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    When the Time Comes, You Will Have a Defining Moment

    Norse Prepper
    April 24th, 2013
    SHTF Plan
    Comments (263)
    Read by 17,026 people

    This article has been generously shared with SHTFplan readers by regular community contributor Norse Prepper.

    In the movie Tin Cup, Roy McAvoy played by Kevin Costner states “I hit it again because that shot was a defining moment, and when a defining moment comes along, you define the moment… or the moment defines you.”

    Looking forward there are going to be many defining moments that will arrive at your doorstep and you better be prepared to act or others will act for you.  Knowing what you will do in these moments will make all the difference in the world.  If and when the SHTF, preppers will be better off than 99 percent of the masses because it was expected.  It was prepared for and decisions have been made for months to years ahead of time of what will need to be done if…it…happens.  Preppers won’t be in a panic such as what we saw in the wake of hurricane Sandy, they were prepared.  Having these decisions made ahead of time will lead to an increased level of sanity when the world has become insane around them.

    There are a multitude of different scenarios that could play out.  I believe it will help people to have a plan for when they do.  It would be impossible to be comprehensive in this article, however the following are three key scenarios we should all be prepared to face.

    Defining Moment #1:  What if comprehensive gun control laws are passed

    What if the government passes laws that ban the possession of a gun you have?  As we all know, there is a major push across this nation by the left to ban different types of guns, ammunition, magazines and the list goes on and on.  These laws go against everything the founding fathers of the United States meant when they passed the 2nd Amendment guaranteeing our rights to bear arms.  That being said, what if the government bans them anyways?  We only need to look as far as the state of New York to see that it is happening, Constitutional or not.

    A defining moment with respect to this scenario will be if a law is passed that says you have 30 days to hand in all of your guns, ammunition and magazines with the penalty of non compliance being felony charges and imprisonment.  It is already unlawful for a felon to be in possession of a firearm.  By not handing the government your weapons, if discovered you too will become a felon.  What are you doing on day 30?  Will you comply and line up to throw your guns on the pile and walk away a law abiding citizen, knowing full well that you are also now in position to become a victim to the violent act of a criminal who didn’t care about the law?

    It is easier for someone to say “Out of my cold dead hands!!!” than it is to actually prevent that from happening.  With the big brother state of government that we live in, it is hard to believe that they don’t know where a lot of the guns are; however I do recognize that they have no idea where most guns are.  What if they decide that they will start checking residences of people who recently purchased firearms, but did not report them or turn them in?  When they arrive at your door what will you do?  We need only look to the door to door searches by armed police to see that in a crisis, the government does not feel the 4th Amendment is valid.

    You can have all of the web gear you want, an arsenal of firearms at your disposal, but present one example of a swat team that has not been able to take a residence when ordered to do so.  Face it, they aren’t going to send Barney Fife over to collect.  If they believe you are armed and are going to cause a problem, it will be more like what happened to 46 year old Terry Porter when he told someone that he was a prepper and that he was irritated that Obama got elected.  If they want to be in your house, they have the means, method and ability to do it.  The gun confiscation after hurricane Katrina is another example of what can happen when martial law has been declared.

    If all of America thumbed their noses at the law it would be a different story, but I believe most will comply with the law out of fear of being throw in jail.  Just look at how there was nobody moving during the Boston lock down.  Parents will need to make a decision as to whether they want to comply and allow their firearms to be confiscated or turn them in and be able to continue to protect and provide for their families as best they can.  This can’t be done while in prison or after they are dead.  Most will be thinking to themselves that they want to remain out of prison and will justify turning in their guns because it is extremely hard to get employment with a felony charge on your resume.

    I pray that such legislation doesn’t come to pass, but I am also a realist.  There will be new gun legislation passed and if not, the likelihood of executive orders mandating the same will come to pass.  Maybe it will be whittled down to just closing some loop holes at gun shows, but maybe it will be escalated to full blown disarmament.  I am not advocating you to do anything either way, that is your decision.  I am just saying know what you will do prior to the defining moment based upon your situation.

    Defining Moment #2:  Friends and neighbors in need in a post SHTF scenario

    Preppers are, by definition, prepared people.  It is also well known that most people are not prepared.  Most typically have a week or maybe two weeks of food stored away.  They have little to no means of providing food when store shelves are bare or electricity if the grid does down and actually believe that the government could not let anything like this happen.  But what if it does?

    Imagine a scenario of an EMP going off such as in the book “One Second After”.  The technology exists.  What will you do when your neighbor shows up on your doorstep with his six year old little girl at his side pleading for help?  It will be obvious within a month who is being well fed and whose rib cages are starting to show.  As I wrote in a previous article, “Is a stranger more likely to watch their children starve or are they more likely to tell their wife “I’m going to get us some food and will return with it or die trying.”

    The prepared need to ask a different question. When they arrive at my doorstep, what will you do? Will you give them some of your preps as charity? Every meal you give out gets you closer to the time when you will be telling your family, as you head out the door, “I’m going to get us some food and will return with it or die trying.” This is a huge decision to make because we need to have resolve in our minds what we are going to do when this day comes. In a SHTF situation there can be no indecisiveness.

    I’m not talking about the neighbors charging your door with a battering ram like in the Twilight episode entitled “The Shelter” that can be viewed on Youtube.  I’m talking about a peaceful knock on your door asking for help.  Will you give him some of your supplies, moving you closer to the point where your family may become malnourished?

    By handing over food or supplies, you are also telling him that you have enough to view what you gave him as extra.  Your gift will only get them fed for a few days before they are out again.  Guess where they may decide to come knocking?  What if you see the neighbor’s little girl picking and eating carrots out of your garden?  Do you kick her off of your property as though she is a thief instead of a starving child?

    I dread the day that this scenario takes place, but preppers can be more prepared to face it after much consideration.  I hope all that are preparing are also preparing for some form of charity as well.

    What will you do when this defining moment takes place?

    Defining Moment #3:  The zombie’s are out

    Let’s face it.  The current financial path of our country is completely unsustainable and there likely is no way out without a reset occurring.  We are on the cusp of reaching the debt limit of our country.  Foreign countries are moving away from trading between themselves utilizing the greenback.  Even historical allies such as Australia have struck deals with China to trade in their own currencies.  The amount of our currency in circulation around the world is staggering because many are still using it as the world currency.  These days are likely numbered.

    Already there are agreements in place between countries to trade utilizing their own currencies.  China has been hoarding gold for years with the intention of replacing the US dollar with a gold backed yuan in as the new world currency.  It will be backed by something tangible instead of a promise.  If you are a foreign country, which currency would you prefer to use?

    If and when this scenario takes place, all bets are off.  No longer will other countries be willing to send us commodities that are worth something to receive back paper created by a print button.  There will be massive inflation with food and oil prices becoming unaffordable.  Stores will be emptied resulting in massive civil unrest.  Just imagine what would have taken place in the regions affected by hurricane Sandy if it wasn’t life as usual 100 miles inland?  If there wasn’t relief and aid flooding in to the area?

    Now imagine this on a nationwide scale.

    This defining moment scenario is featured on the Twilight Zone’s “The Shelter” scenario.  Good people will turn ruthless and do anything they need to do when it comes to protecting and feeding their families.  What will you do when they show up at your door?  Are you prepared to take a life to save yours?  Are you prepared to defend your property and family to the end?  This is a SHTF nightmare situation where people will lose their sense of civility; a world where the fit and prepared will survive and the weak and unprepared won’t.  You may have your Mossberg on standby, but there is a huge difference between having it and pulling the trigger.

    As Clint Eastwood said in the movie Unforgiven, “It’s a hell of a thing killin’ a man. You take away all he’s got and all he’s ever gonna have.”

    What will you do when you experience your upcoming defining moment?

    I pray every day that these things never come to pass and that my children will be able to grow up in the land of the free and the home of the brave as I have.  But know this; you will have in your life a defining moment in the upcoming world we live in.  By taking some time now to write down different scenarios and analyze your response to different situations you will at least have the luxury of defining the moment on your terms instead of the alternative where you allow the moment to define you.

    I look forward to the discussion and different scenarios that you can envision that are possible defining moments.

    As always,

    God Bless

    Norse Prepper

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    Author: Norse Prepper
    Views: Read by 17,026 people
    Date: April 24th, 2013
    Website: http://www.shtfplan.com/

    Copyright Information: This content has been contributed to SHTFplan by a third-party or has been republished with permission from the author. Please contact the author directly for republishing information.

     

    263 Comments...

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    1. NP, thanks so much for taking the time to put your thoughts on paper.

      I’ve ‘role played’ or ‘war gamed,’ if you will, all manner of scenarios over the years… I am sure there are many others who would say the same.

      I try to live by the adage ‘take your mind where it’s not supposed to go’ – and sometimes it scares the hell out of me.

      If we’re talking about truly desperate times coming to pass, I can only imagine how insane it will be… The scenarios you highlight about families, mine and my neighbors hit home… I never want to be put into a position where I’m left with no choice but to “die trying.” Perhaps it’ll come to that, but I am doing everything I can now reduce the odds of that happening.

      Likewise, the little girl stealing your carrots — or worse — what if the little girl’s parents just tried to break into your home and you were forced to shoot and kill in self defense? Then what? Take her in after she witnessed her parents get killed BY YOU? Do you send her packing? … some would consider extreme measures — something I simply could not do… That’s a horrifying thought for me, as what if the situation were reversed – and I was killed in the home raid – what will they do with MY kids?

      This is crazy stuff when you really delve into it.

      Thanks again for what I believe to be an extremely important exercise for the prepared mind.

      Mac

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      • Facebook Page says:

        Many of the armchair peppers here have no idea what is coming their way in the future. We are stupid humans we will find a way for the worst to happen.

        I seen what desperate people do for family. Some of it was unbelievable. First it will be the attack of the bored internet zombies. Then the starving zombies. Then the real evil one will start showing up.

        If you don’t come to terms with your trigger you are screwed. And your family will suffer and most likely die a painful death. Think it though.

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        • Prepared Pastor says:

          #1 I will voluntarily hand over any firearm for which there exists any evidence that I have purchased them. The survival retreat cannot be linked back to me and we could walk away from here with only the clothes on our backs as we would reach the first cache within a day.

          #2 Friends and neighbors are welcome to come here WTSHTF as they are now for localized disasters, but in the event of a world-changer they will be picking through the leftovers since by the time they figure out how bad it really is (compared to media), we will already be gone.

          #3 is somewhat curtailed by being in one of the lowest population band. When the time comes our retreat community will close the one road into our mountain holler at the bridge. In an area where self-sufficiency is the norm, we believe outsiders will be our greatest threat. Draw a line in the sand, put up some warning signs before it, and enforce the line.

          It is amazing what can be accomplished with the difference between the costs of a new vehicle and the $1,500 I spent on my 1989 F250 4WD Diesel.

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          • DRD5508 says:

            (just for fun): Are your posted signs in english only?

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            • DRD5508 says:

              Mac, agree with you on not wanting to make the hard choices or consider the ramafications of our actions or non actions. Because we’ll all be on high alert (tense) during the early stages of shtf. It is the long term where we’ll be really tested morally/ethically.
              PP, you’ll be safe for awhile at your retreat, as most of us will, but they’ll be gunning for us (tptb). By the grace of God, we’ll get through it.

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              • Barterman says:

                No one can know what to do untill the times comes. We,ll handle each day as it comes, do our best and know that in the end were just passing through this life. Peace Yall

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            • Jerry C says:

              also just for fun: The only sign I would post is: If you can read this, you’re in range.

              I would post them absolutely everywhere – even 1000′s and 1000′s of yards away… keeps everyone guessing and nervous…

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          • Indy Colts says:

            So what happens when an armed group shows up and just takes everything from your church? I believe GOD gives me the heart to prepp and the discernment of when I will have to protect my family. Putting a neon sign up at my house saying (FREE FOOD) isn’t going to help me survive.

            Your assumption is everyone will want to work together. There will be thugs in groups looking to pillege people like you and brass/lead will be the only detertant.

            GOD BLESS and pray for wisdom!

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            • Indy Colts says:

              This was supposed to be posted a couple more comments down in response to just saying.

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              • durango kidd says:

                100 million American gun owners hold the future of this nation in their hands. Organize, communicate, volunteer, donate, and vote. Reload if necessary.

                All politics are local. Get involved. Get vocal. Get LOUD! The organized squeaky wheel gets the grease. If you do not believe that, you must recognize that the G&L community comprises only 4% of the population, yet they are getting what they want.

                The Illegal community is getting what it wants.
                The Jewish community is getting what it wants.

                Those who tell you that voting doesn’t matter are liars and losers. Liars because it is not true. Losers because they will never get their way because they will not make the effort.

                Organized lobbying is the way to make your voice heard. Join Gun owners of America. Join a Tea Party in your neighborhood. Focus its attention on the US Constitution.

                Its a numbers game. 100 million American Patriots should control the dialogue and direction of this nation. Engage.

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          • Smokey says:

            If by closing the road at the bridge, you mean a blockade, that is just telling folks there are people on the other side with something to protect. You will need to drop the bridge, both ends, into the drainage.

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        • Justice says:

          Facebook page. You are correct, “think it through” and “come to terms with your trigger”. G-d help us all if it ever comes to having to squeeze the trigger and take a life in self defense. Hesitate and you’re dead.

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          • Like Mac has reflected, and as very few go the distance to correlate to the complete end game, either you do all that is required to survive or you are going to face someone else who is.

            It is THAT simple. Know before it comes is so important. As justice says, hesitate and you are dead and I dont plan to hesitate, whether I die or not.

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          • Mike says:

            I am not going to waste a lot of time and thought on what I should do because built inside all of us by our creator is the will to survive and live, we will do what we must!

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        • lower40 says:

          i think the first 5-10 days will be the most critical ,if you can only live 3 weeks with no food ,im guessing by the second week they arent going to be moving around so good ,i to would have compation for a starving child ,but not to the degree that i would jepordize my own children and grandchildrens live’s ,my family is the (ONLY) reason ive been getting prepared for the events that are coming our way ,ive been trying to cover all the basis to feed and protect them ,and because the dont worry be happy crowd has done nothing to prepare for there family ,is no fault of mine ,be it hard ,i could live with my self if that starving child died ,but ,if by feeding somone ,and taking food from my own family caused one of there deaths ,i could not live with my self ,if you jump in the water to save some one from drowning you maybe succesful ,if you jump in to save a crowd they will most definetly pull you under

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      • Just saying says:

        I have a neighbor that happens to be a preacher. If the worst happens, he will take the extra’s food allocations that members volunteer for the after church meals on Sundays and Wednesdays and we all get fed together at the church services.

