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    Our Government Has Cemented Its Own Downfall and It’s Going to Be Ugly

    Mac Slavo
    February 9th, 2011
    SHTFplan.com
    Comments (55)
    Read by 262 people

    We want to be positive about all this spending, monetary expansion and economic malaise – we really do. But when we read expert analysis from the likes of David Galland of Casey Research, we really can’t help but be pessimistic and alarmed about the survivability of the world as we know it:

    Via The Daily Crux

    If the government had kept its role limited and its finances in good shape, people might not love it, but they’d respect it – and, more to the point, they wouldn’t hate it.

    However, by expanding as it has, the government has drained its treasury. Then, politically unable and unwilling to stop its spending, it kept going – racking up the largest debt in history.

    That has brought us to a crossroads.

    One path leads to more spending, in which case the currency will collapse, wiping out the remaining wealth of the citizenry… resulting in a hateful population.

    The other leads to overt default and a wholesale unwinding of the government’s massive role in the economy, again wiping out the wealth of the citizenry and resulting in a hateful population.

    In either scenario, a government anxious to avoid the worst can be expected to raise taxes and take other desperate measures to avoid failure. Hungary, Poland, Bulgaria, and other nations have recently made pension grabs; we can expect to see that in the U.S. as well before this is over. Again, at the same time that these moves may help the government stay afloat awhile longer, it plants the seeds of public hatred and cements its eventual downfall.

    In our strongly held view, the government will continue to opt for the path of more spending – until it simply can’t, at which point the first path will lead back to the second. And so, no matter what it does at this point, the government will soon find itself faced with serious and widespread discontent.

    Throw a heavily militarized constabulary into the mix, and the potential arises for the situation to get very ugly, very fast.

    We’ve made mention in prior commentary of the two options our government has at its disposal as observed by David Galland.

    1. Flat out default on our obligations, which is something Tim Geithner recently warned about in a letter to Congress and we expanded on in Confirmed: We’re Literally On the Brink of Catastrophic Collapse.
    2. Continued monetary expansion leading to a hyperinflationary collapse of the world’s reserve currency, which we wrote about in December of 2009 summarizing what it will look like and how to protect yourself: No Way of Avoiding Financial Armageddon

    While both of these options are on the table, we lean towards hyperinflationary collapse resulting from continued monetary expansion, a sentiment shared by David Galland and many of our readers who have voiced their opinions in comments and emails over the last several weeks.

    The US government will more than likely not voluntarily default on its debt. Though it is always within the realm of possibility, the effects of such an action would be immediate and extremely violent. We would literally see a complete meltdown within a period of a few days once the rest of the world realized they wouldn’t get paid.

    Incidentally, the effects of taking such an action wouldn’t be too dissimilar from continued monetary expansion. However, continuing to raise the debt ceiling and printing more money will at least buy us some time. In this instance, we will essentially default on our debt through the printing of money. Basically, we borrow $1 Trillion, and then, instead of paying it back with today’s dollars, we’ll just print a trillion at the Federal Reserve and pay that debt off in heavily diluted dollars. So, while the Chinese may hold in excess of $2 trillion in foreign reserves, there is a real possibility that in the end, all they’ll get for that is a loaf of bread.

    The end result will be the same. A completely poverty stricken, jobless citizenry and/or a total, uncontrollable debt and/or currency driven collapse.

    The other consideration that must be made when talking about a US dollar currency collapse is, as David Galland referred to it, the heavily militarized constabulary and heavily armed populace. A system meltdown in the U.S. will make Egypt look like a peaceful demonstration.

    Though it is not exactly a guaranteed outcome, a combination of James Rawles’ Patriots-style post-apocalyptic world and Troy Grice’s Indivisible comes to mind.

    And, that doesn’t even take into consideration the fact that the Chinese will be sitting on a loaf of bread for 30 years of toil assembling stuffed animals, iPods and cheap HDTV’s. There is always the real possibility that they will want the US to make good on our debt, forcing the Chinese into a position where they will have to fight – as in global war – for what they perceive as theirs. When we can’t pay, the Chinese may very well come for our hard assets.

    Please Spread The Word And Share This Post
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    Author: Mac Slavo
    Views: Read by 262 people
    Date: February 9th, 2011
    Website: www.SHTFplan.com

    Copyright Information: Copyright SHTFplan and Mac Slavo. This content may be freely reproduced in full or in part in digital form with full attribution to the author and a link to www.shtfplan.com. Please contact us for permission to reproduce this content in other media formats.

     

    55 Comments...

    Vote: Click here to vote for SHTF Plan as a Top Prepper Web Site
    1. scott says:

      Glad I started buying silver sometime back :) and stock piling food etc. 2 years ago. All those Obumma believers our there singing their la la la la la la la song hope you like the soup lines (if there will be any).

