians are not working for the Gangster Bangsters or the NWO, I don’t think. It looks like they are opposing them. But, they have their own agenda. That agenda serves neither truth, justice or liberty. It serves Russia.

                While you may hate the operations of the Bastard Theives in DC and thus the efforts of the US Military, it would show ones ignorance to think that Putin and his merry band of Communist Bastard Thieves is any better. No, I would say that the Russians are worse.

                But, as one Mountain Trekker above says, “Communism is Communism where ever it’s found.” and while what we have in DC is, technically “fascism” or its synomic term “corporatism” the simple fact of the matter is its a type of “collectivism” just like “communism”.

                Putin is a different kind of collectivist than Obama. While I’m closer to Obama and the stench is stronger because of the proximity, I think Putin probably has, in reality, a stronger, more overpowering stench. That stench would be less sympathetic to any “rights” that people have.

                They are both statists! They don’t believe in self governance nor freedom of the people. I think one is just as bad as the other. Putin may be just a little less bad because he doesn’t try to hide it and try to make himself look like a Christian family man. He just does what a collectivist Russian does with no appologies. Obama is more dangerous because if he started acting like Putin, he’d get the smackdown in a second by We The People.

                So, in summary, I respect Putin because he’s a man. He just does what he’s gonna do and says, “screw you!” But, Obama is a snake. A chicken and a liar.

                …and I will salute the most powerful, most honorable fighting force in the world, the US Military before I’d pee on a Russian soldier even if he was on fire. The US Military may be given conflicting, dishonorable orders and such to make them look like idiots, but in reality, cans of “WhoopAss” are filled with the sweat wrung from the undershirts of our US Miltary personally.

                The only pleasure I get in seeing the Russians flex their muscle in Crimea/Ukraine is that it cuts on the arrogance of Obama Boy. But, other than that, there is nothing else good about it.

        • laeagle says:

          MT, I am also shocked at how many stalwarts at this site have come out of the closet in support of tyranny, oppression, bullying, communism, fascism, and hate for America. I know there are many solid people here but what is going on with all these apologists for Putin and Russian policy? There is no doubt that that many in our government including the top leaders have been naive and living with blinders on but to trash our system in support of Pukin Putin is in itself naive and shortsighted. Even as I am writing this I am watching Putin being interviewed on ORT (Russian TV). He is articulate and speaks extemporaneously. Compared to BHO he sparkles and shines but he is not a good guy. No one at this site should be deceived. He definitely is not stupid and knows what he is doing, but, like all bullies he will overextend his reach.

          The cold and the rain could not dampen the spirit of Mardi GRAS and the folks of this region are ready to wind down one of the greatest parties on earth at midnight. It has been quite a sight to behold. Y’all, come down and join us next year!

          laeagle

          • Be informed says:

            @ laeagle. Two wrongs don’t make a right. The Russian and U.S. governments stink of rotten swamp water. Almost or all governments are not for the people. This is why the Greeks tried to formulate someway of finding ONLY those leaders that were true representatives of the people and not themselves and special interest groups. Up to this time 2000 years later humankind still cannot find those special leaders that lead for the people and betterment of the society.

            • laeagle says:

              @BI, Thanks for your response. I always appreciate what you have to say, knowing that you have put a lot of careful thought into your comments. I have seen the evil of communism up close and personal and it is very difficult for me to equate them with our constitutionally derived form of democratic government. Sure, mistakes have been made and the U.S. has gotten itself into places they shouldn’t be, and done things that it should not have done. Ultimately, it is all about power and control. Who weilds the bigger stick to protect his/her interests. We would not be holding this debate if Putin was in control. It is a violent world out there and Putin is doing all he can do to expand his reach while our leaders in Washington are doing everything in their power to disarm and ‘de-escalate’. Hopefully folks are waking up to the fact that disarming and turning over your foreign policies to other countries and capitulating to foreign powers does not diminish the likelihood of war and global apocalypse. Bullies look for weak individuals to harass and torment.

              @Sixpack – I am sorry you think that I am an idiot. Perhaps I am. Putin is nothing but a KGB bully who is wanting to recreate the former USSR and thinks that by supporting every tinpot corrupt dictator that he can expand his sphere of influence. He has overextended himself and is not doing anything to improve the welfare of his people, the Russian people.

          • sixpack says:

            laeagle, sorry you feel that way. When I see a black kettle, I call it a black kettle, despite some idiot insisting that it is really blue.

          • laeagle says:

            @NR, you are right on. Putin and his pack of wolves have not changed even if some here have put him in sheep’s clothing. They do not tell the truth. They cannot tell the truth and have their own trolls at this site. Ask the American anchor who resigned from RT yesterday. Some people may say they are calling the kettle black because it is black but like Pukin Putin speak it is all Russian pravda. Take it with a grain of salt but better yet, stay as far away from them as possible. You cannot compare the US with the evil, cruel, twisted wolves, the communists. Solzhenitsyn was right! The Ukrainians should rightfully be afraid! Some are trying to to mitigate and justfy the unacceptable Russian invasion of Crimea and Ukraine comparing it to invading Mexico or annexing the Maritimes. It is not the same. It is like comparing apples with durian. Beware of Putin’s trolls and mouthpices.

        • durango kidd says:

          MT: While the Ukrainian Dictator was a thief of the first magnitude and deserved to be deposed by a coup, the Agreement that was signed by all Parties during the Truce was violated before the ink was dry on the paper.

          Imagine if New York and New England were part of Canada and a French Separatist President was elected in Quebec and IMMEDIATELY declared that French was the National Language and that English speaking Canadians were second class citizens?

          Would New England succeed from Canada? Would the naval commander in Bangor Maine declare his allegiance to New England after it succeeded from Canada? Would the USA publicly admonish the Quebec government and declare its intention to protect American citizens and English speaking people in Canada?

          Everyone needs to put the events in Ukraine in perspective.

          There are right ways to do things and wrong ways to do things and the interim government in Ukraine has exercised more authority than the people of Ukraine has given it. These events have caught the O’bummer administration flat footed generating another diplomatic blunder by the leader of the new World Order, and the LSM is trying to blame Putin for NWO aggression perpetrated by Ukrainian Jews.

          This is essentially what happened in Ukraine. 🙂

          • Canadian Vet says:

            Just FYI, in Quebec, anyone who isn’t a native French speaker, a Franco, is a second-class citizen at best and is effectively shut out of society in general thanks to Quebec’s draconian language laws. Anglos get it the worst and Premier Pauline Marois has made it her life’s mission to eradicate every language but the various subdialects of French spoken within Quebec.

            Also, the effective definition of bilingualism in Quebec isn’t fluency in both official languages, but for the Francos to be served in French everywhere in the country, and for the Anglos to speak French well enough so no French-Canadian, especially Quebeccers, should ever have to speak English within Canada’s borders.

            However, any outcry from the rest of Canada over Quebec’s laws and policies is generally silenced VERY fast. Within Quebec by the non-French-speaking minority, it is with harassment from the Office De La Langue Française or by the courts refusing to accommodate their language requirements. Outside, it is through the Human Rights Tribunals which are exempt from the general concepts of due process and Constitutional guidelines and will ALWAYS side with Quebec as any criticism of their policies is considered racial intolerance.

            Welcome to Canada. You fine American folks aren’t the only ones saddled with this sort of nonsense.

            • hammerhead says:

              CAN VET, I get it , being from Michigan i have done a lot of fishing trips and vacations in Quebec.
              They cant even treat a tourist spending money with respect. I stopped going after some of the regulations regarding non-resident fishing got too silly.
              And getting abused at both sides of the bridge is another good reason for me to stay on my side of the lake.
              BTW , i can speak alittle french ,but what their speaking aint quite the same.
              Quebec seems to have its own unique dialect.

            • hammerhead says:

              CAN VET – Have you seen the small army at the SOO crossing ? WOW , talk about a military zone !

        • Be informed says:

          @ Mountain Trekker. What’s fair is fair. The U.S. would be doing the exact same thing as Russia if their borders were threatened. It goes way beyond this with the U.S. It shows just how much contempt the U.S. has for honor and respect for keeping a word. This becomes real apparent with the attacks on the whole Bill of Rights from the 1st through the 10th and beyond. You can’t trust the U.S. government.

          You live in a totally pro 2nd Amendment state that the government not dare touch. All over the country they have been taking guns away from people from one that has a certain magazine level to just about anything else they can come up with. This is true that this is on a state level, but still it is happening.

          I ask this of anyone. What the hell does the U.S. have a right to be messing around in someone’s backyard? If the tables were turned the U.S. would NEVER allowed to happen what has happened to Russia. They have two countries in NATO right on their borders. A tiny chunk of NATO Norway is also been on their borders for decades. What gives the U.S. the right to go around imposing what they want and can take from other countries? This imperialistic drive has many common names for it: thief, crook, robber, bandit, burgular, country jacker.