        Give what you can and everyone gets something to eat. Lets hope my preacher neighbor can do as Jesus and have those fish we break, fill more buckets over and over.

        By this time, we all will need help from above and not just from each other.

        People won’t have to feel like anyone is singled out as all are contributing when there is an emergency. Make a game of it and have the hunters work on meats, fisherman work on their skill sets, if someone has a green thumb they can bring what they can provide. Ultimately we will ask the Preacher for increased help from God while we are providing for ourselves & others.

        At the end of this we should remain close neighbors.

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        • ENFP says:

          That is what I hope for in my rural neighborhood. We have to work together to produce necessities and defend against the migrating strangers from the cities.

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          • Kulafarmer says:

            Thats what I hope for too, we are rural, but have lots of neighbors close by, our island isnt like Oahu where there are over a million people,, our area is mostly old families who have lived here for generations, some not but they are mostly ALL good people. I dont mind growing food and sharing with my neighbors and we all work together to keep things safe, that is what it will take,
            there are folks who have livestock and game on their property, many of us who farm, some who are in the medical profession, even a couple doctors, suffice to say lots of abilities, and even for those who dont have extrordinary ability, they can still run a hoe or carry a bucket,
            scenario #1, Im not going there,,, too many pitfalls in that discussion

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            • John W. says:

              Sounds like you live on kauai. If so you are one lucky individual. Even the North Shore of Oahu would be nice until all the people from Honolulu come running over the Pali.

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              • Kulafarmer says:

                Maui, got a few more people than Kauai, but will be manageable from many aspects, hard part will be retraining the riff raff that doesnt know how to play nice.

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        • Prepping Preacher says:

          why don’t YOU ask for increased help from God NOW and have more to contribute when the time comes..??? not trying to be caustic but the Preacher is not the only one with that has access to God in time of need…

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          • PuppyPrepper says:

            Amen!

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          • Kulafarmer says:

            Preacher,
            Along the lines of what you just mentioned, i want to not only ask for further guidance from God, but also
            Want to build a community of like minded folks locally working toward a more self sufficient and sustainable, most likely healthier lifestyle as well.
            I dont think it all needs to end in a hail of bullets, at least not here in the islands,
            If we can band together and share knowledge, build community and possibly build up a system of like minded folks who want to be closer to their food, better connected, working to eat more healthy etc maybe we can get it rolling, not sure, maybe not, but figure i would reach out and see what sort of input i get, am starting to try this in my circle here at home too but want to plant the seed wherever i can, will hopefully come up with a web connection soon.
            Aloha

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        • Gregory8 says:

          Just saying: Most folks are what I call ‘convenient christians’. They’re christians as long as it doesn’t interfere with their daily lives, and in particular, their survival. But you and your neighbor sound like an actual/real christians in that you’ll do what is right, especially when it’s inconvenient. Thank you.

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        • Sad to say but some of the ones Id fear the most are church members in good standing…not painting with a broad brush but I spent alot of years building/planting churches and alot of time telling folks that God expects us to do what we can and what we know to do and that faith is action not an excuse…got me the left foot of fellowship on more than one occasion…be careful of who you trust and why you trust them…what may be the truth to you and a statute on which you would rather die standing on it than to violate it may be to another just a means to an end…it could be your end if you dont judge wisely!

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      • Nice NP. In the end it will all be about character, morality, preparation, ethics and a conscious. Those who have the right measurements in the right proportions of each will be the leaders and the survivors. Or more aptly put they will be the leaders of the survivors.

        BigB

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        • JustOneGuy says:

          Howdy BigB,

          All good observations Friend…As an aside here, I too have a hard time remembering what the spelling is for the word ‘conscience’…tis easily rememebred with memory device ‘con-science’ ‘con’, with the word ‘science’…I too damn near always do it the other way…incorrectly. :(

          JOG

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      • Heretic Historian says:

        We got into this position one step at a time and that is basically how we will get out, though time is running out. We accepted all of the current conditions, one at a time. We have given them authority where there is none. We have believed in their dream so we could have a piece of a bogus fantasy they sold us. In the process, they taught to separate from one another, to pick and choose who we would give our love, affection and service to, amongst our human kind. They created various forms of competition (commerce, sports, even religion) and we lapped it up like a sponge because it made us feel special, important. Now we are contemplating how we will react to our fellow man when our masters flip over their monopoly board and send us scattering.

        Engage the mind. Disengage the system. Figure out who “they” is.

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        • John Galt says:

          Stop blaming “they”and “them” and start accepting responsibility yourself for the state this country is in

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          • Gregory8 says:

            John Galt: It is our fault because we think everyone else’s congressman and senators are crooks and assholes but our’s deliver the ‘goods’ to us so we’ll keep voting for our guys. The whole thing is a game to pit everyone against everyone and keep moving groups around so we can’t get a handle on who are ‘opponents’ really are.

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      • Kindle says:

        Norse Prepper, really good article with lots to think about. Over the years when I was trying to sort through some of these dilemmas you presented it helped me to read lots and lots of post apocalyptic books.

        I’ve read over 100+ PA books so far and enjoy all the different perspectives and scenarios presented by them. In a couple of them “children” were used in devious ways by irresponsible parents. In a few others orphaned
        “children” became your worst nightmare.

        A starving child could be used to get you to open the door and then the hiden bad guys rush in.

        A starving child could be used to get you to let them on to your property where they do surveilance of your OPSEC.

        An “orphaned” child is used to get you to take them in out of the goodness of your heart. They do recon and report back to bad guy (parents) and later unlock your doors and gates and let bad guys in.

        A starving orphaned child distracts you and occupies your emotions while his 20 other buddies are sneaking up on you and yours.

        Reading these books helped open my eyes to the fact that not all “children” are innocent and helpless. Since so many people have the weakest of spots for children this weakness can be used against you.

        It’s kinda like the family dog that is so loving and harmless when times are good. When owners stop providing for them they can form packs and become extremely vicious.

        I still haven’t found the right answer to this one but reading Pa books helped me to understand that your personal weaknesses and emotions can beccome your worst nightmare if you let your guard down.

        Just some thoughts.

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        • egore says:

          And what do you do when the little girl coming across the field toward your house is carrying a box that the bad guys told her he would let her momma go free if she delivered it to you. And you know it is a bomb. These are the things that will keep you awake nights thinking about.

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          • Mike says:

            Don’t think about them, think about your wife and kids..We don’t always get to throw the dice but we don’t have to lay the bet….Sleep sound!

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        • Not so Much says:

          “In a couple of them “children” were used in devious ways by irresponsible parents. In a few others orphaned
          “children” became your worst nightmare.”

          Could you pleae name the books? I’d like to read those.

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        • “It’s kinda like the family dog that is so loving and harmless when times are good. When owners stop providing for them they can form packs and become extremely vicious.”

          …and TASTY!!!

          In a situation like what we are talkinga bout, those packs of dogs will be a source of protein.

          All of this thinking about scenarios. What if we just hit a slow simmer and simply boil dry, eventually. No, we don’t have a sudden shock. The dollar just gets weaker and weaker and weaker and weaker. No big slump. Not crash. No shocks. Not a “race to the bottom” but and wander to the bottom.

          Guess what? WE ARE DOING IT! Sure, there could be a blow up but the slow burn is more like it.

          I heard a guy say today, “I just can’t get these people (referring to those who have a job and a bigscreen TV) to realize its going to continue to get worse.”

          Its when I had a defining moment: At this point it is not our job to try and “convert” these people. Oh, if you find someone you think will convert, certainly try, but, don’t feel bad if you can’t get them to cross the fence and come out of the field of normalcy bias.

          Remember This: Gently plant a seed. When things get bad enough and their internet gets shut off, they lose their job, the cops raid their home, etc, etc, they’ll think in the back of their minds, “Hmmm. Someone told me about this!!!” and then they’ll be hungry for the truth you can give them. Remind them who the enemy is.

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      • tbone says:

        A little off subject but in the same vein,
        What happened to the life changing events that Glen Beck was set to put into motion if Obama did not fess up to some evil doings?

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        • tuesdayissoylentgreenday says:

          10/4

          Where is the changing event????

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          • you don't need to know says:

            @tbone, Beck blames it on the zombie media for not reporting his findings. That the Lame stream media isn’t covering bc it’s conspiracy, which is no surprise.

            I think I’m over Beck. He used to be much better, but has gone all world peace now.

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        • John W. says:

          He did. No one who matters cares. Without the media to make a big deal of it any issue will simply disappear. We now have state run and aligned media, nothing good has and will come of this.

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      • JayJay says:

        You do what the community in ‘One Second After’ did..you do what you have to do to survive.
        And then bury them in the golf course!!!

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      • Free ell says:

        Mac. You are right about mentally putting yourself in a situation. Sports, military, leadership, etc all add to their training the same way. During my short time here, I have seen a lot of people say what they would do in situations. The potential situations are endless. Killing desperate people, kids, mentally ill, low functioning, old people would not be easy. When the time comes, you are best off going far away or totally blending in. I will do anything I can to not put myself in a position to kill. I am not saying to be timid. I am concerned that some here will let all the naysayers know that we were right. Don’t draw any attention before or during a crisis.

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        • Free ell, there are weapons and ammunition of none lethal force that can be used against the ones you don’t want to kill. A 410 shell reloaded with rock salt worked to keep we kids out of the neighbor’s watermelon patch, it still will dampen a trespasser’s initiative very quickly. Then you can step it up a notch and use rubber or plastic bullets, then move on to rat shot in a 22, or bird shot in the 410 at a distance. Of course if things get out of control, your Barrett 82A1 and Benelli Tactical Super Nova are locked, loaded, and near at hand so you can just shoot the more aggressive slow to learn big ones.

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      • snake eater says:

        Good Job N P

        now i have a question for all that come here,,to read and post,,,

        when are we the people going to put a stop to all this bull crap????????????????when is enough, enough???someone please call me my # is BR 549A

        snake

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      • Grey Owl says:

        ‘Sounds Like Tinley Being Bombed’: Residents Speak Up on Warfare Drills

        From people upset at being kept awake by explosions and helicopters to conspiracy-minded theorists with their own explanations, Tinley Park citizens were outspoken on the Defense Department’s urban training exercises. Read what they had to say.

        Pages of twitter feed.

        http://tinleypark.patch.com/articles/sounds-like-tinley-being-bombed-residents-speak-up-on-warfare-drills?ncid=newsltuspatc00000001

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      • My answer to question #2 involves having a piece of land. If you have some land, you can always store a bin with grain, and then offer anyone who asks, a days grain for a days labor. This will allow them to have the self respect of paying for their keep, and will help you to produce the grain for harvest to replenish the bin. This is SUSTAINABILITY versus Survivability. Preps are well and good, but no matter how much food you have, it WILL run out! What then? This should be question #ONE, in my mind.

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      • Walt Kowalski says:

        I have no illusions about surviving this mess.

        The way I look at it…..you do the best you can do to prepare and take what comes.

        You hear stories about how people go through a horrendous catastrophe and they say, “I don’t know how I survived”.

        I suspect that will be the case for most who make it through this mess.

        There will be some who prepared…had a plan…worked the plan and made it. And there will be others who were totally oblivious to what was coming down……and yet they find a way to make it through.

        When it all comes down to it…it will be luck of the draw, and you play the hand you are dealt.

        For myself..I have certain lines that I’m not going to allow to be crossed. Again….I doubt I’ll survive defending those lines. So be it. But SOMEBODY has to draw the lines SOMEWHERE….or we will enter a new age of feudalism. A good article to reference regarding this is below:

        waronguns.blogspot.com/2007/04/guest-editorial-kill-all-they-send.html

        And this:

        “And how we burned in the camps later, thinking: What would things have been like if every Security operative, when he went out at night to make an arrest, had been uncertain whether he would return alive and had to say good-bye to his family? Or if, during periods of mass arrests, as for example in Leningrad, when they arrested a quarter of the entire city, people had not simply sat there in their lairs, paling with terror at every bang of the downstairs door and at every step on the staircase, but had understood they had nothing left to lose and had boldly set up in the downstairs hall an ambush of half a dozen people with axes, hammers, pokers, or whatever else was at hand?… The Organs would very quickly have suffered a shortage of officers and transport and, notwithstanding all of Stalin’s thirst, the cursed machine would have ground to a halt! If…if…We didn’t love freedom enough. And even more – we had no awareness of the real situation…. We purely and simply deserved everything that happened afterward.”
        ― Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

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      • Rota Wolfman says:

        Very nice thoughts put out. Unfortunately, the only problem I have with it is this:
        “I pray every day that these things never come to pass and that my children will be able to grow up in the land of the free and the home of the brave as I have”

        Americans must realize that they are made slaves shortly after they are born.

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      • Ryback says:

        You have to ask yourself these questions; Will my own government hunt me down? Who will I have to defend myself aginst? Will there be a large group of like minded people that I can go to for support if the time comes? Will I be able to do what needs to be done in order to insure my survival and my familys.

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      • Barry Fupducked says:

        In your major metropolitan areas the only reliable source of food going forward will be human flesh. THAT will be the line in the sand, so the speak. This will be after Fido and Tinkerbelle disappear, along with anything else on four legs. Having your neighbor over for dinner will take on new meaning. (YIKES!)

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    2. Just saying says:

      Looks like gun control is coming at you form both the government and corporate interests directions at the same time.

      http://www.nbcnews.com/business/general-electric-halts-financing-gun-shops-6C9592611?gt1=43001

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      • Boss Hog says:

        Wow GE has some balls with that one, dont they hold most of the millitary contracts, I know we used a ton of their parts on choppers. It must be part of the new normal I missed.

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        • Gregory8 says:

          Boss Hogg: you got that one right-WHAT BALLS indeed! GE manufactures portions of all of our nuclear warheads. Talk about hypocracy!! Boycott GE!!!!

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          • Gregory8, I started boycotting GE decades ago by default. Their consumer products are among the most unreliable electronics made on American soil, so I don’t buy them.

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        • Dan Morgan says:

          Jeff Imelt and GE are close political allies with Obama Admin and are trying to gain as much favor with TPTB as possible. It would take balls for them to stand on principle, they’re just cock sure of a globalist future and the end of America and the Constitution.