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    2. POdPatriot says:

      Comments…..The time to locknload draweth nigh.

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    3. Comments…..  I believe hyperinflation is rearing it’s ugly head out of our financial debt hole.  China is facing it’s own inflation at this time.  They have their own people to worry about.

      So, hopefully, our respective countries will be too busy trying to keep their civilian populations under control and not turn their eyes to world war.

      “The Times They Are A Changing”  and if you are not prepped to change with it, you will be bowled over in the march towards civilian upheavel.

      Good luck to all.

      I suggest that US civilians band together with  like minded people in groups/communities to have any chance of coming out alive. 

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    4. slamhound says:

      Next time you cruise through Walmart (China’s Outlet Store) Take a good look at the people. How many of them are prepped? How many can defend themselves? My guess is not very many if any at all. Things could get real ugly

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    5. Gangster says:

      If things go down in a worst case scenario it will be so catastrophic as to be unthinkable. The only way to survive it you would have to have an tight knit community with a common goal like the Mormons or the Amish. Where I live I am doomed.

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    6. Anonymous says:

      It usually is ugly in China Mart.

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    7. Laura m. says:

      I agree with Mona.  I saw/read crazy things happen in the oil shortage in the 70′s.  People would fight at gas stations, run off with out paying, etc.  Katrina was a good example of local shtf.  Support Oath Keepers in your community;  they will restore order and go against martial law.

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    8. Anonymous says:

      cmon Mac, not you too? the only people the “militaristic constablary” will be clashing with are rioters who are solely doing it to loot, etc.  and even with the relatively low numbers of the partakers of that kind of anger expression, they do not have the  manpower to stop it.  if the “protests” were an actual uprising by the people to remove the criminals currently running our government, we have little to fear from our “LEO’s”  as the numbers willing to stop that will be far less than those willing to stop anger ignorant inner city looters.

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    9. kevin says:

      Comments….. you guys need to stop all this fearmongering, just take 10 minutes and think of all the talented, smart,uncoruptable leaders we have, I believe they will come to their senses about all this spending and uhhhhhhhhhhhhhh……………  WE ARE SOOOOOOO F$CKED! 

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    10. Chris C. says:

      Anyone who has studies the Federal Reserve system knows that hyperinflation was and always has been in the cards. It is the final play, the play to be made at which point all retirement funds have been seized, all states have been bankrupted, and the people with no jobs and no prospects for jobs are on the hook for all the multiple bailouts and quantitative easing done by our unscrupulous Fed.

      You see, hyperinflation is the controlled demolition that the government needs to quell any rebellion, at least before the people finally wake up once and for all and go ape-shit. A sudden deflationary collapse is not nor will it ever be allowed to come to pass. Why? We just might wake up too quickly. That, and the savers of this country would suddenly be rewarded. When in the last 100 years have the savers ever been rewarded?

      Of course the Treasury will continue to print bonds and get Federal Reserve notes in exchange. It is the only thing the system is designed to do. When you have a monetary system that is based upon printing notes when they are NEEDED, you actually have a monetary system based on less than nothing, not just nothing as Ron Paul likes to point out.

      Look for QE2, QE3, and so on and so forth until some trigger precipitates the avalanche of US dollar selling. 1-2 years time max.

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    11. lostinmissouri says:

      Living where no one else wants to be, is starting to look like,  maybe I have some “premium” real estate.

      Country boys will survive all this.    Hunting, fishing, gardens, home distillery, and premo wacky weed, may become primary jobs for awhile.    They used to be just hobbies.

      Now, what I use to do for fun, might just turn into work….Crap!

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    12. Bangkokslim says:

      How is anyone really going to survive when SHTF, will preppers be able to extend there lives longer then others most likely. However, in the long run your house or apt, may be burned down along with all your water and provisions. Eventually most will have to hoof it  with a backpack and fend for themselves and hope that your a good shot.  Thats the bottom line…..if things get really bad.  Say what you want about precious metals,  your metal will mean nothing to me for trade…

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    13. CaveMan says:

      Chris, the only time that I am aware was when Paul Adolph Volcker raised interest rates during previous as Fed Reserve Chairman under Jimmie & Ronnie.  But even he quit this time.  That dog can’t hunt no more this time around.  Not sure what savers earned but people that wanted to borrow didn’t.  I was just starting to dig my claim back then.  I remember that bear never did like me moving in. 

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    14. Jeff says:

      Mona  When things get bad rulers look to war to distract the people….slamhound  Those same people in Walmart will come looking for you. Remember, they are “entitled”.  Bangkokslim  Silver is just one more thing on the list everyone should have. You don’t want my silver, fine. In the 70′s you could buy a house for a bag…..Frankly, I’m tiring of all the precious metal put downs here. Everything has it’s place….We are all prepping in our own way. When you guys run out of food or ammo for you gun you might just find there will be some  form of currency. Silver has been that choice for 5000+ yrs….I believe longer than most here have been around….