          How can I or others support a government that is doing something so wrong? How can I or others support a government that wants to take our freedoms away from us? How can I support a government that has no respect for the people and deems everyone of us as expendable? Wrong is wrong. The U.S. has absolutely no business over there and should be concentrating on the falling apart infrastructure of this country and the people as a whole that pay for the U.S. government to operate.

          • Veni Vedi Vici says:

            I’ve been reading your responses BI and have determined you are 212% correct.

            The US under the auspices of NATO has been in the process of encircling Russia for more than 15 years. We are bringing new countries into the fold and we’d just love an EU-front commercial treaty to smooth into a military alliance with them.

            For those of us old enough to remember, JFK almost took us into a nuclear war with the Soviet Union over missiles in Cuba. We’ve been flanking Russia with one Cuba after another for years…and Russia just drew the line at Ukraine, which given Russian history makes about as much sense as anything else.

            You guys who see “commies” and “Americans” don’t get the level of duplicity and the level of delusion our government leaders labor under. Look at what Paul Craig Roberts, ex Undersecretary of the Treasury for Reagan just said. He called the government of the United States the worst government on earth, the most dangerous.

            He is as correct as BI. This is not about Putin being a nice guy. This is about an America being led by the most criminally afflicted personalities in our entire history. Make no mistake: a few wrong moves when dealing with Russia and we are going to be in a hot war.

            I won’t be cheering for the good ol’ USA on that one. We need to burn down the house, chase out the rats and start over before we all die at their hands.

            Roll the fucking guillotines.

        • sixpack says:

          Somehow, I think the threat of the U.S. is more important to countries like Iraq, Iran, Afghanistan, Lebanon, The Balkans, Cuba, Egypt, Syria, Venezuela…How many countries has Russia invaded in the name of “freedom” lately? —people have plenty of good REASONS to talk bad about the U.S. govt.

          …propaganda or not, the U.S. has consistently been more aggressive than Russia in the last decade or two.

          The truth does hurt, doesn’t it?

      • Bi, if Mexico wants into the ECON, could it be that they blame us for the civil war they have raging? Did Fast and Furious make them just that?

      • braahaahaa says:

        I agree with you, in a way, that people can’t blame Americans for everything their governments. But

        • braahaahaa says:

          I agree with you, in a way, that people can’t blame Americans for everything their government did. But I see Americans, many of them, as hypocrites. The American people who blame and group other people together for the actions of a minority of people. But Americans expect themselves to not be grouped together.

          Some examples are how they group all immigrants and act like they feed off the system. Another is how when an extreme minority of radicals do something, all billions of Muslims are blamed. Another is how Americans blame and call a nation their enemy when it is really the fault of the US for manufacturing that hatred.

          One example are shootings in America. When someone shoots up a school or a mall. Gun owners insist upon blaming the criminals only. But say, when the Kenya mall shooting happened. Americans blamed all Muslims. This is a form of hypocrisy. Blame should only be directed towards people who are responsible.

          If you really meant what you said. Than you should bestow the same treatment to other people and nations and only blame the actual people who commit the crime. Not the whole people or nation.

          Another thing is how many criticize non-preppers as if they were monsters. This is insane. Because not all people can prep. Not all people can afford. Not all people have time to research what’s going on. Some are too busy providing for their families. You must give the benefit of the doubt.

      • Anon says:

        BI,

        Interesting. Do you have any links for more information about ECON? I’m searching and can’t find anything. Do you mean the BRIC (Brazil, Russia, India, China) alliance? Would like to do some research….

        • Be informed says:

          @ Anon. This is a speculation, a fictional name that someday may be real. I got this from Eastern meaning China and Russia and most of the eastern countries. Coalition meaning bloc or alliance. Econ. The countries listed are likely to side with Russia and China in such a pact. ECON sounds threatening. Maybe someone will see this and use this in reality. This was really to show the hypocrisy of the U.S. and the west if such an alliance was real and was admitting new members right on the border and sphere of influence of the U.S. The U.S. would react just like Russia, even more so. They would use the same sneaky tactics under the false flag flying or just go after such a bloc and attack them.

          No one should view Russia any different. Anytime they have had an issue with their borders, war is on. Georgia in 2008, Afghanistan in 1979, Czechoslovakia in 1968, Hungary in 1956 I think. This is no different. The U.S. is over in China trying to support the Japanese over a buch of natural resource rich islands that is none of their business. China can flatten the U.S. economically by demanding payment on all those bonds they hold and send the stock market into an immediate tail spin. The U.S. government has done this to themselves by not saying out of people’s business just like Ron Paul and Rand Paul continue to talk about.

        • If you want to research ECON you’ll have to dive into a few Star Trek books. 🙂

      • 1braveheart says:

        BI, good evening, and once again you’re right on target. The US will pay dearly when the time comes and it is coming.

      • Mcdave says:

        @ BI,
        Got anything on Yellowstone and info being suppressed?
        Any real activity there?

        • Be informed says:

          @ McDave. Yellowstone would be so frightening if it was getting ready to blow that the government, media, or anyone else would never be able to hide it. The swelling would be enormous because of the shear size of it. The earthquakes would be in the constant 4 and 5 range or higher. The amount of gases released would make the park closed for miles. Groundwater would be loaded with sulphur for also miles.

          When you think of a supervolcano in comparison to a smaller standard volcano think of a bicycle tire and a monster truck size tire. Filling both up with airwith enough pressure and both with explode. The amount of air pressure necessary to blow up the truck tire is magnitudes higher. Same goes true for any supervolcano. It takes much more energy to blow a supervolcano. This increase of energy will be felt and observed from around the world. Swelling of a few feet would be massive on a smaller volcano, but over a much wider and larger distance of a supervolcano it is not nearly as pronounced. The energy required to get that much volumes of magma to the surface would translate into earthquake activity that would be frightening. Where before you see swarms of 1 and 2’s you would see swarms of 5’s that would be far more than even the aftershocks of a mega earthquake. No one could hide an imminent Yellowstone eruption. Unless a sudden very large earthquake ripped open a large enough fissure to vent the magma to the surface, there will be clear warnings.

      • 😉 I see what you did there.

    • Prepared Pastor says:

      How old is this article? MacGyver went off the air in 1992. Maybe they’re watching it on NetFlix. Anyway, I learned a lot during my years with the fire department. This is one area where training isn’t a close second for experience. Even wandering around the inner city in the middle of the night (which I did in Columbia) helps hone one’s senses and self control.

      BTW, Premeditatively using WASP spray for self-defense can result in sever criminal and civil penalties. A LEO may have told someone that, but they’re not the sharpest tool in the shed. On average it takes twice as much training to be a barber.

    • Iowa says:

      WW3 will be here before the chat forum comes out.

      Friendly reminder.

    • OutWest says:

      Teenagers may indeed be foolish, but being one
      in the multi-sports arenas is where they learn
      to be fast on their feet and quick witted in the
      face of competition.

      These skills carried over into adulthood gives
      them a decided edge over an untrained person(s)
      with a crude sense of retreat being a vacation
      spot in the Bahamas.

    • Headlines today:

      Stock Rally Stalls As Russia Test-Fires Inter-Continental Ballistic Missile

      65′ Crack In Columbia River Dam Threatens Hanford

      Molon Labe: Connecticut Gun Group Issues Ultimatum to Government Either enforce gun ban or repeal law

      Ukraine Falls Under Fascist Bankster Thumb

      Fukushima – Surge In Airline Pilot/Passenger Heart Attacks, Cancers

      Gas and oil prices soar and petrol could be next: Ukraine crisis shocks world markets amid fears Russia’s energy resources will be hit by trade sanctions

      Navy Cmdr Who Interrogated 9/11 KSM Murdered

      Worst Drought – CA Farmers Demand Fracking Halt

      Monsanto Causing Extinction Of The Monarch Butterfly

      Plastic Waste Threatens Ocean Food Chains

      Facebook Gets Into The Drone Business

      Another Bitcoin Bank “Loses” Its Deposits

      AIPAC Presses Obama To Harsher Iran Policies

      Western media hyping Russain moves to protect Black Sea Fleet

      ANNND FINALLY!! Celente – Ukraine May Ignite World War & The End Of All Life

      Genius.

      • OutWest says:

        Now That’s a real newscast!!
        Straight from the .02 Gazette.
        Screw the main stream media.

        • wrong says:

          You missed the funny pages. What’s going on at the white house?

          • First lady Michelle Obama is bringing together an impressive group of female artists for a White House concert celebrating women of soul.

            President Obama is committed to making this the most open and participatory administration in history.

            President Obama is taking action to help ensure opportunity for all Americans.