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          • Gonetoolong says:

            I know it is small in contribution to the effort, BUT there will be no GE products in my house.

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            • Free ell says:

              GE owns numerous companies and controls hundreds of products. It will take a lot of research to identify all of them. It will be a matter of time before any business connected to guns in any way will be sued. That is not the motivation. GE is playing the polls. An organized boycott is two edged. Do you draw attention to them? That would be what they want. If you check GE holdings you will find a lot of controversial items.
              When it comes to dealing with the government, they will make an exception for money. You will also see regulations or laws protecting them.

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          • Fed Guy 20002 says:

            Dan Morgan

            While I for one was surprised that GE did this…If you or anyone else on this site think that the current administration and TPTB are either one in the same or have ANYTHING do to with each other…You are sadly mistaken…Anything you are aiming towards in the future with that misconception in mind should be shut down and a new plan of action taken…That is simply pure and utter nonsense …

            Fed Guy 20002

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            • Them Guys says:

              GE’s Jeff Imelt was apointed by hobammy as Jobs Czar if I recall correctly. Also I believe in first rnd of huge corporate Bailouts GE recieved at least $200-BILLION taxpayer(usa) backed cash bailouts. While the same year and likly too for prior yrs GE avoides all fed taxes while getting as much as $6-BILLION back from Fed Tax Cash Credits each yr!

              Imelt did at least use some of that massive cash bailout to create more jobs…Only it was ALL Jobs in CHINA at new GE plants etc. Existing China GE plants also I imageian. Oh, and as a side note Jeffery Imelt is a bonafide Tribe member also.

              To me that seems like quite alot of conections to hobammys administration no?

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    3. Norse Prepper says:

      Thank you for this media forum and the personal comments Mac. If the SHTF it will bring so many unforseen moments.

      Thank you again and God Bless,
      NP

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      • Oops says:

        Sorry NP. I fat fingered the neg button.

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      • Norse Prepper,

        Great article. Thank you!

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      • kimintn says:

        thank you NP for reminding us to think ahead regarding both our dignity and our humanity. it is very easy to be stiff-necked about preserving our families at the expense of others, but that is not what the bible teaches. regardless of what anyone’s beliefs are, you have called us all to think about our place and what legacy we will leave both our children, and our neighbor’s children, as they are the ones who will carry on. nicely done! :)

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        • kimintn says:

          and before the red thumbs hit… i am not judging if you turn in your arms or return fire, nor am i judging if you feed the child or turn her away, i am simply thanking NP for awakening us to think about our individual response. personal responsibility, regardless of choices, is what will get us through this.

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      • Daisy says:

        One of the things you didn’t mention is the fact that a HUGE percentage of the population is on some type of drug — drugs that will be unavailable in a SHTF situation. Those drugs include both legal and illegal mood-altering substances, and also drugs necessary for life, such as heart medicines and insulin. Those last will die quickly, but those on mood-altering drugs will become more dangerous than you can imagine. Don’t forget all those people addicted to legal substances such as alcohol and tobacco.

        I feel good about my preps (food, water, heat, and home security) as I live in an area that has low population and only three roads in. Also, over 25% of the population are Mormon and have a year’s supply of food stored, and many of the people I know who aren’t Mormon, also stock food. There are a lot of farm animals in the area.

        I talked to the gas company and the town’s emergency management co-coordinator and I have found out that the gas company operates their lines on energy produced by natural gas. They have reserves for several months. Out water comes from a well in the aquifer and is gravity fed. They don’t treat it and don’t have to do anything to keep it coming day after day and year after year. If necessary, I live a half mile from the river and have a couple of water purifiers, plus water stored. I also have an auxiliary heater that does not need electricity.

        But I think that the biggest risk is all the people who will be crazy and off their meds. Those people who are worrying about zombies are not worrying for nothing.

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        • Norse Prepper says:

          Good point Daisy. +1

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        • the cooking mom says:

          Daisy, actually the first few days they start coming off drugs, they
          Sleep a lot. The ones coming off mood stabilizer meds may get
          Very depressed and suicidal.
          it all depends on the Med or drug involved, but I see a lot of
          helpless beggar types coming out of this.
          I worked at a drug rehab for a while. Lies, cons, it’s a game.
          A small % were actually violent.

          Keep preppin’

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        • Not so Much says:

          “Also, over 25% of the population are Mormon and have a year’s supply of food stored, ”

          Be careful of that assumption. I’ve had several LDS friends over the past several years and it’s pretty unanimous that fewer than 10% of mormons actually do store food.

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          • Daisy says:

            To ‘Not so Much’

            Here is Wyoming, people are very religious. I was surprised when I moved here. I contacted our emergency management coordinator for advise (a Mormon, he says) and he referred me to the Senior Center, where they have equipped an emergency shelter with provisions, blankets, a generator, and lots of fuel. I mentioned that I had heard that 25% of the town is Mormon. She told me that it is more like 33% and almost all of them stock up. That is what I have observed. In fact, most people only buy food once a month because the nearest large grocery store is over an hour away.

            Here in our small town, our local grocer has available huge bags of rice, flour, beans, etc. and a large variety of long term storage in #10 cans (Augason Farms.) I notice there is quite a turnover of those items. Everyone stocks up on at least a month’s supply of food simply because of blizzards and the distance to the nearest supermarket.

            The senior center took my name and address since I am a senior living alone with no nearby relatives. She said in a grid down emergency they would send someone to pick me up. I don’t plan to leave my home, but it is good that the town has plans to care for its citizens if need be.

            Daisy

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            • Not so Much says:

              Here in Salt Lake City, people are pretty religious too. The mormons there may be prepared pretty well, but the mormons here tell me they are not.

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            • Daisy…when did you move?…to Wyoming?…last Id heard you were still in Canada at a new place in the country…did I miss something or are you a different Daisy….or am I misunderstanding…just curious…

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        • Fed Guy 20002 says:

          Daisy

          Prescription meds and the instant lack of them is a huge concern…There is no home remedy for these pills…There is no substitution for them…Prescription psych meds are not as easy to come off of as recreational pills or meth type chemicals…They alter the imbalances they were orig. prescribed to treat making the reverse of them almost impossible…Even more disturbing is how often and quickly without necessity folks are thrown on them…Most folks don’t even understand why or what they do…As long as they are covered by insurance or such they call it a day and begin the regimental dose …One would be surprised how many of the news stories they read and how many “conspiracies” begin with the story just sounding to weird to be real, “something else MUST be going on”…Well it is…And the true story usually starts and ends with these meds…Many children are now placed on these drugs before they even make it to 1st grade…They take them for life…Or…Until they can no longer find them…Then you have chaos…In general most drug dealers don’t deal these type drugs…Street access or bartering for such will not be an option then the doors are shut…

          Fed Guy 20002

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    4. Ted Kennedy says:

      If you think your dead. React on training.

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    5. JustOneGuy says:

      Excellent piece NP!!

      “Alles Klar Hier…Ja!!” :)

      “It is already unlawful for a felon to be in possession of a firearm. By not handing the government your weapons, if discovered you too will become a felon. What are you doing on day 30?”

      Hmmm, after careful consideration of the Nature of the “Right to Keep and Bear Arms” I have only this:

      “Our Father Who Art in Heaven, Hallowed be Thy Name,”

      “Forgive Me Father, For I have Sinned already in thy Sight and soon will do so again. Yea verily, we are Instructed to NOT allow Evil to thrive amongst us..yet it does, This must END”

      “I WILL meet that Evil Father…though it Costs dearly, Yea even My Life…and it will CEASE, Forever more,”

      “…Forgive Us our Trespasses as We Forgive those who Trespass against Us, Lead us NOT into temptation but DELIVER Us from Evil…”

      “…Fur Immer und Jamals…AMEN.”

      The RECKONING is soon at Hand, Prepare…What comes now will spread over the face of the Whole World…

      JOG

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    6. The Saint says:

      I have charity preps. I’m a single person. I couldn’t refuse someone food or drink. I most certainly couldn’t refuse a child. I would take a life to defend mine or another. I would hope I die before the suffering gets unbearable.

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    7. Be informed says:

      @ Norse Prepper. I have discussed this with many people, and what do you do? There is no simple answer. One approach is to remember that while the children have no wrong or right in the equation, the parents do and did. While you were storing up what you and your family needs, those others that had the money and resources did not by ignorant choice. They listened to BO, the mass media such as that clown piers morgan, and they made that choice to do nothing. The 99%.

      You look at the faces of your family and friends that are part of survival group that gave up life’s little “pleasures” so you can all be together for as long as possible. Yes, you need to be hard hearted for those around you that depend on you. There is so much political correctness crap that is going on and how you are some sort of monster for not self sacrificing your entire family for those that “lived it up” while they should have been putting away a little at a time. They have had 4 and 1/2 years since the last economic collapse and over 11 years since 9/11, with all sorts of emergencies of varying degrees of severity in between. The mass of supplies that COULD have been stored up, could have.

      You have to ask yourself, would these characters that are begging share what they have with you. In some cases yes, most NOT. You know why, because IF they did they would have had something for their families there in case of emergencies. Instead they chose to go ballgames, go to Chuck E Cheese, blow money on junk food and chinese junk and toys, and live life as entertainment is ALL that matters. Someone like this is as selfish as anyone that they consider will not share their food with them. IF they did not want to prep, then there was plenty of really needy people and animals that they could have shared their resources with at least some of the time than self indulgence. This may be cold, but let those people eat grass, weeds and tree bark. Might do them some good as at least it is health food right from nature.

      To those that understand the plight of children, you might want to save up a care package just for the kids. This would be used with the understanding that this is ALL that you have, period. After this time you have to realize that every last bit of supplies you give up, you are REDUCING your family’s chance of survival. This is raw math, but it is a fact. Which one matters more to you, your family or your neighbors or someone you don’t even know? Hard core decisions yes, but the answer should be very clear to most people.

      Another question you ask yourself is this one? Can I live with myself turning down a bunch of people that are hungry? Ask yourself this one. Can you live with yourself knwoing full well that you depleted your family’s supplies and 1/2, 3/4 or more and now your family is starving and everyone else around you that you helped. All that planning and sacrfice went to the toilet.

      Morality and conscience are very unfortunately way too much dictated by society. From day one we are taught to not think a certain way, to obey, to do what others do, to mimic others without self thought, to go with the herd or flock. WRONG, WRONG, WRONG. We each have to decide on our very own what is right and wrong. We have to listen to what is best for us and those around us. NEVER listen to “conditioning” of a society that has royally f’ed a planet that was once a garden and plentiful for everyone. Is it wrong to refuse your neighbors and others to stay alive and keep those that mean something to you alive? All depends on your very own point of view, not others, YOUR’s and your family’s.

      One more point I would like to make that very few people realize, and something society and political correctness poison has killed in so many. You have to respect yourself, and allowing society and BO and these others losers decide for you what is best for you, anyone like this has already lost. Thankfully most people on this site are not this way, but it gives thought to what you will decide when the time comes just how much of your lifeline you are willing to part with.

      Norse Prepper, thank you for making all of us think tonight, another fine article written.

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      • BI – quick note — got your email — YES, I will get it online — thanks for your patience with this one. Definitely solid information!!

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        • Facebook Page says:

          Please post his story. He has built it up and maybe this has been your plans all along. But its been long enough. And it better be good after all this wait. There been a lot of Its so good lately and in the end it is a did. Need a good one.

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      • Norse Prepper says:

        BI,
        “You need to be hard hearted for those around you that depend on you.”

        Expert advise friend.

        Thanks to you and others for the kind words and upcoming productive discussion.

        God Bless,
        NP

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        • Be informed says:

          @ Norse Prepper. Someone once told me this, that before you can respect others, first you must respect yourself. Hard decisions are made that are much more difficult when you are not making them yourself. It drives me crazy when I see how many people on the news nowadays mirror what others think and do. Each survival situation is different. You may have just one neighbor within any distance to you and sharing might be a very practical choice. Others might be surrounded by a thousand people. Sharing might be death for everyone around you. Each decision has to be weighed carefully. That decision ultimately MUST be you and your family and friends’ choice on what to do with what you have.

          Again, nice article that MANY will enjoy and give much thought to, as they should because something is coming that these decisions will probably have to be made by all of us.

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      • Prepared Pastor says:

        I believe success in this area comes from never having to turn anyone away from your door because they were turned away at the perimeter or at the gate. These should not be impulsive emotional decisions, but tactical ones decided in advance and implemented in teams.

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        • John Galt says:

          What would Jesus do? Turn away a starving child? I think not. If you had even the faith of a mustard seed, you could not do this.

          But this generation has lost itself to narcissism, selfishness, and greed. Many folks here appear to be worshiping their fears instead of God. God will provide if you have faith

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      • Kulafarmer says:

        BI,
        “You need to be hard hearted for those around you that depend on you.”

        No shades of grey there??? just curious, seems that there really is NO one size fits all for any of this,,,

        one thing I was taught as a child was forgiveness,, not always the easiest thing to do,, an certainly there are unforgiveable, and unforgiven,,, but how to discern who is worthy of forgiveness ???????

        This is not a PC thing either this is a christian thing, do unto others as you whould have them do unto you

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        • Be informed says:

          @ Kulafarmer. You are most fortunate to live in an area that has abundant rapidly renewable food sources all over the island. Most people live in temperate climates and some in very limited amount of growing days because of frost. While it has been taught in many religions that giving the shirt off your back gives you much compassion for others, it leaves you freezing to death and suffering. You must first respect yourself, and giving up your lifeline for others, nice people or those that need to be forgiven, leaves you and your family in the same boat.

          Please consider this from the movie Titanic. Do you “attempt” to let 100 people into a life raft that only is capable of supporting 25 and thus let everyone, including the 25 die from hypothermia or drowning? This is exactly what anyone is rsiking when they give away theur “lifeboat” to others, taking everyone down with them. Sometimes a community sharing is a good idea because working together with others can yeild much, including security. Most other times, someone that laughed at your idea of prepping will LEECH off of your family and when the well runs dry with NOT be there for you. Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me.

          A few months ago I sent everyone a reading from a book that talks about the loyalty and TRUST that is extremely rare quality in people. In a nut shell, those whom you can trust and be there for you, count on one hand, this is likely the number. Cynical as it can be, how many people can honestly call associates true friends that will stick by you? In a survival situation those that you can’t trust will and can get you killed. While each situation is different, your own self survival and what benefits you and your family should be paramount before becoming overly genereous.