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    15. Anonymous says:

      I pulled some vacuumed frozen meat out of the bottom of one of my freezers last week.  Three years + old.  Tasted just fine.  I have enough freezers that are full.  I think silver will last a lot longer if you catch my drift being that I rotate meat out of the freezers.  Well said Jeff.

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    16. Anonymous says:

      The cards are on the table for WW3…and it is planned.
      but it will take a while..their still not done fucking us yet.
      History shows alot about how this game has been played,, and how we, the human population has been played.
      Pawns if you will, in an elite chess game..
      Veitnam, WW2..and all those that followed and our current mess has and had all been orchestrated on purpose.

      Follow the money people,,whos making a butt load of money off this so called war..or wars..or any wars and conflicts..and dont just stop at the “corperate names”..continue to the top..and the the one puppet master..(no not our puppet president)..he is only one tentical of a much larger entity.

      Depopulation is the game…and wealth and power.

      you gotta dig way way deeper than the surface..and than even deeper than that,, it goes way way back in history..way before America was even settled 

      erica

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    17. Bangkokslim says:

      Jeff:  Question is….will you be around long enough for civil transactions?  Can you trust anyone after SHTF other then your family.  Even they might get crazy on you….

      Good luck with the silver hoarding….most likely someone will take it from you in very uncivil ways….

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    18. Well, here we go again!

      The anti-pm retards irritate me. Sorry guys, nobody here believes that silver or gold alone will save the day. …and some of you are correct: In the midsts of complete collapse and chaos, nobody will trade gold and silver for anything of need because they will be way too scared that they’ll need it soon. But, eventually, it will take on meaning again once things calm down.

      The fact is, you need a balanced approach. I call mine the 6G approach. You need copious amounds of the following:

      God: Spriritually and mentally you must be prepared. Without this, you’re done. You’ll crack and go nutso and, well, you’ll be over with. They’ll kill you for your clothes.

      Guts: You have to have the courage to stand up when you need to stand up and dive in a hole when you need to. No bravado. No Rambo bullshit. Its going to be a nasty, kill or be killed, dodge them if you can world for a while. Best stay hidden if possible. The really tough places will be the cities in the summer. The best times will be a rural setting in the winter. People won’t be wandering around too much and most anyone approaching a dwelling will have gunsights on them long before they get within distance to do any damage. It will be avery “polite” society.

      Guns: Yes! You need guns before groceries. In a quick collapse your safety will be paramount. Most of us have enough body fat (especially me) to last a few weeks without eating much. Guns will be your third most important thing. Besides, all the groceries in the world won’t be worth crap if you can’t protect them.

      Groceries: Yep. Gotta eat and drink. Without this you’ll last a while (except for water). Don’t go all retard on this either. Copious amounts. Not mountains. Though, honestly, if you *OVERINVEST* in this department, guess what? It will be the best SHTF investment you’ll ever do. Imagine buying just about anything you need with cans of “Manwich”. Need a new shovel? How about a couple cans of pork-n-beans?

      Gas: You need energy to run your place until you either figure out a way to heat without it. Or, maybe you invest in solar panels for electricity and then do wood for heat. The fact is, you’ll need some energy unless you’ve figured out a way to do without it. But, you will need to move around some. A car or truck that is reliable and repairable is an asset that will be important to have post SHTF and you’ll need gas to run it.

      Gold: EVENTUALLY after the mad chaos is gone, trade and commerce will start again. Frankly, gold and silver will not be much of an asset for maybe a year or even two after TSHTF. Don’t invest in physical precious metal until you have the first 5 above taken care of. Then, start stuffing the silver (my favorite) or gold bag. While it won’t be of much help when all hell breaks loose, after things calm down, those who have invested well may be shocked what they can get done with a few oz of silver or gold. …and if you over invest in guns, groceries or gas, you might also be surprised how much gold or silver you can get for a few gallons of gas or a few cans of beans.

      The fact is, during stress and duress, things go through hyper inflation. You can capitalize on that. If you store up a bunch of food (…or guns or gas…) and you can trade if for a bunch of gold, well, you can make a killing. There are Gold Tards and they will trade an ounce of gold for a gallon of water and a loaf of bread if they didn’t get any of their own and thought their gold would save them. Then, when things go the other way, you might be a weathy soul when things get put back together. Think about it long and hard. You’ll only get one chance in a lifetime for this.