            John Kerry To Explain How Ukraine Is Fixed

            • Sgt. Dale says:

              .02
              What a frigging waist of Tax payers money.
              Most open (HA)
              Opportunity-To go to a FEMA CAMP
              Kerry to Ukraine-WHITE flag of surrender.
              A.S.M.S.
              Sgt.

            • Hunter says:

              .02-

              Sir, if I may..allow me to extrapolate a bit, per your above post:

              ..First lady Michelle Obama is bringing together an unruly horde of ghetto-wench artistic howlers for a White House shindig, celebrating all de hoes in da hood.

              ..President Obama is committed to making this the most open and depraved homosexual regime on the planet. He leads by example, of course!

              ..President Obama is taking executive action to help ensure govt sanctioned depravity, for all queer-Americans..and the straight ones better get over it!

              ..John “LURCH” Kerry To Explain How Ukraine was neutered and financially sodomized, for the benefit of the money masters(bankers).

              Film at 11.

              Thanks much .02…thumbs up to ya!

      • hammerhead says:

        AND…….
        mr.Obama says refering to the Ukraine:

        “So we stand on the side of history that I think more and more people around the world deeply believe in — the principle that a sovereign people, an independent people are able to make their own decisions about their own lives. ”

        HUH? He better check to see whats going on in his own country , cuz , he obviously has no idea !
        I decided that i liked my major med plan and its a decision i made as a soveriegn , independant person.
        WTF?????

      • jerrytbg says:

        .02

        What… you couldn’t mention the rock that’s gonna pass between the Earth and Moon tomorrow…geez… 🙂

    • Boss Hog says:

      It’s the beginning of the end. Hog prices are skyrocketing, tripling in price in one month! MSM AND Nobody is reporting the news.

      ALL BACON IS INFECTED WITH PIG VIRUS!!!!! DON’T EAT IT!!!!!

    • 1braveheart says:

      Lizzie Bennett, thank you for an excellent article. There is nothing in it I can dispute.

    • Hey Boss Hog,

      In some places around the country, bacon prices have TRIPLED in a matter of weeks.

      It is quite obvious that pigs are infected, and the pork industry is keeping it secret.

      They are inflating prices at the supermarket, serving the public with infected meat, while making a profit.

      The failure of MSM to report the news is the reason people use alternative media.

      PCH

      • Mcdave says:

        Let’s see.. who would be affected by high hog prices and possibly infected meat?
        Now, who would not be affected? Seems that there are certain ethnic/ religious groups that would NOT be affected. Hmmmm… Who would that be?
        Interesting..

    • Red Leader says:

      The author is on the road to rediscover the “OODA Loop” that Col. John Boyd developed in the 1950’s after observing the high kill ratio that US Pilots had in the Korean War. The OODA Loop applies to personal combat as well. The object is to process what is happening quicker and get inside your opponent’s OODA Loop.

      Observe
      Orient
      Decide
      Act

      This is the decision loop that your brain goes through in an emergency. If you train or game possible situations in your mind before they happen and you will know what you need to do and you will react quicker.

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OODA_loop

      Mixing bleach and ammonia makes Chloramine gas which can be deadly. I heard it works great on gophers and moles!

  3. I have had many close calls and one thing I found weird is things tend to slow down for a couple seconds or so. I’ve rolled a lot of heavy equipment over embankments, flipped end to end, etc and right before it all goes to hell, things slow for just a moment, then it seems to go into hyper drive.

    • slingshot says:

      .02

      Car accidents have that slow, Oh Shit, moment.
      Another impact is being stunned. Hit in head, punch in the nose and knocked off your feet are a few. Once I was so scared I could not for a few seconds get up and run. No muscle coordination. Then I slipped into gear and was gone.

    • JustMe says:

      The brain goes into hyper-activity in such moments. We are capable of sustaining that rate for extended periods, without stressors. Not easily, but it is possible.

    • Eagle Eye says:

      And you are making a virtue of your “experience”?

      Thank god you are nowhere near me or any machines I own!

  4. Jim in Va. says:

    I usually bite my nails…..up to my elbows!

  5. Sgt. Dale says:

    .02
    You have felt the same thing I have felt when things go to S$%T. Had a time were a guy came to the door after beating the crap out of his wife and she was outside with me and another Officer caring a 9mm. I had to point my 45 at him and try to talk him down. It felt like an hour but it was only about 2 minutes and he dropped the 9mm. After he dropped it seemed like everything was in HYPER DRIVE. We cuffed him without a fight. Thank God.

    One nice thing I learned from the FBI was how to stay cool and calm. How control my breathing and adrenalin.
    One nice thing about what happened was the Compliment that the Chief gave me. He told me “I’m happy it was you at that scene with your experience, because one of our younger guy would have shot him.”

    You need to remember to breath, not get tunnel vision, control your voice, and put your faith in the Good Lord!

    A.S.M.S.
    Sgt.

    • Domestic squabbles = number one killer of police.

    • para bellum says:

      Lieutenant Colonel David Grossman has some great advice that pertains to all individuals. He primarily targets law enforcement and military, but I think it is great advice for all the good guys as anyone could face a deadly situation at all times.

      He teaches a tactical breathing method that could save your life. When faced with a life or death situation, your pulse rate and breathing increases dramatically. This causes tunnel vision, and loss of fine motor skills (like ejecting and replacing a magazine).

      Tactical breathing along with proper mental preparedness helps lessen these, and avoid panic. Panic kills.

      Also, remember to train, train, train. You will rely on muscle memory in such situations.

      Good article. I don’t think many people place enough priority on mental training.

    • 1braveheart says:

      Good evening, Sarge. sounds like you handled that situation perfectly. I just hope the perp got some payback for whatever he did to the girl. I am against any SOB who uses a woman for a punching bag, regardless of what the dispute is about. A lot of couples just don’t know how to settle their disputes in a peaceful, sensible manner and too often someone will go off the deep end and someone loses their life. My only complaint about the domestic violence laws are how men are treated by the judicial system. they are totally denied due process because of gender. Women in those cases get attorneys free of charge and the men can’t even come up with a retainer fee for an attorney. I just believe it’s wrong for women to receive any special treatment in this type of case or any other case for that matter. whatever happened to the concept of equality before the law? What is wrong with treating both men and women the same in any type of court case? It’s also been proven that in more than half of all reported domestic violence cases that the woman was the perpetrator. It would be fantastic to see problems like this go away, but I don’t see it happening. Sarge, ever since feminism came along, problems between men and women have only become worse and more difficult to solve than they used to be. The gap between men and women just gets bigger and there is more animosity and less trust between the 2 genders these days. Feminism is also what keeps me alone. It’s as if I can’t trust women anymore. At least the ones who fall for that feminist crap and it just ruins them.

  6. kfilly says:

    I agree with .02. I had a close call as a firefighter. I fell through a second story floor and almost got crushed by a cast iron bathtub that had also fallen. I made it out ok. Those few seconds when you realize that you are in serious trouble really suck.

  7. Dick says:

    Go to the range with your “Assault Rifle” of choice and practice mag changes. Problem solved.

    On stress though a trait I see happen due to stress overload even more often than fight or flight is freeze or fail. What I mean is when people walk around oblivious and are suddenly in a potentially violent or actual violent situation they do not fight, they do not flee they just freeze up or fail to act. Virginia Tech is a perfect example where college age, intelligent people just rolled up in a ball and let the shooter kill them. My info tells me only two people for sure died trying to fight and one was an elderly professor.

    My point being fight or flight are options for people with some situational awareness or stress training. It is natural to animals because they are aware of what is going on. Keep your head up, eyes off your phone when moving about and what if yourself to give yourself a better chance or better yet avoid the predator because you aren’t an easy target.

    CATI

    • Go hunting with rookies and witness buck fever. Now, take that lesson and times by 150,000 and you will have the city guy that has never fired his weapon at anything other than paper from indoor shooting ranges trying to take a big game animal or worse yet, trying to defend his life. All I can say in that situation is try to be a far away from it as possible. IF/WHEN it all goes to hell, there are going to be a lot of maimed,and wounded wandering the landscape for a short period. Would be hilarious if not so sad.

      • slingshot says:

        Buck Fever.

        Your body will ache. Heart and respiration increase.
        Some will shake before and others after the kill. Pure adrenaline rush that can last for hours. I figure if I do not have when I see a deer. it’s time to give up hunting.

        Was guiding others in the smoke house using Navy OBA’s and one student got scared and latched on to me like a vise and would not let go till we got out.

        • slingshot, I took a little 2 point this year easy 60 yard broadside picture perfect bangflop not ruined meat and only had a twinge of fever. BUT, if that would have been a huge 4 point, or worse yet ANY elk, it would definitely take a couple jiggers of Yukon Jack and half an hour to stop shaking.