          I can’t and won’t tell people how to live their lives. If someone wants to give the shirt off their back and suffer for it, this is their choice, the freedom of choice. However I and others can point out that there will be dire consequences for this. If someone can accept and this is what they must do to become more spiritual or in touch with God, then so be it. my suggestion to others though is to be cynical and think of their families and those whom have been there for them through the difficult and trying times fist and foremost over others that have and will backstab you the second that the opportunity presents itself.

          Something that Daisy bought up, that is brilliant beyond words, is that many of these people are going to be in severe drug withdraw and quite dangerous to everyone around them. Sharing something with someone like this is putting everyone around someone into a life threatening situation if these people are armed with anything.

          Kulafarmer, you can where you are keep people alive and well for a good long time, other places it is going to be protect your family first or lose everything. This for the most part, not everywhere, is the sad truth. Pragmatic and cynical will take the prepper far now and later. Compassion can take only someone so far unless they are some billionaire that has much to share will and can stockpile enough for hundreds or thousands of people for years. Almost everyone else will not have that luxary in most places of the world. Cold, perhaps. Logical and reasonable, absolutely.

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          • Them Guys says:

            There is solid advice for this type scenario right there in either bible book of Timothy or is it Thesolonians?

            It is discussing that there is a difference between Christians and others. It speaks in the manner of Gods children/christian/believers are of the Light, then it lists about a dozen or more other type folks. Such as liars, thieves,murderers, homos etc. They remain as they are because they Rejected Christ and His truths. The writer tells christians to try to spread Christs goepel to those types.

            IF they accept it fine then also deciple them, or teach them enough so they can do well without you and learn on their own if necessary. Also accept them into the Body of believers or group/church. BUT all who keep rejecting the gospel you are to TURN AWAY from them. It is their choice to remain in darkness by rejecting Christs Light. So be it. But if we/you must turn away from them, as in have nothing else to do with them types AFTER we tried to awaken them, then we/You are in the Clear as far as Gods judgements and wraths. And once you turn away from them types you have ZERO other duty to deal with them.

            You also must look at things kinda like this. There are several More places throughout the entire bible which speaks of this or similar situations. Every one states that God will Bless persons And nations that accept His Son Christ, and have zero other gods besides God the Father etc.

            But it also states all those persons and nations that reject Salvation thru Christ Gods Son, those God is going to Curse and Punish. Much like Sodom and Gomerah were dealt with by God. So if you believe whats written then logic says after the Gospel is rejected by persons OR nations, and if God decides to punish or curse them as he states He will?….Is it anyones job as a christian to try to Alter or halt that when it is God acting on His promices to do so?….A good case can be made that, that would consist of trying to Outjudge God by Impeading when he is doing punishments on whoever or a entire nation etc, right.

            If we are to take Gods word for it, and it seems apparent that for example some godless nation full of godless folks, or false god beliefs(acording to biblical viewpoints) has rejected all attempts at preaching of the Gospel to them,and they then seem to be definatly cursed or getting “punished” by Gods wrath? I believe christians are NOT to step in to mediate or negate that. As that would go against God.

            I think likewise as far as SHTF and Others unprepared etc, the same basic tennents and advice given to Christians to Turn Away from unbelievers and those who prefere to remain in Darkness fits swell.

            If the word “Church” really means Body of Christ/Believers. And consists Only of ALL true Christian Believrs worldwide, then That is basically Who should be Our main concerns for or about. Those who rather remain Outside of it, can look for Their help from Their Father…The father of Darkness, Satan. It is not as if they didn’t have a choice right?…Choose Light and Life or choose Darkness and Death eternally.

            What fellowship has Light with Darkness?…NONE! ZERO! and is what christians are supposed to be like. Not some type PC lib nitwit touchy feely help all as all are the same and my bros or neighbors! Thats NOT what the bible scriptures reveals. It is alot of what many priests-Nuns-Pastors today preach of…But Many are also Wolves in Sheeps clothes so bewares. Biblical advice From the bible don’t keep shifting like many preachers today do.

            Check out that stuff I mentioned above at begining of post. Very solid advice to keep you from guilt trips if you refuse to help someone etc.

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    8. Leonard M. Urban says:

      I can’t imagine letting anyone starve–particularly not a child. I’ve piled up an impressive quantity of dried beans and rice, and canned meats–Spam, chicken, Tuna–I’ve been stocking up on canned fish–from Dollar Tree of all places. I like fish, it’s only a dollar a can for the mackerel–a can that with a small amount of rice and a can of green beans leaves one stuffed. I’ve experimented with catching pigeons–a species of dove–with rat traps. They’re tough, but if cooked long enough (especially in a stove-top pressure cooker)are tender and as tasty as any Mourning or Inca Dove. Pigeons don’t eat anything objectionable–like Crows do–they eat seeds, and in fast-food parking lots, discarded hamburger and hotdog buns. I’m also a good shot with rifle or revolver, and have many years’ trotlining experience behind me, so, small game and fish will likely sustain me, and make it possible for me to share with others. I wouldn’t kill anybody for raiding the garden. In fact, unless my life were in danger–or someone else’s were, I wouldn’t consider killing anyone.

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      • Anonymous says:

        i agree i would never want to see a child starve ,be it wrong or right i have always built a circle around me ,when i married it was my wife and i ,when i had children there were part of that circle ,and so on ,it is now my wife ,children there spouses and my grandchildren ,and they ,those that comprise my circle are the (ONLY) reason i prepare ,and ive taken care to try and cover all the basis that ill need to feed and protect them ,so why then ,because of a group of idialogs that decided that nothing ever would or could happen never put back to take care of there family should i risk the life of one of those in my circle,if that child starved be it hard i could live with it ,if by feeding that child part of my family’s food ,and one of them died i could not live with myself ,i may have to stand before God and answer for it ,but my family will have lived through it ,if you jump in the water and try to save some one from drowning you may succeed ,but if you jump in and try and save a crowd they are most definetly going to pull you under

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    9. Hey You says:

      We hear of all kinds of wild rumors. I even recall about 40 years ago hearing about red Chinese massed on the Mexican border, ready to over run southern California. No, they never showed up. Likewise, I don’t think any current bad guys will show up.

      One good reason is that most of the bad guys want to get paid for their bad acts. But seems that the US$ will become virtually worthless shortly, so that threat will probably just evaporate. I think so. The governments will have a lot more to worry about that taking guns, particularly given that the bad guys will probably want their govt issued guns for their own protection.

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    10. Boss Hog says:

      Its a great article Norse Prepper and its something I stew over all the time. No one wants to kill or mame another human being ever, if you do then you dont qualify for being human. I do run thru worst case scenarios all the time and what my response will be. I know that handing over our 2nd amend means slavery at best and just as dead as a noncompliant at worst.
      Will there be a chance to fight and run away live to fight another day? who knows? Will it be a Boston style invasion? who knows? Will it be just a slow decay with ever increasing harassment and hostilities? again who knows how this thing is gonna play out. I do know that if my children are involved then there is no level low enough that I wont stoop to, to ensure their safety. So all bets are off should anyone ever mess with my kids. I honestly dont know how I will react when folks come knocking but I have decided to feed the folks that will help me with the enormous amount of labor that will arise when the lights go out or the oil stops flowing.
      I am going to need people for farming for security for everything we take forgranted these days. So I guess my 2cents is have preps to spare for your laborers. Now how am I going to act when the boots kick down the door, I guess we’ll burn that bridge when we get there.

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      • Mountain Trekker says:

        Boss, I’m afraid this will go down like the frog in the slow boiling pot. I think we will only be awakened and brought to action, after we have many of our fellow Patriots from various locations around the country arrested or killed, trying to resist. These actions will help us make our decision on how we will react. Who knows it could be you or I. I hope it doesn’t come to this, but it looks like this is what TPTB are trying to bring about. Trekker Out. Free Men Own Guns, Slaves Don’t

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        • We need to promise each other that the patriots who die, even alone and early in all of this mess, died for a great and noble cause. We need to promise to keep a list of those brave enough to stand early and alone, if necessary, when the line they drew is crossed. The brave patriots deserve their names carved on a rock, (Red Dawn) or on a monument like the Alamo. These people should not sacrifice their lives for nothing. We need to start writing the history and the history books. It might be 100 years before it comes to light, but they deserve their place in history.

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    11. SmokinOkie says:

      Norse Prepper-
      Very well done! Thank you for all the stuff you’ve contributed here at shtfplan. Over the past couple of years that I’ve been here, you’ve provided many thought-provoking questions and a wondeful insight into the possibilities of human behavior following a disaster. Your presence in our community is sincerely appreciated. -okie

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      • JustOneGuy says:

        Reposted…

        Howdy All,

        Smokin’ BH, BI, NP, all you guys (and gals) as well…

        THIS is no small part of WHY my particular reasoning has run as it has…

        …get as FAR away as you can Humanly get…that’ll minimize what you have to ‘Stand in the Judgement’ for when the moment comes. WHO among us wants to have to stand and answer the question, “WHY did you HARM MY Children?”

        I’m NOT prone to waking with ‘Night-sweats-terrors’…this does THAT for me nightly though of late…35 days left…no more, So Sweareth I.

        JOG

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      • Norse Prepper says:

        Okie, thank you sincerely. It means a lot to have the regulars on here help each other out even if it is with a thought process. Funny, even though I consider many of you friends, I could have a burger in a McDees in the next booth over and never know who you are.

        Would be fun to crack a brew with you some day, even though I would be risking a hernia from snapping my stomach muscles (very well hidden muscles I might add) laughing.

        Thanks again and God Bless,
        NP

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    12. NP….a truly thought-provoking article and the same scenarios that I have run thru my mind on multiple occasions. I just don’t know if I can honestly turn away a child that’s starving. I like the idea of a small care package, but how many can I give out before it starts cutting into my supplies for my family……you can really go bonkers thinking about some of this stuff and yet these decisions will have to be made. You are definitely correct about defining moments…….!
      Thank you for all the articles that you contribute….

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    13. Eisenkreuz says:

      I’VE TOLD YOU PEOPLE A THOUSAND TIMES WE NEED TO GET SERIOUS AND GET ORGANIZED.

      THE SECOND AMENDMENT GOES BEYOND THE INDIVIDUAL RIGHT TO BEAR ARMS. IT AUTHORIZES THE FORMATION OF A MILITIA. IF YOU DON’T USE YOUR RIGHTS YOU LOSE THEM. SO USE THEM. ASSEMBLE THE MILITIA.

      LET ME SPELL IT OUT FOR YOU: MILITIA IS RESPONSIBLE FOR HOMELAND SECURITY. NOT FUCKING DHS.

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      • Anonymous says:

        “Homeland Security Act of 2002″ 187 pages
        - purpose: prevent, reduce vulnerability, help recover from terrorist attacks,

        - 22 agencies from ICE, to Chem, Bio, Radiation, Nuke to Plum Island to Coast Guard to apparently judging from Boston and West, Texas privately owned mercenary organizations with access to military grade explosive missiles and a cadre of actors and FX specialists AND the MSM

        -(also judging from Boston and West, Texas one of their functions is to perpetrate terrorist attacks)

        The purpose of the last two False Flag operations were to paint people who abide by the constitution as terrorists. Luckily, they were so ham-handed that they got caught, but even these idiots given enough money and time will eventually get lucky. As long as they are funded by the Federal Gov’t/The Fed issuing/buying T-securities, to big to jail banks/financial institutions and multinational corps AND as long as they have the MSM feeding lies to the Sheeple, they will have unlimited time and money. Certainly organize, but don’t help them in their goals.

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    14. Eisenkreuz says:

      Feeding the Golden Horde is the dumbest idea ever conceived by the human mind. You altruistic people are playing with fire.

      Let the children starve. You’re not the savior of the world and it’s not your concern. You took care of your own. It’s not your fault the zombie next door didn’t prep.

      This will be the ultimate rendition of the grasshopper and the ant.

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      • Leslie Anne says:

        When people come knocking, don’t answer the door.

        If it appears to be a long term crisis, skip the garden and stay indoors (living off your preps until the die off happens). Garden when things settle down and the weak and unprepared have died off.

        If someone starts to break into your home, it’s self defense, shoot them.

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        • you don't need to know says:

          Leslie Anne,

          You can discuss what you “think” will happen til you’re blue in the face, so I prepare for the worst and hope for the best. I completely agree with your post!!!! Even if the dollar collapses, which most on here do think, who’s going to pay those people to man the electricity buildings? So, we prepare for no power. Once that goes, ABSOLUTELY, stay inside til the die off happens and than be ready to become self sufficient.

          Great post!!!!

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          • Eisenkreuz says:

            The loss of the power grid is a turnkey. I’m not at all afraid of the economic collapse. I can deal with that. But grid-down situation would truly open the gates of hell.

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        • AkCoyote says:

          A simple answer to a complex question. Well said.

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          • Them Guys says:

            The Gates of Hell may be opened wide if Amnesty for 30-40 Million current illeagles, and quickly afterwards for all of their Extended familys abroad, gets passed and done.

            In other words perhaps that Hell Gate Is our southern mexican border region.

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        • Commie hater says:

          Have your heavy dark goggles and hearing protection on. The commie goons will flash bang you first, then it’s dance time, or you die.

          Stalinist commies everywhere and bommie is one of them.

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    15. Eisenkreuz says:

      I rewatched Night of the Living Dead last night for the first time since I was a kid.

      When I saw the zombies swarm the house all I could think about were people texting, watching TV, playing xbox, thanking the Boston police for searching their houses…

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    16. Mountain Trekker says:

      OH to be an Atheist, in times like these! When the SHTF, no worry about who, or when to shoot someone. And for sure, no need to share your supplies with anyone. But when you throw Christianity into the mix, therein lies the problem. When you have to wrestle with, when is it right to take someones life, and with who, and how much to share your supplies. These are real problems, I have as a Christian. I see people that are Christians,as I am, but wasteful and always in need, even in prosperous times. Do I help them out to the detriment of my family? And when it comes to taking a life, I must decide when and if it is right for me to do this in GODS eyes. I think the only answer will come through a lot of pray and serious thought, and wait and see how the situation presents it’s self. Trekker Out.

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      • sixpack says:

        God doesn’t have to be the only conscience we have. Not believing in God does not release one from having compassion and love for each other. Not believing in God does not make indiscriminate killing okay. Not believing in God does not release us from responsibility.