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    19. greaseman says:

      Comments…..  I’m one of those that believes silver and gold have been around for thousands of years, as a store of wealth, and they aren’t going away just because some idiot pundit thinks they’re in a bubble.
           There are many scenerios that will play out in the coming months.  But sooner or later, even in chaos, trade will develop, and prices for exchange will be developed.  it might be goods, it might be precious metals, or food.  But trade will happen sooner or later.  it’s a natural economic cycle that will develop as a necessity.
             On the question of the dollar being worthless, I have heard some interesting rumors lately.  I have been reading more and more of a new currency being rolled out,based on a basket of commodities and precious metals.  Each of 140 countries would have a cut of a 47 trillion dollar “global settlements” fund that has been around for a long time.  The G-20 know that this is the only hope of saving a world economy.  Each country that got the funds would print their own money, but it would be backed by hard assets.  Our FED would no longer be in charge, and the national debt written off,  The US Treasury would be in control again as they should have been all along, according to the constitution. The exchange rate would be a 1/1 ratio.
          The Chinese are forcing this to happen, and that’s what the Chinese premier ‘s visit last week was about.  If this story is true, and we will soon see, there will certainly be some chaos happening, as the FED isn’t going to go down without a fight.
          One of the causes of all all this to come to a head, is the happenings at the Comex, the precious metals clearing house in London.  Many of the world’s billionaires who “store” their metals there, now want to take physical possession of them. Trouble is, they aren’t there, and the big boys are pissed.  The Comex has sold on paper, silver that they don’t have, and now they are screwed, and have to buy it on the open market. Well, if enough isn’t available, and it isn’t, yiou can see the problem.
            What has this got to do with you and I ??? Everything, as it’s all connected.  These billionaires are forcing the crooked banksters like JP Morgan , who has been trying to force silver down, and keep the dollar up, to cover the demand for the silver. They are in deep trouble. 
          Add all this up, and our dollar’s days are just about over. Expect to see something happen soon.  How soon???  if I knew that, I probably wouldn’t even be talking about it right now.  It will happen when it happens.  BUT, I have been following news stories that back up the fact that something is going on behind the scenes.  Hillary Clinton recently recalled ALL the US ambassadors back to the US for some up close and personal face time. What’s significant about this—-it’s NEVER been done before.  They can have a video conferecne anytime they want.I see this as very telling.
          There are other things going on, but this post is too long as it is.  Just keep you eyes open, and we may not have to worry about this fiat dollar much longer.  But we will have plenty of other things to worry about.  Good luck.

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    20. Jeff says:

      [ Good luck with the silver hoarding]   I’m  not hoarding, I’m saving. Thanks netranger and greaseman for the comeback. The Comex is going down sooner than we want to admit. If you remember the collapse of ’08 and study the fall of Lehman and Bear Sterns (that started it)you will realize all we did was kick the can down the road. I firmly believe 2011 is the yr SHTF. March, specifically. If you want to buy silver, fine. If not, fine. Those with limited means and have prepared themselves will be fine. C’mon guys. This is starting to sound like a have and have not dispute. We are better than that. Everyone here will be vastly better prepared for whatever tomorrow brings. Amen, yes ?

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    21. AndyB says:

      At lot of you are missing the fact that our gov’t has been preparing since before 911 for the SHTF scenario.  911 just gave them the excuse to clamp down via DHS, TSA, etc.  The terrorist is really just a straw man to enviscerate the  Bill of Rights; do we really have any of our rights left?  The end game will be known by the elites.  When you hear about troops being redeployed, or overseas bases closed, or a sudden unexpected willingness to guard our borders, you will have at least a few weeks to prepare before the banks close and there are TSA or SEIU monitor goons on every corner.  Lists of “dissidents” have already been prepared; don’t for a second believe that they haven’t been; if a few of your vocal anti-government neighbors suddenly disappear, then get ready.  The Washington Post did a great series on the absolutely amazing expansion of agencies (in the DC area) specifically established for domestic surveillance (as they discovered).  Amazingly all the reporting died after a few days, never to be mentioned again.  So the oppressors are prepared.  IMO that cities will be war zones, and I wouldn’t put it past the Gov’t to patiently put the troops’ experience in Iraq cities to good use, ie. controlled genocide.   Isn’t it interesting that Google is in bed with the NSA?

      In the end game we will certainly be overpowered, staying might not be an option.  Thankfully I have relatives in Canada.

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    22. Jeff says:

      My wife just came in and told me on the news a gas station is offering gas for .20 gal if you pay with pre ’64 coins. He has been doing this for 4 yrs.The consciousness of real money is coming to america….

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    23. Bankokslim says:

      Good Luck to you Leperchauns sitting on your pots of gold !  These are much different times with much more  weapons on the streets.