        • @Slingshot,

          pardon my ignorance, but I don’t understand your 2nd paragraph?

          • slingshot says:

            Sailors have to go for fire fighting training before going to sea. OBA is an oxygen breathing apparatus. It has a canister that chemically produces O2 in a closed masked system. You can fight fire without having to deal with smoke inhalation. The smoke house is used for training in the use of this equipment as you move down and about stairwells and compartments that have fires within creating shipboard “fire” conditions.

            Anyone been to the Silver Dome 32nd street out in San Diego. Fog on Deck!

    • Hunter says:

      Good points Dick. Ditto, always remember that nearly everything close at hand..can be used as a weapon or a brief distraction.

      ..I once witnessed a small stature (maybe 5’6″/150lbs) Irish guy, totally fvkk up a 6’2″/220lbs) US-Airforce negro in a pub.

      The black guy walked up & started talking sweet to his girl..RED(Irish guy) simply spun the top off a salt shaker & emptied the contents into his left hand..black dude never saw him do it..he then told the negro to “piss-off”..black guy turns and leans forward –(big mistake!!!)– and starts to say something and…flash goes the left hand, tossing salt into the black guys eyes..then RED kicks him in the nuts & grabs his heavy glass pint mug..and proceeded to wail the living shit outta his cranium. Yep, there was a buncha blood too!

      Analysis:

      The little guy wasn’t intimidated..in seconds, he devised a plan & executed it to perfection!

      Post-mortum:(sp?)

      He also grabbed his girl and hauled ass when finished..he didn’t wait around for the bobbies(police)!

      Lesson:

      Always use your brain..that’s why GOD gave us one!

  8. frank bank says:

    The trendy Zero Hedge website had a guest editorial the other day about the Banksters pushing us towards a Racial Civil War to provide themselves cover when the dollar collapses. The author cited a 2009 Pentagon War Games scenario in which the American dollar dies. Those of us who understand money have been saying since 1913 that the Federal Reserve is there to steal our money. Charles Lindbergh Sr said that the Federal Reserve will create a series of inflations and Depressions. We are now headed to the worst financial crisis in history. Hundreds of millions worldwide will die from starvation if we do not reform the banking and monetary systems.

    More: http://vidrebel.wordpress.com/2013/11/11/the-uber-rich-want-us-to-have-a-racial-civil-war/

  9. Just got this email this morning and thought some of you might want to take a listen to the show on the “on demand.”

    My attorney, John Clark, (www.privacylawoffice.com) will be a guest on the National Internet Radio Show- “The Mark Kohler Show”. Mark is a CPA, attorney, best-selling author, and has been hosting his national show for the past 5 years on Blog Talk Radio. Mark will be discussing the principals in my book HOW TO BE INVISIBLE and methods for implementing your own privacy strategy.

    It starts at 11 a.m. this morning, Pacific time/ 2:00 p.m. Eastern time. Here’s the link to listen from your computer LIVE, OR you can call in to 646-200-4285 to listen in if you are on the road: http://markjkohler.com/the-mark-kohler-show/

    IF you miss the show, you can still catch the recording “on demand” at http://www.blogtalkradio.com/markjkohler

    Jack Luna

  10. Shtfanner says:

    Not gonna lie, im worried about this Russia thing. im at ground zero.
    can you say “Macdill AFB”>?

  11. Kulafarmer says:

    Ya just never know how you will react,
    Easy to say what you think you will do,
    Whole other thing usually what you will do, lots of factors,,,
    Me personally, chicken with the head cut off! (snicker snicker)

    • Ghost Rider says:

      Kula; I like the chicken reference, good visual 🙂

      IMO the most important part is to react. Don’t freeze. Make a decision fight/flight whatever. Indecision could be very costly.

      GR

      • Canadian Vet says:

        I would actually say that what is important is to make a decision, any decision. Even if it is the wrong one, make a call and stand by it and adjust in the fly if you have to. And don’t fall in love with your Plan A. Or B, or C, or D.

        You MUST be ready to go off-script at a moment’s notice and keep your mind wide open. Otherwise you’ll be blind to everything that falls outside the scope of your carefully-laid plans. Including the one thing you thought would be too damned stupid to even attempt.

        Remember, the best laid plan won’t even survive as long enough to first-contact with the enemy; it doesn’t even survive the start line.

        • Ghost Rider says:

          CV; completely agree. I think you made the point better than me.

          Off topic but that’s par for the course:

          I have been saving for a large purchase for the past year or so. I didn’t have anything in particular I was thinking about just that I wanted to save up. Anyway, I’m thinking I want to expand my rifle capabilities and step up to a .308.

          I’m at the point where I can afford either an entry level 308AR with a minimal amount of ammo or a decent bolt action with a equally decent amount of quality ammo.

          So my question to the site is: What are your opinions? Any and all are welcome.

          GR

          • Sgt. Dale says:

            Ghost Rider:
            I put the DPMS, Armalite, FN, Rock River (LAR8) up in trials. I went with the Rock River.
            Mags are the same as the FN LAR. Very cheap. It just out preformed the rest.
            After saying this. My favorite is the M1A, They make three kinds now Reg. M1A, SOCOM, and Shout. I have the Regular, and I’m looking to add the Scout or the SOCOM to the collection.
            AIM SMALL MISS SMALL
            Sgt.

            • Sgt. Dale says:

              G.R.
              As far as a bolt action I’m a Remington 700 man.
              I have also built 2 K98 Mauser action bull barrel bolt action rifles. I gave one to my wife and I kept the other one. We have taken everything from Yotes to Elk with them. We have also shot 100 yards, and where able to put a quarter over all 5 holes. What the other guys are tell you is very good advice.
              See what you like when you go to a gun shop hold them, and ask if you can dry fire it. They may have snap cap for the rifle. Good luck in your quest. This is part of the fun of finding a new rifle. Then shooting it.
              again Good Luck.
              AIM SMALL MISS SMALL
              Sgt.

            • Hunter says:

              Sarge-

              Per the M1A, I agree! However that said, a good friend possesses a National Match(& damn him, he won’t sell it to me!!!)
              He recently purchased a ‘tanker model(shorter barrel)’ as he called it & I wasn’t overly impressed, as it wasn’t much better than a Bulgarian(milled receiver) AK-47 fitted w/ a Weaver (rear) ghost-ring sight..as far as accuracy @ 200!!!

              Granted we were shooting old surplus Lake City 147gr ball…and using Wolf mfg 124gr. mil-spec FMJ in the AK

              Yes, I reload too..so I understand the concept of loading for the “sweet-spot”.

              ..just endeavoring to give you a heads-up per a shorter barrel, in an M1A.

              ..and yes, a milled receiver AK w/ a rear ghost-ring sight is light years more accurate than the norm.
              Rear sight is available from midwayusa.com

            • Red Leader says:

              I love my M1A Squad Scout with the Aimpoint.

              As far as the AR-15 platform goes, I found the LWRC piston upper on my pre-ban lower to be the most reliable. You can rip off 30 rounds, take out the bolt carrier group and hold it in your hand and it is cool and clean. You can’t do that with a DI gun.

          • Depends on what you are going to do THE MOST with the rifle. If you think you will be using it for mostly self defense or shtf run and gun, then you will want an AR-10. BUT if you want to punch holes in paper @ 1000 yards you will want a bolt action with a heavy barrel, and a high powered scope. If you want to hunt big game, you will want a lighter bolt or even a lever action with a lower powered scope.

            • maudy frickett says:

              Look at the Savage bolt action Hog Hunter with threaded barrel, in .308.

              • Those are cool Maudy, and having iron sights is a must for a true survival rifle imo. You can mount see through rings if you have to have a scope but over the years of hunting even with expensive glass, I have been in rain storms where you cant see but blurry images and shapes through the scope making them useless. The 308 I hunt with is a Remington model 788 Carbine with the 18.5 inch barrel and a salt and pepper thumbhole stock sporting the Leopold VXIII 2.5-8x36mm on see through rings. The diameter of the scope is crucial to still have enough field of view to use the irons in case of glass failure.

              • BB Stacker says:

                Absolutely great rifles, picked up one a couple months ago. Superbly accurate, shooting less than 3/4 inch groups with handloads. Heavy sporter barrel, accutrigger, over size bolt knob, threaded barrel; good stuff for a $400 gun.

                It comes with a flimsy stock though, be prepared to replace it. Still shot great, just has alot of flex and is very tupperware feeling to me. Like the Remington 700’s, you can also add detachable box magazine bottom metal to these rifles if you wanted to.

                Great rifle in my opinion.

            • Ghost Rider says:

              02; honestly for right now I’m just looking to have some fun with it and extend my range. But self defense etc is a big part of it. Shit hitting the fan is always a part of most of my decisions so that plays into it as well.