        Atheism is not a get-out-of-life-free card or a license to be a fucking jerk…just saying.

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      • Aslard says:

        I’m not an atheist but at the same time I’m not a man of any religion. I’d have to say I take offense to this comment MT, and I usually find myself agreeing with you. Morality and having a conscience is not defined by a belief in God or a fear of eternal punishment after this life is over. If it is, then you’re missing the point.

        We have once chance on this earth that we take for granted, I do it every day and it’s not on purpose, I just forget, I worry about my bills and the asshole customers I have to deal with, I worry about where our country is going and I just forget to be grateful to be alive. I value human life above all things, if faced with having to take a life I don’t think anyone will find that to be a guiltless task.

        Lastly I want to say you don’t always know what your neighbor believes in, the last thing we need to be doing in times like these are arguing over religion when we live in a country that is supposed to believe in religious freedom.

        United we stand, divided we fall.

        Best wishes to all in the coming events.

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      • Mountain Trekker says:

        Ever see a Predator with a conscience? Wonder where our came from. Trekker Out.

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        • sixpack says:

          Define “predator”. If you mean carnivorous animals, they don’t kill for fun, they kill to survive. Only MAN has what we understand as a “conscience” and incidentally, only MAN kills for something other than survival.

          Human predators and animal predators have nothing in common. Sorry.

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          • Mountain Trekker says:

            sixpack, human predators and animal predators have nothing in common. That’s my point. Where did we get a conscience? As for the killing for fun. You must not be familiar with, wolves, coyotes or dogs. Or common house cats for that matter. Hey lets part friends. Trekker Out.

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      • Joey says:

        feed everyone in the hood for a day and have everyone starve together, or feed mine and give humanity and christianity a better future?

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    17. Sierra Dave says:

      If you let them in. That’s your first/final mistake. They will tear up your house to find hidden weapons and see everything you have. I’m sure they will use threats on your family and be screaming at your to hand over your weapons.

      If they aren’t satisfied, they will probably take you in anyway. And I am sure they will take note of your food cache for later.

      If enough people resist from the get go, the traitorous LE will rethink their orders. Because at this point, we are living in a Dictatorship. I’m partial to a windshield wiper motor spraying gas onto them outside your door. Yah, fire can spread. But will they want to fire when soaked in gas?

      If you have the room. 50 pound bags or rice are $17. Get a ton of it or as much as you can afford. Add some Beef and Chicken Bullion for variety. Then for giving food to the idiots, they need to tear up their yards and plant the seeds you also got. Hopefully the Rice will last until some food starts coming in.

      No man is an island. And if you have bunches of people to watch and a few firearms to pass out. At the very least, some of the Rice eaters will take some slugs instead of you. Brutal but true.

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      • Gregory8 says:

        Sierra Dave: That’s why OPSEC/COMSEC is paramount. I’ve given up telling people about what is likely to come long ago. Why; because I don’t want folks remembering these warnings and ME. Well, I’ve since moved to a small town in a rural county, hours away from any major city. The only thing on file is my CCW in a very conservative southern state. All purchases of food, guns, and ammo are done with cash when possible, in person with little to no paperwork (gun shows, etc.). A wise person never stores all their goods in one spot should your home be compromised. Just like in the military; have a primary and a secondary fallback/rally point/cache-just in case. Always have a Plan B and C, etc.

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      • Commie hater says:

        Gasoline and a match. SD, I wonder what Molotov thought of that concept when he got his ass kicked in ’39. Finns don’t think much of Stalinists.

        Stalinist commies everywhere.

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        • Sierra Dave says:

          To expand upon the concept. If we got EMP’d or a complete financial collapse has occurred. I will have remotely triggered lethal defenses. No one will be getting to my front door without me knowing well in advance.

          I’m bugging in. Every approach will be well mapped out and appropriately rigged.

          I think a complete gun grab is included with EMP and financial melt down. It will be civil war at that point.

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      • Joey says:

        One problem is that if the neighbor breaks in your house and you kill him in self defense, his family might be so angry as to just burn you out in the middle of the night just out of spite. Be careful drawing the line, once you cross one, you may just have to finish the guys family off the next night. Hate to even think this way. Same as if you don’t throw them a bone every once in awhile, they might just say, if they won’t give me any, I just burn them out.

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        • Them Guys says:

          Joey, All persons are of Gods creation. But Not all persons are Gods Children. Todays PC nonsense of all humans planet wide are brothers and sisters and neighbors so we must help and be with all equally as Christ commands is BUNK! Christs own words as well as those of the apostle writers state in no uncertain terms that PC stuff today is Bunk. Christ came Not to make world peace, but as if He bears a huge sword with which to Divide the world into Two halves(of humans) those that are saved and rightous and those who are Not and are of the Unrightous.

          PC-Kommies have tried to Destroy all of Christs and biblical truths and replace it with PC and Lies. All designed to Trip You Up!..Learn to be discerning, then Use dicernment to figure out which persons really are bros and sisters and neighbors. From the rest Turn Away. God won’t judge anyone as guilty morally or ethecially if we act and do as He says to.

          Some PC fool bleeding heart, world problem solver libs types would advise their own wife or teen daughter to awlays assist another human person in need. Then that same lib fool will cry a river of tears after their wife or teen daughter is found a week later by cops after she “helped” someone on side of road due to she felt sorry and did the liberal pc based on Feelings emotional thing, and stopped to offer e Ride in her warm cozy automobile!

          A weel later cops find an abandon car with a dead female,Gang Raped and set on fire before death due to being pc correct and trying to save the worlds helpless etc. Discernment is a Good way to analize things. Every person is NOT equality as lib kommies preach. Preference of your own kind or type is really a good thing. Especially if You are of the Gods children group and someone else aint.

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    18. Bill says:

      Excellent article. Lots to consider and think about. I pray these things don’t happen.

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    19. Simple says:

      I never had hand guns because of registration.

      So it’s the old pump shotgun and ruger 22 rifle.

      If they said turn them in.
      I’d hide them.

      Maybe all you guys should be buying gun parts and ammo.
      You won’t be able to get them in future.

      shit… many would not turn in the guns.

      At that point…we’d all have to re-read the 2nd and clearly understand it.
      What it’s true purpose is.

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      • Eisenkreuz says:

        You are not prepared. Your sidearm is the primary weapon during the collapse. It’s not going to be a combat situation. You’re still going to have to go to work. Your rifle is not of sufficient caliber to be effective. Time is running out.

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        • Not so Much says:

          “Your rifle is not of sufficient caliber to be effective”

          say what?

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          • John W. says:

            Anyone depending on a .223 will be disappointed. I would love to have an M-14. Much better than an M-1. M-14s are pretty rare though. Navy shipboard roving security people carry them on topside watch only place I have seen them.

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            • Breathial says:

              The contemporary version of the M-14 is the M1A. I bought one as my go-to battle rifle, with a Savage .308 “BAS-K” as my “reach out and touch someone” weapon.

              The M1A is readily available, but the going rate is ~$2k. With extra mags (andossibly optics), you could be into it for almost $3k. At this point, though, I didn’t want a .223 poodle-shooter

              Regards, Breathial

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      • justleavemebe says:

        If its time to hide them its past time to use them.

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        • Commie hater says:

          justleavemebe, I’ve always wondered about the guy who’d bury his weapons. What would it take to make him dig ‘em up?

          Half the country commies and the other half cowards.

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    20. NP, many thanks for the sobering article. I do believe my Achilles’ heel will be the hungry children. What will I do if some are left on my doorstep? I will do my best.
      As for the rest of them (adults), I’ll run them off and bury the ones I don’t.

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    21. Keep Believing says:

      Thanks so much for this great article.

      i think one of the first things we need to do is stock up on our “spiritual survival gear” because the first battle will be a spiritual one.

      We need to know the truth about what is going on around us because this is the only way we can remain steadfast and at the same time peaceful in what we have to do.

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    22. Satori says:

      if you don’t have your hands on it
      you don’t have it

      JIM SINCLAIR: Now They Are “Cyprusing” Physical Gold!! GET OUT OF THE SYSTEM NOW! Swiss Bank Just Refused To Give My Friend His Gold

      http://investmentwatchblog.com/jim-sinclair-now-they-are-cyprusing-physical-gold-get-out-of-the-system-now-swiss-bank-just-refused-to-give-my-friend-his-gold/

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      • anonymous6.8 says:

        I went to Switzerland several years ago to explore putting the bulk of my wealth in a private Swiss bank. Their bank privacy laws used to mean something. Reading the small print in my hotel room … I didn’t like the terms. Starting with (paraphrasing) “Foreigner, this english document is for your benefit. The controlling document is the German version.” It went downhill from there. Gotta smile because I dodged the bullet that nailed Mr. Sinclair’s friend. Even then I steered by: If You Can’t Hold It, You Don’t Own It.

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    23. Enemy of the State says:

      Hidden due to low comment rating. Click to read it.

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    24. Prepping Preacher says:

      NP, this is a good piece… thought provoking… many, in my view, see the coming storm as a kind of math test they’ve had to cram for and not the reality of seeing people dieing and having to have a hand in it… they look past or not at all at the real issues to be faced such as a neighbor’s hungry kid who was sent out to beg from you… life will get hard for all – including the preppers… eating the same foods prepared the same way, under the same cautions, for extended time periods gets very old… many will need medical help that, unless one submits to tptb, will not be had… many things to consider…. many things…

      pray for the best, prep for the worst

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    25. I pray with my heart,mind,and soul each and every day for a level playing field.Natural things can do this.Who then would not be in.People are going to die in either case but a level playing field makes the situation winnable for the good people.Let us pray.

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    26. Satori says:

      remember the Twilight Zone episode “THE SHELTER ” ??

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4TqOu4r1KQA

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    27. Good article and food for thought for some.
      For our family, Mac knows where we will be, up in country, not likely to have too many people trying to steal carrots there, we are well off the beaten track.
      We have prepped well and are not done, you can never “be done”. I learned preparing for the future from my grandparents, it used to be a way of life for many. Now, contemporary times have made people who garden, hunt, preserve food, into crazed madmen….lol….I guess you can never underestimate the stupidity/gullability of the ill informed masses.
      Anyway, we plant enough to feed more than ourselves, and plant enough to generate bio-fuel crops in capacity to meet more than our needs. I will be as charitable as the situation dictates. That is all I can say. I’ll say, we must have compassion. We also don’t allow predators to eat our livestock, nor gophers/rabbits mess up the garden to badly. Deal with the situation as it arises. I’ve been a trapper/hunter….what’s the difference between a skunk or a coyote. Big difference tween that and a human, plus, can the human you are helping or not helping, help you? Much to weigh here. I would say, try to mind play all you want and it will never be what reality comes. Charity may be the order for the day, as a Christian and believing in being a child of God, I think a certain way, and I’ve never been let down, all things have always worked out for the better. I have been guided, may all of you be guided as well, never forget the charity that may have been shown to you. Pass it on.

      But definitely shoot the predators.

      Terry

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    28. Chantilly Lady says:

      I have given some thought to these scenarios–

      #1—- This is a perfect example for coordinated civil disobedience. Say you picked a day– day 31 and everyone who was NOT willing to turn in their guns showed up at the police station all across the state willing to turn themselves in. Imagine if 10, 20, 50 thousand people or more showed up all within a couple of hours– they would absolutely be overwhelmed and the absurdity of the law would be in plain site for the world to see…

      #2— I would hate to see a child starving but if you give ‘em an inch they’ll take a mile– especially if their parents are a bunch of sorry *ss no good thugs.. A starving child staring at you is a no win situation ethically in my mind… Everyone talks about being prepared but there is little discussion about concealing the fact you have prepared after SHTF. I haven’t delved into the subject too much myself but at minimum post SHTF you need to have clothes that are just as baggy and grungy as everyone around you– a trip to the Goodwill should solve that.. Concealment and OPSEC may help to lessen the likelihood of these type ethical choices..

      3#- I think a lot about this situation. There will be a silver lining to this situation as more countries ditch the dollar for trade and if we go to say IMF SDR’s for settlement of trade. The US will have to go back to producing something and balance its trade deficit in order to have currency on hand in which to purchase imports. Regardless, Americans can expect to have lower standard of living going forward as much of American lifestyle was based on the ability to print rather than produce and once the manufacturing and service jobs were exported in sufficient quantities, American lifestyles were propped up by a variety of bubbles- tech stock and housing and DEBT. Wages among countries will eventually reach some sort of equilibrium, companies will accept lower profit margins based on prevailing wages and life will go on. Key is to stay out of debt and get a head of these deflationary trends now..

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    29. reality says:

      Times are getting tough. But I still see people here are still brainwashed. They don’t believe the media except when it comes to Muslims. People need to understand that when someone does a mass shooting, don’t blame all gun owners. At the same time, don’t group the Muslims together and don’t blame Islam. I know that if the media said it was a white man or a gun owner or right winger who did that bombing, people here would yell: conspiracy! conspiracy! But when it comes to Muslims, they go along and believe everything the media says. It’s pretty sad. Don’t fall into this belief that people hate us because how we live. It boggles my mind how people believe such a thing. Muslims aren’t a threat. They don’t hate us. Even Ron Paul said don’t group all Muslims together and to not blame Islam. It is all a ploy to gather support for another war and to continue the one this country is already in.

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    30. BadAmerican says:

      NOMI

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    31. Pavan says:

      If you want to know what it could be like after an EMP attack, just watch a Mad Max movie. It’s not pretty, but it might be realistic. Political correctness will be gone, and testosterone will be in charge. Strength and ability will once again rule, as it always did until post WWII. It will be hard for most, but it will actually be a return to the way things are supposed to be. We are so out of sync with reality, at this time, that a collapse is inevitable.

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    32. Watchman says:

      NP: Thanks be to you. This what it is all about.
      Again thank you.

      Keep the FAITH
      Watchman

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    33. AnitaSweater says:

      Being a Christian, you should already know that God has told you to protect your family first! Whatever that entails in whatever nightmare is coming, He will protect you and guide you. I already know that I will be among the first to die by standing my ground. It makes me sick to think that so many of you so-called preppers would be afraid of being marked as a felon or going to jail. Do you think there will be any law and order? Will there be any courts in action? Get a grip on the real scenarios. Those pictures from Boston are useful in knowing what the first targets will look like.I am going down fighting.No one on this Earth is going to take my freedoms. Why would you question your own belief or even consider a way to wiggle out of the stand you supposedly have taken? Lord of the Flies indeed!