      The people who will be trading and killing each other for silver/gold will be the pirates, thugs, and militias. Which group will you be a part of…? I’ll give you two shillings for your girlfriend and a loaf of bread please.  Thank you sir…

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    24. Patriot One says:

      Wow that’s direct and to the point. On my way home tonight I got stuck on the ICW bridge because the draw bridge got stuck in the open position. No signs saying the bridge was closed, no police directing traffic, nothing. At that moment I had absolute clearity; The government sucks at everything!

      I could only count 3 things I thought the government was ok at, Fire, Police and Military. With the exception of these three entities government is an absolute Failure. They can’t even do the most basic functions, maintain the bridges, highways and roads.

      Its time for a restructoring and we basically need to erase entitlements, laws and regulations for the last 100 years. I know that’s pretty radical, but it must be done.

      The roads are all leading to systemic financial collapse. And just like the ICW bridge tonight there will be no warning signs, no police directing traffic and almost everyone will be trapped on a bridge to nowhere.

      Barter will be the new currency and in the early years PM’s will have little value. Bullets, Beans and Bandaids will be worth there weight in gold.

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    25. grannyb says:

      Jeff – I’m with you. My gut instinct has been really getting sharp that 2011 is the year. But why do you think March is the month? Jeez, I’d like a little longer to finish some of my acquisitions…think Berkey filter, windmill for the water well, a solar oven…

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    26. Dboy says:

      “Thankfully I have relatives in Canada.”

      Ah yes. I’m sure that a desperate and rapidly failing US government will be far too polite to steal Canada and it’s resources. That just wouldn’t be nice.

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    27. PortlandPrepper says:

      grannyb… You got to get your solar oven soon!  We got a Sun Oven for Christmas. That’s a neat idea and it really works! All you need is a little sunshine and you’re good to go. It even works on cloudy days. Hot enough to cook beef stew and biscuits! My wife got a great deal too at http://www.shelfreliancesanantonio.com/jmp/jmp_sunoven.php. Not only do they sell the oven we also bought a lot of freeze dried stuff from them. Love the freeze dried mushrooms and the cheese!!! Hmm…, we’ll have to try to make pizza in my Sun Oven next time.

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    28. Kevin Knowles says:

      Gas for .20 cents a Gallon if you pay with Pre-1964 Coins – GREAT ive got lots of pre 1964 penny rolls I need to get rid of!!!!

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    29. Comments…..@Netranger…right-on!  Survival is tribal!

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    30. @ERICA
      All roads lead to Rothschild

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    31. @GREASEMAN
      I have read that too, that come March 15th the gig is up and the secret of there is a lack of deliverability of silver is going to be found out.
      I have also heard about something this govt did many years ago that made them a corporation adn no longer the de jure govt but in fact a de facto govt. and that the wolrd court is going to hear the case and other countries are backing those pushing it and a interim govt is already in place just waiting for our current de facto govt to turn the lights off so to speak? And that Hillary had  a meeting with the joint chiefs of staff adn that was when she found out she had to call back the embassadors…but sje isnt talking about the meeting with the JCof S.

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    32. GA Girl says:

      @Greaseman
      Where else can I find out about this new currency and abolishing the Fed?  I heard Celente’s web talk show about it.  When will it happen?  Is it for real?  Is it a good thing? 
      What is the meeting with Hillary about when she called in all the ambassadors?  I can’t find out.

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    33. just me says:

      in this order have a couple yrs supply of water,wheat,sugar,rice,coffee,canned veg,canned meat, and all the seasonings,tools to process the stuff, A weapon to protect and keep it, at least 30 pounds of junk silver or eagles and a cold chisel to cut pieces off the silver as there won’t be any change, just bartering, after you have the above and the S hasn’t HTF, do it all again plus learning all you can about surviving on your own as there won’t be any soup lines,no law for you to suck up to, no neighbor or friends you can trust, there’ll be just you and yours.

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    34. emptyhandkiller says:

      NetRanger and greaseman….  All I can say is “Wow!”   Both great posts.   All I can hope for when the disaster hits is this…  Frantic pounding on my door.  I open it to see 10 shivering, almost naked cheerleaders.  They say, “We are hungry and afraid!  Let us in and we will be your slaves!”  I guess my disaster would be over then!

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    35. Lady Hawk says:

      Hey, can’t we all just get along????  
      Net Ranger – well stated.  greaseman – ditto. 
      What I like about this site is on the whole we can disagree and still be civil.  On the subject of PM’s,  I really don’t see that we are that far apart.  It seems we are disagreeing more on the priority and the when in our prepping tactics to acquire, not that they are not needed.  And for many of us, that comes down to finances and we are all in different circumstances. 

      I give a pat on the back to the posters here as they have had the foresight to evaluate events and determine there is trouble head and make plans to address it.  They walk the talk by putting their cold hard cash, time and efforts into prepping which requires staying on top of events, planning, inventoring,  skill development and practicing – true commitment to the cause.  Which 90% of the population is unwilling to do. 