              I was leaning to the AR but was just looking for some differing opinions and recommendations.

              GR

              • BB Stacker says:

                As Sgt. Dale suggests above, I also like the Rock River rifles. Great customer service, returned a 20 inch 5.56 barrel to them that was not quite machined correctly. Had a new barrel the next week, no questions asked.

                Good thing about a 308 based AR platform is the availability of additional uppers chambered in different calibers that will fit on it. Unlike the 5.56 lower receiver, the 308’s can be slightly different and vary from manufacturer. If you ever plan on changing to something like .243 or .260, I would go with the DPMS, due to the most available pre assembled uppers. Unless you plan to change parts yourself; which will involve a few special tools and headspacing the barrel.

                I also agree about the M1A. I have 2, a scoped NM and a open sighted scout. The national match is a tack driving SOB, shoots way better than I do. The scout I have is also an accurate shooter. I use it for open sight practice and can put it on 12 inch plates at 300 (most of the time). Shoots about an average of 1.5 inches at 100 with open sights. Not too bad. Get the best scope mount you can afford, they make a difference. I also like the Check Mate 20 Round magazines. Haven’t had a feed failure yet.

                Concerning the bolt rifle, as Hunter mentions below, I would go with a Savage. Definitely my favorite action. Remington 700 is a close second. Savages are super easy to re-barrel and change calibers. A few tools and you can do it yourself (barrel nut wrench, go/no go gauges and a barrel vise). Never had a inaccurate Savage in my gun safes. Lots of aftermarket support for any extras you may want, especially in the short action models. Howa’s are also another good, inexpensive rifle. Shot a friends 22-250 the other day and put 5 rounds into one ragged hole.

                Good optics are essential for a long range rifle. I own a Nightforce scope that sits on my benchrest rifle, 12-42 power. Great scopes, but can get expensive, that is why I have only one. Check out the Vortex viper PST’s (or HST’s), Nikon Monarch X, Burris XTR’s and Leupold LRT’s. Great scopes that can be had for under/around the $1000 mark. I would stick with a 30mm tube if you plan on going super long range in the future. Mil dot reticles too, and learn how to estimate range and holdover using the reticle. BDC reticles are fine for hunting or quick shots, just be sure to check the point of impact in your particular rifle, as the BDC points are merely suggestions, and may not be dead on with your particular rifle.

                Hunter: funny you mention your tractor mounted lever gun. Have one myself on my New Holland. Marlin 336 SC chambered in 35 Remington. Love that rifle, my first deer rifle handed down from my great grandpa. 1950’s vintage. I load .357 bullets in the cases for plinking around and popping skunks (the actual diameter is .358, but the .357 works fine).

          • Guns are tools and you must use the right tool for the job. You don’t us a sledge to hang a picture.

            • Ghost Rider says:

              That would explain the huge holes in my walls. Thanks.

              • Hunter says:

                Ghost Rider-

                All these guys giving recommendations are “sharp”…they know what they’re talking about! Listen to them!

                But, at the end of the day..it boils down to 4 things in a collapse/post collapse scenario:

                1.) Caliber of weapon/ammo

                2.) Usage & application of weapon

                3.) Availability of ammunition

                4.) Cost

                ————————————-

                Recommendations:

                Stick w/ a military caliber, i.e. .223/.308-7.62×51/30-06 or even the Russian 7.62×39(AK/SKS round).
                As all are currently available.

                .223(5.56mm) is good for +400, maybe 500 w/o a high crosswind w/ 75grsmk.

                .308(7.62×51) is easily good for 750 w/ 175grsmk. +500 w/ 168gr/HPBT match.

                30-06 will go 1000yds w/ 175 & 190smks (I haven’t done so, but I’ve seen men who could)!

                The Russian 7.62×39 might go 300, if you’re good & happen to possess a good weapon w/ great sights.

                Also FYI, both the US military & Law enforcement utilize the .223 & the .308.
                Some urban LEO departments are fond of the .243 also(good caliber too!).

                Remember that data, sir!

                ———————————

                Semi-autos like the AR-AK-FN/FAL-SKS etc are compromises between a rifle & supreme accuracy..a good AR-FN/FAL are more accurate/consistent than the comm-bloc stuff..but the AK/SKS will still shoot after spending 2 days in a mud puddle! The others won’t!!!!

                The M1A is in a class by itself(the best, hands down)..nuff said!

                Haven’t shot Maudy’s PTR-91 yet..so I defer to him in that regard.

                ———————————–

                Per a bolt gun:

                If cost is a major factor, go w/ a Savage Tactical w/ an accu-trigger. Out of the box w/ decent glass, it will out shoot the Remington w/ over the counter ammo..been there, done that..too many times!
                Am not dissing Remington in any way..but their sweet-spot is something you must fine tune your loads for! Others here, may find otherwise..’tis just a personal observation!

                If cost isn’t a factor..go SAKO!!! For the money, you can’t beat the Finns!

                For the glass..I like high end Leupold, Burris, Sheppard & (recently, due to somebody here’s recommendation) Khales!
                IMO, higher $$$ Nikkon is the entry level.

                -{whoever it was pushing German glass..thank you!}..Khales is awesome!

                ———————————–

                Usage & Application:

                Decide/choose what scenario you’re likely to encounter, per your location, i.e. in the house..in the yard..or urban..burbs..rural/country..whatever!

                Close range <75yds..get a "Bertha"(12ga pump)..if less than 25ft, get a .45acp or a .357mag
                See 1BH for details on the 12ga.

                Long distance..go w/ a bolt gun w/ decent glass & practice often..learn to reload too!

                A firefight(if force into such)..go .223/.308/30-06/7.62×39!

                —————————–

                Somebody in the past here, said/mentioned the fact…"whatever, make sure you have a gun/weapon!"

                That's the best advice anyone could give…and its better for you, that you should possess a weapon in a very common & widely available caliber.

                ———————————

                Which brings up an interesting point…last year, I affixed a hard scabbard to my farm tractor..it carries the most common center-fire rifle/caliber in North America, whenever I'm out bush-hogging the fields.

                Yep, its a Marlin 30-30/model #336AS.

                Us southern redneck farmers are a funny bunch!!!

              • Sgt. Dale says:

                G.R.
                Hunter knows his stuff. I would listen to him very closely.

                Hunter.
                Very good info. You said it like it is. You broke it down like even an old Fart like can learn something. Thanks.
                A.,S.M.S.
                Sgt.

              • hammerhead says:

                Hunter , i also have a marlin 3030 on my tractor.
                Great minds think alike !
                I also have a marlin in 4570 incase is see an elk.

              • @Hunter,
                I like what you say about Savage and the accu trigger 🙂

                I have never heard of Kahles?

                Also I see you are a fan of the Sheppard and Burris……these are the fancy battery operated scopes right? That have the laser range finder?

                I like the Sheppard and the Burris Eliminator, but am afraid for me that would be taking a shortcut and not really learning the fudamentals since I don’t know the whole mil dot shooting thing….yet!

                I seen the BUrris Eliminator at Scheels in Iowa City Saturday for 900$ and was soooo tempted. But like the wife said….what happens when you have no batteries?

                Nice post Hunter

              • Hunter says:

                BJ-

                Hold fast bro’..you’ll get there.

                Per my glass usage:

                The Sheppard is a 3x10x40mm(1″ tube)P-2 w/ 18″ Stadia reticle(deer), w/ no battery.
                Note: In 8 years, I’ve never had to re-zero her!!!

                The Burris is a Black Diamond 4x16x50mm/posi-lock(30mm tube) w/ Ballistic mil-dot, no battery.

                The Leupold is a 4.5x14x50mm(30mm tube)Tactical w/ BDC & illuminated reticle(mark #4/long-range/mil-dot)..and is the only scope that uses a battery, but functions just as well w/o one, except in extreme(very dark) low light conditions.

                The Khales(made by Swarovski) is a 4.5x18x50mm(30mm tube) w/ a plex reticle..again, no battery, but she was ($$)expensive!!!
                Yet sucks in photons(light) like a celestial blackhole vacuum cleaner!!!

                ————————–

                Note to self: gotta check out a Nightforce scope one day.

                —————————

                BJ, if you want something worthwhile that uses batteries for a SHTF environment, per your security operations..go w/ a decent night-vision device(gen #2 or better) or better yet..a thermal-vision unit(see Thermal-eye)..try to stay inside the realm of common over-the-counter batteries like AA Duracells.
                ..and get some MRS type radios!