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      • anonymous6.8 says:

        If the PTB pass a law saying we need the EPA’s permission to breathe or we’re felons would you stop breathing? Stratfor or some site like that had an article saying the Taliban were never more than a few thousand guys with home field advantage. Against our entire war machine. Does anyone think we’re winning there? The costumed thugs who would be enforcing a gun grab are no more immortal than we are. One determined man in Los Angeles had every costumed thug in Southern California pissing his pants. What if our choice is being shot in the head in front of a ditch in a FEMA camp or making that lonely last stand? If my choice is that stark I am steeling myself to die amid a pile of brass and dead thugs rather than kneeling beside a ditch. And you?

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        • sixpack says:

          No, they’re not immortal, but their kevlar and flak jackets sure make them seem like they are at first.

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          • anonymous6.8 says:

            Get your own body armor and gas masks while you still can. They aren’t ten feet tall. The question isn’t “do we have a choice for happily ever after and free too?” The choice is do we live as free men and women or do we live (for a short time) as their slaves? What if the FEMA camps are death camps?

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    34. 22Mission says:

      Norse Prepper -
      Well written, thought provoking .
      Much to think about .
      In the starving child scenario, who thinks they can actually cook without the smell infusing the neighborhood?
      How long before the neighborhood is kicking in your door??
      (I often wonder this when I see the shelter in the suburbs comments )
      You can’t hide the smells of food without good macro air filters.
      Doubt that would work anyway .
      Many have guns not registered .
      I say only turn in registed guns and remove the rest to q cache .
      Dollar collapse? Whether it comes in one day or continues to slowly be worth less and less till it resembles the Confederate currency hidden by my forefathers, It is coming .
      I say buy what you can now with it .
      Tools are essentials . Traps and snares will be equal to seeds long-term .
      For if you have millions of rice and beans, but no way to add food later you are going to starve in the end .

      This article should bring deep honest open discussion .
      And should give all pause .
      For we all need clear level heads .

      And more intelligent posting by all .
      Looking forward to everyone’s discussions .
      Take care
      NOMI
      Mission

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    35. Ugly says:

      No one can prepare for the worse that is coming. All you can do is prepare the best you can and do alot of praying. This will not be easy for anyone, especially since over 90% of folks are preparing for nothing. Food came too easy in this country since the 1960s. Now we are the spoiled brat generation.

      It will be a culture shock for everyone. Thus, today is the day to prepare. Each day wasted will be harder later.

      PS. Good artcle NP.

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    36. Chantilly Lady says:

      I wanted to share a couple of excellent articles I came across today that really explains what is going on with the economy– especially concerning the Fed’s actions of QE,impact of debt, etc.. some of the better one’s I’ve seen in a few weeks..

      http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article40113.html

      http://kingworldnews.com/kingworldnews/KWN_DailyWeb/Entries/2013/4/24_Former_US_Treasury_Official_-_Fed_Desperate_To_Stop_Collapse.html

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      • Chantilly_Fan says:

        Hi Chantilly Lady,
        Thank you for your postings. I am not a banker but I do know math. Its good to learn from you. Reading your links now.

        As to the ” The current financial path of our country is completely unsustainable and there likely is no way out without a reset occurring”. I think many are thinking there will be a trigger event and all will become evident. I think the most likely future is the current recent past. People will not starve from food scarcity; but from prices. TPTB are dead set and acting on a plan to eliminate the middle class in the USA. They are doing it at record pace. They are printing money-debt and giving it to themselves. There will be no trigger event as the American working public has no way to stand up to them. They control the non-military militarized departments of government and are taking steps to take control of the military. They are taking more and more steps to eliminate personal freedoms and enslave working Americans. They are doing it at a record pace. TSHTF has already happened. Americans are just in denial. TPTB want us all to be toothless paupers while they live in their mansions – the antithesis of the American Dream. The American Dream is prosperity for all who labor. The American Reality is prosperity for those who control the financial system and the courts. Once they seize control of the military, then America is done.

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      • CL, I read KWN every mourning (after I make the coffee). It was an interesting article.

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    37. Say When says:

      I have many sleepless nights wondering about these very scenarios playing out and how I would react and respond.
      First, I believe that if or when the things play out, the PTB would have to be rid of the internet and all forms of communication in order to not have the people respond in a negative way and be prepared for the assault of the storm troopers. One thing that most of these assaults have in common is that they use the element of surprise and storm in. Once that element of surprise is gone, that makes their job of assaulting the individual homes much more dangerous.
      Second, I will not comply with any unlawful, unconstitutional order to lay down arms. Will not bury or hide them. I believe if one thinks they need to bury arms, then it is really time to dig them up.
      Third, if and when people start begging for food, unlike the welfare state, they will have to work the gardens. Work for food if you will.
      Fourth, FAMILY FIRST, then if you feel charitable, then share with those without but with EXTREME caution.
      Fifth, we are not animals and what we do for the least of Gods creatures will return to us tenfold. I still believe He is still in charge of all things and will not leave us. He promised.
      Sixth, be prepared, be safe, be praying.

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    38. HisArmsWide says:

      We are prepared to be anonymous ‘charitors’. We have 5 gallon buckets filled 50/50 with rice and beans in mylar in a oxygen deprived atmosphere along with bullion cubes, salt and sugar and extra bottles of water purification tablets (rotated yearly) and coffee filters with instructions for cooking and quantities. It’ll feed a family of four for a week if they stretch it a bit and they have at least a marginal way to clean and purify water.

      Those will be given in secret to those friends with children who refuse to see what’s coming. They don’t know about them, they don’t know about our preparations and they won’t know who their benefactors are. We have various options to get them to the goods or the goods to them.

      A couple of them will also receive 10/22 basic carbines, a couple of mags and a brick of ammo where it makes strategic sense for us.

      We’re fully prepared to lose weight along with everyone else, we’ll just do it a little slower and stay healthier with balanced meals and vitamin supplements, proper sanitation and hygiene if we go with the bug in option.

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      • stcroix says:

        a 5 gallon bucket should sustain a family of 4 for a bit longer than just a week.
        a 5 gallon bucket should hold roughly around 80 cups of rice or beans or whatever dried good (i stock a lot of mine w/Scotch Broth Soup).
        and in a shtf scenario, each person should prob only be eating 1-2 cups per day @ MOST.
        let’s say 1.5 cups per day, that equals 53.33 serving, then divided by 4 = 13.33 days, so you’ll be helping them out for roughly a couple of weeks.

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    39. MY SHTF PLAN says:

      Shoot every fucking thing that moves and learn to make jerky!

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    40. Plarvo says:

      Thanks for the article. When I think of the philosophical questions regarding prepping I always have to remind me that the world will become very very small. The car will become irrelevant because all that just in time gas supplies to the gas stations will disappear. Sure you could have 1000 gallons stashed on your compound, but if you’re driving around, you made yourself a serious target. The roaming golden hoardes will have to be on foot, bikes and that takes a lot of energy and TIME to get anywhere. 10-15 miles a day tops and that is if you are getting 3k calories in you, which just probably won’t happen. So my fear of the hoard will dissipate after a month or so. When THSTF your world will basically be a 10 mile radius as in the 1800′s. Your world will be how you deal with that circle. So I’ve tried to concentrate on what I can control within that small circle. Making friends with neighbors, figuring out what skills people have, farming, fixing equipment, sewing, nursing, etc. I know for a fact, I could save food for my family for 10 years, but would still not survive. All it takes is a flu bug, or a bad fall, or my kids breaking a leg, and it changes the prepper dynamic. I’ll HAVE to go outside of my house to find someone to help set my son’s leg, but if I learn what I have within my ten miles, I may know there is a doctor that can help and the barter community survives, he may need something I might have. Sure gold/silver will be great when trading for things worthy of the cost, but in an evironment of total collapse, silver and gold will be worth too much to be viable for trading, however 10 chickens for 20 cans of green beans, I’d be all over that, or help build a root cellar for digging up some community springs, I’d join that crew. Sure there will be bad eggs and people will starve, but I live in the sticks and people are poor and know how to survive. Survival vs. the Xbox world are like two different planets. I’d rather work with the people who are barely holding on to rebuild a community, because that is what they do everyday. I have the apple orchards, and my next door neighbor can shoot a deer from 500 yards, so we have an agreement he shares the meat, I share the apples. That is how I see it playing out. Your ‘circle’ is going to have to work together to help each other, and the ones who don’t will be dealt with harshly. I wish I could say that I’d just board up my house and shoot everyone on sight, but I may need something from them someday. My great grandparents were farmers in Montana and they used to tell me when I was younger that the only way they survived (flu epedemics, famines, etc.) is by everyone gathering together whether it is via a church, commmunity building etc and figuring out how they could all work together to take on a challenge, like providing food, or sheltering the sick, education and so on. My great grandfather had 9 brothers and 6 died during the flu epedemic, leaving 3 to manage a sheep farm and they had to have others help, and because of that help, their ‘contribution’ to the community was sheep, while other farmers, etc. contributed other things like hay, or milk, or clothes. Anyway, that is my thoughts, I just don’t see how my family, even if extended came up to ‘defend’ the compound would survive without outside help. Plus, what’s the point of living if all you are doing is fearing the next person that knocks on your door. As for guns and you feel the need to be a good citizen, I’m telling you one thing that is a beautiful replacement, Bear Repellant. NO ONE comes back from a bear repellant attack. It’s cheap and can put a crowd down in seconds. Then you can do as you please with the ‘marauders’ Zip ties and bear repellant are beautiful things to add to your preps. Ask anyone who had to go through Delta Force or SEAL training about getting sprayed with Bear Repellant and they’ll tell you they’d rather have been shot.

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      • Central TX Mom says:

        Thank you so much for mentioning bear repellant. Hubby and I have been discussing purchasing this because my #1 son’s special needs make it dangerous for us to have firearms right now, (haven’t saved enough for a gun safe yet), but we still would like some home defense should the need arise. Probably violated OPSEC with that statement. Make no mistake, I am VERY pro-gun it’s just our personal circumstances dictate no firearms in the home without proper way to secure them from #1 son. Do you have a particular brand that is reliable and not terribly expensive, or what features should we be looking for when researching what to get. Living on a budget here. Thanks for any info you can give

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      • Former Cal Girl says:

        Norse Prepper very thought provoking article. Things hubby and I discuss from time to time. Platform your thoughts are similar to mine. As I review our rural community(sticksocks) we have two nurses, a Dr.,lot of gardeners and one guy who is a “jack of all trades” with cattle and lots of ideas on how to use things for various purposes. My family survived the ’30s depression here and most families have been here for generations. I definitely see bartering making a come back here. Tough times ahead but God is in control. So we will pray for all but die if need be for our family. We prep because we hope to be around to help restore our country . Oh, and NOMI is Not One More Inch.:-)

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      • Semper Fi y'all says:

        Plarvo, good stuff.

        You mentioned the doctor. Please know he will be out of supplies real soon. It makes sense to stock medical supplies your grandparents didn’t have available.

        During our wars the combat soldier carried a small medical ‘bag’ on his pistol, or cartridge belt with the then available trauma needs- battle dressings, sulfa packets (no longer used), atropine syrettes, ms syrettes, etc.

        When the doctor comes he’ll be out of antibiotics and local anesthetics (zylocaine, for example.)

        A prepper who preps for everything knows how to obtain multiple antibiotics and other essential supplies a physician needs, in ample quantities. It will be essential to have these supplies available for the physician, because he most likely won’t have them.

        Semper Fi

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    41. Eisenkreuz says:

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8VlRKUP4fpc

      AS USUAL, WHILE EVERYONE WAS DISTRACTED BY THE BOMBINGS THE VERMIN PASSED ANOTHER EVIL BILL.

      THIS IS WHY I KEEP TELLING YOU TO HAVE A DISMISSIVE ATTITUDE ABOUT THIS TERRORISM CRAP. COMPASSION IS FOR NORMAL TIMES. THESE ARE NOT NORMAL TIMES WE ARE LIVING IN. WE’RE TRYING TO SAVE A COUNTRY HERE.

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    42. First, get your head around the fact that anyone either legislating, ordering, or carrying out the orders to violate your constitutional rights is the enemy, no different than a foreign invader, and should be regarded and treated accordingly, no matter what uniform they wear, what flag they fly, or what office they hold. Theirs is nothing less than an act of war, and, in a real crackdown during a SHTF situation, they should be regarded as targets of opportunity.

      You can’t win a battle fighting them at your front door, anymore than the colonists could win the battle on Lexington Green; their successful battle was won, not by confronting a superior force directly, but by roadside ambushes, when the enemy – who, at that time, was the legal government, BTW – did not expect it. Hit and run tactics, sniping, burned homes, assassinated politicians, executed collaborators, kidnapped hostages, and IEDs are the order of the day in such a situation, and have been in every successful conflict of that type in history. If you want to win, you don’t fight fair, and you don’t wait until they come for you; you take them under fire from behind when they come for your neighbor. They expect it from him, but not from you, which increases the chances of success. Historically, the side willing to go the farthest will win. If anyone doesn’t believe this, they need to research such conflicts, and if they think they can’t go that far, then it’s better for everybody concerned that they quietly surrender their weapons, lick the enemy’s boots, and go on about their business.

      As for food, in a non-government-controlled disaster; keep a case of expendable stuff. By expendable, I mean outdated, which eventually happens. The odds are it’s probably still edible – I’ve eaten enough outdated stuff in my life – so never throw a can away unless it’s rusty. Tossing someone asking for food an old can of spinach or Spam may save their lives, either by keeping them from starvation or by you not having to kill them to prevent them from taking it. Outdated cans also makes great trade goods, and, after a see-and-sniff test, you can eat them yourselves if need be.

      As for scenario three, if you want to live, you’d better be willing to kill. If you value your life and your family’s lives more than a looter’s, you may very well have to take his. If it looks like the government may be restored in the near future, dump the results in the nearest river or storm sewer and shut up. If it looks long-term, hang the results at the neighborhood entrance with a sign that says LOOTER around its stretched neck; this will tend to discourage others.

      Like you, I pray that I never have to do these things, but I also keep my head around the fact that, in such a situation, I might have to.