      If our goal is to get to the river, there can be more then one way to get there.  Some paths are smoother and straighter then others.  So, can we agree to disagree on when to PM and move on?  I appreciate posts explaining how PM’s are acquired and used pre, during and post SHTF events.  I can just do without the judgement that one is stupid or doesn’t love their family if not done their way.

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    36. Mike says:

      The ship is overloaded and ready to capsize at anytime.  We could go from our “recovery” to code red is a matter of 24 hrs.  Do you want to be one of the people with acquistions to be made in a horrible panic, or be the cool-headed individual who just has to get to the gas station to top off his/her gas tank.  When the ship goes down,  there are going to be a lot of rats chasing a little nibble of cheese.   Bullets, beans, bandaids and bullion or die like the rats…

      Mike

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    37. Lady Hawk,  I appreciate your peacemaking ways.  :)  I’ve always resented anyone who thinks they have the “right” way to do something.  There are usually numerous valid methods to approach things.

      I get that people are hurting, some might be hungry, others might have lost money or jobs, and many are upset about the way things are going. BUT, this doesn’t mean we should go ahead and dispense with civility before the SHTF. Neither does it mean that there is no place for it afterwards.

      Sure, things would be different,  but you still catch more flies with honey. In fact, I’ll be much more likely to sling some lead at assholes post-collapse.  Civility is a virtue and is what we should all hope to preserve as one of our highest values if anything ever does happen.  Listen to me gettin all preachy. :)

      *this is where some of y’all jump in and tell me how being civil when the SHTF get’s my family killed*

      I’m not saying you don’t watch your ass , I’m just saying that holding on to the virtues that make our civilization great now AND then,  is valuable and might be our saving grace.

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    38. I appreciate it too Skeptic, thanks Lady Hawk. Many are going to panic in a bad way adn long before I do believe that a lot of people will lose civility as you put it. They will be all about themsleves and I think  in the long run that is going to back fire on them. I understand fully all about taking care of yourself and family first, but many are going to take that to a different kind of spirit that is not very American as far as our traditions and are going to be down right ugly in the worst way.

      Listen to this all of you who have been helping me and coaching me in the area of silver…..I really feel stupid now and most of you are probably going to laugh your butts off at me.

      I put an ad on Craigs list in my area saying I would pay 20x fv for pre 65 coins. I mean after all, according to many in here that I was listening to, there hard to find, so I didn’t think there would be that many. HA!!! I get an email an hour later…the guy has:
      38 halves
      10 dollars
      4 older halves
      36 quarters 
      7 dimes
      and one silver eagle

      thats like over 800$  krikies…I don’t have that much money, I was thinking of spending around 300$ on silver…LMBO
      I am afraid to email him back, I don’t even know what the heck to say

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    39. Tony says:

      For the record I purchased more food storage today.

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    40. Anonymous says:

      Comments…..
      @GA girl    for more info, refer back to BJ’s post.  he mentions other details also.   There is a lot coming down soon.  To me, it seems like things have reached critical mass.  There has been so much crooked stuff  going on, it’s like a cat trying to cover up his crap–you can only do it so long before people find out. If anyone wants more info, youtube is probably the best place I know to keep up with what’s going on.  Things are happening lightning fast, and I have trouble keeping up with the speed of  events’ changings myself.
            I have also noticed that the main stream media is even picking up on a few things that they would have never told about in times past.
           Things are changing folks, and most of this change is to the next state of collapse.  I believe we have already collapsed, but most aren’t aware of it.  As long as the entitlements  keep coming, most just go on each day like nothing is different.
           Soon enough, the powers that be won’t be able to hide the severity of the situation anymore.  Just follow your plan, and keep plugging away. That’s about the best we can do right now.  good luck, we’re gonna need it.

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    41. Davidus Romanus says:

      People.  Keep in mind that there are a lot of levels of SHTF.  Remember, TSHTF in Zimbabwe when their currency became worthless.  As soon as other money was legal to use, things started getting back to some semblance of normality.  Though few prospered, lots survived.  TS also HTF in Weimar Germany when their currency became worthless.  Few prospered, but lots survived, even though it helped Hitler come to power and TSHTF even worse two decades later.  Even in the cataclysm of WWII Germany, many survived.  How about France in 1789?  TS really HTF then.  Again, few prospered, but many survived.  Now, if the Yosemite Volcano erupts with the big one and covers half the USA with an inch or more of volcanic ash, you will see millions die (possibly hundreds of millions) and all bets are off.  But if there’s hyperinflation and the dollar becomes worthless, that’s significantly less catastrophic, and, while there are certainly no guarantees, a reasonably prepped person (group/family/community) can at least have a chance of coming through.  It will certainly be tough on many, and few will prosper.  Most however, will survive.