                Good luck & may GOD Bless your endeavors…

          • Kulafarmer says:

            It boils down to what is it for?
            If you dont reload and it is purely a combat rifle i would go with a PTR 91
            They are cheaper and better for the $ than a low dollar AR
            If its mostly for hunting or longer range shooting i would go with a bolt gun, that said even a decent bolt action will cost some coin,,
            Another option would be build out an 80% lower then get an upper or build an upper.
            Read up on issues with the various 308 ARs, had a DPMS and it had nothing but problems,,,
            Have an LWRC REPR now and its the balls, but was also pretty costly, but is definitely not a disappointment.

            • If I could have only one rifle to bug out with it would be my 10/22 with 2000 rnds ammo.

            • @ Hunter,
              I thought the Sheppard was a battery operated scope that had a built in laser range finder?

              Thermal eye night vision?

              MRS?

              Thanks Hunter.

              Oh BTW to all who have been taking part in the long range shooting discussions. I found another school today through the website snipercentral.com. I don’t know if they are as good as GPS in AZ, Badland Tactical in OK, or Storm Mountain in WV.? But they are a longer class for less money? They are in Butte, MT and I think it is the guy who runs/owns the site http://www.snipercentral.com who does it?

          • Paranoid says:

            Sgt is right. Buy you need to provide more info. I’m a 30-06 guy but same questions. Have you shot the Rd? If not go buy a second hand hunting rifle. Most hunting rifles have not shot 100 rds, Not only are they not shot out, most aren’t even shot in. They take a lot of cleaning and some shooting just to get set. I usually shoot 25-06. When I bought the rifle I got 250 rds each of two kinds and expect them to last me close to 100 years. With care you can buy a hunting rifle use it some and sell it for what you paid. Most are more accurate than run of the mill military and are just as good or better to learn your ammo on. You will shoot less ammo with a bolt action and hit more. My father was a weapons instructor during WWII. he always said: It’s not the gun it’s the man. Give him a 100 good men with Springfield’s against 100 with anything else and at the end of the day he’d have about 97 with Springfield’s and a spare. You are not going to fight fixed combat. If you do you will lose. A man who takes one good shot and GOOD will live to shoot a lot. So generally speaking I’d go with a good target Rifle and scope with a lot of ammo. It’s a poor weapon to clean out a room. Sub gun and a Grenade

            • jerrytbg says:

              I hear tell of a P17 with a sport stock, remanufacture 55′ …used only to put meat on the table.
              One or two rds to zero every year then the kill shots…not many.

              Fine weapon…

          • Smokey says:

            In addition to an AR10 platform, consider a good FN FAL or an HK 91. They will cost more, but another option if you find one available. Don’t get the CETME clone of the HK 91, you want the real Heckler & Koch. Also avoid the FAL parts guns, you want the real thing.

            As far as ammo goes, load your own, you will save big bucks on ammo.

            • Hunter says:

              Smokey-

              Sound advice! I lust for a real HK-91 too!
              Per the FAL..the best to be had nowadays, are based on the Austrian STG-58 w/ an Imbel receiver…yeah, they’re getting rare as hens teeth, at the gun shows here in the south.

          • lastmanstanding says:

            GR, Check out snipercentral.com Missoula, Mt. The site is run by an Army National Guard sniper who has been to several of the Military and LE schools.

            They test many different rifles and optics on the site and have a very detail review of all.

            They will build you a custom bolt rifle and have several packages. (Howa and Remington) They have a detail estimate page of what a rifle will cost to build. Stock type, trigger, barrel length and other options you may want. You just make your choices and the total cost of the rifle is at the bottom.

            It will be worth your time. Lots of good info and a well set up site.

          • I am no expert, but I have seen, read and heard real good thing about the Savage 110 FCP-SR .308 in bolt action.

      • Hear me when I say that I am NOT bragging in any shape or form. But I can say how I DID react when a man pulled a gun on me in New Orleans and tried to rob me. I can give detail here and post the link to the article the Muskegon newspaper and several others from New Orleans to Chicago wrote on it after interviewing me. But for now I can say that first God was so with me and helped me. 2.Adrenaline is a super drug that can turn your body into a super machine and your brain into a super computer…unbelievable how clear your mind gets and how fast yet slow enough to think through things come through in your mind. Very hard to explain…I hated being shot, never been so scared in my life, but I loved that super feeling of what my body was able to do after being
        shot and the clarity and fast/clear/concise thoughts that run through my brain helping me.

    • Lol, When in trouble when in doubt
      run in circles, scream and shout.
      Bar the door, kill the pig,
      grab a shovel we’re gona dig.

  12. Ted Kennedy says:

    My tin foil hat can’t take no more! Time for a vodka summit somewhere I can see you both coming from a gd long way off.

  13. db427 says:

    a lot of americans are over drugged (opiates of some Px), and have been to the point where their fight/flight response has been completely eliminated. add to that the amount that are too fat and stupid to find their way out of a cardboard box, I’d guess up to 80% would die within a few weeks. the hardest part would be determining friend or foe from the remaining 20%

  14. Socrates says:

    The other end of the equation besides fight or flight reaction…is adrenaline. Many people get pumped up with adrenaline, excitement, fear and it works against them. You have to remain FOCUSED on the task at hand and the intended outcome. When your body and brain get that sudden ‘surge’ it can cloud both thinking and response.

    Much the same as being a rifleman: Relax, aim, breathe, exhale, squeeze and stay on target. Repeat as required.
    Rehearsing different scenarios can be a good way to test your response. I had posted a few weeks back about stranger knocking at my door late one night and I must admit- I got keyed up and in fight mode. I was ready for whatever came my way I thought, but was I really? You won’t know till it happens to you.

    • hammerhead says:

      yep SOC , Havin people at your door late at night can be alittle tense at times.
      I used to live on a bad section of road and had people coming to the door in the middle of the night wanting to use the phone(pre-cellphone) or try to get me to pull them outta the ditch because they were drunk and beligerant.
      Never had any real trouble , but some tense moments for sure . people used to be more trustworthy as a rule .

  15. Ted Kennedy says:

    Donnie Fenn: Movement. 1600 non Russian troops. Approximately… forty goats.
    Bob Lee Swagger: They’re not on anybody’s side. We don’t have to shoot them.

  16. maudy frickett says:

    Stress equals pucker factor.

  17. Canadian Vet says:

    I can probably sum up this article in 4 key points.

    1) everyone can and will eventually lose their shit.

    2) learn to recognize the signs of losing your shit so you can get a grip and carry on

    3) train so you have a set of developed automatic responses to take over from higher functions when you lose your shit, and to delay said losing of your shit.

    4) there are plenty of tricks to hasten any threat to you losing their shit so you can exploit it when they are more fucked up than a soup sandwich.

    Did I miss any key points?

  18. Merree says:

    Another important thing to think about is creating distractions. Think about how a pickpocket might have an accomplice bump into someone to distract the victim while he grabs their wallet.

    It is possible to use distractions are a part of prepping. Such as having a decoy location of supplies that can be sacrificed while the main cache is hidden elsewhere. If you have to battle someone, set off fireworks to draw their attention while you exit to the opposite or attack from the opposite side. These sorts of distractions.

    Another option could be to make them uneasy by not appearing normal. People break into houses expecting the usual generic situation. It is possible to make them uneasy by actions such as placing items in unexpected locations. Try to make the opposition think, “man, these people are weird.” Anything abnormal will make them nervous and it is good to mess with their minds. Think twilight zone. (An empty snake cage with a sign- please don’t let the cobras out again- especially if you have a decoy safe loaded with a pop out snake. Haunted house props. Strange noises.)

    I remember reading about a hoaxer who lived in a dangerous neighborhood who kept his home from being vandalized by a large professionally made sign that read “Protected by thermonuclear device”. He would probably get arrested now days but it worked back in the ’70s.

    The point is- most gang members are not very creative and when the adrenaline is rushing, they are unlikely to think things through very thoroughly. Most bureaucratic fascists have no imagination at all. A little imagination and creativity can make a big difference.

  19. Bert Gummer says:

    If you have a retreat location, when do you pack up and go? Bug out too many times on false alerts may make you jaded and less likely to go when needed. Anyone have a thought on this problem? I don’t have a place, and still trying to figure out if it will really be needed. Found a property for $50,000 which would be 30 years of payments at a real low amount. Something doable, but with it comes the headaches of taking care of another property 1 1/2 hours away. Inviting input.

    • Smokey says:

      If you think you need it, and can afford it, go for it. Less than two hours away is not far. Question is, is it far enough when SHTF? If you think so, seriously consider it.

      Is it a place you might want to retire to, or just for SHTF? If retirement is a goal, put the money into upkeep and improvements. If just for SHTF, maybe not so much, it’s just a hidey-hole. If permanent, consider moving there and commuting back into town once a week for the work week, staying at a low-cost place on weeknights.

    • sixpack says:

      If you’re just gonna work it off, what have you got to lose but some time and effort?