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    43. d... b says:

      Its good to read about preppers having Guns, food, water, and fuel. I havent read much on prepping for a bugout if needed. You had better be in good physical shape. That means working out 4-5 days a week. Backpacking 2 times a month will give you a idea on how hard it is to travel carrying needed supplies. I have been doing this for 20 years and iI still feel like I havent reached the conditioning needed to survive long term on the road. What I have learned is that you must out think a adversary if you cant outrun them.There may be a time when you cannot defend your home any longer even though you are in a rural area. (I am very rural)Physical prepping is a cost free prep. It can be done at home and on the road. It is also the most overlooked.

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      • Semper Fi y'all says:

        Have a small two wheel (puncture proof tires) cart available capable of hauling 150 pounds or so. It’s easy to make one using angle iron, drill and bolts. Wheels can be made out of exterior grade plywood, simple bearings and a strap iron tire.

        Cache more than one if there are several in your party.

        Semper Fi

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    44. Merree says:

      Defining moments for health care workers:

      Drones are being used against you and your family. You know they often use one drone, then wait until help arrives and shoot a second drone. What do you do as far as helping wounded friends and family?

      There is a global pandemic. You have a safe isolated location but the local health care centers are desparate for help of any kind. What do you do?

      Your antibotic supplies are limited. Who do you decide to treat? Do you withhold antibiotics from certain people knowing they will probably die to save medication for others? How do decide what to do?

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      • Be informed says:

        @ Merree. I have a question I am not sure if I asked before about N-95 masks. IF you actually double up on the masks, will the second mask filter out the 5% of what the first mask lets in? So if you wear two masks togther, will the first safeguard you 95%, and the second mask 95% of the 5% that gets through. Thus 95% of 5% which would be 4.75% and be 95%+4.75% which would give you 99.75% protection. OR does it not work that way? If not, would two masks together at least give you better than 95% protection of just one N-95 mask? N-100 masks are so expensive, but worth it if you can’t get near that 100% protection during a mega plague. Thanks.

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        • Merree says:

          BI
          I don’t know if two masks would have a cumulative effect. I think it would depend on the quality of the seal around each mask. You might use two different kinds so that one overlaps the other. I have never seen any tests on the use of two masks so this is just a guess.

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        • PenCRNA says:

          I can tell you as a healthcare professional, you need to be properly fit tested for N95 to work. You can do this in a rudimentary way yourself. First of all men…NO FACIAL HAIR. If you want the mask to work you must shave. Hold the mask in your hand, and put the straps up and over to the back of your hand. Then put mask to your face, and take bottom strap up and over your head, followed by the top strap. When you breathe in, it should feel slightly like you are working, because no air should be coming in around edges. Now to test…..get some an extra person, saccharin powdered sweetener, a large paper sack, plastic wrap, tape and some sort of device you can spray the powder with. You have to make a hood to fit test.
          Step 1 cut a ~8″square hole into the ‘front’ of the sack.
          Step 2. Tape plastic wrap over this hole (this is so you can see and don’t get claustrophobic)
          Step 3. Make a small hole in side if bag, (below the level of the eyes) to blow in the powdered saccharin
          Step 4. After putting on mask, put the bag over your head
          Step 5 have partner blow fine saccharin powder into your “hood” (watch the eyes, do not blow into eyes)
          Step 6. Take deep breathes, and recite a sentence.

          If you are a broad shouldered person you may need to add length to the bag so that it goes over your shoulders. Fit test does no good if saccharin drifts down and is not circulating in the hood.

          IF YOU TASTE ANY SWEET OR SACCHARIN TASTE, you fail your fit test. Try another size.

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    45. Qwoolie says:

      If you haven’t cached at least 1 gun and ammo, now is the time to do it. Do it far away from your property in an area never traveled. Be careful of whom you associate with because there will be infiltrators (should be infilTRAITORS) everywhere as well as people looking to turn you in for food, water, and medicine. This is the time of FASCISM in AMERICA and it is going to get worse unless you get active and vote every anti Bill of Rights person out of office in favor of those who support the ENTIRE Bill of Rights. Trust only people you know can handle stress and people you’ve known for a long time. I guarantee that militias and oath keepers are infiltrated to at least some extent. Main thing is keeping your info private – and don’t make any purchases with a credit card because you’re going to be in the gigantic fusion center in Utah. Also, don’t use Facebook or other social media to comment your views on anything. Facebook is a surveillance tool for the fascists.

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    46. “I rise today to express grave doubts about the Obama Administration’s counterterrorism policies and programs,” said the freshman congressman from Arkansas. “Counterterrorism is often shrouded in secrecy, as it should be, so let us judge by the results. In barely four years in office, five jihadists have reached their targets in the United States under Barack Obama: the Boston Marathon bomber, the underwear bomber, the Times Square Bomber, the Fort Hood shooter, and in my own state—the Little Rock recruiting office shooter. In the over seven years after 9/11 under George W. Bush, how many terrorists reached their target in the United States? Zero! We need to ask, ‘Why is the Obama Administration failing in its mission to stop terrorism before it reaches its targets in the United States?’”

      I know the answer….do you?

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    47. Rasputin says:

      What if a Miss July, a playboy bunny, shows up on your doorstep. Will you be hard hearted and turn her away or shoot her. Better role play all scenarios.

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    48. braveheart says:

      Howdy, CentralTXMom.Any good sporting good store or gun store will have good quality gun safes for sale. For rifles and shotguns, you can get a long gun safe for under $200 if funds are limited; can also hold handguns too. A safe strictly for a handgun can be bought for less than $100. It all depends on what type of guns you’re going to buy. whatever you get, a proper cleaning kit to maintain that weapon is a MUST. If you can handle a shotgun, 12 or 20-gauge are the most popular and shotgun ammo is still plentiful; plus they won’t break the piggy bank. If you only want a .22, I’d get a Ruger 10/22 if you can find one. They’re reliable, accurate, and fun to shoot. Get ammo and extra mags if you can find them. Even a .22 is better than nothing and CAN be used as defensive round, despite what some people claim. .22 is what John Hinckley used on president Reagan back in 1981. .22s were also used for assassinations in Vietnam. Get shot with a .22 and you will need medical attention; that little round can ruin someone’s day. braveheart

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      • Central TX Mom says:

        Howdy Braveheart! Thanks for the info. Available from family are an assortment handed down over years to choose from. I will have to brush up on my skills as far as cleaning and maintenance.(It’s been a while, lol) Going to pick one that I can pretty much hit something in a stress situation (I’m thinking scattershot?) Used to have decent skills, but have let get them rusty through non-use (my fault totally). Mom & dad have already told me if I wanted the original single shot .22 that was the first gun I ever fired, they would probably let me have it. They have to think on it because it was my dad’s fathers gun. As far as safes go, looking for one with combo lock and key. (probably overkill but I know better than to underestimate #1 son)Hope you’re having a good day.

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    49. JustOneGuy says:

      REPOSTED!!!

      @ All,

      Something is NOT right here…from the Hedge,

      “CBOE, World’s Largest Option Exchange, Offline”

      Is THIS the day?

      There will come a day…whether today or no, soon, when some headline JUST like this will blaze across the wires and it will ALL begin
      …just this way.

      In the last 24 hours the Hedge cited JPM as being ‘deeply drawn down’ in their vaulted inventory…the largest private Gold vault in the World…drawn down?

      What’s wrong with this ‘picture’?

      Link to follow…

      JOG

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    50. JustOneGuy says:

      CBOE Ofline?…Not Started YET today?…WHY?

      http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-04-25/cboe-worlds-largest-option-exchange-offline

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    51. patientmomma says:

      Thanks to the writer for reminding us of the hard decisions we will have to make. Experience is something we don’t have until after we need it; so it is hard to say what we will do. He is correct in that we must decide a head of time how we will handle these situations, because indecision will get us killed. We must examine our own character and morals and determine if we can live with ourselves, no mater which decisions we make.

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    52. JayJay says:

      I must say as I am reading these comments, my neighbor is spraying the few dandelions in her yard with weed killer.
      This is my neighborhood. One actually curbed the flower beds with concrete.
      They have no fricking clue what is coming.
      Feed them?? Pfft!

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      • the cooking mom says:

        Dandelions : excellent blood purifier, improves low blood pressure,
        One of the best liver cleansers, vitamins and minerals especially calcium.
        plan on digging mine, cleaning the roots then drying.
        I drink it everyday in tea.

        Keep preppin’

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        • Semper Fi y'all says:

          Dandelion greens are one of our most perfect vegetable foods. This list shows the amount, in grams, in 100 grams of dandelion greens where 1/2 cup of cooked dandelion greens contains 100 grams.

          The content of just the B complex and Vitamin C alone is superb if that were all you got from dandelions. One cup (200 grams) yields 100% of a days needs of Vit C and B complex.

          Lists such as this (per 100 grams) are available all over the ‘net.

          Carbohydrates 9.20 g
          Protein 2.70 g
          Total Fat 0.70 g
          Cholesterol 0 mg
          Dietary Fiber 3.50 g
          Vitamins
          Folates 27 µg
          Niacin 0.806 mg
          Pantothenic acid 0.084 mg
          Pyridoxine 0.251 mg
          Riboflavin 0.260 mg
          Thiamin 0.190 mg
          Vitamin A 10161 IU
          Vitamin C 35 mg
          Vitamin E 3.44 mg
          Vitamin K 778.4 µg
          Electrolytes
          Sodium 76 mg
          Potassium 397 mg
          Minerals
          Calcium 187 mg
          Iron 3.10 mg
          Magnesium 36 mg
          Manganese 0.342 mg
          Phosphorus 66 mg
          Selenium 0.5 mg
          Zinc 0.41 mg
          Phyto-nutrients
          Carotene-α 363 µg
          Carotene-β 5854 µg
          Crypto-xanthin-β 121 µg
          Lutein-zeaxanthin 13610 µg

          The ubiquitous dandelion grows to at least 10,500 feet in altitude. Rely on the dandelion in your preps.

          Semper Fi

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        • patientmomma says:

          Everyone needs to learn about herbs; scriptures tell us that cures for diseases are found in herbs, trees and plants which are on the earth. We are not smart enough to use them correctly.

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        • John W. says:

          Dandelions, eh? Did you see todays Pickles comic strip. It is about dandelions, And dogs and poor old Earl who always gets set up.

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      • I hate weed killers…really like “dandy lions” eat a lot of them around here in salads and use the dried roots for a coffee like brew…spraying week killers on good food..sheesh, some peoples kids :)

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      • Smokey says:

        I sprayed mine today, yet I’ve got a clue. Try another analogy.

        When the lawn turns into a garden, I’ll get a lot more food value out of the vegetables, not the dandelions. I can get them anywhere, but not the vegetables.

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    53. Satori says:

      America is doing GREAT at setting new records

      Record Number of Households on Food Stamps– 1 out of Every 5

      http://cnsnews.com/blog/joe-schoffstall/record-number-households-food-stamps-1-out-every-5

      can you imagine what would happen if the EBT cards quit working ???

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    54. Libertyhound says:

      Something else I havent heard mentioned in regards to some defining moments is the far reaching hand of family??I have three brothers and one sister who dont all share my views on being prepared, but they know!! It starts out quite innocent and something I have a handle on knowing I am prepping for for my small family (2 sons). The math is quite simple for having stuff stored ahead for three. Then the math changes once the shtf. Add my sons wife and baby,add my siblings who will show up and all their families members, add my gf and her family, then add spouses, then you might be adding spouses parents, toss in some close friends and you have a small village. My total climbs to over 40 just with people you care about. Then the possibility of a few of those having close friends who they care about and this is all before the above mention defining moments.
      Can anyone honestly say they will turn away nephews? Aunts and Uncles? I have a large home and cant even imagine 15 people in here let alone 40. Then what happens if things get really bad and we have to bug out? It really is hard to even wrap your brain around all of this and how hard it is going to get even on the prepared!!

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      • JayJay says:

        liberty..I read a prepper father/husband’s solution to this.
        First, no one comes in but his immediate family..that’s wife, their parents, and his children.
        Second, if those lucky people want to feed a friend, bf, gf, close neighbor, etc, it comes from ‘their’ ration for that day-not the food supply of the family.
        I have thought of that since reading; makes sense.

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      • Boss Hog says:

        Time for a family meeting Libertyhound, Godbless.

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    55. 11 Bravo says:

      Off topic……just saw a little blurb about the track student who was the watching the race in Boston with his coach and was initially and wrongly identified by bloggers as one of the two suspects…..looks like they just identified his body as floating in Rhode Island…..

      http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2013/04/25/boston-bombing-social-media-student-brown-university-reddit/2112309/

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    56. Central TX Mom says:

      Norse Prepper,
      Wow!!! A very thought provoking article and if I am honest with myself, I have no idea what I would do in these situations. I will most certainly be pondering these and trying to formulate a plan since these are things you don’t want to decide “on the fly”. I have buried one child and can talk big and say I won’t bury another of mine if I can help it by keeping my supplies for my children & self. My first duty is to my own family. But on the other side, knowing the loss of a child, could I turn one (or more)away, possibly sentencing them to death? I honestly can’t answer that question.
      Again, excellent article and I enjoy your posts as well.

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    57. Padre says:

      #1 I would turn in my guns…

      #2 I would be gone before they think about knocking on the door, and if they find me then I would reward their resourcefulness and give them a spot in my group.

      #3 I have no desire to take a life, BUT I am willing to defend a life, even if that means the death or injury of an unjust aggressor. It is a hell of a thing to kill a man, but I don’t believe that physical life is all there is, and so stopping a desperate man from turning to evil in the midst of despair is actually an act of kindness.

      You are absolutely correct that it is important to think about these things.

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    58. I will not hand over my guns, if that makes me a felon then so be it, anyone caught snooping around will meet their demise, I live 12 miles from the closest town, and my father in law owns a backhoe, bury them so deep, even cadaver dogs can’t find em.