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    42. LowProfile says:

      Comments…..Hey, BJ.  You don’t have to buy ALL of it, just what you can afford.  Do what you can with what you have.

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    43. GA Girl says:

      Went to the doctor today that I only see once a year.  4 doctors have left the practice due to the economy ruining their profits.  So many have lost jobs and gone on Medicaid that they are not making a profit.  They are barely paying the staff and my doctor has not taken much pay all last year.  He said he’s not sure if they will be able to stay afloat or not.  I was shocked.  I think our country is a lot worse off that our government has been letting on.  I’ve known that for a long time, but this was shocking.

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    44. Lots of good stuff here.
      All I can say is have your priorities sorted now.

      FOOD
      WATER
      BARTER
      SECURITY
      SHELTER (DEFENSIBLE)

      The REAL question you should all be asking is….Got Militia?

      From our recent unit Muster:
      1) We are a “survivalist oriented” Militia Unit. (We are not military and cannot compare ourselves to professional soldiers. Our preparations and training will focus more on survival and less on going toe to toe with Regulars. We are NOT a special forces team and cant expect members to act like one. We CAN train to a level of competent marksmen and skirmishers, this will allow us to face any looters/bandits/gangs with confidence and make them regret entering our AO.)

      2) Our FIRST priority in any scenario is to protect, secure and establish our Families in a “Safe Zone” You already know what retreat your family needs to get to.

      3) Our SECOND priority is to eliminate any local threats to our retreats.

      4) Our THIRD priority is to support other Militia Units around the US as we can.( This means that we may send a fireteam or squad of volunteers to help other units in a SHTF scenario. ( This group will be made of volunteers who trust the rest of us to take care of their families while they are gone. Volunteers would only be sent once OUR families are secured, and if such a mission would not leave our retreats short handed.)

      5) Our FOURTH priority is to support any Pro-Constitution Leaders or Groups we can, even in the middle of a SHTF or WROL scenario.

      6) Our FIFTH priority is to communicate and pass news/intel via HAM to other Patriots/ Survivalist Groups//Units in a SHTF
      scenario.

      7) Our SIXTH priority is to establish LONG TERM survivability of our retreats. ( This includes growing our own food, making our own fuel, establishing our own home businesses. ( Tool Shop, Crafting, Trading Post, Sewing and Tailoring etc.)

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    45. Now another guy contacted me and he has 125 quarters pre 1965….geeesh, there is plenty of silver coins up here. Just wish I had about 1450.00$ I would have me a good bag by now  :-(

      I still am embarassed and not quite sure what to tell them since I can’t buy everything they have??

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    46. truth in dangerous times says:

      All of you are being hunted by the U.S. intelligence/LE apparatus.  This massive spy operation intercepts every plain text packet sent anywhere on the internet anywhere in the Western world (and most other places too).  Those packets are then parsed, filtered, and sorted by massive databases into profiles of virtually every internet user.  The fact that you are here means your name is already on a list.  Most of you are hopelessly incompetent with technology and the intelligence/LE apparatus is funded in the hundreds of billions of dollars with the most technologically gifted people in America either working directly for them, or co-opted via outsourcing to companies like Google (Google built dozens of systems for the NSA and DHS).

      For those that of that understand the extent of the American police state apparatus, our free speech is chilled as we are afraid to speak our minds lest the 4 am SWAT team come knocking on our door.  Most of you are protected only by your ignorance and incompetence.  But how long will those protect you?  How long until they decide they’ve had about enough of your stock piling of guns and ammo?  How long until they decide all those Ron Paul/Tea Party/military veterans they’ve already labeled domestic threats need to be rounded up?

      The internet is nothing but a giant spy drag net and your supposed “rights” under the constitution mean nothing to these people.  You’ve been warned.

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    47. shoemaker says:

      BJ – I don’t know, but I like something that is really liquid.  Like silver rounds.  We have a coin shop in town that buys and sells — the difference between asking and selling price is fairly low, so I know there is a lot of trading of 1oz silver rounds.  I could get dollars (like crisp $10 bills) out of them anytime during business hours.  

      How easy is it to find a buyer of your pre-65 coins?  

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    48. Not sure…I was planning on holding on to them for when SHTF for the during and after.

      I am not sure what to buy the lowers like quarters and dimes or halves and dollars. I would think the smaller the denomination the better. If silver really shoots up there to 170.00 like some are predicting could happen, then buying with a silver round worth 170 is hard when what you want is only 20.00 worth….am I on the right track or am I not seeing it correctly?

      and whats the difference between silver dollars, silver eagles and rounds??

      Again thanks folks

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    49. Harry Bawls says:

      EHK, your hands wouldn’t be empty then….