  20. mountain man 6-1 says:

    When I was a teen-ager , I wondered about a lot of thing’s and one of them was how a little lady could pick up a car that had turned over on a child . It just didn’t make sense to me that this was possible , then I was shown it was possible ! A young gal (with two kids ,girl 6 -boy 5 )and me, stopped at a lake one day .We spread out a blanket on a grassy hillside and sat down , the kids playing up above us . So after a while, as we were talking , the little girl called out to us “Casey’s in the water!!” Brain clicks into Slo-Mo ,I jumped up and ran up the hill ,to where she was and as I crested the top of hill and looked to where she was pointing fifty yards down to the lake ,I saw NOTHING !! In my memory of that moment I took off down the hill (still in slow motion)and a few seconds later as I approached the lake all I could see was his hair floating on top of the water ! I leaped in and grabbed him by the legs and climbed up the bank ,as I did that I heard him cough and spit up water . His lips were blue and eyes were wide ,but he was OK !! Don’t remember much after that !! I was shaking and a nervous wreck !! But NOW I know what it’s like !!

  21. jerrytbg says:

    Ms Bennet

    I can’t believe you put so much vital information in what amounts to no more than a pamphlet…brilliant…

    Take heed friends…

  22. Socrates says:

    ***OFF TOPIC***
    But important, nonetheless:

    Putin Advisor Threatens With Dumping US Treasurys, Abandoning Dollar If US Proceeds With Sanctions

    While the comments by Russian presidential advisor, Sergei Glazyev, came before Putin’s detente press conference early this morning, they did flash a red light of warning as to what Russian response may be should the west indeed proceed with “crippling” sanctions as Kerry is demanding. As RIA reports, his advice is that “authorities should dump US government bonds in the event of Russian companies and individuals being targeted by sanctions over events in Ukraine.” Glazyev said the United States would be the first to suffer in the event of any sanctions regime. “The Americans are threatening Russia with sanctions and pulling the EU into a trade and economic war with Russia,” Glazyev said. “Most of the sanctions against Russia will bring harm to the United States itself, because as far as trade relations with the United States go, we don’t depend on them in any way.”

    From RIA:

    “We hold a decent amount of treasury bonds – more than $200 billion – and if the United States dares to freeze accounts of Russian businesses and citizens, we can no longer view America as a reliable partner,” he said. “We will encourage everybody to dump US Treasury bonds, get rid of dollars as an unreliable currency and leave the US market.”

    US Secretary of State John Kerry on Saturday warned that Russian military interventions in Ukraine, which have been justified by the Kremlin as protection for residents in heavily ethnic Russian-populated regions, could result in “serious repercussions” for Moscow.

    “Unless immediate and concrete steps are taken by Russia to deescalate tensions, the effect on US-Russian relations and on Russia’s international standing will be profound,” Kerry said.

    Kerry mentioned economic sanctions, visa bans and asset freezes as possible measures.
    Former deputy energy minister and lively government critic Vladimir Milov slammed Glazyev’s remarks, saying they would put further downward pressure on the ruble, which was pushed down Monday to a record low of 36.5 against the dollar amid fears about the possible outbreak of war.

    “That idiot Glazyev will keep talking until the dollar is worth 60 [rubles],” Milov wrote on his Twitter account.

    To be sure, a high-ranking Kremlin source was quick to distance his office from Glazyev’s remarks, however, insisting to RIA Novosti that they represented only his personal position. Glazyev was just expressing his views as an academic, and not as a presidential adviser, the Kremlin insider said.

    That said, putting Russia’s threat in context, the Federation held $138.6 billion in US Treasurys as of December according to the latest TIC data, making it the 11th largest creditor of the US, which appears to conflict with what the Russian said, making one wonder where there is a disconnect in “data.” This would mean the Fed would need just two months of POMO to gobble up whatever bonds Russia has to sell.

    The bigger question is if indeed, as some have suggested, China were to ally with Russia, and proceed to follow Russia in its reciprocal isolation of the US, by expanding trade with Russia on non-USD based terms, and also continue selling bonds as it did in December, when as we reported previously it dumped the second largest amount of US paper in history.

    More here:

    h ttp://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-03-04/putin-advisor-threatens-dumping-us-treasurys-abandoning-dollar-if-us-proceeds-sancti

  23. slingshot says:

    Stress, Adrenaline, Drugs (Meth)

    Most are aware that a person depending upon where he has been shot or stabbed can lived up to 10 seconds after injury.
    We expect to go up against sane people. What about the ones that are crazy. Tweakers that stay up all night. Un-rational thought processes. Then you have a loner who is only looking out for himself. No connections.
    Very dangerous.

    • Canadian Vet says:

      Up to 10 seconds? Try minutes. The human body can take a damn long time to shut down even after suffering catastrophic damage. Even more so when hopped up on meth, bath salts or even good old adrenalin.

      • maudy frickett says:

        The .357 mag in 125gr. HP, out of a 4 inch barrel, is the number one fight stopper in real gunfights, where only one round was used. For hand guns. Kentucky Highway Patrol have the honors.

        • PO'd Patriot says:

          Maudy, you are correct.

        • Canadian Vet says:

          To assume you will instantly kill your target with a single well-placed round is suicidal. Even one of your magic bullets straight into the pump or in the head isn’t a guarantee of instant incapacitation. There are dozens of variables in play here and even if you do manage to put your round in a vital spot, your enemy might still have enough fight in him to squeeze off a shot or three toward you before he gives out.

          Or, if drugged to his eyeballs, he might not even feel the impacts and the pain and still come at you with his knife unless something load-bearing like the pelvis gets shattered or his head is turned into a canoe. Basically, just like a deer that was shot through both lungs taking off running, not knowing it’s already dead.

          Everything with shooting is worth shooting multiple times. And it’s not because the enemy is down that he is out of the fight. So long as he’s got a pulse, he’s a threat.

          • sixpack says:

            Yeah, we already have too many police following that model. They often shoot innocent people, but at least they make sure the non-threat was no longer a “threat”.

            sarcasm off.

    • “Most are aware that a person depending upon where he has been shot or stabbed can lived up to 10 seconds after injury.”

      That’s why you use nothing less than a 45 ACP. They might not be dead for 10 seconds, but they will be laying flat on their back if hit between the tits and die before they get back up. I see SGT Dale packs a 45 as said his posts, anything less is.. well NOT a 45..

      • OutWest says:

        .02 — sorry for so many replies…..

        I was shooting over at the old dump with
        my .45acp at an iron tire rim once.

        In retrospect, the hardball hit the rim
        near the center and followed the curve
        right back at me and square in the middle
        of the forehead.

        I do remember that it threw me flat on my
        back and I was out cold as a cucumber.
        I awoke with a goose egg that looked like
        it was put there by a ballpeen hammer.

        I can at least attest to the NEAR-lethal
        effects of that old pumpkin ball.

        • GOOD LORD! you are l u c k y you ever saw daylight again!

        • 1braveheart says:

          .02, I once had a .45 but could never become accurate with it. I have a .40 but I’m not as accurate as I’d like to be with it. It seems like I always do better with smaller caliber weapons. I know the .40 and .45 WILL put someone down but it’s the shot placement that I’m concerned with.

          • BH, you know the saying, a handgun is just to hold them off until you can get to the shotgun. Accuracy with handguns to actually hit anything at distance takes years of practice and thousands of rounds. I consider my side arm to be the last ditch effort and hopefully no further away then across the room even tho I have been shooting them for 45 years. But I too am a lot more accurate with my ancient .22 Ruger than my 45.

          • OutWest says:

            braveheart

            When some folks have a hard time shooting
            the bigger calibers (40-45) accurately, they
            are usually ‘limp wristing’ their gun.

            I was schooled when shooting the .45 auto to
            grip it so tight it trembled, then relax my
            hold just enough to stop the shakes. The more
            I did it during dry firing practice the stronger
            I got, and the more accurate I became.

            The reason being, most autos come with a battle
            trigger, heavy and rough.
            The massive slide slamming back, a fresh round
            jumping up, and the slide slamming back into
            battery needs a grip of iron to hold steady and
            to give it a solid base to cycle without jamming.

            This all happens with one pull of the trigger.
            I have bought many fine big autos cheap because
            their owners said they were ‘jammers’.

            • Trigger pull and finger placement on the trigger on the big 45 is important. I like to kind of “roll” the trigger and use the tip of the index first knuckle to pull it. A lot of people make the mistake of using the trigger finger on the second knuckle which will make it pull left. Also do a push pull with your shooting hands pushing with your trigger hand and pulling back with your off hand.