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    59. braveheart says:

      NP, another excellent article. i’ve already wrestled with all of these questions back in the Clinton era. My answers are as follows. #1. I’m not giving up any weapons, period. anyone who forces their way into my home without question will have evil intentions toward me and they will die. #2. If anyone knocks on my door, I’m not answering it and hoping they’ll just go away without any confrontation. I’ve always taken responsibility for my own well-being and my wife when she was alive. I’m not responsible for anyone else’s well-being or their kids; that’s their own responsibility, NOT MINE. If they didn’t stockpile necessities for their own families, that’s their own stupid fault, NOT MINE. #3. we are all being forced into a nightmare scenario none of us ever wanted. The govt. and banksters are destroying our economy and way of life. The day is fast approaching when everything will come to a head and we’ll finally have what we’ve all feared, hoped would never happen, but have been prepping for; THE TRUE SHTF. After the balloon goes up, we’ll all be forced into doing things we would never have done otherwise just to survive. I personally expect to be in a confrontation with someone over ANYTHING that I have. I fully expect that I will have to take a human life in order to keep myself alive. I dread what’s coming as much as everyone else here. I don’t want it to happen, either, but I do recognize that SOMETHING IS COMING and have been and still preparing for accordingly. I’ve been on razor’s edge lately and some nights I break down knowing what lies in store for all of us. it’s going to be a living hell in this nation after the balloon goes up. Everyone get everything you can now while you can. braveheart

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    60. braveheart says:

      Central TX Mom, whatever .22 you can get, it can also put food on the table [rabbits, squirrels, etc.] to help supplement your food storage. having as much variety as possible will really help. I’d say a good .22 rifle and 12-gauge pump and you’ll be all set. Shotgun is my next major purchase coming soon. braveheart

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    61. It is not possible for all of our guns to be taken away from us. There are many hiding places in our homes or on our property to store away a gun for protection of our family. There is not enough manpower in the entire government on all levels to search in detail all homes, cars, and properties. We will not be allowed to carry open, but we could still quietly own guns even if the law says no. We won’t be able to foolishly flaunt our weapons and our hoarded-away tens of thousands of rounds of ammo on the internet, nor even mention ownership of them. We will not be able to trust many of our neighbors who worship our government leaders. Begin now to secure and store away any weapons you can get without a paper trail. You might consider making legal and documented sales (receipts)of your current weapons with paper trails. Of course keep one or two of the registered junk pieces to voluntarily turn over to the gov. Also, keep in mind that the average liberal politician does not even know what a tactical compound bow is. Buy the best tactical bows and accessories you can afford and put them away. A broad-head mounted 425 grain carbon bolt traveling at 402 fps stops any big buck, whether four-legged or bipedal. Don’t take tactical bows for granted. Plus, when you fire one it can’t be heard all the way back to D.C. Concealing one will be an issue.

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      • Afterthefallpa says:

        Brum,

        You’re correct about there being MANY hiding places for guns in the home.
        Don’t ever bury your guns people!
        If you need to hide them then make sure the hiding place is instantly accessible to you if need be not buried 6 feet under ground!!!

        A rifle can be placed in an empty piece of PVC pipe and easily hidden by making the fake pipe look like part of your existing plumbing.

        I’ve got a friend who put up a fake rain gutter which he “modded” and houses a concealed, weatherproofed, and locked compartment where he keeps a Moisin Nagant rifle. Completely hidden yet easily accessible to him by just reaching it through his attic window.

        His house has a pseudo western theme going and he also has one of those lamps where the base is a replica lever-action rifle…although his lamp base is an actual rifle cunningly wired so that it actually is a working lamp. Camoflage in plain sight.

        A frozen turkey in the freezer can hold a pistol instead of giblets.

        Large jars of mayonnaise in the fridge can conceal a pistol sealed inside an airtight plastic bag.

        If you have a cat, you can easily create a fake bottom for the litterbox to conceal a pistol or two. Place pistol, put on fake bottom, fill with kitty litter…not a favorite place for anyone to search.

        Modify an old VCR by taking out some parts inside to make room for a pistol…make sure the electronics still work though and keep it plugged into the wall and into a tv…a blinking 12:00 adds to the effect!

        In fact, many larger electronic devices have a surprising amount of extra room in them able to hide a pistol.

        If you know what you’re doing, You can access the inside of your hot water heater and then you can hide a rifle inside a sealed waterproof bag or even a sealed pvc pipe.
        …or better yet, install a 2nd empty “fake” water heater next to your real one (be sure to install pipes to make it look like it’s hooked up and working)- Great place to store/hide multiple rifles and other arms/ammo.

        Just a few “thinking outside of the box’ ideas of different ways to conceal a gun inside your home as opposed to burying them in the yard.

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        • Wow! Great ideas! I once had an old hot water heater that finally bit the dust and was leaking badly. I bought a new one, brought it home and the pipe connections didn’t match up to what was already there so I left the old one in place and set up and plumbed the new one right next to the old one. Then I disconnected the old one, spun it around and cut the seam top to bottom on the housing and cut a rectangular section out of the housing about 6 inches wide and 24 inches high using a thin Kerf blade in my SawzAll. I cut a good size hole in the tank. Hinged the section of housing I’d cut out with inside mounted hinges and added an interior mounted pressure latch on the other side. I put the hot water heater back in place, re-plumbed it and added a little JB weld in the valve on the inline cold water to plug it up while in the open position. I had to reach around to the back side to access the door, but it was not hard to manage after the fist few practices. That unit stayed there for over 20 years with valuables and weapons inside that were never found.

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    62. ScoutMotto says:

      So what would it be like if a brick was hurled through the sliding back door, shattering it to bits so brigands can enter?

      What it be like if the house was Molotov’d while I’m inside sound asleep?

      What would happen if a small child calling me outside because a parent pretending to be a bad guy was threatening the child with death if I don’t come out?

      Thoughts like this cross my mind often. I hate that these globalists are keeping us so on the edge.

      I hope I get enough like-minded people on my side when the time comes that we have to survive together.

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    63. Great post, NP – very thought-provoking. Thank you for sharing it with us!

      ~ Daisy

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    64. 22Mission says:

      A short note on sleeping safe alone .
      As a rest period is needed by all,
      sleeping alone without getting intruded can be rectified simply .
      Establish a perimeter . String clear fishing line across the obvious pathways .
      Try tying it 2-4″ high . Run the end close to your head .
      Attach a single metal jingle bell .
      Check it by tapping it with a long stick .
      If someone steps on it or brushes it during rest time,
      Hopefully you will at least get a few extra seconds to stand your ground,
      grab your weapon,, or abandon the area before they reach you .
      This does work,, but remember wildlife can trip it as easy as a man .
      Practice .
      Take care
      NOMI
      Mission

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      • CrabbeNebulae says:

        Tangle foot works better than fishing line. Make a dozen overlapping three-four foot diameter circles of wire. Connect them together with several single strands that stand up about 8 inches and arc across the connected circles. There is 1/4 mile of wire on a single roll so you can make several tangle foot layouts and place them in the grass/weeds of the trails and paths to your home. They will not harm wildlife but will catch humans and make them curse a blue streak… It is a very effective passive deterrent that works. It is really funny to hear someone start cursing at 3 in the morning when they step into a layer of tangle foot as it wakes up the dog and everyone in the house. The intruders don’t hang around to complain. LOLOL!!! Every prepper should buy a couple rolls of barbed wire for just such an event.

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        • 22Mission says:

          Now that is an excellent suggestion Crabbe .
          I use clear fishing line for many things and this is something I have used myself sleeping alone outside . I only suggest things I have tried before .
          But I certainly will remember this wire trick .
          I am a single woman who spends long periods outside .
          And I do what is necessary for my personal protection .
          Thanks much .
          NOMI
          Mission

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        • I’ve been in Mexico for 8 years now, finishing up here soon and headed back stateside. We build tangle foot out of Concertina razor wire. I had to cut one guy out of some I had on the roof with wire cutters. The police came and just left him there, they said.. “we don’t want to get bloody”. He bled so badly I had to wash the roof off with the garden hose.. He hasn’t been back. Yeah, you’re right, they make a hell of a lot of noise at 3am when they get tangled. Brum

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          • 22Mission says:

            @Brum
            Thanks for the big grin I’m wearing across my face
            Thanks a good one .
            NOMI
            Mission

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          • CrabbeNebulae says:

            Concertina razor wire is what real tangle foot should be made from but I use regular barbed wire in several spots around my place. It’s not as nasty as concertina (to work with or to get caught in) but is just as effective if it is deployed correctly. Several intruders have gotten tripped up in my barbed wire and woke up both the dogs and family members stumbling and cursing and decided never to come back. Apparently there’s easier meat further down the road.

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    65. Libertyhound says:

      Hey Jay Jay….Its easy to say only certain family members are allowed in your home when shtf, but I believe that attitude will change when they are standing at your front door…if anyone has the will to turn them away for the sake of prolonging their own comfort more power to them. I think that will be extremely difficult to do though. Just another of the terrible scenarios we will be facing.

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      • JayJay says:

        I Timothy 5:8….Anyone who does not provide for their relatives, and especially for their own household, has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever.

        And it wasn’t my plan. I have no family.
        I was just relating.
        But, his plan sounds good to me.
        So let’s see how this works; I open the door to one family.
        They tell their family members, and family members tell their friends.
        Why bother prepping, sacrificing NICE things, like cable(yep–I’m serious, don’t have it here), to feed the flock that bought new cars and the latest blings, vacations?
        According to the above scripture, He is on the prepper’s side.

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    66. Archivist says:

      I’m lucky enough to live in an area where over 90% of the people are related to each other. Whenever someone is down, someone else will have a fish fry or sell barbecue plates to raise money. You can’t go anywhere without seeing countless churches. We’re not in Mormon country, but there are so many here that they’re splitting off and starting a new church. I think we may survive here. The best cooking in the world is Baptist women.

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    67. Anonymous says:

      As far as the feral government rounding up guns, there are at least a hundred million gun owners and not anywhere near that many agents of the feral government.

      Historically, gun confiscation is followed by democide. The government wants your guns so they can take your stuff and kill you without undue fuss. Once they start coming for the guns, you can pretty well kiss your ass goodbye.

      Why not die fighting? It’s better than starving in one of their prison camps. And if one-out-of-ten of us manages to kill one of them before they get us, we will win and they will lose.

      I call this plan “Each One Kill One,” or EOKO for short.

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    68. Revsuzanne says:

      Very thought-provoking indeed.
      >> I still have the “feeling” that the banksters will not win. <<
      I think the cops down here in Texas understand that going from house to house demanding firearms is a great way to get killed. Most are smart enough to abstain. There would likely be some notice, so there would be opportunity to hide/bury guns and ammo. There is also the patented reply, "I had to pawn the gun you mention to buy groceries." I bought plenty of the waterproof ammo cans with the gasket I can bury.

      Being on the Texas gulf coast, my bet is that most non-preppers would begin with the various agencies as it happens post-hurricanes. That will work for a while.

      Ultimately, I'm looking at what happened in Weimar/Nazi Germany, and in particular, Argentina. Firearms are illegal in Argentina, but everyone has one. Precious metals made a huge difference in both cases. Reading the "Surviving in Argentina" blog by FerFal offers a lot of clues as to how to survive one corrupt banker-owned regime after another. The good thing is we have some time to get it together.

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      • John W. says:

        Those cops over by Ft.Hood had no problem arresting that soldier for having a rifle while hiking with his son. Don’t think for a second that your Texas cops are better than the rest of the countrys’ JBTs. They are all pretty much the same when they have power.

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    69. WickedJester says:

      When Your Defining moment comes remember: Adversity is like a flame it melts the weak but tempers the strong.

      Stay Prepped
      WJ

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    70. braveheart says:

      Eisen, you would be surprised what the venerable .22lr round can do to a human body. It’s not just for target practice and small game. I’ll grant you although it’s usually better to have some “heavier artillery” [and I DO have some] the .22lr can be and has been used as a defensive round if nothing else is available. President Reagan was shot by that maniac John Hinckley on March 30, 1981 with a .22 revolver. Jim Brady, his chief of staff, was also shot; his spinal cord was severed and he was paralyzed for life. his POS wife sara turned into one of the gun grabbers because of the incident. The president lost more than half of his blood at the hospital, just because of a .22 round. His excellent physical health and quick action by everyone including the surgeons were what saved his life. it took awhile for him to recover from the wound. .22lr has been in production since before the Civil War. back in those days, everyone feared being shot by a small-caliber weapon because everyone knew what the .22 was capable of. Did you know .22s were used for assassinations in Vietnam? You can learn a helluva lot here if you’ll just listen. braveheart

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    71. Anonymous says:

      Alittle off the topic, but something I did last week, I made a very contained herb garden of 15 plus type of herbs, just buy a hanging shoe rack, fill each pouch with soil and place each herb in it…hang it up on a side of ur fence, wall etc…just thought I would share ..

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    72. There are worse things than dying. …like living with the fact that you laid down and took it when you should have stood up and made evil pack it in!

      Also, remember, while God can strike a mighty blow with a crooked stick, satan can decieve you as an angel of light with a soft word.

      “Dodge this!” – Trinity to Agent

      There can be no murder when you are laying waste to the perpetrators of evil but woe to those who kill the innocent.

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    73. Frank Thoughts says:

      Wrong, wrong, wrong: look at history, who survived? The people who took up guns against a totalitarian state, or those who fled?

      The best preparation you can make is to be mobile and alert. You can have the world’s biggest supply of beans, pork and dried fruit and guns and still totally not understand what is happening in the world around you.

      Throughout history, the people who survived were the people who fled. The people – say the Warsaw Ghetto uprising – who fought back, didn’t stand a chance and were wiped out. The smart Jews were the mobile Jews who got out when it was possible and found themselves sunning on a beach in Israel a decade later surrounded by stunning babes.

      Your stash of beans, guns and ammo will be like an albatross around your neck, always forcing you to second guess when to make your move and over-estimating your ability to hold out against bigger forces. What is your average middle class guy going to do if a battle hardened LA street gang is on the loose and decides to come to your house to get your gold, silver, your wife and your beautiful blonde daughter who keeps fit by riding horses? Think you stand a chance against those motivating factors? I don’t think you have a chance.

      Your best weapon is not to let such a situation take place. Don’t allow government to degenerate, do not disconnect from society and let it go to hell, stop pretending you aren’t racist and reach out to people in the black, asian and hispanic communities: you will find most of the good people want civilization to continue too.

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    74. J.Ru says:

      i wouldn’t really want to survive in a world so described after SHTF (it’s bad enough now), so i just pray it’s an instantaneous death.

      bye bye world, THANK GOD my time has finally come. HELLO Lord, Bless You for Your mercy.

      define that. ;P

      Luke 17:33 Whosoever shall seek to save his life shall lose it; and whosoever shall lose his life shall preserve it.

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    75. A fried says:

      When we deny food to our neighbor, when we treat the stranger as an enemy out to get our precious belongings, is that what Jesus would do, or what Satan would do?

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    76. anonymous says:

      ;)

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