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    50. greaseman says:

      Comments…..   In answer to some questions about which is the best silver to buy , and so forth.  As far as silver goes, there is no basic difference between a US silver dollar, and a one ounce round.  They both contain an ounce of silver.  BUT, in some post SHTF situations, I think the silver eagle will be more readily accepted for trade.  The premium on a silver dollar right now is over $2.50 I think.  The preminum on a silver round is about $1.50 or so.  In most cases, I pay the extra, and get the eagles.  Just my preference.  And later down the SHTF road, when silver is over $100 pre ounce, an extra dollar here or there isn’t going to make much difference in the big scheme of things.
           However, with that being said, my very favorite is just plain old pre 64 junk silver coins.  In a SHTF scenerio, a silver dime will buy you plenty, and they are easy to hide and transport. I buy the plastic tubes to store them in, and removal of a few is easy, and the tubes last forever. Plus, everyone knows what a dime , quarter, and half dollar are.  The only thing that someone might want to memorize, and get familiar with, is how much of each coin does it take to make an ounce of weight.  very important in situations with no electricity, or no internet access.  Calculations will have to be made on the fly, so a good knowledge of what’s what will come in handy.
           I’m one of those who believe that no matter how bad things get, there will be trade that develops between people, and some of that trade will include silver coins.  Even though someone might not ever sell their food for silver, they might sell other staples like sugar, or toilet paper, or salt.  Many other possibilities there.
           Bottom line for me with silver.  Buy the junk coins.  lowest preminum over spot, easiest trade ability when SHTF happens, very recognizable by all, easily transportable.
          One last thing to think about.  One of the local coin shops I frequent around me told me that now, he has many more peoople selling him their junk siklver coins, rather than people buying.  This tells me the economy is getting worse, and people want to take advantage of what they think is a high price for their silver.  So sad–If they’d wait a few more months, the price they receive for selling their silver would be double.  As soon as the COMEX crashes, silver will go into orbit.  soon–very soon.
           Happy hunting, and get your silver while you can.  it will never be this cheap again in our lifetime.

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    51. greaseman says:

      Comments…..   @ GA girl
      In answer to your questions about where to find out more about new currency coming.  Most of what I find out is from youtube.  If you search there, one vid will lead to another , then another, and so on.  I’m finding more vids posted regularily.    There is something going on.  I have been hearing the date of march 15th a few times.  Not sure though.  I subscribe to a poster named    connectingdots1
        he has regular vids with some new info each time. He’s my fav poster.   As I said, one vid will lead to another. That’s the way I keep finding more info.  There are also some web blogs talking about it.  Try a goggle searh using different terms, and see what you come up with.
         Good luck

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    52. @GREASEMAN
      It takes 14 dimes to make an ounce, 6 quarters and 3 halves. These all had to be rounded up. I alos learned that it takes 31 grams to make an ounce for precious metals instead of 28. Also it only takes 12 troy ounces to make a pound versus 16……I am learning  :-)

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    53. Carpenterbee73 says:

      @BJ, there are lots of places you can get pre1965 coins (90% silver).
      I have used Northwest Territorial Mint, and The Moneychanger (http://the-moneychanger.com/entry.phtml . This website has great info on silver. Highly recommend!).
      Get quarters and dimes only. That’s all you need. No need to get fancy. You pay more for halves. Smaller is better because it is more divisible (do you want to buy 1 loaf of bread at a time or 50?) ;)
      Never buy eagles or maple leaves, etc. You will never get that premium back, and it is high. Most silver for your buck is junk silver (90%, pre1965).
      Rounds are 1-oz coins, minted by lots of different companies. Generic silver if you will, 99%. Many recommend these, too.
      For small quantities try ebay, too. My BIL has made lots of purchases this way.
      I recommend the Moneychanger. They’re great on the phone. Happy to answer all of your questions. Last time I called NWT they said there were lots of people waiting to place their orders so they couldn’t answer my questions. Buy or go away, pretty much.
      You will always be able to sell your silver without a problem.
      Don’t pay too much above spot. There is no shortage (yet)!

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    54. Carpenterbee73 says:

      @BJ: We’ve been studying silver coin investments for over 2 yrs now. Sorry if I sound bossy! Just want to help my fellow SHTFers, as I have obtained invaluable info from all as well! (Ok, almost all.)

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    55. James Woroble Jr says:

      The Silver Bears Are Here Again, Explaining Why Blythe Has A Problem

      The bears are back summarizing the most recent developments in the silver market including backwardation, some insider “conspiracy theories”, the Comex’ paper to physical imbalance, the coming endgame, and what all this means in terms of options for one Kamakayz [sic] Bernank.

      http://www.zerohedge.com/article/silver-bears-are-here-again-explaining-why-blythe-has-problem

      —-

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