      • Socrates says:

        As one who actually TESTS rifle and pistol rounds against vests and helmets, etc… I can attest to the extreme one shot stopping power of the Federal HST 230 gr JHP .45 ACP rounds. I will say with a high degree of confidence that if I precision locate said round into the forehead of most anything alive, it will no longer be a threat. Period. Did I mention these are some of my favorite rounds? 😉

        For you non-believers out there allow me to illustrate what a real tactical .45 handgun round can do. Keep in mind these are not even the +P rounds, just standard velocity.

        h ttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iWW2Y-IZpyE

    • Paranoid says:

      That is why the 1911 .45 was invented. drugged up tribesmen. The 1911 doesn’t care it puts you DOWN and stomps on you.

      • PO'd Patriot says:

        Mora tribe in the Phillipines. The US army were given .38 revolvers with round nose lead bullets and after shooting the tribesmen several times were still getting stabbed to death. Wasn’t long before the army gave them back the .45acp

    • sixpack says:

      Tweakers will either be cleaning the floor with a tooth brush, or sleeping because they ran out of dope. I’m not worried about tweakers…it’s those heroin addicts who will kill for a fix.

  24. Gwyn says:

    Over time I have been in a few ‘tense’ situations.
    I have made myself – Be calm, be quiet, and be alert.
    Make quick and good decisions.
    Handle the situation calmly, without losing my head,
    to the best of my ability.
    * Afterwards, when it is all over, ‘that’ is when
    I fall apart. Start shaking, have to sit down,
    sometimes get teary – eyed for a few seconds.

    • thisTexan has had enough says:

      @Gwen-I am OK in a crisis too, but after it is over my knees get weak and I have to sit down or fall down. But I have not yet cratered during a crisis.

    • John_Allen says:

      Dave Grossman, On Killing, confirms it isn’t a myth that people in fear for their lives wet their pants. The biggest, baddest mf in the room can. It isn’t how big. It’s how scared. He says that’s a normal response. That they’re alive to feel angst means they must have done something right.

      • Canadian Vet says:

        I read Grossman’s books too, and that’s why my last stop before mounting up when I was overseas, let it be the plane in or out of the country, a helo or an armoured vehicle, was the can. Completely emptying my bowel and bladder, effectively dropping ballast, and trying to minimize the mess if we were going to come under contact.

        But, thankfully I never had to test out if my “battle shit” actually worked.

        And it is normal to sorta crash after shit has happened. Once the adrenaline gets flushed out, your body realizes it’s been cranked up to 11 for a while and turns itself down so it can recuperate.

      • sixpack says:

        So what if I wet my pants—I can always change them after it’s over. The trick is to survive it, then worry about the rest.

  25. Sgt. Dale says:

    Geyn:
    I had a great Chief that I worked for. (I’m paraphrasing.) He always said “Take care of the problem, and shake, cry, or what ever after you are away form the crowd. REMEMBER YOU ARE HUMIN! LET IT OUT!”
    A.S.M.S.
    Sgt.

  26. PKLauLau says:

    I read a science-y article a few years ago. There are two types of people. One is the “react before they even know what they are doing” and the other is “freeze in place” types. It is hard wired into the brain and hereditary. (Like there are only two types of earlobes). The quick react people tend to go into first responder type of jobs, cops, firemen, etc. For the freeze type people, this can be trained out and you can learn to respond quickly.

    But for the average person…how do you put yourself in emergency situations to learn to change your reactions? And most people don’t even know what “type” they are.

    Many years ago, my family was eating in a restaurant. My dad was sitting next to me and started choking. I raised up out of my chair about 10 inches and froze there. I literally couldn’t move. My brother, sitting at another table, jumped up and gave him the Heimlich maneuver and saved his life. (Brother went on to be a paramedic)

    I have thought of this repeatedly over the years and it really bothers me. I was angry at myself for not being able to function. And have tried to work on reaction time since then and have gotten much better. But again I ask, how does the average person (not in a first responder job) train for this?

    PKLL

    • sixpack says:

      You train for it in your mind. Once you know what to do, you are more likely to act. You probably wasn’t very familiar with the Heimlich maneuver, so you had nothing to base an action on. You brother WAS familiar with it, and he probably was thinking “choking-heimlich-now”, while you were still wondering what to do to help.

      Knowing is more than half the battle, is my point. You won’t try to do it, if you don’t know about it.

      • PKLauLau says:

        Sixpack: thanks for the response. Nearly all the men in my family and extended family are first responders and I grew up with that mentality. I grew up knowing what to do, how to do it and yet, when an emergency came…..I completely froze.

        Even though that was many years ago and I am much better now….it still bothers me. I wish there was a way to hone this skill for the average joe that doesn’t cost a fortune.

        PKLL

  27. Gwyn says:

    To Sgt. Dale – Thank you for your response to my comment.

    I know some military people (in the family),

    and some of them consider showing emotion ‘a sign of

    weakness.’ Your Chief is right.

  28. maudy frickett says:

    The only good commie is a dead commie. Having said that, the commies in D.C. are more of a threat to me than the commies in Moscow. Moscow doesn’t take my freedom. Washington does. Too many people don’t understand the dislike some of us have for the government in Washington. Moscow and Washington are both anti-freedom. One is a little more sophisticated than the other in the application of political oppression. Some readers are against the NWO but at the same time they’re for the government in Washington. The government in D.C. is part of the NWO. We don’t blame America for everything, we blame the government. Big difference.

  29. Barn Cat says:

    If there’s a group of armed people coming on your property it’s best to start shooting right away. After the first perp gets hit they might scatter and run away. Or some might freeze. Take out as many as you can as quickly as you can. If one guy looks like the leader take him out first. There’s also shock value with killing a perp in an unexpected way. Like with a 2×4 full of nails. Or shooting them in the face with a shotgun as they come in the door. When the perps see the guy fall backwards with his face blown off the fight might be over.

  30. Hillbilly says:

    What if there from the Government, and there just there to help?

  31. Anonymous says:

    Got gold or a second trip to the salad bar???

  32. Daisy says:

    Kerry,

    I really like those little Heinz ketchup things at Wendy’s. How’s that million $ blowboat (sailboat) you didn’t want to pay taxes on?

  33. Mike says:

    I’M nOt STreaSeD . Dumb teenagers? I was once a dumb teenager.At 17 I was not old enough to legaly buy beer, however it was O.K. to march for x miles with a M-16. A reporter at the time ( early 70,s ) called us angry druged out teenagers too stupid or poor to go to colladge . Damb right. Now I’m a middle aged pot – belly. Still not too smart and feeling dumber all the time. By the way those 80% AR15 rifles are getting harder to complete with “push here machinist” better get on the ball now if you want one. Too late for $99. SKS rifles $8 bricks of 22 LR etc. If you don’t know what a “push here machinist” is look at internet or better go to a gun show.Got that little camp stove you never used OUTSIDE in the rain / wind. Try now. Time to work out some bugs now before the stress really hits the fan. Just one dummies opinion.

  34. Frank Thoughts says:

    Good piece! Planning and awareness of the tools to hand shows all of us have the ability to defend ourselves in a crisis. It is true having access to precision weapons (rifles) is obviously advantageous, it is not the be all and end all of defense. A rifle can also give you false confidence and make you lazy in your decisions. Many people are infused with the fantasy world of film and television. This can give a person a wide range of artificial expectations in a crisis that can prove lethal for them. I have been in many violent and deadly situations over the years for my work: it is nothing like Hollywood.

    Many people in a crisis will be a bit like the character in the Indiana Jones film who confronts Indiana with his sword. After much bravado and sword play and threats, Indiana just shoots him in the head with his pistol.

    Real life is always another story. Imagine you are in this crisis situation after several nights of fitful sleep, a vicious argument with your wife, and you are feeling constipated and bloated (this is real life). Now the gang of hommies is heading your way. You aren’t feeling too great and to go into the prone position is painful and leaves your arms shaking. Your family is absolutely freaking out because this shit just got real. Your wife and daughter can only think about being viciously raped and killed.

    The best result for you is for the gang to pass you by, not to confront them. Even better, if you have a pre-planned escape route, then take that option. Confrontation should be the last option because it is filled with far too many risks.

    If this is an experienced gang, then they will have the advantage over your typical middle class family guy. That is just life. To live (and eventually die) in a gang is a Darwinian struggle every day. These guys are acting on survival instincts already and have probably done many acts of violence in stressful situations. They are ‘switched on’.

    Retreating in a tactical way can be very effective. If they take pursuit, then you can lay traps for them. As they get excited by the chase, they will be making mistakes. Running down a path they think you are at the end of, only to be tripped up by trip wire and then to land on a spiked tree branch. There are lots of tricks you can do to whittle a pursuing gang down in size.

  35. Joe S. says:

    Just do your best to stay calm and level headed. I suffered from horrible panic attacks for years,But I realized one day ‘with what’s coming’ you can’t be going through this s**t when it happens and I over came my anxiety. A good healthy diet and exercise really helps heal the mind.